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This is a show for burnt-out fashion designers (and TDs, PDs, patternmakers and beyond) who want more flexibility while still doing work they love. As a freelance fashion designer, you can build your fashion career on your own terms. Freelancing in fashion is the only way to get freedom in your day (instead of being tied to a desk). Whether you want to earn extra money on the side, fund your fashion brand, or replace your salary, the FDGP podcast will help you get there. Listen in for actionable tips and strategies to kickstart or grow your career as a freelance fashion designer, build your confidence, and create the life you want. Hosted by $100k+ fashion freelancer Sew Heidi, the show features interviews and strategy sessions with successful freelance fashion designers from around the world who've ditched toxic fashion jobs and taken control of their own destinies. This is the only place to get REAL insights from REAL freelancers who have built REAL careers on their own terms. (Formerly the Successful Fashion Freelancer podcast.)
Heidi [00:00:00]:
Being a mom is a legit job, as a mother of a 4 year old I know. But balancing a career while doing it is a real struggle. And here's the kicker with today's guest. Conscious denim designer, Jacqueline Schumann, found herself in a sort of chicken and egg situation where she needed income to afford daycare, but she needed the time, meaning she needed the daycare, to be able to find that income as a freelancer. Through a tremendous amount of hard work, Jacqueline figured out how to find cracks in the day, in the morning, and at night, and during the hopeful nap that she didn't always get to build her freelance career. She is finally in the position where she has two great clients, and she can afford daycare. But the really cool part of Jacqueline's story that we'll get to a little bit later in the episode is her journey to freelancing in the first place. I'm gonna try to avoid any spoiler alerts, but let me just say that Jacqueline's story is one of perseverance, persistence, and sheer grit and determination to make her dream of working in fashion come true.
Heidi [00:00:55]:
She graduated from FIDM in 2015 while she was 6 months pregnant, and she was met with rejection after rejection when trying to get her first fashion design job. She was full of shame and resorted to working in retail, and the world seemed to keep working against her for years. Finally, after an insane roller coaster of a journey, she had her big break. This has been one of the most inspiring and and just deeply personal stories that I feel like we've shared on the podcast in a really, really long time. Whether you're a mom or not, if you had any level, which I think all of us can relate to, have had that continual push of, like, why isn't this working? Why isn't this working? Why isn't this working? The world is against me. If you've had any type of emotion like that during your fashion or freelance career, this is a story you need to hear. Let's get to it. What's a recent win that you're most proud of in your freelance career?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:02:02]:
I already did. I I told myself I wasn't gonna say, but I just did it. That's okay. I think the proudest thing as of right now is hearing someone say, I look at your portfolio all the time and I I use it for inspiration and reference. And I also heard I just wanted to talk to an expert, and I was like, are you talking to me? Are you talking to me?
Heidi [00:02:33]:
Wow. Tell me the context of both
Jacqueline Schumann [00:02:36]:
of those things. So the Portfolio 1, it was it's with another freelancer. She's one of your fast track students.
Heidi [00:02:46]:
K.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:02:47]:
And she just wanted to connect because she saw my name popping up everywhere because I'm commenting on everything within circle and I'm everywhere. And she just wanted to meet and connect and say hi, and kind of talk to me about where she's at and kind of what my thoughts were. And and I was like, oh, well, aren't you in Fast Track? Like, you have, like, access to Heidi. Like, you got her. You know, why do you wanna talk to me? And she was like, oh, I did I've looked at your portfolio on your website and I just I use it for inspiration because I'm kinda struggling with my portfolio and I think I was, like, trying to not be cringey and, like, tear up in that moment because in 2020, I was looking at other people's portfolios. Like, maybe I should set it up this way. Maybe I could do it this way. I really loved how they did it this way.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:03:56]:
And it just felt like to flip that around would be, like, 10 years for me.
Heidi [00:04:05]:
Wow. Wow.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:04:06]:
Like, forever. And when and she lives in New York, and I'm like, you are in the mecca. Like, you're there. Like, I how have I been to Europe twice? And I still haven't been to New York. Like, this fashion hub that I have dreamed of going to, and you're in it. You're there. Like, I would look at you and think you've got it. You're doing it.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:04:31]:
But you're asking me. I'm in the middle of Utah.
Heidi [00:04:36]:
Yeah. Like, totally not a fashion hub.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:04:39]:
No. Not in any way remotely, and I'm going to write about it on my blog. Yeah. And it just it was such a crazy moment, and I guess, to, like, piggyback on that, I had a call, I must say, about 2 weeks ago, with someone who connected me on with me on LinkedIn, and I wasn't quite sure what she exactly wanted to talk about, other than she said, you know, I'm I'm kind of getting back into conscious fashion, and I really wanted to connect with other people. And I saw you on LinkedIn, and I'm like, great. Cool. Like, I love talking to people. And the call went for an hour.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:05:24]:
So it was only scheduled to be a half hour, but it went for an hour because we both couldn't stop talking. You know, get off the call. My husband works in the same room. His office
Heidi [00:05:34]:
is right here. Behind sheet. And
Jacqueline Schumann [00:05:37]:
behind sheet wall. Yes. Behind the sheet wall. And I turned to him and I said, I think I just had a coaching call, sort of.
Heidi [00:05:50]:
Like you were the coach?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:05:52]:
Yeah. And because she just kept asking for my advice, connecting, just on like, oh, where we're at, kind of what we're doing, all this. But she just kept asking for my thoughts and, like, what I would do, you know, if I were in your shoes. And he agreed with me. He was, like, yeah. That was that was kind of a coaching call. Yeah.
Heidi [00:06:21]:
Is she the one that called you the expert?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:06:25]:
No. That that was a different gal. But Okay. So
Heidi [00:06:28]:
So it's coming at you from all angles.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:06:30]:
Yeah. It's coming at me from all angles. And not just here at my desk, but at the library. I take my son to the library on Tuesdays for Play Doh time. And it's Play Doh's Play Doh for the kids and, like, talk time for all the moms. And I kind of just started, blabbering about, you know, kind of what me and these other moms had been talking about with how hard it is being a mom. Yeah. And I just said, you know, I don't remember where I heard it, but something that really changed my life was this quote that says, you can do anything, but you can't do everything.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:07:18]:
And this this one mom, she was like, woah. I've never heard that before. And in that context, it was in motherhood.
