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There are those in the spotlight, and then there is Everybody Else.
Hosted by Wes Luttrell (Indiana-based artist manager, development coach, and founder of Wally Opus Records), Everybody Else is a podcast dedicated to the invisible people who make music happen. Featuring solo commentary and insightful interviews with artist managers, record label execs, booking agents, tour managers, lawyers, music tech founders, music producers, venue managers, and a slew of others whom we'd consider to have the most interesting jobs in the world.
Speaker 3 (00:00)
This is the Everybody Else Podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:03)
Who are the invisible people of music today? And what do they do to make music happen? Because behind every great artist, song, venue, festival and music service, there's a tribe of people who will dedicate their lives to work that if done right, will never appear to have happened. There are those in the spotlight, and then there's everybody else.
Speaker 1 (00:29)
The Mothership ⁓ is a music venue in Mansfield, Ohio. We host artists from all over the globe, traveling across the country, in between countries. We also host local and regional bands. It's a 100 % music venue. We're not a bar, although we do have a, we put a little bar inside so we can sell drinks during shows. We're working on getting a little recording studio up and running.
for that as a service as well. But yeah, we've been growing and it's been good seeing a lot of talent coming through the doors.
Speaker 2 (01:03)
Yeah.
And what's your role night in the venue?
Speaker 1 (01:09)
Yeah, so I'm more of the operations, general management, and I do the booking and all the sound. So I wear a lot of hats. I do a little gardening here, there. Janitorial services, yeah, whatever kind of needs done. But yeah, all the booking and talent scouting and wherever it takes me.
Speaker 2 (01:19)
share it.
What about you, Jeff? You're the owner, you're the founder? Yeah, own... I like to tell people I own the building and it's the young, cool people that make it all happen. And Nate, by the way, is a great guitar player, singer, songwriter also, so he gets it. He understands music inside out. And ⁓ I was fortunate to find the building a couple years ago when we had a need for that here in our little town. Tell me about that. I'm curious how...
So this used to be a dentist office that you guys converted into first a rehearsal space? Yeah, in a nutshell, it came from the need of local musicians. They had been practicing a little further north of here in a rough neighborhood. And ⁓ one of the guys who's my son came home and was concerned of a gunshot next door while they were practicing. So in a quick conversation, my wife and I were talking, coming home one night.
and said, wow, if we can ever find a safe place for these young artists to practice. And lo and behold, boom, we're driving down the main drag in Mansfield, Ohio, and there's a for sale sign in this place. I'd driven by it a thousand times and never knew it was even there because it's tucked back off the road. And the story of it is it's a former doctor's office, and the guy has since passed away, it's many years ago, but the guy was an avid supporter of music, I just found out.
So he would be happy knowing what's going on here today. And we renovated it. There's like, what, 16 rooms here that we've blown out walls, built a lot of different things. Are all of the spaces, rehearsal spaces, all 16 rooms? The front half of the house is for traveling musicians. We treat it like an Airbnb. So we give bands a place to stay. We've got a kitchen, a separate living room, which is now a green room.
Speaker 1 (03:19)
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:19)
Couple of space, couple of the rooms are for studios and then we have a large space that has been converted into the live performance area. Okay. Okay. Did you have, Jeff, do you personally have experience starting businesses before the mothership? Yes, I have. Mostly in the advertising and sales background, my whole career. Okay. I've owned some businesses in the past, small.
Speaker 1 (03:44)
so
Speaker 2 (03:49)
You know, nothing large. where I got some inspiration from was a guy named Michael Dell, who started Dell Computer many years ago. I happened to meet him when he was 21 years old, starting the company. ⁓ he knew the power of people working together. So it's been a good lesson in life, you know. How quickly after starting the mothership did you bring on folks like Nate? Like how soon did you bring on a team to help facilitate the operations?
Unfortunately, I wasn't that smart in the beginning. I opened the place up and it was basically like animal house. There was all these young music, there's apartments upstairs. So there was musicians and guys, their friends living upstairs, people downstairs. And I have a advertising business I run right now. So I kind of let them do their thing. And then after a while, it just got to be total chaos. But they were having some bands coming in from all over the country.
just through the internet and social media. So a couple years into it, probably for the last four years out of six, we've been doing professional shows. I met Nate and I knew he was smart right away. And I'm like, all right, we need more smart young people involved here. And Nate, what's your background before Mothership? How did you, did you have any experience in music? I know you're a musician, but just in the back end side of things, bookings, stuff like that? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:16)
I hadn't had much experience with booking before Mothership aside from myself and my friends. ⁓ Yeah, so I just a self-taught musician for like the last probably 18 years or so and doing shows and touring around a little bit and running into all kind of, know, odd and bad good situations on the road, which were awesome lessons for, you know, designing this place. We want it to be, you know, a perfect spot that we would want to stop by if we were on tour.
you know, that the artists come by and, ⁓ you know, it just makes a world of difference that we have had all the experience, the negative experiences to shape this place, to make it, you know, really welcoming for the fans and the artists. ⁓ So yeah, my background mainly is as a musician. And this place, you know, it started, like Jeff said, as a rehearsal space. And...
