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From Here Forward shares stories and ideas about amazing things UBC and its alumni are doing around the world. It covers people and places, truths, science, art, and accomplishments with the view that sharing better inspires better. Join hosts Carol Eugene Park and Jeevan Sangha, both UBC grads, in exploring solutions for the negative stuff out there — focussing on the good for a change, from here forward.
[00:02] Rumneek: Hi. Welcome to From Here Forward, a UBC Podcast Network podcast. I'm Rumneek and she's Carol.
[00:15] Carol: That's me. Hey, hey.
[00:17] Rumneek: And today we're doing another one of our Changemaker episodes. This is where we profiled different UBC faculty and alumni that are out there doing their amazing thing to change the world. Hence the title.
[00:29] Carol: So for this episode, we talk to Alexander Leon Gumuchian, aka. baby no money (bbno$), not bbnos. He's a Canadian rapper and TikTok sensation from Vancouver who went viral after releasing his first single, LaLaLa.
[00:46] Bbno$: I am an alumni grad at UBC. That's the right terminology. I totally have not tapped myself into the world of education in quite some time. So life's good. What's up?
[00:59] Rumneek: Fabulous. And this was a wild interview. We caught up with bbno$ the day after he'd just gotten back to Vancouver from the Junos. He was booked into a day full of interviews and was in a burrito shop when the interview was set to start.
[01:14] Carol: When Rumneek says wild, she means wild and we're dramatic people. But talking to him while he was trying to grab a meal was quite the roller coaster.
[01:24] Bbno$: I haven’t eaten anything today so I’m just at this joint trying to get a burrito and taking a little bit longer than I expected. I got back from the Junos yesterday, and it was like the worst hangover I've ever had in my life. I did another interview right before I came down here and I was like “ah”, then I have to make a TikTok, living my best life.
[01:44] Rumneek: TikTok. Life of a rock star.
[01:48] Bbno$: Oh, Alex. Yeah. Perfect, thank you. We got it, ladies and gentlemen. All right.
[01:55] Rumneek: We got the burrito.
[01:56] Bbno$: We got the burrito. Thanks, guys.
[01:58] Rumneek: We're going to keep all of this in the final podcast, by the way.
[02:01] Bbno$: Obviously.
[02:05] Carol: I'm just going to preface that I'm going to call him Alex and not bbno$, because those are too many words in my mouth. So since Alex had just gotten back from the Junos, we wanted to ask him what his experience was like.
[02:16] Bbno$: It was good. I think Imma egotistically state that I think I had the best outfit. There's no doubt. Otherwise, like, I said I was no longer a virgin on live television, which is funny and then I dapped at Shawn Mendez forcingly, which was sick. Cuz dude, Shawn Mendes is so which attractive. I’m sure he, like, has been really… you know when like someone so hot in high school or like when they grow up that everything's just like, kind of like kicked out for them.
[02:46] I feel like he might be like, lightly because I've never spoken to him but he seems like an incredibly nice guy. But, like, holy**, I've never seen anyone more beautiful. Like, his bone structure is like perfect. This man is for the people. Other than that, I was pretty much it, but I got really, really, really drunk. I don't usually get that drunk, but that was nuts. And I was dancing with Arcade Fire, like playing on a jump like Mexican drum and just crazy, crazy.
[03:18] Rumneek: Aside from the outfit and Shawn Mendes. Was this your first time at an awards show? Like, what was that vibe like for you? How did you feel being in that whole environment?
[03:29] Bbno$: It was pretty interesting. I've never been to an awards show let alone the Junos. I've been nominated for a bunch of Junos but I've never won. But it's kind of like super industry. It kind of felt like high school lightly. Yeah. Like an award ceremony in high school or like a—you know when you sing a bunch of Oh Canada's in high school and you sit in an auditorium.
[03:55] That's what it kind of felt like. Kind of sucks. But nonetheless, it's really nice to meet people that I've spoken to over the Internet. And it felt right because I feel like a lot of the Canadian acts that I met there had a lot of respect for me and I have a lot of respect for them. And it was like cool to meet and actually just speak in person because usually it's just through DM’s
[04:18] Carol: We asked him about his UBC graduation, which was also around the time when his first song blew up.
