Beyond The Job Title | Underrepresented Career Stories

In this episode, we join visionary wellness enthusiast Angelique Bolding on a transformative journey of navigating remote work loneliness, unlocking work styles through personality tests, and creating brand experiences that inspire living well. Angelique's multifaceted path in branding and marketing, driven by passion and purpose, breaks barriers and empowers women with a limitless mindset. With a deep understanding that you can't pour from an empty cup, we explore the power of self-care and the significance of building connections and communities. Drawing from her silent retreat experience, Angelique shares the serenity found in silence and offers valuable insights on workplace wellness. Join us as we delve into Angelique's remarkable expertise and heartfelt mission to inspire others, promoting a healthier, more connected world. Get ready to be inspired, empowered, and uplifted on this enlightening journey.

  • (00:00) - Intro
  • (02:57) - Navigating loneliness and isolation in a remote work setting
  • (07:02) - Unlocking your work style: harnessing the power of personality tests
  • (10:26) - Creating brand experiences that inspire people to live well
  • (11:59) - Passion, purpose, and pursuit: Angel's multifaceted path in branding and marketing
  • (14:16) - What are the problems that you want to solve?
  • (15:28) - Breaking barriers: women empowerment and the limitless mindset
  • (18:23) - You can't pour from an empty cup
  • (20:08) - The power of connection and community building
  • (31:05) - Finding serenity in silence: lessons from Angel's silent retreat experience
  • (38:18) - Workplace wellness
  • (47:40) - Rapid fire closing
  • (55:34) - Outro

Angel’s Bio

Creating brand experiences that inspire people to live well.

Angelique is a visionary wellness enthusiast who is passionate about promoting well-being and connecting people with resources and opportunities to live their best lives. As a creative leader and skilled communicator, Angel has designed and implemented innovative wellness initiatives that bring people together and inspire positive change.

Through her work as a connector and creator, Angelique has become a driving force in their community, inspiring others to live their best lives while helping to create a healthier, more connected world.

As a veteran brand professional, Angelique has helped generate business value through integrated experiences with a strong foundation in content production and creative strategy. Emphasizing a global approach to go-to-market strategies, Angelique lives at the intersection of creativity and business with a mindfully innovative, and purpose-driven approach.

She has helped build global brands of all sizes and enjoys an opportunity to exercise her background in broadcasting as a video and podcast host and brand spokesperson.

Referenced

Where to find Angel
  • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/angeliquemarya
  • Instagram: https://instagram.com/angeliquemarya_?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
  • Website: https://www.angeliquemarya.com/
  • Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/c/angeliquembailey/videos

Where to find Cesar
  • Twitter: https://twitter.com/iamcesarromero
  • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamcesarromero/

Creators & Guests

Host
Cesar Romero
Helping startups and SMBs build strong customer relationships that drive product adoption, reduce churn, and increase revenue | Community-Driven | Podcast Host
Guest
Angelique Bolding
Creating brand experiences that inspire people to live well

What is Beyond The Job Title | Underrepresented Career Stories?

The lack of diversity in tech can lead to imposter syndrome, bias, and a sense of isolation that hinders your growth and ambition.

Welcome to 'Beyond The Job Title Podcast,' where we shine a spotlight on the journeys of underrepresented tech professionals and allies within the SaaS industry.

Join us as we delve into the personal development and career insights that have fueled their success.

Discover the stories of trailblazing underrepresented SaaS founders, executives, and professionals who have broken barriers and achieved remarkable milestones.

Whether you're seeking inspiration, mentorship, or actionable strategies to advance your career, our podcast is your go-to resource.

Tune in to gain valuable insights, build your network, and navigate your tech career journey with confidence.

Subscribe now and take the next step toward your own success in the world of tech.

Ready to connect and go beyond the title?

Join the community and be one of the first to know when new episodes drop.