the bands that were playing around that time, they kept inviting their friends to the rehearsals. Well, okay, then that's gonna turn into shows. Well, why don't we just make a show out of it? This kept growing. Well, I got my buddy's band stopping by from Cleveland. I got my buddy's band stopping by from New York City. So this thing has grown really organically over the couple of years. We've never had an opening day. It's all been really underground. But now, like Jeff said, the last four years, we have kind of crossed the line from a DIY...
little stop on people's tours to like a professional venue that is hosting bigger and bigger shows, bigger and bigger audiences. And it's just grown organically. I just started running sound one night because nobody was running sound. was like, this sounds like shit. I can do something with this, you know? So I just kept showing up and, you know, eventually this guy offers me a job. So it's just grown really organically. The people that were hanging around here with
playing music, rehearsing, and just kind of, you know, getting together, talking, making a community out of it, and seeing who fits where as a puzzle, you know, to make this, to grow this place, keep growing this place, you know.
Speaker 2 (07:27)
So give me some context. What's the current music scene in Mansfield, Ohio and your sort of region?
Speaker 1 (07:35)
Yeah, I would have to say it's primarily cover bands, ⁓ which play in the regular bars and they're doing three or four hour sets. And there are some really talented people that play around town. There are a handful of original bands, but it's not, I wouldn't call it a really big ⁓ music scene here or anything, at least from my perspective, somebody else from town might tell you different. But even some of the bands that were originally, helped form this place,
They just banned after a couple of years. You don't often run into bands, in my experience, that are sticking together for 15, 20 years. so even some of the people that were around, they're no longer bands. They have kids, they have jobs now. People move on. ⁓ But I would say Ohio as a whole, now that's a different story. I'm seeing some of the best artists from this side of the country playing around Ohio.
in Cleveland, ⁓ in Cincinnati, ⁓ know, everywhere. I mean, so much talent just in our state. And we're making really good connections with all of those people and saying, hey, you know, these guys are on a world tour that are stopping by this weekend. We want you to open for them. We want you to do half the show because it makes sense. And if you guys click, you know, hey, you go out on the road with them. You know, it's an, we try to make opportunities for people, you know.
Speaking of opportunities, our connection with U.S. is now Leo Lovechild. ⁓ Phenomenal, phenomenal artist. We were so happy we could get him to stop by here from New York City. ⁓ And that's a perfect example. ⁓ Leo comes here and he has a room full of people that are digging his music, digging his new record. And we try to put some local artists with him that make sense.
A lot of times after we do that, I'll see flyers down the road of all these bands that I put together. Well, that's lifelong connections. They're going across the country together, you know. So it seems to be working, whatever we're doing.
Speaker 2 (09:47)
Yeah, it's a, you know, you guys were a highlight stop on Leo's tour. He played nine shows in a row and it started in upstate New York. He played a small festival, weaved his way down through Ohio, through Knoxville, down to Mississippi and hit some spots on the way back. But one thing that he talked about was the people. And I think that what you guys are providing is a very human experience, like a very
communal, small, intimate, but like very real thing. He said like the people were very into it, you guys were super hospitable, so I think whatever you're doing is working.
Speaker 1 (10:28)
Yeah, I'd have to agree. Me and Jeff have seen that from visiting these legendary places. went down to Muscle Shoals Studio in Alabama. Seeing that place, we went up to Motown in Detroit. that place. These places are smaller than the mothership, but they have the most gold records on the planet. mean, you can look around and see that these were just normal people that built something special.
It is not the place, it's not the location, it's not the building, it is the people. That's the lesson that we've taken apart from, you know, visiting some of these places. And it's true, you know, you can make something happen anywhere, you know, with the right people, the right attitude and being real. We didn't get into this to make a million dollars, it'd be great if we did, but, you know, we're here for the music, the artists, ⁓ and making things happen like that, you know.
Speaker 2 (11:22)
I mean, yeah, seems like, like, Jeff, in your experience, like, it comes out of a need from your son, you know? And I think that stuff like that, when it doesn't exist, it becomes like a real, ⁓ not just a communal hub, but like a real, like, magnet for like-minded people to come together, especially if there's, is there any other venues in Mansfield? There are some. ⁓ There's a local theater. Okay. I shouldn't say this, but talk about wasted space. ⁓
They have a beautiful theater, and it's not used for original live music. So there's a few around. ⁓
Speaker 1 (11:59)
There is not another original music spot.
Speaker 2 (12:02)
No, there's not. ⁓
Speaker 1 (12:04)
Not just this area, I would probably say the 50 miles surrounding this area, there's nothing ⁓ that I've run into aside from these bars and these cover bands. And most of time that's background music. I go out and I do that too, just to make some money and get out there. But there's nothing like this place. And from what we're hearing, even the cats that are coming here from Europe or from Canada or from the West Coast, they're saying there's...
