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Building a business is tough. It takes grit, never-ending days, missed family birthdays, and more coffee than you thought it was possible to drink.
Unfortunately, many business operators do all of this and see initial success but then - crickets! They hit a plateau or, worse, fall off the cliff entirely.
This is The Business OS, a show powered by JustCall dedicated to ensuring that you don't get lost in that Bermuda Triangle of irrelevance.
Join us as we talk to entrepreneurs, business leaders, and real-world operators - folks who know your struggles better than anyone else. They are also the ones with the knowledge and playbooks to help you succeed. Through candid conversations with our guests, we make sure you’ll walk away with actionable takeaways to help you think ahead and pivot fast.
True, building a business is tough - and you have to hustle. But it does get easier when you have a Business OS.
Julie Bee [00:00:00]:
The main two things that I tell people to do is, one, say no to new opportunities, new things that come across your plate. So the goal of that is just to stop adding things to your plate. Because a lot of us really love opportunities. A lot of us have fomo. We don't want to miss out on things. So it's a lot easier said than done.
Kushal Kakkar [00:00:19]:
This is the BusinessOS, a conversation powered by JustCall, dedicated to giving you the tools and knowledge needed to win your business.
Tom Burgess [00:00:28]:
Hi, everyone. Welcome to The Business OS podcast, a show powered by JustCall, where we help business operators avoid the irrelevance. And today, I love to welcome our guests. We've got Julie Bee on. So just a little bit about Julie. Julie founded TJB Media as well as BeeSmart Social Media, and she also hosts an award winning podcast and is quoted in several publications anywhere from Fast Company, Forbes and Beyond, which are just a few of those many accolades that we could really point out. And more recently, I think exciting for Julie is she launched her book called Burnt, which we're certainly going to talk about today. And that book, and I'm going to butcher this, by the way, Julie.
Tom Burgess [00:01:13]:
But I know it will help business owners and just the global collective really overcome that burnout and turn that into fuel for success. And just to note, you can find that book on our website, thejuliebee.com. you can also find it on Amazon, and I'm sure in a lot of different other areas that I'm not listing right now. So, Julie, welcome to the show.
Julie Bee [00:01:39]:
Tom, thanks for having me. And I'm looking forward to this conversation.
Tom Burgess [00:01:42]:
I am, too. I was doing a little bit of browsing before, and I've got to call this out since I live in, in Colorado, but you talk a lot about craft beer. We're enjoying a craft beer. So summer months, regardless of where you are in the world, what is your go to summer beer?
Julie Bee [00:02:01]:
My go to beer period is a Imperial or Bourbon Aged Stout. I love it. I don't care if it's summer, winter or whatever. I will drink it when it's 100 degrees out and when it's 30.
Tom Burgess [00:02:14]:
So you're talking. You're talking. I just got goosebumps. So we have a, we have a beer out here, and this is not sponsored by Epic at all, but we get a beer called the, it's the Imperial Pumpkin Porter and it hits around the fall. Highly recommend if you haven't had it. Yeah, I've been on a big hazy kick lately. Hazy IPA out here, so we'll certainly share a beer after. Now, tell me a little bit about your journey.
Tom Burgess [00:02:38]:
So I know you're an entrepreneur at heart, or so it seems. So walk the listeners through your background, where you started, how you got to where you are now.
Julie Bee [00:02:50]:
I started, actually, I ran my first business when I was in high school, and I carried that into college. It was a math tutoring business, so I did that. And that was more of a side thing. That wasn't, obviously, I was student first and student athlete second, and then that was kind of my third thing. Then I did the typical thing. I went to college, got a degree, got a degree in accounting, which has actually served me really well as a business owner. And I worked in corporate America for one year, and then the rest of my career has been in small business. So after that one year in corporate, I worked for other small businesses for about five years, lost my job in zero eight, and started a digital marketing agency that became BeeSmart Social Media.
Julie Bee [00:03:35]:
Ran that for 15 years. Very successful company. I truthfully got burned out on the social media industry and exited that last fall and sold some things and exited in a little bit of a different way than most people think about exiting, but got out nonetheless. And I've been running TJB Media for about three years that started all this podcasting. And now today what I do is primarily, I call myself a burnout strategist, and I primarily work with business owners. And we work through burnout so that they can not only protect themselves, but protect their companies and their families and their employees, because if the business owner is burned out, it's really hard for them to do what they need to do in order to survive and eventually thrive. I try to catch burnout before it gets too bad and just help my business owners turn it around. And it's usually, the interesting thing about it is usually through taking some type of action, a lot of us think that burnout is you need to do less.
