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Startup CPG's Daniel Scharff sits down with Hannah Koch, Category Manager for Supplements at Kimberton Whole Foods, one of the most beloved independent natural retailers in the country. Based in Pennsylvania, Kimberton Whole Foods has built a reputation for thoughtful merchandising, strong community relationships, and a deeply mission-driven approach to retail.
Hannah's path to retail is anything but traditional. After starting as an art teacher, she joined Kimberton Whole Foods in 2008 and worked her way through multiple roles before finding her passion in purchasing. With a background in herbalism and a deep love for natural products, she now oversees the supplement category, helping shape the assortment for eight stores across southeastern Pennsylvania.
Daniel and Hannah dive into how Kimberton approaches product selection, what makes emerging brands stand out, and why customer behavior is changing faster than ever. They discuss how social media is influencing supplement trends, why packaging matters more than most founders realize, and what retailers are looking for when deciding which products deserve shelf space.
Listen in as they cover:
· What makes Kimberton Whole Foods different from other retailers
· How Hannah evaluates new brands and products
· Why packaging is often the first thing that gets a buyer's attention
· How customer demand is increasingly driving product innovation
· The growing role of Fair and other platforms in product discovery
· Why supplement formats are shifting from pills to powders, beverages, and gels
· What founders should know before pitching a retailer
· How Kimberton supports staff education and customer guidance
· Why authenticity and mission matter when building a natural products brand
· How Startup CPG founder meetings at Expo West helped uncover promising emerging brands
Whether you're preparing to pitch retailers, launching a supplement brand, or trying to better understand what buyers are looking for, this episode offers valuable insight into one of natural retail's most respected organizations.
Episode Links:
Hannah Koch on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hannah-koch-4a06047a/
Don't forget to leave a five-star review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify if you enjoyed this episode. For potential sponsorship opportunities or to join the Startup CPG community, visit http://www.startupcpg.com.
Show Links:
- Transcripts of each episode are available on the Transistor platform that hosts our podcast here (click on the episode and toggle to “Transcript” at the top)
- Join the Startup CPG Slack community (35K+ members and growing!)
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- Visit host Daniel's Linkedin
- Questions or comments about the episode? Email Daniel at podcast@startupcpg.com
- Episode music by Super Fantastics
Creators and Guests
What is The Startup CPG Podcast?
The top CPG podcast in the world, highlighting stories from founders, buyer spotlights, highly practical industry insights - all to give you a better chance at success.
Hannah Koch
Kimberton is a mission based company we started on a farm. Our founder was the person who first started making seven Stars yogurt on the seven Stars Biodynamic Dairy. So we come out of what now is called regenerative, but in the past would have been called biodynamic. We come out of that world literally directly off the farm. So there's a deep rooted investment in sustainable agriculture and in a commitment to the earth and also like what's best for people's health. That's not just like a tagline or something that we're saying because it's popular. It's deeply felt and meant and invested in. And sometimes people can assume that you're only in it for the money and that would be a big mistake. With Kimberton Whole Foods, it can't just be like, oh, this is trending. We created this product.
00:56
Hannah Koch
There has to be like, I want to feel good about that. And this is a company that I feel really good about. Kimberton Whole Foods has so much heart and integrity to it that I want to be met by that with at least good percentage of the products that are on the shelf.
01:11
Daniel Scharff
Welcome to the Startup CPG podcast. I am so excited that today we get to learn together all about Kimberton Whole Foods. It is an absolute darling retailer based in Pennsylvania and I'm even more excited that we're going to learn about it through the lens of Hannah, who is the category manager for supplements. I think she might have been the most popular person at our recent founder dinner at Expo West. Brands were over the moon to get time with her and even some of them got on shelf because of it. You are going to love hearing about how consumers are driving what's on her shelf, how she makes assortment decisions and even some hot takes on what's driving innovation these days.
01:47
Daniel Scharff
And if this podcast doesn't make you want to move to Pennsylvania to become a Kimberton Whole Food Shopper, then I don't know what will. All right, let's get into it here. We. Welcome everyone to another episode of the Startup CPG podcast. I am so excited today because we have a guest we've been trying to get for so long. We've got Hannah. She's from Kimberton Whole Foods. Hannah, welcome. It's so nice to have you here today.
02:14
Hannah Koch
Thank you, Daniel. It's nice to be here.
