Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Join Derek Hudson as he explores Essential Dynamics, a framework for approaching the challenges facing people and organizations. Consider your Quest!
Welcome to Essential Dynamics. I'm Derek Hudson, the host of the Essential Dynamics podcast. I've been developing Essential Dynamics as a way to understand how we work together in organizations, how we get things done as people. And I'm really excited to have David Dorward together with me today on the on the podcast. David, welcome.
David:Thank you so much. You have a great name for your podcast. Congratulations. I love it.
Derek:Well, thanks very much. It's... There's a lot of meaning and essential dynamics, and sometimes I talk about that stuff. But today, we're gonna talk about basketball and buildings. I'm really excited for the conversation.
Derek:So just to set things up a little bit, David Doorward is a community servant, a community organizer. He sat in the legislature of province of Alberta for three years and was associate minister at that... For part of that time. We're gonna go back from before he was a politician when he was really getting stuff done, and I want I want him to tell us his story. So are you up for that, David?
David:Oh, for sure. It's a pleasure to be here.
Derek:Yeah. So, David, maybe you could just set the stage a little bit by telling us what what the Go Center is and what it became. Just just real high level, and then we'll start talking about how how we got there.
David:Well, the go the go center is the colloquial name for the building. Bruce Savile gave us a very large and and generous donation, and so the building is called the Savile Center... Savile community Community Sports Center. It rose out of the ground from a construction perspective in in 2009. Although it was seven years before that that I officially kicked off the start of it.
David:And two years before that, going back many years to the time when I envisioned it and then started to build the conceptual plan and then officially kicked it off in the spring of two thousand and two. We cut the ribbon in 2011. It's been operating for now fifteen years as a very successful building. It's five acres in size, which is 217,000 square feet, 12 full size basketball courts, volleyball, gymnastics as well with our Ortona Gymnastics, a partner of ours. And it's occupied all the time.
David:Busy. Busy. Busy. We could use a couple more of them.
Derek:Couple more of them and more parking and another LRT stop, probably.
David:Well, we may get into the parking issue because everybody brings that up.
Derek:So so my experience, I I heard about this from you many, many years ago, but I have a son who played basketball all through his growing up years. And we used to have, like, a game in Beaumont on the South Edge of Metro Edmonton in the morning and one in Saint Albert on the North Side of Edmonton Metro in the afternoon in winter roads and stuff like that. And it was only his last year playing when he was in grade 12 that the Savile Center opened, and we were able to drive ten minutes to that place and enjoy just a just a fantastic atmosphere. Like, you you walk in the room... Walk in the building and you feel the energy.
Derek:There's just, like, tons going on. I mean, of course, if it's a if it's a bears or pandas game, basketball or volleyball, there's even more energy. But just just the kids in there, it's just a fantastic facility, and it's, I think, probably unique in Canada in terms of the the scope of it. And so I... I'm just thrilled to have a chance to talk about the idea and the process.
Derek:So let's get started with... You you backed it up quite a bit. So tell us how you got the... Where did the idea come from?
David:Well, it came out of my being blessed... I guess, family being blessed by the game of basketball. I coached for about fourteen years in the community. I've... I was involved in in the first club basketball program with a guy named Phil Allen and Paul Sir.
David:And we put together that program. We we did a lot of things in basketball, and it was kinda coming to the end of our four children that I coached. Spencer was now getting involved in grade 10 basketball. And so my coaching days were gonna come to an end, and I thought, what can I leave the game? So I actually...
David:I was on the board of directors of basketball at the time, and I thought, well, let me build a a coaching, take all my coaching ideas and and build a manual. And I brought that to the board, and they said, what are you talking about? There's already manuals. Like, that doesn't... There's not a need there, David.
David:We don't need that. And so I thought, what is the pinch point? Like, what is what is the thing that narrows right down in the game of basketball that does not allow kids to play it? I could... As a coach, could always get...
