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In Ask Ashley, Founder, Thoughtleader and award-winning media personality Ashley Russo sits down with leaders who bring purpose and humanity to business.
Each episode explores how people navigate uncertainty, lead with empathy, and create meaningful change in their organizations and lives. Listeners gain practical insights on resilience, leadership, and financially confident decision-making amid disruption.
This podcast is brought to you by Ask Ashley. If you’re interested in building a confident, purpose-driven wealth plan, reach out to Ashley at ashley.russo@nm.com.
welcome to ask Ashley the podcast
where we shine a light on the unsung heroes
of the workplace I'm your host
Ashley Russo financial AI board member
thought leader and wealth management advisor
each week we sit down with inspiring leaders
exploring their journeys
motivations and the real challenges they face
from job insecurity to the evolving role of AI
in a world where many feel overlooked
these guests
are building hope and connection for their colleagues
join us as we uncover their stories
and discover how they're making a difference
one conversation at a time
hello everybody
I am so excited to be here with
who I'd like to call my most fashionable guest
definitely the best hat collection I have ever seen
please please
please introduce yourself
yes thank you so much for having me Ashley
so my name is Mao Vang
I am a HR professional
I've been in the industry in for about 12+ years
very big mental health advocate
very big advocate of di belonging and accessibility
and I'm just really excited to be here
and talk to you today about what's going on in our
the world we live in yes
so much so much to talk through
so I'd love to start with your motivation
to get into the HR field and how your upbringing
and certainly being in a large family
as I know shaped your approach towards your work
yes so as
as you mentioned I am one of eight children
and so with that I
you know first started getting
I got into HR through like learning and development
which is um
honestly it's a very
it's a very easy path I'd say
in the sense of you know
I was in operations
became kind of a subject matter expert
and then from there
was asked to help train some new hires right
that's a very a path that many people can go down
and I realized like I really enjoyed that
and so with that is learning to say like yes
I want to help people I want
you know I was in that in order
I'm the third youngest and so from there
always looking up to my older siblings
and wanting to say like
I want I want in
I wanna learn I wanna grow
I wanted to be like them right
and so being able to help others um
we all know as a a simple example is onboarding
right starting a new job
starting a new field at a new company
um you're always on the outside right
you're trying to understand what are the norms
what what should I do
what are the written down norms
and what are the unsaid norms
and so being able to really help people
and get them up to speed and the
for me even to this day
it's still
the moment that you see the light bulb go off
you're like it clicks
you get it like
that is so satisfying
and being able to just be a part of somebody's journey
and help them along like
I'll take it any day yeah
it's really satisfying yeah
Matt you called something out there that I think
maybe subconsciously we're all aware of
but you you did call it out
you do feel like the outsider coming into something new
and having someone Shepherd your way through
that is key for your experience
I also love that you were doing the math
you were counting what number of sibling you were
um that's fair
I mean you're one of eight
um I'm curious
what were some of the key moments
or turning points that influenced who you are today
and how you lead yeah absolutely
I think I'll start with you know
I I am raised in a family of eight children
and there are seven girls
so one boy and with that
that means I had five older sisters
or four older sisters see
four older sisters who like
I could really look up to
who really did like have paved the way for me
very ambitious educated family
and with that is saying like what
where do I where do I want to make my Mark
like how do I
you know and
but also as if folks know
whether you're in Asian family
and a lot of very typical Asian families are like
you know you have to be a doctor
you have to be a lawyer you have to be a dentist
an engineer there's like
specific paths that our parents have kind of
carved out for us
but like I'm an HR that's not anything close to that
I didn't even know what HR was growing up right
and so it's like really being able to like
find my voice and coming in into like
I would say uh
early college years where I took a turn
I went initially for what I thought was gonna be pre
pharmacy and taking biology
chemistry and to being like
I don't think I wanna do that and what do I wanna do
and how do I still make a Mark
and then actually like having a moment with my
some of my older sisters who were like
no one told you how to do that
like why
why do you like it was a expectation I put on myself
quite honestly and it was that moment of being like
actually I I don't know what I want to do
but I know it's not that
and it was empowering to actually hear somebody like