02:17
Daniel Scharff
All right, so Kimberton Whole Foods is just one of those retailers that the people who know it love it so much. And I just have heard from so Many people. How there's. It's just like a really. A store with so many passionate shoppers and the velocity is really good for brands that get in there. But can you just give us the 101 on Kimberton whole Foods? What is it? Where is it? Why do people love it so much?
02:40
Hannah Koch
Sure. I mean, I think Kimberton is actually a very special place. I think one of the most important things is that we're family owned and operated to this day. It's been over 35 years and that four of the five children of our founders actually do like work in our stores. One of them is my supervisor. So very integrated that way as far as the family business is concerned. And we're a mission driven company. And I think there's something about our mission we could always talk more about, but it's a little bit infectious. And I think that you come into the store and you can feel that energy. And especially at our first store, you know, people come in and it's like the quintessential old school health food store and then some. So people get that vibe and they love it.
03:16
Hannah Koch
And all health food stores kind of have that smell and we do too. So it's just a great place to be.
03:22
Daniel Scharff
And who is Hannah and how does Hannah fit into the Kimberton Whole Foods picture?
03:27
Hannah Koch
Sure. So I've been at Kimberton whole foods since 2008. I came there on a part time job while I was an art teacher at a middle school. And I'm a person with natural foods passion, but also studied herbalism pretty in depth for the past 15 years or so. And so I bring that to it. And I started purchasing in 2019. I've done. This is my fifth position at Kimberton Whole Foods. So I've done almost there. But I do love the purchasing the most because it allows me to bring my herbalism passion and combine it with just the retail knowledge I've gained over the years and put those two together and it's a great combination for me. It's a great job.
04:03
Daniel Scharff
That's so interesting to go from being an art teacher, obviously much more, you know, creative. And managing kids, that's a tough task as well.
04:10
Hannah Koch
Yeah.
04:11
Daniel Scharff
Do you feel like it's a big difference in skill set or is managing all the brands a lot like managing kids in an art class?
04:18
Hannah Koch
You know, I think it does. I think the part of retail that I embrace is the people and the creativity. So those two things are in common with teaching the brands that I work the best with. Are the ones that allow me to be creative with them. And we have, like, a nice flow between us, so that's definitely part of it. And I just love the people in our industry in general, both customers and on the vendor side. Every time I go to Expo, I feel like it's like a reunion of people that I love. I feel that we actually genuinely connect over more than just business. So I think there's all of those things in common.
04:49
Daniel Scharff
That's amazing. And can you just go into a little bit more detail about, like, where are the Kimberton stores? How many are there? How do the brands that are lucky enough to work with you actually get the product there? All of the basics?
05:03
Hannah Koch
Sure. We just opened our eighth store two weeks ago. We have stores in southeastern Pennsylvania. We're in three different counties right now. We're always looking to grow. Most of our business is fresh and grocery, and the supplement game is part of the business, of course, but we really draw customers in for food. That's a big pull. So a lot of our business is done with Kahi and Unifi and big distributors like that. For supplements, I do a ton of direct ordering, and then I've had to work more and more with different platforms. Like, Bear is a really growing platform for me. But then there's, you know, a lot of the emerging brands that are coming out right now. I'm just trying to get them while they're available, and a lot of times that's through their own platforms online.
05:45
Hannah Koch
So it really just depends on who the brand is, what the product is, and how much we need it.
05:49
Daniel Scharff
I've heard a couple different retailers talk about using Fair, which was interesting to hear. And when I've heard it before, they're like, yeah. I mean, especially if it's a product that's going to be maybe a little slower at the start, or maybe it's just easier than me trying to get them set up in our system. I can just order a couple off Fair. How do you think about using that channel Fair specifically versus going direct or using one of the distributors?
06:09
Hannah Koch
Yeah, I was actually very averse to it at first. I was like, oh, not one more ordering platform. But, you know, there's some freedom that it allows, which is what you just discussed. So I do find that there's some interesting things that I can almost shop on there as a customer and see, like, oh, what happens. I type this ingredient in. So I have actually found brands on Fair just from perusing, and I do enjoy that aspect of it. And then it does make it easier for brands that aren't quite ready to go into kehe. But I need the products quickly and they're really not set up very well for direct distribution. It does bridge that gap pretty well.
06:44
Hannah Koch
It's a bit more work on the retailer side just for the things I have to do on my end as far as putting a PO in that never corresponds to fair. So there's more work in the ordering and receiving. But in the end it allows me to get product that I really need in store.
