Ep 31: Perfectionism Made Him Great. Will It Break Him As A Dad?

A former New York City Ballet principal dancer opens up about the fear underneath the joy of expecting his first child. Chase Finlay talks with Tony Cooper about the perfectionism that carried him from a childhood ballet studio to the world's biggest stages, and why that same drive could work against him as a father. They cover the difference between performing for approval and living in alignment, why presence stops time with your kids, and how recovery and honest relationships taught him to become his own cavalry instead of waiting to be rescued. Chase also shares his intentions for his baby shower, his hopes to raise a daughter free to imagine, and the advice he's giving himself for the first months of fatherhood.

Key Takeaways

• Perfectionism can build a career and also work against you as a father if left unchecked
• The external pursuit of validation can be fulfilling, but internal alignment creates lasting fulfillment
• Recovery and a healthy relationship helped reframe self-reliance: "I'm the cavalry"
• Presence is the antidote to feeling like time with your kids moves too fast
• Play is a child's domain, and imagination is worth protecting from screens and self-consciousness
• Doing your own personal work before becoming a parent is a gift you give your children
• A baby shower can be a celebration of the work both partners did on themselves, not just the baby
• Being a firm, present, aware foundation for your partner matters as much as showing up physically

If you enjoyed The Dad Manual, leave us a rating on your podcast app! If you loved it, share this episode with a Dad! Send your questions to [e-mail]. Connect with Tony Cooper: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thetonycooper/

00:00 Cold open
00:29 Meet Chase Finlay
01:19 30 weeks into pregnancy
01:35 Abundance and joy in pregnancy
02:30 Fear of not being good enough
03:24 Wanting everything to be perfect
04:11 The evidence he'll be a great dad
05:03 Chase's ballet career begins
06:41 Principal dancer by 19
07:32 External pursuit vs internal journey
09:07 How he discovered dance
11:40 Athletic and artistic, not fitting a box
13:18 Tony's son finds DJing
15:23 Watching your kid arrive at themselves
17:24 Being flexible, not predicting the future
18:13 Perfectionism: great for dance, risky for dad
19:31 Living aligned with authenticity
20:29 The shift from performing to real recovery
21:14 Becoming his own cavalry
22:19 Substance abuse and hitting bottom
23:00 His wife calling him on his bullshit
24:20 Alignment resolves inner conflict
26:11 Doing the work before kids arrive
27:27 His vision: presence as his top value
29:28 Be what you want your kid to become
30:07 Presence stops time
32:30 Wanting to rebuild play and imagination
34:22 What joy means to him now
36:16 Planning the baby shower
39:11 Celebrating the work, not just the baby
40:08 Advice to himself for the first months
41:13 Closing thoughts

Creators and Guests

Host

Tony Cooper

Tony Cooper is the founder of Playing the Game of Business, a business coach, father, and podcast host.

What is The Dad Manual?

The Dad Manual is a fatherhood podcast hosted by Tony Cooper, featuring honest conversations with dads about the real, unfiltered journey of parenthood. This parenting podcast for dads explores everything from the excitement of being a first time dad to navigating the teenage years. As one of the best podcasts for expecting dads and experienced fathers alike, we dive deep into what it actually means to be a modern dad—the struggles, the growth, the mistakes, and the moments that change you forever. Whether you're looking for a new dad podcast or seasoned parenting wisdom, this family podcast delivers the honest guidance you won't find in books.

Tony Cooper 00:00
You're not learning and you're not creating from that learning, then life becomes really, really dull. He just graduated with a degree in sports management and a minor in finance. He's like, dad, I want to be a teacher. I want to be a math.
Chase Finlay 00:13
However you get there. Perfectionism, it's the thing that made you great at dancing and it's the thing that's going to mess you up in fatherhood.
Tony Cooper 00:29
Hi, I'm Tony Cooper, this is the Dad Manual podcast and I'm here today with one of my favorite about to be dads. Will you please introduce yourself?