Heidi [00:07:34]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:07:35]:
But it applies to, you know, to to anything. Because, specifically, with freelancing, you know, especially with the concept of niching down, Because you can do any of these niches that you want. Yeah. You can't do everything. You can't do them all. You'll go insane.
Heidi [00:07:56]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:07:58]:
And I walked away from Play Doh time, and I were joking, and I said, you didn't know your life was gonna change at Play Doh time on a Tuesday, did you? And she was like, no. I didn't. I, like, I never heard that before. I never thought about it. And she was like, you just changed my life.
Heidi [00:08:16]:
Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:08:18]:
Like, that's a quite the compliment.
Heidi [00:08:21]:
Yeah. Can you talk for a minute about juggling motherhood with your freelance career? Because you if I'm not mistaken, you take care of both your kids full time? And they are daughter's in school. Your daughter's in school.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:08:39]:
Okay. Yeah. She's in 2nd grade. Okay. So that takes a lot off. Yeah. A lot off of my plate. But
Heidi [00:08:53]:
Your son, you watch full time.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:08:56]:
Yeah. Yeah. I'm trying to think of how to kind of gather my thoughts and articulate it. But there was a point, a year ago. So you and I chatted on the podcast a year ago, March 2023.
Heidi [00:09:10]:
Yeah. On a coaching call.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:09:11]:
Yeah. Yeah. So and that was a strategy session. And at that part at that point, we had to make other arrangements for our son for me to, do the podcast with you. And I remember one of the biggest things that I was working towards was getting projects just so we could afford a little bit of daycare Mhmm. To allow time to work, because it just wasn't it it was almost like I was the definition of working harder, but not working smarter. It was, like, trying to work so hard in every little crack of the day, and and I still do that, but in a different way now. Oh, I wanna
Heidi [00:09:52]:
hear about that.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:09:53]:
Yeah. I know. It's like, oh, what's this big secret? Before it was like, okay. So hopefully, he's gonna nap for 2 hours. And if that didn't happen, my expectations were not met, and it just sucked. It was so hard. I was working so hard, but I just wasn't working smarter, and I wasn't being realistic with what my life is, and what I've chosen for my life. Life is and what I've chosen for my life.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:10:30]:
And because many people have pointed out to me, oh, man. You're gonna have kids? Like, oh, your career is gonna take a back seat. And I'm like, well, yeah. If you wanna have children and be, you know, somewhat of a good parent, you know, your career is gonna take a back seat because both of those things take up so much time. Yeah. And they compete a lot of the times. So we had my husband and I talked about, you know, what would be the threshold of projects coming in to be able to move to a day care situation. And I finally got those projects which was huge.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:11:17]:
And I was like, okay, I guess we can start looking at daycare. And thankfully, we found one that's very affordable, and it's it's like a 2 minute drive. And he's only there 2 days out of the week. Okay. And it's only 4 hours each day. So I take him Mondays Wednesdays. And during that time, it's like, I'm really I'm working. Like, I am in the zone.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:11:43]:
And the days that he's not working or that the days that he's not at daycare, I don't work as much. And Yeah. It was a lot of, like, kind of acceptance, because I think I was, like, I want a family, but I also want a career, like, how do those intertwine? Because both require such high demands, and I was just, I was fighting it so hard, because I was trying so hard to be seen, because I felt really invisible as a mom. Oh, interesting. Yeah. I know, I know I'm not the only one. I know so many moms out there feel invisible because we're doing this incredibly taxing job, and we're not getting paid for it. It's the strangest concept ever, like, it's the biggest sacrifice, but it's, it's so worth it, but you're not gonna get paid, but it'll, like, yeah, it's so complicated.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:12:54]:
And I don't know. Does that I don't know if I feel like I answered your question.
Heidi [00:13:00]:
I mean, I still have some more curiosities like you were saying. I mean, first of all, huge congrats because I know that I've heard you talk about the juggle of, like, it's the chicken and egg. Right? Like, how do I find the time to build my career versus finding the money to get a little bit of daycare to find the time. Right? Yeah. And I know that that was a juggle for a bit for you, and so I didn't know you got those 8 hours a week, which is amazing. Congrats. That's a huge, huge win.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:13:33]:
Thank you. That's huge.
Heidi [00:13:34]:
Also, you found some affordable day care. That's really exciting.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:13:36]:
I mean, isn't that the biggest surprise? Of it all? Yes.
Heidi [00:13:43]:
So how old is your son too, by the way? Just so for people to
Jacqueline Schumann [00:13:46]:
relate to. Actually, his birthday is on Thursday. He'll be 3 this week.
Heidi [00:13:51]:
He'll be 3. Okay. Alright. So definitely, that's a very hands on age.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:13:58]:
Yes. It's almost 4. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He turned 4. I I was trying to think back of, like, how old he is, but I, it's almost like more hands on than when he was a baby because Yeah. I was joining coaching calls while I was nursing him Totally.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:14:15]:
Pulling him up my desk.
Heidi [00:14:16]:
Yeah. And, like,
Jacqueline Schumann [00:14:18]:
you think that's hands on? No. It's hands on when, like, flour is dumped on the floor, like, water is all over the kitchen for some unknown reason, Like, race cars are everywhere. The dog hasn't been fed. Like Yeah.
Heidi [00:14:32]:
It's Agree.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:14:34]:
Yeah. It's just a game of, like, almost not being phased by craziness. Like Yeah. You really just gotta roll with the punches. And as far as building that bridge to working while having kids, it's almost like, just like what Jade said, like, choose your hard. Like, am I going to choose the hard of going to work full time, 9 to 5, and dropping them off at day care for 40 hours a week? Yeah. And only seeing them after at night when it's dinner, bath, bedtime.
Heidi [00:15:14]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:15:14]:
And then go to bed before you're exhausted. Yeah. Or squeezing in an email while I'm at the park or bringing my tablet to McDonald's to let him play at the play place.
Heidi [00:15:27]:
At the gym. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:15:28]:
Yeah. And there was a huge learning curve. But I definitely and I I'm always learning. I'm not saying I'm like, I have found the answer to all with working from home with kids.