06:58
Daniel Scharff
That's cool. That's really cool to hear about. And can you also just clarify exactly what. So you buy for supplements? What exactly is in there? What's the range of products that you're looking to source and have on shelves?
07:11
Hannah Koch
In the supplement category, we do everything from A through K vitamins to protein is huge. Of course, I don't know, it could be very specific ingredients. I'm trying to think of something that would be like a niche, like we sell real raw bead propolis from a local honey supplier, things like that. We have almost everything. I would say, of course there are quality standards, but I'm trying to fill the niche if I can. As long as there's enough customer draw for that product. I try to have it on the shelf. I'm probably over skewed. Yeah, that's the danger. I mean, too many things to fit on the shelf.
07:47
Daniel Scharff
Honestly, I don't know a lot about supplements in general, so this is actually all very good learning for me. How do you interact with the other buyers who have more of the center store categories, more the grocery or beverage, all that stuff? Do you feel like your job is pretty similar to theirs or do you feel like you look at it differently, make decisions differently?
08:06
Hannah Koch
Yeah, it's a great question actually. It's very much the same in that the goal is to always have what the customers want at the right price, at the right time, the best product at the right price. So we all have that in common. We're all working in the same office. We work in like a group atmosphere. So. And we've all worked together for a really long time. I am the most recent of all the category managers and I've been there 18 years. So the rest of them have been there over 20 and one of them has been there for 30. So we know each other really well. Quite honestly, we're like family and then we work with a family. So I don't know.
08:37
Hannah Koch
There's a lot of like banter here and there, but then there's also a lot of seriousness when it comes to getting the job done. So there's that part of the commonality. But then really, I think the categories demand their own differences. You know, like fresh is completely different than my category. The timeline alone is intimidating to me that you have to roll through products so quickly. And so that just creates a whole other set of demands. Whereas the supplements, I've got years to sell it based on the expiration date, but it's really about like having the thing that the customer wants sometimes. It's about making sure. I think across all categories, it's making sure you have enough products that signal like, we are an unusual store or we care about high quality items.
09:17
Hannah Koch
There's certain things you have to have on shelf, even if they're not in high demand, that just show more of your identity as a retailer.
09:24
Daniel Scharff
That's so interesting. Thank you. And so I got to see you at Expo this year. So when you're looking for supplements and making sure you have everything that your shoppers are looking for, when you're at a show like Expo, what is some of the kind of innovation that you're seeing or just broadly these days, what are you paying attention to? But yeah, what are you looking at when you're there? What are you looking for? What's new, what's cool? What sets people apart for innovation and supplements these days?
09:51
Hannah Koch
Yeah, right now with supplements, I think format is a huge part of it. I think I saw very few exciting pills. And I know pills are kind of boring. Like on this podcast, it's silly to talk about pills, but you know, traditionally supplements are pills. But this year I saw almost exclusively new products that were powders or liquids. So many supplements are turning into like RTD BEVs actually. So they're like exiting my category and entering my coworkers grocery category. I'm seeing that happen over and over again, which, like, really it's tough for me. Cause it's like that's my ingredient. You know, there's certain things like magnesium l threonate that like, to me, that belongs in my category. But it's going to end up in a beverage because that's how consumers are consuming it right now. So I saw a lot of format differences.
10:38
Hannah Koch
And basically at Expo, I'm looking for things that like really pique my interest or that I know customers are looking for. A lot of times exciting packaging is going to pull me in, but it has to fill a void for me in some way. And right now trend is just driving so much of supplements. But I have to pay attention to what the customers are the most excited about. That's really what I'm looking for.
10:58
Daniel Scharff
So just a full shelf of protein and maybe some fiber, maybe some creatine.
11:03
Hannah Koch
Squeezes things in a gel format seem to be coming up. Yeah, I mean it's just, it's anything that you can like eat. I think customers are really tired of taking a pill. But I also think, I think that customers are looking for ways to integrate supplements into their daily life without having to commit. That's something I see over and over again. And I think that like drink phenomenon speaks to that. It's like I do think there's a bit of a customer that's saying like, I want to feel really good about my choice right now in this moment. I'm going to have this beverage and it's going to give me this thing and I'm going to get a, a temporary focus or a temporary stress relief. But I don't have to commit to 30 days of a routine or an ongoing thing.
