Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Interviews with top marketers sharing tactical tips, strategies, and lessons learned to help you grow your business. Hosted by Dave Gerhardt, founder of Exit Five, former CMO, and author of Founder Brand. Learn more at exitfive.com
Dave [0:00:01]: You're listening to The Dave Gerhardt Show.
Dave [0:00:02]: Hey, my guess on this episode is Hailey Mcdonald.
Dave [0:00:19]: She's VP of revenue marketing at Sprouts social.
Dave [0:00:22]: They're a social intelligence platform with thirty thousand customers they've been around sixteen years.
Dave [0:00:26]: She sits within a seventy five person marketing, Org, three marketing leaders that report to the CMO.
Dave [0:00:32]: Her job is all about revenue marketing.
Dave [0:00:33]: She's the one responsible for the pipeline.
Dave [0:00:35]: This is the hardest role to hire for in B2B right now that we're hearing revenue marketing demand gen.
Dave [0:00:40]: So we talk about her approach at Sprout Social.
Dave [0:00:42]: Why it's all about the strategy and the segmentation, not the channels.
Dave [0:00:46]: Enjoy my conversation with Hailey Mcdonald.
Dave [0:00:49]: Seems like this role, which you are, your VP of revenue marketing, but this is, like demand gen, which seems to be this unicorn type of hire today.
Dave [0:00:57]: Why is this the role so hard to hire for?
Dave [0:01:00]: This is off the cuff not in our prep, but, like, this role of, like, a demand gen leader.
Dave [0:01:04]: This is you?
Dave [0:01:04]: Why is this role so hard to find?
Hailey [0:01:06]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:01:06]: Well, I mean, I think there's a lot of people, you know, like, the demand done isn't new.
Hailey [0:01:10]: It's been like, the favorite child.
Hailey [0:01:12]: They think of especially B2B tech for a while.
Hailey [0:01:14]: I do think right now, it's, you know, there's a lot of pressure on hiring this role because ultimately, you're responsible.
Hailey [0:01:20]: I view is my responsibility to attach all of marketing activity into some sort of, like, revenue generating machine.
Hailey [0:01:28]: Right?
Hailey [0:01:28]: Like, ultimately, for the most part, if you're in B2B tech or B2B marketing, you're there to like, sell a service or sell a product, you're not there to just have fun in games.
Hailey [0:01:37]: And so it's the seriousness business of connect all of that together, and that can be really challenging when you also wanna do good marketing.
Hailey [0:01:44]: You know, that, like feels human and you're connecting with people and you're making people feel things.
Hailey [0:01:48]: It's like, I'm crunching the numbers in the background and someone else has to make that experience work too on the other side.
Dave [0:01:55]: Well, yeah.
Dave [0:01:55]: Or it's like, there's this this fundamental tension between the channels that, like, this podcast would be one example of.
Dave [0:02:02]: Right?
Dave [0:02:02]: Like, the ROI of doing this podcast for company.
Dave [0:02:04]: It's a little bit muddy.
Dave [0:02:05]: It's not just like, because we did twelve episodes this month.
Dave [0:02:08]: We're gonna book three sales meetings, but there's lots of, like, implications that you can get from doing this podcast.
Dave [0:02:15]: And so I think, like, the reason it's become that darling of the B2B world is because you want someone on the team who you feel like is responsible for, like, making sure sales gets fed.
Hailey [0:02:24]: One hundred percent, like, it's my job to kind of engineer that connective tissue, and I have to do it from a place of authenticity and also a place that connects onto the product side as well.
Hailey [0:02:34]: Right?
Hailey [0:02:34]: Like, because ultimately, you want your...
Hailey [0:02:36]: You wanna get great customers.
Hailey [0:02:38]: You wanna get great customers that say with you for a long time and spend more money with you, but you also want them to be getting the best experience and use out of the product.
Hailey [0:02:46]: And so, like, figuring out all of that pattern recognition and like, okay.
Hailey [0:02:50]: Well, what's the connective tissue and therefore, how can we design our campaigns and make sense of our marketing activities?
Hailey [0:02:55]: Like, that's my bread butter.
Hailey [0:02:57]: That's what I do every day.
Dave [0:02:59]: Okay.
Dave [0:02:59]: So we're we're gonna get into that.
Dave [0:03:01]: You're big and segmentation apparently from my prep dot we're gonna get into that.
Dave [0:03:05]: But let just set the lay of the land for the sprouts social marketing or looks like seventy five ish people on the marketing team, and there's kinda three arms that you report into the CMO.
Dave [0:03:15]: There's the revenue and growth.
Dave [0:03:17]: That's your piece.
Dave [0:03:18]: There's a product and customer and there's brand experience.
Dave [0:03:20]: And then this is a note in my doc.
Dave [0:03:23]: This just is just did the team runs on a chief of staff who W cross functional.
Dave [0:03:26]: Can you give me the lay of the land.
Dave [0:03:27]: Give me the marketing Org a little bit overview?
Dave [0:03:30]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:03:30]: Yeah Yeah.
Hailey [0:03:30]: So we got kind of, like, our three arms that you described exactly and we're all linked together in locks, works really nice that way.
Hailey [0:03:37]: And then, we are very lucky that we also have an office of the CMO where we have a chief of staff who does in fact, gran us and bring, like, structured to everything that we do and make sure that we're able to connect all three of our centers, but then also extends out into our other cross functional groups too.
Hailey [0:03:53]: So just I haven't had that every reorganization, but oh my gosh.
Hailey [0:03:57]: It's, like, big shout out to having a chief of staff when you do at that privilege?
Dave [0:04:01]: Yeah.
Dave [0:04:01]: Yeah.
Dave [0:04:01]: Well, that's why I wanted to ask, like, I don't have familiarity with that.
Dave [0:04:04]: You haven't had it before.
Dave [0:04:05]: So what is that?
Dave [0:04:06]: The team...
Dave [0:04:06]: Like, what is this office of the CMO?
Dave [0:04:08]: Is that like, a...
Dave [0:04:09]: Does each company have a...
Dave [0:04:10]: Each team have a department?
Dave [0:04:11]: Like what does that even mean?
Dave [0:04:12]: I don't understand.
Hailey [0:04:13]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:04:13]: So I I actually...
Hailey [0:04:14]: I had a similar setup that my last company to at Mari where we...
Hailey [0:04:18]: We're marketing at a chief of staff and there were a couple of departments that had it, particularly the ones that have to work incredibly closely together, and particularly the ones that like your plans.
Hailey [0:04:27]: Essentially need a fit, like, a puzzle piece with another department's plans.
Hailey [0:04:31]: Right?
Hailey [0:04:32]: And making that happen both cross functionally as well all the ways for your team is just, like, due to the full time job.
Hailey [0:04:39]: And that's why we have a chief of staff that just, like, helps keep us honest around that.
Hailey [0:04:43]: I think dude we're also just a bunch of marketers.
Hailey [0:04:45]: And so with like, if we get into a room and we don't have those facilitator.
Hailey [0:04:49]: It's a mess.
Hailey [0:04:50]: So we have we have someone that helps them do that.
