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The holiday season can be a joyful yet stressful time for families, especially for parents of neurodivergent children. In this episode, we explore practical strategies for preparing children for family gatherings, managing expectations, and communicating effectively with extended family. The conversation highlights the importance of flexibility, understanding, and involving children in holiday traditions to ensure a positive experience for everyone. Parents will gain actionable tips for reducing stress, maintaining routines, and supporting their children in navigating complex social situations during the holidays.
Creators and Guests
Host
What is The Shrink Down?
Four lifelong friends, all clinical psychologists, unpack the latest in current events, pop culture and celebrity news through the lens of psychology.
Vanessa (00:01.422)
Welcome back to the Shrink Down. Hello ladies, how are you doing today? Good. All right, so today we're going to be talking about the holidays and specifically we're going to be talking about parenting during the holidays. Holidays bring lots of joy, connection, tradition, but also a lot of noise and I mean that both literally and figuratively, expectations and also stress as a parent. We all know that. So we're going to be talking about just parenting in general for our kind of neurotypical kids and then also
Wilhelmina (00:05.572)
Good.
Teri (00:05.794)
Good.
Lauren (00:05.826)
Good.
Wilhelmina (00:20.301)
you
Vanessa (00:30.936)
kind of the added layer to parenting our kids who are neurodivergent. So we'll be talking about some of the challenges that we come across as parents, but also giving some tips and some strategies too that can be really helpful during this time of year. All right, before we get into our discussion, let's do our four minute faves. And today, I remembered it was four minutes and not five minutes. Lauren, do you want to start us off today?
Wilhelmina (00:43.279)
Thank
Wilhelmina (00:49.422)
You
Lauren (00:53.47)
Sure. So I am recommending a new movie that's out on Netflix and it's called The Thursday Murder Club and it's with Helen Mirren, Pierce Brosnan. There's like really good, I'm forgetting the other man's name, Ben Kingsley, like really big names. But the reason I'm recommending it, so it's super cute, super easy plot line to follow, but we watched it this past weekend with my parents. So my youngest son is 10,
all the way up to my dad and my mom and dad that are in their seventies and we all enjoyed it. So it's a really just like light funny. Yeah, they're obviously it's called the Thursday Murder Club. They're investigating murders, but it's perfect for all ages. It's PG-13 just because of a little bit of language, which we're okay with in my household. So, but that's why the rating is a little bit higher. There's nothing super scary or anything like that.
to be concerned about, but it's like an all-star cast and really, really fun. Easy plot line for a 10-year-old to follow all the way up. So it didn't, you know, there wasn't a whole lot that went over anybody's head. So highly recommend for like an easy, fun holiday watch if you're with multi-generations, especially. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.
Vanessa (02:10.167)
In my movie.
Wilhelmina (02:12.131)
That's good to know. It's based on a book that people really liked. I don't know if the book falls into that cozy, mystery category, but I think it is in that somewhat. then, yes. Yes.
Lauren (02:23.244)
That's a good way of describing it. Cozy mystery. I like that. Yeah, yeah, it definitely was. It was cute. So yeah, what about you? The Thursday Murder Club. Yeah. What about you, Wilhelmina?
Vanessa (02:29.742)
He said it was called the Thursday Club? Murder Club, okay.
Wilhelmina (02:31.407)
Thursday murder.
Wilhelmina (02:37.241)
So first, I just want to give like a quick shout out because I get People magazine. It's my like, I love it. And Jonathan Bailey, who you might know from Bridgerton and from Wicked, he was announced as Sexiest Man Alive. And he is the first, he has made history being the first openly gay man to be
Lauren (02:47.394)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (02:50.862)
Yes. Yes.
Wilhelmina (03:04.621)
labeled as sexiest man alive, which is a huge thing in Hollywood because that was sort of what people used to say of like, why men didn't come out, actors didn't come out because they wouldn't be deemed sexy. And so like this sort of marks this moment of, wait, a man can say he's gay and still be thought of as a sex symbol for men and women alike. So I just thought that was pretty, pretty cool. Yeah. My fave.