11:40
Hannah Koch
Or maybe they're not even trying to fix like a long term health issue. They're really just looking for like an added benefit. And that category has grown a lot. And I think it's a more casual consumer and respectfully, I think it's a less educated consumer than we would traditionally see in a health food store over the years. But it's also bringing in a lot of new consumers, which. That's great.
12:01
Daniel Scharff
That's so interesting to think about. I wonder then, do you think a lot about what is going to stick around for the long run versus what is, let's say, a fad right now? I can say just from a personal standpoint. About a year ago I started taking protein powder and I also started taking creatine. And I have kept that habit up every single day for the last year. I don't plan on going away from it and I feel like how would I ever know? But I feel like it's helping. It's so hard.
12:27
Hannah Koch
Yeah. I was going to ask you what's kept you taking it for the past year? What is it that keeps you repurchasing that? Is it because someone told you it's good for you or are you feeling a difference?
12:36
Daniel Scharff
I think I had seen creatine trending on data and I think just heard anecdotally from a few different people like, oh no, it's like, it's good now. Everyone says that you're supposed to. Creatine is really important. Not like when were in high school and just some of the gym bros had it and you're like, ew, what's that? Like, I don't want to just gain a bunch of weight. And yeah, I think the protein, I think just because I wasn't really getting a lot of great results out of even going to the gym a bunch. And so I guess I decided whether or not it's true, maybe it's because I'm not getting. I don't have enough protein and the creatine and that'll help. And I will say, whether it is legit or not, I'm not the scientist.
13:15
Daniel Scharff
I did it pretty immediately get better results in the gym. I felt like I could push myself a lot more. I just could lift a lot more and just like, really start going up in the weights that I could lift. And so. But I also just made a much bigger commitment to being healthier the last year. Have done way more cardio and done cardio really almost every day and rarely missed a gym day. So it's hard for me to say, like, oh, binary. I didn't do anything different except I started taking protein and creatine and now I'm better. It's not really true. It's part of an overall health thing. So who knows? Like, if you know what's what, you're.
13:48
Hannah Koch
Speaking to your own investment, right? It's like you're not just investing financially, you're investing, like, energetically with what you're willing to do, how you're willing to spend your time. I think, to answer your question. So I loved hearing your response, first of all, because, you know, you're a customer too. I think that I am interested in what's going to stick around. And I'm also, I think, you know, you just spoke to it like something that you might see a difference from. I don't want to say that the creatine and protein is like changing your life, but you're changing your life and you're adding them as part of that regimen. So I think if it becomes integrated into a customer's behavior, that will stick around, but they have to see a benefit. Just like what you're talking about. You're talking about like lifting heavier weights.
14:26
Hannah Koch
You're. You're meeting some of those goals that you wanted to meet, so you're seeing a benefit. Therefore, you're probably more likely to consume and keep doing that. I think that there's always going to be a place for basic nutrition, protein being part of that. I will admit I worry not Just about the industry because it makes it a lot. The way trend is moving so quickly right now makes it very difficult to purchase. I do feel that I could be wrong about this, but I think that this might be one of the first times that, like, customers are driving innovation more than brands driving innovation. That's something that I felt like I saw more at Expo. It's like these larger brands that I'm used to working with over the years that are so established and they have a great reputation.
15:05
Hannah Koch
I think they're actually like scurrying to keep up with these very nimble online startup brands that can very quickly create a viral product and then they don't have to have like sales reps or, you know, people out in the field or they don't have to have an educator or things like that. So I think that the industry is shifting very quickly and I think that I don't know if anyone knows, like, how much traditional supplements, like taking your vitamins is going to stick around. I wonder about that personally. And I also worry about it because it's just, I think customer behavior is just changing so quickly. I think Covid was really like the start of that.
15:41
Daniel Scharff
Let me ask about something that you just said that was very interesting. You said customers driving innovation instead of brands driving innovation. Does that mean people who are getting advertised something on TikTok or maybe seeing something from an influencer, like this is the new key ingredient and then they're like, I need it. So then some nimble brand has to be the first one to launch it and then the big brands have to respond to that.
16:01
Hannah Koch
Yeah, 100%. That's what I'm saying. I think like, they've been influenced, right? As we all have been influenced in some way if we've been on social media. And then some brand is very quick, someone's agile, someone's skilled and intuitive and knows how to do the thing, you know, package it right, promote it correctly, drive it to the right customer and be like skilled enough in an online platform to drive it to the right customer base. Those are all skills that I think are growing and emerging right now. And not every brand is going to have someone in place that is going to be able to do those things.