Dave [0:04:54]: Any marketing event, I've been to ever.
Dave [0:04:56]: It's like, you go around the room and you do introductions and next thing you know the meeting is over.
Dave [0:04:59]: Like, everyone has their whole spiel.
Dave [0:05:02]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:05:03]: It's like, our chief and staff, ad, like, teach just, like, on point and just, like, really make sure that we get what we need out of everything that we do and that we like you know Okay.
Hailey [0:05:10]: Whatever marketers also, lots of big idea, but What's realistic.
Hailey [0:05:14]: How do you bring those to life?
Hailey [0:05:15]: Like, that's something that our chief of staff supports to.
Dave [0:05:18]: Okay.
Dave [0:05:18]: Cool.
Dave [0:05:18]: So since you...
Dave [0:05:19]: You've been there for...
Dave [0:05:20]: You know, I think you joined in the spring ish, Linkedin says five months.
Hailey [0:05:25]: Mh.
Dave [0:05:26]: What's been your big task?
Dave [0:05:26]: It looks like this whole thing around segmentation and really thinking how the company is gonna generate pipeline.
Dave [0:05:33]: Why don't you take me through some of that?
Hailey [0:05:35]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:05:35]: So I think, you know, another part, if I had to talk about revenue marketing in general at a higher level, I think a lot of it is around, like, helping your marketing teams create plans around how people buy.
Hailey [0:05:48]: And that's, you know, both, like, you wanna create a good experience for your customers, but you also, like, want your activities make sense, control your, like, cost of operating all of that.
Hailey [0:05:58]: So sp actually has been, you know, we're fifteen year old company.
Hailey [0:06:03]: We've always been very trial forward product where you go to the sites.
Hailey [0:06:07]: It's like, try it out.
Hailey [0:06:07]: You can get right into it.
Hailey [0:06:09]: But been a sales organization for a really long time.
Hailey [0:06:12]: So you are an individual practitioner even and you would, like, go talk to a salesperson.
Hailey [0:06:16]: Right, which has served us really well because we've created these amazing customer experiences.
Hailey [0:06:21]: We've been able to, like, move up market and we're with some of the biggest brands in the world, but it also can get like, that's not the they only scale so far.
Hailey [0:06:30]: Right?
Hailey [0:06:30]: So I was brought in specifically to kind of thread out our product led growth motion and run that alongside?
Dave [0:06:36]: Sorry.
Dave [0:06:36]: Can we go back that?
Dave [0:06:37]: What only scales so far?
Dave [0:06:38]: Meaning, like, once did you change the talking about if there's, like, a trial or free experience or not versus the, like, bridging the gap between either getting on the phone and talking to sales or not buying from you?
Hailey [0:06:49]: I mean, just really honestly, sales like growth motion gets really expensive.
Hailey [0:06:52]: Particularly when you're...
Hailey [0:06:55]: You know, like, what you're serving such a broad market.
Dave [0:06:58]: Yeah.
Dave [0:06:58]: Can you break that down?
Dave [0:06:59]: Like, why?
Dave [0:06:59]: What does a sales led growth motion mean versus another motion and why does it get expensive?
Hailey [0:07:05]: No.
Hailey [0:07:05]: That's a great call out.
Hailey [0:07:06]: So I mean, sales led.
Hailey [0:07:07]: Right?
Hailey [0:07:07]: It's super human.
Hailey [0:07:09]: So you go interact with a website, you request to a demo you start a trial, and you have a human, your customer service person.
Hailey [0:07:16]: Like, your account executive reaches out fold your hand tells you everything that you possibly need to know.
Hailey [0:07:21]: It's a very concierge experience, but feels good.
Hailey [0:07:24]: That's fun.
Hailey [0:07:25]: Right?
Hailey [0:07:25]: Like, that's super great.
Hailey [0:07:26]: That side, not everybody wants to buy like that.
Hailey [0:07:29]: Number one.
Hailey [0:07:30]: Like, some people just wanna interact.
Dave [0:07:32]: Look, I'll say it for me, annoying is shit.
Dave [0:07:35]: I'm sorry.
Dave [0:07:35]: I understand.
Dave [0:07:36]: This is the dichotomy of marketing where, like, I'm allowed to have both thoughts, but I wrote about this in their day.
Dave [0:07:41]: It's like, and we don't even do.
Dave [0:07:43]: Someone was asking like the price of our community or whatever.
Dave [0:07:45]: And I was like, don't...
Dave [0:07:46]: It's not published.
Dave [0:07:46]: But as a buyer, I'm like, I wanna know the price.
Dave [0:07:49]: And so this is, like, yes, on the company side, we say you're gonna get a you're gonna get a concierge.
Dave [0:07:53]: I'm like, no.
Dave [0:07:54]: I don't want that because I know what that means.
Dave [0:07:55]: That means that this person is going to call me.
Dave [0:07:57]: Literally, my phone is in my pocket right now because god, my phone number is you know, plastered across the Internet.
Dave [0:08:01]: My wife won't let me change it.
Dave [0:08:03]: She's like, dude, we've been together for fifteen years.
Dave [0:08:05]: I finally memorize your phone number.
Dave [0:08:07]: You can't change it just because you lost Pam.
Dave [0:08:08]: But, yeah, I don't wanna say that out loud.
Hailey [0:08:11]: I think it's totally fair.
Hailey [0:08:11]: Right.
Hailey [0:08:12]: Like some people don't wanna buy, like, that.
Hailey [0:08:13]: And then there's other instances where it's just like, you can move faster, exploring a product on your own through more, like, product led growth where, you know, like, the product is designed in a way for self discovery.
Hailey [0:08:24]: That just like suits people's needs a little bit better.
Hailey [0:08:27]: In addition, they're, like, if you do it well, and you do it right, on the company's side, it's more affordable to run a product led growth and so many organizations, so many start up start up like that.
Hailey [0:08:37]: So we're kind of in the opposite where we started out sales lab and now we're really developing that product led motion to run alongside it.
Dave [0:08:44]: Okay.
Dave [0:08:44]: And is your Ic, like, an enterprise customer?
Dave [0:08:47]: Because typically the sales led motion is more of, like, an up market customer, or are you selling to multiple?
Dave [0:08:53]: Who is your Ic?
Dave [0:08:54]: That's the question I meant to ask.
Hailey [0:08:56]: Dude that's the tough thing about a place like sprout is, like, we serve such a broad...
Hailey [0:09:00]: Such a broad audience.
Hailey [0:09:02]: So we go all the way down from like, individual practitioners or, like, creators that can use, like, our software for, like, publishing and analytics and, like, managing all of the different inbox across, like, ten different platforms that they might have.
Hailey [0:09:14]: And then we have some of the biggest brands in the world too.
Hailey [0:09:17]: So our Ic is enormous, which is why I, like, always laugh, like, someone is gonna punch me in the base that they gonna be say segmentation one more time on my team at my company, but it's, like this is why segmentation is so important for us so that we're...
Hailey [0:09:30]: We can really drive effectiveness through our marketing rather than just kind of having one a one size fits off, which gets a little and isn't effective, to like people People need a special message on a special panel.
