FounderGPS

Hate dealing with returns? You’re not alone. In this episode, we sit down with Naial Casanovas Mack, founder of DropUpp, a startup making online returns effortless by picking them up from your doorstep. We talk about the pain points of e-commerce returns, how DropUpp solves them, and the surprising behaviors of online shoppers. Naial shares the journey of building DropUpp, from its initial concept to a full-fledged business, and the challenges of marketing a service people don’t know they need—until they do. Tune in to learn how he built a tech-driven logistics company using no-code software, why customer interaction is key, and how DropUpp is scaling up to take over Philly.

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Welcome to the Shoemaker Films Podcast.

This podcast explores stories of local businesses, entrepreneurs, and creatives, while also offering tactical tips and valuable knowledge on video marketing, social media, and navigating the digital landscape.

At Shoemaker Films, we focus on crafting professional video content that can help your businesses thrive online. Whether you're looking to launch a new product, tell your brand story, or engage with your audience on social media, we're here to help!

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Creators and Guests

Host
Dane Shoemaker
Founder and Owner of Shoemaker Films, Dane Shoemaker is an entrepreneur and filmmaker who interviews business owners, creatives, and brand-builders across the Greater Philadelphia region and beyond.

What is FounderGPS?

FounderGPS is the official podcast of Shoemaker Films. Join host Dane Shoemaker in 1-on-1 conversations with entrepreneurs, founders, and creators across the globe. Join the adventure with guests as they share their experience building in public and explore the platforms and culture across the digital marketing and business landscape. Watch and listen to inspiring stories while gaining some practical business advice. Visit www.shoemakerfilms.com for more details on our company, and stay up to date by following us on Instagram @shoemakerfilms

Voiceover:

This is the Shoemaker Films podcast.

Dane Shoemaker:

Naial Casanovas Mack, founder of Drop Up. Drop Up. Pretty interesting business model. So interested to hear more about that and your story and how you came up with the idea and, you know, yeah. So let's just dive in.

Dane Shoemaker:

Tell us about your tell, you know, tell tell me first about your business.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. So drop up came about almost about three years ago now. And it is a startup where we pick up online returns at home and drop them off for you. Like, have you ever had to return something?

Dane Shoemaker:

Of course.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Do you know the how com not complicated, but just how time consuming it is to Yeah. Leave your house, go somewhere, plan. If you have two returns going to two different to two different places, now that's probably thirty, forty minutes out of your day. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so drop probably thirty, forty minutes out of your day. Yeah. And so drop up kind of solves that solution of the same way you ordered something to your house. Use the same way you return it. Just drop it off at your front door, side door, porch.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

We'll come pick it up, drop it off at UPS, Whole Foods, Staples, post office, anything anywhere anywhere where it has to go Yeah. We'll pick it up and drop it off. So any any brand, as long as you as long as you have a PDF of the label Yeah. Or a QR code for the thing, we can handle it.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. So you're essentially just saving the the customer's trip to UPS, FedEx, USPS.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Correct. So we are total convenience service. Right. So there's some customers who will do their own returns, but sometimes they have, you know, two or three items going to different places. That's when they use us.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But if they're going to Whole Foods and shopping anyway, they'll do like, okay, I'll do myself. And that's that's fine. Like, it's not it's not for everyone for every situation, but we have some customers who just use us religiously, you know. We we have we we're gonna pick up a bunch of items at their house weekly. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. So you're really benefiting from people being lazy and people We we like to look at it as

Naial Casanovas Mack:

not lazy, but busy. But busy. Busy people. Sure. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

And and it it is it is, you know, the the sign of the times that people are very busy.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. We we do

Dane Shoemaker:

I mean, I do pretty much all my shopping online. Right? Except for Like, 95%. Yeah. If I bought my a pair of jeans, my like, once every two, three years pair of jeans I gotta buy, you know, at at the mall.

Dane Shoemaker:

But, other than that, everything's Amazon. We do a lot of our shop, our grocery shopping Yeah. Whole Foods, they deliver now.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Which is great

Naial Casanovas Mack:

as well as too.

Dane Shoemaker:

You know, Costco, once a month, will do delivery as well, which is which is a game changer.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. You

Dane Shoemaker:

know? So you're saving money. In my opinion, you're actually saving money by ecommerce.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's the time.

Dane Shoemaker:

You're saving your time, but also you're not buying all the stuff on the shelf that you're walking around at the store. You just buy, oh, look at that sauce. It's like $15

Naial Casanovas Mack:

of Whole Foods or whatever it is.

Dane Shoemaker:

So, you know, you're really providing that connection of, hey. Something doesn't fit. I don't need

Naial Casanovas Mack:

this anymore. It's not what I expected. And it's it's hard to, tell the customer and show the customer how much of their time they're consuming in their in their day. It's kind of a chore Yeah. Right now.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Returns are kind of they've become a chore Yeah. Like doing laundry, doing your dishes, cleaning. Like, do you do you not expect someone to pay someone to go do do your returns for you? But if you they don't realize how much time they're spending on doing returns. If they live next to UPS, it could be a ten minute round trip.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. But if they don't and this it's it's more powerful in suburbs where a round trip would be thirty, forty minutes depending on where you live. Yeah. Or if you have to go to UPS store and, FedEx or UPS store and post office, that's probably an hour.

Dane Shoemaker:

So you're kinda streamlining the whole process. Exactly. Exactly. Actually, this is one thing. Personally, I noticed that, I did an Amazon return maybe a year ago or something like that, and I was able to go to Whole Foods.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Like, they accept the

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Exactly.

Dane Shoemaker:

However, I did an Amazon return about two weeks ago, and the only option was, like, UPS. Yeah. So which I was confused about.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So Yeah. So different different items, will be different vendors, and they will have different return options. Okay. I think they try and funnel more, returns through Whole Foods because it's no box on label QR code. Some stuff will need packing.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So you have to take care of that. But they've opened up, like, Amazon return hubs in every single, Whole Foods, which helps the customer. They still have to leave and and Yeah. And go and do that.