16:35
Hannah Koch
And so I see our, like, legacy brands chasing that and honestly struggling to get that product out fast enough because there is this, like, time is kind of moving more rapidly and if you don't have certain products out fast enough, you're going to miss that window because. And the other thing is there are certain Products that it's like a customer just wants that name. That's the other thing that influencer culture has totally changed. It used to be that like maybe customers wanted creatine and you could have a creatine or you could have the creatine that we like to sell because we have a great partnership with X brand.
17:11
Hannah Koch
But now I think it's like, yep, you can bring in other creatines and some customers are going to be price driven, but there's going to be more and more customers that are brand identity driven like that. It's like they only want this creatine or they only want this electrolyte. That's the one that's influenced them to come into the store and look for that thing and that's the thing they want. And if they resisted the click of the button on their phone the first time, chances are they're going to go back to their phone and buy it the second time if you don't have it. So I'm working very quickly to try to like get that stuff in right away.
17:40
Daniel Scharff
Okay, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah, they could miss the buyer window where the buyers are like responding to that trend and then all of a sudden they have enough products. So the big brands are behind the eight ball. So let me ask you a follow up question on that, which has to do with how consumers are deciding what they need to buy. Okay. So I started taking the creatine and protein. I buy it from one specific brand. I go on their website, every time I order, they give me 60 other additional things that I could buy. I'm like, well, should I? Because I trust this brand a lot and I like these products that they sell. But like, what is all this stuff? Do I need it? I don't know.
18:11
Daniel Scharff
And I, I'm trying to stay focused and just do the stuff that I'm doing, but I just, I don't know that I have the education. These are a lot of ingredients that I haven't heard of. And probably there are variety of people out there who all swear by one of them that I'm not taking. Am I missing out? I don't know. So what role does Gimmerton, Whole Foods and the people in the stores play in actually helping with consumer education? Shopper education, when they're coming in and looking for stuff versus it really is actually like that they're coming in knowing what they want to buy because they saw it on TikTok or heard about it from a friend or whatever.
18:45
Hannah Koch
Yeah, well, I think first is that I'm so fortunate that Kimberton Whole Foods cares enough to staff our stores for customer service. I don't think that happens very often anymore. That's something that's like a passion of the family that owns our business. And they really. We call our wellness department the apothecary. So we're supposed to always have somebody in the apothecary. There should be somebody there almost all the time. So just having a body that someone can ask a question is very helpful. And that's another behavior that I do think changed since COVID It used to be that staff was tapped a lot more for their knowledge than they are today. I do think that customers crave some feedback and that they really do value. When a staff person says, like, that's my favorite, or I take this one, they want to know why.
19:28
Hannah Koch
I definitely still have customers ask me that. But I do think a lot more customers are coming in, just like I said before, knowing the thing that they want to buy because they've already been advertised to. But we do provide staff education, so that's something I'm super passionate about. That is where my teacher background meets this role. We organize a training once a month. We have two to three brands come in once a month. They meet with our entire team, except for the people that are watching the floor and it's in one place. They're off the floor, they get some lunch. They get to learn about things in depth.
19:59
Hannah Koch
And that provides them with at least enough knowledge to be able to speak to a customer, at least about maybe it's going to be the brand identity, but maybe it's also going to be like a specific product education piece that they have. So the goal is to have a well trained staff, at least that can answer a question or if they can't, to point to where the answer could come from. And one of the things that I'm super adamant about, and I know that we've talked to our team about it, is that they don't know the answer to just say they don't. Because we never want to be offering health advice that we don't know anything about. But I do think that an educated deaf is part of how you build the relationship between customers.
20:33
Hannah Koch
And Kimberton is a place that really wants to be a community market. That's part of our mission statement. So having that one one conversation is very much part of having a community market.
20:44
Daniel Scharff
You're really making me wish that I lived closer to Kimberton Whole Foods so I could shop there. I would love to shop in a community environment. This sounds fantastic. And that's what I've always heard from everybody. Now I understand why. So, okay, let's say that you do show up at Expo and there's a trending ingredient that you know people are asking for and you are hoping to find the right supplier. What is going to make them stand out? Let's say you're there and there are four different suppliers of that same new ingredient that's doing really well. What is going to make one of them stand out for you? What are the kind of things you're going to ask them or what are you looking for to figure out which is the right fit?