David:You know, I could get coaches, dads, moms. I I could get players, easy. I could I could find balls. I could get the materials. I could get into the league.
David:What did I have a problem with? I had a problem with gyms. And so in the spring of of two thousand... What really pushed me was in the spring of two thousand and two, there was a teacher strike. And I I...
David:At that time, it was just right in February, March, and I figured, you know, I I think we wanna keep basketball rolling in the community. And so it really became poignant that really gym time was what people had a a lack of. And so why don't we build our own basketball facility for that? And now, fortunately, I had a model because the the the great folks that did indoor soccer had created the West End Soccer Center by that time. And so I kinda thought, well, if they can do it, we can do it.
David:So I just started going around and talking to people. I went and talked to the U of A, Mike Mann, who was the dean of phys ed. I went to Brian Anderson, who's sadly left us a while back and big loss to our city, of course. And Brian, as a counselor, was keen to get going. Brian always said that you're climbing Mount Everest, David.
David:Like, you're climbing Mount Everest. You can't raise enough money to get a building like that built. It's sports. It's not medicine, and you're gonna have a real difficulty. And so I said, okay.
David:Well, I'm I'm game to give it a try. And and so we we proceeded on from there, and we just continued to build. We found friends. There's a couple of techniques I used along the way to build those friendships we might get into. And along the way, we...
David:I recruited and found very folks that were just as keen as I was, fortunately, and they they became the board of directors, and they became the head of the committees, and the the chairperson in the committees feeding information up to the board that I created with the not for profit structure that's charitable, which you might wanna get into. We had to bring together the University of Alberta for the land. We had to bring together three levels of government to provide funding, and that wasn't easy because of their misunderstanding sometimes of how funding needs to be. Had many problems along the way, Derek. Really, really big problems.
David:But I am... I I was never unhappy with somebody using the word problem, but but I didn't like the word problem. I always thought it was, and you've used it in your podcast before, a challenge. I like that word better. But but more so, it was an opportunity to grow.
David:Because unless you have problems or challenges, you really don't know how you're doing, and you don't know what you can do to fix that. So we always had the the, I guess, philosophy or principle on our board that we would deal with these issues as they come up with... As opportunities to move forward in a stronger way, and that's how we approach them.
Derek:Well, I do wanna get into the obstacles because I'm sure that, there's some very interesting stories. But let's just talk about your early friends first. Who was the first person that you brought in?
David:I wanna say my wife, because I was running a a charter account firm at the time, and she was my office manager. And she would come into my office and say, do we have to pay this bill? And I'd say, yeah, because we're just starting out this venture, but we have to... You have to pay for some things, but keep it in a separate account. Someday that might get...
David:Well, it ended up being a donation eventually. But I sort of have to say that Janice was one of the first ones aware. But then the second was a gentleman who was named Bob Butland, and Bob virtually stood right... Sometimes ahead of me, actually. Bob was also the vice president of the Edmonton Youth Basketball Association when I was the president.
David:And when I was the president, I gave Bob two responsibilities. I said, Bob, we gotta pack away some money. So someday, this is probably year... Boy. Nineteen ninety nine ish.
David:And I said, Bob, we gotta we gotta have more money to put aside a few shekels for a building someday. And he was all over that, and I said, there's two ways to do it. We increase our fees just a bit, and it wasn't that expensive for kids to play basketball. So we increased that a bit. He And said, you gotta go to the city and get our fees reduced.
David:So he did both. And Bob just joined the... At the time, what was called the Go Center immediately upon me mentioning it to him. He stood there beside me. And after the building was built in 2011, I went on to politics, and Bob stayed with the building and ran it for years and years and years.
David:So Bob's number one in that regard.
Derek:That's fantastic. And when did it go in your mind from a good idea to we're really gonna do this?
David:Probably when we got the provincial money. The the city money we got because I was able to convince the city creatively with Brian Anderson's help that they shouldn't give me 10¢ unless I was able to raise all the money. So we creatively found a system that would work for them. You... When you're working with people in any situation like this, you always have to find what what is a win for the other side.