There's nothing like the mothership. They make a stop every single year. you know, don't know if they're, know, flattery will get you everything, but you know, I think some of it is a little bit true maybe, so.
Speaker 2 (12:43)
I'd say it probably is. That's what's cool about what you guys, because you treat people well, I could see how as artists grow and as your venue hangs around for years, ⁓ hopefully all this continues to just grow and sustain for years, is that people will come back and take care of the little guy, or mention the little guys when they're, I'm in the same boat, I'm in southern Indiana, doing my thing. We all...
So like when I see you guys doing your thing, I'm like, man, it's inspiring that you're kind of leading your own thing. You're building your own scene, really. And you know, a lot of it is just common sense. You know, I grew up in a different generation than Nate did and that you did. And you guys have been through some shit with COVID and changes in technology and all this. And I guess me being older, I grew up just in, you do business on a handshake. Your word is your bond.
And when these people come in, we want to treat them right. You know, we went out on the road together with two bands last year, Nate. And I learned a lot that I expected to be totally different. I thought these venues would be happy to see the band show up and they would help them. But sometimes the band shows up and the owner of the venue, he don't give a shit. It's like, yeah, there's the stage.
Speaker 1 (14:00)
We're having music tonight. ⁓ my god. Yes, you know
Speaker 2 (14:04)
Why are you in this business, sir? You know, and that's not saying anything great about us. It just comes down to common sense things like, you know, this band just drove six hours from Pittsburgh. Bring them in, show them where they can pee and get a beer and a hot dog and sit by the fire. It's pretty simple. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. You're exactly right. think a lot of
I think a lot of like, especially in bigger cities, I know some people who I like personally, but at their day job, which might be working at a smaller venue in a bigger city, they have a very jaded perspective towards smaller artists, because in their own life, perhaps they didn't reach some goal that they thought was destined for them, or like they're pissed off at their own dreams not unfolding. So they take it out on younger bands versus exactly what you guys are saying.
Who doesn't love a free hot dog and a damn beer? I mean really, like these are simple, simple ass things but... Or water! Bottle of water! Yes.
Speaker 1 (15:07)
These
guys need water to survive, dear God. Again, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:10)
And you know, I count my blessings every day. I am fortunate and I've told these young bands that come through here. It's like I've got a little venue here in Mansfield and I get to see some of the greatest performances in my own little mothership with Nate On Sound and a good audience that I would have paid 100, 200 bucks over at Ticketmasters to see, you know, another band. You know, so we're real fortunate. There's so much talent.
cruising across America and around the globe and we want to raise them up and give them an opportunity and hopefully they'll hit stardom and a lot of them are. mean Leo's phenomenal. What a good kid. I I was telling Nate a minute ago, I had his CD on yesterday.
Speaker 1 (15:55)
hasn't taken his CD out of his car. And I know I'm wearing it out. I mean, it's really good songwriting. And that's just one example of ⁓ the amazing people of Stop and Buyer. It's almost mind blowing. really our little area surrounding us doesn't even quite grasp what is happening here because they've never seen anything like it.
Speaker 2 (15:57)
I'm not working in any...
Yeah. And you know, it's, was thinking about this, like thinking about talking to you guys and just looking around at your website and different things about Mansfield. And I was thinking, you know, it's so important for the entire music ecosystem. If you think about it as like a giant ecosystem where you have the biggest venues, you know, stadium tours, you have festivals, then you have mid-sized venues, but the little guys, formative...
spaces, not just for the local community, but giving an artist like Leo, who's, it's a self-funded, you know, like I helped him book it, but it was mostly him taking the reins and doing his own thing and taking his band out on the road. It's not just about like the space to play, but a place to stay that's a huge, just value add or benefit to the artist that is, it doesn't happen if you're at a mid-sized venue and
New York or something, you know, they don't have that sort of thing where you guys are offering a very almost like family thing Yeah, and it's like you're welcome to stay here Wash your clothes. Take a shower relax
Speaker 1 (17:30)
Yeah,
facilities and I tell them every time there's no... All these guys that stop by, they're like, well, is there a checkout time? No, know, re... There's no checkout time. You know, get a shower before you go back on the road. That's what's important. You know, like, recoup yourself. I know you got a 10-hour drive to the coast, you know, so just regroup with your people and then go on your merry way, you know. So, yeah, like you said, it's a huge service to people on the road and us understanding being on the road too, like...
These things take funding, these tours, there's food, there's shelter, there's basic things to survive when these guys are out on these trips. So we try to do what we can just to give them a leg up and that has paid us back a hundredfold, hospitality. And that's just coming from who we are around here. We don't expect anything in return, but it has been returned a hundredfold. And it continues to grow us.
Speaker 2 (18:04)
soon.
Yeah, it's tough.
Speaker 1 (18:31)
It's
expensive. It's gotten more and more expensive. It takes real planning and funding and these people aren't just showing up on a magic carpet. They're paying for gas and food and shelter and basic things to survive. So we try to do whatever we can when these guys are stopping by to give them a leg up and a reprieve from that mostly. And I would say that attitude towards these artists has paid us back a hundred times over.