Dane Shoemaker:

I drive sales for Whole Foods.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Exactly. I I have customers who still shop at Whole Foods, but still use us to return for the Whole Foods. And they'll text me saying, hey, I just went I just shopped at Whole Foods. I I walked out, and there was eight people online for returns, and that's why I use you.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. They they they will still it's still streamlined to where customers can, plan their returns to their grocery runs. Yeah. But those still don't wanna stand in line, in behind eight people to do return. And sometimes there's no there's no one there.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Makes sense.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But they still just use us, and and they also, so they could plan to go and do the return when they go do their groceries, but they don't. Just easier to just drop it off your at your front door and and Absolutely. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Yeah. So how does it work? I mean, is there a monthly fee? Is it a per pickup?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So, there are different options. There's a one off option for $5.99. Every pickup, you can do up to four items. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So, $5.09 $5.99 for one pickup. There is a 10 per month option for two pickups a month, fifteen dollars a month for four pickups a month, or $25 unlimited pickups, unlimited returns.

Dane Shoemaker:

Okay. So okay. So $10 a month will get you two pickups.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Will will give you two

Dane Shoemaker:

Basically, up to eight items per month.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Items. Yeah. Okay. Got it. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

For each pickup. Up. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. What's the what's the most that you've ever had a pick up before?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

There was there is a limit on there was a limit on four items for pick up, because Okay. Got it. There was the the more items that are at the door, the more time the driver has to go through and sort through, each item. Yeah. Because the items right now is you put a description of what it is.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Blue, blue shoes, white shoes, necklace, black jacket, blue sweater. So the more items that there are and if they're similar, it takes even more time because you gotta check the tags and and kinda match them with the description. Okay. So there's one customer, I believe. I think they did 17 items in one pickup.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And that's that's the after that day, I I I put limits on Okay. On items per pickup.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. So somebody can do for the $25, that's unlimited pickups, but it's still only

Naial Casanovas Mack:

four max. And they can do you can still do, you know, a pickup today, a pickup tomorrow, a pickup the next day of four items.

Dane Shoemaker:

What's the most pickups you've done with a particular client?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like a monthly or, like, at

Dane Shoemaker:

In one month, how many times did you go to their house?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I've I mean, probably the no. Probably four times. Okay. Multiple items. Alright.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. Because there there's always that limit of of four pickups per month. I had I had set that limit before. Got it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. Yeah. Got it. So no one no one could really do more than four pickups a month. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But there was there was no item limit. Got it. Until I arrived and there was the 17 item. They were very well labeled. I will give kudos to that customer.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. It was, you know, one it was like one through 17 Yeah. And it was one through 17 in the description. So I will give that customer kudos for Yeah. For that.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It was very easy, but it was still 17. Yeah. Yeah. And there's also I also added a a size limit too because there was no size limit before. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so I picked up, another customer, and they had two huge, I guess, bed frame, things. And it was, you know, from the front of my car all the way at, to my trunk. And after that day, now there's a size and and weight limit. That's what I'm frightened. So you you

Dane Shoemaker:

just go learn it. You can buy, like, like, mobile homes on Amazon now. That would be, quite

Naial Casanovas Mack:

the predicament. Yes. That's when you say, hey. You call the cops. Hey.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I can't put this in my car. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And another one, there was, one customer was scheduled for an area rug.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And he's like, area rugs, they could be big, they could be small. It was big. It was long. Really? One more engine, it wouldn't have, fit in my car to to pick up.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty. Yeah. That's the end but you're just still learning of of how to Sure.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

How to interact with the customer and how they you can set simple instructions for, like, how to use a product. Yeah. And it's just, like, the

Dane Shoemaker:

people People will sell it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Won't read it.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so you really have to think about how they're thinking and do it as clear as day. Mhmm. And even with that, like, even with an oversized button, peep people won't click that. Mhmm. And you just try different fonts, different positions, and it's just sometimes they just don't click it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. Or or or they don't want to. But you deal with it. You learn.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right. Right. They just wanna see if I hey. Can I get away with this or not?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Exactly. Exactly. It's human nature,

Dane Shoemaker:

I guess.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Right? Yeah. Absolutely.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's cool, though. That's awesome. So so you've been in business for how long? Three years?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Almost two. Almost three years now. Three. Okay.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. That was how did you come up with the idea?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I came up with the idea. I had the idea of, when you order something to your house Yeah. These brand new boxes that are from five, ten miles away that get delivered to your house from a warehouse, nearby. They come in, they're brand new boxes. It still has like a it could still it could still be used three or four more times after you open it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Mhmm. Because they're brand new. They're off the they're, straight from the warehouse to your house. Maybe a couple of bumps and bruises, but they're still structurally fine Yeah. To get used three or four more times.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. And so the initial idea was, let me make my rounds, pick up all these, shipping boxes that people from from people's orders. Okay. Refurbish them, like, lit laser off the labels, steam off the the the, the packing tape or whatever it was on there. One, a lot of labor for that.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So that was a little that was some friction there. And then I said, let me pick them up, refurbish them, and then whenever you need a return, I'll drop off the box at your house again with the tape and with the label. Back then, the labels were mostly PDF labels. Okay. So instead of you having to print or find tape or something, I will drop off a refurbished box for you to use.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And then not not only that, I'll come pick up your return and drop it off at post office UPS. Wow. Okay. But that posed a problem where I was coming to your house three times, hypothetically three times, for a couple of copper boxes and a return. Didn't make sense.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Boxes are extremely cheap to buy and make. Yeah. And so that just it just it was a pity that these brand new boxes would go into the trash or recycling when they don't have to be popped up and be made into another box. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's just it's it's it's a little silly, but it they're extremely cheap to make. Yeah. So that that didn't make sense. But I hit on another problem was the was the returns.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so I was like, okay. And you go asking people. I sent a survey out. I think that close to 70 people answered the survey. I I sent out all I sent it out all to my friends, and then my friends, send it to their friends until they all answered.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I didn't wanna give away kind of the the idea or what I was trying to build. I just wanna test the waters on, like, the the online ordering, returns, what they did, what to do with the boxes. So I kind of got some a whole info on that. Yeah. And I found out people hate returns.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And that is every conversation I've had with people about drop up or returns, I say, oh, I'm in returns. And the next phrase is, oh, I hate returns. That is a phrase I hear the most is I hate returns. And so that's how the idea came up.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It was like, oh, alright. People hate returns. They're they're still simple to do. You just take it to somewhere, UPS, Whole Foods. You still have to leave the house.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And so that's kinda where the idea started was, alright. Let me start picking up, returns to people and doing them for and and and doing it for them. And I started that, and that's kind of how the idea was born.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's amazing. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you would it it's it's something where it's so easy. You can get something from around the world and have it landed at your house, at your front door Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

