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The HeadRush Podcast with Paul Frase and Corey Berry takes you inside the reality of Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy (CTE) through the lens of football and rodeo. With firsthand experience in two of the most punishing sports, Paul and Corey share their stories, the lasting effects of head trauma, and the fight for awareness and support.
Rico Transcript
0:10
This is the Headrush podcast with Paul Frase and Corey Barry.
0:18
>> Welcome to the Head Rush podcast. I'm
0:20
>> podcast.
0:21
>> Yes, I'm Paul Frase and I played 11 years in the NFL. Why do I still have to
0:26
read that? and
0:29
>> they don't know.
0:31
>> And our co-host Corey Barry rode professional rodeo for nine years.
0:37
>> Bucking horses.
0:38
>> Bucking. He was a bron rider.
0:40
>> A broner back Bronco.
0:42
>> Not a saddle. What's the difference? Why?
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>> One has a saddle and one has a saddle.
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>> Okay. Well, why is is one harder than the
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other?
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>> Oh, yeah.
0:54
>> Yeah. Bearback riding is harder in saddle. But saddle is pretty dang
0:58
dangerous itself because saddle you got stirrups, you got
1:05
a saddle, and you got a rain. Bearback riding. You
1:09
got a suitcase handle.
1:11
>> I don't know why you guys just don't ride the horse as it is supposed to be
1:15
ridden.
1:16
>> We do, but sometime horses just can't be ridden.
1:19
>> All right. All right. Ed the Headrush podcast. We talk about everything
1:24
related to uh brain trauma and brain health and wellness. We talk about
1:29
traumatic brain injury TBI, chronic traumatic encphylopathy, CTE, traumatic
1:35
encphylopathy syndrome, TEES, which is the closest that you can be diagnosed to
1:40
CTE in the living if while you are your your heart is still beating. And Corey
1:46
actually is diagnosed TEES. And we talk about repeated head impacts, RHI. We t
1:52
we cover how traumatic brain injuries can and will cause mental health issues
1:57
such as depression, addiction, lack of executive function,
2:02
memory loss, even suicide ideiation, as well as degenerative neurological
2:09
issues. These symptoms can be found on the Mayo Clinic and Boston University
2:14
websites under symptoms of CTE. Our mantra is how to cope and find hope. We
2:20
focus our energy on finding therapies and sharing hope through education and
2:26
by wear raising awareness. And please help us raise awareness by liking,
2:32
sharing, commenting,
2:34
>> reviewing,
2:35
>> subscribing. We do have a YouTube channel. We need to boost those uh views
2:40
up. So um welcome to the Head Rush podcast. Corey, do you want to?
2:46
>> Yeah. Our next guest, well, I'm going to tease him a little
2:50
bit, but today our guest, he has walked the walk and now he uses
2:56
his experience to bring hope and awareness to recovery from TBI.
3:02
He is a former four-year starter linebacker with the Oregon State
3:07
University. We know we know. and hot and a hall of
3:14
fame for sport athlete at Sierra High School in San Monteo, California. During
3:21
his time playing football, Rico sustained over 15,000 subconcussive hits
3:29
and 25 plus concussions. Rico felt that he had survived his time
3:35
playing with no major lasting impact to himself
3:40
until March of 2021 until it's always that 10year mark.
3:45
Ain't that what they say?
3:48
>> It catches us all
3:49
>> when he experienced what's that word? Systemic.
3:54
>> Yes.
3:55
>> Failure of his brain and body affecting mood behavior, sleep, cognitive and
4:00
physical functions. Within a six-month period, Rico's declined was a aggressive
4:08
and severe with referrals to multiple medical specialists and to hospitals try
4:15
to determine the root cause which with every symptom track back to
4:21
neuro in nature.
4:24
>> Amazing. Shocking. Mhm. In July of 2021, Rico was enrolled in an open study at
4:31
the University of Utah on the use of red light for footballers,
4:37
football players with traumatic brain injury and or suspected CTE. Though the
4:44
use of red light over the past five years and other supplements or
4:48
protocols, Rico is now functionally operating at or near his symptom state.
4:56
>> Pre symptom state. Rico now uses his brokenness to be of service to others in
5:04
the TBI and CTE community, offering support, guidance for persons with brain
5:12
injury and their caregivers based on his shared experience. Rico, welcome. I'm
5:19
sorry to give you a hard time about being a Oregon beaver. You know, there's
5:25
plenty of
5:25
>> Well, there's plenty of platypuses up in Oregon, but I'm an Oregon Duck fan.
5:31
>> Let him speak.
5:32
>> Yeah. Yeah, I understand that. Uh, you know, you're poking a little fun, but at
5:36
that time, you guys were one and 10. So,
5:41
>> it was it was literally the battle of the the toilet bowl until uh Phil Knight
5:45
decided to come in and drop suitcases of money on your program. So, oh, so they
5:49
they had no uh recollection of playing a 12th game during that time, huh? No, it
5:54
was always Yeah.
5:56
>> No, not until Phil Knight stepped in. And now we're at the semifinals going
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>> Well, how talk to me. You You talk about this guy coming in and throwing money at
6:07
a college game that Nike
6:10
>> that doesn't Oh, well, Bill Knight,
6:12
>> he's not supposed to throw money at the organization. I mean,
6:17
>> he doesn't. He throws it at the university.
6:19
>> Oh, did he throw
6:20
>> He was also a coach at the university.
6:22
>> Is he involved with the NIL, too?
6:25
>> Oh, I'm sure he is.
6:27
>> Yeah.
6:27
>> And I'm also
6:28
>> They one of They have one of the largest NILs in college football.
6:32
>> Do they really?
6:33
>> Yes.
6:34
>> Gosh.
6:35
>> Yeah.
6:35
>> Wow.
6:36
>> He was a track coach. Uh the founder of Nike was a track coach for the Ducks.
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>> Okay. and uh Prefontaine. Steve Prefontaine.
6:48
>> Exactly.
6:49
>> And that's how the tennis shoe came to be.
6:52
>> Is it all right? Um
6:55
>> well, we don't want to lose you guys any viewers by I know there's a lot of Duck
6:58
fans out there, so I'll stop with that. Uh we've already been dripping with
7:02
enough sarcasm, too. So, we'll we'll roll we'll roll off the football tie.
7:07
>> Yeah, it's it's time to get
7:09
>> Dr. Rico, I want our listeners to also understand that he just attended the
7:14
global summit in San Francisco at UCSF,
7:20
>> right? It was amazing experience. Uh, eight hours that was just backto back uh
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heavy hitters in the neuro world, a lot of our great advocates, not CTE deniers.
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So, it was wonderful to have that much support in one room of researchers,
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caregivers, and also uh CTE warriors. So, uh, really exciting time.
7:40
>> Both of my neurologists were there.
7:43
>> Wow, that's that's impressive. There were a lot of the top dogs there, so
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you're in good hands. Obviously,
7:48
>> Dr. Tanner, one of the speakers, is my top neurologist.
7:53
>> Nice. Very nice.
7:55
>> And
7:55
>> yeah, it was it was it was like the uh pro bowl of neurologists. It was really
8:00
really impressive. I mean, Dr. Cantou, uh, Dr. McKe and many others. uh Dr.
8:08
Cummings. I mean, it was it was pretty amazing.
8:10
>> That would that must have been amazing because obviously, you know, as far back
8:14
as you know, Mike Webster and Dr. Bennett Amalo. Um and uh why am I saying
8:22
Amalo Bennett? It's it's Bennett Amalo. And he was ostracized, right? He he was
8:28
they they tried to Yeah. and and what a what an amazing turnaround to a couple I
8:35
I guess one of the first protocols for CTE awareness or um it was announced. Do
8:42
you do you remember the de details of that?
8:45
Um
8:46
>> um was
8:47
>> Yeah, it was with the um one of the footballers associations I want to say
8:52
maybe
8:52
>> Canada.
