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From Disaster to Dream Home! takes you inside the homebuilding process, from the ground up. In each episode, acclaimed interior designer Jana Rosenblatt brings you both the time-tested practices and the latest trends in homebuilding through conversations with leading architects, designers, and industry experts. Whether you’re building a custom home, rebuilding after a natural disaster, or renovating an older home, From Disaster to Dream Home! is your trusted source for the insights and connections you need to bring your home dreams into reality! www.FromDisasterToDreamHome.com
This is the EWN podcast network. Whether your home will explode with color or embrace a unified subdued color palette, each color for the walls, ceilings, and trims must be selected and specified for your builder. For many people, these choices can be daunting. Our guest today is a color expert and will help us understand the factors to be considered and the process to select the perfect pallet for our new home.
Speaker 2:Welcome to From Disaster to Dream Home, the podcast that takes you inside the home building and rebuilding process. When interior designer, Jana Rosenblatt, had an 80 foot tree fall in her house, she saw the opportunity to create the customized home of her dreams. From Disaster to Dream Home provides you with the information and resources Jana wished she had during her rebuilding process. Now, she's sharing with you the expertise of leading architects and home builders and the newest products and materials on the market. Here's your host, Jana Rosenblatt.
Speaker 1:Welcome back, home builders and remodelers, to another episode of From Disaster to Dream Home, the podcast that will take you through the process of building or rebuilding a new home from the ground up in 52 episodes. If you are rebuilding after the loss of your home or building a new home from the ground up, each episode of from disaster to dream home will help you know what you and your design team will need to do next every step of the way so your dream home can rise from the ashes. Our podcast have been has been following the process of rebuilding a new home from the ground up. All our prior episodes have brought us to this moment, about three quarters of the way through our timeline. The structure is complete.
Speaker 1:The drywall has been installed. The seams have been taped and sanded, and the walls and the ceilings primed. This is the time when we look back at our original early research and inspirational photos to remind ourselves what kind of colors we imagined. We have selected and purchased all the building materials that will support our vision, the tile, the plumbing fixtures, the countertop slabs, and the flooring. We have selected the exterior finishes too.
Speaker 1:The stucco and siding materials and any stone or bricks have created a color palette we may want to carry into the house. When you had a home full of art and possessions, the paint colors may have been selected with these in mind. Now needing to start from scratch to rebuild your cherished collections, you will have to decide whether to enhance your spaces with color or create a simple palette from which your new art and finish and furnishings will show up like art on a gallery wall. Today's guest, Jamila Davis, has been a professional color adviser with the Dunn Edwards Paint Corporation for the last ten years. After finishing her degree in interior design, she turned her love of color into a career.
Speaker 1:She began working with homeowners to select their paint colors and has recently moved into her current position as architectural services, where she is working with architects and designers in specifying Dunn Edwards products and colors. Welcome, Jamila. So exciting to talk to you today.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Speaker 1:It's wonderful. And as I already told you, unofficially, I have career envy. I can't imagine a more wonderful thing to do than work with color every day.
Speaker 3:Yes. It's it's very thrilling and very, very nice to the soul to be able to work with color every day. It's not inspiring, really. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Jamila, can you, you know, tell us a little bit more about yourself and share specifically what you do as an architectural services representative?
Speaker 3:Yes. So as you mentioned, I work with architects and designers in specifying our Dunn Edwards colors and products. Are mostly their new construction projects. So I'm starting at the ground level with them, preparing their finished schedules, selecting colors, providing color samples for them. And then when they get to their specifications, helping them with their product recommendations and making sure the product used is the best for the project.
Speaker 1:Cool. So so you work with a lot of new construction. And on this podcast, we are primarily speaking to people who have lost their homes and are in the process of rebuilding. So once the drywall is up, the contractor will want to get the primer coat on, and then they will be eager to know the paint color selections. I would love to talk about the suggested materials to use throughout the painting process and about what we should consider when selecting the colors.
Speaker 1:First, let's talk about paint quality.
Speaker 3:Okay. So okay. Go ahead.
Speaker 1:Yeah. No. Go right ahead.
Speaker 3:Okay. Well, as you mentioned, the drywall is up. So you do wanna make sure that you're selecting the correct primer that is supposed to be applied onto onto drywall. Drywall is very porous, and if you were to apply a paint without the correct primer, that paint is just gonna absorb into those pores and not be able to give you a nice clean finish. So your primer is acting as a blank canvas before the plate is applied, but it's also acting as a protection to the substrate or the surface being painted.
Speaker 3:It also provides adhesion for the paint to stick to it. And as I said, it gives you a nice, fresh canvas to start with before you apply the paint. When determining what type of paint and quality of paint to use, I'm gonna get a little technical.
Speaker 1:Okay. I will take it.
Speaker 3:With paint composition, there's basically four ingredients into what is in your can when you purchase paint. That is your pigments, which is your color, which also helps with hiding and coverage. There's also your binders and your resins, which are your glue and what holds the pigment particles together. And then you have your solvent or liquid. So if you're working with water based paint, that's gonna be your water.
Speaker 3:Uh-huh. And then you also have your additives, and additives help with mildew, mold, and any skins or anything that may form in the paint can. Additives prevent those from happening. So you have your solids, which are your pigments and your binders, and your liquids, which are your solvents and additives. As paint dries, your liquid is what evaporates, and what is staying on your walls is your solid, your pigments, and your binders.