David:What what is it? And what strengthens us together? And and so, of course, we're gonna be strengthened together because they were gonna give 25% dollars instead of having to build a whole center themselves. A 100% dollars, 25% dollars without having to give me a dime if I couldn't raise the money. And so we we...
David:A 100% of their their 10,000... I'm sorry, $9,000... $9,000,000 was going to be for capital and no operating at all. But but then as a result of that, I was able to go to the feds and and the and the province and and others, charitable side, and and and get them convinced that I had $9,000,000 in the bank. Although, I kinda didn't have $9,000,000 in the bank, but essentially, I had a commitment for $9,000,000.
David:By the way, you mentioned the word charity. As you know, Derek, as a... As an accounting tax professional yourself that
Derek:Oh, just... I gotta stop I gotta stop it right there. That's I don't do tax. Please don't call me. Don't ask me.
Derek:I have an accountant. Okay. But I I like I I like accountants who do tax. I'm just not one of them.
David:Okay. Well, and I'm kinda in the same boat. Good good catch. We don't want them phone
Derek:That's right. We don't want them phoning us.
David:Alright. Well, good catch. Thank you for that. Most people would think, well, you can't be a charity if you're involved in sport. But the reality is that the income tax act that charities director at folks, they recognize that buildings themselves can be used for public reasons, including sport.
David:So you have to separate the operations from the building, which can be a charity. So we do If I
Derek:I pay for my kid to play basketball, that's a service to my family. I'd pay for that. But if you donate to a building that's got public benefit, it could be a charitable cost.
David:Correct. Yeah. And and that... We use that as as a lever to be able to have people contribute. We also actually indirectly use that in...
David:To to actually donate the whole building to the University of Alberta for a totally different purpose. Because the University of Alberta is a charity, and we were a charity. So we were able to donate a $40,000,000 building to the University of Alberta. By the way, I should say that any any group that's proceeding along a pathway of trying to get things done like this, you know, and dealing with any... Anything in business needs a solid foundation of concrete, not a soft, shifty base of their operations.
David:Have some solid things that you stand on and and be principle based and forward thinking and with the end goal in mind always. And in that regard, I was very pro going with a structure under the company's act called part nine company, and we we don't have time to get into that, but your listeners may be interested in checking into that versus a not for profit that's that's a society's act, not for profit. So two different ways to go. Yeah. For us, the controlled structure was a part nine.
David:And so I... My my overall message to your listeners is, you know, get the get the structure really solid, and then you have a better chance of success.
Derek:So so before you got a part nine incorporation, I think you had some other elements of a solid foundation. And you talked about sort of the pitch that you gave the city and then other levels of government. So take us back to from the point of view of the people you were gonna join your team and put money in, what was the problem that you were trying to solve? And what was the purpose of this activity? What are the...
Derek:Of this project?
David:The problem was not enough youth being in in children and families involved in in activity in their lives and sport. The problem was a very dispersed group of athletes, referees, leaders, organizers. I mean, very disparate. Mhmm. Meaning, they would show up at a gym, play, want to leave because it's so packed and everybody's footwear is all over the place.
David:We we needed to have a center place in Edmonton, which would be the basketball hub for for an attitude of wanting to go over to the building and being there all day long, and if... Maybe the whole afternoon, if it's tournament all day long, being able to stay in the building in between games because the the hallway is two football fields long, and it's nice. It's 23 feet wide. I designed it that way. And then staying for...
David:You mentioned the bears and pandas volleyball or gymnastics play in the building, and they have their own suite in the building to run their operations. So getting all of that in one place, kids seeing the referee change rooms. At one time, we have up to 30 referees there in that... In coming and going out of that room. Gee.
David:Maybe I could referee because I... Now I see the referees. Maybe I could be the administrator of something. Oh, there's somebody playing wheelchair basketball. Wow.