[04:24] Rumneek: I mean, crossing the stage and becoming an overnight sensation is an ideal scenario, I'd say.
[04:29] Carol: You would say not me. Anyway, like this interview it wasn't an easy path for Alex, especially in terms of getting his parents on board with his music career.
[04:39] Rumneek: Been there, done that. Well, not from my music career, but just getting my parents on board with things. Anyways, we'll save that for therapy. Here's Alex.
[04:48] Bbno$: Hold on, my mom's calling me. Give me a second. And now someone is mowing the lawn in my apartment, like, dude, you guys just got the [] of the law. Let me text my mom. I'll call you later. June 7th, we promoted the date for ‘LaLaLa’ for like a month. And then I was like, oh, shit, I'm graduating.
[05:08] That's it. That's crazy. And that was pretty much it. I remember my sister, my mom and my dad, they were like, driving back after me walking across the stage and I was like, “yeah, I got to drop songs, it's going to change my life.” And my mom and dad were like, “No, let's go for lunch. Like what?”
[05:29] And then my sister texted me. She's like, “Why are you, like, breaking up the family on an important day?” And I was like, “Relax. It's not a big deal. Let me just go grab the song and come back, and everyone would be happy, and then we can go for food.” And then I just ended up missing the lunch because I had [] properly.
[05:46] And I ate a bag of [] chips, honey [] to be specific. And my stomach was hurting because I just felt so bad after eating that bag of chips. But at that moment, my life, like financially, metaphorically literally changed in every way possible for the benefit perhaps. I don't know. But yeah, that's pretty much it. And then every single record label in the world was in my email inbox and they were like, “So, what's going on here?”
[06:18] And then signed it for a bunch of money and now my life is amazing so it's great. I'm glad that I use my university degree for absolutely nothing. But I mean, I feel like a lot of people do these days. But education is still power. I will say that.
[06:33] Rumneek: I read an article about bbno$ that was called Meme to Mainstream. And given both the course of this interview, and apparently his career, that couldn't be more accurate.
[06:44] Carol: Meme to mainstream is such a Zillennial reality. Even though he found mainstream success overnight, it doesn't take away from the fact that he's so dedicated to his craft and his artistry. He never gave up on his music career, which not everyone is willing to pursue their real passions. It is too much of a gamble sometimes.
[07:02] Bbno$: You guys probably know somedays can suck. I would like wake up at four in the morning and like drink coffee and like make music because it was like my passion project before I would go to class and I stopped partying. So, if anything, it was like a health benefit. And my friend’s music took off and then we had a bunch of songs together. And I was like, “I'd be stupid to not at least give this a shot.”
In the beginning of my musical career was definitely an escape. It was just like something to do. And my mom was kind of worried, to be honest. She was like, “What are you doing with all this music stuff? You swear so much in your songs, I'm not proud of you.” And then I was like, “Yo, just give me five years.”
[07:40] And then I did it in three and a half and now she's proud of me. So, it was all good. She doesn't care. But my family's pretty traditional. My dad's Armenian, my mom's Swiss Danish and me being late, also punctuality, I apologize once again. I am never late. I always show up way before but my stomach was on time.
[08:00] Rumneek: I respect the hustle and his honesty.
[08:03] Carol: Could you imagine waking up before your day starts to put in the hours for your passion? Because I simply could not. Alex also talked a bit about his time at UBC, which was relatable.
[08:14] Bbno$: The one thing I really like about school is everyone is simultaneously getting destroyed by school. And it's kind of like… it's a unifying in a sense where everyone is just, like, under the weather and no one's happy. No one's just, like, skating by perfectly 99-percentile. There's obviously a couple of nerds in the world but I was not one of those. I would put my hours in and I would not get the results I wanted back usually.
[08:43] And I was like I know that the linear form of education, the public-school education is just not really for me. I'm a different hands-on learner and I learned by trial and error rather than just like textbook.
[09:01] Rumneek: I was also surprised to learn that he was a competitive swimmer in university, which he said inspired his drive and the rest was chalked up to just, quote, “being himself”.
[09:11] Carol: Look, I know athletes get a bad [?] for being, quote unquote, unintelligent, but some of my friends in high school used to be up at the crack of dawn doing drills, then going to class, then going to after school practice for hours on top of doing homework and studying in between I mean. I could barely get out through my first year. Athletes have drive.
