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Practical governance for volunteer committees and not-for-profit organisations. Hosted by governance consultants Kate Hartwig and Kate McPhee, each episode tackles one topic — clearly, honestly, and without the jargon. Short enough to finish before your coffee goes cold.
The meeting has been going for ninety long minutes. The same three people have spoken on every agenda item. One of them is on his fourth lap of the same point.
Kate H:There are two committee members that have said nothing the entire meeting. One of them is the person with the most relevant expertise on the biggest item of the night.
Kate M:The chair has just said, any other thoughts? For the fifth time to the same sea of silence. And it's already twenty minutes past when the meeting was supposed to end.
Kate H:A well chaired meeting, unlike this one, is one of the most underrated governance tools there is. Welcome to the Committee Room.
Kate H:Welcome back to The Committee Room. I'm Kate Hartwig.
Kate M:And I'm Kate McPhee.
Kate M:We help small, time poor, volunteer led committees run better meetings, make better decisions, build stronger structures and have better systems with less stress and less mess.
Kate H:Last episode, we built the foundations of a good meeting before anyone had even arrived preparation, agenda structure and reports. Today, we're inside the committee room. We're talking about the chair's job, managing the discussion and guiding the committee to make decisions that stick, because you can have the best prepared agenda in the world and still have a terrible meeting if nobody's running the room well.
Kate M:And a quick note before we start, this podcast is for general information on best practice governance for small to medium associations. It is not legal advice. Right. Let's get started. And on that note, for me, there are two absolute basics before anything else.
Kate M:Start on time and finish on time.
Kate H:Starting on time is about respect. If you regularly wait for the late comers, you're training people that the start time doesn't matter and you're disrespecting the people who showed up on time. Provided that you have a quorum, you start the meeting on time. Late comers can catch up and if they're embarrassed, so much the better.
Kate M:Yes. Indeed. And finishing on time matters for the same reason. People have made plans based on the meeting time frame. So if the agenda says seven to 9PM, the meeting finishes at 9PM.
Kate H:Start on time, finish on time.
Kate M:If you haven't got through everything, then defer what's not urgent or agree that there can be a short extension. You never just keep struggling on through, you know, till 10:30 because people stop coming when they never know when they can leave.
Kate H:Starting and finishing on time is a form of respect for all of your fellow committee members. Full stop.
Kate M:So let's talk now about the chair's real job. The chair's job during a meeting is not just following the agenda. It's managing the discussion, And that's a skilled active role, not a passive one.
Kate H:Three things a good chair does consistently drawing out quieter voices, redirecting the ones who've already had their say, and keeping discussion focused on the issue at hand rather than the personal ities involved.
Kate M:Drawing out the quieter members, Kate, I think that's one of the most important things a chair can do because not everyone volunteers their view, but the person who said nothing might be the one with the most relevant expertise as our opening demonstrated. So a direct warm invitation works better than an open question to the room. So something really simple like, you know, Sarah, you've worked in this area. What are your thoughts on this? But often it skipped over as an opportunity.
Kate H:Now that's not putting anyone on the spot. It's signalling that their contribution is valued and expected. Very different thing.
Kate M:Particularly if that person's been brought onto the committee because they've got expertise in a particular area, then yes, it is an expectation and it's okay for the chair opportunity to draw out that quieter member. Then there's the redirect, the committee member who's on their third circuit of the same point. So saying something like, thanks, Dave. We've heard that for you. Let's hear from some other people now. So you say it warmly, not dismissively. It keeps things moving along without shutting anyone down.
Kate H:And when everyone has had their say or discussion is going in circles and people are clearly ready to make a decision, you say, well, we've heard a good range of views on this. I think we're ready to move to a vote. That's leadership. That's what the chair is there for.
Kate M:In Just a Tick, I say the chair should be focused on purpose, process and pace, not the content. The job of the rest of the committee is to be focused on the content. You know, that's the division of labor in the meeting. So you certainly don't want the chair trying to do both. That gets messy.
Kate M:And sometimes when things get a little warm in a meeting, and they do, even in well run committees, it's the chair's job to say, let's keep this focused on the issue, not on each other. A calm, clear redirect. The chair's kind of like a traffic light. They manage who speaks and win without playing favorites and without being heavy handed about it.
Kate H:Yeah. That's a really good way to frame that issue. The broader culture the chair sets matters enormously. Respect as the baseline. Focus on ideas and issues, not people. Listening, really listening, as we've said before, not just waiting for your turn to talk. And be willing to change your mind when you hear a good argument. You're all on the same team.
Kate H:The chair isn't the only one responsible for how the meeting runs. Now, we both make this point in our resources and in the training we run. It's every committee member's job to know the basics of meeting procedure, to respect the chair's authority and stay focused on the content rather than the personalities. A great chair can't save a roomful of people who simply aren't willing to play their part.
Kate M:So for those occasions when things are complex or sensitive or have been going around in circles, there are more formal rules of debate that are really helpful for the chair to have up their sleeve. Now in brief, what happens is that the chair says the meeting will only discuss something if there is a formal motion on the floor that has been moved and seconded. So there will be speakers for the motion and then against the motion, ideally two or three on each side, or if necessary until everyone's had their opportunity to speak. There's no interrupting. All questions go through the chair. They are not directed at other members.
Kate H:It's not something you'd use at every meeting, but it can completely reset a meeting that's gone off the rails. Just knowing it exists and that the chair is prepared to use it tends to be enough. And it's an active choice to make, Kate. The chair will say, I am moving to the formal rules of debate. After that, all of those things come into play and the discussion goes straight into that mode.
