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(Episode previously named “Racism”)
In this episode, Dani discusses racism and how white people need to do better.
For links & recommendations, view full episode notes.
Dani is honest and refreshing in her takes on the world and society. Listen as she explains how she’s come to understand the world through kindness, both towards ourselves and everything else.
[0:00] Hey everyone. Today I’m going to talk about racism. Today’s episode will mostly be me talking to my fellow white People. I’m white and I would love to talk to other white People about how to not be racist, and what we can actually do about it. In the episode, I’ll be talking about two books that I’ve read. The first being “Why I’m No Longer Talking to White People About Race” by Reni Eddo-Lodge. The next one is “Aphro-ism”, it’s essays on pop culture, feminism, and Black veganism by two sisters named Aph Ko and Syl Ko. I’ll also be talking about an episode of Unlocking Us, an episode of The Bearded Vegans, and an episode of Bitchy Shitshow [podcast no longer available]. So, without further ado, welcome to this episode of Understanding Kindness.
[0:56] Theme.
[1:03] Okay, so let’s get into this today. Well, I do wanna start by saying I’ve been putting off recording this episode for a bit. Kind of procrastinating on actually recording it because I wanna make sure that I do it right and I wanna be able to explain it the way that everything makes sense to me. And also, listening to and reading the media and books that I’ve consumed by People of Color, and interviews that I’ve heard from People of Color about what anti-racism really is. The first thing I wanna say is white People are the reason that racism is still so rampant in this country, the United States, that I live in. That might be harsh to say, or some of you may think, but it’s the truth because as white People, we are the dominant race in this country, we reap most of the benefits from everything, uh, with blatant disregard for other People and how they’re treated, and blatantly not acknowledging our own privileges. And that we understand that other People, non-white People, don’t reap these same benefits, but for some reason we’re okay with going on with our lives reaping these benefits knowing that others don’t because of the color of their skin.
[2:32] And that’s a problem. Any time that you, as a white person, see racism happening around you or hear of something happening around you, and you don’t call it out or address the racist person head-on, you’re being racist. You’re letting this perpetuation continue, and you’re allowing others to be racist towards People of Color. That’s racist. If you’re allowing something to happen in front of your face and not saying anything about it, you’re the reason that racists are still around and you are perpetuating racism. You’re saying, by not saying anything, you are saying that it’s okay for that Person to be treated like that, it’s okay for somebody else to treat another Person that way- and it’s not. And if you’re gonna tell People that you aren’t racist or that you believe everybody should be treated equally, then you’re gonna have to show me some action behind that. It makes absolutely no sense and it’s very hypocritical to say, “I’m a compassionate Person, I believe everybody should be treated equally and get equal rights”, but then (1) not educate yourself into what’s actually happening to People of Color and non-white People. Well, specifically Black People in this country and Indigenous People in this country, but all People as a whole, you’re gonna say that you’re against racism or you are an anti-racist, but you’re gonna let things happen around you that are racist? That’s unacceptable. You need to educate yourself about it and you need to call it out when you see it. That is the work of- just saying you’re an anti-racist is not the work of being an anti-racist. You’re just labeling yourself something without actually doing any work behind it. To be an anti-racist, you have to work towards it. I mean the goal is everyone is treated equally, and the only way we’re going to get there is if there are People pushing back against the People who aren’t treating others equally.
[4:33] I am calling on all of you fellow white People out there to push back against People, and when you’re gonna say that you’re an anti-racist, do that work of anti-racism. A wanna quote from “Why I’m No Longer Talking to White People About Race”. Reni Eddo-Lodge says, “White support looks like financial or administrative assistance to the groups doing vital work or intervening when you are needed in bystander situations. Support looks like white advocacy for anti-racist causes in all-white spaces.” So, again, that last part is similar to what I’m doing now. I’m talking specifically to other white People who wanna say that they’re anti-racist and have no action behind it, as a white Person. Cause it’s not just Black People, Indigenous People, other People of Color saying that this stuff is racist. I’m a white Person and I’m saying it’s racist and it needs to stop. And again, any time you’re in a situation, you see a situation, you hear about a situation happening around you that is racist and you can do something about it, you need to. You need to. Cause if you’re gonna call yourself someone that lives by a set of morals or ethics, you need to make sure other People are treated just the same way that you get treated and the same way that every other white Person in this country. Reni Eddo-Lodge also says, “The mess we’re living in is a deliberate one. If it was created by People it can be dismantled by People and it can be rebuilt in a way that serves all, rather than a selfish, hoarding few.” So if we look at the history of this country, obviously it was based off of racism. There were slaves and they were strategically Black People. So we’re seeing that the country is built off of racism, but naturally, inherently People aren’t racist. You’re not gonna meet a racist baby, right? So if we can understand that these systems were deliberate, they were made so that white People could stay at the top, so that white People could be in charge, and we can see that it was created by those specific People to serve those specific People, we can also see that it can be deconstructed and, like Reni says, “…in a way that serves all, rather than just the [sort-] selfish-hoarding few.”
