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Hello and welcome to the Insights and Sounds podcast, a podcast centered around classical music. Join Dr. John Sinclair, and explore composers past and present, their works, and an occasional classical music informational episode.
Insights & Sounds - Derric Johnson Interview
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Dr. Sinclair: [00:00:00] Hello good people. I can't wait to introduce you to a dear friend. This is a wonderful man and a wonder.
A person
who's Written over 2, 800 vocal charts. 12 books. The founder of , the famous group Regeneration and now you probably know him best for his work as the founder of Voices of Liberty at Epcot, but.
What you may know about this person is that he also was the person and the [00:01:00] brain behind Candlelight. His arrangements, his idea, and I thought we needed to have that on record of how this all started. If you don't know anything about me other than I wave my arms for the Bach Festival Society and a professor at Rollins College, I am so fortunate that I ran across Derric Johnson because he is the one who made it possible for me to be involved in Candlelight all this many years later.
And so, in the room, You have accounting for probably over half of the candlelights that have ever been done at, at Epcot. So I'm really grateful to have Derric Johnson as my guest. Welcome Derric.
Derric Johnson: John Sinclair, it's so good to be with you. Anytime, anyplace, anywhere. It's just, you're a, you're a joy. We really have great times, man.
Dr. Sinclair: is. It is. I can't tell you how grateful I am to you. You have, you've changed my life. So I wanted to start with how did candlelight start?
Derric Johnson: [00:02:00] Okay. Backstories are everything to me. Whenever I speak. Or, or write. If it doesn't have a story involved, I don't care. So, so here's the 69 years.
Dr. Sinclair: Good.
Derric Johnson: That was in, uh, 1955. The International Olympic Committee was meeting in Paris, France. On June the 17th of that year, Alexander Cushon was a man from California and he pushed to have the Olympic Winter Games in Squaw Valley, California.
So buildings were erected quickly. First Olympic Village was constructed, And then in 1960 is when the games, these began.
The opening ceremonies were scheduled for Thursday, on February the 18th of that year, but on Tuesday was the first dress rehearsal. Now, , blizzard conditions stopped the dress rehearsal, so everybody's in their quarters. Now the opening [00:03:00] ceremony, , was being handled by Walt Disney. , he was named head of pageantry for the games. he had a dazzling presentation, you'll love this, within the framework of limbic tradition, including the release of 2, 000 doves, myriads of balloons, extravagant fireworks, 1, 300 instrumentalists, and a choir of 2, 500 voices.
Now, Dr. Charles Hurt, who then was the choral guru of America at University of Southern California.
He was picked to conduct the choir, but because of the snowstorm, the blizzard, nothing could happen. So the Menick building, they called it a home, it's a huge hotel, erected just for the Olympic Games, had a big, , indoor patio, roaring fireplace, plenty of room for casual conversation. So Walt Disney, And, , Dr.
Hurt got together for the very first time. They each knew [00:04:00] of each other but never had met. So they had plenty of time on that day just to go through dreams and visions and what might be. , Dr. Hurt said, do you miss anything? He said, yeah, one thing I really miss. Characters. On Christmas Eve. I just missed that. And Dr. Earth said, well, can I help you there? I could get choirs together. Walt Disney said, that's great, why don't you do that in the circle by the train station and I'll be in my office above the fire station over City Hall.
I'll open my window and I can hear carolers. So, Dr. Hurt put together a thousand voices
Dr. Sinclair: Oh my.
Derric Johnson: and circled that area. The problem was Dr. Hurt was directing from the middle.
, he said, I was standing directing in the middle with everybody surrounding me, you know, so the, and it was, it was a serendipitous thing. No publicity, no one who was going to happen except the core staff, but not the public. So [00:05:00] people could hear the music, but they couldn't see it Walt loved it. He said, let's do it again. And so Dr. Hurt said, well, why don't we then put the choir at the train station on risers and at least we can sing down, looking down Main Street so people could have a chance to at least a sense of what's happening. So they did that and of course it was a gigantic success.
People loved it. Well then when Magic Kingdom, when it opened in 1972. The first thing they brought from California was candlelight. It was easy, easy to bring over. It was just then, it was in the Magic Kingdom, as it was at Disneyland. Two nights, Saturday and Sunday. And then the next week, Saturday, Sunday.