[09:32] Bbno$: I work really hard. I know for a fact not many people around me work as hard. Whether or not that's just because I went to school and I was like I figured out a work ethic. I don't know. I used to be a competitive swimmer so that also kind of helps because you're like heads down for 3 hours not speaking to anyone and you're just busting your ass in the water.
[09:55] But yeah, that's pretty much it. I figured out how to-- I excelled in like presentations and at that moment, I was like I feel like I'm good at presenting and I'm good at speaking in front of people and being myself. I learned how to research. I think research in itself is like, kind of like the most important thing that you can get from university, people skills too. So, essentially a university is just like social networking.
[10:21] You just broaden out your base of who you know and… being in the musical world and the music industry, that is like practically the only thing that matters is being able to, like, bullshit and talk to people and I feel like I was like relatively good at it. And I don't think the network that I made through university is really beneficial for my career currently.
[10:44] Rumneek: Even though bbno$ for an international fame, he could have moved to L.A. like every other Canadian artist.
[10:50] Carol: He could have, but he's staying humble and sticking to his roots. And I really respect the love he has for his family.
[10:57] Bbno$: I love my family and my family lives here so I can't see me moving away. But I'll definitely buy property elsewhere and stay there when it's terrible here. Which is five, six months of the year. It's all relative because there's several times in my musical career where I'm just like, “Wow, I just don't do this right now.” And today I'm doing like seven interviews and talking to people and taking meetings. And then I have a therapy session afterwards and it's just a ton of talking. So sometimes it's very cyclical and it feels like I'm doing the exact same thing every single day. And it's obviously a very facade.
[11:38] The music business, but sometimes when you see it from the real side, it's not a big deal. And it really isn't that all that interesting. And I think the best way to educate yourself is to have fun with it. And that's the one thing I did a lot of with my music is I really just have fun. I don't know if it is kind of a telltale, but I'm an insane person and I feel like I've just hatched into more of an insane person because I've been able to preserve my like, inner child and just do what I want.
[12:20] I take a lot of inspiration from like Yung Lean and a lot of like the real SoundCloud era, like Warner Hollow Boys, [?], Suicide Boys. And it was like pretty inspirational being able to see these guys have a meteoric rise from literally just dropping music and cultivating a fanbase from continual music output. And that's all it was. A desirable facade to watch and be like, “Oh, wow, I find these guys interesting. They look real, they look so similar to me.”
[12:57] And it's like the relatability is kind of what struck me. And then I was just like, “Well, shit, if they can do it, I could do it. And I didn't expect to get this far. I don't think anyone can and usually the people who do get far, really far don't expect to be successful in music.
[13:17] Carol: Not to be like a media person but TikTok has opened up so many opportunities for so many people. It's mind blowing to see that anyone can go viral and find success in nontraditional ways. It's not just a silly dancing app anymore. You can build a whole career out of whatever expertise you decide to contribute on the app.
[13:34] Rumneek: Yeah, I mean, we could never go viral like that, but it will not stop us from trying. I want to follow up on that because you said you started off kind of on SoundCloud as well, and then a lot of, your success continues to spiral on TikTok, and both of those platforms are places that people can share directly from themselves, that you can just post your stuff on SoundCloud, you can just post yourself on TikTok.
[13:56] How do you think that being able to kind of have that agency over your content and being able to kind of just like put stuff out there as you wanted to…. helped your career and kind of impacted your career?
[14:08] Bbno$: See, I was really apprehensive in the beginning of TikTok when it blew up. Because I was like, “I don't want to have to do another social media. I'm already losing my mind.” But I was like, right in the gap, age gap of--most of the people I know personally don't use social media. So it's like right under me, like the ’97s, ‘98s ‘99s are people who loved social media and that's their life.
[14:37] But God bless TikTok, it changed my life and God bless social media and God bless my innate ability to figure out what people want by just looking at numbers and analytics and statistics and like research and marketing. And without the Internet, I would not be a musician. There's no doubt. I would definitely be cracking people's backs as a chiropractic. That's it.