With a click of a button. But then to return it, you have to leave the house. Come on.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I'm surprised that there aren't like, this is this is not

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I'm surprised.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I mean, I know that I don't even know. You used to be able to have schedule a pickup by by FedEx or UPS or something like that. You might be able to do that still if it's especially

Naial Casanovas Mack:

if it's You can still yeah. You can still do that. Okay. I've I've talked to a lot of customers and the, like, example, the UPS pickup windows, they'll give you, I think it was, like, a four hour window. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And sometimes they don't even show up. Right. So we're just providing a a reliable pickup service and a no box no no box no label. Like, you can't you can't have a QR code return and have UPS pick it up. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It has to be packed and lay has to be at least packed, and they'll bring the label for it. Okay. The power of us is you can just leave a raw item that's no box, no label, which is most of Amazon returns. Yeah. And we'll come pick it up and and, categorize it in in our system and then drop it off at at Whole Foods Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Or UPS where wherever it has to go Right. Right. With the QR code.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. So talk to me about the infrastructure of this. Like, you so you have do you have drivers going out?

Dane Shoemaker:

Is there an app? I think is there it's just a web app for today? Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So the the web app I'll start with the web app. Yeah. I'm nontechnical. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I joined this pre accelerator. It's a twelve week accelerator. And they introduced me to this no code software. And which is basically I explained it

Dane Shoemaker:

as Bubble or what is it?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Bubble. Bubble. Yeah. Okay. Bubble.io.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yep. And I explain I explain it as Wix on steroids and cocaine. Yeah. Because it is crazy powerful on what you can do. I can build anything now.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. It's pretty cool.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Two certain limits.

Dane Shoemaker:

I've played around with it Yeah. A while ago Yeah. Yeah, on some different stuff.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's a huge learning curve. Yeah. Like, which is just drag and drop and, you know, a couple of things. There is a huge learning curve to bubble. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But once you know how to do it, I can go and change my whole software tonight That's amazing. Without having to call anyone and or or wait, you know, overseas.

Dane Shoemaker:

So you built the whole web app?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Built the whole thing. It was a so from in the pre accelerator, it was, like, a twelve week program. And in that twelve weeks, I came in with a raw idea of the refurbishing the boxes to twelve weeks later, full MVP built a web app, full MVP built, paying customers and people using the app. Okay. And so that was, like, within three months, I had I basically learned the basics of Bubble to where I could just build something that worked.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And then once I launched that, then I say, okay. This is very ugly. Let me now now that I know a lot more, let me revamp the whole thing. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And we're probably on version maybe three or four Okay. Of of the web app. But you basically but you basically start with the like, where do you start? Sign up page. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And you do you have an input, which is your username, email, password, confirm password, and then a button that says sign up. Okay. And then the power of bubble is it's like when you you tell it when you when the when the user presses sign up, if these three inputs are empty, don't do anything, or give an alert saying, hey. The emails the you need an email. If these three inputs are full, create an account with this email, this password, and sign the user in.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. And that's literally how you start is a sign in page. Okay. And you start playing around with that. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. And then, you know, thirteen months later, and I have the whole version what I have now Wow. Is is the whole drop up web app. And there is a customer portal, there's account, there's admin portal, there's a driver portal, and there is a store portal for our drop off points in in in Philly.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. So that's an that's a newer part of the business. Right? You have

Naial Casanovas Mack:

That is

Dane Shoemaker:

you have drop physical drop drop off. So the yeah. The the

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I haven't come up with a word with it yet, but it's for now, it's a

Dane Shoemaker:

Drop drop off drop off. Drop off drop off points right now.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. I have not come up with a word, a name for it, but it is these the home pickups for the cities are more complicated. Yeah. Because you can't just leave it outside. Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so I had to come up with a system to where the customers could easily return something without having to go to UPS, to Whole Foods. Anywhere, they have to go go drop it off. So, I found these mailbox stores. Mailbox stores are independently owned stores where the customer pays a subscription to get their packages sent to, that store and get held so the items doesn't stay don't stay on the front doorstep where it gets stolen within thirty minutes Yeah. Less.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So the this store can accept all the customers, packages, but they can only accept returns that are packed and labeled. So if a customer comes in with a UPS QR code, a Whole Foods QR code, they can't return it unless if it's packed and labeled with a PDF of the label. Ready to go. Ready to go. They just come scan it and pick it up.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. And so I was like, oh my god. Like, I can give these stores access to handling not only their customers' packages, but also the customers' returns. So in one stop shop, they can do anything that they order online or have to return. Great.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And then they can and then they can plan to drop their packages off when they're or when they're picking up their next order, which is within a couple days of, picking up the last order. Yeah. So there's no time spent returning. They're already going in to pick up their items. They're just dropping the stuff off there and picking up their next order and going home.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And so that's, that's been new in the past three months. Okay. Opened up I'll be doing my eighth location tomorrow, Tuesday.