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Angelique Bolding | BJT06
[00:00:00] Angelique: I recognize that there's a lot of problems in this world that I can solve. And I want to be unapologetic about the ones that I'm going to solve.
[00:00:09] And it came to a point for me where I was working in tech and software sales and, um, you know, the great organizations, but it wasn't the problem I wanted to solve. I wanna help people and ultimately my own personal experiences, uh, caregiving for elderly parents. Going through the, the process of, of that understanding, you know, grief, understanding, you know, self-care, mental health, that really, really, I.
[00:00:34] Just came to the forefront from me over the last three years, especially going through something like The Pandemic. And I just said, you know, if I'm going to dedicate my entire life, we, we spent a lot of our life and our careers and our, and our jobs, then I wanna make sure that I'm helping people. And so this has been a way for me to combine my brand experience with helping people.
[00:00:57] And on a fundamental level, I look at [00:01:00] the organizations that we have today. We have mega, mega, mega organizations that, in some cases are more powerful than some governments. So I believe that if we can really care at the heart of the people that are running these companies to give a shit about things going on in the world, then we might have a, we might have a greater opportunity to, to make some changes around here.
[00:01:19] So I wanna be the one to help with that.
[00:01:21] Hey friends, this is your host Cesar Romero. And you're listening to beyond the job title podcast, the show that explores the human experiences to shape our professional and personal lives.
[00:01:40] My guest for this episode is my good old friend angelic balding. And Joel and I met back in 2014 through the power of travel and community.
[00:01:51] And I'm her core angel is a connector and a creator. She's all about bringing people together. Inspiring positive [00:02:00] change. And she has become a driving force in their community, inspiring others to live their best lives. While helping to create a healthier, more connected world.
[00:02:08] In this episode with time deeper into one land angel, to pursue her passions for branding, marketing, wellness, and experiences. And become unapologetic about the Providence that you want to solve. We'll also talk about the role model that may her believe that a woman can do ops. Anything that she sets her mind to.
[00:02:29] We also talk about the value of creating brand experiences. I inspire people to live well. The differences between loneliness and isolation and how extreme remote work can, can lead to. The extreme of that. Uh, her approach to community building and one-on-one connections and so much more.
[00:02:42] So, if you are someone that believes in the power of community and helping people live more meaningful lives. Then this episode is for you. Thank you so much for listening, and I hope you enjoyed the episode.
[00:02:57] Angelique: Uh, one of the, the dudes from uh, happy [00:03:00] Hail, he sent me something yesterday.
[00:03:03] Cesar: Um, happy hail. They're in Raleigh, right? They're like, uh, yeah. Healthy
[00:03:07] Angelique: food chain. Yeah. It was this, oh, say it says loneliness. Loneliness is the tax you pay to atone for a certain complexity of mine.
[00:03:15] Cesar: Hmm. What does that mean to you?
[00:03:17] Angelique: Well, I think in that topic of, uh, loneliness when it comes to being remote, I think it's interesting because we're complex thinkers and especially in business, um, you know, it gets even more complicated. And so I think that having an opportunity to connect with individuals on a one-to-one basis is going to continue to be extremely important.
[00:03:37] And we need to be able to get out of our heads, you know, and, and speak from the heart and be able to speak with one another. Um, but I think it also comes into play as individuals. You know, we can feel lonely because our thoughts can be very complex and, you know, it's not always easy to articulate. So, Yeah.
[00:03:52] Cesar: Have you felt lonely recently?
[00:03:56] Angelique: Um, I've been okay with being lonely. I think for [00:04:00] me it's more so isolation. Mm-hmm. I think there's a difference. Um, I am somebody that's good with being alone. I like being alone, but I, I mean, I drove myself nuts when I was a hundred percent remote and I'm in this box of a room and my cat is here, and my snacks are here, and this is all I had.
[00:04:20] So, yeah, that, I think it wasn't, it wasn't so much of loneliness as it was, it felt isolated. Yes.
[00:04:27] Cesar: I feel the same way. Uh, you feel. Isolated in a room four walls. Um,
[00:04:33] Angelique: and this is my only mode of connection is to speak to somebody through a computer screen.
[00:04:38] Cesar: Right. And a lot of people are in a situation, which that's why I think hybrid to me, it's like the balance and the middle ground between remote and onsite.
[00:04:50] And that's why you, you're seeing more companies do that. Um, like they're, they're doing hybrid, right? Especially in, in tech. Yeah. Um, so I'm, I'm all about that to be [00:05:00] honest. Uh, about give people the option, right. Of going to an office, like see other humans physically. Um,
[00:05:07] Angelique: yeah. Yeah. I think there's a lot to be said about, um, you know, there's a lot more research that's coming out in regards to how people work and.
[00:05:16] I don't think it's something that's gonna be easy to organizationally when you're working with a thousand plus people to be able to put something into practice that appeases everyone. But I think for teams to understand the different personality types and how people work and seeing how you can at least find some common ground in things, I think is another interesting topic because we all work very differently.
[00:05:40] We all learn very differently, and I think so many, so many roadblocks come from just simply not understanding one another or feeling as though there's one structure to how something should be, or one system to how something should be, versus being open to the possibilities of needing to change a structure to be a little bit [00:06:00] more flexible for individuals.
[00:06:03] Cesar: Yeah. How, how would you go about doing that though? In, in, in terms of personalities, like would you recommend people. Taking a test and sharing that during the interview process. I, I know you're, um, you're a fan of the anagram, right? I, I saw that on your, on your LinkedIn. Uh, I'm a peacemaker. I think that's number two.
[00:06:19] Uh, in, you know, I took that test because I really wanted to have a baseline on how to explain my tendencies when it comes to my personality. Okay. And the, and the anagram helped me understand that I gravitate towards peace and harmony. Mm-hmm. I tr I tend to avoid conflict. And just being aware of that has helped me a lot in terms of, I start to notice that I start to go with the flow.
[00:06:42] I start to not confront Right. And not speaking up my mind. Um, so that's been super helpful and I'm, and I'm, I'm, I'm curious, how did you. Find out about the engram and, and, you know, what's your approach when, when, when it comes to matching your personality to the [00:07:00] business, to a brand, you know, to your job?
[00:07:02] Angelique: Hmm. So I'll start with the first question of, uh, my, my thoughts on the engram and, and if you know where I heard about it. Um, I, I guess with the engram, I, I'm a fan loosely. I think that mm-hmm. There's so many different personality, uh, equations and tests and things like that out there that you can take.
[00:07:16] I mean, I've done the disc assessment, I've done Myers-Briggs, I've done E N F J. I mean, I'm like a, not a Scorpio, I'm a Aquarius. Capricorn cusp, I mean, There's so many things for folks to reach for, to wanna have a guide to understanding who they are. And I look at the engram and some of those things very similarly where, um, it's like astrology where it's like, okay, this is helpful, this is helpful in understanding, you know, some similarities within traits that, that I might, um, might have.
[00:07:45] However, I think that it really depends on your season of life. I think it depends on where your mood is at when you take these tests. So I definitely don't look at them as Bible. I think that they're kinda like those stars [00:08:00] in the sky that you can kind of follow in a, in a certain direction and understand, um, high level what other people, um, what other people are like.
[00:08:08] I do advocate for. Again, having something like that in a team setting where you can understand your teammates, I mean, there's in a lot of work that have gone into these types of tests and, um, analogies. And so I think when you can get that baseline understanding of, okay, you know, this person is more of a challenger, so I'm not gonna be, I'm not gonna feel some type of way or be reactive when they challenge me, because I know that's just simply who they are.
[00:08:36] Um, same thing for, you know, I'm a number seven enthusiast. I guess my wing is supposed to be like an eight or a six. I'm kind of undecided because I can be a challenger, especially in business. Um, but yeah, I mean, I think they're definitely helpful tools for at least understanding the dynamics of your team.