Chase Finlay 00:39
My name is Chase Finlay and I am a good, soon to be dad and I have a lot of insights to share.
Tony Cooper 00:50
Yeah, and I'm going to throw great, because I know you will be, because you are, you're just somebody who has just always impressed me as taking things on at the highest level you can. So why I'm super excited about our conversation is of all the journeys you've been on and all the things you've accomplished in your life, you're stepping into now 30 weeks, is that correct?
Chase Finlay 01:00
30 weeks, yeah.
Tony Cooper 01:19
Okay. It will be 34, 35 by the time this airs, but still before the baby's born. This is like the next great adventure. And I know your life has been accelerating recently and you know, we were talking about abundance and we all crave abundance, we all want abundance, get over our scarcity. And then the universe goes, all right, here's some abundance. How's that feel? And it can feel really overwhelming. So with everything that's happening right now, just maybe just start with, how has it been in pregnancy? What's come up for you and what are you observing about yourself in this process?
Chase Finlay 01:35
There's so many different levels and angles I could take with that because pregnancy has brought up a lot. I mean, obviously the first and primary for me is just the joy. I mean, you talked about abundance. This is something that I have been craving. This is something I've been waiting for for a very, very long time. I mean, ever since I was a kid, I just, there was this desire inside of me to caretake and to be a dad and to be able to step into that playfulness again. The kind of obvious part is just the thrill and the joy and the anticipation of everything. But then what comes along with that is the fear, the insecurity.
2:30
Am I going to be good enough? Am I going to do the right thing? Am I going to be able to show up for my wife, for my child, in a way that is necessary. Right. I don't want to mess anything up. So those stories and those thoughts come in every now and then as well.
Tony Cooper 02:59
And are those more like generalized feelings of insecurity, or there's specific things that you go, I don't know that I know how to do that?
Chase Finlay 03:00
Yeah. This is both of our first times in this journey together. And so it's really easy for me to fall into that story of, you know, I've got to make sure that everything is perfectly prepared and I have to make sure, you know, we have all of the stuff, of the things and everything outside of me needs to be perfect.
03:24
But what has brought me the most solace throughout this process is really just about what do I need to be, what do I need to continue to remind myself to come back to so that I can show up as the fullest, best version of myself for whatever happens? Because we all know that I'm not in charge of this process.
Tony Cooper 03:51
So that is correct. So what is that that you come back to? What is the anchor you have for yourself in it all?
Chase Finlay 04:11
That is that I am capable of doing really difficult things. It's really easy for me to get lost in what I don't know yet, what hasn't happened yet. But if I can trace back throughout my timeline and look at all of the evidence as to why I am going to be a great father, the evidence is, is that I overcome challenges, is that I have a deep level of love that is within me that can't wait to be expressed. That I am a curious and, like I said earlier, a playful person, somebody who just really values what patience and presence really means and how to fully embody that.
Tony Cooper 04:11
You've known yourself to take on very difficult goals and achieve them at a very high level. So I'm thinking about your dancing career. So tell me a little bit about that and that journey. Because what I know about it is it's highly competitive, there's very few spots at the top. And so as much as you might want to be an abundant win win kind of a person, I know that there's no way that that environment fosters that. So you had to really create and probably overcome some huge obstacles in order to be able to achieve the level of success you did. So tell me about that, man.
Chase Finlay 05:35
Where do I start? I was a teenager when this whole thing happened. I had been studying in New York City since I was a child. I would equate it to a childhood actor. How your childhood needs to be put second in order for you to achieve this.
05:55
And truly it is a passion, it was a passion of mine, but something that I was just in this constant pursuit of perfecting. And there was an element there that, if I get to this certain place, then I will feel the joy, the acceptance, the affirmation that I felt like was somewhat missing in my life. But by the time I was 15 years old, I was auditioning for pre-professional companies. By the time I was 17 years old, I was accepted into the New York City Ballet. By 19 years old, I had made my way through the ranks to principal dancer and was dancing the most prestigious roles on the largest stages in the world.