Dave [0:09:43]: That's cool.
Dave [0:09:43]: One of the reasons I like doing this podcast is because I think when I've...
Dave [0:09:46]: You do it so much.
Dave [0:09:47]: I've now seen all different types of companies, and I take somebody.
Dave [0:09:51]: I think of someone, like Claire, who's VP marketing a tech metric
Hailey [0:09:54]: Okay.
Dave [0:09:55]: They have a very specific Ic.
Dave [0:09:56]: It's like this type of has to be an auto repair shop has to be doing this has to be in this location has to be this.
Dave [0:10:03]: Then just last week, I do a podcast with Katie who's runs marketing at Survey monkey, and she's more similar to you, which is, like, Well, we have enterprise customers?
Dave [0:10:11]: We have small business customers and it's like, okay.
Dave [0:10:14]: Well, what do you show on the website?
Dave [0:10:15]: And who do you argue with, you know, the VP of this segment is, like mad that there's not enough product marketing material for this?
Dave [0:10:22]: And it's like Grass is always greener.
Dave [0:10:23]: So for you, though, this path to driving more predictable revenue in these segments has been segmentation.
Dave [0:10:30]: Maybe your team is sick about hearing you talk about segmentation, but where not?
Dave [0:10:33]: So bless us with some of?
Dave [0:10:34]: What are you doing?
Dave [0:10:35]: Take us into the mind?
Dave [0:10:36]: How you go and attack?
Dave [0:10:36]: How do you build a marketing strategy here?
Dave [0:10:38]: What are you doing?
Hailey [0:10:40]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:10:40]: So I like to describe this, like, if you don't know what your segments are or, like, I think in some cases, organizations will be in a situation where people are thinking about segmentation out of necessity.
Hailey [0:10:53]: Like, maybe the marketing team is thinking about it because at some point, you have to when you go to, like, distribute your activities and, like, what email lists you're sending to.
Hailey [0:11:03]: And, you know, like, things like that.
Hailey [0:11:04]: And you may find yourselves, orient around personas or something like that.
Hailey [0:11:10]: When you think about segmenting and creating unique groups.
Hailey [0:11:12]: Right?
Hailey [0:11:13]: And your company might be in a situation where marketing, doing that, sales of thinking about segmentation in different way product is thinking about it in another way.
Hailey [0:11:20]: That is where I see, like, I mean, efficiency go to die.
Hailey [0:11:24]: Basically, when everyone is think is either not being about segmentation at all or is all doing it differently.
Hailey [0:11:30]: So my first sort of principle is that you really need alignment across your revenue organization, so, you know, sales, marketing customer as well as product on, like, who are your key ideal customer profiles segments.
Hailey [0:11:43]: And that can be...
Hailey [0:11:45]: I mean, there's more than one way to peel a potato.
Hailey [0:11:46]: If and...
Hailey [0:11:47]: It can be done in a lot of different ways.
Hailey [0:11:49]: Sometimes you'll see it show up in verticals.
Hailey [0:11:51]: Sometimes you'll see it as, like, business types.
Hailey [0:11:53]: I generally try to lead that conversation around how how are your customers buying?
Hailey [0:11:59]: Like, how does that happen?
Hailey [0:12:01]: How do they think about themselves, what do they come to you about?
Hailey [0:12:04]: And a lot of times that will show itself in, like, use cases?
Hailey [0:12:08]: Like so when we think about sprout social?
Hailey [0:12:11]: I think, like, think about retail and e commerce.
Hailey [0:12:14]: When they wanna use social media, they're thinking about it oftentimes as a channel where they're selling their products.
Hailey [0:12:21]: So, like, on the Tiktok shop or, like, you know, like, e e commerce sort of things.
Hailey [0:12:24]: And that's the use case that they're really getting out of us.
Hailey [0:12:27]: And so they use, you know, A B and C product or solution, whereas, like, if you look at a technology organizations, like, you know, in B2B, they use social for an entirely different season.
Hailey [0:12:39]: And they might be using it.
Hailey [0:12:40]: I was like, a publishing mechanism and reporting, listening, analytics, and so they use more often our products, you know, D e and f or something like that.
Hailey [0:12:50]: And that sort of alignment.
Hailey [0:12:51]: Like, where you're looking at this here if you can get your your segments on your kind of...
Hailey [0:12:56]: When did I put it on the top?
Hailey [0:12:57]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:12:58]: Your segments across the top and your solutions down the other side.
Hailey [0:13:01]: You're able to kind of create this heat map of, like, what are we selling to who?
Hailey [0:13:05]: And what is the priority?
Hailey [0:13:06]: Like, which one are we selling more of who?
Dave [0:13:10]: Okay.
Dave [0:13:10]: And so does this...
Dave [0:13:11]: Is this like one zero one.
Dave [0:13:13]: The point is This is like the foundation.
Dave [0:13:14]: Right?
Dave [0:13:15]: If you just started firing off making tiktok videos, making ads, choosing what events to go to?
Dave [0:13:21]: You can't really do that effectively without first sitting down and mapping this out?
Dave [0:13:25]: Is this your sheet of music for figuring because I think the question I'm trying to ask is like, how the heck do you figure out what to do with so many segments and so many different personas you know, you could make the case to do or not do all these events to do or not do all of these influencer campaigns to do these ads or not?
Dave [0:13:42]: It's like, how is that how do you go and execute on that stuff?
Hailey [0:13:45]: I mean, like, I think this is...
Hailey [0:13:46]: There's kinda two things to say about that.
Hailey [0:13:48]: One.
Hailey [0:13:48]: Yes.
Hailey [0:13:49]: I do think this is the one zero one.
Hailey [0:13:50]: If you can orient it and look, this is just one view.
Hailey [0:13:53]: I have found this view very clear and helpful and kind of used it in a few different scenarios effectively, and this is your math.
Hailey [0:14:00]: This is where kind of like all the begins and where you're able to attach every single marketing act Tiffany into something that you know is geared up into something that will be revenue generating, but also in a way where you hope that again, you're gonna get happy long term customers as well.
Hailey [0:14:15]: And the other side of it is like, Tiffany I mean, like, not to dig on any other marketers out there or whatever, but I also, I would say that there's not a lot of organization doing this.
Hailey [0:14:27]: There's many more organizations out there that are plainly kind of doing the one size fits all thing or probably more often.
Hailey [0:14:33]: Are in that situation where every different department is thinking about segmentation differently.
Hailey [0:14:38]: And so at the end of the day, like, sure things might come together especially if the market is pulling you forward, but there are so many leaky know, we was talking about leaky funnel.
Hailey [0:14:48]: It's, like the ultimate leaky funnel.
Hailey [0:14:49]: There's just stuff coming out of all different holes in your business when you're not aligned to something like that.
Dave [0:14:55]: So how does this play out for all of the the channels.
Dave [0:14:59]: Right?
Dave [0:14:59]: So you run...
Dave [0:15:00]: You run demand gen, revenue, marketing at this company.
Dave [0:15:03]: How do you figure out where to spend the budget?