Vanessa (03:15.832)
those opportunities.
Teri (03:28.866)
Very cool.
Wilhelmina (03:33.319)
is a book of poetry. It's called How About Now by Kate Bear. So this is her fourth book of poetry. The very small book, I mean, it's like 97 pages and all of her poetry books are around that length. She is 40 years old and married with kids and she writes a lot about being
a woman being middle-aged, being a mom, being a wife, and her poetry is so, so good. It's very readable. So it's not like you have to, it's not Shakespeare, but it's so relatable as a woman in my middle-aged woman. And it's just so raw and poignant. It's beautiful. And
Again, I've read all of her poetry books. I've seen her in person. She's amazing. yeah, so if you, you know, looking for a quick read, because obviously the, mean, it's just little, little poems. And I just wanted to read this one line. I'm not going to read the whole thing. It's called Marriage Poem. And it's like, my husband says I have a way of making some everything into something.
The happiest hours of my life have been alone, watching my family through a window. I love my life except for the noise of it." Which I just thought was like a way to phrase sort of the mixed feelings we can feel at times when we're like, love my family and I love my life, but it's so chaotic and loud and noisy and messy. And I just thought in one little line, she just summed that up. And I feel like that's a good like,
Teri (05:03.448)
you
Wilhelmina (05:26.987)
example of her poetry in general. So, highly recommend. It just came out. yeah. Terry, what about you?
Lauren (05:31.446)
No.
Teri (05:37.44)
Mine is one that I believe you also have Wilhelmina. We spent a lot of time talking about the brand CalPak, C-A-L-P-A-K. They are a company that makes suitcases, travel gear, and they have a travel duffel bag. It's called the Luca, L-U-K-A, travel duffel. I've had it for a couple of years. I believe several of us have it. Yes.
Vanessa (05:45.936)
Wilhelmina (05:56.783)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (06:02.839)
I have a two.
Vanessa (06:04.354)
bought it after I saw both of yours.
Lauren (06:05.728)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (06:07.192)
I'm a huge fan, was on a girl's trip recently and two of us had it. And one of my other friends was like, I'm putting this on my Christmas list. It, don't have it to hold up, but essentially you, has a compartment on the bottom to fit shoes. It doesn't take up a lot of room, but really fits a lot in, has a lot of compartments that are all very useful. And then it also has this slot on the outside so that you can slide it over the handles of your carry-on. So you can plop it on top of your carry-on.
It'll fit snugly because you slide it in. It's awesome. I actually bought the CalPak brand backpack recently. I had intentions of walking to work because I moved offices a couple of months ago. I have yet to actually do that. However, my plan was to do that. Maybe it'll happen one day. Yes, seemed like a great idea. So I have two of their products. Now, actually, I have
Lauren (06:52.514)
I love the intention.
Wilhelmina (06:52.655)
You
Vanessa (06:52.942)
It's a good idea.
Teri (07:02.05)
Two of their suitcases, their rolling suitcases, their carry-on size and their bigger, larger size, yes. And then I have their travel duffel and other backpack. They have great sales. I think right now everything's 20 % off around the holidays. They have stuff on clearance. It's C-A-L-P-A-K CalPak. Highly recommend their travel stuff.
Wilhelmina (07:04.908)
Yeah, me too.
Wilhelmina (07:21.999)
And I have the backpack as well and love it. I had gotten tired of like having like a one-shouldered bag when I was traveling. And so I transitioned to the backpack and love it for like airplanes when you're just like having to do a lot of walking. For a road trip, I like the Luka.
Teri (07:25.228)
Yeah, it's good stuff.
Teri (07:43.18)
Right. Yeah.
Vanessa (07:43.887)
Yeah, and I will say it. I bought it after our last trip that you both had it and I was asking you about it. And since then, it's actually become Mark's bag. So he is, yes, he keeps stealing my luggage. Yes, he stole my away bag. He is currently on a trip right now. He's coming home today and he has the cow fag with him. So it's definitely gender neutral. Like, you some bags look a little like maybe more feminine, more like I feel like that's a really good kind of gender neutral bag, like the way it looks.