say like
no one you don't have to compare yourself to us
no one told you to like
stop putting that expectation on yourself
and then being like OK
I think I might try something different
I have no idea where this is gonna lead
I truly didn't it was a job and you know
I I was just trying to see what where it would lead
but it LED me here and
and I'm all like so happy that it did
but I would say that turning point
and that was like
early college years of trying to understand like
like many folks young adults are is like
who are you where do you go from here
is is college you know
college isn't for everybody and it really honestly
for a long time it wasn't for me
I did go back and finish
but took many years of trying and retrying
and pivoting and being okay with that being my path
there's a lot of interesting things there
that I think people can relate to
one is the stories we tell ourselves
in terms of expectations
of what we think we're supposed to do
based off of what we think others want us to do
and realizing that that's actually not there
and then giving ourselves the permission
to then find out what really makes us tick
and I feel excited in life and
and enjoy our own journeys
that's fascinating
I'm sure a ton of people myself included
can relate to that so
your backgrounds interesting
because it ranges from large corporations to startups
which are very different environments
what drew you to your current company
what was that experience like
going from large to small and in that sort of thing
and and how is that
that transition shaped your professional growth
yeah absolutely
you know I I would say starting off in very
in entry level roles at large corporations
was actually really fulfilling
I Learned so much I mean
there's there's anywhere you go
there's pros and cons right
but for what I was for the
that chapter of my life
and that growth and that learning and development
that is so necessary and that like
foundation'cause
because a lot of large corporations have
like built out structure and organization
and it's you know
roles are clearly defined
and once you do your role
you may be roles or maybe siloed
like you do your role and then you pass
you do your job and you pass it on to the next person
right who's doing the next thing
and so going from that
to where I decided to actually dabble in like
startups was really saying like
I actually I just wanted to learn more
I wanted to do more
I wanted to get my hands in more things
and I again
kind of back to giving yourself permission to be like
I think this is a jump I wanna take
and quite honestly before taking that jump
I remember talking to a mentor of mine
who made that jump as well
and I asked like what are the pros and cons
like I had no idea what it meant to work for a startup
and I had no idea
all the things that would be involved
and so I didn't know what I
was going getting myself into
so I did like network and ask folks and
who I knew had made that leap
and try to understand more
but like I don't regret it at all
you know it's a different type of hustle
let's be honest but it's okay
like I Learned a lot
I'm still learning a lot to this day
like there's you just get to wear more hats
I felt like
I get to have more autonomy and more influence
whether that be with leadership and
or within the business or just shaping people strategy
you know there's just so much things that again
it's not to say that it's impossible
at a large corporation
it's just right there's more levels more
you know and that those conversations become more
maybe exclusive to certain folks right
which is fine and fair
but I wanted more exposure and um
experience and I'm all the better for it to be honest
it's as hard as the hard days are
you know the learning doesn't stop and I
I just appreciate that opportunity
so I'm I'm curious based off that in terms of influence
especially around a subject that I know
you're very passionate mental health
are there strategies and practices
that you put in place
especially when it comes to that mental health aspect
in that sense of belonging
and where does that passion come from
why is that so important to you
yeah absolutely
so a let's I'll I'll I'll start with so yes
as I've said before
I'm really big mental health advocate
you know
I honestly went through my own kind of break through
breakdown whatever you'd like to
however one would like to identify that moment is
you know I am an advocate because I
myself have gone through significant work
and in
I've done a lot of work and trying to understand
you know different what I've been going through
so what in the pandemic it was
it was you know
some some traumatic experiences
and then as as well as just really realizing like
I needed to seek help and so a lot of what I
how I show up is actually
because I've experienced it firsthand
now everybody's regular
let's recognize
like everybody's experience is not the same
but having experienced it
and being on the HR people side right
is a lot of times we often are the ones who are
we're the listeners we're the we're sometimes
you know depending
depending on the day depending on who you ask
we might be the therapist
right for somebody and we're so a lot of times for me
what I realized I was doing is
I was actually compartmentalizing my own feelings
personal feelings and work feelings