Julie Bee [00:04:42]:
And what I found, especially with business owners, is it's usually you need to, you need help prioritizing what actions to take, and that's usually what addresses burnout.
Tom Burgess [00:04:52]:
Very good. I know you mentioned early on you were a student athlete. To get to the, maybe the funner side. What sport did you play?
Julie Bee [00:05:00]:
Yeah, I played basketball. So I played basketball in high school, and then I played it in, like, the club leagues in college. I wasn't good enough to make it onto the, onto the big stage, but I did play for a little while, and then injuries and just, you know, wanting to have a life outside of sports eventually.
Tom Burgess [00:05:18]:
Yeah, maybe some of that burnout, too. Very good. And I know, yeah, you went to West Virginia Mountaineer. I'm a Hoosier at heart, so I've got a little bit, I'm not a basketball player by any means, but I do have a little bit of that basketball background from just being at a school like that. Now tell me, let's dig into your book. We're going to kind of get this started early. Give us a sneak peek so you don't need to give us all, I want our listeners to certainly go out there and read it and buy it if possible, but give us, like, the Cliff notes version. So you talk about burnout clearly, but what was the inspiration behind that? I know you kind of talked about that early on, you know, exiting the social media side, but also just in zero eight, some of the burnout you felt.
Tom Burgess [00:06:02]:
What was the background to write that book?
Julie Bee [00:06:04]:
Yeah, I had a pretty epic burnout in 2021 and went into the emergency room, thought I was having a heart attack, was a panic attack. And when I got out of that, I knew I was burned out, and I wasn't sure what to do next. And when I looked for answers online, I mean, it was the standard advice of, you know, take better care of yourself, set boundaries and go to a therapist, all of those sure, wonderful types of things that you should do. But there wasn't any specific guidance for business owners on how to move through it and how to prevent it in the future. And the more I talked to people, the more I realized that resource needed to exist. And so what I did was, and I had done this in the past, I'm a big process person. I'm a big systems and process person. So I had already had some of this system documented, and I just documented the rest of what I did.
Julie Bee [00:07:04]:
And then I ran it, you know, through some studies with business owners. And I figured out that I had a system that really helped people not only recover from burnout, but recognize it before it starts, prevent it in the future, and also leverage it to do something with it, not to just have this experience and not get anything out of it. So I went on to write this book and sold it to a publisher and have kind of been on this really amazing journey with writing and being an author and all along the way helping a lot of business owners and other people, not just business owners, manage burnout and prevent it.
Tom Burgess [00:07:47]:
Well, I can say for myself and probably all the audience that it's nice to see some resources out there, because I think one of the pitfalls is you might be able to recognize that you might not, but then it's to your point earlier on, instead of trying to avoid it, how do you. Well, of course avoiding it, but how do you use that to leverage moving forward? And I think that's where a lot of people get stuck. So on that topic, thinking about whether you're a business owner or just a colleague at a company, doesn't matter who. What should most leaders or people look out for or to really recognize that burnout? Like, maybe top two or three things.
Julie Bee [00:08:30]:
If you're talking about recognizing it in yourself, I think you first have to know what normal looks like for you and what not normal. So I call it baseline to burnout in the book. And, you know, your baseline things are you get certain numbers of hours of sleep every night, and if you get too far off of that, you're sliding towards burnout. And the thing is, the measuring part of it, that's the one part of the book that I think is really different is measuring these indicators, or red flags, as I call them, that may indicate you're heading towards burnout and being able to turn it around before then. One for me is I laugh with my, my wife every day, and if I'm not doing that every day, if I go a few days, I'm like something, you know, what's going on here? You know, I've got a course correct. So my goal in that specific chapter is helping people not only understand what their baseline looks out looks like, but also what their burnout looks like so that they can stop the slide into burnout and turn it around before. Before we get all the way into some of the, you know, depths burnout that we can get into.