It was a mirror program, the same program in, , here in Florida. And Dr. Hurt came and directed that. then you could get 1, 200 chairs in that, in that area there. And it was kind of a Christmas party for a couple of Disney [00:06:00] hierarchy people. They got to invite their friends.
Nobody else could sit down to see anything except their, you know, their friends, what it's for. that went on for a couple, a couple of years. And it was, it was truly a grand event. A thousand voice choir and harrow trumpets up on top of the train station with the wind blowing there. The banners, I mean, it was just, it was just other choir would march all the way up from behind the castle.
Oh, it may be singing carols. That's why it's. Call the candlelight processional. They needed a way to get crowds to come to Epcot because marketing is always based on three things. As good as, better than, or not as good as.
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah.
Derric Johnson: Well, not what's like Epcot, there's not there's a marketing couldn't compare anything to anything.
So they really struggled for attendance. So somebody got the good idea. Why don't we just move Candlelight over to Epcot and , get [00:07:00] crowds. , by then I was directing at what, and what happened in Magic Kingdom just before they asked me to take it over. , Dr.
Hurt age made him feeble. He didn't want to fly across the country again. Doing two in California, he could still do that, but he didn't want to trip. So they had a couple of different people do it outside, but that didn't work. So I was there because of Voices of Liberty. Would you take it? I said, sure.
And, and this is an aside, you'll, you'll love this, John,
okay. They had, they were just using music then. off the shelf. You know, any choir, any place, high school choirs could do it. So it was okay, except some of the material they had picked, they had joy to the world in the key of B minor.
Dr. Sinclair: Oh my goodness.
Derric Johnson: Now you cannot sing joy to the world. It just, and I've got to direct this. It was horrible trying to think, how do I sell these to get smile? Well, I mean, you applaud through it. It was, you know, some arranger had [00:08:00] said one day, Ooh, I bet you nobody's ever thought of this. There's a reason
Dr. Sinclair: I beat you to that. And, you know, I know only a slight a bit about that because in the early days, the Magic Kingdom, a couple of times, uh, our Bach Festival Choir participated in that program because we have in our library, some of those charts that were the stock printed charts and you're right.
They didn't quite
Derric Johnson: So some are just, and one real child is, this was, that should write out of a hymn book. Well, you don't want a thousand voice choir just, I mean, singing four parts
and it, and anyway, so it needed some dress and it. It just wasn't working like it had, and Walt was, of course, gone, I mean, so he wasn't there to say, no, I really want that, so they were going to cancel it, because it interfered with Mickey's very Merry Christmas party, because they would all set up, , then you have to tear it down for two nights.
And then set it all back up again, [00:09:00] and it has to be done at midnight, you know, because you don't do that while guests are there, so over time, and so operations, the other people with the money, it's, it makes no sense to have candlelight. I mean, this thing is 3 weeks long candlelight, 2 nights, I mean, do the math.
So they were going to cancel candlelight. Bob Matheson was one of the vice presidents, said, as long as I am alive. We will do candlelight because that's a statement that our company needs to make to this community in that
Dr. Sinclair: Good for him.
Derric Johnson: really good for so, so we were there, but it was still struggling. Sonny Anderson, who was one of the big, he was in charge of all talent casting.
And I had known Tony from places, Sonny from places before, and we were in a meeting together. Thank you. , it was a big audition that we're doing and I was sitting next to him and he asked me, he said, what, what do you do besides voice? Because I'm his consultant. I never was an employee. [00:10:00] So what do you do when you're not here for voices?
And I said, well, I just finished writing a Christmas musical. It's called a song, a star, a son. He said, let me hear some of that. I said, okay. I flipped to one of the side of my. Walkman in those days, you know, and, , it was, , angels from the realms of glory come and worship.
It was a chart.
Dr. Sinclair: Sure.
Derric Johnson: And he'd listen, boy, his, his eyebrows went up as he listened to it, and it finished. He said, We are this. We should have this a candlelight. This has got sparkle to it. And so he yelled at somebody, you know, Al Fidel, though, some guy down the other end of the table, this big meeting said, you're coming in on this so that we can put this in candlelight this year.