8:53
>> UK.
8:54
>> Yeah, UK or Canada. And it was just uh trying to limit um contact and hits to
9:01
uh try to prevent CT in the future. knowing that knowing that we're now, you
9:06
know, which which is a big shift because even
9:08
>> the organ organization that uh hosted this event originally was called
9:13
Concussion Legacy Foundation and they said that their rebrand to the CTE and
9:19
Concussion Foundation was to recognize that this is not a
9:23
concussionbased disease or condition that it's a repetitive hit injury
9:28
condition. So limiting those hits in all contact sports, uh whether you're a bron
9:34
rider, a football player, uh I the gamut of I
9:39
>> I have seen hockey players. I I have had um sailors, you know, in the little
9:45
dingy boats that have been hit by the mast or the bumping of the water, water
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polo players,
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>> uh cheerleaders, you name it. there it's there's a wide range of us unfortunately
9:56
that are dealing with the aftermath of repetitive head injury.
9:59
>> So Rico you you talk about 15,000 impacts or repeated head impacts right
10:05
when
10:06
>> Yeah. talk. When I started talking about that, I thought it was incredulous to
10:13
say I I've I've been hit in the head, you know, 8 to 10,000 times. You This
10:19
was years ago. And I was like, and nobody would take you seriously. But now
10:24
we're talking 15,000
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>> 20,000. Well, if if you if you say, you know,
10:31
1,00 to500 hits a year of 20 years of uh, you know,
10:37
organized football of Yeah. So, it's in it's kind of it is it is incredulous how
10:43
many times that we have had impacts.
10:46
>> For our listeners, what does incredulous mean?
10:50
>> Incredible. Um, just it's it incredulous. Well, Rico's a lot smarter
10:56
than both of us put together.
10:58
>> So, you're just using the word without knowing.
11:01
>> I I I I don't
11:03
>> remarkable would be remarkable or incredible or remarkable. So, I I I
11:07
have, you know, an idea of it. the $50,000.
11:12
>> You you boss my my my my b
11:16
>> I I can only thank my understanding of that because of Sister McCabe at Sarah
11:20
High School who was my uh honor my honors uh AP English teacher and she she
11:26
was honest. So she made sure that we uh learned proper English in her class.
11:30
>> That's great.
11:31
>> It was literally her life.
11:32
>> That's awesome. We're going to get into it and uh sorry for such a long leadin.
11:37
I don't know what got into us today. This episode of the Head Rush podcast is
11:41
brought to you by our personal doctor and team of doctors uh Dr. Myisel Deo
11:49
and she's with the Paradise Behavioral Health and we are in the Brainwell
11:54
program which is also part of the Millennium Health Center. Uh Dr. Mark
12:00
Gordon, you've seen him on Joe Rogan and even on our show, the Head Rush podcast.
12:08
Um, and the hormones. And Michelle is
12:14
awesome. We love her.
12:16
>> She's she's our doctor of psychiatry. She works for the Mark Gordon program
12:20
with the hormones and uh and she she adds her twist of genetics and um and
12:27
it's it's it basically is melding two wonderful uh uh mediums together and
12:33
we're getting great help from Dr. Meiselle Deo. So, please check out her
12:38
website at paradisebehavioral.com.
12:43
>> Look up the Brainwell program. Get involved.
12:47
>> She's sponsoring us. They're sponsoring us for the next year. So, we are excited
12:51
to have them on board and uh and and shout the new the good news to everybody
12:57
uh that is watching these broadcasts. So,
13:00
>> is she helping you, Paul?
13:02
>> Absolutely.
13:02
>> She's helping me. So, go check her out. paradise behavioralhealth.com.
13:09
>> I I want to hear your story. what happened to you that uh that you had
13:14
actually had to search out help um from from symptoms or you know obviously
13:20
start start with your career and uh
13:25
>> talk about Sierra High School because you played against us I'm sure
13:31
>> but back in them days Bishop was probably a lot
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not as probably as good as my day
13:39
>> Bishop Yeah,
13:41
>> I was I was in the Catholic school league. So, uh Sarah High School's part
13:45
of the Bay Area Catholic School League. It's
13:47
>> Oh, is that a Catholic school league?
13:49
>> Yeah, it's the top probably one of the top conferences in the nation. Uh this
13:54
our our program itself is usually running for a state title and you know
13:59
there's several other schools in San Francisco and in the Bay Area elsewhere
14:02
that are pretty prominent. Um Sarah High School has a long history. John
14:06
Robinson, Lynn Swan, Barry Bonds, uh a guy named Tom Brady you might have heard
14:11
of. They all went to my uh to my high school. So, it's it's uh one of those
14:15
schools that people go to play sports and hopefully get recruited. So, I grew
14:20
up in a small uh a town. Cory, you would have fit right in. We had the rodeo Half
14:26
Moon Bay uh California. So, it's a
14:29
>> yeah, nice uh nice a community. So, um, I, you know, obviously wanted to try to
14:34
play football at a higher level. So, I I came across the hill. It's about an hour
14:39
drive every morning to Sarah and played, uh, my first football was in high
14:44
school. I had never played, um, you know, youth football at all. So, that
14:49
that was kind of my first introduction. Uh, started four years there. Um,
14:54
finished out pretty strong. I was all state and uh one of the top rated
14:58
linebackers in the nation blue chip wise behind a guy named Dwayne the Rock
15:02
Johnson. Uh so pretty good company with that. Um and
15:08
really looked at a bunch of different schools, but when I did my trips, I had
15:12
one at UFO, but felt like uh Oregon State was my
15:17
best fit. And so I signed with them. And one of the reasons was I didn't want to
15:21
sit on the bench. I wanted to play right away. and uh they had told me you come
15:26
here you're going to probably start four years and that's what I did. So uh as a
15:31
205 lb inside linebacker I started my freshman year and um played all four
15:36
years there. So I so I played uh and and started four years at Oregon State. Um
15:42
unfortunately between my high school and my college time
15:46
uh high school I probably had about at least six to eight concussions that I
15:51
can recall. And then um in college is where I really had some serious ones. I
15:57
had one against Cal where the skybox saw me running around in circles
16:03
>> uh in the middle of the field. So they called somebody to pull me out and when
16:06
I went to the sideline,
16:08
>> I thought the team doctor was my dad and I was telling him about my pretty shoes.
16:12
So
16:13
>> um
16:13
>> yeah, it was it was it was a bad deal uh in that regard. And though overall, you
16:21
know, I I did have some head pressure. I had some headaches. I mean, I was taking
16:24
1,200 milligrams of Advil a day to try to stop the headaches. Didn't know that
16:30
that was masking my concussions, but I I you know, after I finished school, I
16:35
really didn't feel like I had any uh ongoing symptoms or issues. So, um, fast
16:43
forward a bit, uh, right around 2021, um, I
16:50
started experiencing these cascading effects from, um, you know, mood,
16:56
behavior,
16:58
>> how how old were you in 2021?
17:01
>> Uh, I was 47. So, um, it it it came on, um, I've talked to a lot of CTE warriors
17:09
and their families. And what's interesting is
17:13
many of us have a shared story that some sort of traumatic event can kind of
17:17
trigger an initial cascading. And that could be a bankruptcy, uh, a divorce,
17:23
financial issues, etc. And at that time, um, my wife was in the ICU for 17 days
17:30
with a 1% chance of living. And so I think that whether it shortcircuited my
17:36
brain or caused a stressor overload, but somewhere shortly after that is when I
17:42
really started experiencing all these issues. Um the first things that came up
17:46
for me immediately was this severe depression. Um the depression was dark.
17:54
It was overwhelming, constant. I just felt incredibly sad. I
17:59
didn't have a reason that I could point to that was making me sad. Um but it was
18:04
it was everpresent and then um from that the suicidality kind of drifted in and
18:12
uh you know I I I tell people it was like there was an angel and a devil on
18:16
my shoulders.