06:42
So to put it as short as possible, that was some of the things that I was up against. But the thing that I found in that was, and this kind of ties into my own personal development over the years that I would love to impart into my daughter, is that the external pursuit can be very fulfilling and was very fulfilling. But what I found is actually the internal journey of finding myself, of becoming realigned with my own authenticity, my own self expression, pushing myself to my own internal boundaries, that is what really created the most fulfillment for me.
Tony Cooper 07:33
That pursuit of that external validation or the external accolades, however it shows up outside, that desire to achieve something really great. Where did that come from for you?
Chase Finlay 07:50
You could chalk it up to, I had middle child syndrome or there was something like that going on. I think there was a purity to it because I don't want to paint this as something that was just like an internal flaw or that I was doing it from a place of lack, because the moment I stepped into that ballet studio, there was something about the ability for me to fully express not only emotionally but physically that just, it felt like home. Felt like the sensation of being home. It's like, here is a platform where I can finally just be all of me.
08:31
And to be honest, I don't really know why there were elements of that throughout my childhood, or throughout going to school or being on sports teams, that I just didn't fully feel like I fit in entirely. And that has nothing to do with the way that my family system was or that my environment was created. But there was just something about that form of expression that really captivated me. It was my first ever passion.
09:07
And if I look at the purpose and meaning, it's not necessarily a tangible thing, but it's more of a feeling.
Tony Cooper 09:07
How did dance start with you? Where, how did you find it?
Chase Finlay 09:36
So my sister was a ballet dancer, figure skater, and kind of by association, as my mom was chauffeuring us here and there and everywhere, there were times where I'd have to hang out at the skating rink or I'd have to hang out at the ballet studio. And for several years it was, I was either playing my Game Boy or throwing the ball against the wall or just doing something to distract myself.
09:56
And there was a performance where the kids from the school get to dance alongside some pre-professionals and professionals in the certain city that I grew up in. And the first time that I was sitting in the audience and I saw a professional male dancer on stage, I saw that it was athleticism, that it was artistry, that somebody got to play a role for a certain amount of hours and kind of just lose themselves in the grandeur of this production. And there was just something about that.
10:19
I mean, me as a child, I would say I was athletic, but again, never felt like I fit in with the jock crowd. I spent a lot of time on my own in the yard. And every birthday or Christmas, I would ask for costumes of my favorite character from a certain movie. And that was kind of my first level of creativity and self expression. So when I saw this thing on stage, it was like, oh, it's not that I don't like sports.
10:56
I love running. I love being outside. If you put me in a classroom, all I could think about was being outside and running and playing.
11:05
So I was not the school jock type as a kid. So when I found this thing, when I saw this thing and there was a model for me of this is what boys to men can actually do, there was, it was both these worlds that combined harmoniously. And right away I was like, mom, I got to do that thing.
Tony Cooper 11:27
It's awesome. It all clicked. All the different parts of you. You're like, I'm really athletic, but the jock route isn't for me. I'm really artistic, but that whole angle isn't for me.
11:40
And there's all these parts of you, but it's sort of like all intersect in a way that dance became something that just made you feel like yourself.
Chase Finlay 11:40
Absolutely. That you felt like you could be yourself.
Tony Cooper 11:40
Absolutely.
Chase Finlay 11:40
And just to emphasize on something you said, the artistic side of me, the one who wore the costumes, who entered his own world out in the yard, there was something that was inherently lonely about that. There weren't many other boys at my age who had that kind of internal creativity that I had. And in fact, a lot of the times it was teased.
Tony Cooper 12:16
There's a stigma. Right. And certainly, because kids, they're just projecting the stuff they hear from their parents. There's traditional female roles and traditional male roles, and if you cross over, then I have judgment and I can put you in sort of a box. So I'm sure you've dealt with a lot of that.
Chase Finlay 12:31
Yeah, absolutely. So then, just to circle back around to the question, is when I saw that there was something inherently artistic and something inherently athletic at the same time, with community, with acceptance. If there was the ability to make another person feel the way that I felt when I was sitting in the audience, I was like, that's the coolest thing in the world.