You know, and we don't expect anything in return, but I mean, like you said, when these guys are hitting stardom, they remember exactly where we are. And we're at the top of their list to return to our little town, you know, every time. it's, it's working out for sure.
Speaker 2 (19:15)
So take me into a, like paint the picture of a good show at the mothership. what is the, what's the, how many people are there? What's the vibe? me, give me a, like paint a picture of the visualize, you know, the space.
Speaker 1 (19:30)
I'd say, you know, generally around seven o'clock, we start having a crowd show up ⁓ and they come through our walkway. They pay the door cover, get their wristband. They're welcome to go anywhere, you know, in the facility that isn't marked off for artists. And we always have bonfires going out back. We kind of have a patio area out back. Always have bonfires. We're always grilling up or we have a food truck and everybody's just hanging out talking. We don't have a single TV in this venue.
Okay, there is not one TV and guess what? Nobody else when they come here in this room is full of people. Nobody's on their phones. They are totally in the experience and that you know the the attention that they give to artists is amazing. So yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:14)
And
that gives me a lot of satisfaction to see the lack of technology, know, the screens. You we have no TVs. And I looked around the room and it's like, people aren't texting each other and they're not on their cell phones. The only thing a cell phone is being used for is some of these bands, they'll do Facebook live things. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:31)
get
stream going, get some pictures, and then they're right back in it. I love it.
Speaker 2 (20:36)
We want the artists to be close to the fans. Fans close to artists, you know, they get to mingle and get to know each other, sell some merch. And, you know, if you get anywhere between 50, 100 people in here, it's a great energetic crowd. And, you know, the bands get paid and they sell merch.
Speaker 1 (20:43)
Yes
Cool.
I know it's fun. Very laid back and yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:59)
Sorry, was just going mention having the bonfire in no TVs. It's such a, again, just like a human. I was just watching a video the other day about the best connection, the best conversations happen around campfires, bonfires, how that's like, humans have been doing that for thousands of years, sitting around a fire talking. And I just imagine if you're a fan of someone like Leo, you come to the show, you can go drink a beer with him outside by the bonfire.
Like, it's just such a unique, you know, environment versus if you're in a different area, you know. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:38)
And me and Jeff, we love going to these bigger venues. And as soon as the artist walks off the stage, he said, we got your money, now get the hell out of here. It's favorite thing. And you don't get to hang out and talk about the show or make plans for another one. It's not. It's not our favorite thing. So we're very laid back here. like you said, people come here, they get to talk to the artists and interact with them.
And some of these people, like we found out, one of our bigger artists, the Toxards, they stop by every year now. We actually had fans fly over here from England for that show two weeks ago. Holy shit. Wow. Just because of that reason, you are not gonna find, those guys are playing really big auditoriums across the country, so you're not gonna find another place where you're up close with them, interacting with them, just vibing with them, than the mothership,
I saw the ticket sales, I was like, huh, England, huh? And then, yeah, they had flown over just for that. So that's amazing. We're doing something, I guess.
Speaker 2 (22:45)
And what was amazing when you looked at the ticket sales, very few were from Mansfield, Yeah, they were from around the world, around different cities. It's like, wow, interesting. ⁓ But again, it's the people, it's not us. We just provide an environment. ⁓ The fires always are nice, like you said, hanging out. And it just came through, I guess, trial and error that... ⁓
And we realized, damn, it's cold out here. We should have a fire. Common sense. Let's build a fire. And we had a drummer one night who built a fire pit. And it's still out there. That was four or five years ago. it's just common sense.
Speaker 1 (23:25)
Yeah, we said that's a good place to put it. That'll work great. It's been there ever since.
Speaker 2 (23:30)
I mean, but isn't that like such a... Yeah, it's almost obvious as you say it. But the thing about, I think, that people get into when they enter music is there's a lot of ego and there's a lot of, want things my way, I want things to look this certain way, which of course you have to have your aesthetic, you have to have your identity, but it really seems like you guys are, I don't know, like selfless or just really about what you're doing and not about your...
or like, you know what I mean? Like, you're not about your control, you're about whatever facilitates the best experience for everybody. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:05)
100%.
I would say that's been huge and why I continue to do this. There's no egos in this room. It is about the mission and about the people. However that comes back and reflects on me or Jeff or anybody, it's all in the mission. We're not looking to change the, rewrite the wheel.
Speaker 2 (24:31)
And you know would be fun to do as we go down the path is it'd be great to find a bunch of old abandoned dentist's office or doctor's office all around the Midwest and convert them into motherships. know, it's kind of like the Hard Rock Cafe on a smaller scale, you know? Yeah, yeah. It'd be fun to be able to put that together. And you know what's fun too about here is the volunteer teamwork. You know, we've got a neighbor two doors down. The guy makes sure the place is clean, spic and span.
We got a weird old guy, Roger, that does a liquid light show. He shows up here every morning. His morning starts at 4 or 5 p.m. He'll probably walk through that door any minute.