Tom Burgess [00:09:33]:
Yeah. Is there. How do you track this? Like, I know a lot of this is mental awareness or just self awareness in general, but do you find writing it down or, like, tracking these kind of indicators somewhere is helpful?
Julie Bee [00:09:46]:
Yeah, I mean, I recommend when people aren't sure what to do with this, I always say, what are you already tracking? And is that tied to burnout at all? So for me, I have an app that I track my sleep on, so that's pretty easy. If you. One thing that one thing that a client of mine does is they want to make sure they make it to at least 75% of one of their children's sports games. So they're able to track, like, on their calendar and look at a week and say, okay, I made it to 75% or I didn't. So whatever you are currently documenting, that's the first place I look. And that's usually around your calendar, around apps that you use. Like, if you exercise, that's a place we can look as well. So we want to look for things that you're already tracking that are, you know, you don't track things that aren't important.
Julie Bee [00:10:36]:
So if you're tracking it, it's important for some reason. And that's usually the best place to start in terms of this conversation about tracking and measuring where you are on that burnout scale.
Tom Burgess [00:10:46]:
Very good. Very good. Now, on the. Maybe talking about a more recent event, you know, after Covid or I guess just with the popularity of this remote first organization in most capacities, has that shifted how you can perceive burnout? Like, are there any? Whether you're working in office, but more specifically, speaking to remote first orgs, what are some of the key differences, if any?
Julie Bee [00:11:15]:
Yeah, it's hard. It's hard to know. I think it's harder to know if you're burning out when you're working from home, when you're working remote, because if you're not around your coworkers, if you're not around other people, you may not recognize your own signs of it. And you also don't have that. Sometimes in workplaces, other people will recognize burnout in you before you do. So you don't have that social filter, I guess, that may help you identify. And I think that's one of the problems. And another problem is a lot of us like to work remotely, and there's a little bit of a hesitancy to say that that may increase the likelihood of burnout.
Julie Bee [00:11:56]:
So I think that we have a little bit of a hesitancy to say, well, I'm burned out because we don't want remote work to be blamed for that. But we are social animals. You know, we're social creatures, and we need to be around other people. And so I do think that. I think it's easier to burn out when you're working from home because there are no time constructs when you're working from home, really, you can work anytime, anywhere, any place, mostly if you have Wi Fi for most of us that are working in that model. So there's no, like, bookends to the day. And I think that makes it a little bit easier to burn out, quite frankly. So one thing that I work on with a lot of my clients, work out of home offices, is making sure they have bookends to their day or something that signifies start and end and shutting off, you know, shutting off work for a period of time every day, I think, is so crucial.
Julie Bee [00:12:49]:
And I do believe, though, it's harder to do when you are working from home all the time.
Tom Burgess [00:12:53]:
Yeah, I would say I fall into that guilty trap. You know, for me, it's like making sure that I have access to my kids, whether they're in school or not. And just kind of like, taking that mental breather, I think, really helps. But it. It is interesting because I don't go anywhere. I have a car, but I don't need to drive. So it's really helped me, I would say, shift the priorities. And this is after five plus years of being remote or fully remote.
Tom Burgess [00:13:22]:
I really like the way that you framed it up where it's understanding you have bookends. I think that's really important to recognize when there is a clear start to your day and there should be a clear end. And I specifically talking about your work environment. Right. Like, I want to shut off and then go be personal or have a social life. Very good. So I want to touch back into the point, you know, if I'm an individual and I'm self aware and I'm starting to recognize or maybe like, just feeling this sense of burnout, once you recognize those signs, what are the easiest ways to try and get out of that? Like, to get out of the quicksand? Like, quick and easy ways that. Okay, I've recognized it.
Tom Burgess [00:14:12]:
Now what do I do from there?
Julie Bee [00:14:15]:
Yeah. So the main two things that I tell people to do is, one, say no to new opportunities, new things that come across your plate. So the goal of that is just to stop adding things to your plate, because a lot of us really love opportunities. A lot of us have fomo. We don't want to miss out on things. So it's. It's a lot easier said than done to say no to an opportunity that comes across your plate. When you are.