Tony Cooper 12:52
And what a great model as you're stepping into raising a kid. Because our job is really to help them find their way and help them find that place where they can feel like this is right for me. Like that click that you felt. It's interesting.
13:18
My son Leo just graduated from college last week, about four weeks ago. Olivia, my wife, just launched their design agency and they had a launch party here at the house. And Leo's friend is a DJ. And Olivia asked Leo if he would ask Tiago if he would DJ the party. And Tiago wasn't available. So Olivia then said, hey, can you learn how to DJ for the party? Can you do that? So Leo, of course, was like, all right. And he borrowed a board from his friend and beautifully just watched YouTube videos on it.
13:50
And I was there the first day he was playing with it, and it's just like he really naturally, just like that same sort of way it clicked. So fast forward, four weeks later, we're at the launch party. He plays a six and a half hour house set. So he's already in house music, he already has the music down.
14:08
But his musical selection, the way he would transition between songs, I was watching something happen in him that was the very first time in his life. He's 22. Where I was like, oh, shit, I think he found it.
14:24
Like, because he's really cerebral and he's very smart, and he loves expression, but he has a very different kind of expression, sort of an interesting thing to notice about your kid, is that he has this very deep, very sensitive, soulful part of him, but it only comes out when he writes. So he writes poetry, and he writes the most beautiful cards.
14:48
And it's sort of like there's this external Leo and there's this internal Leo. And when I watched him be a DJ, he was obviously thinking about what he was going to do, but the way he was moving and feeling the music, he was a hundred percent guided by his whole body and his whole being. And it felt like an integrated thing. And when you see that in your kid, the ability to create that opportunity or to create the kid that finds that opportunity. So this isn't really an acknowledgment for your parents, how they created you as a person who knew himself so well.
15:23
He just didn't know where he fit in. And then when the opportunity presented itself, you went, I've arrived. And so I just saw that happen. And now all of a sudden, he just graduated with a degree in sports management and a minor in finance. He's like, dad, I want to be a DJ. I found it. However you get there. But, as a dad, man, there is no greater joy than when your kid finds a way to express himself in the world that's authentic, like who they were built to be.
15:52
So I felt a lot. As a father and thinking about what a joy it is as a parent to find your kid, find that in themselves.
Chase Finlay 16:16
Yeah. And that, this may be a slight pivot, but something that also comes up for me around entering fatherhood is, again, going back to that question of what are maybe some of my worries or some of my fears about this, and the tendency for me to go, I have to make sure that everything structurally is perfect so that when this person enters the world, things will go as planned. And again, coming back to that foundation of trust and peace, and I can do hard things, and being able to really just be present with the way that this person unfolds in front of my eyes.
Tony Cooper 16:50
What you're saying is helping me realize, it's like we can't predict what this is going to be. What we can do is we can be the most available, we can be the most flexible version of ourselves as we enter parenthood. But ultimately, universally, who knows what the spirit of this person is and what they're going to fall in love with and what lights them up inside. And it's almost like it's much simpler than we make it ourselves, which is kind of a lesson with a lot of things.
17:24
But if you can be present and open and flowing with whatever this person wants to do, then as they find those things, it's like, okay, cool, how can I celebrate that with them? How can I create space for them to flourish in those things? How can I be an example of what curiosity looks like?
17:50
So as we step into fatherhood, it's a great opportunity for us to resolve whatever we've been carrying with us. And so you just talked about this perfectionism, need. You have a need to have it all worked out and structured in a particular kind of way. Assuming that came out of your upbringing in one way or another, you've had it your whole life. It's the thing that made you great at dancing.
Chase Finlay 18:13
Absolutely.
Tony Cooper 18:13
And it's the thing that's going to mess you up in fatherhood.
18:21
So how have you been resolving that? How have you been going after that? I mean, you're already seeing it. Let's just acknowledge, you're a licensed therapist. You work with chemical dependencies and trauma and really helping people perform at a really high level in their life, overcoming. So you have a particular insight into this, probably an advantage over others. So how have you been addressing that with yourself?