Speaker 1 (25:09)
He's here every day, runs lights for all the bands.
Speaker 2 (25:12)
Long
gray hair, 85 years old. Yeah, he did liquid lights for Iron Butterfly and he know...
Speaker 1 (25:18)
All the acid bands and the keys, yeah. Grand lights all that. First person to be here, last person to leave. All the bands love him, he's our mascot.
Speaker 2 (25:21)
⁓ And he shows up here every day.
So isn't that like part of the experience too, like baked into the experience for somebody traveling through are the characters of your town who also gravitate towards music and like this experience, but also they contribute to the whole vibe, like to what makes it great. You know, it's cliche to say it's all about who you know, but in music industry, it is all about who you know. It's true. But what if you make great music, you got all the connections in the local scene, but your music's just sitting idly.
on DSPs like Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon, just chilling there, like a bobber floating in the middle of ocean, just lonely, just sitting there waiting on something to bite. If you want to make a bigger splash, it's time to begin partnering with the people who can help you get your music heard. Insert my friends at Symphonic Distribution. Frankly, not all digital distributors are built the same. And as a new artist, Symphonic gives you the opportunity to get started using their platform.
Get your music out there and become familiar with their tools as a paid subscriber through a starter pack. With the starter pack, you'll retain 100 % of your royalties for the low yearly fee of $19.99. But really that's just the beginning because as your project grows, so too can your connection with the team, the real people and the resources offered to you by Symphonic. ⁓ it must've been about a year and a half ago. I set up my first release through a starter pack on Symphonic on behalf of one of the artists on my label, which is Try Not Something New.
back then, and I soon realized I had some connections within the distributor. And after a few emails and an introduction through a fellow artist friend who was using Symphonic, we became a quick partner. And now we partner with them regularly on our Wally Opus releases with our client manager, Lee Griffin, who was featured on episode three of the podcast. And we've grown a connection with the rest of their marketing department who are actively pitching our music to curators from all across different DSPs like Apple, Spotify, and Amazon Music.
So if you're a new artist and you want to get involved, head to Symphonic.com and sign up for a starter pack. Using the code word, everybody else at checkout will get you 25 % off your first year. It's a little something to get you into the door and please let them know Wes sent me. Look, it's daunting to set out in pursuit of building a music career in 2025, but it becomes easier as you meet the right people. I would know I'm building all of my record label podcast and coaching service right here in Southern Indiana.
So I've had to really branch out and get my people. And perhaps your journey in finding the right people begins by joining Symphonic. Thank you to Symphonic for sponsoring this episode. And now back to the show.
The drummer, he saw Roger's picture on the wall and he comes up and goes, man, how's Roger doing? And he's really asking me is he still alive? Because he's 85 years old. And I'm like, Roger's doing great. And they ran out there, gave him a big hug. And it's like, Roger, great to see you. And yeah, we'll get Roger on this podcast someday. ⁓
Speaker 1 (28:25)
What are you talking about?
hope you got a lot of empty space on your computer. He's got to it up.
Speaker 2 (28:41)
Yeah, that's awesome. So tell me about the other side of it, the recording studio side. What's the ambition behind the recording studio side?
Speaker 1 (28:51)
Yeah,
so we're getting that up and running. That's going to be one of the projects for this winter when we're not having as many shows and artists coming through. ⁓ And really the idea with that is just to offer that as a service ⁓ that we can ⁓ sell studio time to like regional artists. But I also really wanted to be there. It'd be so important to have something where these bands on the road, you know, really don't have anywhere. Maybe they cut a song on the way here. Like they're constantly writing.
And they don't have anywhere to get these ideas out, maybe a little cell phone or something, but wouldn't it be nice that some of these artists can stop by and cut a quick demo, get it handed to them and they're back on the road, you know, just being part of the process. So that's definitely one of the visions behind that.
Speaker 2 (29:36)
Are you guys building, is it part of the actual building or is it a separate space?
Speaker 1 (29:42)
Yeah, it's part of the building and that originally was the side that it was just kind of rehearsal space before the stage was built in here. ⁓ So we have like isolation rooms back there and a drum room and a guitar room, the board and all that stuff. So yeah, it'll definitely be part of the building. Part of the, it's right across from the green room and the artist's bedrooms. So like I said, these guys can roll out of bed, ⁓ cut a demo in the morning and hang out in the green room or the patio, talk to Roger, know, cut the other demo.
Whatever, whatever works, yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:14)
Yeah, that's a great, you know, it's so, what you guys have built is so interesting because I'm a big fan of Rick Rubin. Do know who Rick Rubin is?
Speaker 1 (30:24)
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:26)
He's kind of a thought leader in creativity, I guess you would call it. one thing, I was just reading his book the other day, like for the second time, and he talked about how when a good idea arises, it can pop up in different parts of the world at the same time. What's really interesting about what you guys are doing, and I hadn't thought about this till right now, is a couple years ago, because there was a couple jam rooms in Evansville in our southern Indian area.