Dane Shoemaker:

Nice.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So it's been very exciting. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Yeah. So these are essentially, like, mom and pop owned, mail box shops.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Independently owned stores. There are what's called the mailbox store, which is more of, like, the ordering, but also a pack and ship store, which which are, you go there, you have to ship something, they they have better rates. And instead of having to go to a UPS, we just you can just, ship it from there, which is closer to your house. Yeah. So all these locations now, you can not only ship stuff and receive your mail, but you can also return anything you have as long as you have a a QR code, you can drop it off right there.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Nice. That that seems like a great that in and of itself is a great idea. I I used to live in South Philly Yeah. For, like, probably seven years ago.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So you know

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. And, like, obviously, package stuff was a huge issue. We never really got around, but it was just kind of, like, we just ordered less or had stuff shipped to our, you know, parents' house or whatever or or at work. I had a lot of stuff shipped shipped to my office down in Yeah. Downtown.

Dane Shoemaker:

So, yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So these these mailbox stores now are kind of popping up Yeah. Around Philly just to help the the neighborhood kinda handle there. Yeah. If even if there's no theft problem, you're just you're just uneasy, and you you have to wait at home. If if you work from home, sure, you can pick it up.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But sometimes you just miss the knock or miss the the the doorbell. Well, you might not use the the doorbell. Sure. But the package just sits out there and, you know, you're just uneasy. So they'd sign up anyway to go, for these mailbox stores.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. And and they they appreciate the extra foot traffic, right, of, like, hey. We're gonna put a drop up box here. They don't mind more people doing it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And that's that's what it's it's not a drop up box. I'll I'll explain that a little later. But Okay. Yeah. They don't the more foot traffic that goes to the store, the better for any any store.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Whether retail mailbox or pack and chip. There's just more people into that store to see what it is.

Dane Shoemaker:

So Explain what what the what it's not a box. It's

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's not a box. So the the when when the customer has a return, they'll go in. They'll, if they don't have an account already, they'll sign up real quick, upload the QR code, pay and drop it off there, and then the person at the counter will check it in in the system I built for them.

Dane Shoemaker:

Okay. Oh,

Naial Casanovas Mack:

nice. And so then it gets categorized. If it's packed already, a QR could go a QR code goes on it. So it categorizes that item. So when when I come, I can just scan the QR code on the item, and I know exactly what it is, what the customer uploaded, and where it's going.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So that's the the the person at the desk is only checking it in. So I know, one, when stuff gets tricked in at the store, and two, what that item is when I pick it up. Yeah. So the customer from sign up to walking out the door is three minutes.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's great. So you've really you've built, like, a moments, like, partnerships with these Yeah. Stores. They're kind of integral now with to this the software and everything.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So now they're coming to one. I'm not sending them any, not many clients just yet. Right now, it's their existing customers that are, like, using the platform. The next step for me now is to partner up with online retailers in the Philly area so they can use those drop off points instead of having the customer have to ship the the return back to them.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So come up with partnerships too so they can instead of the kind of option of shipping it back or dropping it off, for free at, no box on the label at one of these drop off points that I'm, partnered up with. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's great. Yeah. You do you have any employees today?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Contractors or No employees. Contractors. The drivers.

Dane Shoemaker:

The drivers. Yeah. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

We have, five, part time drivers whenever I need them. Okay. And they do the rounds in in the morning. I do the pickups. We do pickups every day, Monday through Sunday.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And these store pickups in the city would be Tuesday, Thursday, or Saturday. So they kind of get the shifts of in the morning or the store, pickup. Store pickups happen around midday. Right?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

And how how how have you, you know, sourced these drivers? Are they Funny.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Signing up, looking for a word early? Funny enough, when I was on, Fox twenty nine Okay. A year a year ago, January. Okay. They reached out for for a segment.

Dane Shoemaker:

Nice.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I got so many hits on my contact Us page about drivers, about people wanting to drive for drop up. Yeah. And so the whole power of building yourself with with with your no code because I was getting so many requests. I was like, oh my god. I I should let me do a, a driver application page.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So within, I think, ten or fifteen minutes, I had I built a just a simple thing where you can put name, last name, email, your ZIP code, date of birth, if you wanna be full time contractor, or part time, some notes, and you just submit it. And then all all that goes into a database. So within minutes, I push this new, this new page so drivers could just apply Yeah. To join the wait list.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And so that's what I did. What what went on there. And a bunch of people, submitted maybe I wanna say, like, 15 to 20 drivers, submitted the form and come into our vet database. But I searched for drivers, funny enough, on, on Nextdoor.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Nextdoor. Okay. Yeah. I put out a post on Nextdoor. You will not believe this.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I have an account for the city and an account for the, for the main line.

Dane Shoemaker:

Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I posted on both. And I was like, hey. I'm the founder of drop up. You know, the holidays are coming up. I'm looking for, you know, extra extra drivers.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Wanna make a couple bucks do a couple hours of work Yeah. Of overflow. And so I must have gotten forty, eighty comments and messages on each account. Wow. And so I was not expecting that from from Nextdoor.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And so that's how I found these just drivers who just wanna do, like, a couple hours a week, extra, make a couple bucks, a week. Yeah. And so that's that's how I found, most of the drivers and I post on on a couple Facebook ones. But Nextdoor, powerful.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

I mean I like Nextdoor too.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. If you're

Dane Shoemaker:

like local hyper local Yes. Kind of, like, mountain

Naial Casanovas Mack:

biking. Yeah. And it's good because I wanted drivers in the main line, but also wanted drivers in the city. Because I didn't want kinda like a someone who lives in, I don't know, Malvern driving to the city Yeah. To go pick up packages.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Right. Right. Right. I got, some drivers from next door in the city and from next door in the main line, which is nice. It was great.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It was fantastic.