Chase Finlay 18:37
Yeah. So again, there's this model that I try my best, despite the perfectionism, to live by, and that is being aligned with my own authenticity. If I am trying to perform my way through life, if I am falling victim to the way that I think that other people want me to parent or other people want me to father because of, again, that old story of if I just do enough, if I perform well, if I show up and just be a good boy, then I will have the acceptance that I'm looking for, constantly looking at the external thing to fill the internal void.
19:31
Were there some things throughout my life that reinforced that? Sure, absolutely. But the thing is, I'm just so grateful that I had an entire life shift that took me from an environment that I couldn't really look inside. I had to continue this outward character in which people wanted me to be. And when I took the journey inward, when I took the journey towards personal development and my own personal recovery and stepping into wanting to help people along the same path, there is a foundational message that I come back to, and it's, if I am out of alignment with my own authenticity, I am going to always be in conflict with something else and with myself.
20:29
I've done plenty of my own trauma work before and looked in the past, but to me, what's really been the most useful is how am I showing up in the present, and who do I want to be? What kind of person do I want to show up as as I move forward? And so really being able to know that version of myself through visualization, through meditation, through acts of integrity, through taking ownership in my life, the moment where I realized that nobody was going to come save me from my own story, it's when I was completely free. The whole imagery of the cavalry, like, they're coming to save you, and then when it hits you that I'm the cavalry.
Tony Cooper 21:14
How did that hit you? Once you see it, you can't unsee that. So what is it that led to you having clarity around that?
Chase Finlay 21:35
I mean, it was just kind of this continual desire to grow. I always say to people, if you're not learning and you're not creating from that learning, then life becomes really, really dull. I struggled with substance abuse of my own when I was dancing. And that was ultimately the thing that kind of brought me to my knees and forced me into this new pivot in my life. Initially I had this first introduction with therapy and spirituality and a healthy community of men and looking deep and internal within myself. And there was just something about that process of this kind of internal exploration that just felt really clear.
22:19
And it was over the years, just as I continued, studying therapeutic modalities, I never use something on somebody that I haven't done on myself first, doing leadership courses and personal development and emotional intelligence trainings and just continuing to be this sponge of growth. To answer your question, I don't know if there was a moment where it just really stuck, but I'll also attribute it to entering a healthy relationship for the first time, seriously, like having somebody be able to stand for me in a way that I couldn't even stand for myself at the time.
23:00
My now wife, she came into my life and she was just like, you are playing so small. But was fearlessly able to call me on my bullshit. And between the therapists that I've had and the coaches that I've had, those are the kind of people that I want around me. Because sure, is it going to hurt my feelings sometimes? Right.
23:24
But it gives me yet again another opportunity to look at what is the self-deprecating story that I'm living in that makes this offensive, or what caused me to feel upset by that or triggered by that. And in a way, it's like now I'm kind of contradicting myself because the cavalry was my therapist and my wife.
Tony Cooper 23:52
But that's, no, I think that's actually really the point, which is, and first of all, the fabulous Fabi, who stood for you in that way, was standing for herself. There was a way in which she was able to stand for you, but that was her being her own cavalry. In the same way that you said before, this thing about really getting clear on your authenticity, that when you're out of alignment and you're in conflict with yourself, you're in conflict with the world and vice versa. It's like, but as soon as you align with yourself, then the world, the conflict goes away.
24:21
And so all of these modalities, all of these experiences, create the opportunity for you to see something different. Because without it, it's very difficult for us to come up with a new way of seeing something. It's going to get triggered by something, call it a divine inspiration or a massive breakdown that you experience, or whatever it might be. We'll keep doing what we keep doing until something breaks us out of it. So the stimulus is usually external, but the solution isn't.
24:53
And so I think that's what you're saying, which is not a contradiction. It does have to come from somewhere. But then you get to decide, what do I make this mean? What am I going to do about it? What thoughts am I going to have? What beliefs am I going to hold? What ones are we going to let go of? And that is the work. That's the work of just being a human. But you have the luxury of time until you become a dad.