Dave [0:15:06]: How you figure out which channels to invest on, especially today, like, I like to say that everything works, Everything you could, you know, you could certainly talk to a marketer if you or listen enough episode this podcast and they have an example if something works.
Dave [0:15:17]: It's.
Dave [0:15:18]: I think one of the challenges not and it's not in figuring out what to do?
Dave [0:15:22]: It's like, what to say yes to and what to say no to.
Dave [0:15:25]: It's like, less of an innovation problem.
Dave [0:15:26]: Especially as you get to your scale.
Dave [0:15:28]: So how do you...
Dave [0:15:29]: How have you figured out which place you're gonna run.
Dave [0:15:32]: It's too much.
Dave [0:15:33]: It's too much for my little brands.
Dave [0:15:34]: Why I run a tiny little business.
Hailey [0:15:36]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:15:36]: It's a lot.
Hailey [0:15:37]: Well, it looks overwhelming when you kind of see it in a chart like that.
Hailey [0:15:41]: And you're, like, weight.
Hailey [0:15:42]: That's effectively, you know, it's so many different, like, holes that you're filling on that sort of chart.
Hailey [0:15:47]: But I showed.
Hailey [0:15:47]: But ultimately, if you can decide the prioritization around your segments, and that is normally, like, an exercise that happens, oftentimes driven by the revenue team and the product team and like, a planning exercise where it's, like, you're...
Hailey [0:16:03]: Someone in your organization needs to figure out where you think the most revenue is going to come from out of those segments.
Hailey [0:16:09]: So let's just Let's keep them...
Hailey [0:16:11]: Let's talk about them as the verticals to make an easy though let's say you have retail, travel, media entertainment.
Hailey [0:16:18]: So on and so cool.
Hailey [0:16:19]: Right?
Hailey [0:16:20]: And you decide, like someone in your organization decides.
Hailey [0:16:23]: It's like, based on modeling or being sound best best or whatever, we think I...
Hailey [0:16:28]: We could talk about that later into as far as like, the signals that should inform that in my opinion.
Hailey [0:16:32]: But, like, however, that's prioritized.
Hailey [0:16:33]: They, like, great.
Hailey [0:16:34]: We think that thirty percent of our revenue was gonna come from retail and therefore, we know it'll be attached to these solutions that they use, We think twenty percent of it gonna come from media and entertainment, ten percent from travel.
Hailey [0:16:45]: Right?
Hailey [0:16:45]: And that gives you a pretty direct ability to understand how you should spend how you should invest.
Hailey [0:16:52]: So I normally kind of taking those sorts of percentages and then cross multiplying them against, like, total revenue targets and generally you're getting those split.
Hailey [0:17:03]: That's a lot of.
Hailey [0:17:03]: This is where it gets like really math heavy.
Hailey [0:17:05]: Because they're typically get those split out by, like, region, You'll typically get them split out, you know, like all the different ways that matter to, like, your sales organization, but you can start determining, like, alright, our campaign for retail needs to essentially funnel down to these products.
Hailey [0:17:20]: And it needs to generate this amount of revenue and back that out to pipeline based on your model compared to, Right And maybe that's our tier one.
Hailey [0:17:28]: Yep.
Hailey [0:17:29]: Compared to travel, which was point ten percent, which maybe is our tier three.
Hailey [0:17:33]: You know?
Hailey [0:17:34]: Like, we're
Dave [0:17:35]: So you're splitting, like, if you mirror on a whiteboard right now, you're building this plan by the different verticals or segments that you're calling.
Dave [0:17:41]: So retail is a core persona, you're gonna have a pipeline target for retail, you're gonna sign reps have quota, then you're gonna have all the marketing channels and plays.
Dave [0:17:51]: Some of that cascade and, like, hits the whole sprout social brand, but you're, like, trying to drive specific pipeline in a segment.
Dave [0:17:58]: Right?
Dave [0:17:58]: Am I be understanding that right?
Hailey [0:18:00]: That's right.
Hailey [0:18:00]: And then you were kind of asking about, like, how does that then down in the channels?
Hailey [0:18:03]: I mean...
Dave [0:18:05]: Oh, yeah.
Dave [0:18:05]: Wait.
Dave [0:18:05]: And can I interrupt in one layer on there?
Dave [0:18:07]: Like, that I've always thought is interesting is how teams have this setup up because it's, like, do you have a digital team that just run that runs ads just for retail or you know, you have specialist doing across all and then how does product marketing fit and then content, that's kinda like the layers that I'm interested in and as you give me that answer.
Hailey [0:18:23]: The org design around this is like, that's the interesting thing.
Hailey [0:18:27]: I think that I feel pretty passionately that you can like, design your org, how you feel is necessary, like, just whatever works for your team.
Hailey [0:18:37]: Like, some organizations are very, very, like, solutions marketing forward.
Hailey [0:18:41]: Right?
Hailey [0:18:41]: And they have a product marketer that is on a particular segment.
Hailey [0:18:44]: And then they have everyone that, like falls in suits to that.
Hailey [0:18:48]: We're not like that.
Hailey [0:18:48]: Like, we we even even have, like, I know we've kind of been talking about demand gen, engine in general.
Hailey [0:18:53]: Like, our demand gen really is actually split across a couple of teams.
Hailey [0:18:57]: Like, we have customer marketing, which also does some of our demand generation within life cycle marketing.
Hailey [0:19:01]: We have the digital function on my team and on my partner's team that runs brand experience and field pick up like events and field and so really demand generation.
Hailey [0:19:10]: Is everywhere, and the thing that kind of drives what gets activated is our campaigns team, which does sit on my team, and they are taking any, like, our goals, our prioritization, and then with all of their partner around the scene?
Hailey [0:19:24]: They're having a conversation of, like, okay.
Hailey [0:19:26]: We're doing a retail campaign?
Hailey [0:19:27]: Or we're doing a travel and hospitality campaign.
Hailey [0:19:30]: How might meet how can we best go engage those people?
Hailey [0:19:34]: Is it at events?
Hailey [0:19:35]: Like, how do retail marketers?
Hailey [0:19:37]: Like, where are they if we're selling to reach marketers or maybe we're selling to people in Hr in retail, whatever.
Dave [0:19:42]: Tell me more about this campaigns team.
Dave [0:19:44]: I like this idea.
Dave [0:19:45]: Obviously not new.
Dave [0:19:46]: Some guy who hates me, Little will listen this podcast like I just kinda not know what a campaigns team is.
Dave [0:19:50]: What is a good campaigns person do?
Dave [0:19:53]: What does that look like on a team?
Hailey [0:19:55]: So when this is, like such a marketer thing.
Hailey [0:19:58]: Like, it depends.
Dave [0:20:00]: I mean, that could be the whole podcast.
Dave [0:20:00]: We could do no guess.
Dave [0:20:02]: It's just...
Dave [0:20:02]: I don't know.
Dave [0:20:03]: Depends.
Dave [0:20:03]: Listen and join me for the next episode on it depends.
Hailey [0:20:07]: You need to start a new podcast.
Hailey [0:20:08]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:20:09]: It sounds depends.