Dane Shoemaker:

So you almost have, like, two different hubs, almost Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And, you know, if if if some of the drivers it's very manual process right now. I kind of ask them, hey. Are you are you available tomorrow to do a couple of pickups? Okay. So, you know, I'll start with one driver in each location.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

If none in the city can do it, I just have, you know, a bunch here where I can just send them Yeah. To say it's it's extra time, but Yeah. Stuff gets picked up. Yeah. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Which is the most important thing.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's cool.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Talk to me about, like, I don't know, some early challenges, you know, that you face. Like, anything that you were able to, you know, overcome

Naial Casanovas Mack:

or I think you

Dane Shoemaker:

can share?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I think the when you come up with your idea, when you're when you're coming up, like, online return picking up online returns at home, like, this is a genius idea. You know? Everyone's like, oh my god. Yeah. You should do it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Totally do it. It's like, okay. Let let me do that. And you think it's gonna blow up. You think when you launch, like, people are just gonna go sign up, use a service every single day.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

You know? And when I launched, it was like crickets. I should've in hindsight, one thing I learned was when you're gonna when you're gonna launch a product, a company, launch anything, build up the hype. Yeah. And that's what I should have done on the socials is kind of make an online presence before, launching.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So there's some hype and you feel a little better. And there's, you know, you can do, like, a hard launch at, like, a physical vacation would be kinda cool too. Mhmm. So there's people there taking pictures, you know, something. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But it didn't build up the hype. And so when I launched, it was, you know, we're launched. Like, no one cares. Yeah. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So that's one one thing I should have done was, build up the hype. Yeah. And I regret doing that, but, you know, you learn.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I mean

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I've seen companies launch multiple times every year. And companies do launch multiple times every year. The the launching isn't, it's in constraint to one time. That's it. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I've seen customers rebrand and launch again or different colors. Relaunch, again and build up the hype to that Yeah. To launch and invite a bunch of people. Yeah. In hindsight, I didn't have the resources to to, like, a physical launch, but, you know, you learn.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yep. Yeah. I would've I would've done something.

Dane Shoemaker:

Well, yeah. You I mean, now you you got customers. You're rolling. You you can't, yeah, Train's left the station, so to speak. What kind of marketing are you doing today, though?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So marketing, I've turned off, Facebook ads. Okay. Just pouring money into that. It's dumping money Yeah. With some results.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So I resorted to word-of-mouth is huge, especially in, like, this mainline area. Mhmm. You have to build trust with the customer too because people will see will see your ad and be skeptical. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like, oh, well, why why would I pay someone to do that? Like, you don't have to. Yeah. You can't no one's stopping you from doing it yourself. I I used to post on on Nextdoor.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I was trying to find ways, like because you can't you can't self promote on these on these Facebook groups or or or Nextdoor.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so trying to find ways to just kinda promote, get the name out there. Yeah. And so, on Nextdoor, I'll be like, hey. You know, I I found this, you know, cool company to drop up. You know, they come pick up, your your your online returns at home.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I use it in my household, and people chew you apart. It's crazy. People have no I think people just sit there and just kinda find just post

Dane Shoemaker:

Of course. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

To just attack you.

Dane Shoemaker:

What kind of stuff were they saying? Like

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like, who's gonna pay for this? Like, people people can do it on their own. People are so lazy. Yeah. There was one Sure.

Dane Shoemaker:

Sure. But you're saving time.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

You know? But people don't understand the the the time slash value Yeah. That they could be saving. Mhmm. And that's fine.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's a drop up is not for everyone. Mhmm. It's not for everyone yet. Yeah. And like, even on I was running ads, and there's this one person just commenting on every single drop of ad.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I don't know what they did. They just just find every single one and comment. Oh, people are lazy. Like, why would people pay for this? I do it on my own.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I was like, that's that's fine. Like, you can just scroll past it. Just scroll past it.

Dane Shoemaker:

I probably commented on one ad and then just kept getting served ads, and now they're probably

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So exactly. Right. Right. They're they're engaging. Oh, look.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

A potential customer. Like, no. No. Everything it was just the nasty stuff. And I Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I resorted to, people some disgusting stuff too. So, I resorted to just being that account that just, like, responded with the same energy act. Yeah. That's like I stuff I can't say, but it's just it's just funny. Like, you're really, like, good good for a job.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

You know? Just just, like, boom, a burn towards them. That's that's you know, I'm having fun.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I I like a lot of your videos that you've posted also. Do you Yeah. Talk a little bit about your

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. So that's, that's also too is is doing your own making your own content on a budget. Yeah. You have a $1,400 camera in your in your in your pocket that you use every day, and you don't use it for for camera stuff. So I was like, okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So I have a garage behind my house. I turned into a a green screen, emptied everything out, cleaned everything, bought it's incredibly cheap to buy, like, a 50 by 50 or 50 by 80 sheet of green screen. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's, like, $50.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I was like, So I got that, hooked up the bar, attach it to the edges, and it's a nice I mean, it's a it's a good set. It's a good set. And I started doing, my ad. My ads are, kind of copied off of have you ever seen the the Mint Mobile commercial Yeah. With Ryan Reynolds?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. Right. I mean

Dane Shoemaker:

He does. Those are good.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Love those.

Dane Shoemaker:

Those are good. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Love those. Yes. He has a more established brand and, you know, exactly what they're doing. So I was like, okay. Let me let me try and do those.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And my ads are modeled after after his ad too. That's awesome. Yeah. I don't know if you saw the, did you receive the Victoria Beckham or the David Beckham, Netflix show?