18:17
>> Did you ever did you ever have suicide ideiation before then?
18:21
>> No, never. Never. And and I also didn't have any depression. I I am kind of a
18:26
guy like you guys. I, you know, Gen X dripping with sarcasm and and, you know,
18:31
like to uh be the, you know, the guy that's making jokes all the time. So, it
18:36
was a total change in my character. You know, my even my kids were like, you
18:41
know, dad, why don't you smile anymore? Why aren't you happy? I mean, they
18:44
didn't know if it was something they did. They didn't know what was going on
18:47
with me. Uh, I remember distinctly, you know, I would have to cross the
18:53
Sacramento River on this bridge every morning to go to work. And I remember
18:58
crying in the car as I started approaching that bridge because it was
19:01
always this strong push to just want to pull the wheel right and go off the
19:06
bridge.
19:07
>> And I I knew that if I made it across that bridge, I was going to live today.
19:12
And that was kind of, you know, something that was really
19:16
scary to deal with. And again, as athletes, you know, our body, you know,
19:21
we're really in tune with it, but we also like to pride ourselves on being
19:25
able to manage our mental toughness and work through things and you know, and so
19:31
I was trying to do that, but it just was getting progressively worse. And you
19:36
know, so so with that, I noticed my sleep quality started failing me. And
19:42
you know, I was getting some physical symptoms. I was starting to drop things
19:46
a lot. I was having a hand tremor and it it just all started turning the wheels
19:52
with me. Um, tonitis got really bad, light and sound sensitivity,
19:58
uh, explosive anger. So, at one point when the darkness got
20:04
really heavy, I I found a uh brain injury group online and I posted my
20:10
story and just, you know, said, "Hey, ex college football player, I've had this
20:16
many hits, this many concussions. Uh, I something's not right. Does this sound
20:22
like it could be CTE or TBI?" And you know, people in the group
20:26
started saying, you know, this this sounds very common to what a lot of
20:30
people with suspected CTE are dealing with. And fortunately, uh, that very
20:35
same day that I posted, one of the members of the group told me that there
20:39
was this red light study that was being done at University of Utah for football
20:43
players and that they were actively recruiting. So, as soon as I heard about
20:47
that, I I jumped on the opportunity. If you've been told is all in your head,
20:51
but deep down you know something is wrong, listen closely. Brain fog,
20:56
depression, anxiety, irritability, even PTSD.
21:01
These are not just mental issues. They may be signals of neuroinflammation and
21:07
hormonal disruption. Root causes that traditional medicine often ignores. At
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the Millennium Health Centers, founded by Dr. from Mark Mark Gordon. They have
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helped veterans, athletes, and everyday people restore brain function using a
21:22
medical process called the Millennium Protocol. Take their free brain health
21:28
assessment at tbhelpnow.org and discover if inflammation, not
21:34
weakness, is holding you back. You're not broken, you're unbalanced,
21:40
and balance can be restored. One of the one of the things that we do here is we
21:47
we we are searching out modalities or therapies that might have you know might
21:53
work for brain injury because you know we know there's not a magic pill and we
21:58
know there's probably never going to be a magic pill to whatever stop the
22:03
inflammation in the brain. I mean obviously there's neutrauticals and
22:07
neurotropics that we can take to help in the supplements. I know you're you're
22:11
big into the supplementation, but one of the huge things is we we always are
22:16
searching for a therapy and we know some from our search that some therapies work
22:21
for some people, some therapies don't work um or as well. Um we had a
22:27
conversation, meaning myself uh uh you and Corey uh last week and I'm excited
22:34
to hear about what you have to say. So, we're always searching for that a
22:39
therapy that can help our brothers and sisters with TBI.
22:44
What therapy did you find?
22:46
>> Before we go to talking about therapy,
22:48
>> Yeah.
22:49
>> I want We got two football players here,
22:52
>> right?
22:55
>> A major player in California.
22:58
>> Yeah. Well, that's
22:59
>> then went to Oregon. you as an NFL, this new study that came out of Harvard.
23:08
I want to talk about that with you two.
23:10
>> Do we want to get get in? Well,
23:12
>> yeah. I mean, we got two of them. Let's get in and get into the weeds. I mean,
23:18
you you read the study.
23:21
>> Yes. Well, I I
23:23
>> have you read it, Rico?
23:25
>> You're
23:26
>> Yes. Yes, I have. I've had some online uh u conversation about it as well. It
23:31
definitely raised uh flags and concerns with a lot of people that are are
23:37
struggling with uh suspected CTE. That's
23:40
>> Yeah, I I think Yeah. So, so the study that you that Corey speaks of, it was a
23:44
study that came out um and they are were uh uh debunking
23:52
uh not the myth because it's factual that uh suicide rates have raised in um
23:58
players specifically I think NFL players uh over since 2010
24:06
um exponentially and
24:10
some of the so their study was based on you know possible reasons that could be
24:16
um I personally I personally so the possible reasons are you know
24:22
concussions and CTE has been be been in the limelight and the me media um and
24:29
and and they they actually used this word they said well it could be a
24:34
copycat situation where guys are hearing that and they there.
24:42
Let's face it, if somebody commits suicide, they they have no hope and they
24:47
they feel it's their only way out. So,
24:50
>> yeah, it it it was extremely insulting,
24:53
>> right?
24:53
>> Because you're you're talking about I mean, we now know that we've got
24:58
military veterans. We're losing 22 a day. It's not just athletes. You know,
25:02
the blast exposure is causing the same kind of issues. And you're taking
25:06
people, you know, you and I, Paul, we didn't get to I can't speak for Corey,
25:11
but you and I didn't get to uh being uh at the level that we played being, you
25:18
know, slouches. You know, we're top 1% of 1% people. We're high performers. And
25:23
in fact, I would argue that unfortunately with this condition, most
25:28
of the people that I know are overachiever, high performer people.
25:32
they had this many hits and this much exposure because they were practicing
25:35
all the time because they were playing at higher levels. You know, this is not
25:40
a a a mindset or a type of person that is prone to fail or to give up. And you
25:48
know, I can tell you my my own experience that I you know, I never had
25:52
any of this suicidality. I never had any of these issues. And I think as we get
25:57
into my story, we'll also see that I don't have them now. So that tells you
26:01
that this was a a triggered mechanism of you know bra the brain issue. It had
26:07
nothing to do with CTE uh uh you know prevalence or publicity and I think
26:13
that's insulting to the families that I deal with and you guys see on a daily
26:20
basis. We have so many warriors, families that are part of uh the
26:24
communities that are trying to enlighten people because they don't want another
26:29
family to go through what they did. And every story is very similar. Their
26:34
person, their loved one was never that was never their intent. They did not
26:38
want that uh to be the solution. But they're dealing with a uh a medical
26:48
community that when you go and visit, they're going to tell you, "Well, we
26:53
can't diagnose this in the living." And it's a neurogenerative condition, so
26:59
there's nothing we can do for you. It's eventually going to take your life, and
27:03
you know, the best we can do is maybe manage your symptoms for you. Well,
27:07
>> and and and that that is that is I mean, if we want to talk about the
27:11
accountability or the why, um when you stack those things up against a person
27:17
that is already struggling to understand the condition and figure out how they
27:22
can have some hope, that's not a very hopeful triad of of things that working
27:28
together, or I should say working against you. Well, and and I I look back
27:33
at every uh uh release that that specific group, it's the Harvard Medical
27:39
something for
27:42
>> you go there. You got to remember Trump took all their funding.
27:46
>> Mhm. Well,
27:47
>> where did they get the funding to do this study?
27:50
>> Um uh our our friends uh down in 500 Park
27:56
Avenue or whatever. So, uh, but I've never, if you really look back, I've
28:03
never seen an article come out saying, "Oh, NFL players are more susceptible to
28:10
dementia or are more susceptible to this or that or all I in and heart disease."