Julie Bee [00:14:40]:
When you recognize you're burned out or heading that way, that's like, step one is just no more stuff on your plate, and that's at work. And I would even say in your personal life, too, just know. And so I do always say there's. There are outliers there. You know, if a massive media opportunity came my way and I was burned out, I'd probably still figure out how to make it work. But for the most part, we can say no to the new things. And then the second thing, once you do that, once you say no to the new, what I recommend people do is look at some of the not the day to day stuff, but the bigger picture initiatives you have going on at work and at home. For example, you may be leading a major marketing initiative at work, or you may be at home.
Julie Bee [00:15:28]:
Maybe you're doing a kitchen remodel or something like that. And sometimes what we need in that space is to actually pause that or just give us, give ourselves like a week off from whatever that initiative is to get some, get some breathing room, if you can, you know, now there are parameters, and I go into detail in my book about how you make that decision specifically, you know, contract considerations, timelines, consequences, all of that. But there are usually, most people have a lot of initiatives going on alongside of what they do day in, day out for their daily work. And if we can find an initiative or two to pause temporarily, it's not a permanent pause that can help open up some space so that then you can start to work on burnout, because burnout requires your attention. I mean, you have to be able to work on, it's not just recognizing and it's not just recovering from it or addressing whatever's causing burnout. There's a whole process of it that you have to make some space for it to address. So those are the two ways that I usually help people open up that space.
Tom Burgess [00:16:35]:
Yeah. I mean, I, at least for myself, I think it's hard. It might be easy to recognize, I think then how to action. It becomes really hazy to me. Or, and I'm sure from, from a, whether it's a business owner entrepreneurial standpoint, it's recognizing your positive qualities, but also, like, your pitfalls. And being able to then navigate, I think, is a really hard thing to do. Now. Now when you're aware of the burnout, we'll kind of stick on this topic.
Tom Burgess [00:17:10]:
You talked about the ability for people to kind of shed away initiatives or opportunities. When you talk about that from a business owner perspective, what are some of the best tactics for them to make sure that for me, if there's an opportunity in front of me, kind of like you, I'll still try and find a way to do that. But, like, what are some of the red flags? Like, you're now recognizing that burnout? You're starting to emphasize that I need to slow down or cut stuff back. What are some of those ways that people can still almost do those initiatives or take on those opportunities? If you have a team around you, like, how do you make it easy for them? To convey that this can still get done or how do you start to, like, build that process around it?
Julie Bee [00:17:57]:
Yeah. So if you still want to, if there's an initiative that you still need to work on, the first question I go through a process of, like, is this actually something that only you, business owner or leader, can do, or is this something that can be delegated? Can the leadership of it be delegated? Can the decision making around it be delegated and the management of it? That's the first thing. If you, if you have an initiative that you need to continue but you don't have, like, if you're really struggling with burnout, we start to look at, okay, what else is still on the list and what can be delegated, what can be, you know, pushed off until a little bit of a later date. And then, I mean, you basically, if you're not going to eliminate it, you either have to delegate it, do it later, or keep it on your list. So delegation is the obvious next stop. There's, you know, the delegation is a double edged sword because that requires some of your time to transfer that project, that knowledge, that initiative. But hopefully, once it's off your plate, all you have to do is continue to check in with it. But that, I mean, if you have something, you have to keep doing, but, you know, you need to find another way to get it done.
Julie Bee [00:19:11]:
Delegation is really the route that you have as a business owner, really as anybody in a leadership role. So being an effective, I think being an effective delegator is something that a lot of people struggle with. And one thing I've seen and burnout is that people who tend to, we tend to ratchet up the micromanaging when we are burned out, actually. So you've got to also balance that. And I think you've got to be able to have really honest conversations with your team as well. You know, have a safe place at work where you can say, listen, I need help with this. I am burned out of, or I am approaching burnout. And so I would like for you to take this off my plate and run with this project.
Julie Bee [00:19:52]:
There may be a conversation you have to have with that person then about what do they deprioritize. I think that's also something that gets missed a lot with leaders and business owners is we don't, we don't really, we know what output we want, but we don't sometimes understand exactly how much input it takes to get that. And so a lot of the times when you're delegating, you have to help the person you're delegating to deprioritize some things on their list so that they know what the clear priority is. And you do that so that they don't burn out themselves.