David:I could do that. There's somebody playing sitting volleyball. Maybe I should think about doing that. There's badminton. There's 10...
David:Table tennis. There's a there's a gymnastics suite right over there for for Ortona gymnastics. There's volleyball being played with the regional tournament. Wow. I'd...
David:My friend's playing there. I wanna go and see what that's all about. So much more community involvement was the pitch to be able to to get this done in a very safe, healthy kind of a way.
Derek:So if if you're talking to people whose job it is, let's say, is quality of life in the city of Edmonton, then your hypothesis is if young people are involved in meaningful activities and particularly in a bit of a community for that, that they will, what, develop life skills, stay out of trouble, have fun, be physically and mentally healthy, all that stuff?
David:Absolutely. And and that's a whole new... You know, not a whole new, but a other podcast, which has been probably covered many times. And and certainly, there's there's a lot more there's a lot more information out there and and studies done in... On those particular areas.
David:In my experience, youth, children who are involved in sport generally are healthier mentally, physically, staying out of problems, staying out of malls, coming down to the gym to sit around and play when they want. So it's it's it's just an extremely good thing. It's it's probably one of the single most important things that our politicians and leaders in our communities can do is these kind of centers. And and not just the sport that I happen to be stumbling along with basketball. I've mentioned many others, but ice rinks and swimming places and all those would fit along the same kind of way.
David:Let's keep people active, especially since we live in a northern climate.
Derek:Yeah. So there's something about basketball though that you just need a pair of shoes and you can play. And so it's pretty accessible. And I know that you worked really hard to get the building located on the LRT line. Tell me a little bit about your motivation there.
David:Well, you kinda said it. I mean, that's it. Getting kids there was most important. We actually... When I went to the city in 2002, I asked for money and land, and they were able to, over a period of time, give us the land at a place called John Fry Park, which isn't that far away actually from the university's South Campus area.
David:However, the bus service was not good at John Fry Park, the piece of land that we ended up getting at Savile in the South Campus at the university is better in size. So we ended up doing a situation where we kindly went to the city and said, apologies, but we've been able to... And and and as a side in the middle of my sentence, we've been able to get the university finally understanding once we get the $10,000,000 from the province. And so they were then willing to talk to me about bringing the building there, albeit I had the land at John Fry. And bless our hearts, the city of Edmonton were very kind to be able to say to us, yes, you'll still get the money.
David:It won't be on city land at John Fry Park. It'll be at university land, but we still support you a 100% with the funding that we had agreed to in that package of land and funds. So there you go. On the on the LRT line. And now kids can come from wherever and connect through and get right off there at the building.
Derek:That's that's fantastic. And there's a lot of kids in that building on... Particularly on a Saturday in the winter.
David:Yeah. Oh, oh, yeah. Yeah.
Derek:So You can feel the energy. Tell me a little bit about... You've got the city behind you, and they don't have to write a check, but they... If everyone else is in, they're in, and they're the first in that sense. Now you have the university and the province and the federal government.
Derek:Those are the big other contributors. Is that right?
David:Yeah. The the... I should mention the province. I mean, there there you go. Derek is a is a classic example of taking an issue and then finding a solution and being thankful for the fact that it just isn't a closed door, that there's there's, you know, there's an active conversation happening.
David:And so there was a gentleman, the minister of culture, Gary Maher, at the time. Gary and I were past the point where he understood the project. And in other words, there has... You know, the the good thing about taking nine years to build the the building to get from cutting the ribbon to the conceptualization state that I did was that we had time to get these things done and and understood more and and taught too many people. So Gary was past the point of, you know, not knowing about the project.
David:He understood it, and he wanted it to happen. But... And so he and I were yakking one day, and I said, Gary, if we can't find the money in any budgets, which was the concern, because there was just no money. There was money to give to cities, but I had already got my money from the city.
Derek:Right.