25:15
And when you become a dad, it's fast forward. Because a lot of the guests that I'm talking with on this podcast, their kids are in their teens before they kind of get it, which is wonderful because being a dad is an incredible journey of transformation. However, the victims of the delayed awareness and insights and breakthroughs are that the kids pick up on all the things that's been unresolved. And so I appreciate so much about your journey, is you have been doing this for the right reasons. You're doing it for yourself, your own health, like you coming back to yourself and believing yourself so much. And I'm imagining it's the same belief that you had in yourself when you started dancing. You kind of somehow come back to that, but the majority of getting the stuff out of the way that you don't want to pass on to your kids is such an incredible gift you're giving to your family.
26:11
Again, to doing the work. Right. Putting the work in on the front end before getting to this stage in your life.
Chase Finlay 26:24
I've been in recovery and doing the self-development thing for the better part of eight and a half years. And throughout that time, there's this part of me that's like, why can't I just have the ideal relationship and the child and I want my life to start moving forward? And there was something universally that was just saying, not yet, you're not ready yet. There is more for you to identify within yourself that is going to set you up to the best way that you possibly can to show up for this little innocent, beautiful girl who is going to literally steal your heart.
Tony Cooper 27:02
Over and over and over.
Chase Finlay 27:02
Yeah.
Tony Cooper 27:02
So I love to hear, what's the vision you have for yourself as a dad, as you step into imagining this little being, this little beautiful daughter you're going to have?
Chase Finlay 27:27
One that is fully present. I think presence for me is one of my number one values. And this might be a little bit of a generalization, but having worked with a lot of men over the past eight years, I just see a lot of unconscious. When we talk about being able to identify our triggers and being able to identify what's going on internally with me emotionally and to either avoid that, suppress that, or not even be able to identify that. And then that comes out in some sort of toxicity or backlash or something that has a negative effect.
27:59
Being able to be present and aware of myself as I am going through life as a father is something that is the number one thing for me. Because again, I could try to predict and set everything up the way that I think it should go, but at the end of the day, there are going to be so many different ups and downs and twists and turns to this process that, being able to be present, being able to be aware, being able to be flexible and to really just meet everything with love is a huge part for me. Because I know if I am out of alignment or disrupted or triggered in some way, that is, we're talking about generational trends, that is going to be passed down.
28:56
So to sum it up, I would love to be a healthy masculine figure for my daughter.
Tony Cooper 29:28
I love that. That sounds good. This is good, because we, as fathers, what we're imparting into our children, your daughter is the vision that she has about what a man is supposed to be like, whatever it is, however we show up. And so they will consciously or unconsciously seek that. So it's like, what do you want for your kid, man? Be that. Whatever you want your kid to have in her life, show up that way.
29:36
That's the greatest motivation. And what I love you said about the presence too, because I've definitely talked about this, but one of the biggest complaints, I'm sure you hear it all the time, is, oh my god, time flies. The kids are growing up so fast. And I was like, there's one source of that. Time is not going faster.
29:54
Kids do grow in leaps and bounds. They're showing you time, they represent time and how they're growing. And if you are not present for a little while, you come back, things have changed rapidly.
Chase Finlay 30:07
Absolutely.
Tony Cooper 30:07
And so it's not that time is flying, it's that you're not paying attention.
30:14
So the idea of presence is literally, it stops time. When you sit down and go, okay, I'm going to play with my kid for 10 minutes, it could feel like an hour if you are 100% in their world. And so what I love what you said before is about your desire to be a father started a long time ago, and you said something along the lines of wanting to get back to that playful part of your life. So I would love to hear more about that, because if there's anything that will make you a great dad, is remembering you're parenting a child. So show up in the consciousness of a child, and play is a child's domain. That's their oxygen. What did you mean by that when you said capturing that play?