Tom Burgess [00:20:21]:
Yeah, I feel like. Would you say that's one of the top continuations of burnout, especially from a business owner or leadership mindset, is like, it's very hard for them to give up control or to delegate.
Julie Bee [00:20:33]:
Like, I think so, yeah. There's a ton of books out there about delegating, but I mean, from, from my perspective, the things that you have to understand is that nobody's ever going to do it the same way you would do it. Sometimes that's a good thing and sometimes that needs to be adjusted. Sometimes people find different ways to get the same thing done in half the time. Once you get over that hurdle, as long as there is a. I always tell people if somebody can do it, about 80% as well as you would do it, it's probably good enough for most industries, quite frankly, and to let it go.
Tom Burgess [00:21:11]:
Yeah, I think that's spot on. Sorry not to interrupt. And one of the, one of the resources that I come back to you that I don't know if you've subscribed to them, but, like, really, the covey curriculum kind of gives you this, like, baseline understanding of, like, knowing your strengths and weaknesses, but also, like, taking advantage of the team and just the global atmosphere of, like, listen, I know where I excel, but I also know where my team excels or I know where my colleagues excel. So it's really just like, recognizing that and taking advantage. You're giving me a lot of flashbacks to understanding. Like, okay, there's a core basis around where hopefully you can try and avoid burnout from the start.
Julie Bee [00:21:56]:
Yeah, I think one of the best things you can do when you have a team is, I think, invest in, I love assessments because they give everybody a common language to use. So assessments or some type of system or both, preferably that, where you have a project management methodology where you're all using the same types of the same words and you all know what they mean. I think that's really important no matter what you use. I mean, there's so many different assessments out there that will show somebody's strengths and weaknesses, and there's a lot of different project management methodologies, but I think picking one of those in both buckets can really help you be a more effective communicator as a leader. And when you do need to delegate, it makes it a little bit easier because you're all speaking the same language and you know who is strong and what and where to go with the project.
Tom Burgess [00:22:51]:
Yeah, very, very spot on. That's. That can be from a leadership. I just go back to the idea of you're very process oriented. I feel like I'm very similar. So, like, to us, that might be second nature to them. Listen to Julie here. It's something worth investing in for sure.
Tom Burgess [00:23:12]:
Now, I want to move us a little bit forward here and maybe use your crystal ball to think about five years, ten years, or even more in the present. But we have, or at least you have an understanding of the methodology and approach that you take to help helping business owners with their burnout. How do you think burnout's going to evolve or shift as we look to the future, whether it's business or just personal?
Julie Bee [00:23:37]:
I think, well, first of all, I think it's going to become a diagnosis in medical communities right now. It's not. And it's not. I mean, doctors will talk to you about burnout, but it's not like an official, you get a diagnosis of burnouth. I think that's probably going to change because it is so widespread. I mean, the stats on it are, I would say anywhere between 50% to 80% of us are walking around burned out all the time. Like, that's the stats. I think that we will have more assessment tools.
Julie Bee [00:24:10]:
I think we'll have more access to realistically solving the problem. Telling people to take a vacation, telling people to take time off does not solve the burnout problem. And there's a lot of the, there's a lot of research, actually, that the amount of work you work isn't necessarily what, indicate what, what sets you up for burnout. It's really more about how, how much control you have at your job, if you have a job, or how much, how effective you feel like you are in your role. So that's, you know, with a business owner, how effective their business is, no matter how much they work, probably up to a point. But it's really, if you're even, I would say probably up to 55 hours a week, even that doesn't, if you are very effective at what you're doing, people, you may be very happy even at that pace for a while. So I think we're going to see more, they're going to see less content about taking vacations, using paid time off. I think burnout is going to be more accepted as a conversation, and I think we're going to see really unique and different programs show up in workplaces than what we've seen thus far, which has mainly been focused on wellness and well being, which is important, but doesn't specifically address burnout.
Julie Bee [00:25:29]:
I mean, that's a very specific. That's a very specific topic. So I think that that's kind of where we're heading in the general sense.