Heidi [00:15:44]:
I don't really there is ever the final answer.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:15:47]:
Yeah. Yeah. It's always it's ever changing, and there's never a final answer because they never stay the same age for forever. They're Yeah. And their needs change. So, you know, 2 years ago, I was I had the the bop it and I'd scoot up to my desk, get a nurse him while I'm on the coaching calls. And, you know, I but now it's it's like, you know, just an email here or an email here. And I on the days he's not at daycare, we go in the car and drive around, and he'll fall asleep in the car, and then I transfer him from the car to his bed, and I get some work done during his
Heidi [00:16:28]:
nap. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:16:29]:
And if he doesn't nap, I did I'm not even phased by it anymore. I'm, like, okay. Well, I'll pick that up when he goes to bed tonight. Tonight. And there's not that fight of, why didn't he nap? I could've gotten this done
Heidi [00:16:42]:
because I know that
Jacqueline Schumann [00:16:46]:
feeling. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's expectation management.
Heidi [00:16:51]:
Totally. So it sounds like it was more an internal mindset shift where you were just like, it's gonna be what it's gonna be. And if the nap doesn't happen, I could get totally, like, thrown off my rocker and just lose my s h I t internally or maybe sometimes externally or no big. I'll finish it tonight after bed or after bedtime or get up early and exactly in the morning. Okay.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:17:18]:
Yeah. Yeah, and I will say you know, everyone's situation is different and it's gotten way easier for me because my husband actually changed jobs. And now, you know, he's been working from home since, like, fall of last year. And, you know, I had a call the other day, and was trying to get him in the car, so that he would fall asleep in the car for his nap, but it wasn't happening. And I just asked my husband to go take him for a drive. So I hop on that call, like
Heidi [00:17:53]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:17:54]:
I have a lot more support, and his job is much more flexible now. So
Heidi [00:17:59]:
Okay. That's huge.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:18:00]:
And I know that's not the case for everyone. So Yeah. It just depends on your situation. But it definitely has been a lot easier since he's were I mean, since he's worked from home.
Heidi [00:18:10]:
Okay. So that's been I know because we're recording Where Are We March. So that's been about 6 months or so he's been from home.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:18:17]:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. And, like, I take calls at the there we have a tiny gym at the town home, complex, and Okay. I've taken calls there too, because they have, like, a kid's area. And it's, yeah, it's a lot of expectation management and rolling with the punches. Totally.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:18:42]:
Totally. So
Heidi [00:18:46]:
and I think sometimes, at least, what I've learned from myself. So I don't wanna put words in your mouth. But, like, understanding that, like, you're not ever gonna maybe have or it's gonna be a lot harder to have that perfect environment with that perfect big chunk of time to, like, sit down and really focus. And you're like, you know what? I gotta get this call done. It's not ideal, but we're gonna go to the play center in the gym, and you're gonna play, and I'm gonna do this call in the background. And if he comes over and, like, screams in the call, like, hopefully, you've got an understanding client. And it's funny because I know Connie Bourgeois, one one of our students who she's chatted about this specific thing. She go she's got a daughter who I think she's 2 or 3 now.
Heidi [00:19:27]:
Maybe same age as your son. And she's like, sometimes my daughter's on my lap during calls with clients. She's got a $1,000,000 agency for anyone listening. This is like the right situation. And she's like, I have my daughter sitting on my lap sometimes during calls. And if clients don't like that, then maybe they're not the client for me because I put my family first. And, yes, I'm a working mom, but also like sometimes there's this juggle in this balance. And so I think that that's, you know, a really interesting opportunity that you can open up for yourself as a mom getting to To some extent at some point like really choose your clients And if they're not working with your kid if they if that doesn't work for them, maybe your kid in the background sometimes, then and obviously, there's a point where it's, like, so insanely, Right.
Heidi [00:20:14]:
They gotta leave. There's a boundary where, like, okay. What is what can we tolerate with a little kiddo playing in the background or something? Right? But, like, at some point, people just kind of understand that, like, these are sometimes the logistics of life. Oh, exactly. Exactly. And I'm with
Jacqueline Schumann [00:20:30]:
my first big denim project, the 2 clients, one of them is a mom. And we I was in a meeting, and my daughter came in the room, and, like, my heart kind of, like, skipped, because it was the first time either of them had come in while I was in a meeting with a client, and Yeah. That was when my husband was still, at his other job, not not working from home, when he was in the office, and I I was so nervous, and I said, oh, I'm so sorry, and then helped her with whatever she needed. And they were totally fine about it. They were like, oh, don't even worry. They're like, I mean, haven't we all been there with COVID and Zoom? And I I was like, yeah. Like, I just ran with it. I was like, yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:21:23]:
Totally. It's like, I was so nervous. Sweating over here. Oh, yeah. I was sweating for sure, but I was like, way more comfortable after that point, and some of the other clients, like, they had overheard, you know, our toddler screaming or whatever for a minute, and while I went in the other room, and they were I don't know. They just didn't care. And, like, it's I don't know. It's just life and, you know, they were like, oh, yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:21:57]:
That is, like, no worries. And
Heidi [00:21:59]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:22:00]:
I, you know, when I was nursing our son when he was a baby, I didn't really care to come on the coaching calls while I was nursing and, you know, I covered up to where I was comfortable, but it's, like, the this is what we're doing. This is life.