Speaker 3:So when determining a good quality paint, you wanna make sure that the solid that are left on your paint on your wall are good quality at a good percentage. And a good rule of thumb objective way of looking at that is looking at the percentage of your volume solids of your paint. And that information can be found on any product data sheet of any paint manufacturer. Mhmm. And you want to have those volume solids be between 35 to 45%.
Speaker 3:So when you are looking at your volume solids, if it hits between those range, you are working with a good quality paint.
Speaker 1:So I imagine that if it's not, it's because people are kind of, stretching the water, stretching the use of the paint.
Speaker 3:Exactly. Yes. Not So if you have more liquid than solids in your paint, then you're not gonna have those solids that are gonna what's staying on your wall. So, yeah, if you're having more liquids,
Speaker 1:that's a problem.
Speaker 3:I mean, I've certainly funny paint. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I've certainly witnessed some, some non imperfect textures, and I guess that the explanation on why that is. So now you brought up a a ton of questions I didn't even think of asking already, so I'm gonna ask you to begin quickly, which is so in California, we can only use water based paint. And, also, coming from East Coast, I wasn't familiar with Dunn Edwards paint until I got to California. How widespread is the Dunn Edwards brand is the first question.
Speaker 3:So, we are a regional company. At first, we were a regional company, but we do have an online brand called our Dura brand Oh, yeah. Which can be purchased and sampled online, and that is a curated color palette just for that brand. So anywhere that brand can be purchased from our website, but we also have dealerships within the nation and internationally as well. So our products can be purchased almost anywhere in the country and some places outside of the country.
Speaker 3:But I like to say we're home bred in LA, Los Angeles. Uh-huh. That's where we started. But, yes, we we started as a regional brand, but now we can be found in different areas as
Speaker 1:well. Alright. So, so then as a California company, you have certainly needed to perfect the water based paint product line. And, you know, we run into all the time in renovations places that had been originally painted with oil based paint that we have to special treat. But so is, does Dunn Edwards still have any oil based products, or is it all, water based now?
Speaker 3:So you can find oil based products in our store locations outside outside of California. Okay. So our locations in Arizona, they do still, sell oil based paints. But, yes, because of the regulations with California and the VOC content of oil based paints, we can no longer sell or distribute oil based paints in California.
Speaker 1:Yes. This is this is definitely the case, and we're, you know, working with that all the time. But mostly, it's for our own good. So now
Speaker 3:let's talk
Speaker 1:a little bit about, yeah, surface preparation. What are the key steps in preparing the surfaces of a new house for for for painting prior to applying that, first coat of primer?
Speaker 3:So as done, Edward, we like to say clean it, stuff it, dust it. So you want to first clean your surface. So you first wanna clean your surface, with a mild detergent and water. Okay. Now if you are working with metal type of surfaces, I would refer to the Society of Protective Coatings because they do have their standards of how to treat and prepare metals before you apply your primer and paint.
Speaker 3:But other typical surfaces like drywall, wood, I would say a mild detergent and water can be used to clean those surfaces. You wanna remove any oils or any contaminants that might be on these surfaces that will affect the primer and paint once it's been applied. And then after you clean it, give a nice cleaning, you wanna dust it. So you would use a fine sandpaper, usually about two
Speaker 1:twenty grit. Dust. Yes. You don't apply the dust. You're creating No.
Speaker 3:You're creating the dust. Yeah. So you would use a fine sandpaper, usually two twenty grit, and you're just giving a light sanding to these surfaces, especially if there's a gloss on them. So if there's been a semi gloss, you wanna give that a nice sanding. You're not removing the paint completely down to the bare substrate.
Speaker 3:You're just giving it a nice sanding and a nice deglossing. Once you've completed the sanding, then you would do, like, take a nice rag and wipe away any of that dust. So as I said, clean it, scuff it. So you're scuffing it with your sandpaper Uh-huh. And then you're dusting it you're dusting away the sanding residue from those surfaces.
Speaker 3:So a nice dry rag will help dust those areas clean.
Speaker 1:Okay. So then if you're renovating an older home and there's already been, you know, how many layers of paint on the wall, is it the same process?
Speaker 3:Yes. Gonna clean it? Still. You're cleaning it? Yeah.
Speaker 3:Exactly. You're just cleaning it, mild detergent and water, then taking a fine sandpaper, giving you a nice sanding, stuffing the surface a little bit, and then you're doing your cleaning with a nice rag to get away all of that dust particles that was created from sanding. I like to give the example when ladies get their nails done. The first step in that process is they file your file your nails Yeah. By giving you a nice buff.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And then after that, they apply clear base coat, which is your primer, and then they apply the two tops of coats of paint, which is your paint. So they give you a nice scuff, and then they clean them, and then you apply your products. Fascinating.
Speaker 1:And then, so then let's talk about, before we get into color, let's talk about the world of paint finishes and selecting the proper finish for the job and, and wall textures, but there may be two different questions. So so dig in.
Speaker 3:Okay. So with finishes, lot of people use different terms when they're describing finish. It's either finish, gloss, or sheen. So there are a myriad of glosses and finishes that you can choose from, usually starting with flat, which is the least amount of sheen that you will see in a paint. Flat is good for areas that you may not need a lot of washability.
Speaker 3:So if you have people running their hands on your finger on your walls, getting them dirty and scuffed, then a flat finish might not be the best choice for you.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh.