[00:08:52] I know some teams that. This one, um, c e o, she will not hire somebody in a sales role that's [00:09:00] not like a seven or like an eight or something like that. Uh, so it just depends on the team and how they view it and how strongly they view it. I think it's helpful. I think that you always have to leave room for humans being human and people changing.
[00:09:16] Cesar: Yes. And um, that's what happened to me cuz I took it as a frame of reference, but I also saw it as an opportunity to have a way to explain my, my tendencies, but also at the same time, knowing that I can change these tendencies, right? Mm-hmm. It's, it's, it's not like they're fixed. It's more like, um, like a snapshot of your, maybe you're going through some growth, maybe you're going through a season, right?
[00:09:39] And some tendencies are more prevalent than than others. Um, so, but yeah, I, I don't think it should be taken as gospel.
[00:09:46] Angelique: Yeah. You know, and, and I think on the flip side is, um, even understanding your, uh, the low points of the tendencies of your personalities. You know, as an enthusiast, I'm somebody where I'm like, Ooh, this is a great idea.
[00:09:57] This is a great idea. Let's do this. I'm gonna, you know, reinvent the [00:10:00] wheel. We're gonna create seven companies by next year, and this is great. And it's like, yeah, well, sometimes you are perceived as being unfocused or like, there's too many things that you're trying to do when you just need to simplify.
[00:10:13] So I think it's also helpful as that guide to see both sides of yourself and then have to face the other side of yourself and be able to call your yourself on your own shit and be like, simplify, simmer down now.
[00:10:26] Cesar: No, there's, there is, um, on your LinkedIn profile, there is, uh, Slogan and I wanted to ask you about that, you know, and, and it's, uh, it, it reads, uh, creating brand experiences that inspire people to live well.
[00:10:35] Yes. What does that mean to you?
[00:10:36] Angelique: What that means to me? I mean, I'm a creative at heart and for me to create experiences. Experiences can be broad. It can be the experience of content, it can be experiences of interaction, it can be experiences of, as you know, I've, I've hosted retreats, I've done, uh, different workshops.
[00:10:55] I've held events. Um, and, and so I think when, for me, it's creating experiences [00:11:00] that enable people to connect, but even more so connect in a way that inspires them to live well. And when you think about brand experiences, especially, you know, it's one thing to have a product, it's one thing to have a slogan, it's one thing to have a logo.
[00:11:16] If your brand doesn't have an experience attached to it, it's really hard to create community. And so for me, when I say creating experiences that inspire people to live well, it's looking at brands and, um, you know, opportunities to create branded experiences which bring people together on the common goal of inspiring them to play, to make art, to have self-care, to, you know, do the yoga, do the wellness, go to health coaching.
[00:11:45] And so for me, it's an opportunity to broaden the lens of what an experience could be and attach myself to an organization and help them, you know, figure out what that path may look like for their, their customers and their individuals. Now, how do you
[00:11:59] Cesar: define an experience? You know, what makes an experience Hmm, relevant?
[00:11:59] Angelique: What makes an experience relevant? Well, I think the relevancy comes into how people feel. Hmm. I think an experience comes down to literally, it's, it's, it's how something makes you feel. So you and I have worked in the travel space mm-hmm. And you know that, you know, if there's one industry that's booming, it's because they travel is an experience.
[00:11:59] So you know how you feel when you travel. And so when someone asks you, you know, Hey, how was, how was traveling to Guatemala? Or, you know, the trip to Costa R it was an incredible experience. You innately, as you, as you talk, as you explain that you, you, you express that feeling. Mm-hmm. And so an experience is a feeling.
[00:11:59] And I, I believe that there's a lot that can be packed into an experience and packed into a feeling from a program or a product perspective.
[00:11:59] Cesar: I love that it's, it's about how you make people feel. Correct. Okay. The experience, the brand is an experience
[00:11:59] Angelique: completely. If your brand does not have an experience, it's really hard to create a community.
[00:11:59] Yes. You've gotta invoke in motion.
[00:11:59] Cesar: [00:12:00] What inspire you to. To pursue these passions around branding, marketing, wellness experiences. You know, was there a certain point in your career where you decided, Hey, you know, this is the path I'm gonna pursue, or was there, have you always been that way? I'm, I'm curious about that.
[00:12:17] Angelique: Yeah. You know, me too. No, I, uh, it's something that came natural to me ever since I was a, a small child. I've always been interested in the arts. I was very fortunate to have a set of parents that had really, um, pushed me to be more, uh, they advocated for the arts at a very young age throughout my, my educational career.
[00:12:33] Um, but it was when I got into college and growing up with a, a mother who was an entrepreneur and just alpha female, that I learned so much from her about the business side of things. And so I found that in college, um, it was an art major and I switched to an art minor and I found my love for broadcast art and tv, film and media.
[00:12:51] Because ultimately I wanted an opportunity to be able to utilize both left brain, right brain, business and creativity, and see how I can infuse [00:13:00] the two together. Now when it comes to wellness, I think that's always been, um, self-care has always been a journey for me. Uh, you know, as it is for everybody. I, I, I see how it can make someone feel.
[00:13:10] I see how it can brighten someone's day. Um, and, and self-care isn't, it shouldn't be. And it, it kind of can be, uh, the idea that we have to consume ourselves. Our, we can't consume ourselves to wellness, but when it comes to being able to, being able to create experiences, create community, that's where I found this intersection, intersection.
[00:13:28] And for a good bit of my career, I was working with consumer product goods. So I, you know, we're selling spirits, selling jeans. Mm-hmm. Working with really, really awesome brands. Uh, I switched into travel at one point, and obviously travel was right up my alley. Um, I got burnt out a little bit in the travel industry, you know, it's like I can go to Cayman 27 times and it seems really, really exciting, but at the same time, it's like I'm out there, you know, working on Seven Mile Beach and it's, it's work, it's hard.
[00:13:57] Um, but no, I think what I really wanna sum up [00:14:00] is, uh, I've been at a point in my career in brand marketing and advertising and, you know, even in business development where I recognize that there's a lot of problems in this world that I can solve. And I want to be unapologetic about the ones that I'm going to solve.
[00:14:16] And it came to a point for me where I was working in tech and software sales and, um, you know, the great organizations, but it wasn't the problem I wanted to solve. I wanna help people and ultimately my own personal experiences, uh, caregiving for elderly parents. Going through the, the process of, of that understanding, you know, grief, understanding, you know, self-care, mental health, that really, really, I.
[00:14:41] Just came to the forefront from me over the last three years, especially going through something like The Pandemic. And I just said, you know, if I'm going to dedicate my entire life, we, we spent a lot of our life and our careers and our, and our jobs, then I wanna make sure that I'm helping people. And so this has been a way for me to [00:15:00] combine my brand experience with helping people.
[00:15:04] And on a fundamental level, I look at the organizations that we have today. We have mega, mega, mega organizations that, in some cases are more powerful than some governments. So I believe that if we can really care at the heart of the people that are running these companies to give a shit about things going on in the world, then we might have a, we might have a greater opportunity to, to make some changes around here.
[00:15:26] So I wanna be the one to help with that.
[00:15:28] Cesar: I wanna come back to the, OR organizations in, in that, but I wanted to ask you, was there a particular. Moment or lesson that stands out to you when you were growing up? Just watch your mom be that entrepreneur.
[00:15:39] Angelique: Mm-hmm. Was there a particular moment that stood out for me about being an entrepreneur?
[00:15:39] No.
[00:15:39] Cesar: Any particular moment that stood out to you, just watching your mom, right, being, being that entrepreneur? Like any, maybe something you saw or maybe an experience that made you reflect, huh? Like, that's amazing.
[00:15:39] Angelique: Hmm. So my mom was somebody that she, uh, she made me believe that a woman could do absolutely anything that she set her mind to.
[00:15:48] And she made me realize that when you care about people, people will care about you. And I spent a lot of my life watching my mom. She, uh, she was an accountant, so she, uh, had her own [00:16:00] accounting firm for, you know, it was the four or five months of the year. And then in the other months of the year, she worked in the cosmetics industry, in in sales.