Dane Shoemaker:

I I've I've never watched it. I've seen, like, a lot of memes since

Naial Casanovas Mack:

There's a memes of, you know, like, be honest. Yeah. So when that He's

Dane Shoemaker:

like he's like through his through the door.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yes. Yeah. So that's that's the one that when that when that kind of show, launched on Netflix, that clip kinda went viral. It was like, oh, you know, Victoria was talking about how she how she grew up in a a middle class family, and and David was like, be honest. She's like, no.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Well, we did my dad was a working man. I was like and and David was like, be honest. What car did your dad drive? She was like, well, she's like, no, be honest. And she was like, well, my my dad drove a Rolls Royce.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so when that went viral, I was like, I have to do the same thing, but for top up. Yeah. Yeah. And so I got a friend set up, this was probably, like, a week after. I was like, I wanna just re just recreate something.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Just get the so people can identify the people who know will know, and people who don't will just see, like, a nice little fun ad. Yeah. And so I got a friend, wrote up some lines, and we shot it in an afternoon. That's cool. And she was like I think it was like, you know, I hate returns.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like, returns are are are super hard. And I was like, be honest. And she's like, well, no, they are. And I was like, be honest. Like, what do you do?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

She's like, well, I was like, no, no. Be honest. She was like, well, I sat outside and someone did it for me. And so that's how that that ad came out.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's great. Yeah. That's genius. Like, that's how you have to play. Just kinda like I'm like, I think your brand really, like like, is set up well to do, like, funny

Naial Casanovas Mack:

stuff like that. Yeah. Exactly. And it's it's it's hard because I I don't wanna do all the ads myself. And it's also time too.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Like, the the the green screen ads. Yeah. It's I can have something out within twenty four hours of when I think about it, but it has to be, like, full on nothing but that for twenty four hours. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like the, like the Mother's Day one we discussed. Yeah. I was sitting home. Must have been, like, in the morning having my coffee, and I was like, oh my god. Mother's Day is tomorrow.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I wanted to put out something out for Mother's Day because a lot of my users are moms.

Dane Shoemaker:

Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So I have to put, like, dad the, Father's Day and Mother's Day. And it was the next day. So I was like, crap. I gotta I wanna I wanna make I wanna make an ad for for Mother's Day. And so I spent the the whole day before Mother's Day from when I realized to the evening, I wrote up a whole script.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Writing scripts, you can write a whole nice little script and read it. Sometimes it just doesn't sound natural.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So you have to write a script, say it out loud, perform it. It's like, yeah. That's not something someone would say. And so you just go and read read it reiterate. I wanna kinda hit, like, certain things and come up with ideas.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so, in the evening, I think, I've done the script, and then I I I wanted a shirt that says, I love my mom. And so I went to TJ Maxx, bought the, bought a t shirt. I have a whole vinyl cutter press t shirt Oh, really? In in my basement. Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Previous venture. And so I was like, I wanna make, like, I love my mom t shirt. And so I designed the t shirt. It's just I wanted it, like, TJ Maxx at 7PM, I think. Got the T shirt and got to it just in case the colors weren't weren't good.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so I then I designed, cut out the vinyl stuff, pressed it onto the T shirt. And I think by 10PM, I think I was maybe ready or almost ready to do it. Yeah. But the filming didn't start until, I think, one in the morning Oh my gosh. On Mother's Day.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Wow. Yeah. And so I and this I'm in a garage alone in a pitch dark. Outside is pitch dark. Obviously, the the whole set is illuminated, but in one in the morning, I'm starting to film this ad.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I think by two, I had all my lines ready, natural, didn't need, you know, the card in front of me, so I was just talking. And even though you have a script, then on when you're filming, you say stuff. Even if you memorize it, you still mess up. Yeah. It's like, oh, I forgot this or you just forget different words and, like, or just alter a phrase that has, like, completely different to what you had, but it kinda makes sense.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right. Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And so then you kind of, alter. And one of the things was, I wanted to, like, talk to someone on set. It's like, why are we charging the moms it's Mother's Day?

Dane Shoemaker:

Right. Like, you're talking to someone Like, if I'm talking to someone

Naial Casanovas Mack:

and I'm alone in my at this point, I'm alone at 2AM in my garage talking to nobody, you know. Imagine someone someone opened up the garage room just there talking to myself at two in a morning. I know. I don't know about it. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. We lost them. Yeah. And so, yeah. So that was it was, kind of improvising the lines and Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I was happy with what I got. After two, shut everything down. I went home Yeah. And started editing. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I think I didn't finish until, I wanna say, like, five in the morning Wow. For, like, a eight I thought it was, like, an eight or 09:00 launch on On post it. Media. Yeah. Right.

Dane Shoemaker:

Oh my god.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And from mother's day, we were ready. Yeah. Under under 24 from idea to launching, the

Dane Shoemaker:

Well, there was a lot of engagement on that, but I saw it was good.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It was it was it was a fun idea. I I did like that.

Dane Shoemaker:

Did you run that as an ad then also?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Or No. That was just that was just, media. Yeah. Yeah. That was awesome.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And it's like, you can I would love to make create so much content and run ads and have, social, like, content creators create content? But there's so much I can do in a day. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Right. I think I think you could actually benefit pretty well from, like, UGC. Like, just, you know, people just saying, hey. There's this great service where they pick up, you know,

Naial Casanovas Mack:

all my And that's that's what I do wanna do because I've seen, like, Insta three sixty does great, great commercial, ads with UGC where they'll just send a camera to someone and they'll say, alright. I'll send you a camera. Just create you have a a content creator creating good content. And I did that, I think, with one or two creators. But once they post it, hype goes up and then done.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And it's just there and, like, it's not something. But I learned next thing I wanna do is do the same thing. But instead of them posting it on their on their stories, like, don't you don't even have you can just create the content for me. Don't even post it on your on your wall.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. I wanna run ads with it. You post it and run ads. I would actually do that. Run ads with it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Not not even post it. Just run ads with it. Yeah. And it can you can link both accounts to where she gets some, some some views out of it, and I get some views out of it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Exactly. Yeah. So that's that is something I've thought about. I haven't executed it, but it's something I wanna do is is Yeah. You just see run ads, don't post it on your wall, and ruin your nice beautiful feed.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I just need someone to do content for me.

Dane Shoemaker:

And there's plenty of Philly and even mainline, like, kind of influencer type people that you could reach out to. Exactly. And then yeah. Even even just, like, no name random people, their services online.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

As long as they have as long as they can create good content from home Yeah. By all means, I'll I'll I'll I'll I'll

Dane Shoemaker:

I mean, you get 20.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It it doesn't have to be, like, someone who's a content creator. Yeah. It could be someone starting out.