But we had thought about with the record label, I have a studio in my basement, but it was like, what if we got a different building and there's a rehearsal space because there's a need for that. And also a place to store your shit if you're a band. And then there's a spot to record and then there's a venue aspect to it because it just seems like a need in general for small cities that don't have that sort of offering. So it's really interesting.
that you guys have built it and it's growing and it's happening. Yeah, and you can make it happen right there, you know, in your town. You know? And, you know, another thing Nate's done terrific is build relationships with bands around the country, you know, a lot of them are in Nashville, you know, when you and Luke were going to Nashville, you know, and if we can help schedule those bands, all right, you know, tonight you're in Mansfield, tomorrow you're in Evansville next to it, you know, make their job a little easier too. ⁓
Speaker 1 (31:52)
It's discussed too, kind of a talent agency booking manager on top of another service we offer. So yeah, there's no telling how it branches out. There's a lot of good ideas floating around here. Like you said, the common ideas, that's because there's needs for all these things. It's very clear that there's needs for all this and why not put it all in building if you can make it happen? And our challenge is...
Speaker 2 (32:15)
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (32:22)
Let's get this thing self-sufficient and feeding itself and it'll keep helping artists forever is the main goal.
Speaker 2 (32:34)
You know, I think that there was a time where everybody was moving to bigger cities to express their music, express their artistry. ⁓ After small venues existed everywhere, I hear probably once every couple weeks about a spot in our city that used to exist that had shows every Friday or dances every Saturday, and none of that exists. We have bars that have bands, and we have people who are starting smaller spots that are kind of shared venue spaces.
But it seems like there's a move back to small towns, Midwest especially, where people want to set up things like this and have people come together. It seems like you guys might just be early on the wave, you know?
Speaker 1 (33:20)
Yeah, and again, know, what's, of course it has to happen. What is the alternative to not doing that, you know, $300 tickets to go see, you know, a guy who hasn't written a record in 15 years that's worth anything, you know I mean? What exactly is the alternative? Or go to the same dive bar and see the same band that you saw for the last 10 years playing the same song. There is no alternative. Like these artists need platforms. Like there is things.
being made all the time, know, people need to hear them and appreciate them and be part of that, you know, that's where it's headed for sure. That's how I feel.
Speaker 2 (33:58)
I'm curious, so when you guys went down to Muscle Shoals, what specifically about Muscle Shoals, if you can remember, was there anything specifically that you got, like you took away from that experience or you thought was really interesting? Because I've seen the documentary twice.
Speaker 1 (34:15)
I will say what was really striking for me, and we had a really good tour guide who used to work there back in its operations. like he had the stories. I wasn't ready to leave, but they had to drag me out of that place. I was going to talk to him all night. I don't care. But what was really striking for me was he was saying how the soundproofing got on the walls. This was from one of the brothers that built this place.
Speaker 2 (34:31)
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:44)
This was the foam that came around, I believe the electric meter, packaging material ⁓ that, you know, at his day job, that's what they had laying around. He's like, well, I'm going to fill my truck up with this. We'll use this as soundproofing. It just reminded me of this place, our place, you know, and it just hit me that again, this is built by, you know, not billionaires, not, you know, trillionaires. This was built by working people for a reason.
Speaker 2 (34:47)
of
Speaker 1 (35:11)
⁓ And made legendary music. I mean things that will go on forever ⁓ Hearing that story and hearing about ⁓ Also, how Bob Seeger did every contract. Yeah He said Bob Seeger Never had a signed contract with anybody. It was all a handshake And they still send royalties based on that handshake. Yeah muscle
Speaker 2 (35:32)
I was on a handshake.
Yeah, they get a couple hundred thousand dollars a year
Speaker 1 (35:40)
years later,
there's no legal anything connected to it based on that handshake and that conversation when that album was coming out. He still sends the money there. so again, just the way you treat people and do business and the respect and you know, that was also very striking. So and of course the size again, small, the it's probably about half the size of the mothership. And just seeing that I'm like, you know, it gets you thinking that
There is anything possible with, you know, don't need a stadium to make these things happen, to make good music, you know, so...
Speaker 2 (36:18)
And the stories that were told there were phenomenal. You know, from the Rolling Stones to Bob Seeger to who put out the first album was Cher. It was a total flop.
Speaker 1 (36:21)
Yeah.
Yeah, their first album was a flop and they said, well, let's try it again. Boom, instant gold record. You know, they didn't give up. Yes. So, and that's another message. It's like staying in business and staying on path long enough for the success to meet you halfway. You know, and the people who are succeeding in, I wouldn't say music, but also just our side, the business, the venue stuff, they don't stop. Or when they're having, you know, maybe they don't have the best shows, a couple, maybe they have a rough patch. They don't stop.
You know, that's the common denominator between all this is the people that succeed in the end, they keep getting back up, keep walking, know, meet the success halfway.