Lauren (07:52.862)
that's funny.
Wilhelmina (07:53.123)
He keeps stealing your luggage. He keeps stealing it.
Lauren (07:59.266)
Ha!
Wilhelmina (08:03.107)
That's hysterical.
Lauren (08:03.36)
I mean.
Vanessa (08:13.112)
So we have it in black, so he has used it on several trips. So yeah, so I can vouch that it is well liked in my home as well.
Teri (08:21.826)
Yeah, it's a good one.
Lauren (08:22.178)
That's a good one.
Wilhelmina (08:22.371)
Yeah, my watermelon color one is a little bit less gender neutral, but yes, typically. Yes, absolutely.
Vanessa (08:24.766)
Yeah. Yes. I mean, I just meant the style of the bag. Yes, depending on what color you got. We have it in black, but the style is not like, I feel like it's pretty gender neutral. So yeah, it's a good one. So I am actually going to recommend a show today, The Witcher. So this is definitely in the like fantasy fiction genre. It's based on actual a book, like a book series.
Lauren (08:26.195)
Ha!
Teri (08:35.362)
Yeah, how about you Vanessa?
Wilhelmina (08:45.807)
Ooh, you've told me about this one before.
Vanessa (08:53.722)
And so if you're like a of Thrones, like that's the similar genre. So if you like Game of Thrones, I think you would like The Witcher. they just, season four came out, I think it might be already like two or three weeks. And I was hesitant to watch it because Henry Cavill played, I think that's how he says his last name. He played The Witcher and I loved him as The Witcher. And then from what I read, he was supposed to get tapped for Superman.
Lauren (09:15.463)
All right.
Vanessa (09:22.848)
and said he couldn't do The Witcher. And then that actually didn't happen, but it was too late. And so they actually had Liam Hemsworth take the role, which I was like, this is why I didn't watch it, because I was like, that is the weirdest replacement. I mean, I think they're like 10 years between the two of them, very different. And so there is, I think there is a video game. I'm not really sure, but I've seen like a cartoon version of The Witcher.
Wilhelmina (09:36.196)
Whoa.
Wilhelmina (09:43.373)
Very different looks.
Vanessa (09:52.493)
which is what they made. Henry Cavill looked just like him, like they obviously he's wearing a wig, like the same around the same age, same like built, like he was just such a good witcher. So when they announced that it was gonna be Liam Hemsworth, I was like, how is that gonna work? So I was really hesitant to keep watching. Cause I was like, this is so weird that that's who is replacing him. But I will say, I think this is the best season, the season four.
I still think that Henry Cavill is a better witcher, but I actually am pleasantly surprised with Liam Hemsworth, how good of a job he's doing. And to be honest, I think if he had been it originally, I would have liked the show, but he's doing a really good job. But this season actually was the best for me. I think somebody else is directing it. It definitely has more of that, you know, like the slowed fight scenes where like, know, they like...
slash someone and you see the blood slowly tear you wouldn't like this. So it's definitely got that vibe to it. It's a very cool cinematography, I will say. So it's just really good season, a lot of character development. But the Witcher is essentially, so it's a fantasy fiction, not gonna get too much into it, but the Witcher is the main character. His name is Geralt, I think is how you pronounce it. And he fights creatures and he...
Wilhelmina (10:45.647)
Thank
Teri (10:46.776)
Mm-mm.
Vanessa (11:10.988)
basically has this love interest, she's a witch. And so there's a lot of this fantasy fiction and they have this whole like tumultuous relationship, which I just love like the, it's just a good relationship. And then there's this girl, I won't give away too much that they're protecting essentially. And so it's just kind of the story of the three characters and how their stories intertwine. It's really good if you like that genre. I...
Wilhelmina (11:34.307)
I've heard it's quite steaming too at times, which piques my interest.