21:20
Hannah Koch
Honestly, packaging is probably the first thing that draws me in. I think it says a lot about a brand, how they want to position themselves, who their core customer or their target customer is. It speaks so much. I think it's the first thing that a customer is going to see. It's the first thing that I see. So that is number one, just to get me in the door, right? It has to be something that looks like I could put it on the shelf. And I think packaging also tells you a lot about whether the brand is ready or not. If the packaging looks like it's been thoughtfully designed or that it's.
21:50
Hannah Koch
There's a sense of understanding, like the current trends or understanding what customers are looking for visually or even what visual packaging trends are, that tells me like, okay, this brand has done their research, they're ready to be at shelf, they understand the customer, they're ready to go. That's so number one, I think pricing, ingredients, those things definitely come in next. Like ingredients would be second. I want to make sure that it meets basic standards. If it has an interesting or exciting ingredient that's going to be more likely to draw me in something that's in high demand. So I really want to get those items in the door.
22:22
Hannah Koch
But if there's like some junk in the product that would put it, you know, out and then understanding pricing and promotions, when a brand is new, if they don't understand that customers are price driven or they're promotion driven, that's a huge part of the puzzle. If a brand's really not ready for that gives me much more pause. So someone who's really ready to play the game, it is a game, you know what I mean? Like, I want to provide a great quality product for someone who's looking for a product that meets their health needs. And sales is a huge part of this. The product has to move off the shelf. So it has to be ready to roll in all of those categories.
22:57
Daniel Scharff
That makes a lot of sense. You were so kind to take some one one meetings with members from our community at Expos this year. So for anybody who doesn't know how these work, we are able to recruit lots of top tier retailers, brands can apply to meet with them. And then we give you the list of everybody who's applied and you'll look through a couple hundred brands that have applied and you guys were very popular on the brands this year and then you'll select ones like, yeah, that actually is worth a quick meeting at the booth and they're, you know, just to have that in person conversation. So I'm wondering if you have any feedback on how the brands came prepared for all the topics that you're talking about.
23:33
Daniel Scharff
Did they come with the story and they understood the ingredients and they came to play and they understood the promo or I mean generally what was the feedback that you had for them? Did you feel like they really did understand all of that or. It wouldn't surprise me if in some cases the brands didn't really have a full promo plan ready to go with you or they didn't totally have everything in a row for that. What was that experience like?
23:54
Hannah Koch
First of all, it was actually my favorite part of Expo because it was something new and different that I did and it brought a lot of just fresh energy to the experience of going to Expo where for me it can be a lot of the same brands over and over again. Maybe they have some innovation and of course I'm very happy to see the people that I only get to see once a year. But I think that startup CPG did exactly what it was supposed to do. It like injected this very fresh energy into my experience and showed me something that I probably would not have stopped to see otherwise. So I was very pleasantly surprised by the experience. It was really fun. Actually. My favorite part of the job is to like spitball innovation with people.
24:33
Hannah Koch
I just, I get like high off of that because it's like a game. It's like, oh, well, what if you did this and what if you added this to it and what if you did this price point? Like there's something about it just allows a little bit more creativity. When a brand is in those beginning stages and they're open to feedback and they really want to know from you, like what do you think? And then you can play together. There's an energy of play to it. And that's really like, what I loved about the meetings. First of all, I think the brands were prepared for the most part. Some of them, they were like almost ready to be in Kahi, which makes my job just so much easier when they're ready for that.
25:06
Hannah Koch
So two of the brands were like kind of ready but not quite. And I've ordered a product on fair. I did actually say yes to, I think three out of five of the brands that I met with and they're doing well. So like, when I get excited about something, then the team gets excited about something, then it gets a better placement in the store, then there's just more energy behind it. So that was like, very successful. I'm really happy about that. One of the most interesting meetings I had was with a, like still in the innovation process.
25:33
Hannah Koch
They haven't even formulated it down to a brand or even what the product's going to be, but they had this ingredient they felt really excited about and they wanted lots of feedback about, like, how do you see a customer purchasing this and what ingredients do you think a customer would enjoy this with? And that was really fun. It was because it was purely like a conversation about what could be and where they want to go with it. And so it was really enjoyable to be in that phase of just ideas.