28:17
And you know, I four or five years when they were trying to
28:22
they they literally came out and said on an average uh um NFL players are
28:28
actually more healthy than the general public. And I'm like, uh, so
28:34
there has not been one article that has actually been
28:39
negative towards, you know, that the activity of hitting your head over and
28:45
over and over and over and over and over again. If if if the average NFL player
28:50
is healthier than the general population, then why is the average age
28:56
of death 20 years below the American national average? So the national
29:02
average for a for a US male is 78 years old.
29:05
>> The average age of death for an NFL player is 58 years.
29:08
>> 58.
29:09
>> You beat it.
29:10
>> Yeah.
29:11
>> Yeah. So
29:11
>> 60. Yay me.
29:14
>> Congratulations.
29:15
>> Yeah. Well, so yeah, I I I have problems with
29:20
those. So, some of these studies that are coming out. So,
29:24
>> well, to Corey's point, just to build on it a little more, is um right before the
29:28
two studies you're referencing came out of Harvard and I am going to pick on
29:32
Harvard directly because this is all the facts and you can look it up. they NIH
29:36
pulled all of their research funding and Harvard actually put a blast out from
29:40
their neuro their neuroscience department that they had zero funding uh
29:44
for projects shortly thereafter these couple doctors that you're talking about
29:49
that were the leads on this research um if you look at their disclosures
29:56
these were metaanalysis so these were just yeah cherrypicking what they wanted
30:00
to include into the studies number one number two uh they have conflicts.
30:07
They're they're they have NFL directly supported funding uh channels with with
30:12
them. And you know, I I think that's what we have to be wary of. There's a
30:17
lot of manipulation here because the way I look at it right now and the way this
30:23
should really be looked at when you're dealing particularly with pro sports and
30:27
even with the military is if we make this a mental health issue or
30:36
we place it in a in some sort of uh spectrum that the individual somehow
30:43
either has some uh association either genetically or their mental health or
30:48
what have you. Then what we're doing is we're putting the onus on the individual
30:52
that this is somehow caused by something within them.
30:56
>> Whereas what we really need to do with CTE, it's a repetitive hit injury.
31:02
>> So that means that it's employment related.
31:06
>> Prove to me otherwise, right? That means if you're in the military, you have this
31:11
succession of blast exposure. the military is responsible and has a duty
31:16
of care for you. The NFL and all other contact sports that it's no different.
31:21
Even the NCAA, you know, if this was caused by your employment, then your
31:27
employer should be responsible for your medical and your care. And that's not
31:31
happening.
31:32
>> It's a it's a simple uh uh equation in my mind and just as simple as you just
31:38
explained it. Uh, so and I I appreciate
31:41
>> I'm sure the NFL has that little closure in their agreements now in contracts.
31:46
>> These the kids are signing they're signing. Go ahead.
31:49
>> Yeah. Look at another repetitive injury. Uh, carpal tunnel.
31:53
>> How many employees because of typing on a keyboard for 20 years get carpal
31:57
tunnel surgery and it's covered under workers comp by their employer.
32:01
>> That's a repetitive hit injury or a repetitive use injury. And it it's the
32:06
same as as what we're dealing with with CTE and repetitive hits to the brain.
32:11
>> Really quick story kind of along those lines. We were talking to, you know, the
32:15
the the the um 1,00 to,500 hits per year if you as you play
32:23
football. That that's kind of taken um very uh commonly. And there was a doctor
32:31
that that basically had been with the you know do Dr. U maroon
32:38
and he he said publicly on a podcast that well the new data uh we we put the
32:45
the mouthguards in and the new data is only like 350 hits a year and and and I
32:51
was thinking okay you just told me instead of I I
32:57
don't have to have 1,00 to500 hits a year I only have to have 350 hits a year
33:03
and and this causes auses um mental health issues and causes TBI. It causes
33:09
white matter damage in my brain. It causes possible CTE. Is that is that
33:13
what you're saying, doc? Because you just you just de debunked, you know, the
33:18
a,000 or500 hits a year by saying only I was like that.
33:23
>> Yeah. Yeah. You just lowered the threshold. That really didn't work in
33:26
your favor.
33:27
>> No, exactly.
33:28
>> If you watch the if you watch the documentary League of Denial, uh I think
33:32
Dr. Maroon is featured in that. So yeah,
33:34
>> you know what we call him, right?
33:36
>> No, no, no.
33:37
>> All right, let's
33:38
>> We're trying to be nice,
33:40
>> [ __ ] We're We're going back to what therapy have you found that has helped
33:46
you.
33:47
>> Please pray tell.
33:50
>> Tell us about it. Preach it.
33:52
>> All right. All right. So, so as I was getting to um with that uh group I was
33:58
in, I found out about this University of Utah study. Uh, I wrote a one-page
34:04
manifesto to the lead that was uh, doing the recruiting for that and just begged
34:10
him to get in. It's a gentleman named Dr. Larry Carr. Uh, he's an XBYU Hall of
34:15
Fame linebacker. Uh, and he was patient one doing red light, which is really
34:21
cool. So, he was having uh CTE issues uh back uh a few years prior to the study
34:29
starting and went to Ann McKe at Boston U and said, "Hey, I I think I'm meeting
34:34
the criteria for this. I'm having some issues. Do you know of anything to help
34:38
the living?" And she said, "U, you might want to check out some work by Dr.
34:43
Margaret Naser uh with the VA. They're doing some red light study." And so he
34:48
got into that and had some really significant improvements with using
34:53
what's called photobiomodulation. And what that is is it's the um shining
34:59
of red light um through the skull. So they actually
35:03
put a headset on you and um these red light um penetrate the skull and they
35:12
activate the mitochondria and help them to produce extra energy and power. And
35:17
what that does is it reduces neuroinflammation. It
35:23
reduces this hyperimmune response. It creates more energy which helps prevent
35:30
this mitochondrial dysfunction that's at the root of many neuro conditions. Um,
35:35
it helps with clearing waste, oxygenation, and a host of other
35:39
benefits for the brain.
35:41
>> This is all this is all clin clinically proven uh information
35:47
>> 100% absolutely.
35:50
>> It's not just anecdotal.
35:52
>> Not anecdotal. There's over 5,000 clinical trials and studies on the use
35:57
of photobiomodulation and um really you know you as you
36:02
mentioned Paul you said there isn't any magic pill and there isn't one thing
36:07
that we know works for everyone. Well, I'm going to challenge that a
36:11
little bit because the way red light works is on, you know, a component of
36:16
the cells, the mitochondria, which is within all of us. And the biology, this
36:22
mechanism and the biology of it says that it's going to do something. It's
36:26
going to create some sort of performance or gains for you because it it is
36:32
helping these mitochondria do their job better. So, that's kind of the layman
36:37
version. I I I'm not the the scientist that I can go into all the the the
36:41
details of the the chemical process or the mechanisms, but that in a nutshell
36:46
is is what it does. Now, um you know, I can speak to my experience with it. And
36:52
what I will tell you is, you know, my my symptoms were
36:57
very bad starting about March 2021, as I said. And by July of 2021, I was
37:04
enrolled uh in this program and I had to go to Salt Salt Lake City, Utah. I was
37:09
living in Sacramento area at the time and my wife did not think I was going to
37:14
get on that plane. I mean, she just did not think it was going to be possible
37:18
because I was just in such bad shape. I could not handle being in social
37:23
environments. I had severe fight or flight, uh, light and sound sensitivity,
37:28
uh, you know, the anger and disorientation, cognitive function. I
37:32
mean, trying to get through an airport is not an easy task with a good brain.