Speaker 2 (37:10)
You know,
it reminds me, I was thinking about this earlier about you guys. It's similar to like the comedy store in LA. I went there, I used to live in LA and I went there a few times. And that's where, you know, greats have come out of the comedy store for generations. Yes, generations. And it was, oh shit, I'm blanking on her name. Polly Shores, mom, forget her name. But she, it was like one lady who was the lady who, she was always there.
She gave you the green light to get on the stage. She gave you the red light to get the hell off. But she was like the gatekeeper, the one who set the pace and kept the thing on track. And it reminds me of like, you know, these like old restaurants, family-owned restaurants who have been around forever. There's always the core people who were there day in and day out who kept it together and gave a shit. And I think that's what like you guys portray that in your venue, you know, that like...
We're real humans, we really give a shit and you show up. And I feel like that is what most people just don't do, is just showing up for a long period of time being consistent. You guys are doing it. You know another good analogy is, have you seen the movie about CBGB in New York City? Yes, it's been a while, but I know what you're talking about. Oh my God, yeah. It's like, that's pretty much us. It's like my wife Vicky, she helps run this.
enterprise and it's like, it's almost like the Misfits, you know, we welcome everybody in, you know, we don't care if you're green, black, white, gay, straight, it doesn't matter if you're here to have a good time. you know, and the legendary music that came out of CBGB.
Speaker 1 (38:56)
Yeah, there was a need. The artist showed up when it opened, you know, and the community grew around that. There was nothing there. It was a street. It was a shell. know? ⁓ Again, another example of it's not the place, it's the people. And like you said, the consistency. The consistency is so important. They didn't close their doors when, you know...
they had 10 or 15 people show up like, well, that's it. I guess, you know, it's not working out. know, they kept going and now it's legendary. mean, that place will live on forever.
Speaker 2 (39:34)
I mean, that's what it takes, know? I was listening to Jack Ansonoff, he's a big producer now, Taylor Swift, Sabrina Carpenter, know, just massive guy. But he was in Fund, the band Fund, and before that, what was it called, like Black Train or Dark Train, I forget, but Night Train, something like that. But he talked about how when you're touring and you're a young band, you have to be...
merely delusional to keep showing up day in, day out, playing to nobody sometimes. But it's that sort of self-belief where you're out on the exterior world to focus on your vision. You know, that's what it takes. That's what the level of success takes. You've to be delusional sometimes. You're the ones setting the way, you know? You know, I've had to tell some of these young artists that how good they are.
You know, I've been around, I've seen a lot of concerts, I've seen a lot of music, and the only thing I play is the CD player and the turntable. I can't play a note. But the damn artists that come through here, and I communicate that to them, I'm like, you guys are special, you guys are really good. And a lot of that, they just need the confidence boost, you know, because they are delusional in other ways too. But it goes a long way to let them know how good they are. And don't quit, keep going.
You know, you're gonna make it. I mean, that is what even somebody like Leo, who is entrenched in the New York music scene, I think for him to get out, every time he gets out of New York, he comes back, re-vigorated, like focused on himself, not caught up in the drama of what other people think and shit. Because that really, what's funny, we've talked about this all the time, it's like, what really exists is the world in your music.
You can't get focused on whether the scene gives a shit at you or not in New York. You've been there for 10 years, know, 15 years, whatever it might be. We all, they all know you there, but getting out, getting out into the country, sharing your stuff, that's really where your fans are. That's where the people who support you live, as out and out in the rest of the country, or perhaps even the world. It's such an important thing to get out there and see yourself to other people's eyes. Yeah, and...
I could see that talking with him out by the fire that you can get to know people and you know how good they are, but you also can sense some frustration in people like, man, I've been grinding and grinding and grinding. And I get it, light's not easy. And then when they have a great show and it just opens up a whole new brain channel, they're like, I feel good about myself again. It's a good thing. So tell me what...
What are your guys' vision of the future? What do you have coming up? What are you looking forward to? What's the ambition? Paint a picture of the future. My ambition right now is I'm going to pee. I'll be right Go for it. Nate, you can go.
Speaker 1 (42:32)
I'm gonna take over. Yeah, so moving forward, mean just it's just been getting bigger and better every year. So again, we're after ⁓ bigger audiences and bigger bands and you know, just keep it keep it growing and I will say this year was the first year we got our outdoor stage So we have kind of shifted things during the hotter months to outdoors because our capacity out there is
way larger. can probably comfortably fit 500, maybe 800 people outside versus inside it's like 120 cap place. So to have that space out there also volume wise, know, some of our older crowd, it's a little too loud in here for them sometimes. So we've found when we move things outside, we get a huge response from the older crowd coming. They want to see these artists, but they want to be comfortable, you know? Yeah.
So more things outdoors next year, ⁓ start to bring in some vendors, more food trucks outside. ⁓
Speaker 2 (43:33)
500 to 800, that's a whole nother...
Speaker 1 (43:37)
Another
ball game. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And I've also found that even booking wise, I think I'm going to have an easier time booking for a 500 space versus a smaller space because some of these bands, they're like, well, at least they're agents. You you tell them 120 room and they're like, yeah, nice try. know, they're playing, these guys are playing 2000 seat rooms. So I don't, and of course, if I talk to the bands, they'll be like, well, yeah, we're on our way. We love that place. You know, that's how it works every time.