So that was my 1st, 1. To get into candlelight. Of arrangement wise, then a guy named Paul Sharavelli came down from Chicago. Disney had hired him to do some producing work. And he was, he was to produce Candlelight. See, for a while there, I was the [00:11:00] producer, the music director, the music writer, and the conductor.
I mean, it was, it was all mine. I mean, sort of, you know. Whew, and you can't do all three. I was so glad to have a producer come along and handle all the logistic things, you know. And Schoenfeld was just a great musician, and a super guy to work with. , he said, , the one song that works that really, that really works in Candlelight, , it's that angel thing you did. He said, you need to do another one. I said, well, who's going to tell me to do that? He said, I am. I'm the producer. So I want you to do it. So I called Ted Ricketts, who was the. music coordinator for all of the Florida properties. And, and, uh, he said, shall we do this together?
Because I'm not an orchestrator, I'll do choral. Dad said, I'd love to. So we met together. And, , I had sketched off the choral part and a little piano transcription just to give him some guidance for,
Dr. Sinclair: Mm
Derric Johnson: You know, I mean, not, not to be orchestrated, you know, [00:12:00] I want him to know I thought of something, you know, change anything you want, but, and, uh, I forget what the second song was, but he really, Ted liked it and sure as I said, okay, so we're going to do two of the, we're going to change the whole program, but we can't do it at one time.
So two songs every year, and we'll just keep going to it. So, I said, he said, and you and Ted do them, he said, you guys are magic. He said, what, what you do together, it just really, it, it lived away past some of these other charts. And of course, there's two of us who should be anyway. And I had just done an a cappella version of, uh, uh, kind of a gospel song called Rejoice with Exceeding Great Joy.
And, and some of the choir directors had heard that. Uh, an a cappella version that said, can we ever do that for candlelight? So I said, I'll give that a try. So I played it for Ted and he said, no way. He said, it's way too gospel. This is a dress up [00:13:00] kind of program. We're still doing two shows over in Magic Kingdom.
I said, yeah, but I think it really would work for these high school kids. Let's give them something to kind of, you know, feel.
Dr. Sinclair: Mm hmm. Sure.
Derric Johnson: know, beyond theology, Ted said, I don't know, I don't know. I said, come on. So we talked to Ron Logan about it. He wasn't very excited either. Shareville he was.
He said, I think it's a great idea. And if we don't like it, we don't do it two times, we'll never use it again. So we did it that first night. And Ron Logan's wife. Carol was a sweetheart of a lady. After the show, Ron and I are talking about just the, the program because I'm still new at this thing. You know, I'm wanting to check that my tempos are free, you know, from his family.
Ron Logan's the guy running everything entertainment wise. And his wife came, but she just interrupted us. She said, Ron, that Rejoice song, that's the greatest thing you've ever had in Candlelight, ever. I smiled at that boy. If you can get the producer, I mean, the head man, [00:14:00] he'd get his wife pushing him, you know you got it.
So today, that song is probably the most, most requested.
Dr. Sinclair: when the students, I don't need to tell you. When the students start singing it, they light up every single time they
Derric Johnson: You name that title out in the rehearsal tent, they start to clap. They just love it so then , Ted and I just adding , two songs every year. So we probably did about, I'd say for the 10, we have it at 18 songs. We take them, put them out. In fact, you're using one, I think this, this year in your, in your Christmas program that we did for a couple of years and then
Dr. Sinclair: that written for candlelight? Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
Candlelight Dates
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Dr. Sinclair: So, so let me get the dates clear. So, the first candlelight that Dr. Hurt did was in 72.
Derric Johnson: No, he was in Disney in Disneyland. So yeah, the
Dr. Sinclair: So the first one here was in, in Florida, 72. And then in, when did you start directing the candlelight in Florida? [00:15:00] 83.
Derric Johnson: Dr. Hurt kept doing it. Then I had a
Dr. Sinclair: over in
Derric Johnson: of guest guys come in to do it.
Dr. Sinclair: and then it stayed in the Magic Kingdom until Uh, , 1993 it moved , over to Epcot. And then when it came to Epcot,, how many of those were done each year?
Derric Johnson: We've been doing Two every year until then and they call me and they said we're coming to epcot and I said well this you can't get a thousand boys choir On the stage at epcot because there's not only not only size, but the weight You're restricted. You can't get more than 400 people on that stage You know somebody coming in the orchestra and their instruments and your singers.