so that I could be
make space for those I support in the business
and then it was through that
where I realized that it was actually super unhealthy
and so with that as to your first question around
how does that influence
how do I try to influence others
and being an advocate for that is truly like
first off like being very open about my own struggles
like I
I actually did a talk yesterday at my work where I
I walked through my story
my mental health story but really
like being really open and honest and vulnerable
um cause at the end of the like first and foremost
we're humans and every and
and I think that sounds so easy to say
but in the workplace often times
you know depending on the culture
like you're your title or you're somebody's manager
or you're the person who is
has this person's ear right
there's a lot of labels that whomever um
may put on us and and we put on ourselves
and so I think for me being an advocate
being in the people's space
and also trying to influence leaders
and into the humans
is really being open and honest about like
where are you really at with things
you know I always
always start my one on ones with leaders and say like
no like really
how are you doing like if I know that they're
you know they're the family
maybe there's a family member who
was just diagnosed on something
like starting off with that
like we can get to the work talk
but like if somebody you know
if you have a family member who's very ill
that might be like all you can really think about
and so I'm not gonna sit here and pretend to talk shop
for 30 minutes when you're like worried
you know about real other things
and so just trying to like put the human first and
and actually demonstrating that
and and so that like
hopefully as I talk to lead people
leaders
and I also talk to just employees and have check ins
is like that
I hope that they can do the same for somebody else
like really demonstrating that I think it's important
that's powerful that's powerful
and how authentic and wonderful to be so transparent
I'm sure that then breed safety and credibility
reliability
right to have that that that that type of exchange
there's there's three questions
and I'm gonna do my best to ask all three
that come from that
so one is what advice would you give other leaders
professionals who want to champion
this really important topic of mental health
and authenticity in their own environments
yeah I would say that you actually create that safety
you had talked about it but we talked often
in the workplace around psychological safety
and like create that safety
but that safety has to come with like being genuine
right authenticity
people can read through somebody who's like
doesn't actually care
and so it's it's not just saying the words
it's like really following through
and it's how your actions are
it's how you you know
your reactions give like creating that safe space
giving them space right
like also there you know
there's there's a
it's like a pendulum right
you wanna
you wanna strike the right chord in regards to like how
how much you ask but you wanna be respectful
not press too much right
and that is tricky I'm not saying it's easy
but I hope that like
if leaders are really genuinely interested and care
that their people will see it
and then that if something were to come up
that the people feel safe enough to share
it's a really good and important call out
in this fast pace
technologically driven environment that we're all in
that the human aspect is irreplaceable
to say the least especially in this context with that
it it makes me curious
especially you know
if we think about the recent community challenges
what's your approach to leading through
something like that where there is
you know an emotionally charged difficult moment
yeah I
I would say first and foremost is
if it's not clear by now I'm a very direct person
so first and foremost
is actually just calling it what it is
like I don't
I know that maybe historically
you know we don't talk about things in the workplace
and I understand that and I respect that
I still believe that if there's a
if
your community is going through a really hard moment
that it's also important to call that out
I can't sit here and pretend that you know
there's again to you know
what you're referencing I've been in Minneapolis
and Operation Metro Surge was here
it really heavily impacted many of our employees
including our communities
including myself but it's important to call that out
and not pretend like it's not happening
so I think first and foremost is that uh
and I know a lot of
depending on what organization you're with or your
who your shareholders may be
there may may not be an appetite for that
but that and then I would like to think that like
where we can create moments of connection
that we are doing that
and those moments of connection don't have to be
quite honestly it could just be a check in right
it could it doesn't have to be this
it can be big organized things
but that doesn't that's not always how folks process
that's not exactly gonna meet everybody's needs
but if you're thinking about like
what's within your control
like I'm one person what's within my control
well I can reach out to certain individuals who I know
who are like disproportionately impacted right