[00:16:08] And those two experiences were really unique for me because I would see the people that would come in to get their taxes done and I swear it would become more like a therapy session for them. My mom was given, you know, spearing off. Here's all the resources you need. You need to talk to Bob, you need to talk to Cindy.
[00:16:24] I'm gonna connect you to Sarah. And like the amount of connections that that woman made. Just by simply helping people. Uh, and they took care of her. They took care of her as well. And I think it was also watching my mom, um, she was very involved in our, on our church parish growing up too. And, um, you know, it was very much a sense of we helped, she helped everybody.
[00:16:43] You know, if there was, uh, a family going through something, if there was an elderly couple that needed something, she, she would take me to my aunt and uncle's houses and we'd be doing my aunt's, you know, hair curlers, taking her grocery shopping and things like that. And, you know, I think from the, uh, the sense of her working in the cosmetic sales, what it also showed me, [00:17:00] just funny as I, I talk about this, I see so many parallels between my mom and I now, but, um, she was, uh, she worked for Christian Dior and so part of her, uh, experience with Christian Dior is she was this rep.
[00:17:11] So she'd do a lot of traveling and her job was to create experiences. So she would put on these mega shows like in the mall or she'd, uh, you know, she'd run out these venues and hold fashion shows and she'd have all these gifts and like people getting their facials done and their hands massaged. And, you know, she just created so many of those experiences for people that I think I knew that I, I saw some of myself in her for sure.
[00:17:37] I mean, it's hard not to, you know, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Um, but yeah, growing up watching a mom that built a business, multiple businesses on helping people, she really made me see that if I focused on community, then I could do anything. Because more, more times than not that community, they'll come in and they'll be there, right there for you.
[00:17:58] That explains
[00:17:59] Cesar: a lot, [00:18:00] angel. I know, right?
[00:18:01] Angelique: I'm gonna have to re re-listen to this and just like take it in cuz it's like it's true. No, that's true. Thanks to that, that way.
[00:18:08] Cesar: Experiences, how to make people feel like the, they're the most important in the room, community, all those things you took them from, from your mom and your environment, and now you're applying it into your own life and career.
[00:18:21] Yeah. That's amazing.
[00:18:23] Angelique: Well, the one other thing that I would mention though is, and I've said this, um, recently, is, you know, you can't pour from an empty cup. My mom was a phenomenal, phenomenal woman. She helped so many people, but at the end of the day, she kind of put he self care to the side. And I think, uh, that's a little bit more of why I wanna focus in on mental health and mental wellbeing, um, because I, I think everyone wants to do good.
[00:18:46] Everyone. I, I think everyone wants to do good. Um, but at the same time, that's not something we can neglect and still think we can do good and give to others. Mm-hmm. Because it's a really important aspect of work and, um, I'm just happy to see that, you know, [00:19:00] recently the, uh, office of the Surgeon General, they just published a huge framework of workplace wellbeing, resources and ideas on how to implement different practices into the workplace to encourage people to work well.
[00:19:16] So I, I think we're finally waking up to the idea of, um, hustle culture just doesn't work. You, you can't help others if you, if you don't help yourself first.
[00:19:26] Cesar: So, glad you mentioned that because part of what inspired this podcast is so Dr. Vivic. He has a book called Together, and in that book he explains the loneliness epidemic that, that we're going through.
[00:19:43] And through this podcast, I wanted to explore going beyond the job title, like exploring the human experiences that shape people's lives. And you know, that that book had a big impact on me. And it just, it's very sad because, you know, [00:20:00] we have access to a tool, call the internet, but we're more disconnected than ever, you know, and sometimes even more disconnected to our own selves.
[00:20:08] Right? And. I wanted to ask you, how do you approach building community? You know, being in the community is one of your core, core pillars. How do you approach building community and, and connecting with, with others? And what would you recommend to someone that wants to feel more connected to their, to their jobs, to the community, to themselves?
[00:20:31] Angelique: That's a, that's a great question. Great question. Uh, and it reminds me, and, and I wish I had the book on me right now, but there's, uh, a fascinating book. It's dense, it's, it's heavy. Um, but it talks a lot on this subject and it's called the Disappearance of Rituals. And it breaks into how and why we have something like a loneliness epidemic right now.
[00:20:50] Um, it's because, well, I mean, as, as they pinpoint is, um, digital, digital connection is not connection. You know, it's, I am literally connected to you via wifi right [00:21:00] now. Um, but it takes longer to build relationships. And so when you ask me about my approach to building community, um, you know, I, I, I really think it's important to take things offline.
[00:21:08] Mm-hmm. I think it's important to take a walk with somebody. Um, and I'll, I'll, I'll back up there just a second because, um, when it comes to community, I think you have to look at the individuals within that community. Hmm. Now, it's one thing to go to an event and be like, I'm in community. Unless you make personal connections with every single one of those people in some capacity.
[00:21:30] Then I think it's really hard for you to say that you're in community. You're quite literally around people. But the whole point of it is to create a relationship and you don't create a relationship with just a community. You really create a relationship with individuals. And so I, I think sometimes, um, you know, we've gotten into this pattern, especially with the pandemic.
[00:21:49] You're like, yes, being virtual, it saves you a lot of money and allows you to scale in many, many ways. But I think it also impacts the human condition when it comes to just being able to [00:22:00] be in the presence of somebody, take a walk with somebody, be vulnerable with somebody. So I think when I look at my approach to community, it's looking at subgroups and communities, but wanting to get to know to some level, every person individually.
[00:22:16] And I, I think that's something that commonly can be missed. Um, I think the loneliness epidemic also is we've become conditioned to a virtual setting. I mean, yes, I am far more productive because a, after I hang up from our interview, I can go into my kitchen and, and start my next thing. I'm not wasting time on a commute.
[00:22:36] But sometimes those are those mindful moments that I think we need and we need to rebuild back into our time structure because, you know, maybe that time could be taken, calling somebody, maybe that time could be taken, you know, stopping on, on the way home to your, your friend's house, stopping in and seeing how they're doing.
[00:22:54] The other important construct to community, um, that I think can't be missed is, uh, showing [00:23:00] up for your people. Mm-hmm. You can't have community if you don't show up and. I mean, there's, there's so much to unpack with that because, um, I also understand that there's, you know, there's some mental things that can, that can hold you back from showing up sometimes too.
[00:23:11] And I know that there's people out there that struggle and are struggling. Um, but I, I think that as things and access to care is becoming more accessible, um, you know, my hope is that that'll, that'll start to, to reshape some of that, um, my hopes. My hopes, you know, again, you, you gotta kind of push past these things.
[00:23:31] And I have, I have friends that, some friends that suffer severely from social anxiety. Mm-hmm. That showing up is really freaking hard. But those are the people that you know, you, you check on. And that's why it means, you know, you have one-to-one personal rele relationships because when you get to know those people, you put in more time and effort.
[00:23:50] And I think that's when, um, community really starts to thrive is when that community knows it's safe and it's supported.
[00:23:58] Cesar: How do you [00:24:00] approach building one-on-one connections? Is, is there a, uh, questions you ask or things that, that you put into practice to, to foster this, these connections when you're in a, in a community or, or in a group setting or perhaps one of your retreats that you've had posted in the past, you know, what, what was your approach to to cultivating that, that type of, of environment where one-on-one connections, you know, just come up.