Vanessa (11:36.927)
Yes, but there have been seasons where like, yes, so that was one of the reasons why I was like, how's this gonna work? Because yes, Henry Cavill and the main character, her name is Yen. I forget the actress's name. I've never actually seen her before. She's great. She's amazing. Her character is so good. Their chemistry was like, wow. So I was curious how chemistry was. I would say it's good. Again, I think it's not as good, but it is good. again, I was kind of like, how's this gonna work? So it's good.
Wilhelmina (11:59.599)
It's not as good.
Vanessa (12:05.368)
but it's not as good as it was with the original, but still a good show. So the last season is coming out. They've already finished filming it. So it comes out next fall and it's with Liam. Yeah, you do, you do. You definitely have to start at one. And I will say, I can't remember if it's season one or season two. I think it was season two. The way it was filmed is very odd. That's why I said, I think they have a new film director.
Wilhelmina (12:17.219)
And I assume you have to start at one, season one.
Vanessa (12:35.126)
And I know it kind of threw Mark off. was like, what is this? This is weird. I don't get it. But when you watch it, if you watch it all the way to the end, then you're like, my God. It's like one of those where like the way they filmed it, it's like weird. And you're like, what is happening? What is happening? And then when you get to the end and you realize what it makes so much sense and it's actually really awesome what happened, like how, like what it reveals. So I would definitely say it's a good, it's a definitely a good show if you like that, that genre for sure. So The Witcher, it's on Netflix. Yeah. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (12:47.321)
Makes sense.
Wilhelmina (13:00.387)
That's been on my list for a while. I think you mentioned it to me a while back and it's been on my, been on my queue.
Vanessa (13:06.06)
Yeah, think season two or three was a little bit slow, but definitely still worth it. But this season was just so good, so good. I have one episode left. I can't wait to watch it tonight. All right, ladies, thank you for sharing. So holidays are coming up. This episode is going to drop right before Thanksgiving. And so Terry mentioned, let's talk about holiday and parenting. Are typical kids, are neuro?
Wilhelmina (13:16.911)
you
Lauren (13:18.208)
Nice.
Vanessa (13:34.627)
typical and neurodivergent kids, talking a little bit about some of the things that we might experience and I think most importantly, giving some tips and strategies of some things that can be helpful during the holidays. I think one of the things that I thought of when you mentioned this topic, Terry, was something that happens a lot during the holidays and it's like going to other people's homes. Like that happens a lot, that at some point in the holiday season, you're gonna end up at someone else's house. And so was thinking of...
you know, what are some things that you can do even before you get there to kind of prepare for what's going to happen, right? And so I think that's something I know as myself, I don't always do as a parent, but I think can be really helpful about talking about who's going to be there, what to expect there. And then things, I think even more importantly, to talk about things that what not to expect there, right? Or things that might have changed from like the previous years. I was just thinking of like my family.
specifically, like we used to all have this like really big celebration. Everybody was there. And I think between like COVID and a falling out between a couple of people in my family, it's not the big, you know, party that it was before. So I know that one of the things my daughter is always like, is someone's gonna be there? So, you know, so I'm always like, okay, this is the people who are gonna be there. This is what we're doing. And that can be, I think, really helpful for kids to know kind of what to expect there. And obviously,
Lauren (14:52.684)
Mm.
Vanessa (15:01.496)
things can change, right? Like you can't prepare for every situation or scenario. But I think that that is something that can be really helpful for kids is it's kind of previewing like the expectations of who's going to be there and kind of what's going to happen and what's not going to happen and who might not be there or like a tradition that maybe has changed from previous years, things that we're like not doing anymore, I think can be really helpful.
Lauren (15:21.644)
So I know in my practice and I'm sure in other people's practice, I call it priming in the same way that we use the word or the term priming for when we're working with kids or educators, interventionists are working with kids on academics, priming for comprehension. It's the same idea. It's like in order to best comprehend the situation, if we prime ourselves, we prime our kids.