Speaker 3:Flats are usually used on ceilings because a lot of people are not running their hands along the ceilings, and those areas are not getting dirty. The plus about using a flat finish is that it hides imperfections. So if you have textured walls or areas that weren't sanded down, you see a little bit of imperfections from a previous paint, project. If you use a flat, it's gonna hide those imperfection. So I'll I'll explain when light hits a gloss.
Speaker 3:Uh-huh. If you have any imperfections, it will cast those shadows along those imperfections, and that's what you're seeing when you use a higher gloss on an imperfect, wall. With Dunn Edwards, we have a velvet sheen, which is one step above flat. With the velvet sheen, it provides you some washability and some scrub ability, but also helps hide some imperfections like flat. So if you're not wanting something too shiny, but you're wanting something that gives you some washability, then a velvet sheen is a good choice.
Speaker 3:The sheen after that is eggshell, and that is just, again, one step glossier than velvet. And, again, if you have high traffic, lot of people are running their hands on your walls, you have children, you have pets, then you might wanna do an eggshell finish because, again, that's gonna give you some washability. We do have higher sheens like our low sheen, which is very similar to a satin finish. Again, that's giving you some more protection, some more washability with your surfaces. And then after that, we go into our semi gloss.
Speaker 3:Semi gloss is great for areas where you might have spills or moisture. So like your kitchen, you're cooking a pot of spaghetti stuff, it over boils, it splatters on your wall, you wanna be able to clean those surfaces. So you wanna semi gloss to be able to protect those surfaces to give you some washability. For bathrooms where you have showers and it's gonna be a high moisture, you wanna have a semi gloss or a higher sheen just so that it's standing up and protecting your surfaces from that moisture and water, intrusion from the steam in your shower and such. After semi gloss is your gloss finish.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. This gloss finish can be for highly decorative reflective surfaces. So Uh-huh. If you want your cabinetry to kinda spark and and highlight, you might wanna do a glass like gloss finish. Gloss can also be used on doors.
Speaker 3:Doors usually get really beat up with people touching them and handling the handles and pushing them open, using your foot to kick the door open. So you might want a semi gloss or a gloss to be able to give you some washability and a harder shell to protect against, like baseboards. You're vacuuming your room when you hit your vacuum against your baseboard. Having a higher gloss is gonna help against that ding against the the baseboard with your vacuum. Mhmm.
Speaker 3:And then after that is our high gloss finish, and that is just a more reflective, like, glass like finish. Uh-huh. Gives you a really glossy finish, and that also could be used for cabinetry or doors or, like, exterior doors, especially if you get a lot of sun. That gloss is gonna protect against UV exposure as well.
Speaker 1:Fascinating. Of course. Now you bring up the subject of washability. If we've chosen, a velvet or an eggshell for our walls, which I I almost always high highly recommend unless we're going for a specific effect, what can we use to wash our walls if there's some scuff marks or kids kids' handprints like my grandbabies and, you know, things like that? I my let me just say that I try not to wash them off because I love them.
Speaker 1:That's just memories. Doesn't like them so much. So, so what are the things we can do to keep our you know, keep those places crisp and clean?
Speaker 3:I would still use a mild detergent. So Dawn soap is a really good mild detergent. Simple green is another type of detergent you can use and warm water. So you're just gonna use a rag, and then you're going to wet the rag with your mild detergent and water mixture and just wipe your walls clean.
Speaker 1:Alright. Good. So so then do you is is wall texturing that goes on be before the primer something that you guys know about at Dunn Edwards, or is that something the builder's gonna do and you're gonna try to cover?
Speaker 3:So it's the point to cover the texture or to hide the texture?
Speaker 1:Well, it's texturing is used to hide the imperfections in the construction process. So when when a client is all is going to at some point in the decision making process, need to decide whether they want their walls flat or whether they want a constant coated, texture. And the constant coated texture is a lot less expensive because it gets, it gets, put on, you know, it gets blown on and and, sprayed on is the term, I guess. And it creates an overall texture at which point, the paint is going to you know, it's not we we can never ask our paint to fill it in because there's too much texture involved. But we want the tech you know, the paint to go on well and and cover it.
Speaker 1:And and so when you're talking about imperfections, it's not as much the texture. It's about places where maybe the texture has been changed or, you know, there you have to kinda recreate that texture to be consistent?
Speaker 3:So I would say if you're painting something that is textured Yeah. I would still suggest a flat finish, just so that texture is not so much highlighted.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh.
Speaker 3:And if you use a higher finish and you're thinking scrub ability capabilities, you're not really gonna be able to clean and scrub a textured wall, because you're gonna remove that texture by cleaning it. So using a flat finish will kinda smooth out that texture and not highlight it so much.
Speaker 1:Okay. That is that is good advice. And, sometimes I do that, and sometimes I don't. I never use a flat on on a wall. I always use at least velvet.
Speaker 1:So that's my compromised position. But then, you know, the the textures are put on and they're meant to last. But I find it most desirable to have a flat finish, you know, the flat surface with which to apply the paint. But if if you're doing a big, you know, $4,000 4,000, I'm sorry, square foot, home, it can be pretty expensive to get a flat finish before you start. A lot of times, those tech wall textures are gonna be applied.
Speaker 1:But so so really making sure to stay on the on the
Speaker 3:flatter Lower sheens.