Kate M:And just make it really clear. This means that the participants in the meeting direct their comments or questions to the chairperson, not to each other. So that signals you know it's not your turn yet, and you're asking permission to speak. You're not just barging in. So saying through the chair is not a green light to interrupt.
Kate M:So you signal, you wait for the chair to give you the nod, or you can raise your hand and wait to be recognised. You know, that often works just as well unless you've had the experience that I've had on a number of occasions where you're sitting there with your arm being propped up by your other arm waiting for the chair to notice you. Sometimes chairs deliberately don't, but that's the sign of a bad chair, not the sign of a bad participant. Either way, the message is the same. You're respecting the chair's role and the right of your fellow committee members to have their say because nobody wants to listen to a meeting bully however great their ideas might be.
Kate H:Yeah, well exactly. And if you want to see the formal rules of debate in motion, just watch Question Time in Parliament sometime. You don't have to watch it for long. You know, nobody needs to be put through that misery for too long. But you'll see that every question is directed through the speaker, and the speaker is the only person who is actually addressed.
Kate M:Having had a little bit of experience with that, actually watching parliament during the committee proceedings is better if you wanna see it in action properly. But anyway, that's just a slightly cynical view. Okay. Let's look now at the decision itself because the whole point of a committee meeting is to make decisions, and some committees make decisions very badly or even worse, not at all.
Kate H:So we'll be doing a deep dive into decision making next episode but in terms of process every formal decision needs a motion. Someone who proposes a specific clearly worded course of action and it always starts with the word that. Someone else seconds it, which signals that at least two people in the room think it's worth the committee's time to discuss. If nobody seconds, the motion lapses and you move on.
Kate M:And everybody's happy because you've saved time. Then you have further discussion as needed and then the chair will call for the vote. Usually that will be done by show of hands. So all in favor and you count, all against and you count. Majority wins unless it's a, you need a special resolution for something and then your constitution will say that you need 75% majority.
Kate H:But they're fairly rare circumstances, so simple majority is what gets it over the line most of the time. Yep. So what gets recorded in the minutes? Well, motion itself, who moved it, who seconded it, and the result, carried or not carried. And here the preparation we talked about in the last episode really pays off.
Kate H:If your item of business is a report that already contains a recommendation framed as a motion, it goes straight into the minutes as written. No trying to get the wording right on the fly. No ambiguity about what was decided.
Kate M:Everybody's happy because the meeting's moving really quickly and your secretary is very, very grateful. Now, Kate, what makes a committee decision stick? What in legal terms is called a safe decision?
Kate H:A safe decision requires a properly moved motion, a seconder, sufficient discussion, a clean vote, and a clear record. Now miss any one of those five steps and the decision is in trouble and it could very well be back to bite you at some stage in the future.
Kate M:And if someone fundamentally disagrees with a decision, well they can ask for their dissent to be noted in the minutes and that's perfectly proper. But once the vote is taken, it is the committee's decision and everyone is expected to support and act on it. Discuss. Decide. Do it.
Kate M:Vigorous debate inside the room, one voice outside it. Now I know we've said that many times across this series, but it bears saying again because it's one of those principles that really matters.
Kate M:So to recap, start on time, finish on time. That's a form of respect. The chair's job is active. Draw out the quiet voices, redirect the loud ones, keep things focused and moving. The three p's, purpose, process and pace. Let the committee members focus on the content. And every decision needs a properly moved motion, a seconder, discussion, a vote and a clear record. That's what makes a committee decision stick.
Kate H:I particularly like the three p's, but I think I preferred the seven Ps from our last episode.
Kate M:The one with the beep?
Kate H:The one with the beep. Oh, dear. Did I forget to put the beep in? Never mind.
Kate H:So really good reports, good agendas, good sharing, good decisions. It's the whole system working together.
Kate M:So the listener's challenge for this week. If you're the chair, then at your next meeting, identify the one or two people who tend to say the least and make a point of directly inviting their contribution on at least one agenda item. Don't just ask the whole room, ask them and see what comes back.
Kate H:And if you're not the chair, notice how decisions are being made in your meetings. Is every decision properly moved and second in motion with a clear vote and a clear record? If not, that's a conversation worth having with your chair and your secretary. Regular listeners to the show know we like to make your committee life easier, so in the show notes you'll find a plain language summary of the very basic rules of debate what they are and when to use them, whether you're in the chair or an ordinary committee member wanting to get home on time.
Kate M:If every meeting in your organisation feels like a battle, that's usually a sign of something deeper going on, culture, structure, or both. Now that's exactly the kind of thing we work on directly with committees through Fresh Allsorts. If you want more information about how to work with us, you'll find the details in the show notes and at freshallsorts.com.au.
Kate H:And if you've got a governance question you'd like us to tackle on the show, use the contact form at the committee room dot com. Au. Your question could be the inspiration for a future episode.
Kate M:Kate, I've just had a question come in from, from someone about, their chairperson who they say regularly moves and seconds motions in meetings. Oh. So I think we're going to add that to our next questions from listeners episode, and we can explain why that's nearly always a definite no no. So if today's episode, listeners, has helped you, then please subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, and don't forget to share The Committee Love around. Check out the show notes and the freebie downloads at thecommitteeroom.com.au.
Kate H:Today, we've talked about the mechanics of making a decision. Next episode, we'll go deeper into the principles of decision making, how not making a decision is a decision in itself and generally not a good one, and the checklist that your committee should use every time.
Kate M:And until then, I'm Kate McPhee.
Kate H:And I'm Kate Hartwig.
Kate M:And this has been The Committee Room.
Kate H:Remember, you don't need good luck if you've got good governance.