So I get stonewalled a little bit from some agents sometimes. again, it's going to be an easier sell with the bigger space ⁓ outside. they'll fill it. Some of these guys, they will absolutely fill it. And that'll be a whole other ball game. But also continue doing stuff inside and just having the different spaces available to suit the artist's needs and whatever makes sense. that's kind of what
Speaker 2 (44:31)
Even having the 500 cap outdoor space or, you know, five to 600, whatever it might be. And then having the spot to stay as well. It's still like, it's still a great thing even for a, if you're 500 cap rooms, a spot to stop on the way through the Midwest is a great little, a nice place to crash.
Speaker 1 (44:53)
Yeah, it's most of the time, especially with these bigger artists, and maybe they're touring with somebody that's like really big names, you know, but it just makes sense most of time where our location is, is central Ohio, and we're right off the highways of 71 and 30, and 30 goes the entire length of the country. Lincoln Highway. The Lincoln Highway, as Roger will tell everybody, this is the Lincoln us to San Francisco. It will take us right into downtown San Francisco.
⁓ So we get a lot of people that are traveling from either Canada to Nashville or Detroit to Nashville or New York City to Chicago or maybe Chicago to DC. I mean, we're at an intersection where there are a lot of people just passing us daily on these tours. for a lot of them, it makes sense. This is a good stop, good people, ⁓ place to stay, attentive fans.
It makes sense and we're getting some bigger names to stop in here, even though it's a smaller indoor space. So it'll be an easier sell again with the higher cap. And I said 800 only, if we can figure out the parking, we can 100 % get 800 people in. But parking is always an issue around towns. We'll see how we can solve that. Maybe we build a new parking garage and yeah, we can put Roger at the gate to take tickets.
Speaker 2 (46:17)
Throw Eddie out, get rid of Eddie. Negative neighbor that owns a shop down the road. Those damn hippies are playing music again. Well, that's great. I am, I just want to say I'm super grateful for you guys having Leo, but not even that, just doing what you guys do. think it's a special niche that you guys are filling.
And in role that you're playing in the modern music industry where artists need these sorts of venues, they need these sorts of spaces, not even just for the show, but for to connect with themselves, like you were saying, Jeff, and like to see themselves, you know, as somebody appreciated basically. Yeah, and Leo's a good example. You like I said earlier, I was listening to his whole CD while I'm out working in the yard yesterday, and his song, Kill Bob, about Bob Dylan.
It's like, holy shit, what a great song. know? That is a great, great tune. there's, you know, there's a good future for that kid. I hope he keeps doing what he's doing. He's a lovely individual, great guy. his band that came with him was phenomenal.
Speaker 1 (47:33)
Yeah, and speaking of which, how I found Leo, again, and I think this is really the future of marketing as far as, people making connections, Instagram. I found Leo because what I'm doing currently, I am watching a bunch of little or mid-level venues that I really like. I really like their tastes and who they bring in. And so I'm always keeping an eye on these venues. One of those venues is Skinny's in New York City, the Honky Tonk. Yeah.
some of the artists I've seen. And then I came across one of Leo's performances at Skinny's and I was like, ⁓ rewatch about a hundred times and I'm like, this guy ain't gonna talk to me. And he did, yeah, he respond. He's like, you know what, that sounds great. So we were so happy to get him over here. I was looking forward to that all year long. And he comes and does his solo act, which we loved. And then he says, well, I'll bring my band next time. I was like, this is gonna be great.
Again, just those little connections and I hope we have Leo coming back till the cows come home every single year. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:38)
Yeah, there's another band, I'm gonna send you guys off record. There's another band who I told about you guys, who we work with, who's been doing good this year, they're a shit ton of fun. And next year, they're playing a festival in Pennsylvania. And I was telling them, they're based here in Nitzotnanny, and I'm like, you guys could route through the mothership if you guys want to have, if you guys would be open to having them. The routing would be pretty ideal. But we'll do that stuff off the record.
Speaker 1 (49:05)
Yeah, and we get a lot of bands from Indiana, lot of bands from Fort Wayne, and Indian Elbis, and that's another thing, because we're right off of 30. If you're coming from Indiana, like it is a perfect stop for people coming from Indiana. So yeah, I look forward to sending us the material. I'd love to listen to them. I believe in your taste. So if you're working with Leo, I respect your taste.
Speaker 2 (49:30)
Let me just say, this is a total 180 from Leo, but they're
Speaker 1 (49:34)
I- I try- I try-
Speaker 2 (49:46)
Hey, thank you for listening to the show this week. Visit everybody else podcast.com to learn more about this show, including a list of past guests and previous episodes. You can find me on Instagram at West Luttrell, where I post my own work, including activities related to this show. And you can also find the show on Instagram at everybody else podcast. The show is self produced and hosted by me, West Luttrell with artwork by Ethan Douglas and music by Jim Neuer.
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