Speaker 1:The palette. Yeah. Lower sheens. That's the technical term.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:Alright. So, you know, the elephant in the room is choosing the paint colors. It's helping the homeowners approach, choosing the right paint colors for different rooms. What are the considerations that we should be aware of?
Speaker 3:So when you come to the part where you're deciding on colors, I always like to reference Pinterest so that people can kinda get an idea of what their style is and what colors they'd like to kinda get an idea. I also, like to suggest HGTV, again, to kinda get an idea of your likes and your dislikes. No. I shouldn't say that.
Speaker 1:No. No. No. No. That's fine.
Speaker 1:It's good. It's good. It's good.
Speaker 3:Okay. And you can always go to any paint store. They usually have color brochures, near their color area, their color chip area just so that you can browse those and get an idea of what you're looking for. When it when you kinda got an idea, I always like to think of what is the architectural style of the space.
Speaker 1:That's what I'm gonna come to that. But, yeah, that's great. Talk about that.
Speaker 3:Okay. Looking at the architectural style of the space Uh-huh. And maybe pulling colors from those architectural trends to get an idea of how to bring those colors into your current space. Now I know there are trends, and trends are that they're trendy. But trends do come to an end at a certain point in time.
Speaker 3:So trends usually typically last about ten years or so.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow.
Speaker 3:So if, yeah, so if you're if you're liking a trend towards the beginning, then it might follow you all the way through that ten year period where you might be thinking about repainting, refreshing. Right. Whereas if you're working with the architectural style, that team seems to be timeless because it is working with that style that's been around for so long. Did I miss anything?
Speaker 1:No. That's pretty good, description of trends. So so I'm gonna skip to my trend section and then move back to the historical section. So when when choosing, the paint colors, people, you know, I do I do make sure that early on in the design process, we pull images that people, you know, are attracted to. And so it's at this point that I bring everyone, you know, the the homeowners back to these images, and I say, well, what is it about this image that you liked?
Speaker 1:What did you respond to? Sometimes it's, you know, a a drawer pull. But a lot of times, it's the overall feeling, and that's gonna help us determine what, what the colors are that make that feeling. And and so my feeling about trend is that, you know, knowing what's out there is good. But if you love the color, then it's gonna be a color that you're going to love.
Speaker 1:And it's interesting that you mentioned, you know, ten years because now that I've been in business for more than twenty years, I'm finding that I get the callback about ten you know, eight to ten year intervals to come back in and take a look at the colors, and that's when people are ready to make some changes. And, you know, the with so that's kind of interesting.
Speaker 3:Yes. Yes.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I think that and, you know, and it does feel like like people, you know, the in the design world are complaining about gray and grayish.
Speaker 3:Yes. But it's at the end of probably we're near the end of this ten year very towards the end of the gray trend. I mean, the gray grayish era
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Was, about ten years. And so now we're coming towards the end of it where people were last stained with the cooler tones, the cooler gray. Warmer. And now moving to warmer colors and your warmer greiges as the term has been used, or your taupes. Something that has a little bit of a warmth to it to warm up those spaces.
Speaker 1:That that is exactly what I I'm seeing spontaneously happening in the culture. And what I like to do a lot of the time is I'd like to have a warm and a cool color in the house. Sometimes, you know, if a client doesn't necessarily want, like, every, you know, room a different color, to get an overall going from a grayer tone or a cooler tone into a warmer tone in certain rooms can be really refreshing and kinda help move the spaces.
Speaker 3:Exactly. And, I mean, I know we were talking about, how to determine what color works for that space. Yeah. I would what is the function of that space is my first question. Is it to sleep?
Speaker 3:Is it to relax? Or is the function of that space to work, to keep you energized, to keep you working? Right. And then choosing colors that will help speak to those type of spaces that you're trying to to create. So, for example, if you're wanting to try to create a calming, soothing space, blues and greens tend to help create that sense of calmness.
Speaker 3:On the cooler Whereas if you're I'm sorry?
Speaker 1:On the cooler end of the spectrum.
Speaker 3:Yes. And if you're trying to create a space that gives you energy, you might wanna look at warmer tones like your yellows or your reds. And you may not necessarily want to paint your room red or yellow, but you can definitely bring in accents of those colors to help you bring energy to the space if that's what you're wanting.
Speaker 1:Exactly. And so, so with that in mind, this sort of combination of warms and cools and and, you know, maybe in your, sleeping areas, you're cooler, and in your kitchens, you're warmer. Let's go back to the architectural effects of for a minute. I mean, certainly, you know, major architectural styles are traditional and, mid century modern or maybe, you know, Mediterranean. How do colors are are they affected by those styles?
Speaker 1:How should we be looking at that as an influence?
Speaker 3:So looking at arts and crafts or craftsman style homes Uh-huh. The base of that architecture is to bring one closer to nature or to bring nature within the space. So you may want to, incorporate colors that represent nature, like your greens or plants and foliage or blues, like the ocean and water. And then you wanna bring those colors in, and you may wanna mute them some so they kinda modernize the colors a little bit Uh-huh. So they're not bright green or bright blue, but muted, maybe darker colors.
Speaker 3:And that will kinda modernize the colors and modernize the space, but paying homage to its architectural style. Mhmm.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And I think that with an architectural styles, you have to make a specific choice on whether you're going to blend them and enhance them or intentionally contrast them for some reason.