Hailey [0:20:10]: Stuff I think, like...
Hailey [0:20:11]: So I have a very selfish perspective having, like, campaigns on the revenue team, but when you when you attach it to revenue marketing, I kind view them as, like, the quarterback.
Hailey [0:20:19]: Really?
Hailey [0:20:20]: I make this...
Hailey [0:20:21]: I make this joke all the time with the team, like, they need to stop the sports analog in the sport, but they're they're kind of the quarterback.
Hailey [0:20:27]: Right?
Hailey [0:20:27]: Like, they're bringing that strategy down from the office.
Hailey [0:20:30]: Right?
Hailey [0:20:30]: And they're pulling it down and working with all of their partners to design, like, what a campaign should look like.
Hailey [0:20:36]: That's ultimately gonna attach back into that goal.
Hailey [0:20:38]: So they really lean on their partners like, let's say, hint field for, like, what does that experience feel like and what does the event strategy.
Hailey [0:20:46]: Right?
Hailey [0:20:46]: But we know that we'll we market x segment.
Hailey [0:20:48]: We need a lot of events for when we market to this other segment we need digital.
Hailey [0:20:52]: On points.
Hailey [0:20:53]: So we have some channel expert.
Dave [0:20:56]: But it's almost like, I've I've been in companies where there is not the, like, campaigns layer.
Dave [0:21:00]: And so certainly because I'm kinda...
Dave [0:21:02]: The other side of this is, like, well, could you just have a revenue marketing manager and their job is to interface with the field, the digital, the whatever.
Hailey [0:21:11]: Totally.
Dave [0:21:11]: But the hard part about that is, like, those people also have other things, and then it's like this weird ownership and responsibility too.
Dave [0:21:18]: It's almost like the same the same concept of, like, why does the marketing org have a chief of staff, The campaigns manager, owns the, like, goal, and then the delivery might be working with different teams.
Dave [0:21:29]: Question mark period.
Hailey [0:21:32]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:21:32]: I mean, like, that's how I think about it for sure.
Hailey [0:21:34]: It's like there's is...
Hailey [0:21:35]: They're they're w everything and bringing everything together harmonious.
Hailey [0:21:39]: And, like, look, if we're being really honest, when I've had campaign functions like this.
Hailey [0:21:44]: There's generally some sort of like, there's something that no one is owning.
Hailey [0:21:48]: There's always like, one thing.
Hailey [0:21:49]: Right?
Hailey [0:21:50]: And it's like, who's gonna do this and, like, a lot of times your campaign managers have a more kind of broad set of skills and demand generation, and they pick it up.
Hailey [0:21:58]: So, like, Do the webinars.
Hailey [0:21:59]: I'll be the one that runs webinars.
Hailey [0:22:00]: So, like, I'll be the one that handles are kind of, like, sponsorships with media organizations or something like that.
Hailey [0:22:06]: Like, they're sometimes a little bit in a catch all.
Dave [0:22:08]: Okay.
Dave [0:22:08]: Understood.
Dave [0:22:09]: How do you talk about success and measurement and reporting.
Dave [0:22:13]: I'm not trying to ask you like, how do you measure marketing because that's another, like, it depends thing, but there's a little bit of an art and science and being the revenue marketer in that, not all this stuff is directly attributable to.
Dave [0:22:24]: We did act we sent to this email and this thing happened.
Dave [0:22:27]: Any lessons you've learned as to, like, making, you know, fig...
Dave [0:22:31]: Making sure you're making the right bets and investment, you know, not everything is direct response.
Dave [0:22:35]: I just love to hear your your philosophy on how you would guide someone listening to this.
Dave [0:22:39]: Appear of yours or someone similar in your shoes so, how do we talk about the the strategy of of revenue?
Dave [0:22:44]: How do we talk about marketing impact on the funnel?
Hailey [0:22:47]: Well, I'll tell you what I've got right, And then I'll tell you when I've got wrong, and I'm still, like, learnings.
Hailey [0:22:53]: I've done this enough cycles and done enough rhythms that I've learned over time and they really feel strongly that, like, I model back from, like, the the hardest thing from a marketing, I'm marketing a metric.
Hailey [0:23:08]: That I can.
Hailey [0:23:09]: You know?
Hailey [0:23:09]: So I'm not, like, like, I don't...
Hailey [0:23:11]: Yes.
Hailey [0:23:11]: We still use M mt where I am today, you know, and, like, things like that.
Hailey [0:23:16]: But when I'm thinking about modeling back, I actually wanna be thinking all the way from Nr.
Hailey [0:23:21]: Like, I also don't like modeling from pipeline because we can go manuscript after a pipeline.
Hailey [0:23:26]: Like, if you've been in marketing long enough, you know you can go make it up, model back from at Nr r.
Hailey [0:23:30]: Again, the point of your organization is that you want happy customers they're staying with you as long as possible and spending more money over time.
Hailey [0:23:39]: Right?
Hailey [0:23:39]: And so model back from that.
Dave [0:23:41]: Is that true though?
Dave [0:23:41]: Can you make up?
Dave [0:23:42]: I think you could make up leads.
Dave [0:23:44]: I think pipeline is tough to make up.
Dave [0:23:46]: If you
Hailey [0:23:48]: you pressure sales hard enough.
Hailey [0:23:49]: You say, hey, make these leads into pipeline and they go make it up.
Hailey [0:23:52]: Okay.
Hailey [0:23:52]: Not saying that sales are bad guys.
Hailey [0:23:54]: It's just like there's enough pressure and people do things.
Hailey [0:23:56]: Right?
Dave [0:23:57]: Okay.
Dave [0:23:57]: No.
Dave [0:23:57]: No My mind went to.
Dave [0:23:58]: It says so my mind went to...
Dave [0:23:59]: Yeah.
Dave [0:23:59]: You're wrong because you can't just make pipeline happen because sales has to create opportunities.
Dave [0:24:05]: But what you're saying actually that even a more gangster move was, like, no, Actually, there are levers, you could probably pull internally to, like, incentivize the wrong types of meetings.
Dave [0:24:13]: And if you them as meetings.
Dave [0:24:15]: You could choose the pipeline number that way.
Dave [0:24:16]: And sales is still...
Hailey [0:24:17]: The are incentivized off of pipeline too.
Hailey [0:24:19]: Right Like, either incentivized off of revenue.
Hailey [0:24:21]: But, like, it goes wrong that way.
Hailey [0:24:23]: And it's not because anyone's trying to be a bad guy.
Hailey [0:24:25]: It's just like, how humans psychology works and everyone's just trying, like, paid around
Dave [0:24:29]: hundred hundred percent, It...
Dave [0:24:30]: I think this is such an under underrated.
Dave [0:24:32]: Like, one of the thing, and I'm learning this in building my own company now, Dan and I talk a lot about this.
Dave [0:24:36]: But as a...
Dave [0:24:37]: Lesson I wish I had known when I was running marketing.
Dave [0:24:40]: Was how important incentives are for driving behavior.
Dave [0:24:44]: Not just on your team, but also in understanding the other...