[00:24:26] Angelique: Well, I think they happen naturally. I think especially in a retreat setting, there's so many different activities that you engage in that a lot of times it naturally comes in where, you know, I think of one I ran, I went on just recently. Um, it was actually a silent retreat and oddly enough, I felt more connected to these people at the end, even though I knew nothing verbally about their lives, I knew about how they, they interacted in this space.
[00:24:50] And, um, even silent cues where we were on a hike and we're silent and we had to get across this river, and it was somebody reaching out their hand to help the [00:25:00] person behind them, that is a one-on-one connection. Um, you know, I think about other opportunities where, you know, I'm in a networking event and you just, you, you know what it feels like when you gravitate towards somebody or somebody pulls you in and, and introduces you to somebody.
[00:25:15] Um, you know, I, I think that's kind of has to be sometimes a non-negotiable about, about. Uh, you know, community settings and networking events is like, go introduce people to people. If you see somebody sitting over by the wall, walk up to them. Because we all have to be those advocates because we want those advocates too.
[00:25:30] So we need to personally make those efforts to show up for other people. So I think it's a mix. I think that creating those personal connections, um, I am somebody where when I say, let's have coffee, let's do lunch. I want a walking meeting. I mean it, so I'm gonna reach out to you. I'm gonna put it on our Google calendars and we're gonna go, even if we do it once, then I know something enough about you.
[00:25:51] So that down the line, if there's, you know, a reason for you to reach out to me for something or somebody that I can connect you to, I at least know a little bit about your [00:26:00] life story. I love how you
[00:26:02] Cesar: operate Angel. It's all about paying it forward, especially at these typical networking events, they're so cringe, especially for, for someone that might be attending an event the first time.
[00:26:14] Right? Like it's, it's overwhelming. You don't know who to connect with. Sometimes it's, it's very loud too to have like an intimate conversation. So
[00:26:22] Angelique: you're yelling at the other person from like, right, yeah. Driving
[00:26:25] Cesar: nuts. And what dressed me nuts about the typical new networking event or, or meetup is that it, it's not, it's very loud and you can't really have an intimate conversation with someone, you know?
[00:26:35] Yeah. Conversations are typically superficial. Um, so, um, yeah. That's, that's my, my thing against this, you know, networking events and made ups, I, I, I prefer to do retreats, right? Like, like what you put together. Uh, because when you are immersed in an environment with a group of people, uh, Man, the connections happen way faster and people let their guards down.
[00:26:55] Angelique: Yeah. Especially when people all show up for the same purpose. Um, now I [00:27:00] will say, you know, accessibility isn't always there. You want people to be able to come on these retreats, and I think there's an argument to be said about that, but, um, yeah, I mean, the things, the, these happen naturally, especially when you put people into scenarios that their guards are down.
[00:27:15] That the leving, the, the playing field is leveled. And as cheesy as it is, I was in competitive cheerleading and so we had to go to cheer camp every year. And well, one of the things that I loved with our team bonding experiences, like some of these things were off the wall ideas. I mean, one in particular I remember is that they had this, like, between these two trees, they had all these ropes connected and you had two teams and one team, and the other team you had to literally pass a person's body through.
[00:27:43] So we were holding these girls up, passing them through these ropes, and you couldn't touch the ropes. So we had to all work together in these creative off the wall. Now, I don't know if we're gonna be doing that in corporate settings, but you get my gist. I mean, it was a fun way where all of us [00:28:00] just like barriers down.
[00:28:02] We've got a task at hand and let's have fun with it. But I, I will say, you know, I, I, um, When it talks about, uh, you know, paying it forward and doing those things, I think it does, for some people, it takes seeing that happen in front of them. Mm-hmm. Some people are not the initiative takers and I mean, I get it.
[00:28:17] I, I, I do and I don't. Um, you know, in that same retreat setting, I remember there was a few times where, you know, there was something that could have been done to help the experience for the other people. And it was a simple, simple task of doing one thing, but no one would do it. So you had to wait for the one person to get up and go, take the initiative, go silently, ask for a pair of tongs so you can pick up, you know, the salad.
[00:28:40] And it's, that part was kind of amazing to me, where people can be very, um, in their own mind about how do I co accomplishment this for myself versus I'm in a team setting, how do I help the team? Um, so take of that what you will, but I think that, you know, at least if you see those people's people in those moments, [00:29:00] go and grab 'em.
[00:29:00] Go get them out of their comfort zone. It's gonna make them uncomfortable. I'm sure I've done that to people in their, but for the most part, I've had messages from people that would be like, thank you for doing that. Thank you for, for including me. Heck, I've been in settings Cesar that. I have been in settings where you're with a group of people that all know each other and you're the new one in, and rather than being like, oh, what are da da da da, da, they literally talk about inside jokes and their day versus ever including somebody.
[00:29:30] And it, I mean, being on the other end of that and several times you're like, can I interject here? Can I interject here? And you're just like, what do you do with this? It
[00:29:39] Cesar: doesn't feel good. I've, I've been on that side. Oh no. And it's like, Okay. I'm not cool enough to be included in the inside jokes.
[00:29:46] Angelique: Well, well, exactly.
[00:29:48] And it, it just like, it shows, I don't know, I have a very, very, I, I think a type of way about people that do that because it makes me just feel like some people are just not conscious about other people. Um, and I [00:30:00] also, you know, on the flip side, I'm, I am I sometimes say I am plagued with perspective because I can see both sides of things.
[00:30:06] Mm-hmm. In some aspects. I know people that are like, I have enough friends, I don't need more friends. I'm happy with the friends I've got. I don't like people. Or in so many words. And, you know, I think, uh, you gotta respect people's boundaries too. So, uh, but I think if you're gonna show up to a networking event, you, you, you're kind of Yeah,
[00:30:26] Cesar: yeah.
[00:30:26] No, you're, you are there for a reason, right. To connect to our conversations. Um, At least that's, that's the reason why I attend these events. Right? Right. It's not much about whatever the speaker is or the topic it's about, I wonder who am I going to meet at this event?
[00:30:42] Angelique: Right. Don't go to a networking event with your friend and only talk to your friend the entire time when you, that's why,
[00:30:49] Cesar: which is why I prefer to go by myself than to bring a friend.
[00:30:54] Because if I bring a friend, I, I feel forced to be around a friend all the time.
[00:30:57] Angelique: Yeah. You got a safety net and [00:31:00] sometimes those friends can be the ones attacking you and you're just like, dude, go, go, go meet people here. Yes. Meet Danny.
[00:31:05] Cesar: No, no, it's true. Now, I'm, I'm curious about the, the silent retreat. What did Silence teach you?
[00:31:13] Angelique: Uh, well, they're, uh, silence, um, uh, Well, there's some inner dialogues that, uh, it's easy to ignore when you have something like this all the time. Mm-hmm. Uh, when you have something like this all the time. So I think my, my, the biggest silence aspect, um, taught me to, that I rely too much on my devices, my digital devices.
[00:31:30] Um, silence taught me that, um, I will not find the answers in here. I have to work through things on my own. Um, and well, not on my own. I mean, there, you know, I have to determine what resources I need to do X, y, Z. Um, silence taught me that. There's so much beauty in nature that I tuned more into the running water on my hike.
[00:31:54] I tuned more into the way that the butterflies swam across the waterfall. I [00:32:00] tuned more into, you know, the birds and how they chirped at each other back and forth. I turn tuned more into, um, being in community without speaking, I tuned more into what are rituals that could set me up for success. Um, you know, I, I grew up only child, but also like the baby.
[00:32:17] And my siblings are 17 years older than me. My cousins are 20 years older than me. So I think there was a little element of like, I really like being on my own. It's kind of fun. I'm an independent person. I, I brought my paint set with me, so I just had a good old time painting. Um, I, you know, played some golf by myself.
[00:32:37] I. You know, I really wanna go back to a silent retreat. Sounds like a little fun. Oh, man. It was, it was good. At the end of it, I, uh, I got anxiety around picking up my phone, but I remember being like, I could do this for like five days. This is great. Like, sign me up, see you, see you next fall. Like, this is wonderful.