Yeah, we'll have about 350 singers. I said, really? So yeah, we're going to do 15 nights, two shows a night.
Dr. Sinclair: So thir 30 shows, it went from two to 30,
Derric Johnson: I said, are you up for that? And I said, yeah, sure. I'll do that. So we do that a couple of years and the crowds were big. [00:16:00] Yeah. I
Dr. Sinclair: I remember.
Derric Johnson: whoa. So then they called and said, we're gonna do three shows a night, you
Dr. Sinclair: Oh my.
Derric Johnson: Yeah, I said that , I'm ready to help you out with any way I can, but, and I could physically, I could do three shows, but, but logistically you can't because you have two choirs, you know, one choir at the early show at five 30 and , then, then another choir for the last two.
And so you're going to miss some rehearsal someplace and you don't dare walk onto that stage without having a big rehearsal tent going through. At least the tricky parts because these kids don't know who you are. They've never seen you
Dr. Sinclair: Well, we, we both experienced what it's like to do that and it's, um, it's got some suicidal tendencies to it.
Derric Johnson: So that's when you came, became my good friend and came in
Dr. Sinclair: So let's see if I've got this right. In 1994, we moved to Epcot. Okay. And then when did we go to three programs? Was it 96?
Derric Johnson: Yeah, it would be [00:17:00] so
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah, 96. And you know, that was my first year because they went to three and you were going to George Fox University to work. And so they, they needed someone to fill in for you when you were gone that weekend.
And that was when I was, I was called and I think I just did a handful of them on that first weekend when you were gone One thing I'll throw in here and then you can play off this. I remember my first year of filling in for you.
, but they called me out to talk, and I think Ted was there, maybe Paul was there, and they asked me about what I'd like to conduct candlelight, and I said, I guess so, but I don't really exactly know exactly what candlelight is, I hadn't been here that many years, they told me, and I said, yep, that's what I do, and they said, yep, we know, because Derek had told us that's what you do, and so I, , the end of the conversation was, they said you'd need to shave your mustache and beard.
And I looked at him and said, you're teasing, aren't you? And they said, no, we don't allow facial hair in the front of the park. And I said, well, you know, I'd love to do this, but [00:18:00] I don't think my kids have even seen me without a beard. I don't know if I want to do that. So, , I said, I don't think so, but thank you very much.
If I could ever do anything else, I'd love to be a part of this. Well, a few weeks went by and I get a call from Rich Taylor and , Rich Taylor was, I think at that point he was in charge of entertainment for. Walt Disney World. And so I get a call from Rich Taylor, he said, John, how would you like to be a consultant?
And I said, well, Mr. Taylor, it really sounds good, but what does someone like me serve as a consultant for you? What do I do? And there was a little bit of a pause. He said, he keeps his beard. And , I was an employee and I never have been, I've been a consultant just like you. And so, , I remember where I was headed with this story is I remember, , we were doing the rehearsal and you brought me over, you and Ted, and you looked at me and said, John, you're a fine conductor, but there's one thing I need to tell you.
This is not a classical concert. This is a show you're part of it. And that changed [00:19:00] completely how I viewed my work there. Because before that I was one of these people, it's kind of stood still and wave their arms. And all of a sudden I recognized. Hold it. I've got another job here. And so you changed how I looked at that, that whole program and how I pursued conducting for that kind of music.
And it is, it's been glorious to learn a different way to do things. But anyway, so let's see if I've got this right. So we came to Epcot. The candlelight was brought to Epcot in 94. And in 94, you did 15 nights with two shows a
night. And then in 95, they asked you to do , 30 nights, but so 60 shows
Derric Johnson: two a night.
Dr. Sinclair: to a night and you did them all.
, same thing happened the next year, 97. You went again. And I. , filled in and then it seems to me whether it was 98 or 99 that they went to that dinner package idea.
, or all I remember is all of a sudden I think I was needed and you were doing the [00:20:00] heavy lifting all, almost all the heavy lifting and all of a sudden we started dividing up that lifting because it was so much and then they filled out instead of, 15 days, I think they went the entire month of December and now that, that happened in 96 or 90.