like as much as folks did the same for me
who were offering you know
driving me to work picking me up
getting me groceries because it wasn't safe
quite honestly and so
but that's what folks
felt like they could do in that moment
for me and that's and my reach out to folks
individuals what I felt like I could do
and even that is so much more
I mean it says so much about the communities we live in
and the people we that like again
we're all just humans at the end of the day
it doesn't matter like what side of the pole
what side of the aisle folks may be on
like people were like yeah
I want you to have your basic needs met
including like feeling safe
feeling safe and and being sure that you
you know you and your family have food
like that was so appreciated and it goes so
such a long way that hit me
have your basic needs met in a
and the power of people just showing up it
it leads me to this thought and question
with everything going on
as someone who pours so much obviously into others
both internally externally
how do you make sure you're filling up your own cup
what are your self care routines or grounding routines
how do you keep centered yes
a good question so I would say that over the last 3
4 years
I have actually given myself more permission to just
like treat myself
quite honestly
or like pamper myself with like massages again therapy
uh acupuncture
all these things that like
I'm not going to feel bad about um
you know I'm gonna allow myself to enjoy it
and it's for trust me it's for everybody's best in
and everyone's best interest that I am and doing this
but also
I think one thing that I've more recently in the last
like year
have a lot of myself to do is like
given myself permission to do nothing like
and and that's just and being okay with that
like I really just need to rest
I need like 30 minutes of quiet time and that's okay
and it's not even necessarily scrolling
it's just like resting and not feeling guilty about it
I think you know
in the hustle and bustle of life
and priorities and obligations and everything else
you know we
I think we
would find any reason
not to allow ourselves to actually rest
until it's until maybe like our
it manifests in a different way
where your body is like breaking down
and you're like oh no
you're can't you know
can't do it without six cups of coffee a day
like that's
I don't I'm trying to rest more so I don't get there
so being I guess
more intentional and allowing
giving myself permission to rest yeah
it's it's such a good call out
you know there's so much demand
and there's always something else to do
you made a really powerful point there
if we can be proactive about it
before our bodies literally breaking
asking for it
we're actually better for ourselves and others
and it's giving ourselves the permission to
I love that take a 30 minute break
quiet time uh
self care with massages I love acupuncture
I I agree
I agree and do that one too
and therapy and all the things that really
by filling up our own cup
it makes us better and stronger for others
especially when you're in a position like yours where
you know your center
it provides other people's center
that's that's a really
really good call out with that
you being such an incredible human
and continuing to give back in so many ways
I know in a previous conversation
we talked about
you're involved in a women in tech community
and it's I'm curious
what's been some of the most powerful lessons
or outcomes from that collaboration
yeah yes
I have partnered closely with the Minnesota
Women in tech group here
on a couple different events
I think honestly every time I go to one of
every time we partner together and
or I go to any of their events
I'm extremely humbled to be quite honest
just the the
the caliber of talent and intellect in the room
it's extremely humbling I like what am I doing here
but like I love that I love it's
it's love it to see the innovation
love to be around people who are just truly there
to be there for each other
you know I think often times in our society
you know like
we just need to be there more for each other
as women in the workplace
quite honestly and our allies
and so I just like
I'd never come no matter how exhausted I am before
like I'm
or no matter how much maybe like I'm just like
I don't know if I could fit it in
like I never regret going
because I always Learned something
and I'm always back
fascinated by the individuals that I meet
and just like the power houses and the stories
and those again
kind of going back to just those connections
that we make um
yeah that it's they
we tend to like the topics always kind of shift
and so it's never one
like sole topic that I'd say is like the
you know the winner of like
what was the best thing that I took away from it
however I think it's just like
being the relationships that are built
and just seeing the phenomenal people
kind of be able to show what their expertise is well
it's an amazing call it again
to support in a different way
but also to build that community to build connection
I I'm finding a
a really meaningful theme
coming throughout our conversation today
which is the human connection in so many different ways
shapes and forms if you could change one thing
about how organizations approach community
support and employee advocacy
I'm I'm curious what that would be and why yeah