25:59
Daniel Scharff
That's very beautiful. I really appreciate that you took the time to do that you were so interested and excited to come and meet all of these early stage brands. But it doesn't surprise me given how much you fun and curiosity you bring to your job as well. So we'll be excited.
26:14
Hannah Koch
Like, so much of the job is doing the same thing over and over again. So I need reminders of why I do what I do. I think we all do in the health industry. It's like, right, I got into this because I love plants, I love herbs, I love people. I want to help people. It feels great to help people. And when you're doing price change worksheets or just like planning your next month's sales tags, that can feel like you can lose that connection. And so when you meet a founder, like, I actually met Sheila from Food Over Drugs at your founder dinner. Just she like happened to walk up to our table and talk to the other women I was sitting with and she didn't know that I was a supplement buyer.
26:53
Hannah Koch
And she just started talking to the other founders about her brand. And then I was like, oh, I just happened to be a supplement buyer. Tell me about your brand. And we just brought a lot of her line into the store. And what I love about her line is it reminds me so much of how we started Kimberton Whole Foods as an organization. It's very grassroots feel, and it's in the packaging and the product and it. She's very true to the herbs, to the medicine. So I love that part of it. And I think both I and the customer and the staff need signaling to remind us this is why we're here. Right? Like, we're not just here to sell the next thing that Nestle owns.
27:28
Hannah Koch
No offense, Nestle, but, like, we're also here to provide a platform for this kind of product for these real people, you know, who are putting all of their money on the line to try to create something that's going to make a difference in someone's life. And chances are they have this really interesting story about why they started to create that product, what got them into the business. The Gem Bytes was very similar. Great founder story. You can feel the energy coming off of her. You can feel like how much it's changed her life. That makes me want to bring something into the store. I'm very influenced by the energy behind a product.
28:01
Daniel Scharff
I love that. And I'm so happy that you were able to come to the founder dinner that we had at Expo. Also, I got a bunch of notes from everybody who was lucky enough to sit at your table saying how happy they were that they went and what a good time they had.
28:14
Hannah Koch
They were great.
28:15
Daniel Scharff
Yeah. It seemed like you had a really great table conversation. That's really beautiful.
28:20
Hannah Koch
We did. I was so impressed with all of them.
28:22
Daniel Scharff
Oh, that's so good. That's exactly our hope. So thank you for coming to that. So let's say that a brand isn't lucky enough to get to have one of those meetings with you or meet you at a founder dinner. How are they typically getting on your radar? Are they sliding into your DMs on LinkedIn or going through a formal process? What is the way that some people find success?
28:44
Hannah Koch
Yes, people do slide into my DMs on LinkedIn. You have to be pretty special in your product to be able to get my attention that way. Because LinkedIn is just like huge universe. We do have a process where everyone fills the same basic form out on our website. And then that goes to my supervisor and he kind of throws them to me. He'll give me his feedback and I'll take a look at the product. I try to actually look at those websites pretty quickly. In the past, it was something that I sat on A little bit more. But lately I just feel that innovation is calling. So I will look at those quickly. If I feel that there's a need for it or that it's exciting in some way, or customers are really craving that, I'm going to hop on it a lot faster.
29:26
Hannah Koch
So I think having the right product for the time, you know, at the right price, with the right packaging says a lot about your ability to get in the door.
29:34
Daniel Scharff
Okay. And as we're kind of wrapping up here, one thing that I would love to ask, because you mentioned before the difference in shelf life across some of the different categories. What are your velocity expectations for people? Because they do have good, long shelf life and they're higher price points. So what are you really looking for? What's going to be good? What's going to get people in hot water with you and make you feel like it's not work? What are you looking for? And what can people do if they're not hitting those numbers?
30:02
Hannah Koch
So with startup brands, I'm going to be more flexible because they're unknown. We're taking a chance on them, the customer's taking a chance on them. I understand that people don't have the same resources on the founder end than, you know, a large corporation does. So I'm going to give them a little more leeway, especially if I feel like there's a real need for it or that just given the right amount of time and the right exposure, we could like start a fire. Right. So I'm looking for that, like kindling time. I probably will give you six months before it's like done, if nobody's picked the product up or if it hasn't generated any of its own interest. And I've done my legwork.