Heidi [00:22:17]:
Mhmm. Totally. It's amazing. I'm super excited to hear this. Tell us quickly, because we didn't get to this yet. Like, what's your backstory in fashion? Where did you where do where do you come from? What was the start of all this?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:22:35]:
How much time do we have? I'll try to condense it as much as I can. So I applied to FIDM in California. It's the Fashion Institute of Design and Merchandising. And I genuinely didn't think I was gonna get in. I was like, this is a Hail Mary. I was like, I don't I don't know if I'm gonna get in. And it that feeling was mainly because I just I don't know. I never was good at hand sketching or drawing.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:23:08]:
Mhmm. But I with the, you know, brief that they gave me for the project, I I still have it. It's in a box in the garage, but I just made kind of a collage and I got accepted. And my whole time at FIT,
Heidi [00:23:26]:
When was this? When did you apply when did you start?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:23:29]:
So I went 2013 to 2015. Okay. So now I feel old, but it's, like, been 10 years. But every project at FIDM, I either Wow. Yeah. Yeah. So opposite. The instructors were like, oh, I thought you were into denim.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:23:59]:
You're gonna do this project on bridal wear? I'm like, yeah. Well, I redesigned my prom dress and turned it into my wedding dress, and that's kind of where that interest started. And so, even though they're just so opposite, I really loved both, and the denim because, I mean, it's the most iconic fabric ever. Like, I mean, you can't argue with that. And, so, I wasn't sure kind of what I wanted to do, but while I was at FIDEM, they offered, what's called a denim tour, and it was this 3 day event where they took you around to different brands and manufacturers in LA, and it was kind of, like, you know, here's behind the scenes, but also, you know, maybe would you wanna work for them, some of the different brands there. And I was like, field trips, sign me up. I, you know, get out of the classroom, get off of the computer, go and see these brands, see behind the scenes, and I was like, this is the coolest thing ever. Like, it's not every day you get to go and see how jeans are made Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:25:14]:
Or how denim is put together. And so I I loved it, but, it must have been, like, the last day of the tour. We got to a wash house, and they were applying all the finishings to the jeans, and I remember thinking, like, I mean, I wouldn't wanna work here, like, standing there all day with goggles on, and All the chemicals and stuff. All the chemicals. Yeah. And face masks. I mean, we all know, like, what it's like to wear face masks now.
Heidi [00:25:57]:
Was COVID.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:25:58]:
But then there was COVID 10 years later. But, it I don't know. You can look up pictures on the Internet and everyone thinks, like, I wouldn't wanna be hunched over a sewing machine for 12 hours. But when you go to these places, at least for me, I was partly, like, this is so cool to see. But then the finishing stages, I was, like, this cannot be a great job for these people. Like, whether it was the goggles with the, the face mask and the monkey wash. So monkey wash is the nickname for potassium permanganate. That's the chemical that the main chemical that used to be used less than 10 years ago for the fading effects for genes.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:26:48]:
And it's just, like, heavy, kind of muddy, dirty looking chemical. And if you work around it for long enough, it can cause cancer, it can cause carcinogenic effects. Yeah. And I didn't know that at the time. We were just walking through, you know, me and a bunch of other students, and, it wasn't just that. It was, like, the sandblasting, which is now almost illegal. There are still some denim manufacturers that do it, but it's literally sandblasting. So there's sand in this, like a device.
Heidi [00:27:31]:
Type of thing.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:27:33]:
And they're spraying it at the jeans, and it can cause some of the same effects as the monkey wash. And, it's also, like, you have to wear all the protective gear. I mean, like, who wants to wear that for 8 hours a day, 5 days a week? And then just the manual labor of sanding to get the distress in and all of that. But at the time, like, I was bothered by it, but I was like, I guess this is just how they do it. Like Yeah. Coming from a very, like, rookie beginner novice, like, who am I to question this?
Heidi [00:28:14]:
Sure. Sure.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:28:15]:
To learn. You know? I I wasn't thinking about stepping into that mindset of, like, questioning it, because I was more comfortable with, I'm a student. I'm here to learn. I can't question their methods. They know what they're doing. Totally. Type of mindset. So after that, I I'm trying to gather my thoughts here.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:28:43]:
I wasn't sure if I wanted to go into denim or bridal wear, but it wasn't really kind of a choice. Because in fashion school, they don't really teach to niche down. It's just like, yeah, wherever you wanna work in whatever, you know, company or category, just whatever you're interested in. I just wanted to get a job. I just Yeah. I was, like, okay. I'm ready. I I swear, it was, like, briefcase, like, I am ready to work, like Put me in.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:29:16]:
Put me in. I'm so excited. And, the timing with everything, gosh, I look back and I'm like, and we really could have timed that better, but at the same time, I do feel like everything happens for a reason. And I was 6 months pregnant at graduation.
Heidi [00:29:37]:
Okay.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:29:38]:
And, you know, at graduation, you're going on interviews during that time, you're looking for a job, showing your portfolio, and I must have gone on maybe 12 to 15 interviews within 2 weeks. And for me, that looked like an hour and a half train ride, walking, subway, and I was 6 months pregnant, carrying my portfolio.
Heidi [00:30:04]:
Where was this? This was not in Utah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:30:06]:
This was in LA. Oh, in LA. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So I started at the Fidham Orange County campus, and then my 2nd year was at the Fidham LA campus. Okay. And we we couldn't afford to live in LA, and Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:30:21]:
We really didn't care for the area anyway. So we lived, over an hour away. So I was coming in. I was taking the Metrolink and the subway just, you know, like I don't know what I was thinking. I was just like, yeah, this will work out. Right? This will be fine. And because all I wanted was I just wanted a job. I just wanted to work in the industry.
Heidi [00:30:47]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:30:47]:
It was a dream for me, and it was just a dream to be accepted into Fiddim. So I I went on so many interviews, and, I mean, at a certain point, you can't hide the pregnant stomach. Like, I don't know. 7 months along and Yeah. Nobody wants to hire the pregnant girl. Yeah.
Heidi [00:31:11]:
So you didn't get a job?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:31:12]:
I didn't get a job. I even, I tried to schedule the interviews, like, as many as I could fit in a day because the commute was so far for me. Mhmm. And but there, I remember, I I don't know how I could ever forget this, but there was one, it was the only one I could line up for that day, and I was so excited for it, and I got up early because, I mean, the commute was so far. And I rode the train, I took the subway, I walked to the office in downtown LA, and, you know, 7 months pregnant with my portfolio. And I chose to wear high heels. I don't know why I did that.
Heidi [00:31:53]:
But Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:31:56]:
I I got to the office where the interview was at, and, no one showed up.
Heidi [00:32:03]:
They ghosted you.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:32:04]:
Yeah. They ghosted me, which is so much worse in person. Oh, that's horrendous. Yeah. Yeah. And, I stood there waiting for over an hour, and I was so worried that if I just sat down on the floor in the hallway that they would come walking in and I would just be sitting there like, hold on. Let me get up here. My gigantic pregnant stomach and Yeah.