organizations honestly
it it this might sound like very almost elementary
but I would just say like talking about it more like I
there is such whether it's advocacy
or community involvement and engagement
I feel
I feel like there are so many organizations that again
just like they're like nope
that's not our place and for whatever reason right
and so they it's almost shunned on or like it
it just adds to the stigma that comes with all that
it's like and you know
but I also I think it's important to like lean
like be tuned into the org
so you know
there's some organizations do a great job of that
community involvement and engagement
and it really you know
doing great things um
but then some I think are just
they don't even know how to navigate that
it's so like don't wanna
don't wanna piss off the wrong person
and so or there's like
who's the executive sponsor for this
or where does it do we have budget for this
like it's all these things that you quickly
it's like oh
it's too difficult right
it's it's
all these
layers and barriers that all of a sudden come up
but it's again I don't know if it has to be that hard
I I understand all the hard and
and I I
I recognize that but I also like at the core of it
it's like okay
well you can talk about mental health
and it doesn't have to be like we
we can bring in somebody from EAP right
we we
we pay for EAP
let's bring in somebody from EAP to talk about it
you know to well
today it's burnout you know
like in 2020 it was quiet quitting
I mean
like it just let's let's bring in it'll be tomorrow
it'll be the next thing right
like it's just let's bring in the right professionals
we pay all this money to all these other things that
like programs that we use or don't use
quite honestly and so it's like
if it's a budget thing like let's talk about it
and so yeah
that'd be my thing is just actually talking about it
trying to meet the meet the org where they're at
or meet the people where they're at again
recognizing this isn't for everybody
but I think if everybody
felt like they could be more themselves at work
and that there was more safety
around some of those topics that
you know
we'd all be hopefully be able to be our full selves
that work yeah
yeah you also
it's not hiding behind the complication
you know what I mean like it's
it's it can actually be simple
if we choose to make it simple
it's a complicated issue
but let's not create hard as the blocker
which I think is a really good call out again
very very good call out
so I'm curious
with all this is my favorite question to ask
and this is my final question
with all of your life experience
with everything that you've
you've been through that you've seen
if you can say something to your younger self
what would it be
um
I think it would be probably be like
it's gonna be okay like just trust yourself
I think there is so I mean
so much that as a I think to back to my again
I kind of alluded to earlier like your you know
early early college years
not knowing what was going on changing majors
I mean these are this
all things that many individuals go through
and then questioning
do I want to rack up all this debt
and not really not knowing
and like there was many years of self doubt
and where I kind of felt like
quite honestly
I alluded to it as like I lost my groove for like
so this is a 90s reference for folks like
Stella got her groove back
and like
when I finally got my groove back when I like found HR
quite honestly and I realized that
and then it was so empowering to be like okay
this is actually what I'm supposed to be doing and like
as and so I think just trusting yourself and like
it's going to be okay and like for me
a lot of it is like enjoying the journey
like I'm better off for it
I would not if somebody told me honestly
at 18 that I was gonna be in HR
I'd probably laugh at them again
I didn't know what HR was
so'cause it's not one of those
you know
wasn't flashy it's not sexy it's but that's you know
I I'm so glad and I'm better off for it and yeah
I just I really
obviously enjoy what I do and connecting with people
but I think just trusting yourself and and be and like
you know it'll
it'll things will come together as they as they are
as they should and as they're meant to be
I think that's just a beautiful sentiment
and what I find just lovely about you
you're calling out very practical
real life things that we all go through right
but you're doing it in such an authentic
genuine way that it doesn't have to be stigmatized
meaning we can we're gonna go through challenges
we're gonna take time likely to figure out who we are
you said many times throughout our conversation today
these are normal things that people go through
meaning
you're acknowledging that you went through something
but so do a lot of other people we all go through this
but what I find again
just lovely about you is you're calling it out
and then
you're helping people find their way through it too
not just going through it and well
that was my own journey
now moving on and not sharing it
but truly being a champion for authenticity
is how I would describe you
besides fashionable with your amazing hat
so I just
I have so appreciated my time with you and just again
your genuine genuine self
it's been a pleasure I appreciate it
thank you so much for having me on Ashley