Dave [0:24:48]: Like, I had a sales leader that I worked with and the CEO that the comp plan was all messed up in that we were literally fundamentally misaligned to never be on the same team because they didn't...
Dave [0:24:59]: They got...
Dave [0:25:00]: They got paid out more if it was like, not marketing sore right.
Dave [0:25:03]: And so it's like, things like that.
Dave [0:25:05]: You you could you start to un unpack and realize like, oh, it's actually driving the behavior here, or I've been in a company where they really wanted to do cross sell, but it was nobody owned that.
Dave [0:25:14]: Nobody had a number.
Dave [0:25:15]: Nobody had a strategy.
Dave [0:25:16]: So it just like, well, we sure we're we're twenty five percent, you know, behind on our cross sell plans it's, like, but, who who owns that.
Dave [0:25:22]: So...
Hailey [0:25:23]: Well, and that's so, like, full circle.
Hailey [0:25:24]: Why I go to Nr too, like, when you can.
Hailey [0:25:27]: Like, look, it's an evolution.
Dave [0:25:29]: Yeah.
Dave [0:25:29]: And while you answer this, can you tell me how how does marketing drive Nr?
Dave [0:25:33]: Right?
Dave [0:25:34]: Isn't that gonna be down to, like, product usage, expansion, retention.
Dave [0:25:38]: What role does marketing play there?
Dave [0:25:40]: I don't understand.
Hailey [0:25:41]: That's a great question.
Hailey [0:25:42]: It helps me answer this, and that's why I...
Hailey [0:25:44]: I modeled back from Nr because, like, ultimately, like, okay.
Hailey [0:25:47]: I just said right.
Hailey [0:25:48]: I can create I can manufacture leads, and then we can put pressure on Bd and them to create pipeline.
Hailey [0:25:53]: And then we can put pressure on sales and incentivize them to sell to literally whoever, Right, regardless of whether they're in your Ic you're not are regardless of, like, they're likely like to churn in twelve months is, like, ninety percent.
Hailey [0:26:07]: You still put pressure on sales to do that.
Hailey [0:26:09]: And then it just gets kicked down to your poor.
Hailey [0:26:12]: Your poor Cs.
Hailey [0:26:13]: Right?
Hailey [0:26:14]: Like, that account goes over And, like, that's why Nr is the true definition of success.
Hailey [0:26:20]: And if you can model back to, like, the people that you are marketing to are the people that are most likely the ones to be happy and successful with your organization long term.
Hailey [0:26:29]: Like, we are the start of the chain.
Hailey [0:26:31]: Product, obviously, It's like a big circle.
Hailey [0:26:33]: Right?
Hailey [0:26:34]: And product has, like, build for those groups too, but that's why.
Dave [0:26:37]: Yeah.
Dave [0:26:37]: It's like all about expectation settings on the way in.
Dave [0:26:40]: Right?
Hailey [0:26:41]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:26:41]: So that's what I've gotten right.
Hailey [0:26:43]: As far as, like, measuring marketing goes, like, look, if you can model back from Nr or, like, if you're if you're not there yet, and you're, like, modeling off of leads today or pipeline today.
Hailey [0:26:53]: You'll least start with revenue.
Hailey [0:26:54]: Right.
Hailey [0:26:54]: And try to get your way to Nr.
Hailey [0:26:56]: But like, if you can do that, you're already on the right track and then kind of model that all the way backward.
Hailey [0:27:00]: Am I engaging the customer that are going to be the highest likely to stay with me.
Hailey [0:27:05]: What I have not ace and what I'm working on as a marketer or myself today, and also, it's attached to why I was, like, so invested and interested in also going to sprout.
Hailey [0:27:14]: As you said, I've only been here five months.
Hailey [0:27:16]: And I think that is such a hot topic right now on marketing, but it's like signals.
Hailey [0:27:22]: So, like, you kinda engineer what I just talked about and all of this stuff is, like, So be fair.
Hailey [0:27:28]: It's a little bit of, like, building spreadsheets and Ivory towers.
Hailey [0:27:31]: You can do that all day long.
Hailey [0:27:33]: But if you're not, then also layering on and paying attention to the signals that are telling you which of your segments you should be prioritizing where and when.
Hailey [0:27:42]: Then it's literally just a spreadsheet, and it all goes to help.
Hailey [0:27:47]: And so I've kind of seen that play out in the last couple of years when I run campaigns on these sort of segments, and we've learned.
Hailey [0:27:53]: We've...
Hailey [0:27:53]: We've made our bets.
Hailey [0:27:54]: I'm like, we're gonna make up...
Hailey [0:27:55]: This is our tier one.
Hailey [0:27:56]: We're gonna make the most revenue out of this segment.
Hailey [0:27:58]: And then at the end of the day, ninety percent of that pipeline falls out at stage two and it's like, what what did we just do?
Hailey [0:28:05]: And we actually were not listening to or ignoring all the signals in the market that told us your product is...
Hailey [0:28:12]: You might be on the shortlist list, but you're not winning any deals because your products all behind or this this segment right now is suffering.
Hailey [0:28:19]: And they're never gonna get budget approved because, like, they're just suffering in the market.
Hailey [0:28:24]: And so those are the sort of signals now that I'm trying to, like, all into my system to be able to come build smarter.
Dave [0:28:31]: Oh, that's super interesting because I think so often the marketers brain goes to more more, more more more more more new leads, more meetings, more this, but what you're saying is actually the root cause of this might be, hey, we're going after the wrong persona, or we have the right persona, however, the...
Dave [0:28:51]: Especially in your case, right?
Dave [0:28:52]: Sixteen year old company, The market has a perception about our product that we need to go change and so the deals are not gonna close until we make this investment in the product.
Dave [0:29:01]: So this is a great example of where, like, a real demand gen revenue leader doesn't just drive net new.
Dave [0:29:07]: It's We have to influence change across the org oregon.
Dave [0:29:10]: And so you need to be able to say, well actually the reason we're we're booking meetings, but the reason these deals aren't closing is because people are just shopping and they end up going with this other product.
Hailey [0:29:18]: That's right.
Hailey [0:29:18]: And I have for that reason.
Hailey [0:29:19]: It's like it's my part time job to be best friends with my product marketing leader too.
Hailey [0:29:24]: Right?
Hailey [0:29:25]: It's just, like, in locks stuff.
Hailey [0:29:26]: And I mean, brand...
Hailey [0:29:27]: Like, everyone is involved, but, like, that product marketing relationship and intelligence and feedback loop is, like, probably the most important thing to, like, making my plan successful.
Dave [0:29:38]: I wanna put a bow on that because I think the difference that whatever we just talked about in the last couple minutes, that to me is the difference between a marketer and an executive.
Dave [0:29:48]: A marketer is someone who's go a new execute on campaigns to hit the marketing goals and say, what?
Dave [0:29:54]: We hit the marketing goals.
Dave [0:29:54]: I did my job.
Dave [0:29:55]: We grew traffic.
Dave [0:29:56]: We grew this for that.
Dave [0:29:57]: But if you want to be a CMO, a VP or an executive treated like an executive in marketing, the real ones that I've worked with.