Speaker 3:Yes. And I mean contrast is is great because you're not it's it's it's not the same. It creates texture. I know we're talking about texture on the wall, but you also wanna create texture and dimension with your colors as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah. That's right. Incorporating color can really add a three-dimensional quality to your architecture when you, you know, have something in the further distance that might be more intense color and you enter into a quieter color, you kind of feel the whole scope of the space. So that's an interesting thing to consider as well.
Speaker 3:And one question I usually ask first. I ask several questions, but one of the questions I ask is, what do you wanna highlight in the space? Do you wanna highlight your walls, or do you wanna highlight your decorative element? Right. If you're wanting your decorative elements, your art, your furniture, all of those items to be the highlight of the space Uh-huh.
Speaker 3:Then you want your color to kinda fade in the background and speak to those elements. Whereas if you want your walls to speak for the space, then that's when you can be really creative when punchy with your color selections because the l the decorative elements are gonna be what are the most muted in that space and bring highlight to your wall.
Speaker 1:Yeah. That's a really good point. And so then let's talk a little bit about flow and cohesiveness. You know, I occasionally do have, people who want to almost treat each, room and space as a different environment. But a lot of the time, I'm gonna gear people clients toward the feeling of the whole space and the cohesion of walking through the space.
Speaker 1:And and, again, like, highlighting, is there an a cathedral ceiling in one area and, you know, an atrium detail in another area? Is is you have, an area that might be a home theater that you want to, you know, make feel more like a movie house? You know, how about that cohesion and the flow process?
Speaker 3:So I would always look at if your selected color has a color family. If it has a color family, then within that color family, it's taking that color in different shades, whether it be lighter shade or darker shade. So you can always work within the color family to create a nice cohesiveness throughout the whole entire space. But I also like to reference our color harmonies. So interior design school color one zero one was the color wheel.
Speaker 3:I'm learning the different color harmonies. So the first harmony is our complimentary harmony, and that's kinda working within the same color family and doing different varied degrees of shades of the same color. But you can also do, like, the, opposite color family, a complementary colors. Yeah. Complementary color harmony is selecting two colors on the opposite sides of the color
Speaker 1:wheel. Contention.
Speaker 3:So for example, blue, yellow, red, green. So you can use your color harmonies to kind of pick colors that match together and create a nice flow and cohesive nib using your different color harmonies as well.
Speaker 1:Okay. So, so we're talking about sort of the overall feeling. What about accent colors? You know, certainly, there we think of those as, like, in the eighties. There might be, you know, orange walls and, you know, olive green walls or something.
Speaker 1:But in the practical world, you know, now, you know, in in the in our time, how are people using accent walls? What do you suggest in that regard?
Speaker 3:So to select an accent color, I'm still looking at your decorative elements. So I'm looking at your fabrics, your pillows, any artwork that you may be displaying within those rooms, and pulling maybe a color from those that can be your potential accent color. Accent colors I've seen mostly go darker than the main base color of the room, but I've seen some situations where they'll choose one wall to be lighter than the other, walls in the room. And that's just a preference of how what you wanna see when you walk into your space. I like to suggest your accent wall to maybe be your focal wall.
Speaker 3:If you have a great piece of artwork that you wanna highlight, maybe that be the wall that you highlight that artwork on. If you have a beautiful headboard that you want, people to take notice of, then you might want to, put an accent color behind the headboard just so that everybody's eye focus on focuses onto that accent color and focuses onto what is displayed against that accent color.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And I always look if someone wants an accent wall and they or they want to embrace some color, but they're afraid of it. That's where an accent wall can be really useful. And there are two rules of thumb for me. One is the shape of the wall.
Speaker 1:If you're gonna accent the wall, it should not be the one wall with three doors cut out of it. Yes. Yes. Somehow the most beautiful wall in the room, you know, the one that goes up into the cathedral ceiling or, you know, whatever it is. And, also, this is where to really rely on your building materials.
Speaker 1:So while you're choosing all of your base colors throughout the home, you wanna pull together the sample of all your tile, your flooring. You if your flooring is warm, you don't wanna go too cool, you want it to reflect, you know, the wood or whatever, you know, the material is. And and that's where you can get your your, accent colors. If there's a beautiful blue, you know, in this floral tile or the texture of something. A geometric has a gorgeous color in it.
Speaker 1:That's where you wanna kinda pull that through the room. It's something you were attracted to once, so you might like it, you know, when it's on a whole wall.
Speaker 3:Exactly. And I like the point that you made. If if you're afraid of color, if some if you're not used to working with color, an accent wall is a great beginner step because it's only a wall. If you don't like the wall, you can always repaint it to whatever color you want. Whereas if it's a whole space Right.
Speaker 3:You might become overwhelmed. Right. So axle wall is a great step into being introduced into color. Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Exactly. I mean, it's not
Speaker 1:like you're gonna need to remove tile to you know, it's paint is is the easiest thing to fix and adjust. Yeah. And I I do challenge people to go a little out of their comfort zones, and I rarely have had a problem with that. I I find that people are so glad that they did, and, and I that always makes me feel good inside.
Speaker 3:Yes. As you said, it's paint is one of the easiest and almost always the least expensive Yeah. Way to refresh a space. So if you're like, my space looks a little old, it needs updating, try giving it a nice fresh coat of paint, and that will do wonders. Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Alright. So now a little, a little more on the technical side. How does lighting influence like, your colors and your choice of your colors?