Chase Finlay 31:21
Well, I'm also just so aware that she's going to teach me so much. I mean, again, I look at all the different interactions that I've had in my own life have taught me so much. Have there been things that didn't go perfectly? 100%. But I'm also not naive enough to look at, I would not be the person that I am today if it weren't for my ballet career, if it weren't for devastating substance abuse. And I wouldn't be the person that I am today if it weren't for the relationship that I'm in with my wife. I wouldn't be the person that I am today if it weren't for the relationships that I have with my closest friends that I've known since I was eight years old.
31:51
So every interaction, every spirit, every human being that comes into my life, if I'm willing to be present and aware enough with that person, is going to unlock this whole new version of who Chase is. And maybe it's not new, but maybe it's just something that's been really stagnant for a long time. Because referring back to who I was as a child, I was the one who was asking for costumes so I could go outside and be in make-believe land. I can't wait to do that with her. I can't wait to build forts and pretend like we're blasting off into space. I can't wait for those sweet, innocent moments of just pure innocence and imagination.
Tony Cooper 32:48
Absolutely. I think the thing that gets drummed out of our kids real fast is imagination. I'm not going to go on a soapbox around digital friends, but as soon as you put a screen in front of a kid, their imagination goes out the window.
33:01
Like, truthfully, no, it's an interactive game. I'm like, it's a screen. It's not.
Chase Finlay 33:01
And so as you just described that, like putting on caution is doing whatever they want. Following their lead is the foundation of them being able to be whoever they want to be or create whatever they want to create in the world. Because that's imagination. And that's going to give me permission to, again, it's like meet this inner child portion of myself that maybe because of adulting and society, it's like, it's not always an okay thing to do to pretend like you're an animal or something like that.
Tony Cooper 33:38
No, no, no. Unfortunately, no, it isn't. No. You just get a lot of looks. But it's funny what you can get away with if you don't give a shit what other people think.
Chase Finlay 33:51
Right. As much as I'm excited to teach her, I'm excited to learn from what this, again, this imaginative, innocent being is going to just show me or remind me of in my life.
Tony Cooper 34:08
That all sounds really great. I was just wondering, at this point in your life, after everything you've been through and all the incredible accomplishments and amazing things and the lows, what would you say joy is for you right now?
Chase Finlay 34:27
Joy for me? I mean, I'm going to come back to just being completely aligned with my own essence. Is really just who I know myself to be, giving myself every permission to take action from that place, as opposed to, again, there was so much fulfillment in my dance career.
34:59
And the thing that feels different is now the fulfillment lasts. It just keeps lasting. Instead of this euphoric experience on stage, and then the curtain comes down and it's like, okay, all the dopamine's gone, and then we have to wait for the next performance or the next rush of excitement.
35:25
But being able to be a conscious individual in this world, to know yourself on a deep level and to be able to say, no matter what, I'm going to operate based off of my own system, there's so much freedom to that. And, sure, I can point to me and my wife going on a vacation and having an experience that's joy. 100%. I experience joy in those moments. But again, joy is created from your own internal experience, in my experience of being in alignment with yourself. If I'm pretending to be somebody that I'm not, there is always going to feel like there is something missing.
Tony Cooper 36:16
Very well said, Chase. Speaking of performance, your next big performance is a week and a half from now. You guys are having your baby shower?
Chase Finlay 36:26
Oh yeah.
Tony Cooper 36:26
I wish I were in Austin, I would totally be there. I love you, but what do you want that to be like, given that, I think just from a man's perspective, baby showers are, many of them men aren't even part of. And so sometimes they are, and obviously in your community, in your instance, it is a coed event, but men kind of take the back seat, I think, in a lot of those things. And truly, actually, I never really told this story, but the reason I even started this podcast is I started a men's team when I moved to Davis, California, in 2010. And I just found that in the school, all the moms were super involved in the class when we were at any event, and all the dads were like, as far away as they could be against the wall, not even, they didn't even know each other. I was like, this is not okay. We have to be as much a part of their lives as the mom.
37:14
So I was just thinking about that, and what do you want to have happen at the baby shower? How do you want that to go?