Wilhelmina (15:44.335)
you
Lauren (15:45.034)
you will see the best outcomes. And I think it makes a whole lot of sense when we think about how we all function in unknown situations, it increases our anxiety. And in different kids, people, all of us deal with anxiety in different ways. And so if we go through some priming exercises of, you know, walking through where you're going to be and what like how it's going to, you know, play out who's going to be there.
things that would be typical versus not typical, things that you can expect and do that'll be exciting and fun, things that might be a little bit, I don't know, overwhelming or scary or anxiety provoking. Priming is a strategy that always works. And I think when you term it that way for, I have found in my practice, when you use that term,
Teri (16:20.44)
boring or yeah.
Vanessa (16:23.502)
Thank
Lauren (16:35.296)
people's brains immediately go to academic priming comprehension. And it really does apply in these different situations. And I think it helps you in a really natural way to prepare yourself, your kids, whomever for the situation.
Teri (16:48.854)
And I think what goes...
Wilhelmina (16:49.591)
In addition to that, I think that
In addition to that, we have a smaller family even when we're all together, which we usually are for the holidays, but we do have a wide age range of kiddos now, ranging from just one to my daughter who's 13. And so I have found that I like to plan for some sort of activity or craft or something that everyone can, all the kids can do together.
because sometimes there's a bit of a wall between like the different age groups and just being like play together doesn't really work, but being like at the same table and all doing something together does help. All of a sudden that wall breaks down a little bit and then they're kind of talking and then they slowly kind of evolve into playing. And so that's something that I've found that's helpful when you have kind of a wider age gap with kids and you're trying to get them
Vanessa (17:28.75)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (17:52.939)
one, maybe like occupied, and two, to kind of, if they haven't seen each other in a while or things like that, that they get something that brings them together that they're doing and then it kind of helps break the ice a little bit.
Teri (18:06.836)
And what goes along with that is the priming and the previewing. But in addition to, do you have a game plan for your kids if something goes awry or something happens that is frustrating, somebody makes a comment to them, someone tries to force them to eat something that they don't want to eat on and on. The example that I can think of is if we've talked with our kids, if there is, we have a lot of nieces and nephews who are older. So on my husband's side, my kids are the youngest.
Wilhelmina (18:18.466)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (18:36.788)
what do you do if your cousins are on their phones the whole time? And my kids don't have cell phones yet. And you're, yes. And what you bring up, Wilhelmina, makes sense, but it actually gets really, really tricky once there's teenagers and young adults in your family, which is coming down the pipeline and they want to be on their phones the whole time. Or they'll engage, they'll play one game of Yahtzee and then they're on their phones. Or they do the craft and then they're right on their phones.
Lauren (18:40.917)
I love that question.
Vanessa (18:42.498)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (18:42.743)
Yes, yes.
Wilhelmina (18:53.155)
Mm-hmm. You're right. You're right.
Wilhelmina (19:01.625)
See ya!
Teri (19:04.03)
And we talked with our kids about if you feel like a particular cousin is too engaged, come up, pull us aside. What would be the language you would use? What would you say to us? Like, hey, I'm feeling really frustrated. We can help troubleshoot. We can practice a script and a role play of what you could say to a particular cousin or family member if you want them to come play with you and they're not. What do you think Warren's coming to us as an adult for further support? And I also think that
Lauren (19:14.754)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (19:32.286)
you need to give kids direction and jobs. It can't be like, here we are, we've arrived at grandma or aunt blah, blah, blah's house and it's a free for all. What's the agenda? And you need to be able to do that on the fly. Is everybody watching football? Okay, maybe during halftime we can play a board game. Is everybody doing X, Y and Z, but you as a parent need to be flexible with a routine and get a lay of the land and be able to think on the fly of what are we gonna do?
Lauren (19:50.614)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (20:00.522)
with the kids, especially when it's not your own home. And that's where it gets a lot trickier. When you are not hosting, you have to really be prepared. That means bringing things with you. If it's bringing board games or UNO or whatever it is, if it's nice out, bringing a football, you know, so they can play catch. But I really think you've got to be planful, preview and also preview with your kids what to do when things don't go according to the preview plan. What are you going to do to get some support around that?