Dane Shoemaker:

Authentic. And and the good thing is that you don't have, like, a product. You don't have to ship them anything. You literally just have to get, like, a package Yeah. Or something.

Dane Shoemaker:

You have

Naial Casanovas Mack:

to use it. Yeah. They they can just, you know, kinda make believe that they're using it and just drop it on their front porch. Yeah. Exactly.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Like that. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I also think that, like, a mailer, like, a physical piece of mail, have you thought about that, actually sending those out?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Be expensive. They are? It's very I've I've looked at the, like, the post office routes. Yeah. And each route is, like, 3 to $400 plus the the the we're we're bootstrapping this.

Dane Shoemaker:

Per per route. That's how much Per route. Is that right?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Plus, you know, the I guess, for, like, a good one, we'll say, like, 5¢ per per per mailer. Okay. So if you wanna get a Yeah. A good zone, you're spending a thousand plus Right. For a good post office route.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And it's not it's not it's not worth that. Plus you

Dane Shoemaker:

have to print all the night, you know,

Naial Casanovas Mack:

the night's gloss. Yes. Yeah. Exactly. What I did do was, I would go around the main line on trash day, on recycling day.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Okay. And any house that had a full bin of recycling or or, like, online boxes that they got Yeah. Walk up to the door, leave a card. Not the mailbox because that's illegal. Put it on their front doorstep.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Is it is it? Yeah. If you can't it has to go through the post office. Right. Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Right.

Dane Shoemaker:

That makes sense.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I'm sure there's a I mean, I've gotten stuff in my mailbox, but sec I'm pretty sure, that is illegal.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Yeah. Another thing I'm thinking, now my wheels are turning here, but, like, your drivers, right, after they do a pickup, they could, like, go to every house on that street with a flyer that says, hey. We just picked up something from your neighbor.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So someone like that. Someone told me, they told me, why don't you have your drivers mistakenly go to, like, your neighbor's house? The the the customer's neighbor house knock on the door and, like, hey, I'm here. I'm here to pick up a return. And they'd be like, what?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And then be like, oh, isn't this, you know, 03:20, this road and oh my god. It's next door. Oh, I'm so sorry. You know? Just like immediate interactions before the actual customer.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Well yeah. It's a little sketchy, though. You don't wanna do that. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

This is you know?

Dane Shoemaker:

But, you know, you you offer a great service, and I feel like it's, you know, yeah, it's definitely needed and, you know, it's pretty neat.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's something where building here. Where the the the online return home pickups is starting to grow, and people trying to get comfortable using it. Yeah. Because if you had told me three years ago someone would do my my my return, I'd be like, no way. I'm gonna do it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. I don't know if someone else is doing that. What if they mess up? Yeah. That's totally valid.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

We want you try it and everything goes correctly. Whenever I whenever a new customer signs up, I'll just text them, hey. I'm the founder. Another mistake, going back to the mistakes I did, when I launched, I wanted to look bigger than I appeared. Like, I wanna be, you know, my face was wasn't on the website.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

This is who we are. We're we're a company. I wanted to kind of appear bigger than I actually was. I was a one man band. Right.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Right. What I've seen works better is, hey, I'm the founder. This is my company. I'm doing everything. Like, I'll be there tomorrow to pick up your, your It's awesome.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Your return. Yeah. Anything, text me. And so when even now, when people sign up, I will text them personally. Hey, I'm the founder if you need anything.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I try and do any any new person who signed up, I try and do the first one.

Dane Shoemaker:

Okay.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Just to kind of see that just when everything goes right. Yeah. And and if there's anything that goes wrong, I'm saying, hey. I'm the founder. I'm outside.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I don't see a package. Yeah. And so I always try and do the first one and kind of text them to the process saying, hey. I I picked up, your package. I'll I'll let you know when I drop it off.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And at the end of the day, 3PM, I'll text them, hey. Everything's being dropped off. You'll also receive an email notification. Because sometimes it goes to junk. So I I've had people text me saying, hey.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I didn't receive any alert that's been dropped off. Like, oh, it has been dropped off. You should have received check your junk, or or your spam folder. And, oh, yep. It's here.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Fine. But that personal texting back and forth, who you're sure is a customer a lot.

Dane Shoemaker:

Goes a long way, especially, like, early on, these early customers and yeah. Just building trust and

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So that's one mistake I'd another mistake I did was just trying to appear bigger than bigger than I actually was. Yeah. Always just be

Dane Shoemaker:

Some faceless company and app. Yeah. You know? But, like, but, you know, you I like your approach.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But you think, you know, like, oh, customers wouldn't want, like, us to work with a start up. They they want, like, an established brand, an established company. Right. Like, I thought, customers would, be more comfortable with a bigger company, you know, proof of concept that everything's right. They do prefer start up texting back and forth.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I have customers who've I have an an elderly customer who can't leave their house, and she calls me to schedule, her pickup.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's great.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And because, you know, screenshotting a QR code may not be of her abilities. So they get Yeah. You can forward me the email and she scheduled something on it. I kinda walk her through it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. But sometimes she's like, I can't. And I was like, alright. Don't worry. I'll I'll submit it on your side.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Just email me the the label, the QR code. Yeah. And so we do that like that. But to but try I try and be personal with every every single customer now when they sign up. That's great.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Which is something I found, which is that works a lot better. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

I people appreciate it. This day and age, especially everything's digital. Everything digital automated.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. That's great. If you have a start up and you have, an AI customer service, you're doing it wrong. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Doing it wrong. Yeah. You be you be the one talk talking to the customer because then you then you know what? You you get feedback from the customer too. I had someone sign up not too long ago.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

They added some items to their, to return for a pickup, and then they never, picked up. So, hey. I'm the founder. I noticed you didn't, you didn't schedule a pickup. Let me know if you need anything.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And she said, oh, I you know, I ended up doing I ended up doing it myself. Thank you. And and I responded, great. No problem. As a start up, I'm looking for feedback.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Can you give me a reason why? And she said, yep. I work from home, so I just wanna get out of the house and and do it myself. I was like, I totally understand. Couple hours later, she she texted me back saying, actually, for some more feedback.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And she explained, like, kind of how she did that return Yeah. And, kind of her process. And she kinda walked through. Okay. Next time I'll use you because by the amount of time I spend doing that plus paying the public transportation to get there and printing the label at this at the store, I could just pay you $5.99 to do it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And I was like, that's exactly that's exactly what we're here for.