Heidi [00:32:33]:
Oh my god.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:32:35]:
-Yeah, so, so the guy never showed up, and I ended up leaving after, I wanna say, maybe like an hour and a half, and I walked back to Fiddim, and I walked into the career center, because I had talked with the lady before, and she was like, oh, let me know how it goes. And she said, oh, you're back so soon. How like, how did it go? And I just said, it didn't. And she was so, like, furious for me. She emailed the guy, because the job posting had come through the career center. Yeah. And she said, you know, an alumni of ours, you know, tried to have this interview with you and you didn't show up. You know, we're going to take you off our list, you know, etcetera.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:33:20]:
And I think that was kind of the, like, it just hit me so hard, and I had spent a whole day just getting there. Yeah. And it was almost like the universe or, I don't know, god or who, you know, however you wanna think about it, just kind of telling me, like, either this isn't gonna work out or something different maybe is in your path or, you know, is gonna happen for you. And I oh, my gosh. I look back and I'm just like, why were we thinking? But we were just I don't know. We were just we were young, we were early twenties, and we're starting a family, and eventually, it got to the point where, we couldn't afford to live where we were living at. And, I had a lot of stuff going on with my family, and so we decided to move back to Utah, and that really was kind of the worst years for me as far as adulthood because, a lot of really hard things happened in my family, and it was almost just, like, a mixture of grief and, like, embarrassment because all my friends were, like, oh my gosh. She's doing it.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:34:54]:
Like, she went to fashion school. They moved out of Utah. They moved to California. Like, she's doing it. Oh, she moved back to Utah to be a stay at home mom?
Heidi [00:35:06]:
Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:35:07]:
It was like everything fell apart. And, you know, there's there's a lot more to the story that I'm leaving out because I just I'm not gonna be able to get through it. But I, I don't know, I was doing everything I could to find that part of myself again. And so eventually, it got to the point where I was like, I'm just gonna go back to the mall. So and I had worked at, I I had I worked so many retail jobs, in Utah and in California. And Mhmm. So I went back to the mall and just worked retail for a bit, and that helped me just get in a better head space, and get out of the house, and, like, come back to this world that I really fell in love with even though it was just the mall.
Heidi [00:36:02]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:36:04]:
And when I really think about it, there was so I was carrying so much shame of, like, my gosh. She went to fashion school. Are you a fashion designer now? And I'm like, I just work at the mall. Like Like, so embarrassed for where I was at in my life when I was grappling with this fight between reality and the universe and, like, I put all this out here and this is what I wanna do and this is what I'm trying to be and this is who I want to be, but life happened and I'm back here and I I don't understand why and, don't know. I feel like so many people get to that point in their life because something happened, and I just I didn't know how to deal with it. And I so I just went back to the mall. And
Heidi [00:37:01]:
eventually we at in time? Like, when did like, your daughter's born, your son is
Jacqueline Schumann [00:37:08]:
not in
Heidi [00:37:08]:
the picture yet. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:37:09]:
He wasn't yeah. He wasn't born yet. So thank you for asking, because I when I'm listening to your podcast with other people, I'm like, wait. Hold on. Where in time are we? We? And I forget. You graduated in 2015. You were 6 7 months pregnant. Didn't get
Heidi [00:37:20]:
a job. Moved back to Utah. You're working retail. Like 2017. Okay. So your daughter's, like, 4 34?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:37:33]:
No. So she was born September of 25.
Heidi [00:37:36]:
I'm sorry. 15. 2 years.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:37:38]:
2 Yeah. Yeah. So she's like 22 years old. And so at that time, we were living with family, and, my family was watching her while my husband was at work and while I had my my evening shifts at the mall. Okay. And, one of those nights, my husband and I were just talking, and he said, you know, I I think I know someone at, like, a custom suit company. I know it's not what you wanna do, but, I don't know. Maybe it could lead to something.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:38:09]:
Maybe just meet up with them. And eventually, that led to me working as an intern for this start up custom suit company, here in Utah. And I could say a lot about it, but eventually, it taught me that it taught me how much I value myself and my time because it was unpaid. And I was gonna ask. Yeah. Which is is so notorious for fashion. Come work for us for free. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:38:52]:
Yeah. It's gonna be so fun. And, so eventually, it got to the point where my husband and I were talking about it, and he was like, I don't think they're gonna pay you anytime soon. And we were at the end financially with, like, we need more income or we're gonna have to move back in with family. And so I just had to tell them, you know, like, thank you for the experience, but unless you're going to actually pay me, I have to move on. And it was another great way to get myself back into the industry in a really interesting way, because I actually kind of married the talents of Suits with bridal, and taking that bridal experience. But at the end of the day, they weren't paying me, so I had to leave. And I actually ended up at a hotel, which I know this story is, like, all over the place, but I ended up at a hotel and that, like, that's just the job I got.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:40:06]:
And it was another point of embarrassment and game, Especially, on my first day, when I was meeting, my my new coworkers, and I was just getting to know this girl, and she was like, oh, wait. You went to fashion school? Oh. What are you doing here? Yeah. Oh, gosh. Another, like, slap to the heart. Yeah. Yeah. And I had gotten a little more resilient at that point, but it would it was still it was still man kind of a knife to the heart.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:40:45]:
And I was I think I just said something like, you know, I don't know either, but I'm here and this is what this is where I need to be right now, I guess. Because at that point, it was a matter of whether we would be able to pay rent or not.
Heidi [00:41:02]:
Yeah. You need the income.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:41:04]:
Yeah. We just I we just need the income, and that job turned into me being on the phones, answering questions for guests into being, ambassador. And that position was handling high profile guests for the hotel, and it brought my confidence, like, through the roof, because they saw me on the phones, and eventually they were just, like, you're, like, really good at talking to people. Have you ever thought about applying for this? And I so I applied for that night. I got the, got the ambassador position, and I had the most fun at a job I've ever had for something that I didn't even wanna do. That's amazing. Oh my god.
Heidi [00:41:56]:
How wild is that?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:41:57]:
Oh, it was crazy. I I didn't expect it. I just it was, like, another death to my career that turned into, like, I don't know, just the craziest fun stuff. I was setting up rooms for people that were gonna propose to their someone special.