Derric Johnson: Always, when we started to do the, three shows a night, that's when that happened.
Dr. Sinclair: .
And so it varies every year is depending how many there are, depending on where Thanksgiving is. Okay. Now, how many total candlelight pieces have you written probably? You alluded to maybe 18, but I bet you've got a lot more in there that you all did over the years.
Derric Johnson: light? Well,
Dr. Sinclair: 18. So we rotated the 18 in and out. you know what I'd love to hear is kind of the stories of each one. , everyone expects us to do shout for joy first. So is there a backstory to shout for joy?
Shout for Joy
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Derric Johnson: We had another [00:21:00] opener first called Sing Praise to Him. And Ted said we needed a fresher opener.
I said, okay, what do you want to do? He said, let's write one.
Dr. Sinclair: There you go.
Derric Johnson: I said, okay. So we wrote Job for Joy.
Dr. Sinclair: Okay. And there's some of the pieces in there you dare not touch. You dare not touch. Oh, come all you faithful. Now was that an arrangement you wrote strictly for candlelight the first time in and then also the joy to the world? No one. It's beautiful. And was that also a chart written for candlelight directly?
Derric Johnson: grew. I did that for my, I had a high school choir. I was in a church in San Diego many, many years ago now, but a really fine high school choir in my church. And so I wrote the joy, joy, joy. I wrote that for them. And then when region came along, regeneration came, we had done on a Christmas album and then
Dr. Sinclair: I have that album. It's a great one, by the
Derric Johnson: Oh, thank you.
You're very kind. [00:22:00] And, and then, , we did that. And then Voices of Liberty started to do it in the Christmas repertoire. And we sang for one of the luncheons. Paul Schiavelli would have high school choir directors come in from all over the country. You had to pay. To get there, but when you got there, man, it was red carpentry and voices would be there and we did joy to the world one time just and I'll never forget bill.?
Dr. Sinclair: hmm. Renfro.
Derric Johnson: he yelled out. Why can't we do that for candlelight? And
Dr. Sinclair: There you go.
. Well, and the
Insert Music Rejoice With Exceeding
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Dr. Sinclair: rejoice with exceeding great joy that we talked about earlier.
When you're even warming the kids up in the tent, you know, that's one of the pieces you know that they really don't need to go all the way through because they know it. Right. They all know it. And so every night when you're rehearsing and you stop a little ways into it, because you say, I know, you know, that I just need to do the ending with you.
The beginning and the ending is kind of like, Oh gosh, it's really like to sing this piece. So every time you stop them, you kind of see their faces drop. But, and I always say, don't [00:23:00] worry, we do the whole thing in the show. So you're, you're, you're set, but they love that piece.
Derric Johnson: know,
Dr. Sinclair: And if you know, what's interesting to me about that is how that has transcended generations.
Think about, from when Candlelight started and when that piece was introduced into Candlelight and now it has that same impact on high school students as it did from the first time you did it as we do this year
Derric Johnson: year.
Dr. Sinclair: and kids have changed somewhat, the world's changed, but great music and fun music to sing has not changed.
Derric Johnson: And it's music with heart.
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah, it's for sure. That's for sure. , . Now, one of the very favorites every time is
Insert Music - Oh Holy Night
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Dr. Sinclair: Oh Holy Night. Is there a backstory for your writing Oh Holy Night?
Derric Johnson: it's probably the fifth arrangement. I have a bunch of different things. You know, I wonder something different for For Canton, usually songs start soft and build to a big conclusion. That one goes the other way
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah, it does, doesn't
Derric Johnson: I'd get those [00:24:00] kids, that word fall, I'd even make them shout it. Okay, now sing it, but sing the shout, fall.
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah. And
Derric Johnson: And it comes down to nothing, to the light. That last chord, I would always hold it out and no cutoff, just let them fade away. When you run out of breath and the lights go down and out. So I thought, just to focus on what the night does become. Don't wake up the baby. That was always my
Dr. Sinclair: I, I, I, uh, I usually remember to give you credit for when I say that. Uh, but, but I, I use that line and I usually say, you know, the founder of this show, Derric Johnson used to always say, don't wake up the baby here. Yeah. I, I do. I do say that
Derric Johnson: Well, let's see, one of the problems you were into with a big choir like that. Especially when you get some of the really good choirs where they all just want to sing too loud. Everything's
Dr. Sinclair: true. It's
Derric Johnson: Just go for it because you're singing with people who can do
it. But boy, to get the texture of going soft.