Dane Shoemaker:

That's amazing.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

But she came back, like, couple hours later to even go be more feedback because I had text her. And if I hadn't if I hadn't, you know, sent the first text to get some feedback, I wouldn't have gotten that. I didn't even think about people taking, the bus or the train to to go return something.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. I mean, absolutely. $5.99 for what?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And she was like, I'd love your service, and next time I'll I'll use it. And I was like, that's exactly what we're here for. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. But to your point, like, talking to customers is the absolutely most critical thing you can do. Yeah. Yeah. And

Naial Casanovas Mack:

talking to them honestly, listen, we are a startup. Like, anything you need, just text me, call me, anything. 2AM, call me. I'll answer. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. And you and you ask them for feedback too. Feedback is gold. Yeah. So you can iterate, on the feedback that they give you.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And if they see if they give you feedback and see an update the next time they do it, like, that fast, could be the next day, could be a week later, they'll text and say, oh, hey. I saw the update. Fantastic. Works great. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And that's how I do it a lot more personally than big company, huge huge start up. You know? Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Do you have plans to to scale?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yes. People have asked me, what's your goal? And I wanted I want to have the experience of taking, like, a service a startup like this kind of nationwide. Yeah. Because I could I could scale in Philly and then kinda sell it or scale for the East Coast and sell it.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I wanna do I wanna try and do it nationwide. Yeah. But for right now, it's just kinda conquer Philly. Get it right. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Build the proof of concept. Build proof of concept. Try and get product market fit Yeah. Which is the hardest part. And then from there, then just kind of stamp out in the city.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Boom. Boom. Boom. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Can Can you talk a little bit more about that product market fit? I mean, is there Yeah. Something yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's something to where it's it's it's, the process in the startup world. It's called product market fit, and it's when you know how much you're gonna spend, your customers how many customers you're gonna get, and the revenue, and it works. Like, you're not trying to iterate left and right to get customers. You know ex the exact process of getting a customer, and the customers are finding you and using you. And that when you're just kind of hands off, know how to get, users and customers to use your product, that's product market fit.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. When you don't have to iterate left and right and okay. Let's try this. Let's try this. When you know exactly how to get a customer, how much it's gonna cost to get the customer, how much is it they're gonna spend, and they're coming back to use it again.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

When you have that, that's the golden goose. You just then with that, you can start kind of doing the exact same thing at a different city. Yep. And you stamp out because you've got product market fit, because the customer comes to you, comes back to you, and reuses you, and loves you. I think I forget who it was.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Or the the founder of Superhuman. Okay. He said if the if the if you would shut down your service, you want your customers to scream and shout in pain because you shut down. Like, you wanna get feedback, and and you wanna build a product to where if you shut down, if that service stops, your customers are clawing, screaming in pain because, like, they they need the service. They wanna use that service.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

So that's what you all in back of your head of, like, how how do you build that? I don't know. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

How do I achieve

Naial Casanovas Mack:

it? Yeah. Exactly.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Yeah. And your and your drop up is on its way.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I feel like Drop up is on its way. So it's still very early. Yeah. Still Still very early. Someone just someone just, drew a graph for me.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And it was, you know, the the the, you know, users and time and, like, your your kind of hockey hockey stick. Yeah. And everyone sees the hockey stick, graph, but they don't see before the graph, the squiggly line up and down. And, like, that's, like, five years before you even see the hockey stick. Right.

Dane Shoemaker:

So

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I'm in that squiggly line, area Right. Of just trying to figure out what works, how to get customers, and trying left and right new things of how to get customers Yeah. Yeah. And and have them come back and use a product. But no one sees no one thinks about those, you know, five first previous years before you get, like, the good traction and then, you know, massive traction Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

And and massive growth.

Dane Shoemaker:

They don't see the sweat and tears and blood and sleepless nights.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

That's not that's not on that graph. That's that's that's five years before that graph even sees anything. Yeah. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. We got a great service here, you know, great business. Yeah. Yeah. I love what you're doing.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Anything, you know, the next six to twelve months you're working on?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Increasing drop off points, adding some new features for the home pickups, and then partner up with partner up with retailers improving that concept for the drop off points. Yeah. And then with that, I'll be ready to, probably raise around, once I prove that retailers are retail customers are using these drop off points to return stuff. Yeah.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

It's and I'm kind of playing around with the with with with, like, the the wording, but, you know, giving giving smaller smaller retailers the the Amazon return experience to where we're walking to Whole Foods, scan a code, drop it off. I want I want that to be every single return that any anyone has. And that's kind of what I'm providing with these drop off points and with picking up is you're just screenshotting, uploading, putting it on your on your doorstep. Done. That's your return process.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. And then we handle everything from that end.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. That's great.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Yeah.

Dane Shoemaker:

Where can people find DropUp?

Naial Casanovas Mack:

What's your website? Can find DropUp at dropup.com, up with two p's. Right. Drop up inc on Instagram, drop up on Facebook, but, you know, the website is is a place to go. You sign up, create an account there.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

If you wanna contact me, DM me on Instagram, Nile Casanova's Mac or through drop up. My DMs are always open or in the contact us section on the bottom of the drop up website. Amazing. Yes, sir.

Dane Shoemaker:

Yeah. Niall, thank you so much.

Naial Casanovas Mack:

I appreciate it. Thanks for having us. It's been great.

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