[00:32:56] Cesar: Any new habit that you have incorporated [00:33:00] as a result of, of the Silent Silence retreat?
[00:33:04] Angelique: Putting my phone in another room at 9:00 PM
[00:33:08] Cesar: Hmm. Have you noticed any, any difference? Sleep. Great.
[00:33:12] Angelique: That's amazing. Now, uh, I've, I've, I've noticed better sleep. Um, You know, I, I do think that I didn't really grow up with tv.
[00:33:18] Um, and so I get frustrated about, you know, TVs and computers in the bedroom and, and phones in the bedroom. You know, it's, it's a sacred space. So, um, yeah, I definitely noticed that when I don't have as much digital connection prior to sleep, I sleep better, go shit, you know, no shit. Like that's gonna happen.
[00:33:30] Um, and I, I think I, I also realized that in the middle of the night, um, I'm notorious for waking up for all the reasons. Four o'clock every single time. Four every single four o'clock. I could be on the east coast, I could be in Europe. I wake up at four o'clock in the morning. Uh, but those are the times that my mind starts going and I wanna solve the world's problems.
[00:33:52] And then I reach for this and it does nothing and it keeps me up. And so, um, when it's in another room, it [00:34:00] makes it harder because the last thing you wanna do is get up and be cold. You know, getting outta your cozy bed. So I definitely think that has helped. Um, I am more of a movement meditation kind of person, a mindfulness type person.
[00:34:10] Um, meditation is, it's not part of my daily practice yet. Um, but anybody can do anything for three minutes, and so I'm trying to incorporate a little bit more of that into, uh, into my daily, daily habits. I
[00:34:23] Cesar: love that. It's, it's a habit that I'm still working on, but the times where I have put my phone in another room and 9:00 PM as well.
[00:34:32] 9:00 PM seems to be like prime time for, to, to, to stop any screen time. But the times I've, I've done it. Man, I, I sleep so well and I wake up the next day. I'm like, let's go. Right, right. But I'm human, so, you know, some nights I don't do it and I feel like crap the next day.
[00:34:50] Angelique: Yeah. You know, I think it's, uh, it's a topic that I've, I've really been exploring a lot of, especially since this silent retreat, because I will admit, I, I fully see that I have a [00:35:00] digital addiction.
[00:35:00] When I look at something where we've engineered in like the, we have like a newspaper, you have an ending to a newspaper. There's no ending in your newsfeed, there's no ending in my Google box. There's, okay, well usually there is, but when you don't have an ending, it just keeps going. And we've engineered, we're like, this is like a, this might as well be a third arm for me.
[00:35:23] Okay, I'm probably gonna get carpal tunnel cuz of this stupid thing. And it's just like, why does this thing exist in our lives? It, it just, it's everywhere all the time. And, um, you know, I, I think it's something where you even have these same companies that have engineered the dings and the notifications that are now engineering in like, Hey, did you know you spent seven hours on your phone today?
[00:35:46] How about that? You don't feel good when you see that. You
[00:35:50] Cesar: don't. And it's awesome. I've been wondering, like, okay, how is this helpful? Great to know that I, I spent seven hours a day looking at my phone. But[00:36:00] on this topic, I believe that we were not ready for the iPhone. We were not ready for social media and we're definitely not ready for AI because our, our brain is still that primitive brain from many, many years ago.
[00:36:14] Yeah. And when you have this technology. You know, humans, like, if it's convenient, you're gonna gravitate towards what's convenient. Mm-hmm. The phone's convenient. Social media is convenient and it's also addictive, right? Cause you wanna, you feel connected, you wanna keep scrolling. Do you have that, uh, you know, what's, what's beyond scroll or above the fold?
[00:36:35] Yeah. And with ai, it, it's, uh, I dunno, what, what side are you on with,
[00:36:38] Angelique: with ai? I think, you know what side I'm on with ai.
[00:36:42] Cesar: I don't know.
[00:36:44] Angelique: We're doomed. No, we're doomed. I think there's a time and a place. I really, I really, really hope we can get a, get ahead of having regulations and, uh, you've all, you've all Harari.
[00:36:53] Um mm-hmm. He published something that I thought was great. He was like, we're spending so much time investing in this like alien intelligence. Like this is, [00:37:00] this is the alien invasion is ai, rather than investing in human consciousness. And I don't know, a little bit, part of me thinks that maybe we're working in tandem because of how much emphasis we're starting to finally put on mental health and mental illness.
[00:37:17] Um, but yeah, I think that we should be spending far more time focusing on, um, understanding ourselves and humans than, yeah, I don't, AI scares the hell outta me. Deep fakes, scare the hell outta me. And that's, that's already here regulations on these things. So when McDonald's and all these other places have robots doing the jobs, then what, what are we to do?
[00:37:40] I, I do think it'll be interesting to see what shift we go into. Part of me is like, I'm gonna buy land and I'm gonna get farm animals. I'm, I'm gonna go back to, honestly, though, honestly, I, I, I, I, I mean, I know I should be like, oh, embrace technology and digital, and yes, there's a time and place I think chat, G p T, go write your [00:38:00] emails, Joe, you know?
[00:38:00] Yes. Figure out your captions. Get your email subject lines. I, I just really worry about the future and, and what it holds, especially for our youth. I mean, already we're in a space where, I mean, depression rates and suicide rates, I mean, they're, they're rampant and it, it really scares me.
[00:38:18] Cesar: What, what stood out to you about the, the study that Dr.
[00:38:18] Viv Murray came out when it comes to, to anonymous, you know, any, any particular. Stat that, that stood out to you?
[00:38:18] Angelique: I don't know that I've read, I've read that one. I, I think you mentioned it earlier in the interview, but I don't know that I've seen it lo The loneliness study. Yeah. Yeah. I haven't, I have not read that one yet.
[00:38:18] Um, I'd love to.
[00:38:18] Cesar: Yeah. Well, I mean, it's, it's, it's one of those things where I went, like, as we mentioned before, it's, it's, um, it's just crippling the, the workforce, you know? And I wanted to ask you, like, what, um, what do you think it's, it's broken in the workplace?
[00:38:22] Angelique: What do I think is broken? Mm-hmm. Hmm. I think, oh man, I feel bad.
[00:38:22] No, I don't, I think middle management. Mm-hmm. There's a, there's roadblocks left and right with middle management. I. And I think that we have so many people that aspire to get to this point, and then they're not the ones having to do the work. Now, don't get me wrong, there's a lot of work that has to go into managing teams.
[00:38:38] Mm-hmm. Totally. But I think sometimes, um, you know, roadblocks can be created there and there can be blind spots there. And, um, you know, I think the other problem is, is that I really emphasize mean they have to report to the powers that be. And at the end of the day, they want numbers. They want, uh, to know that things are working properly.
[00:38:57] And I think sometimes the values of an [00:39:00] organization and the values of the individuals on those teams can be missed. Um, and I, I don't know. I struggle when I say that because it's like, you know, again, plagued by perspective, you know, those are hard roles when you have to, I, I know people that have teams of 50 to, you know, 200 people.
[00:39:14] That's tough shit. Like how are you supposed to manage a team and have order with all these different personalities, all these different, uh, you know, ways of working, ways of learning, ways of communicating, ways of listening. Um, like it's hard. Um, I think that, uh, this guy, Mike, he said it, what is Mike's last name?
[00:39:35] Um, Mike Parks, I think is his name, but he said it best. He said that we have a lot of, uh, well meant wellbeing, where we have these awesome wellness initiatives. And here, here's the calm app, and go use this app and go log into this app and log into this app and track your, your, your steps. Well, I mean, personally, like you have to have, people have to per have a personal accountability to actually do [00:40:00] these things.
[00:40:01] Um, and unless they're enforced and a lot of that is, um, incorporated into the style of management at those organizations, then what's it really doing? I mean, we're at a point where, uh, you have so many of these wellness initiatives available now and people are at an even more alarming rate, claiming burnout.
[00:40:21] Something's, something's, something's wrong there.
[00:40:23] Cesar: So glad you mentioned this and a couple things that's sit down to me there. One of the things that comes up when I talk to leaders is that, The difference between being an individual contributor at a company and being in management. They're completely different skill sets.