Dr. Sinclair: Well, the silent also to take you to the next one.
Insert Music - Silent Night
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Dr. Sinclair: The silent night is magical [00:25:00] too. , is there, is there a story to that one?
Derric Johnson: I, I do have to tell you that with Ted Ricketts and I, you know, and we were really a team, but I had a hard time getting him understanding what some of these textures are. He's a trumpet player, a great trumpet player, wonderful. But then to him, everything is upbeat.
Pretty, pretty much. His background is very Disney, you know. So he said, that's too long, I said, don't, just one, one verse is plenty. I said, no, you, we, you have to have, you have to have one verse that we can set it and then the congregation, and I'll call them a congregation, it's a crowd audience. They need to sing it because who doesn't want to sing Silent Night?
And he said, oh man, no, it's a, cause I had submitted an arrangement that's three verses. One. I said, compromise on two. So that's what we
went with. And he just plays too slow. And I understand that's his taste. The other thing he loved most of [00:26:00] anything I think that I wrote, we talked about just when he was here a couple of weeks ago, , in, in O Come All Ye Faithful, there's a spot where the herald trumpets.
And I scored it so that there's a major seven feel on the top. He said, I love that. He said, Harold trumpets never get to play major seven. You always try ads, you know, and you wrote, he said, that's the, I, when I come to Epcot at Christmas time. If I can't see the whole show, that's, I will always get there for, for, for, you know, for Okamoto Faithful.
That just thrills me. Uh, we had a lady, uh, executive lady, Diane Rinkus was her name. Real classy executive Disney lady. And she was, I was in a meeting and the door was open and she waved at everybody in the room as executives would.
And boy, about 15 seconds later, her head peers around the door jamb and said, Derek, come here for a minute. Come here. Well, it's kind of her house. So [00:27:00] she's that kind of executive, excuse me. So, you know, I got up and walked out to the hall. I just have to tell you, my father has Alzheimer's. I have not heard him speak a word or make a sound for six months.
But I took him to Candlelight with a friend of mine, just, and we're saying that you turned around and had the crowd start to sing Silent Night. And I heard my father singing.
Dr. Sinclair: Oh my goodness.
Derric Johnson: Just the first time I'd heard his voice in six months. And she's standing there, this executive, crying. So he said, don't you dare ever stop singing Silent
Night.
Dr. Sinclair: What a great
Derric Johnson: I told Ted the story. I said, okay, if you say so, I just don't get it. It's funny how, but,
Dr. Sinclair: it differently. But you guys made a, you know,
Derric Johnson: well, listen, we balance each other very
Dr. Sinclair: Lennon and McCartney and Johnson and Ricketts.
Derric Johnson: Right. But the [00:28:00] other, the other side, and I said, it was noised about when one night that Michael Eisner was in the crowd, Oh man. Of course, and wherever Michael would go, all these badge people just clustered all around him, you know, and he was coming to the candlelight, then, oh man, because he is Jewish. Not so much by religion, but certainly by birth. But I mean, if that's too much for him, he's the guy that can say, cancel this, you know, it's over. Oh man. Well, I had, JC was little at that time. Our, she's our youngest daughter. She probably maybe seven or seven or eight and Debbie and JC would sit down and that produces role, which was about four back. And then, Families, , narrator families would sit down the rest of the row.
But then, and, and I would always start off in silent night by, I'd look at JC my daughter first as we sang, and then I, I knew where I was looking, so I would [00:29:00] basically cover everybody by my eyes, to get 'em to sing along. And, , Michael Eisner was seating right in front of, right in front of jc. I mean, he's, he's right there with his wife Joan.
Oh man. I didn't want to look at him in case I'd be getting all phlegmatic daggers. You're looking, oh man, I mean, I was really, I was, I was pretty worried. So I didn't look, I, I, I didn't start with JC. I started over to the spot looking around. But it's like, if you have a toothache, you cannot keep your tongue off that thing.
I just had to look at Eisner. I mean, I just had to. He was sitting there, arm around his wife, just singing away. Saturday night.