37:37
But a broken brain in the height of all that trauma is asking a lot. So, I did
37:43
make it. Um, they did some baseline scans with me. It was a partnership with
37:47
the VA in Salt Lake City. So, what they did is they did an an MRI with DTI. So
37:52
they went through and and scanned our brains for the baselines. They did um a
37:58
cognitive assessment. They did move and behavioral accessess assessments. Uh
38:02
they did a sleep evaluation. And then they did some cognitive and physical
38:06
testing. And this was all probably four hours in a day. And uh it was pretty
38:12
rigorous doing all that at once. As you guys know, when you when your your neuro
38:16
battery is kind of already limited, you know, I tell people, you know, if your
38:20
brain was a bad your iPhone battery, you'd always be in the red, you know,
38:24
and so this took a lot out of me. I mean, I th those four hours cost me
38:29
probably a week and a half in bed when I got home.
38:32
>> Um, but, you know, so that was on Saturday. Sunday, they gave me the red
38:37
light device, uh, and showed me how to use it. Very simple. Uh, you put it on
38:42
for uh 20 minutes. Um, I'm gonna I think I'm I've got mine here. So, I'm not
38:49
going to plug it in, but I will show you real quick.
38:54
>> And this this is a one and done or this is continuous.
39:00
>> Yeah. So, this is the this is the this is the newer version of the headset. Um,
39:05
and so as you see, there's a nasal piece here that goes in, and then there's a
39:11
battery setup uh that that you connect to this. Unfortunately, I didn't pull
39:16
that out, so we won't see it actually lit up, but as you can see, there's
39:19
dodes on each part of the head, the the prefrontal cortex, and then the nose
39:23
piece actually shines on the bottom of the prefrontal cortex. So, it it gets up
39:29
underneath
39:30
>> the nasal passage.
39:32
>> Yeah. you get a you get a really good um coverage on on the prefrontal cortex
39:38
where most of us have our damage. So um my clinical version of that set was a
39:43
little uh more janky than that but uh nonetheless it worked under the same
39:49
mechanisms and what we were instructed to do was take it and use it uh for 20
39:54
minutes in the morning when we wake up 5 days a week. So, I would take Wednesday
39:58
and Sunday off and do it on the other days.
40:01
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40:07
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40:55
>> Tell us what happened. You you you you you were talk you tell you told us the
41:01
four or five things you were dealing with.
41:03
>> Well, not just what happened, but walk us through it. You you're talking about
41:07
2021. This is 2026.
41:10
>> You just had the helmet on your head.
41:13
>> So, you're still using this. So, tell us about it.
41:18
>> Yeah. So, so what happened is um I started wearing it, followed the
41:24
instructions, went home. What's great is this is a treatment you can do at home.
41:27
You can, it's portable, you can bring it with you, non-invasive. There are zero
41:32
known side effects from using red light, by the way. So, there's no, you know,
41:36
like pharma and stuff, you you know, many people with CTE or suspected CTE or
41:41
TBI are dealing with the side effects of the medications. Zero side effects
41:46
involved with uh photobiomodulation. So, um, I started using it and about two
41:52
weeks in, um, I was in the shower and my, uh, wife at the time, she goes,
41:56
"Hey, I think this thing's working." And I I went, "What do you mean?" She goes,
42:01
"Well, you're singing in the shower again and you haven't done that for a
42:04
couple years now, so I I I I I think I might be getting my old Rico back."
42:09
>> And it was just one of those examples that I was just really really uh I was
42:14
like, "Huh?" So, I I called uh Larry uh Dr. Carr and I said, you know, is this
42:21
is this supposed to work after two weeks because my wife says she's already
42:24
seeing a change in my mood and behavior. And he goes, yeah. He goes, I I started
42:29
having um some improvements at two weeks. And he goes, and then it just
42:33
builds from there. And sure enough, you know, um about a month in, I was feeling
42:39
really good. the light and sound sensitivity and other issues. You know,
42:42
I used to I used to basically scare everybody away from the dinner table. Uh
42:47
because the clanking on the plates, the loudness of having teenagers, you know,
42:52
I would just get really frustrated and I look around and realize I was the only
42:56
one left at the table um when when it all um you know, when it was all done
43:01
because I just would get into that anger phase and you know, retreat to my
43:06
bedroom uh isolate, that kind of thing. And and so
43:12
um with this I was you know re-engaging with my family. Um I started noticing
43:19
symptom improvement. Um the tonitis was not as bad. The head pressure started
43:24
going down. Um I wasn't dropping things like I was literally dropping something
43:29
in my kitchen almost every day. And you know my grip I was having issues. I was
43:34
having tremors. Those things started uh resolving themselves. Um, you know, I
43:40
had not mentioned earlier to you guys, but you know, I saw like 13 specialists
43:44
during this time that I was be prior to the red light study and I did a sleep
43:50
study and I was only getting 12 minutes of REM sleep a night. I had complex
43:54
sleep apnea which is uh means you stop breathing as well which is neuroreated.
43:59
I had tonitis which I went saw an ear nose and throat doctor. They eliminated
44:05
hearing loss, structural damage, and again that pointed back to neuro. Uh I
44:10
had vestibular and ocular issues that tied back to neuro. So virtually, you
44:14
know, like I said, 12 or 13 specialists for all these, you know, 50 plus
44:18
symptoms and issues I was having and every one of them tied back to neuro and
44:23
nature. So again, when I hear that CTE can't be diagnosed in the living, I'm
44:28
like, take a look at my scans and take a look at my symptom list and tell me
44:32
that, you know, the fact that it covers mood, behavior, sleep, cognitive, and
44:37
physical elements and they all tend to tie back to neuro in nature. I if you
44:44
can't call it this, what else are you going to call it?
44:47
>> It's not Alzheimer's, you know.
44:49
>> Yeah. So,
44:50
>> you know, and that's what ENT said. Mine's all nerve damage from the
44:55
repeated head impacts. My vestibular, my my death perception, my balance,
45:02
>> uh head knowing what my feet are doing. Um
45:07
>> my trimmers, my my excuse my French, my bowel movements.
45:15
>> It's all related to the repeated head impacts. I went to the ER when
45:22
>> you
45:22
>> two weeks ago.
45:23
>> Okay.
45:24
>> Didn't I wasn't it about two weeks ago I went?
45:28
>> Yes. Yes. Yes.
45:29
>> And you know I don't go to the ER because I get overstimulated
45:34
and the bright lights and Hello. Um, and they did a CT scan, they did blood
45:44
work, they checked everything, and the doctor literally came in and said, "This
45:48
is symptoms of CTE."
45:50
>> H Yeah.
45:52
>> And then you go to the orthopedic surgeon when he did the
45:59
PET bone scan on me and it showed inflammation down my spine, all through
46:04
my head and everything. And he goes, "This is all repeated head impacts." So
46:10
by some doctor at Harvard, you know, I wonder what Chris Ninsky
46:16
thinks is his degree at Harvard now if he would be proud to go back to
46:21
>> Boston. He's at Boston University right now. So he has nothing to do.
46:25
>> I wonder if he's go back to me and Chris Hobbit.
46:27
>> Yeah.
46:29
>> Um well, so here's the great thing. Uh Corey is,
46:34
you know, I we have probably similar lists it sounds like and I think these
46:38
are also very prevalent. So for your listeners, um you know, it's important
46:43
that we're not just looking at mood and behavior things because often that sends
46:49
you down the path of mental health and um counselors which are not equipped to
46:57
deal with us. And for the CTE person, you lose hope because you feel like this
47:03
is I know something's wrong with me and this is not it.
47:06
>> And I would I would argue to say that a a certain portion of the CTE suicides
47:14
are people that got gas lit and were not um
47:21
were not given the hope that to understand really what they were dealing
47:26
with. and and and so um you know that's that's kind of the the thing that I want
47:31
to leave behind is you know look at the symptoms get get the specialist to help
47:36
validate that it's neuro in condition and then if it is a neuro situation then
47:41
look at your repetitive hit injury uh history and if you are somebody that had
47:46
a lot of repetitive hit exposure and everything's pointing back to neuro you
47:50
do got to take a strong um a strong stance that you may be dealing with this
47:54
>> now are you clinically diagnosed TEES like myself.