[6:58] Uh, I wanna go into the book “Aphro-ism” by Aph Ko and Syl Ko. This book is as I mentioned earlier, about pop culture, feminism, and Black veganism. So, it does have a lot of comparisons between animality and white supremacy, racism, things like that. But at the base, talking about compassion and anti-racism, anti-speciesism, things like that. In one of the essays, Aph says that, “We’re striving for a social system that does not institute oppressive ideologies as the standard.” So, if we look at what oppression is it’s obviously not including others, leaving People out, telling them what they can and cannot do, and we can see that all over many institutions in this country itself. You know, it may say that we are all free, all have to operate under the same laws and whatnot, but again, that’s kind of like saying you’re an anti-racist and having no action behind it. So, we’re saying the police are supposed to protect everybody, but we’re seeing their actions are only to protect wealthy, white People, right? We’re seeing them killing Black People over and over and over again so, it’s all- they’re all talk. Everything they’re saying doesn’t match up. And what we need to do is deconstruct everything because we know that it only works for those specific People, and rebuild this whole system so that it isn’t oppressive at all and it benefits everybody equally, actually. And the way we do that is, well, to break down these systems and put in place ones where People are held accountable, People aren’t able to be bribed by money, and wealth has no power over others. That’s the kind of system that we need, so that People, everyone, all beings are treated equally.
[9:13] I understand that as white People who may have been very privileged their lives and have never had to see the actual effects of racism in the country systematically, and to those white People I want to talk a bit about what Nichole and Callie of Bitchy Shitshow said in a recent episode on dismantling whiteness, that I’ve only started watching, haven’t finished yet, but I’ve already pulled out some great things from it so I may talk about it in a later episode. But this one part that they talked about was to, “go past your own experience, see the struggles of others, and see how it’s connected to your struggles and everything around it.” And the way that we get past our own experiences is learning from, first-hand, these People who have been disenfranchised by these systems. So that’s a lot of what I’m trying to do here. I’m trying to push out and get the word out about, you know, this media, these books that talk about it so that everybody can learn about it and start to see what’s actually happening, and how we as white People play a role in the continuation of these systems that are oppressive.
[10:39] Ibram X. Kendi said something great on an episode of Unlocking Us, and that’s that, “If the heartbeat of racism is denial,” so we’re denying that Black People are just the same as, well People of Color in general, are just the same as white People, that’s the denial, “the heartbeat of anti-racism is [going to be] confession, acknowledgment, and admission.” You need to do all three of those things about yourself, about what’s happening around you, about what happens systematically in this country, because only then, once you confess that to yourself, you acknowledge it and you admit it, that you’ve been an active participant every time you don’t say something or do something, that’s -once we do that, then we can start striving -well we can do the actions, right?, then we can see what we need to do in the future and how we can move forward in a better way to include everybody.
[11:39] So I wanna end with, uh, not so much quoting, but just talking about something that Andy said on The Bearded Vegans in their epis- two-episode series about the Thug Kitchen, and that’s titled GASLIGHT. Basically, that two-episode series discussed everything going on with the Thug Kitchen, which, if you’re not aware, Thug Kitchen was a blog ran by two white People, and as we all know “thug” is a word that has been used to describe Black People in a negative way. Obviously, it’s very problematic that two white People co-opted that name and then sold cookbooks and made money off of that stereotype of a thug, using language that is very stereotypical for this “thug” and in their real lives were nothing like that. That’s obviously a problem, but something that Andy said in that episode is that, “Unless your words are coupled with actual self-examination and behavior change it’s meaningless.” So, what I was saying in the beginning that when you say you’re an anti-racist, but you don’t do anything about it and you just continue to let these things perpetuate, it’s meaningless that you said that you were an anti-racist. It doesn’t matter if you put something up on your profile about it or changed your profile picture because of it, that’s not the work of anti-racism. Anti-racism, like I said, needs -to call yourself an anti-racist, needs to be coupled with calling racism out, learning about the systems that actively harm Black People, Indigenous People, other People of Color, and changing that. We need structural, societal change for these People to be treated just as every white Person is treated here. And yes, that may mean that you lose some privilege, but really I don’t really give a fuck because there -throughout history, especially in this country, white People have reaped so much from the backs of Black People, Indigenous People, People of Color in general, they still are, and you’re gonna think that this country is anti-racist and say it’s anti-racist and everybody’s free, but really no, not everyone is free and a lot of People are being actively harmed and oppressed because of these systems and because white People like you and me allow them to perpetuate. Actually, not like me, I’m not allowing those things to perpetuate because I’m gonna call them out, and I want you to also call them out.
[14:27] I do wanna say this one little, short list of -it’s from The Beared Vegans episode 233 on The Seven Points of White Allyship, and they had Omowale Adewale on to talk about this. That’s something that Omowale does as a career and this is something that they’ve put together to help white allies know what to do. So if you’re gonna call yourself an ally, these are great examples of things that you can do, coupled with being vulnerable, stepping outside your comfort zone when you see something racist happening, and standing up for the Person who’s being oppressed. So these Seven Points of Allyship are specifically for white vegans, but I think it applies towards white People in general, if we’re gonna call ourselves compassionate People. Well, you know, this first one, is specifically about vegans, but if ya think about it, it can be applied to non-vegans as well if you’re gonna say that you are compassionate towards animals. Which, if you’re not vegan, I’m gonna challenge that. Anyway!