Dr. Sinclair: Wonderful.
Derric Johnson: Whoa, that made me feel it. So afterwards, he came over. I'd met him a couple times before, just in some meeting
Dr. Sinclair: Mm-hmm
Derric Johnson: And, uh, he walked away. So that was, that was great. Said, I've, I've heard candlelight in California three times.
Nothing [00:30:00] like this is, this is astounding. What's the difference? I said, well, number one, we get to do it a hundred times here in California to do it twice. You know, and Joan, his wife said, It's the music, Michael. It's the music. And they said, well, who writes the music? And Joan said, Derek writes the music, Michael.
So then he shook my hand again and he said, we need to put this on TV. So, and he had all these, it was, it was the same weekend that they were opening, , Hollywood, , the studios. So they had all this TV stuff, everybody. But he yelled at somebody, get this. You know, we gotta get this tomorrow night. And I said, stuff's already gone.
All the cameras are closed. So we couldn't, and so they never did. But I was glad. 'cause you can't put candlelight, it, it's, it, the choir's too big. If you get the whole choir, you can't see anybody.
Dr. Sinclair: You know, it's an experience.
Derric Johnson: Exactly. You gotta be there. You
Dr. Sinclair: that live experience. You can watch it. I know during the pandemic, they filmed one night and send it around and [00:31:00] I watched it. There's something about live music, something about, so speaking of that, , what is your favorite memory or memories?
You got to have a zillion, but can you boil it down to a few of your favorite memories from candlelight?
Derric Johnson: Oh, man. You know, there really are, are, are, are so many. Number one, it is that it, it's, it's a live show. The thing about live, you risk your soul when you do, there's no click crack, there's no pre records, there's nothing.
Well, you stand out there, you're set the tempo, you set the emotion. , the energy that that provides to an audience. , it doesn't go on film, you know? I think probably the story I've told more than any other we had Walter Cronkite was our narrator one year. I always would go back to the green room and talk to those guys.
It was just so much fun. And, , we'd had some time with Walter and his wife. We had dinner with him. There were 10 of us, but Deb and I got to sit right across the table from Walter. His wife's name was Betsy and just [00:32:00] hear him talk. Whoa, you know, it's his stories. Oh my word. But I, I, I said to him, Why don't you that, you know, we, we created that.
So as a window of oral opportunity, the narrator shouldn't say anything. It's all, it's through scripted. So you read, you finish your scripture and the song starts, the song ends, you're on to scripture, but after the hallelujah chorus, there's what I call that window of oral opportunity for the narrator.
Insert Music - Hallelujah Chrous
---
Derric Johnson: Say something that you would like to say,
address, Yeah. So I said to him, since you just read the Christmas story, why don't you say, and that's the way it was.
Dr. Sinclair: Mm.
Derric Johnson: that's kind of how he would end
Dr. Sinclair: That's his tagline.
Yeah.
Derric Johnson: It's a nice idea. I would choose not to say that. I said, really, why not? You always want to ask why,
you know, never think you know it all.
Too many people put a period in the middle of that line, make it never think [00:33:00] you know it all. Don't ever get, don't ever get to. So you always ask why. And, , he said, well, because if I say, and that's the way it was. Everyone will think of Walter Cronkite. We are not here tonight to think of Walter Cronkite, are we?
We're here to think about a baby born in a manger, bring peace and love into this world. I would choose not to divert the attention.
Dr. Sinclair: Wow. What a classy answer.
Derric Johnson: Whoa.
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah. What a deep
Derric Johnson: I was wishing every choir director, every preacher could just don't divert. The attention is not about you. Stop it.
Dr. Sinclair: Well, you know, I always feel that way about conducting. I always think that. While we have an important role, , we're kind of the, main server. You know, in your case, it was different because you were the cook and, and, and the chef, you, you made the music, you grew the music, you cook the music, and then you conducted the music for me.
I'm just the [00:34:00] server. , you did the music. I help prepare it, but I make it look good to go to the plate to the audience. , and that's quite a difference. And that must've been really special. , I can't, I can't get my head around it cause I don't, I can't write
Derric Johnson: I can't
Dr. Sinclair: a, well, I can write, but nothing like you.