Heidi [00:42:14]:
Oh, yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:42:15]:
New flowers in rooms and balloons and looking over contracts for celebrities that would come in, and their room needed to be exactly to their specifications. And, yeah. I mean, I had so much fun, but, like, eventually, it had it was someone in the sales department. We were making our rounds through the hotel, and he said, you know, you're really good at this. Have you ever thought about a career in hospitality? And I was like, oh my gosh. This is how it happens. Oh, no. This is where my dreams go to die.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:42:54]:
Yeah. Kind of that moment of, you know, when you hear people, and they if they're talking about regrets in their life, and they're like, I wish I would've just gone for it. Totally. Yeah. With x y z. And it just set me over the edge. I was, like, oh my gosh. I'm getting too comfortable.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:43:16]:
Like, I know in my bones this isn't what I wanna do for a career. I think it's time I start putting my foot out there again. And it was almost like, yeah, in fashion, and it was almost like I was sitting on a boat about to dip my toe into shark infested waters, like, waiting for a shark to
Heidi [00:43:38]:
come Wow. Amy. Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:43:42]:
But that person saying that to me really pushed me into going for it again. So and at that time, that was the year that I found you. And I was watching, Zoe Hong, all of her YouTube videos, and then I saw the video that you guys did together. Yeah. And I was like, who is this woman? She is talking about freelancing in fashion. I was like, that is not even a thing. I went to fashion school. I would know.
Heidi [00:44:16]:
Like Oh my god. How funny. I never knew that was your mindset at the moment in time.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:44:21]:
Yeah.
Heidi [00:44:22]:
I know you saw the Zoe Hong video. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:44:24]:
Yeah. Yeah. And so, eventually, I when I would go up, so part of one of the tasks of the ambassador position at the hotel was to go and make sure that the room was absolutely perfect before the, before the guest would come in. And I got better Wi Fi signal up there than down on the near the phones. So and I had to take my phone everywhere with me for that job anyway. So, you know, I've got a toothbrush and a rag in one hand. I'm scrubbing down baseboards, And I've got you on YouTube. And I was watching all of your content and I was, like, okay.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:45:02]:
I was, like, vetting you mentally. I'm like, alright. She I think she knows what she's talking about. Okay. Like, next video. And I'm, like, scrubbing the baseboards, listening to make sure that nobody was walking in the room, and, you know, dusting the light fixtures Oh my god. Videos. And it didn't take long to earn, like, for you to earn my trust, because I was like, alright.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:45:39]:
She knows what she's talking about. Like, okay. And so I started talking about you to my husband, and I was, like, she has this course. I know it's, like, a little bit out of budget, but I think that this could work for me. Because at that time, we had already tried moving back to California for me to have a job there.
Heidi [00:45:58]:
Oh, right. Because you're not you're like, I'm not gonna find something in Utah, so
Jacqueline Schumann [00:46:01]:
we have to move. Exactly. Wow. Yeah. We even got to the point where we sat down with my family, and we said, so we're moving back to California.
Heidi [00:46:12]:
Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:46:13]:
And they were they were devastated. Our daughter was the first grandbaby in the whole family, and so it just crushed my mom, but, ultimately, she was like, I want what's best for you, and if that's what's best for you guys, then you have my full support. And Yeah. I even, I took a trip down to California, and I went on more interviews.
Heidi [00:46:44]:
Wow. You were like, you were going for it.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:46:46]:
Oh, I was really going for it. On my resume and my application, I put my best friend's address to make it look like we were already living there. So that that wasn't another hurdle for that in October. Oh my gosh. And I, you know, cover letter after cover letter, making sure the address was right, and all of these little things, because I wasn't ready to give up yet. So, I had, you know, I went on interviews, and they they didn't work out. And so we stayed here. I got the job at the hotel, and, I when I found you, I started I was like, okay, I'm gonna put my foot back out there.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:47:33]:
I guess it's possible to freelance in fashion. This lady says so, and she looks pretty credible, so I guess I'll go for it. So we, so I started simultaneously applying to fashion related jobs while thinking about pursuing freelancing. Okay. And also, at the same time, I was doing more deep dives just on myself, like, by myself at night on the Internet, like, looking at brands that were in Utah or, like, anything. Something. Yeah. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:48:13]:
Something. And that was also when I kinda started to find out more about the fashion industry that I wasn't taught at FIDM. Because at that point, I was, like, okay. There's now 2 things that Fidham did not talk about that I'm now finding out. 1 is freelancing. The other, this horrible depressing side of fashion that is just chemicals and waste and more waste and unsold stock that sits there forever, that no one's gonna wear, that just goes to a landfill. Like, it was so much information within a few months of time that I really wasn't sure what I wanted to do, but I did get to a point of like, am I really gonna be a part of this industry? Like, how can I learn about all this and know it, and then, like, just go keep making it? Yeah. Like, I was, like, I maybe I just shouldn't do this.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:49:23]:
And because I I mean, we all know, like, the landfills are horrible, and then they're a huge problem. But it just very much feels like problem that, like, well, I can't do anything about it. So whatever. Just
Heidi [00:49:35]:
move on. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:49:36]:
Yeah. I'll just move on. I'm just, I'll go make dinner. You know? And so I was I was doing a lot of things at the same time. I was looking at you and freelancing. I was looking at all of the problems of the fashion industry that I was just now finding out about because FITM never said anything. And also trying to apply for jobs. And I ended up finding one at a outdoor company here in Utah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:50:09]:
Okay. But it was for, like, a photo shoot assistant job. And I was, like, close enough. Great. I'll take it. Anything. So I interviewed, I applied, they accepted me. I started, and then 3 weeks later, I got laid off because COVID happened.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:50:29]:
Oh. It's like the never ending train crash.
Heidi [00:50:37]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:50:38]:
So, at that point, I I wanna say I had already bought your course, and I was just kinda leaving it in the background. So I was like, oh, I got this job. Like, okay. I'll do this. Mhmm. And then I remember some coworkers just, you know, hush-hush. Like, my gosh. They're saying something is coming.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:51:02]:
Like, they're they're doing something, but it's over here. Like, we might get laid off. They were talking about COVID. And I was like, oh, do you, like, do you think we're gonna be laid off? And they were, like, yeah. We just got hired. We're the first to go. And sure enough, like, the next day, they let all of us new folks go. And I was like, okay.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:51:24]:
This is a sign from God that I am going to take this freelancing path and this is the time to do it because nothing else is really working out. So that's when I really dove in and I did take some breaks because we had that's when we had our son. We had him in 2021, and so it wasn't, like, full force, 8 hours a day or anything.