Tom Burgess [00:25:37]:
No, that's amazing. You touched on something there that I kind of want to come back to, which is the idea of burnout being recognized medically and just some of the ways that you can recognize and then alleviate from the front side. What are the key differentiators? Or how do you split up the idea of what you need from maybe a personal or medical standpoint, whether that's, you know, therapy or just, you know, like, confidence boosting, whatever that may be, versus the tactical distillation of burnout, and how you really make sure that you're focusing on that. Like, where. What are the key areas that you kind of diverge from? Okay. There's a lot of personal, like, health and wellness, sleep therapy, versus now, how do we really tackle the burnout? Like, where do you see that difference, differentiation?
Julie Bee [00:26:29]:
I mean, I see it based on where the person is. So for me, with the way I see burnout present is kind of opposite of what I think has been written about ice. I see it showing up first and leaders specifically at attentional burnout. And then I go, attentional burnout is you can't focus. You have a hard time getting a sentence out. You're just kind of all over the place. Then you get into emotional burnouth. That's kind of phase two of it.
Julie Bee [00:26:56]:
And that is you're snappy, you're irritable, or you're just. You don't care. You're just like, whatever. I don't care. You know? And then where I think the medical line gets crossed is when you get into that third stage of physical burnout, and that is when you start to have things like panic attacks and when you have serious sleep problems and when you're sick all the time. And that is when I think you'll start to see more. And actually, if I get somebody who comes to me who is, like, having all these things, I'm like, okay, you need. You probably need to go to your doctor, because I don't think I can help you here.
Julie Bee [00:27:35]:
That's kind of the line where I see people with the medical elements and the medical interventions coming in. But if we can catch it before it gets to that, I think we could reverse a lot of burnout and I think that we could prevent a lot of that. I'm sick all the time because I'm so stressed out type of burnout. And that's really kind of where I focus my work, because that physical burnout, I've been there twice in my life, and it is. I mean, it can take you out. Like, when I. In my book, I talk about, you know, I have a business owner friend who shut her business down for two years because she was so burned out. She took a two year sabbatical, like, wasn't making income, just shut it down and sold everything they had and lived on, lived in an rv, her and her husband, for two years, and then was able to come back to work.
Julie Bee [00:28:21]:
But you got to catch it before that. And that point usually aligns with when you start to get into those physical burnout symptoms. And so that's where I think the medical community steps in, is at that point.
Tom Burgess [00:28:32]:
Sure. That's super insightful. Now, as we look to wrap up here, I've got a couple more questions. So, with burnout and now the growing awareness around it, what resources do people or business owners have just at their disposal? You talked about, clearly, you have a lot of resources on your site, and I highly recommend people that are listening to go check that out. But are there support groups, whether it's LinkedIn, how is the network and community growing around this?
Julie Bee [00:29:05]:
Yeah, and it's. It's not growing as fast as I want it. So, um, as far as I know, based on my research, my book is the only, like, one resource out there for specifically for business owners. There's a lot of books about leaders. Leaders, women, men, for burnout, but this one is very specifically for business owners. The other thing I would say is, if you are a business owner, you have to get into a support group. You have to have a support group. And that is way different than networking groups.
Julie Bee [00:29:38]:
That's always a line that I make, because a lot of the times in networking groups, we have to posture or show up as, you know, somebody maybe we're not really feeling like we are in that moment. So it's important to have a support group of other people who understand what you're going through. So that for a business owner, that's other business owners, for, you know, a manager in what you do, that's other managers, that type of thing. So you've got to make sure you have peers you can talk to, that you feel like you can go into that room and tell them whatever is going on. And it might be that you have dinner with one and lunch with another. You know, every couple of months. It's not like you have to get together in one group and I'll talk about it, but you as like the individual, you need to make sure you've got a support group of other individuals that you can talk with. And that is something that I encourage business owners to like day one, start building that and figuring out who those people are, whether they're mentors, coaches, just people you meet at networking events that you really vibe with.
Julie Bee [00:30:36]:
Just, you know, you can meet them in all different places, but making sure you have that. And then the third thing I would say in terms of resources would be rely on your, well, one, be, be very open in terms of like seeking some of the free counseling that's available in your communities. There's a lot of free, like business counseling available out there, so take advantage of that. And when you talk to somebody, be open with them because they may be able to connect you with somebody else that can help you. But I mean, it's, it's, we're still really early on in terms of resources specifically for business owners in this whole burnout thing. Part of it's because there's this thought of, well, you started this thing, so this is kind of the bed you made for yourself.