And, and so it must be really gratifying to, to think of the creation of these pieces and know what it means to people. Not only to the people singing, but the people coming to hear, , there's not telling you anything new. There's so many devotees that come to candlelight every year. And I couldn't count the people who've said, , this is what Christmas starts for me. And this is where I come to get inspired.
Derric Johnson: here's the story. This couple had come down, I unweighted, because I'm a pastor at heart,
really, that's what I started out to be when I began my career,
you know, um, I always stay around until the last dog is hung. I just, so people can, my pastor always said [00:35:00] to me, people need the chance to say thank you. You don't need to hear it, but they need the opportunity to say thank you. Thank you. So give them that chance. It's not about you feeding. It has nothing to do with you. It has to do with them. So this couple came down.
He was all kind of humped over. It was a cold night, bundled up and they waited a long time to get to me, but she came up and she put her hand down, shook my hand and said, I just want you to know that we come down from Wisconsin every year for candlelight.
This is our Christmas present to each other. , you have no idea what this means to us and knowing that you wrote it, we'd like to come but last January, my husband was not feeling well and went to the doctor. He has cancer, stage four. Doctor said, give you six months. It was last January. He said that we walked out of the doctor's office and my husband looked at me and said, I have to live long enough.[00:36:00]
To your candlelight one more time
Dr. Sinclair: Oh,
Derric Johnson: Then he stuck out his hand shook my hand really he said thank you for keeping me alive Then they turn and walk back into the
Dr. Sinclair: Uh, I get goosebumps hearing that
story.
Derric Johnson: and you know, here's the interesting thing Ted was standing right behind me I didn't even know it had a baseball hat on
Dr. Sinclair: Mm hmm.
Derric Johnson: but look and I said, did you hear that?
And he said I'm half of that
Dr. Sinclair: Yeah.
Derric Johnson: So that's it, Ted. That's why we do what we do. , it's not slick and I mean, it's just, it's real to people. So, yeah, I've got tons of stories
Dr. Sinclair: Oh, , that's so touching. I mean, how do you, how do you follow that? It's, it must be continually gratifying to go and hear a performance of your music and to know that you were the, you created it.
Um,
Derric Johnson: times,
Dr. Sinclair: Most times? Well, I, I know it depends on the performance. I, I can imagine that. Uh, but, [00:37:00] but, uh,
Derric Johnson: yes, it's always wonderful. It is.
Dr. Sinclair: so is there any one thing that I have completely missed or that we have missed that you would like people to know about candlelight? The bones are so good on this piece. , I would love to know statistics. I don't think we'll ever be able to figure it out of how many people have seen candlelight.
And you see, and the reason you can't quite get a hold of that is because. There's the people who sat in seats, but there's thousands that you're walking by and, or, and they walk by and they stand back there, you know, many nights I look back and the audience is filled, but there's, there's thousands back
there. So it would be interesting to hear how many people have actually experienced candlelight and how many people come back yearly or often to hear candlelight.
Derric Johnson: It has been many millions. , I try to check it one time, just.
To justify its existence because sometimes to operational people you have to do that, you know [00:38:00] You
Dr. Sinclair: are an institution, a legend, and your work is inspiring to all of us. , and I, I personally can't thank you enough, but I'm thinking you on behalf of all those millions of people who came to hear your
music and you and Ted, you and Ted are my heroes and I, I am, , I'm one of those, not only benefactors, but fans, and I just can't thank you enough.
And I want you to say goodbye to our audience for us today.
Derric Johnson: Well, thanks for listening. If you're still with us, because it's been great to be with my good friend, John Sinclair, I, I define your best friends are not the people who spend the most time with. It's the people you have the best time with. And John is that kind of friend. We just love to get together and sometimes it's a minute or two sometimes it's an hour or two but we never run out
and You and the audience keep listening to these podcasts because the man [00:39:00] has something to say it's always worthwhile I cherish his friendship.
I am just plain proud to know you Johnson Claire
Dr. Sinclair: Thank you, Derek. Bless you. And thank you, audience. I hope you've enjoyed the inside of Candlelight, the origins, and you have talked to the creator today, the creator of Candlelight. And thank you so very much for joining us on this podcast. And remember, the power of music belongs to each and every one of us.
Use it for the good of the world. Goodbye.
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