[15:02] Carol: It's no secret that Vancouver has a lot of amazing talent. Every city does. But that being said, it can be competitive or just difficult to get recognition outside of the artist's niche.
[15:12] Rumneek: Definitely. It sometimes feels like you have to know someone in order to make it big.
[15:17] Carol: I’ll just throw myself under the bus here by saying that when Alex mentioned a local Vancouver talent, I had no idea what he was talking about, which is unsurprising because I am a mainstream girly.
[15:27] Rumneek: I feel like calling yourself a mainstream girly just kind of cancels that out.
[15:31] Bbno$: You know, it's weird. I feel like the municipality of Vancouver kind of like holds back artistry here. They keep on like cutting down venues that are like very important to the heart of the Vancouver scene and for like kids to go and experience. But I really, really like Porcelain. I really like jungle Bobby and [inaudible], like my camp. [?] He’s great, angst is great.
[16:01] There's really quite a lot of music coming out of this. What’s this group? Doohickey Cubicle, they're like an alternative band. I think Peach Pit is from here. I don't know specifically if they are. But there's so much I don't even know where to start. But those are like the ones that immediately come to my mind that I like and friends with like, probably talk to them often.
[16:24] Carol: I don't know about you, Rumneek but I feel like we need more Canadian shows when artists go on tour. Like, it's so annoying when your favorite artists either don't bother to tour in Canada or choose the most random cities to show up to.
[16:36] Rumneek: Yeah, it's not fun having to fly out of province because that's the only Canadian city that a singer is touring at.
[16:41] Carol: Indeed. And since he's an international artist now, I had to ask Alex if he was touring in Canada.
[16:48] Bbno$: Yeah, I'm doing a Canadian tour. I’m actually touring until December 8th. I’m worried for my health but it should be fun. Touring is fun. It's very gruesome. It's very difficult. I did not expect it to be as difficult as it is. It definitely takes a type of person. There was a point on tour, my last tour, I had like 20 hours of sleep a month. It's awful. But at least it's great. You get to see the physical means of doing shows and see the people that make my life amazing. And then I get to get back to them to the best of my ability. And I give it a cookbook every time I do a show too. It doesn't matter what cookbook it is. It just something I do.
[17:36] My show is pretty much like sketch comedy rather than music and it's cool because the energy I put out in the world is so well reciprocated. And people, they're like my friends because I put myself out there in the world and then my fans are just like funny dudes and funny ladies that are just like quirky, nerdy. And I'm like this is fire. Like I just get to have fun with my friends. So, Canada tour and I'm going to Europe, and I'm going to Australia, Southeast Asia. That's too much honestly. I got to eat the burrito now.
[18:16] Rumneek: Yes. I think that was it. Yeah, that was it for us. Thank you so much for giving us your time and hopefully enjoy your burrito and get through the rest of the interviews today.
[18:27] Bbno$: No, worries, No worries.
[18:35] Carol: Despite his chaotic energy which was warranted, given his hectic day, it was nice to chat with a viral sensation who's pretty sure and humble. And he's just a Vancouver boy living in a big world. Are you inspired, Rumneek?
[18:47] Rumneek: [?] the inspired. I mean, maybe I will work on a debut album myself as a UBC alumni.
[18:53] Carol: That will not be successful.
[18:55] Rumneek: Haters are going to hate. Anyways, I do have to give it to him though. He is unapologetically his chaotic self and that led him to the success he has today and I'm impressed.
[19:06] Carol: It goes to show that timing, hard work and a little luck can go a long way to make your dreams come true. Look at me, I'm a philosopher.
[19:14] Rumneek: It was deep.
[19:17] Carol: I was not done. Anyway, stick to your guns and you'll get a UBC degree, a viral music career, and a burrito.
[19:24] Rumneek: You truly cannot forget the burrito.
Carol: Iconic.
Rumneek: Thanks everyone for listening. Make sure you catch our next episode by subscribing or following our show on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you're feeling your feels, please drop us a review. You can also find me on Twitter @rumneeek with three E's.
[19:44] Carol: And me @caroleugenepark.
[19:46] Rumneek: Today's episode was recorded at CiTR Radio and engineered by Hina Imam. From here Forward is an alumna UBC Podcast, produced by Podium Podcast Company.