David:So so I couldn't... I wanted the money from the province. No. I I want it directly, please. And and so I said, Gary, if we can't do that, we we have to...
David:If we can't get the funds because it's not in anybody's budget to give it to us, well, then can we create a budget item? So we got together and and and it was through the gaming side of things, which legally has to be sent out into the community. And we created actually a new program within the within the the culture department in gaming, which which specifically gave funds out to non municipality groups, maximum $10,000,000 matching. So it had to be matched, and I had that with the city eventually, you know, that is there. And and so Calgary got funds.
David:Edmonton got funds, and there were rural funds the the year 2008, I think, that we got those funds. The the federal government was very complex. They were the slowest to come along, which... And they basically... They also understood the project.
David:But they said, look, if we give you month... Ten... If we match the province, we're gonna be in trouble because everybody's gonna want one of these centers gonna have to come to us. And so we wanna do it indirectly. So long story short, the University of Alberta was bidding on university ad games.
David:And and we were building the building at the South Campus already. We had that committed. And so they... The Western Diversification folks at the federal government said, look, we will get you the funding to the university through to you if you will allow the building to be used for the university. You had games as part of that.
David:I said, great. Except I said to them, I need a plan b. Because what if the university doesn't get the university ad games? So my wife and I went to Belgium that year, and we always wanted to be there when they opened an envelope. And they opened the envelope, and it said Korea, South Korea.
David:So my plan b was good I built a plan b. So that's another message to your listeners. You know, it's... It... That's why I love the word dynamics, Derek, because that was a dynamic situation.
David:Very clearly, a very challenging dynamic situation. So I actually was in Belgium, and I got a text at BlackBerry at the time, and it said it said, David, I guess you were right. We need a plan b.
Derek:Plan b.
David:So plan b ended up being a program the federal government came up with, and we got $14,700,000 instead of the 10. So I kinda like Korean folks because they stole the games away from Edmonton, but because of that, we got delayed a bit, we and got a bump of $4,700,000 from the feds. So,
Derek:David, we have to we have to wrap this episode up now, but I'm gonna take the mic back because I just have to stitch some of these things together. So I was a missionary in Korea in the early eighties. And while I was still a missionary, I heard about the university games that were held in Edmonton in '83.
David:Yep.
Derek:And I had my parents fill out the form to volunteer to be an interpreter for team Korea coming to the to the university games, and I was assigned the basketball team. Wow. And so I was the guide for the Korean basketball team at the university ad. And so I got to be an interpreter for the team and go to all their games. That also got me a backstage pass, I got to see Canada beat USA and Charles Barkley and that whole thing.
Derek:I'm sure you were there. That that was amazing. And then my parents were so kind that we had the whole Korean basketball team over to our house for dinner. It was, like, super fun. Wow.
Derek:Super fun. Just, like, amazing experience. And I love watching the Korean kids play ball. They were... Like, they weren't big, but, man, they could shoot and play defense.
Derek:And, anyway, it was super fun. So I have very fond memories that every time I see the Butterdome, I used to work Kitty Corner from the Butterdome, I just get excited about that whole event. So I'm glad we had it once. Sounds like fair enough. We'll let Korea have it the second time, and we'll get our ducks in a row for for the Go Center.
Derek:So let's carry on next time
David:Sure.
Derek:As we need to we need to hear about... A little bit more about the challenges and then how y'all pulled pulled it together. Then we can talk about what we learned from it. Is that okay?
David:You'll have me back then.
Derek:Okay. That's awesome. So David, how can people get ahold of you if they want to to learn... Hear more stories from Dave Ward?
David:Yeah. I'm on LinkedIn. I'm pretty accessible on Facebook, and that's probably the best two sources. Any DM in either of those places will get me real fast.
Derek:Well, we'll hook up some links for people to be able to find you. And so we're gonna come back and to hear more about David's epic adventure. And for everyone, until next time, consider your quest.