Chase Finlay 37:44
Man, I just want to use this as kind of, there is so much about the pregnancy process that doesn't even feel real. There's obviously those moments where me and my wife are laying in bed at night and we can see, through the glow of the TV, her belly starting to jostle and turn, and I'm speaking to her belly. But there's something that doesn't fully feel real yet. And not that this process is going to make things feel real. I mean, once she is in this world and I get to lay eyes on her, then I think that'll kind of fulfill that for me. But the baby shower, I really just want it to be a celebration, this process, myself and Fabi, our relationship has been extremely accelerated.
38:11
I think universally it's so interesting. When I lived in New York City, she literally lived three blocks away from where I used to dance every single day for a number of years. When I moved to Austin, my apartment was one block away from where she worked. So we've constantly just been crossing paths this whole time. And, again, it's like the work that she's put in, the work that I've put in on knowing ourselves fully, and being able to, I don't think people ever arrive, but to get to this certain landmark where the universe is kind of like, hey, you're ready. Let's do this thing.
Tony Cooper 38:53
I love that it's a celebration of what you all have created and what's about to come. But I love that you're celebrating the work that each of you have done on yourselves to be ready to be the greatest parents you can be to this lucky little child. That's a fantastic intention. I love that.
Chase Finlay 39:11
Yeah. I always tell people, again, this perspective of, like, pain is something to be worked through or pain is something to be avoided. I also want to bring that into it. To be completely honest, I want to feel the entirety of what brought us to this point of being a couple months away from this little girl entering the world. My dreams are literally about to come true.
39:37
And how can we celebrate all of it? It's not just the good, but also some of the things that have been really difficult.
Tony Cooper 39:48
Yeah, I love that. Okay, we'll wrap up here in a second. And I wanted to have you, you know your wife pretty well, you're about to go through something neither of you have been through before. I want you to think about what her needs will be in a couple months, after you have a baby, after she's at home with you all, and after you start to live your life. What advice do you want to give to yourself? How do you want to guide yourself as you show up in those moments in the first, say, few months of your child's life?
Chase Finlay 40:22
I just, I just really want to be an advocate. Obviously, I want to show up physically for her needs, but also emotionally, to be able to withstand and hold and create space for whatever hormonal disruption wants to happen, or whatever experience she's having with the baby. Again, you can't predict what's about to happen. So being the firm, solid, present, aware, conscious foundation for whatever comes up, if I look back on that time and I can fulfill that role, then I'll be like, we did it.
Tony Cooper 41:08
Yeah, we did a good job. Yeah. Amazing. Chase, thank you so much.
Chase Finlay 41:13
Thank you. Thanks for being here and sharing this journey.
Tony Cooper 41:13
This is so much fun for me, and I'm so excited for you guys, waiting to meet your daughter. I love you and appreciate you.
Chase Finlay 41:22
Love you too, man.
Tony Cooper 41:22
And I would love for us to check back in in another, I don't know, a period of time. I'm like, how's it going now, you're an actual dad. Everything that I said was wrong.
Chase Finlay 41:32
Yeah, I know, I was 100%. Mainly provide the rebuttal.
Tony Cooper 41:41
Awesome. All right, well, until then, can't wait. I'll talk to you soon.
Chase Finlay 41:41
All right, thanks, Tony.
Tony Cooper 41:41
I just want to thank you for listening to this episode of the Dad Manual podcast, and for supporting dads to become the best version of themselves as they strive to bring healing and inspiration to their families. I'm looking to grow a community of fathers who are ready to change the world. But I need your help.
42:00
It's super valuable to the podcast when you like an episode, when you leave us a rating and subscribe to our YouTube channel, when you follow us on Instagram, The Dad Manual Podcast, and maybe even the most important, when you share the podcast with the dad you love. Also, you can impact what we talk about here. If you've got questions or topics you want me to explore, email them to me at [e-mail]. I would love to answer your question on our next episode. And until next time.
42:30
Hi, I'm Tony Cooper, and this is the Dad Manual Podcast.