[00:40:40] And what ends up happening at organizations is that typically the individual contributor, that's like an A player, gets promoted to people management. And if you're a first time people manager, they struggle with making that transition because [00:41:00] there are different skill sets, right? One is about doing the work and being in the weeds.
[00:41:04] And the other one is about being strategic and being more about the people that you're serving, right? Right. So, and there's no training, right? They're just like, oh, you're promoted, now you have a team, and um, now you have to, you know, perform. Right? And the second thing that stood out to me was, yeah, you know, with, with those benefits, like I've been at companies where, hey, you have all these benefits, meditation apps, therapy apps, But the habit is not there, right?
[00:41:33] It's like, yeah, you get access to these apps, but you know, it's not required for you to do it. Or I've done the, the calm app and weirdly enough I feel empty. Like yeah, you know, I, I meditated, but you know, now what? I'm not, I'm not with people. I'm, I'm, I'm not sharing with, with anybody. Yeah. So I think it's a start, but you're right.
[00:41:56] I, I think there's a lot more work that needs to be done. Um, especially when it comes to when, when it comes to [00:42:00] burnout.
[00:42:01] Angelique: One thing I wanted to mention is, you kind of repeated it back to me in the, um, in the context of middle management and, um, performance and promotion, is that we've literally created that as a step ladder award system.
[00:42:14] Mm-hmm. Oh, you've been promoted. Now you're gonna have to manage teams. Well be non apologetic if you don't wanna manage teams. Like why is that What makes you successful is when you have to manage other people. Mm-hmm. Why is that? Our construct of success rather just, I mean, if you're an individual contributor, be promoted on that actual and that basis right there.
[00:42:35] Mm-hmm. I, I, I don't know, I think that that kind of stood out for me because it's like we've created that as a success point. Um, you know, I've, I know someone recently where, you know, she, she's a nurse and then she got promoted to being a nurse's nurse director, and she's like, I mean, this is great. Like, my schedule's better, but like, I to manage people, I don't wanna manage people.
[00:42:53] And I, I, I don't, I can't be doing the things and I get yelled at if I wanna try doing the things. And it's like, I don't know. Maybe we need to re [00:43:00] re-look at how we, um, view success, view, um, promotions. Um, I don't know. I think that there's some people that are very natural born leaders and some people that get to that point just because it was the next, next place to go up that ladder.
[00:43:14] That's point. Or I think we need to explode the ladder.
[00:43:17] Cesar: Yeah, no, that, that's a good point. And sometimes people might not want to go up that ladder, but they, they're forced to do it because that's the only path for them. Right. Like, hey, you start as an independent contributor, then you're gonna move up to senior, independent contributor, then manager, then mvp, and you know, you get further out from the work.
[00:43:36] Right. And some people love to do the work, some people don't wanna give up the work, but you're kind of forced to do it.
[00:43:42] Angelique: Then I, I think there's gotta be a point where if you're an individual contributor and you're good at what you do, that's awesome. But if you don't care about managing people and you don't give a shit about mentoring people, don't be a manager.
[00:43:57] Mm-hmm. I mean individual, individual contributors are something that we all [00:44:00] need because I feel like you get to this management point and then it's just like, I'm gonna create all this work because I need these people doing something, so go do this. And it's just like, those are those tasks that can really get to me where it's like you're creating work to make it look like we're busy.
[00:44:12] Mm-hmm. Rather than being more strategic in how the work is done and how you're building this team. And I might, I might be a little, some type of way right now cuz I've, I've seen this so recently too, where it's just like a lot of the roadblocks happen there. And what you said that it was so important is they get so far away from the actual work mm-hmm.
[00:44:30] That they're trying to strategize on something that they no longer know anything about and they don't wanna listen to the people that are doing the work. That I think is absolutely toxic. And I've seen that in many situations where, The people talking to your customers, the people touching your product on a day-to-day basis, they are the ones that you should be listening to.
[00:44:52] So maybe I'll flip this on the head and say, managers need to serve their people, not the other way [00:45:00] around, because for some reason we view it as the other way I manage people and they are to report to me. Mm-hmm. You are serving them. These are the people that are working to know everything about the ins and outs of your product and your people listen to them.
[00:45:14] Yeah. Same,
[00:45:16] Cesar: same when you're part of a, of a community, right. You serve the community members. Right. Right.
[00:45:20] Angelique: Well, so you'd hope, you'd hope,
[00:45:20] Cesar: you'd hope, but I mean that's, that's one of the things that it's broken right? In the, in the workplace. Yeah. Is is, is that, That framework, that, that mindset of what being a manager is, uh, especially for first time managers, right?
[00:45:20] Because they don't know any better. They're just, Hey, I got promoted and I'm gonna figure it out as like, well on.
[00:45:20] Angelique: Right, right. Well, it's, I mean, it's all, it's all well intended. I know. It's like everyone, we are trying our best. Everyone is trying our best, but, you know, there's blind spots. And I think sometimes you operate from a space of necessity and pressure that things can be missed.
[00:45:20] And I, uh, one thing is, you know, well, this is how it's always been done, so this is how we, I cannot think of something that kills a culture quicker.
[00:45:20] Cesar: Yep. Especially in this day and age where change is happening fast. Right. Extremely fast. You can't just say, oh, this is how has done it. Um,
[00:45:20] Angelique: also joke Oh yeah.
[00:45:20] I mean I think there's, there's one of many things involved in, in what's going on in, in workplace culture and, you know, I, I, I don't wanna say that everything is bad. I think that there's, there is a lot of good that is happening. There's a lot of good that is happening. There's a lot of managers waking up to this.
[00:45:20] Mm-hmm. There's a lot of resources for new managers. There is a lot of change that is happening that I think sometimes we don't put enough emphasis on, cuz we always focus on the problem.
[00:45:20] Cesar: Mm-hmm. What are, what are some of the positive changes that, that you see happening?
[00:45:23] Angelique: Well, I, I think to to note again, when we're looking at the importance of wellbeing in the workplace mm-hmm.
[00:45:29] I think we're finally getting to a point where the, oh, I mean, it was a tipping point and a forced tipping point. When you have something like the, a global pandemic happen where you're like, oh, these are human beings. We've kind of care for these human beings because if we don't have these human beings, we don't have an organization.
[00:45:44] And, you know, who knows what'll happen with, you know, ai And as AI becomes more, um, prevalent in, in that, but okay. Focusing on the negative again, back to the positive Wellbeing is a clear focus in organizations now. And, um, the folks that are the ones [00:46:00] that we're reluctant, I think they're finally realizing, yeah, we, we've gotta, we've gotta make a point to make this, make this an, um, you know, a program in our workforce.
[00:46:07] Uh, I think the d e I and B initiatives are, are, I mean, I. I am not gonna go to the negative. I want to focus on the positive. I love seeing that that has been more of a focus in organizations. I think there's a lot to continue to change and create habits. Um, part of the program that I'm at, at, at Duke right now is all about behavior change and behavior change doesn't happen overnight.
[00:46:30] Mm-hmm. And that's, that's just with an individual. For me to change a habit takes weeks, months. I mean, I am a conditioned individual of 35 years of experiences now, put a thousand of me into an organization. That's a lot of time that it takes to fundamentally change something. But we are actively making a point to do that and to have those conversations.
[00:46:54] So I, I think that that's a positive change. Um, you know, I like to, uh, there's a movement called Conscious [00:47:00] Capitalism. I think there's a lot of strength in that, especially in, uh, a lot of the conversations around social impact, social enterprise. Mm-hmm. Making money. We need to make money. We, we live in a, in an economy.
[00:47:11] I mean, we, we have to, you know, continue to innovate and find ways to, um, you know, thrive. And so I have no problem with capitalism. I have a problem with shitty capitalism. So if we can make it more conscious and do good along the way, hey, there's a lot of good we can bring to this world and maybe even survive this.
[00:47:30] Climate crisis if we can, if we can really, you know, keep that focus, um, long term. So yes, I think that there's a lot of good that's still happening in the world today. Um, we just don't hear about it as much.