Tom Burgess [00:31:26]:
You've got to work your way out of it.
Julie Bee [00:31:28]:
I mean, in part that's true, but that doesn't mean you need to suffer the entire time you're doing it. And business ownership is, can be very isolating and very lonely. And that, I think, is the biggest message is like, let's look, you do not have to suffer inside silence with burnout. There are, there are other burnout coaches, there are other burnout strategists out there in the world that may be able to work with you. Talk with somebody, just talk with somebody. I mean, that's really where you got to start because sometimes you won't even notice that you are burned out. I mean, some, most people use code words about it. Most people are like, I'm tired, I'm overwhelmed, I'm stressed, I'm fatigued.
Tom Burgess [00:32:04]:
Yeah, I mean, I fall into that trap, too. And no, I think the, it's funny, like from a partnership angle, it's still pretty greenfield so we're starting to see this burst of communities where I have like minded individuals, whether it's the same role or not, that are maybe building programs from scratch. So I think, you know, just going back to the idea of spend the time to find like minded individuals, business owners that. That have either experienced this or are experiencing with you, because we all know the power of two better than one. And just like, having someone to talk to is really powerful. Now, the other thing that I do want to point out is you have a burnout quiz on your website. Can you walk through what that will do? Clearly that's probably a great resource for people to connect on.
Julie Bee [00:32:53]:
Yeah, that's a great resource. It's really short. It'll take you less than five. It probably takes like three minutes to do. But it just asks some questions and you get scored basically on a scale of you're not burned out, you're kind of sliding towards it, or you are burned. And when you get your results, you get a couple of tips and just some things that you can focus on to help you, to help you along. And that's actually, I don't gate that. So you don't have to even enter anything to get that result.
Julie Bee [00:33:21]:
You can take it without any. Without an email address if you want. So, yeah, so that's a good place to start, too, is just to answer those questions honestly and get a baseline for where you are.
Tom Burgess [00:33:33]:
Very good. Yep. So in case you didn't hit that, Julie Bee. Does have an awesome quiz on her site. I think everyone should take it whether you're a business owner or not. So please head over to there. Now, as we wrap up, Julie, I've got one final question, or actually, it's not a question, but I want you to give. So in terms of a tactical takeaway, you know, someone's listening to this, they're like, maybe, am I burned out? Am I nothing? Clearly they can go take this quiz.
Tom Burgess [00:33:59]:
But even before they do that, what are the one to two tips or takeaways? Whether it's to try and avoid burnout yourself or to, like, be self aware that our listeners can action. Right now, I.
Julie Bee [00:34:14]:
Let me think. There's so many.
Tom Burgess [00:34:16]:
I know.
Julie Bee [00:34:17]:
Yeah, I think that it would be ideal. Well, take the burnout quiz. I mean, that would be the first thing I would say. Take that quiz on my website because that will tell you where you are and what you can do in terms of your stress, you know, if you're heading towards burnout. And then the other. The other thing I really want people to know is that vacations never fix burnout. So you have to. You have to address whatever is.
Julie Bee [00:34:48]:
You are whatever is causing your burnout. You have to understand that taking time off is never going to fix that. You've got to fix it and then take your time off. Yeah, vacation PTO, that goes more in the prevention category. So just having that, like, understanding, I talk to a lot of people who say I took two weeks off and I'm still burned out and I don't know what to do. We live in a society where it's like, just take some time off and you'll be fine. And that's not the case. And so just having some awareness around that and understanding what it is that you need to do to fix your burnout before you even go on vacation, I think is a really important thing.
Tom Burgess [00:35:27]:
Yeah. Yeah. If we can put that into an old school phrase, a vacation a day will not keep the burnout away. I think it's a good one to work on.
Julie Bee [00:35:36]:
Definitely not.
Tom Burgess [00:35:38]:
Julie, this has been amazing. Thank you so much for sharing your experience, your story once again, go check out julie's website, thejuliebee.com. she's got a lot of great resources out there. And we'll catch you another time on the BusinessOS podcast. Thanks for joining.
Kushal Kakkar [00:35:56]:
Thank you for listening to The Business OS. If you're looking for more resources on how to navigate growth, please go to justcall.io./thebusinessos. And don't forget, the journey is easier when you have a business osite.