Dave [0:30:04]: They treat the company as their job.
Dave [0:30:07]: Marketing is the thing they oversee.
Dave [0:30:09]: You know what Mean Hailey?
Dave [0:30:10]: Like.
Dave [0:30:10]: My job is to influence.
Dave [0:30:12]: It's not like, oh, product's not my job.
Dave [0:30:14]: No.
Dave [0:30:14]: No.
Dave [0:30:15]: My job is to, like, marketing is like the mouthpiece where the tip of this with sales where you need to influence the thing we're selling.
Hailey [0:30:21]: One hundred percent, and that's actually...
Hailey [0:30:23]: It's a funny.
Hailey [0:30:23]: Just like, a personal reflection.
Hailey [0:30:25]: It's an interesting place where I'm at in and kind of, like, the middle of my career is, like, I feel so fortunate.
Hailey [0:30:32]: But I'm still close enough to, like, hands on tools.
Hailey [0:30:36]: Like, I'm still hands on pools some days.
Hailey [0:30:38]: Right?
Hailey [0:30:38]: And, like, that's the market they're love marketing.
Hailey [0:30:41]: I love it.
Hailey [0:30:42]: Love doing all of the different roles that I've been in.
Hailey [0:30:45]: But now I'm in a world where I do kinda need to take those executive responsibilities and so balancing between, like, how much time you spend on those sort of, like, strategic drivers versus, like, doing your craft.
Hailey [0:30:58]: Is hard.
Hailey [0:30:59]: Like, that takes like mental energy from me every day to make the right call on that.
Dave [0:31:03]: I mean, your craft at this point though your craft is that that is your job.
Hailey [0:31:07]: That's true.
Hailey [0:31:07]: I think that's where it's going for temperature you're better or worse it's I like, but I I don't know.
Hailey [0:31:11]: I'll never I think about that a lot.
Hailey [0:31:13]: Like, when you love something and you do the craft for so long.
Hailey [0:31:16]: It's like, if you keep moving up, it's...
Hailey [0:31:19]: It changes.
Hailey [0:31:19]: Like, your day to day changes, and I I kind of like have those number career conversations with people on my team, about that.
Hailey [0:31:26]: Like, what do you want your day to today day to look like in a couple of years because that very much...
Hailey [0:31:30]: We'll push you in a different direction.
Dave [0:31:32]: Yeah.
Dave [0:31:32]: Who knows?
Dave [0:31:32]: Who knows?
Dave [0:31:33]: Speaking of that topic.
Dave [0:31:34]: Can we Haley take?
Dave [0:31:36]: Not as a revenue marketer says you someone a bunch of experience in this field.
Dave [0:31:40]: How are we feeling about Ai, the state of marketing as of us recording this September twenty twenty six.
Dave [0:31:47]: What's cool What's real?
Dave [0:31:49]: What's over hyped?
Dave [0:31:50]: Where is marketing going is is Are things changing as much as people say they are?
Dave [0:31:55]: Are they not?
Dave [0:31:55]: What's your pulse?
Hailey [0:31:57]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:31:57]: I mean, it's a great question.
Hailey [0:31:58]: Everyone's talking about it.
Hailey [0:31:59]: I was really lucky that I was in.
Hailey [0:32:01]: So I was working for an organization that's in the Ai workforce transformation space, like, when generative Ai really hit the market.
Hailey [0:32:12]: So I was in such a sweet spot to have an incredible exposure to that who really my CEO at the time was from, like, work transformation background.
Hailey [0:32:21]: So, like, early days, I was into the using it, how do we augment the way that we work to do things better, faster, unlock capabilities that we didn't have before How does that change?
Hailey [0:32:33]: How we think about our organizational structure and are, like, we call it our workforce Dna?
Hailey [0:32:37]: Like, how many full time employees do you have versus Flex versus says Ai I've been there and done that.
Hailey [0:32:41]: It's not old news.
Hailey [0:32:42]: Definitely haven't mastered it.
Hailey [0:32:44]: But like, my personal take on, like, what's actually keeping me up is less about, like, how we're augmenting are, like, you know, daily workflows and for me, it's like, how tech stacks are changing because of how Ai has unlocked tech development.
Hailey [0:33:00]: So, like, just our marketing automation platforms, Ab platforms, like, all of these tools that we've been using for so long are changing overnight because new companies that our Ai first are coming in are able to develop something that we've never been able to do before.
Hailey [0:33:17]: And so when you're at an organization that already has an established tech stack or is already has so much built on these, like legacy systems, it's like, how do we as marketers which are very tech dependent and heavy how do we move ourselves forward in a responsible way?
Hailey [0:33:33]: We're not just, like, clinging onto some trend.
Hailey [0:33:35]: And, yeah, I'm losing a lot of hours of sleep on that these dates?
Dave [0:33:40]: A lot of hours of sleep over, like, are you keeping up enough with tech?
Hailey [0:33:44]: And just, like, how are we...
Hailey [0:33:45]: What of this is a just a kind of trend?
Hailey [0:33:48]: Or, you know, like, is gonna is fleeting and is gonna be gone in a couple years or change and how much should we be acting on now?
Hailey [0:33:56]: Like, should we go Vibe coat our site, like Vibe I've got?
Hailey [0:33:58]: Like, what do we do?
Hailey [0:33:59]: Like, that's just a big question.
Dave [0:34:01]: I don't know.
Dave [0:34:02]: Did you see...
Dave [0:34:02]: I'm not a big stocks market guy, but I am following like, companies like Salesforce and Hubspot pretty closely just as it's telling of, like, the marketing landscape, and no one's ripping out Salesforce.
Dave [0:34:13]: And there's gonna be, like, a couple of core, and we talked to so many execs.
Dave [0:34:19]: It's like, I don't know, the vibe coating stuff is cool, but I've talked to more people who've, like, hiring an agency, hard guy that they know and they, you know, and it once someone does it and, like, kinda half works and like, I don't know.
Dave [0:34:30]: That's cool.
Dave [0:34:31]: Yes.
Dave [0:34:31]: Okay.
Dave [0:34:32]: Cool.
Dave [0:34:32]: Ai can, like, one shot the website, but, like, maybe if you're like a two person start with not a lot of risk with like, a high tolerance for risk.
Dave [0:34:39]: Like, sprout social.
Dave [0:34:40]: Absolutely is not gonna, like, vibe code a website and have some, you know, twenty two year old on the team maintain it in their claude code environment.
Dave [0:34:49]: That's just not realistic.
Hailey [0:34:51]: No one hundred percent right, but, that's the thing is like, in this space that we're in right now, like, in general, like, anyone that's kind of, like, in technology?
Hailey [0:34:59]: Yes.
Hailey [0:35:00]: We are, I mean, I work here.
Hailey [0:35:02]: I've gotta say it.
Hailey [0:35:03]: We're like, the biggest and the best.
Hailey [0:35:05]: Right?
Hailey [0:35:05]: We have, like, this great reputation and all of this stuff And, like, if if there's gonna be an Rfp that goes out for a social and intelligence platform, we're gonna be in it.