[00:47:40] Cesar: Yeah. Cheers. Subconscious capitalism. Yes. Um, awesome Angel. Well, I, I wanna do a rapid fire round to wrap up the, the episode and Ooh, okay.
[00:47:48] I'll ask you, ask you a question and you gimme your top of mind. 32nd answer.
[00:47:52] Angelique: Okay. All right. All right. All right. Nice.
[00:47:54] Cesar: Okay. Ready? Growing up, um, one book [00:48:00] that has influenced your life,
[00:48:03] Angelique: nudge.
[00:48:04] Cesar: What is Nudge? Who's, who's the author and, and what, how would you describe the premise?
[00:48:08] Angelique: Okay. I don't wanna butcher the author's name because I need to, it is one of my favorite books.
[00:48:14] Um, one of my favorite quotes from the book is that give people liberty so long as they pay for the harm that it causes society. Hmm. So Nudge is a book by Richard h Thaler and Kass Sunstein. Uh, and, and I wish I could say who recommended this book. Oh, it was my, my brother-in-law. Um, it was a book that I believe it was the Obama administration had, uh, their entire administration read.
[00:48:36] And, uh, one simple example to kind of get you in the mindset of it is, uh, if you have an energy bill, a lot of, uh, a lot of what the companies have incorporated is a graph. So you see what your neighbor does, you see what the other neighbor does, and they see where you're at. That right there is a nudge that is something that was engineered to help you as an individual.
[00:48:55] Start to make a more conscious decision. Hmm. And I, what I love about that [00:49:00] is that, uh, it surrounds choice architecture. Mm-hmm. So I'm gonna give you the liberty to make your own choices. I'll give you the information to help you make, you know, see both sides of it, but ultimately you as an individual are the ones that are going to be responsible for what's to happen.
[00:49:16] And there's a lot of really interesting examples, um, that they provide. And I will say the, the middle chapters were all on healthcare. They lost me a little bit. Uh, it was ironically at the time where I was helping my parents, um, through a lot of that stuff. So it was helpful in those own ways. But you see just how complex systems can be.
[00:49:34] Mm-hmm. And honestly, sometimes how complex choices can be where simplicity is key, but that, that quote of give people liberty so long as they pay for the harm it causes. Love
[00:49:45] Cesar: that quote. Thanks for sharing. I appreciate that. Next question, one of the most worthwhile investments that you have made recently.
[00:49:55] And by investments, it could be financially, it could be relationship, it could [00:50:00] be physical, it could be an experience.
[00:50:03] Angelique: I got two. Real estate and education.
[00:50:07] Cesar: What, what about real estate?
[00:50:09] Angelique: Uh, I think, well, I mean, again, goes back to creating experiences. So, um, you know, was fortunate to say, okay, like either I remodel our kitchen or we're gonna go and, and buy another property and, you know, invest in a new community, invest in experiences for our family, invest in, you know, creating, um, a place for others to create experiences.
[00:50:27] Love that. Um, you know, especially in the market that we have now, uh, I'd rather my money be there sometimes than Okay. Completely in a blank. Um, so that was one. And then I started the, uh, the Duke Integrated Health and Wellbeing Coaching Certification Program. Uh, I've wanted to do it for many years now, and I'm so happy that I took the plunge because, uh, it's, I think I mentioned earlier, it is completely focused on behavior change and how to, honestly, it's rewiring how you communicate and how you listen to help people uncover the [00:51:00] answers that are already within themselves.
[00:51:01] Hmm. And I really, really like that approach. I really like that approach to whole health and, uh, I look forward to seeing how I can bring that into the business world.
[00:51:09] Cesar: I love that. Love that so much. Well, thanks for sharing. Next question here. Any quote that you think of often or perhaps say a motto that you live your, your, your life
[00:51:23] Angelique: by.
[00:51:24] You can't stop the ways, but you can learn to surf.
[00:51:27] Cesar: Ah, it's so powerful. I love it.
[00:51:30] Angelique: I mean, life will keep serving you things, but as long as you can roll with the punches and, and, you know, surf through 'em, um, there's always gonna be a, a new set of waves. There's always gonna be a light at the other side.
[00:51:43] Um, and I think at the other, as far as like a model that I live my life by, um, I learned early on is that in those dark moments that you have the light to reflect back on. Mm-hmm. But when things are light, you have to acknowledge that. And if you don't have gratitude [00:52:00] when things are good, it's gonna be really easy to forget about those times when things are not so good.
[00:52:06] So, gratitude. Gratitude always. And, um, yeah, I mean, I, I believe in the big guy, so I believe that, uh, you know, I can give all my worries to him and, and he'll help me through a lot.
[00:52:16] Cesar: Yep. The big guy's always watching out up. Okay. Next, next question. Um, I know you already mentioned one of the habits that, uh, you're incorporating, you know, which is like putting your phone outside the bedroom.
[00:52:29] Any other habit that you have in incorporated that has improved your, your life recently?
[00:52:34] Angelique: Make your bed.
[00:52:36] Cesar: I used to make my bed, but I stopped. But weirdly enough, I felt good when I, when I made my bed in the morning.
[00:52:41] Angelique: Actually, this is my, uh, Rob, my husband would kill me. But, uh, it's, I believe this wholeheartedly, uh, between making my bed and putting my throw pillows back. I believe that there is a fundamental importance to this, okay?
[00:52:55] Because listen, if there is one thing that I can control in my day, [00:53:00] if it is my throw pillows and making my bed, let it be, let it be. Put your throw pillows back. Decorate 'em as you want, but sometimes there's a lot of things in our, in our day-to-day lives we can't control. But if I can control my throw pillows, I'll take it.
[00:53:15] I'd be
[00:53:15] Cesar: curious to see what, what your husband thinks about this.
[00:53:17] Angelique: He hates throw pillows. He's like, men, all men hate throw pillows. I was like, what the hell do you have against throw pillows? They're beautiful.
[00:53:24] Cesar: I'll, I'll keep my opinion to myself. All right, angel, last last question here. Um, any takeaways that you would like the listeners to, to absorb, you know, as, as it relate to this episode and as as it relates specifically to experiences mental health wellbeing?
[00:53:39] Angelique: Yeah, I would say, uh, I'm gonna always go back to, you cannot pour from an empty cup.
[00:53:45] And if I can be encouraging to people to take a moment to look at, uh, parts of their life where they're giving a lot. To just see, uh, you know, where the parts of their lives that they're giving to themselves. Um, because a lot of times the parts that we're, we're not giving to ourselves are the parts that we take away from the [00:54:00] things that are even more important, like our families and our mental health.
[00:54:03] Um, so I, I definitely would hopefully encourage people to take a look at, at where they're giving a lot, um, where people might be taking a lot. And, uh, just know that there are, there are resources out there. So if, um, you know, if I could be somebody to lean on to understand what those resources may be, I'm happy to help.
[00:54:21] Cesar: Love it. And where can people find you? Learn more about your work?
[00:54:25] Angelique: Yeah, so I'd say, uh, LinkedIn is a great place to start, especially when it comes to my work. My portfolio is Angelique Mario, m a r y a. Um, and so I'll share the link with you as well, and then Instagram, Angelique Maria underscore. Um, but yeah, I feel like everything's interconnected at this point, so you'll find all the other things through the one thing.
[00:54:43] Uh, and I also have, um, finder Flow is a web show that I started, um, earlier this year, and love asking some of life's greatest questions to really interesting people and sharing perspectives on, uh, on those questions. So, um, yeah, I'd hope to tune in if you're ha if you, Caesar or [00:55:00] anybody else of your listeners that are interested in joining.
[00:55:02] I'd love to, uh, to have a conversation.
[00:55:04] Cesar: Absolutely. And, uh, well, thanks so much for joining the show. Uh, and thanks for being on, on this side of the, of the mic, you know, me asking. Yeah, this is so, so fun. Yeah. Super fun. Um, but yeah, angel, thanks so much for, for joining and, uh, yeah, I'll, I'll, um, we'll have to do another episode and, and dive deeper into other, other topics, but, uh, but for now, thanks so much.
[00:55:20] Angelique: All right. Thank you. And I will look forward to seeing you in North Carolina soon.
[00:55:34] all right. I hope you enjoyed this episode and thank you so much for listening all the way through. I appreciate you. And I hope that you get some valuable information that you can apply to our personal and professional life. If this story resonated with you and you would like to support the podcast.
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