30:39
Hannah Koch
So my legwork would be like, I've talked to the team about it, hopefully the brand has been smart enough to give them some free samples. That is like a huge thing. I would say, like invest in giving team the opportunity to try your product because most people who are working in retail are not making enough money to buy lots of supplements. So if you want them to try yours, you should provide it for free or come train them and give them a sample or let them try it, something like that's going to be a big part of it. So if I've done my legwork by like educating the team, maybe I've given you like a great position in the store, you know, like I've given them great product placement or maybe I even put them on an end cap.
31:17
Hannah Koch
As I've actually done with some of my startup CPG brands. So. And then if the customer still isn't like feeling the pull to that product after about six ones, I'm probably going to let it go. But if there is enough interest and we're building towards something, I'll give it more time. But I'm looking for, I don't like to share my philosophy goals, but I'm looking for it to feel like I can make a reorder without worrying about am I keeping product on the. Here's my line. Am I keeping product on the shelf for the sake of the brand or am I keeping product on the shelf for the sake of the customer? I don't like to keep product on the shelf because I'm trying to meet a brand's needs. That doesn't work in the long run for anybody.
31:53
Hannah Koch
You know, it's like a one sided relationship. So I try to just be very honest with someone. If it's not working, let's try these levers, see if we can work this a different way. And then if we've tried all those levers and it's still not working, I need to be honest with you and say it's just not working.
32:07
Daniel Scharff
Very fair. Okay. And so yeah, I guess just Hannah, this has been so great. Really, what an interesting. I just have loved learning about Kimmerton Whole Foods through your lens and through your category as we wrap up here. Just anything else you feel like we didn't cover, anything you would love for everyone to just really understand about Kimberton Whole Foods that maybe I didn't ask you any overall thoughts about it or just I wish every brand applying would know this about us or understand this about our shoppers or our culture, our experience. Anything to wrap us up on.
32:39
Hannah Koch
Yeah, I think something I didn't get to say in the very beginning because I was just trying to be brief is that Kimberton is a mission based company we started on a farm. Our founder was the person who first started making 7 stars yogurt on the 7 stars biodynamic dairy. So we come out of what now is called regenerative but you know, in the past would have been called Biodynamic. We come out of that world literally directly off the farm. So there's a deep rooted investment in sustainable agriculture and in a commitment to the earth and also like what's best for people's health. That's not just like a tagline or something that we're saying because it's Popular. It's deeply felt and meant and invested in.
33:20
Hannah Koch
And so, you know, I saw you had asked a question on the interview sheet that was like, what do people. What could someone get wrong? I think what. Sometimes people can assume that you're only in it for the money, and that would be a big mistake. With Kimberton Whole Foods, it can't just be like, oh, this is trending. We created this product just because Shilajit is the most popular thing right now. Don't you want the shilajit? There has to be like, I want to feel good about that. You know what I mean? And this is a company that I feel really good about. Kimberton Whole Foods has so much heart and integrity to it that I want to be met by that with at least good percentage of the products that are on the shelf.
33:56
Hannah Koch
So I would say just feel the need to tell the origin story because it is so integral to who we are and how we do business.
34:03
Daniel Scharff
I love it. I think that is the reputation that you guys have, which, yeah, sorry if we didn't even cover that enough, but that is what I've always heard from everybody. Like, do you know about Kimberton? This is a really special place.
34:15
Hannah Koch
Well, if you've ever met Terry Brett, our founder, and he was on the Infra board almost the entire time I've worked at Kimberton, one of the founding members, and he's just a genuinely special individual. And I think anyone who's had the opportunity to speak with him at Expo or anywhere else, that's probably what they're responding to, is Terry really is invested and. And then you draw the great people that work on your team for that reason, and then the customers feel that. And then, like, the brands want to work with you because they also feel like they're working with a special place. So all of that really fits together and creates a good atmosphere for everyone.
34:48
Daniel Scharff
I love it. All right, Hannah, thank you so much for your time today. I'm so excited for all of the brands in our community to get to hear this. And then they'll have it in mind when they meet with you next year, and they'll be even more prepared. All right, thank you.
35:03
Hannah Koch
Thank you so much.
35:06
Daniel Scharff
Well, my friends, we've now arrived together at the end of another episode of the Startup CPG podcast, the top globally ranked podcast in cpg. As you may know, we're not just a podcast, we're a community of brands and experts. And you should join. You can sign up @startupcpg.com you'll then get an invite to our online Slack community. You're going to hear about amazing events near you, all of our special opportunities to get you in front of buyers, investors, brands and more. It's a free community, so what are you waiting for? I will see you there or on our next episode. Bye Bye.