Hailey [0:35:14]: That's great.
Hailey [0:35:14]: But like, a company that just started off, like two years ago that's been able to build Ai first and has been able to, like, do things and, like, come up with processes and, like, just in a way that, like we would have to undo and then rebuild and we're big we're, like, a cruise ship and so things take long It's like that balance that.
Hailey [0:35:34]: I'm like, how do big organizations can move with that same level of agility.
Hailey [0:35:39]: As the up and commerce and, like, a lot of that for marketing swirl around, like, how you're leveraging technology.
Hailey [0:35:46]: So right now, that's really where I'm kind of trying to figure it out.
Hailey [0:35:51]: I have tons of brilliant people on my team that know how to put Ai use and, like, the best most responsible ways and I'm like, so proud of them, and It's just, like, you guys are off to the races is learning all these things.
Hailey [0:36:02]: Now how do we think about that on the macro scale for, like, how we drive our entire strategy and how we operate?
Hailey [0:36:08]: Like, that one's hard.
Dave [0:36:10]: Yeah.
Dave [0:36:10]: Alright.
Dave [0:36:11]: I just got a ping from my team because I'd like to send...
Dave [0:36:14]: I take a screenshot, like, when we're recording the pod part of my system as I take a screenshot and I'm like, kinda live taking notes as this is going on.
Dave [0:36:20]: So it makes our post production easier And
Hailey [0:36:23]: yeah.
Dave [0:36:23]: Our team was, like, great.
Dave [0:36:24]: Ask her when her slides are gonna be ready for drive.
Hailey [0:36:30]: Just Allison is like, you ellis is, like, she's fired.
Hailey [0:36:32]: Just, like, end up on her No.
Hailey [0:36:33]: No.
Hailey [0:36:33]: Tell Ellis and I'm on it.
Dave [0:36:35]: Please I apologize.
Dave [0:36:36]: They...
Dave [0:36:36]: I am the number one culprit of this if I were ever speaking at an event, you're certainly not getting my slides until I've been day before.
Dave [0:36:43]: Because I need the flight on the way there to, like, do them.
Hailey [0:36:46]: Totally.
Hailey [0:36:46]: No.
Hailey [0:36:47]: I'll be sending them through.
Dave [0:36:48]: Where are you by the.
Dave [0:36:48]: You're on the road?
Dave [0:36:49]: Are you in the road right now?
Dave [0:36:50]: Are you in a Am mx lounge somewhere on the road where are you?
Hailey [0:36:53]: I'm not cool enough to be in an Am lounge.
Hailey [0:36:55]: I'm in the Alaska lounge.
Hailey [0:36:56]: Seattle Grove.
Hailey [0:36:57]: But, yes, I'm in the lounge.
Hailey [0:36:59]: I'm on the road all month.
Hailey [0:37:00]: I can't wait to see you guys next week.
Dave [0:37:02]: Yeah.
Hailey [0:37:03]: Drive.
Hailey [0:37:03]: But, yeah, I'm heading to And in Boston right now.
Hailey [0:37:05]: Your old stop zone.
Hailey [0:37:07]: So I'll say hello.
Dave [0:37:08]: What are you doing there?
Hailey [0:37:09]: Flow.
Hailey [0:37:09]: Go to flow.
Dave [0:37:11]: Alright.
Dave [0:37:11]: Okay.
Dave [0:37:11]: Good.
Dave [0:37:11]: There you go.
Dave [0:37:12]: So another another example.
Dave [0:37:13]: We're out the website or, like, hire vendor and use them to run the website.
Dave [0:37:16]: Right?
Hailey [0:37:17]: I know.
Hailey [0:37:17]: Web flows Like, please feel love about.
Hailey [0:37:19]: Don't go just go find bunch your site week.
Hailey [0:37:20]: No No.
Hailey [0:37:21]: Like, yeah go away there.
Hailey [0:37:23]: I'm excited to see you guys.
Dave [0:37:24]: Alright.
Dave [0:37:24]: And then you're coming our way.
Dave [0:37:25]: Are you gonna be inbound un bound also?
Hailey [0:37:28]: I'm not.
Hailey [0:37:28]: No.
Hailey [0:37:28]: I I had something else going on.
Hailey [0:37:30]: I can't even remember what it was, but I'm not gonna be there on everything all in on exit side drive this year.
Hailey [0:37:36]: And also just like, quick plug.
Hailey [0:37:38]: Is that so much of what I was talking about today in regards to segmentation, both, like, up at kind of granular level as well as I you think about it across P and enterprise?
Hailey [0:37:46]: That's what my workshop is on.
Hailey [0:37:48]: After I have some super excited.
Dave [0:37:50]: Yeah.
Dave [0:37:50]: That's awesome.
Dave [0:37:50]: We're lucky to have you in our universe.
Dave [0:37:52]: Nice to get to hang out with you a little.
Dave [0:37:53]: Hailey.
Dave [0:37:54]: I'm gonna let you go.
Dave [0:37:55]: Get out of here on the Alaska, safe travels to Boston.
Dave [0:37:58]: Thanks.
Dave [0:37:59]: I'm busy today, man.
Dave [0:38:00]: I got you right now.
Dave [0:38:01]: I got a prep call with Cara Harden after this.
Dave [0:38:04]: She's one of our keynote speakers.
Dave [0:38:05]: And then after, I'm doing a podcast with Ross Simmons.
Dave [0:38:07]: So I'll look forward to To give you a hug when I see it next week here in Vermont.
Dave [0:38:10]: Haley Rock.
Dave [0:38:11]: I'll talk to you soon.
Hailey [0:38:13]: Thanks so much for having.
Hailey [0:38:13]: It's like such a privilege.
Hailey [0:38:14]: Okay.
Hailey [0:38:15]: Bye bye.
Dave [0:38:19]: Hey, Thanks for listening to this podcast.
Dave [0:38:21]: If you like this episode.
Dave [0:38:22]: You know what?
Dave [0:38:23]: I'm not even gonna ask you to subscribe and leave a review because I don't really care about that.
Dave [0:38:28]: I have something better for you.
Dave [0:38:29]: So we've built the number one private community for B2B marketers at Exit Five, and you can go and check that out instead of leaving a rating a review.
Dave [0:38:37]: Go check it out right now.
Dave [0:38:38]: On our website, exitfive.com.
Dave [0:38:40]: Our mission at Exit Five is to help you grow your career in B2B marketing, and there's no better place to do that than with us at Exit Five.
Dave [0:38:48]: There's nearly five thousand members now in our community, people are in their post every day, asking questions about things like marketing planning, ideas, inspiration, asking questions and getting feedback from your peers, building your own network of marketers who are doing the same thing you are so to have a peer group.
Dave [0:39:04]: Or maybe just venting about your boss when you need to get in there and get something off your chest.
Dave [0:39:08]: It's a hundred percent free to join for seven days so you can go and check it out risk free, and then there's a small annual fee to pay if you wanna become a member for the year.
Dave [0:39:17]: Go check it out, learn more exitfive.com, and I will see you over there in the community.