Heidi [00:51:49]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:51:49]:
But, that's a very long winded way of saying how I found you and and freelancing
Heidi [00:51:57]:
Yeah, and you're in it I'm in it clients. You're doing it
Jacqueline Schumann [00:52:04]:
Like, you're doing
Heidi [00:52:05]:
it on your own terms. Yeah. Holy cow. Interesting. Is it feel how does it feel? Yeah?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:52:13]:
It feels just kind of unreal, like and I I do have to be careful because I find myself on this never ending seesaw of, like, oh my gosh, I can't believe I'm doing it. This is so great to, there's people doing so many other big things. They have more followers. They have, I don't know, they have more people. They're they have more clients. Mhmm. Why should I be excited about this? I I keep straddling that seesaw of, like, being super excited and be really, you know, being proud and happy to, like, oh, man. Come on.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:53:00]:
You haven't done that much yet. Like, you'll be proud when you do, or this, or this. And so I always have to kind of check myself and, come back to a healthy place of, no, this is what I wanted. This is what I've worked so hard for.
Heidi [00:53:19]:
So hard. I had no idea all the nuances of your story. Like, I got chills multiple times. I had no when when you're like, I showed up to that interview and the guy didn't come, I was like, did you burst into tears? Because I'm about to burst into tears. Just listening to you, especially 7 months pregnant, you're, like, all emotional and
Jacqueline Schumann [00:53:38]:
Oh, yeah.
Heidi [00:53:39]:
My gosh. Like, so many moments. Like, so so much struggle.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:53:44]:
Yeah. Yeah. And I I wanna be careful with time because, like, I I could talk for hours about this, but I do feel like it's so important to just touch on these little nuances and these little moments because those are the moments that made up my day, which made up my week, which made up my life at the time, and, yeah, that was a horrible day. I commuted for 2 hours to get to that interview, which there was no place to sit. I stood for an hour and a half, you know, arguably, I should have just wore flats, but I stood for an hour and a half, 7 months pregnant with my portfolio, waiting for someone to open that door, and no one ever came. And it's almost like it was a metaphor for my wife, as in, like, no one ever opened that door for me, so I had to open it for myself.
Heidi [00:54:45]:
Oh, yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:54:48]:
I just keep doing it now. Like, I'm there was one coaching call, I really felt like I connected with another freelancer, and so I got her number, texted her, we started a call, we added a few others now. I have a weekly call with the other girls, and we're, like, pretty much best friends at this point. And Oh, my gosh. There's another group that I am talking with, and they're like, Yeah, like, so did Hailee ask you to start these groups? And I was like, No. I just started them. You're opening the door. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:55:25]:
I'm like, the door isn't being opened for whatever reason, and I can look back in 20 years and say you know, speculate on everything and say, like, I think that happened for that reason, or maybe that happened for that reason. And and I think it did, and, like, there's things that I wish didn't happen. Like, yeah, I wish I just got a job, but now, like, I kind of am glad that I never got that job, because I would have seen how the industry works, just traditionally, and maybe I wouldn't have been able to think outside the box, And Yeah. My whole approach now is that I only work with brands that meet these level of standards for me, And some people call that sustainable fashion. Some people call it ethical fashion. I call it conscious fashion. Because conscious is, like, the umbrella for all these different terms. But, like, I didn't see anyone offering services for conscious fashion, specifically in denim.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:56:25]:
Mhmm. And I was, like, well, this is how I feel about it, and this is what I found out about it. So I'll just do it.
Heidi [00:56:35]:
I'm gonna open that door, damn it.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:56:37]:
Yeah. Just open the door, and it's I don't know, like, you either just stand there in the hallway, and no one opens doors for you, or you go find another door and open
Heidi [00:56:51]:
it yourself. Oh my gosh. What a note to end on, Jacqueline. Oh, wow. Did you have that in your head going into this conversation?
Jacqueline Schumann [00:57:03]:
Not at all. Okay.
Heidi [00:57:05]:
And then I randomly brought up the 7 month interview the 7 month pregnant interview when we got ghosted right at the end because I was like, that moment was, like, so heartbreaking for me. Yeah. I love that. A little birdie just told me that you started a, a coffee chat inside fast for parents freelance parents.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:57:27]:
Yes. Open that door. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Build a school community. Yeah. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:57:33]:
I'm just gonna open it because, so many people see being a parent with a career as just the most awful thing, like, you just have to juggle so much, it's so negative, and it's very hard, yes, it is very, very hard, but you have to choose your hard. Like
Heidi [00:57:58]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:57:58]:
If you want to do, I don't know, anything worth doing in life. It's it's gonna be hard, and it's it's so rewarding. And so I just I was just like, well, wait, why isn't there a coffee chat specifically for parents? Because we face unique challenges, and I added opportunities. Because I've I've learned that there are opportunities to it. I mean, I learned that from you when you pointed out that having kids, it's, you know, it kinda forces you to just get it done and get it good enough. Uh-huh. And I needed that lesson because I was taking my time
Heidi [00:58:41]:
Yeah, I was like not that time anymore.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:58:44]:
Yeah, it's it's not an option and I think just the last thing I'll say is, I know everyone is not going to be able to relate to this fully because it's it's such a specific, experience, but I and it may sound like it's coming from left field, but I promise it relates. With our son, I I had planned an epidural and that's not what happened. My water broke. He was born 45 minutes later and Yeah. And in the moments of giving birth, I I was so exhausted I got to the point where I I mentally was just thinking there's no way I can do this. Like, I cannot do this. And this one nurse that was standing right next to me, she was holding my hand, and she looked me right in the eye, and she said, you have to push into the pain. Oh.
Jacqueline Schumann [00:59:49]:
And I I do I I was like, oh, I have to physically push while I'm having the contraction into the pain, which is what I was avoiding because it hurts so badly. And she said that in context to, you know, giving birth, but it has really stayed with me for so many things, because every time I'm scared to do something, or I'm just I'm feeling so nervous or scared, I really think about what she said, and she was like, you have to push into the pain. I'm like, okay. I'm just gonna keep walking through the fire. As you've heard me say, like, you just had to push through the pain and you'll walk out the other side.