[15:36] First one is apply your compassion for animals to Black lives. It’s a pretty simple one, seems very obvious to me. However, it still needs to be said because many white vegans don’t care about Black People’s lives as they do for animal lives, so that one goes almost without being said, but it has to be. Respect Black space. So what that is is allowing Black groups to be without you in it, you don’t need to be there and a lot of times it’s so they can heal from everything that white People have perpetuated against them, all the oppressions that they face. And they don’t want white People in it because they’re the ones doing the oppressing. So, respect it, leave them alone, let them heal. Support calls for ending police murder and misconduct. In this time, where we’re seeing, well white People are finally seeing, that Black People are being systematically murdered by the police in the United States, we need to listen to Black advocates, People supporting Black Lives Matter, and hear what they have to say about the police violence, and what we need to do to stop it. And, in my opinion, we need to listen to the People that are going to break things down from -take it all the way down, root it deep out because this system as a whole is what is the problem. The system, the policing system itself is the problem. It’s not the individual cops, it’s the entire system that makes these cops do the things that they do. That is what we should be addressing. Why do we think it’s okay that anybody, no matter what kind of badge they wear, has the right to kill someone else? We need to listen to the Black activists doing the work and hear what they want so that we can see the systematic change we need to end oppression.
[17:44] White organizers mobilizing white forces on behalf of Black People. So, that’s again kinda what I’m trying to do here is, I’m not an organizer, but I do want to mobilize white forces on behalf of Black People because, like I’m saying, if you see racism, hear it, read it, smell it, whatever, if you’re not actively doing something about it, you’re perpetuating the racism. Respect Black lives. It’s gotta be said that you need to just treat Black People, Indigenous People, and other People of Color like everyone else, they’re no different, they want the exact same things. Respect their lives, not just their bodies, their lives. Their lives are just as valid and important as yours as a white Person, and it is not worth any -you are not worth any more than they are. Your white life is not worth any more than theirs is. Respect that and let them be, let them live however they want. It is their life, they get to do what they want with it. They don’t need your judgment and frankly, who the fuck cares about what you have to say about what they’re doing with their life. Respect it. And back off. White financial resources. I think it’s very obvious that white People have had the financial upper hand in this country for far too long and (1) we need to pay People for the labor that they did for free for hundreds of years; and (2) even though things may seem different now, they’re not, and as a white Person you do probably have more money than many BIPOC People. So, donate to places that need the money to stop oppression against them. White media. That’s again, I think just using -white People using a platform you have to talk about racism and how to be anti-racist.
[19:49] So those are the seven points. I think what I want to say is that we need to not dwell on our past actions. Not let us make -not let it make us feel guilty because guilt isn’t gonna do anything. Any time you hear someone -oh! this is actually a great quote from “Why I’m No Longer Talking to White People About Race”, but, “Freedom of speech doesn’t mean the right to say what you want without rebuttal. And racist speech and ideas need to be healthily challenged in the public sphere.” When you hear someone, see someone, read something, anything being racist, and sure they have the freedom of speech to say that, but they don’t have the freedom of speech to be an asshole. They don’t have the freedom of speech to be a dick, and you need to stand up for the People that they are taking voices away from with their hateful speech. You need to stand up for them because you know it’s right. If we just sit there in guilt, we’re not -it -guilt immobilizes you. It’s doesn’t -it causes no action at all. So, what we need to do is, yes acknowledge that you did bad in the past. You didn’t say something when, you know, something racist happened around you. But the only way that you’re going to actually be a better person, actually be that anti-racist, compassionate Person that you say you are, is if you get over your fucking guilt about not doing something in the past and just do it now. Do it now because this is your opportunity to be better, this is your opportunity to stop racism in its tracks. Show People that it is not okay to be racist.
[21:29] So, yes, acknowledge that in the past you let things happen, you let things slip. Acknowledge the history of this country and how it has been racist towards specific People, while it allows others to reap all of the benefits. And acknowledge that the only way things are going to get better is if you do something now about it.
[21:52] If you enjoyed this episode, help support the podcast! All this content is free and I’d love to make it my job one day, so if you’re financially able join our patreon or send a one-time or recurring donation through paypal! You can also share an episode with family or friends, and give UK a kind rating and review!
Check out UnderstandingKindness.com for all episodes, transcripts, and blog posts. And why not take a listen to my other podcast, Better When Awkward, co-hosted by my childhood best friend Jasmine!
Get in touch with me by emailing UnderstandingKindness@protonmail.com, or through social media. You can find all links in the episode notes.
For now, be kind, be compassionate, be understanding, and question everything. I’ll be here. Thank you for listening to this episode of Understanding Kindness. [End transcript]