Speaker 3:So there are three types of lighting you should always take in consideration when selecting color. It's your direct, lighting, so that's direct sunlight. So as everybody should know, the sun rises in the East and sets in the West, and our sun travels the south of us. So in the morning, on the East, that room that's facing the East is gonna have direct sunlight. Whereas the sun travels towards the afternoon, that east facing room is gonna have indirect sunlight and opposite for west side rooms.
Speaker 3:So in the afternoon, that west facing room is gonna have direct sunlight, but in the morning, it's gonna have indirect sunlight. And most rooms facing the South is gonna have direct sunlight because of the way our sun travels, whereas rooms facing the north are gonna have mostly indirect sunlight because there isn't a lot of sun hitting those spaces. So working with indirect and direct sunlight, you always wanna see how a color is going to be affected when the sun travels. It may look bright and fresh in the morning in an east facing room, but in the afternoon in that same room, the color may look muted. And you have to determine, do you like that color change, or is that something you can be happy with?
Speaker 3:With the third type of lighting is our artificial lighting, light bulbs. And light bulbs are either warm or cool. So if you're working with a cool paint color and you're using a warm light bulb, that might give it a yellowish undertone. So you might wanna change your light bulbs to a cooler light bulb, which is going to pick up to those cooler tones. And the opposite, if you're working with a warmer tone and you have a cool light bulb, it's gonna mute that color and hide the warm tones.
Speaker 3:Whereas you switch it to a warm light bulb, those warm tones are gonna highlight more in that warm color. Is that a lot of words?
Speaker 1:No. That's great. And and I just wanna add that, that something that people should be aware of now is that so recessed lights is is what, we usually use in new construction especially to be able to get a blanket of light into the room that then can be controlled with dimmers and switches and things like that. And that, now in in today's world, the bulbs that are used in recessed lights, you can choose the range of, the color temperature. So what I always do, and I want people to be aware of this because they need to ask their electricians to do this, is choose a room, put in the first, you know, three or four recessed lights, have your electrician put them at different color temperatures, and then see what you like.
Speaker 1:I Yeah. Like clean white light that's like the sun.
Speaker 3:But Same.
Speaker 1:I have a lot of clients that do like a kind of warmer, tone that makes everything kind of feel rosy and glowing. And then I have people who, you know, like it even a little bit starker than I might like it. So so that's a really important factor that, you know, the technology in today's world can really help you, you know, do wonderful things with. So you can choose the color temperature of the bulbs if you plan ahead and choose the right fixtures. And then, you know, and then you can choose the change the mood in your room through I love the way light changes, the color.
Speaker 1:I like that, my my kitchen the are the orange bright orange, I and I'll put this online. I paint it in my kitchen. It's bright in the morning, and it's deep in the, you know, afternoon and evening and, you know, helps us quiet things down just the way it moves. And so that leads us to testing our colors. Yes.
Speaker 1:So I how important is it for the homeowner to test the with paint samples on their walls before making their final choices? And I'm gonna preface that to say, I don't like, to paint swatches on the walls. I I like we go through an elaborate process of taking the strips of, white, of white paper, butcher paper that we paint on. And sometimes we'll do a primer first, but always we'll do the same amount of coats that you're gonna do on your wall so that you really see the color properly. I do that because I don't want the paint to change the texture of the wall.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And because I want to be able to move it around so you can see it
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 1:On different walls without painting a block of paint on different walls. So what are your thoughts about sample testing, and what are some of your tips and tricks?
Speaker 3:So sampling is, without a doubt, the most important step before you apply any paint into your space. And I do the same. So I have some people who do like to paint the swatches on their walls, but, yes, if you use a cardstock or, like, a foam board board, you can always paint those with your stamp set.
Speaker 1:You know what else I'm just remembering? Sometimes I use manila folders. But just to prime it first so the yellow doesn't come through. But those are just wait.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, a white foam cord board is a great, way of doing that as well because it's white. You don't have to prime it. And then you just apply your two coats of paint as if you were applying your wall or any, applying paint onto your wall or any other surface, and you let it fully dry. And then that is great because you can take that sample and move it in different areas of your space. So as you said, you like to do that because our sun moves.
Speaker 3:Light travels differently throughout the day. And so you wanna see how this color is gonna look like first thing in the morning compared to how it's gonna look like in the afternoon. And if you're using that same color in different rooms and different spaces that have different lighting, then you can take that sample and, again, move it in different areas. I like to put it above my head and see what it looks like. Put it directly in my eyesight and see what it looks like, and put it towards the floor and see what it looks like because color will change in different directions.
Speaker 3:The way our eyes view color, whether it's up, down, side to side could change.
Speaker 1:To the next. So one person could do the next. Yeah. That's right. You have to build a consensus in your family with the people who are gonna, you know, be most vocal about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And then you also have a different of, like, if you're working with a very colored tile
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:In your kitchen, how that tile color may reflect
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 3:Onto your paint color. Right. Right. So if you have a very green tile and you're painting your room yellow, that green might reflect onto that yellow, casting that yellow into a green hue. Are you gonna be happy with that?
Speaker 3:So, So, yeah, do you wanna make sure to see if you're having any other elements that are gonna have color on them, how those items are gonna reflect onto the paint color, and if it will change it or not?
Speaker 1:Yeah. All of that is, a really good case for going through the sampling process and giving yourself enough time. You do not wanna be choosing your paint colors the morning the painters are arriving. You will not be happy. I like to go give it, you know, weeks if possible.