Heidi [01:00:35]:
So relating that to, like, freelancing, can you give, like, one example, maybe?
Jacqueline Schumann [01:00:41]:
Oh, yeah. The first pitch You have many. Gosh. I have so many. But the first pitch I ever sent, my hands were shaking at the keyboard. And I think back now, and I'm like, oh my gosh, why was I so nervous? But it was the first pitch I had ever sent. And I was really, really scared. It took me way too long to write.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:01:05]:
And it sounds ridiculous now, but just hitting that send button Mhmm. It was just pushing into the pain, like walking through the fire, pushing into the fear. And, I mean, that was with a pitch. The first time we talked for the podcast, I was so nervous. I did a panel a few weeks ago. It was my first time speaking at an event. And I was like, okay. I'm just gonna push through the pain of, like, being terrified.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:01:38]:
Yeah. Walking through the fire.
Heidi [01:01:41]:
Yeah. But those are the actions you have to take in order to get the results.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:01:46]:
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Heidi [01:01:49]:
Oh my gosh.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:01:50]:
You just have to you just have to do it, or you're just gonna live with so much regret, and it's not worth it.
Heidi [01:01:55]:
Yeah. It's easier
Jacqueline Schumann [01:01:58]:
I
Heidi [01:01:58]:
mean, it's not easy, but it's arguably less painful to push through the pain than it is to live with the regret of not having tried.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:02:06]:
Oh, for sure. Exactly. Yeah. Because I got to the point where I was, like, when I had finally given up on looking for a full time job in California and moving back.
Heidi [01:02:17]:
Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:02:17]:
I said, at least I did everything I could. I literally took a trip down there. I faked my address. To do this. I did everything in my power, and it's not working out. So that is life telling me that it's time to go in a different direction. And now I'm so happy I didn't get any of those jobs. Oh, good.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:02:42]:
I am too. Yep.
Heidi [01:02:45]:
Yeah. Look at you now. Yeah. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:02:48]:
Yeah. I mean, it's
Heidi [01:02:49]:
it's training. This has been lovely. Your story is, like, there was some roller coaster moments. I was like, and then what happens? And then what? Yeah. But I'm I I feel like, internally, so much joy for, like, where you're at right now. And I I know that whole, like, compare and despair thing of, like, oh, but look, that person and I'm not it always exists. I think it's human nature. Right? But I think it's it's, you know, so important to also look at, like, well, I am here, and look at how hard I've worked, and I'm I'm doing this and, like, celebrate your own wins, like, on your own level.
Heidi [01:03:30]:
Yeah. I think it's amazing.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:03:31]:
For sure. Yeah. And and it's funny because I I guess in the beginning, I kind of thought I needed a lot to feel seen or special or important. And now I'm kind of like, actually way easier for me to be a mom and juggle the mom in freelancing and working because I'm really satisfied and happy with, like, 2 or 3 clients. And, like, I feel like, everything that I was looking for. Oh, like, it's a surprise. There it is.
Heidi [01:04:12]:
Oh, that's amazing. Yeah.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:04:15]:
Thank you. Happy for you. Yeah. Thank you so much for, like, having me on and listening. I know it's such a long story. A long answer to your question.
Heidi [01:04:26]:
Yeah. I really appreciate it though, because I often when I ask people, like, what's your story? It's like 3 sentences, and then great. We, like, get on to other things. I all these other things I was gonna ask you, which is fine. We don't have the time. But Yeah. I think that it was really relatable on so many levels, and I think that people listening are going to hear so many, like, little slivers of your story or maybe even the whole story arc and
Jacqueline Schumann [01:04:52]:
be like, that's me. Right? Yeah. Yeah.
Heidi [01:04:56]:
So I think it's important to tell these stories.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:04:59]:
Yeah. I think it actually would have been kind of a bummer to just be like, I went to Fiddim, and then I moved back, and then I met you, and now I'm here. Because it's it's just not what happened, you know?
Heidi [01:05:13]:
Yeah. Yeah. No. I appreciate your transparency and, like, really painting the reality of the picture of, like, this is how it went
Jacqueline Schumann [01:05:20]:
down. Yeah.
Heidi [01:05:22]:
Okay. Two things for the end. First, I think you know the question that's coming. What is one thing you would, like people to ask you about freelancing in fashion that they never do?
Jacqueline Schumann [01:05:31]:
I would like to ask I would like for people to ask me what specifically in fashion that I do, because so many people, assume that I know everything there is to know about fashion or work and everything that there is to do, and there's, like, a conversation to be had of well, there's actually a lot of categories within fashion. And then when I explain all of that, like, there's luxury, there's couture, there's bridal, there's swim, there's accessories, there's casual wear, women your favorite women's ready to wear. There's men's, there's kids, all, like, all the things within that, they start to understand that there's so much more to it, and it's not this surface level, type of work. There's so much more to it. And so I do wish that people would ask what within in fashion that I do.
Heidi [01:06:38]:
Okay. Conscious Denim.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:06:41]:
Yeah. If we
Heidi [01:06:42]:
had to sum it up really succinctly.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:06:44]:
Yep. Two words, conscious denim. And there's a conversation within that because people are, like, are you talking about a pair of jeans that has AI that has consciousness?
Heidi [01:06:58]:
Oh my gosh. Okay.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:07:00]:
Which is yeah. Right? Crazy because we're so used to, like of course, you know what that is because we are in the industry and we talk with other fashion, you know, professionals, but people who aren't in fashion. Like, I had a friend, few months ago, he was like, what is sustainable denim? Is it like, jeans that last longer? Or something? Totally. Totally. So there's there's a huge, disconnect or learning curve that has to happen, and I'm more than happy to make that happen.
Heidi [01:07:40]:
Yeah. Okay. So if people wanna connect with you, where can they find you online?
Jacqueline Schumann [01:07:44]:
So I have my website. It's jacquelinediane.com. And, you know, my LinkedIn, my Instagram is is on the website, but that's where you can find everything. And I'm I'm a little more active on LinkedIn, a little bit less on Instagram. You know why? But you can yeah. Those 3 places.
Heidi [01:08:09]:
Okay. Awesome. Thank you so much for coming on the show, Jacqueline. This has been really, really exciting to chat with you in more depth.
Jacqueline Schumann [01:08:15]:
Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.