47:58
>> Yeah. Yeah. I have I am test with probable CTE because that's the as
48:03
flowchart through test then you kind of then get the for lack of words uh
48:10
probability that you might be CTE um you know or what you what your what your
48:16
likelihood of CTE is. And I'm I'm at that highest level of uh the club. I
48:21
guess
48:22
>> Dr. Jeremy Tanner did me the same. I'm te probable cte.
48:28
Yeah, I I you know um my you know like we talked about when it's also supported
48:33
by the scans you know my scans uh as Paul mentioned earlier white matter
48:38
hypertensity intensities uh cave septum pelicum uh enlarged ventricles uh signs
48:44
of eskeemic stroke so vascular constrictions pretty common with this um
48:50
my cerebellum uh which should be like look like a nice oak tree with a lot of
48:55
branches uh has very few. It's been pruned down unfortunately. Uh and
49:02
uh one neurologist that didn't know my history that saw my scan um especially
49:07
the frontal cortex is the left side has been pulverized. Thought I was victim of
49:12
a gunshot wound to the head. So um you know
49:15
>> you saw I saw that scan.
49:17
>> Yeah. The cumulative when you when you look at all of that again with the
49:21
symptom list.
49:22
>> Can you put that scan up Lexi the brain scan?
49:28
It could be a pretty dire situation unfortunately.
49:31
>> So, but
49:32
>> let's let's let's let's get back to the butt.
49:35
>> Yeah. Let's let's let's talk about
49:37
>> show show the picture now that we can't. Yeah.
49:40
>> Oh, she can. Okay. shield kind of established we've established
49:44
that it's it's a pretty bad situation both with how I was physically
49:48
responding reacting to my world and living with all the 55 plus symptoms 50
49:52
symptoms and also the scans validating this the study as I went forward I kept
49:59
seeing improvements and you know at eight months they excuse me uh two
50:05
months eight weeks they sent us back to Utah to do a follow-up And by two
50:12
months, I was feeling about a 50% improvement. So, I was actually pretty
50:16
excited to get back to them. You know, I wanted to take that flight versus not
50:21
knowing if I was going to make it. I I was 100% confident I would get on that
50:24
plane, have no issues getting there, and that I was going to slay the testing.
50:29
And on every single level, you know, grip strength, uh, reaction time,
50:34
physical testing, cognitive testing, and also the evaluations they do for mood
50:39
and behavior, everything showed clin what they called clinically significant
50:43
improvements. And it wasn't just for me. My cohort was 50 uh, play ex- football
50:48
players, college and NFL, and the the group as a whole showed these same
50:54
clinically significant gains in all the areas that I mentioned. So, it was
50:58
really exciting to be a part of that. And in fact, you know, when I got out to
51:02
about a year, I was probably 70 to 80% improved on my overall symptoms and
51:07
issues. Um, which is pretty amazing, especially for anybody that is dealing
51:11
with this. I don't know
51:13
>> of any drug that's come remotely close to that. In fact, most people with CTE
51:19
are usually dealing with anywhere I know of three to 12 pharmaceuticals to help
51:25
them manage symptoms really. I mean, they're they're on sleep stuff. They're
51:30
on anti-depressants. They're on things for anger and so on and so forth.
51:34
Whereas, you know, currently I'm on zero pharma.
51:39
>> I wish I could say that. I'm on the new deck that
51:43
>> it's Yeah, it's not to take away from anybody. I mean, honestly, I think that
51:47
you do what you have to do and you look at it like uh you know, this is the
51:51
band-aid to carry you forward, but you know, hopefully there are things like
51:56
red light and supplements that will start as you attack your symptoms and
52:01
your underlying condition more importantly that you'll be able to start
52:04
rolling some of those pharmaceuticals back because as we know
52:09
>> um many of them use artificial ways to penetrate the blood brain barrier which
52:14
can cause uh brain bleeds and other pretty uh significant uh side effects.
52:21
So, um yeah.
52:23
>> Now, we've been hearing photo modulation.
52:27
>> Mod modulation.
52:29
>> Modulation for the last 45 minutes.
52:32
>> Photobiomodulation.
52:33
>> Photobiomodulation.
52:35
>> For the last 45 minutes.
52:37
>> Yes.
52:37
>> Rico's been a huge part of this in helping others. out of all the studies
52:44
and everything you've read, where's the best place to get your device and how do
52:49
they do it
52:50
>> there? There's a lot of different devices. Yes. Or
52:53
>> Okay, so there Yeah, that's a great point. There are a lot of different
52:56
devices out there. You know, you can certainly get red light pads off of
53:00
Amazon and places like that. Um there is only one company though that has been
53:06
behind this research that has their own researchers in house and that is used in
53:12
the majority of these red light studies and that's a company called Vite Vie Li
53:17
ght uh out of Toronto Canada and they are
53:21
the ones behind my study and there's five or six other major studies that
53:26
involve veterans, firefighters uh and other focal groups that have had
53:32
great results. Now, the other piece which you guys would be interested in is
53:38
the results were so great with my uh study that they went, hm, wonder how
53:45
this would work in active football players.
53:47
>> And so, they actually did a follow-up study behind mine with the BYU football
53:52
team. And they gave it was a double blind placebo study. They had um 22 of
54:00
BYU's starters and they had 11 in a sham device and 11 using the Vite Neurog
54:06
gamma which is the same device I used. They scanned them with D MRI with DTI
54:11
beginning of the season and also at the completion of the season and what they
54:16
found was pretty incredible. So, every single player, whether they had a
54:20
concussion or not, that had the Sham device had significant signs of
54:26
neuroinflammation in their brain throughout the entire brain. The players
54:30
that had the used the red light uh device over the course of the season had
54:37
no signs of neuroinflammation in the brain. And um that can be found online.
54:42
The Vite site actually has those studies and they have some of the visuals of the
54:46
MRI with DTI, but it's pretty amazing to see one that's completely red, lit up of
54:53
those guys that didn't have the device and then a completely sk MRI with DTI on
55:00
those that did. So, um, we're we're now looking at something that can not only
55:05
help people that have an existing head trauma that they're trying to recover,
55:11
but we potentially have something that's a neuroprotectant for active uh,
55:15
athletes. So, you know, this changes the game because, you know, guardian caps,
55:20
qallers, those kinds of things don't stop brain slash and they don't stop the
55:24
neuroinflammation. And this actually the biological
55:28
mechanism of this actually can help with re you know as you hear uh eliminating
55:34
that neuroinflammation.
55:36
>> So your executive function pre red light therapy and post red light
55:42
therapy.
55:44
>> Wow. Uh was horrible. Uh I literally lived with Post-it notes everywhere. You
55:48
know 150 200 Post-it notes. I I was in my, you know, I'd be in my office and
55:54
people would walk in and they kind of look at it, but they wouldn't say
55:56
anything. And that was just normal. That was how that was my new brain. I mean,
56:00
everything was on the exterior and I had it kind of classified by things I have
56:03
to do today, things that are related to work and things that are related to
56:07
home. And as I completed things, I took the stick them off and I threw it in the
56:11
trash, you know. But that was that was my short-term memory or my brain
56:15
function. I there was no uh brain uh coherency whatsoever unfortunately
56:23
and it was it was getting really worrisome because I was you know
56:26
concerned I wasn't going to be able to work. I was worried that uh uh that it
56:30
would continue to decline. Uh you know and as I said I was I had some
56:35
indicators of early Parkinson's. Um I had REM sleep behavior disorder. I had
56:39
tremors. Uh I had uh aphasia. I was losing the the sense of smell. um which
56:46
are all attributable to uh you know Parkinson's
56:50
um and so I was starting to head down that path and
56:54
>> so now as I said now I I don't have those I I don't have the tremors I
56:59
haven't had a REM sleep behavior incident in probably two and a half
57:02
years this is supposed to be an incurable condition
57:06
>> so uh you know and it's documented I had two sleep studies so I I bring the
57:11
receipts on everything I'm saying because I have baselines before I did
57:15
red light and I have uh data after red light that show the difference. Like my
57:20
REM sleep, I was only getting 13 minutes. I'm getting uh right around two
57:25
hours right now, which is what you're supposed to get. And and so that's a
57:30
pretty significant pump.