Speaker 1:Certainly, a
Speaker 3:couple of
Speaker 1:days. Also, does the color change as it dries? People ask me that all the time, and I don't actually know the I know what I say, but I don't know the answer.
Speaker 3:So, I mean, everything looks a little when it's wet, it looks a little darker and a little shinier. But, yes, as it dries, the color should look a little darker compared to it being wet. However, if you have a gloss, a glossy paint, a color that is in a semi gloss or a higher gloss, those colors tend to look a little lighter as if they were painted in flat. And that's because the light is reflecting on that gloss Uh-huh. And making the color appear lighter.
Speaker 3:Whereas if you were to use the same color in a flat and compare it to something the same color in a semi gloss, the color in the flat is gonna look a little darker, and that's because there's no sheen or gloss reflecting off of that color.
Speaker 1:Fascinating. And so now speaking back back into the gloss and semi gloss, let's talk about trim and detail work. How can you approach painting the moldings in the house? The baseboards, the crown molding, the window and door casings, the doors themselves. We've touched on that a little bit.
Speaker 1:And any walls with, with, wood or applied details like the chair rail or wainscoting and v groove on the ceilings, How do we treat those areas specifically?
Speaker 3:So I treat those areas because they tend to get a little bang up more than the actual walls. People tend to touch those areas more often than just the walls. Like I mentioned earlier, you're vacuuming your space and you hit your vacuum against the baseboard. You're have a handful of groceries and you're walking in your front door. You may use your foot to kick the door open to let yourself in.
Speaker 3:Because those areas tend to get a little beat up more, I would use a higher cloth, a higher finish, because it gives you that hard shell of protection. So if you do kick, you're not gonna ding or chip the paint easily, and you'll be able to wash it, and have spherability capabilities because it is a higher sheen. Now I know we talked a little bit about oil based paints and not being able to find those in California. A lot of paint manufacturers have developed something called hybrid. They're water oil hybrid.
Speaker 3:So they have the pros of oil base being a harder shell and a higher harder finish, but the water evaporates during the the drying process, leaving that harder shell. So for woodwork and such, I do recommend maybe going to a hybrid type product just so that you get a harder finish on those.
Speaker 1:That is something we can get in California?
Speaker 3:Yes. You can get hybrids in California. And they come by different names, alkyd emulsions, hybrids, water oil hybrids. They all come by different names, but, yes, you can get those in California.
Speaker 1:Okay. And so so then in addition so you've talked to, the technical aspects of why, we use the gloss and the, semi gloss or gloss for our trims. It's also, of course, a visual contrast. So if you want if your space if you're relying on it to be more like a gallery space and the things you put inside it are gonna be colorful and you want it to be a lighter or whiter kind of refreshing look, You might contrast with a higher sheen so that there is a separation between the trims and the, the walls. And so but what about color contrasting about people applying color to their trims.
Speaker 1:Are you seeing that happen?
Speaker 3:So I've seen it in few situations where people have painted their baseboards and woodwork a different color than their walls. Typically, you mostly see white or off whites for these areas, but I've seen some cases where they may use a dark chocolate brown, and that usually kinda goes with the architectural style. So if they're working with a Spanish or Pueblo type space, they might use a dark chocolate brown to contrast that woodwork. And they may use brown because it is the color of wood, so it's going to highlight those wood like areas. But I've seen a fun, when I first started working with Dunn Edwards, someone wanted to paint their baseboards black.
Speaker 3:I thought so when they painted it black, it really gave it a nice glass glossy, pristine finish, and it just gave it a nice contrast to the space. They left the rest of the space white to give you that contrast of that black woodwork, and it was really nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well, that I have I have sometimes I had clients who wanted to do some pretty extreme things with their woodwork and their their trims. And I'm gonna say that one of the reasons why we don't recommend that is that it is more expensive to apply those paints and do it perfectly. So it's easier to repaint a wall where you've taken a chance. It's not as easy, and it's a little more expensive to repaint your trims.
Speaker 1:So that's why I think a lot of times people will go neutral on those choices. Although, you know, I will take a ride with anyone that wants to try something new. The one place yeah. The one place that I sometimes do, recommend the base the baseboard particularly to be the color of the wall is when it's a a room with an abnormally low ceilings that then it's almost like when you, you know, are at choosing a shoe for a perfect outfit. You're gonna get a longer look if you, you know, if you have a a shoe that's more like your skin tone than if you contrast it.
Speaker 1:Like, if you put on those red pumps, you're gonna see the red pump. So we kind of look at it that way. And so does Sanad Awards have do have wood stains and wood clear coat finishes?
Speaker 3:So we do not manufacture clear coat or stain type finishes, but we do partner with third parties that do. So, like, man Old Masters is a, same product that we definitely work with when it comes to specifying products for, staining. Yes.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And and that's something that I also recommend, especially in, in a a home where it's appropriate, like a mid century modern or craftsman, where it's can be really beautiful to use a sustainable wood, a stain grade wood for your casings and your, not as much crown moldings, but your your base and your casings and even your doors to contrast with some beautiful, you know, paint finishes to get that wood. And, again, I'll I'll post some pictures where I've done that. It can be really refreshing and beautiful and really accent the architect of the house.
Speaker 3:And just note, when you are working with stains, the stain itself is usually a flat finish. So you usually have to coat it with a clear coat, to give you some sheen or gloss, which is gonna give you your aesthetic, but it's also gonna give you the washability and the protection of the surface as well.
Speaker 1:Beautifully added. Thank you. So then, you know, the one of the earlier than your interior colors, you're gonna we're gonna be choosing our exterior colors, because they're as they seal up the house. So are there specific considerations or guidelines for selecting exterior paint colors and considering factors like the architectural style or the surroundings or curb appeal? What are your thoughts about exterior color choices?
Speaker 3:So, yes, I, again, I would always look at the architectural style of the home to pull colors from that. But I also like to, on the technical side, think of will this color fade. So you wanna be aware of colors that are not UV stable and will fade after prolonged UV exposure. So, unfortunately, those tend to be your brighter colors, your yellows, your oranges, your reds. Those used as exterior colors tend to fade quicker, and that's the that's determined on the the different pigments used to create those brighter colors.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. They're just not UV stable, unfortunately. So I just would be aware of selecting a color that is UV stable. And most paint manufacturers will have a little symbol on the color that will say interior preferred or Right. Will fade with UV exposure.
Speaker 3:So just look out for those different type of symbols that you may find on the color that may determine if that color will fade or not. So with most exteriors, they're masonry, and there are some colors that have some alkali sensitivity with masonry surfaces. Okay. So really one rule of thumb is you shouldn't paint any mesh masonry until it has fully cured, and that's usually thirty days. So after thirty days, you're pretty good to make sure you're applying the proper primer, and then you can apply the paint on top of that.
Speaker 3:But there are certain colors that do get affected with alkalinity in your masonry. So, most paint manufacturers will have a symbol on that color as well just so that you know, okay. If I use this color on newer masonry, I may have an effect color change with those colors. So those are basically the two symbols that I always look out for is if it's an interior preferred color or if it has alkaline sensitivity to that.
Speaker 1:With this, when we go in to buy our paint, we're we're gonna ask for an exterior or an interior paint. Right? So, if we're asking for an exterior, is it automatically not gonna have, principles that we should be concerned about? Is it automatically gonna be more stable for use exterior use?
Speaker 3:So if you are using an exterior paint, most exterior paints have UV protection included in them. So, yes, you could use an interior preferred color by tinting it in an exterior paint. Yes. It's going to help with some UV exposure, but it's not gonna be a 100% this color will never fade because I'm using exterior paint.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 3:Because those colors do break down quicker with UV exposure, whether you're using an exterior paint or not, you're still gonna have some fading
Speaker 1:issues. Interesting. So I have very much in commercial use. We do residential and commercial, exteriors and interiors. And, and I have often, you know, put on a color that I knew was gonna break down within a certain amount of time so that it, you know, would be a fairly intense color.
Speaker 1:But, you know, I've I've often gotten a call like, oh my god. It's so bright. I'm like, you know, wait about six months. And it's,
Speaker 3:the air, but
Speaker 1:I didn't realize it wasn't really just the air that it actually is the inherent color stability.
Speaker 3:Yes. So I can be technical again. Please. So so with pigments, which is the color that you you find in paint, pigments are the color, and it also helps with coverage and the hide of the paint. Pigments are there are in inorganic pigments, and there's organic pigments.
Speaker 3:Inorganic pigments are more of your earth tone type colors. Your bay your browns, your beiges, and such. Whereas your organic pigments are your brighter colors, your yellows, your reds, and oranges. Organic pigments are considered UV unstable. So any color that is made with those organic pigments are going to have not great color blasting because of the the organic pigments used to make that color.
Speaker 1:Fascinating. So so, Jamila, is there anything I've forgotten to ask that we should that we should consider? What what else do you want us to make sure to incorporate in our choices? I think we've been pretty comprehensive.
Speaker 3:I think so.
Speaker 1:Yeah. This has been wonderful. Thank you so much. So, so I wanna thank you so much for sharing your enthusiasm for color and quality paint projects, with us. Clearly, it is a a passion that we share.
Speaker 3:And,
Speaker 1:for more information on selecting your paint products, you can find some really interesting articles and inspiration and some things that Jamila has written, on the Don Edwards website, which we'll put on our website, but it's www.DonEdwards.com. At Janet Design Interiors, we will always love to take you through the color selection process. So, of course, feel free to contact us. And in fact, in a moment of shameless self promotion, we have a book called the future interior designer's handbook. Now it's written for children eight to 12, but a lot of people find it useful, especially the color chapter on, on creating color schemes and how to look at color and how to make color choices.
Speaker 1:So Jana Design Interiors is a full service interior design firm working with commercial and residential clients. If you're thinking about a company move or a major home renovation or you're rebuilding after the loss of your home and you're in the Southern California area, please reach out to us at Janna at Janna Design Interiors dot com, and go to www.fromdisastertodreamhome.com where you can find all of our previous episodes and photos of each step of the construction process.
Speaker 2:Thank you for joining us on this episode of from disaster to dream home. The podcast that takes you inside the home building and rebuilding process. Each week, we bring you time tested practices and the latest trends through conversations with top professionals in the building industry. You can find other episodes of From Disaster to Dream Home at ewnpodcastnetwork.com, as well as Spotify, Apple Podcast, Audible, and most other major podcast streaming services. Need design help?
Speaker 2:You can contact us or find out more about our guests at from disaster to dream home Com. Until next time, let us guide and inspire you as you create the home of your dreams.