57:31
>> Stop. CTE.org proudly sponsors the Head Rush podcast.
57:38
>> Karen and Doug Zagel, they are uh founders. Karen founded the Patrick
57:44
Greca CTE Awareness Foundation and they are one of the most comprehensive
57:52
websites regarding repeated head impacts and
57:57
chronic traumatic consephylopathy. They have they work with legislature. They
58:02
are they've been doing this for about 10 years.
58:06
>> They're the grandparents of CTE in my book. So don't knock it. stopct.org.
58:13
>> Let me ask you a question, Rico.
58:16
>> Yeah,
58:16
>> you're still using that game of red light. There's no cure for this disease.
58:21
If you did not use that, would your inflammation take back over?
58:29
>> That's a great question. And so what this is doing again is it's continually
58:34
supporting the mitochondrial function. So they actually with Larry Carr, who I
58:40
talked about earlier, when they did his study, they actually took the red light
58:46
away from him for two months and he began to regress. And so that tells you
58:52
that this definitely has a direct effect on all of these types of function and
58:57
performance uh gains that I'm seeing. And so um when our study was done, it
59:04
was supposed to be a one-year study. They expanded it to five years because
59:08
they had such incredible results with uh everybody that was involved. But at the
59:12
one year mark, they pulled us all in and and told us that if we wanted, we could
59:16
give the devices back. And not a single person that was involved in the study
59:20
gave their device back. So that tells you something. Yeah.
59:23
>> And um for me, there's no way I would not use it at this point. It's so easy
59:28
to do it. You don't feel anything. You just wake up, you throw it on, you look
59:32
at you can look at your phone, you know? I mean, most of us waste 20 minutes in
59:36
the morning laying in bed anyway. So, it's it's it's a really easy protocol to
59:40
do. And um like I said, I feel the benefits every single day. I used to
59:46
have sundowning at like 1:00 in the afternoon. You know, I I'm you know, I
59:51
can I make it till, you know, 8:30 at night now with no issues.
59:57
>> Got me beat. I get them earlier than 8.
1:00:03
Um, and the sense of smell. What smell? I can grab Clorox and go,
1:00:10
>> "Don't smell it."
1:00:11
>> Yeah,
1:00:12
>> that was me. And worse yet, I had like this weird aphasia that my nose was
1:00:17
replacing like whatever. Like if I smelled
1:00:21
something bad, like a skunk or something, my brain would recall that.
1:00:24
But then anything that smelled bad would smell like a skunk. So if I smelled an
1:00:29
onion, it would smell like a skunk. It was like the weirdest. Again, one of
1:00:34
those neuro quirks, but it was it was pretty wild.
1:00:37
>> The only thing I can smell now is dog poop. When the dog poops in the house,
1:00:42
it's like,
1:00:43
>> can I can I get red light through sunlight?
1:00:48
>> You can. So, um, you can get red light through the sunlight. Obviously, the
1:00:52
best time for that is early morning as the sun's coming up. Um however
1:00:58
you know the one thing is the the sunlight is not going to penetrate your
1:01:02
skull and so the V light one of the mechanisms is it's actually as you saw
1:01:08
it's placed on the various portions of your brain called the default mode
1:01:13
network and so um and it's placed directly on the skin and the power and
1:01:19
frequency of it and um and and spectrum of light is shown to penetrate the skull
1:01:27
and get to the brain tissue. So, um, if you go out in the sun, because I've had
1:01:32
people ask, why do I have to do that? Why would I do this? Why would I just
1:01:35
not sit in the sun? You're going to get the refraction and
1:01:39
you don't get the deep penetration into the tissue that you do with uh the red
1:01:43
light device.
1:01:44
>> And quite frankly, our our issues are in the in the brain because when it it's
1:01:50
it's totally inflammation. We know we know that. I mean, I I I got hope
1:01:55
watching, you know, 47 is when my flatline, serotonin, everything went
1:01:59
away or I I thought and uh it's same same thing. And um uh but I saw the
1:02:06
movie Quad Explosions a few years ago. I'm 60 now. I saw it probably three and
1:02:10
a half, four years ago. And the whole thing about inflammation, you know, how
1:02:15
how many years, you know, after your last subconscious
1:02:22
cytoine, right? years and years and years up to 17 years apparently. Anyway,
1:02:28
but but just seeing something like that and hearing about a therapy that that
1:02:33
you have experienced yourself, it's like, okay,
1:02:36
>> okay, there's there's hope there there's a possible way out or a possible um
1:02:41
therapy that's going to help help me. Well, and that's what I think is great
1:02:46
about the movie Quiet Explosion is the movie concussed, my wife cried,
1:02:53
but you know what? They needed to show the cold, hard reality of this disease.
1:03:00
>> Mhm.
1:03:02
>> And so there's no hope in that movie, right?
1:03:04
>> This is what happens. This is what trashes you. If you don't believe me,
1:03:10
>> read this book from Brandy Winens.
1:03:13
>> Yeah. whose husband Jeff Wayne died of it
1:03:17
>> if you so I forgot what I was going to say Dan
1:03:23
um
1:03:23
>> with the hope the hope you get with with with seeing something like
1:03:27
>> yeah like quiet explosions
1:03:30
>> is now you got something that goes
1:03:33
>> shoot that sounds like me I mean we had Andrew Mah on our podcast who's part of
1:03:38
quiet explosions and would he say it's life or death for
1:03:43
him now on his diet and his protocol. It's life or death.
1:03:49
>> Yeah. He's so strict. He's strict. So strict about it, you know.
1:03:54
>> Yeah. Here's the great thing is I think that um my personal gains I mean I've
1:03:59
done a lot of public speaking now. I go around and speak to doctors and sports
1:04:03
performance people. I've spoke at other different events um about my story and
1:04:09
my shared experience and you know people that know me
1:04:15
have seen this just incredible recovery uh from where I was and where I am and
1:04:20
and now fortunately my testing and medical support um that I did have this
1:04:26
drastic improvement and again I was not taking any pharmaceuticals so I am a
1:04:30
great I tell people I'm kind of like an open source like Elon Must did with
1:04:34
Tesla. I I'm giving away, you know, that I had these baselines and I have the
1:04:41
finished product and that the the main thing I was doing was red light.
1:04:44
>> Well,
1:04:45
>> now that being Oh, go ahead.
1:04:47
>> No, no, don't. Oh,
1:04:48
>> I was just going to say that that being said, once it gets you to a stable
1:04:53
point, you know, I didn't have the suicidality. I didn't have the explosive
1:04:56
anger. My cognitive is working extremely well. I mean, I had my best year. I'm
1:05:02
I'm in sales and I had my best year of sales last year uh ever and I've been in
1:05:07
it for 30 years and I I think it's just I'm very sharp. I do a lot of
1:05:11
presentations and I I'm able to stay on top of my game. But um you know once I
1:05:17
got it manageable because that's the hardest thing as you guys know is once
1:05:22
your symptoms just feel so overwhelming and the neuro fatigue and you you lose
1:05:27
hope and then your family is getting disrupted and they're wondering what's
1:05:30
going on and everybody's getting in this depression cycle. You know you just need
1:05:35
a little glimmer of hope. And once I had the red light and I had the hope I could
1:05:39
build on that. And so from that, the shift was to supplements and diet. And
1:05:47
as you guys said, one of one of the diets that I think if anybody with a
1:05:50
neuro condition, whether it's Alzheimer's, CTE, TBI, postconussion,
1:05:55
Mediterranean diet is proven time and time again, the best diet that's for
1:05:59
anti-inflammatory and to to keep your brain in a good
1:06:03
place, right? Um, with that, uh, you know, I stop eating after 5:30. Uh
1:06:08
intermittent fasting has been shown to be very effective getting your brain
1:06:12
into ketosis uh and also um autoagi which is the removal of zombie cells and
1:06:19
clearing waste. You know that can help you when you're not sleeping well and
1:06:24
you've got some waste buildup. This is another tool that helps get some of
1:06:28
those zombie cells and waste out of your system. So that kind of combination has
1:06:32
been very effective. And then supplement-wise,
1:06:36
uh, for me, uh, I do, um, some real tried and truths that you'll hear across
1:06:40
the board. You know, I'm not I'm not the methylene blue guy yet. I'm not willing
1:06:44
to kind of go on the fringes, but, um, highdose omega-3 has been shown to be
1:06:49
extremely effective. CoQ10 is, uh, is a another solid that really helps, uh,
1:06:56
boost the mitochondrial uh, energy in the cells. Um, vitamin B complex is also
1:07:04
a great one. Lion's mane mushroom is the most underrated uh
1:07:10
>> uh supplement you can find. Uh you get a lot of the same benefits that
1:07:14
psychedelics are uh are showing uh in
1:07:19
>> without the psychedelic part of it.
1:07:21
>> Without the psychedelic part, it's a culinary mushroom. So uh you know, so so
1:07:25
those are those are a couple that I found that have been just incredible.
1:07:29
And then for sleep, magnesium glycinate is a very uh tolerable um and a
1:07:36
wellabsorbed form of magnesium.
1:07:39
>> And um magnesium is a driver. It's the silent driver behind a lot of our uh
1:07:46
chemical processes in our body. And Americans, I think 60% of Americans are
1:07:51
already deficient in it without having a brain injury. So, um, getting that and
1:07:57
the glycinate side of it really is good for your nervous system. And I found
1:08:01
that really helped with my sleep as well and the lack of, uh, disruptions to
1:08:05
sleep.
1:08:06
>> That's That's great.
1:08:07
>> I think we take everything he just suggested plus more.
1:08:11
>> Well, a little little D3. I like that, too. So,
1:08:14
>> I do 20,000 units of D3 a day. How about you?
1:08:18
>> Yeah, I' I've been doing 10,000.
1:08:20
>> 10,000. But um look, we always end, you've already finished our our ending
1:08:26
because we always end with a word of hope and you just you just speak, you
1:08:30
know, shared hope all over the place through diet, through recommendations,
1:08:35
through, you know, the fact that you're you're you're you've had your best year
1:08:40
ever in sales. And how old are you now?
1:08:43
>> I'm 53.
1:08:44
>> You're 53 years old. And and just
1:08:47
>> six years six years into my symptoms. Yeah. So, six years ago, you were you
1:08:51
were you couldn't even get on a plane. It was hard for you to go through the
1:08:55
airport and now you're number one, you know, best in sales for you. You know
1:09:02
what you do? So,
1:09:03
>> what do you sell, Rico?
1:09:05
>> Uh, I do design build uh for a construction company uh architectural
1:09:10
firm. So, we we help people with uh building
1:09:15
>> buildings and and their interiors. Yeah.
1:09:18
>> Love that. No, it's not like me when I was out selling nuts, bolts, and oil,
1:09:24
you know. Well, when I worked for Vavalene, I was top 80 in the nation.
1:09:29
>> Yeah. Well, that you that that's a specialty. That's that's a you know, you
1:09:33
both.
1:09:34
>> But now I couldn't sell ice to an Eskimo where before that would be the easiest
1:09:39
sell in the world.
1:09:40
>> We got to get you your little helmet. A little
1:09:42
>> We got to get me a Gammaite. I I'm excited. We definitely need to hook you
1:09:46
up, Corey, because I'm I'm excited that you will become a disciple like me that
1:09:50
red light works.
1:09:51
>> Great.
1:09:52
>> I'm all game.
1:09:54
>> Thank you so much. And Rico, you have fun at the Super Bowl media walk
1:09:59
tomorrow and enjoy your time there.
1:10:03
>> Thank you. Yeah, I'm going to be part of that Lee Steinberg Neurosummit. So, I'm
1:10:06
really excited. So, I'll send you guys some follow-up uh photos from that.
1:10:10
>> Be a great time. And hopefully we'll learn some more about some of the
1:10:13
advances with CTE and uh and healing the brain.
1:10:16
>> Excellent.
1:10:16
>> Well, have you seen that list that Lee Steinberg set down on every all the cons
1:10:23
people that's going to be there and different companies? Violife's one of
1:10:26
them by the way.
1:10:27
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They're there. There's it's it's Lee has done this for over 20
1:10:32
years and he brings the best of the best together and he's really been an a an
1:10:37
agent that gave back uh and and is really about helping the players and
1:10:42
helping save football too. So he's he's an incredible person and uh just I'm
1:10:47
this is my first one. So I'm really excited to be a part of that. We heard
1:10:51
him speak
1:10:52
>> at the
1:10:54
>> Mac Barkman
1:10:55
>> Mac Barkman uh you know global summit last about six months ago, seven months
1:10:59
ago. So
1:11:01
>> yep. Uh appreciate it. Um we uh uh I'm having some CTE moments right now.
1:11:09
>> I need I need a break.
1:11:12
>> Rico, thank you very much. We'll have we'll we look forward to the next time
1:11:16
we have you on and I look forward to uh testing out some photobiomodulation.
1:11:22
>> Awesome.
1:11:23
>> Thank you.
1:11:23
>> Thank you gentlemen for everything you do uh you know as part of the CTE
1:11:28
advocacy community. Uh there's a lot of eyes on you. We all appreciate how hard
1:11:32
you guys work for us and that you're getting the word out and you're more
1:11:36
importantly removing the stigma about CTE.
1:11:40
>> You know, this is something that happened to us. This is not a defect of
1:11:43
us. And the more people understand that a lot of us are are everyday people that
1:11:50
were high performers that are just trying to get back and be able to enjoy
1:11:53
our family, enjoy quality of life. You guys are helping change that that uh
1:11:58
that image that uh you know that the NFL and others have portrayed that we're all
1:12:03
uh you know,
1:12:04
>> loose cannons that uh you know can't be controlled and you know, so thank you
1:12:09
for for what you do. Thank you. And like I said, have fun and we'll talk to you
1:12:15
here shortly. I'm going to give you a little bit of a break after Saturday
1:12:18
night. So, um, you guys,
1:12:21
>> I look forward to that.
1:12:23
>> Thank you, Rico.
1:12:24
>> All right,
1:12:24
>> take care, guys. Bye. Bye-bye.
1:12:27
>> All right.
1:12:28
>> Wow.
1:12:28
>> Yeah.
1:12:29
>> What a great
1:12:31
>> episode. Please like, share, follow, subscribe, review, do everything that
1:12:38
the millennials and all the social media gurus do. And
1:12:45
>> you've gotten pretty good at this social media thing. And I I think I've seen
1:12:49
>> No, no, because we got Redbird Media doing it for us.
1:12:52
>> Yes, Redbird uh media is doing it for us now. But you made your own little AI
1:12:58
cowboy thing you where you were jumping around these cartoons that they're
1:13:03
doing.
1:13:04
>> Should I show the video?
1:13:05
>> No, no, no, no.
1:13:09
>> I don't I don't like some of that stuff that it's it's realistic. It's
1:13:13
>> Oh, it's scary.
1:13:14
>> Yeah, it is scary. All right, stay stay alive.
1:13:17
>> Thank you.
1:13:18
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1:13:21
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