Vanessa (20:04.27)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (20:12.524)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (20:27.554)
Hmm.
Vanessa (20:31.17)
Yeah, we always have everly and we do this even like just to go out to dinner. I'm like, fill a backpack, like get your backpack, whatever is going to keep you occupied. And I'll tell her like, here's who's going to be there so that you know, are any of those people going to play with you or like, you know, like, so she gets the lay of the land and she knows what to bring and how much stuff to bring with her. We'll be like, we're going to house. There are no toys there. Right. Like, so this is going to be a no toy zone. So, you know, what to put in your bag, you like pack your, you know, whatever you think is going to keep you. and that works.
Wilhelmina (20:36.91)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (21:01.07)
pretty well to keep her busy because she's picking, you she's at the age now where she can pick whatever she wants in there. But I think that's really important to like not just assume you're going to show up somewhere and there's going to be stuff for your kids to do that like you may need to bring some things for them. Even if there is stuff, I think kids like having their own kind of things with them and that can really help, I think, avoid some of the stress.
Wilhelmina (21:11.343)
Right.
Wilhelmina (21:20.089)
Well, and in addition to the priming, so we do the hosting for Thanksgiving and I establish we are not playing video games. We are not on our iPads. So don't even ask. Don't even ask because it's going to be a no. And then I put those away so they're not even visual. And the only thing that I will allow them to play is that
Vanessa (21:33.186)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (21:49.475)
The next, which I think was one of my favorites last season, which is that one where they're really active and they're doing that. And said, that's the only thing I'll say yes to from like an electronic standpoint, because otherwise they're like, Mard, can we go watch TV? Can we go do this? And I'm like, no, you cannot. And I'm going to say no ahead of time. I'm going to say no. So I'm going to just tell you right now, I'm going to say no. So don't even ask.
Lauren (22:13.748)
Okay, so I have a question guys. What do you do when you host? So I'm hosting both a Thanksgiving and a Christmas event this year. What do you do when you're the host and that's your expectation? We're gonna hang and we're gonna be together and we're gonna talk and we're gonna eat and there's games and there's activities to do and there's always football on TV. So there is like that screen available, but people come into your home and let their kids be on their phones the entire time. What do you do?
Teri (22:14.242)
Well, let me, same, same.
Wilhelmina (22:18.383)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (22:41.965)
Yeah.
Teri (22:43.18)
Yes. That's happened to me also.
Lauren (22:44.098)
Because that's happened to me. Or they let their kid bring a device or something like that and the kid's sitting in the corner. Now, do you have empathy? Do you think that kid must be anxious or struggling or whatever and they need to be self-focused and self-regulating in the corner? What do you do? It's easy to judge.
Vanessa (22:45.677)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (23:04.705)
It is, it is.
Vanessa (23:05.838)
for sure.
Teri (23:07.682)
Well, what my husband, what my husband, well, can tell you what, yes.
Lauren (23:08.002)
It's not an easy answer, is it? It's not an easy answer.
Wilhelmina (23:09.538)
silent!
Vanessa (23:10.286)
I think it depends on the family, like your relationship. I think there's a lot of different ways that that can pan out.
Wilhelmina (23:13.935)
The kid, what it is, yes.
Teri (23:18.956)
So, yeah.
Wilhelmina (23:20.035)
Cause if this were my nephew, I'd be like, off your iPad. Like, come on, let's go over. If I've like, yes, yes.
Vanessa (23:24.846)
If you have that relationship with them, yeah, yeah. What would you say,
Teri (23:25.996)
Right. And while I have two, I have one question I wanted to pose to the group, but before I do that, I will say what we tried on one occasion last year for the holidays. I think it was Thanksgiving and we hosted Thanksgiving for my husband's side and my, maybe it was a Christmas thing. Regardless at one of the holidays, my husband looked around and it wasn't just the teenagers and young adults. It was all the adults and everybody was on their phone and my husband grabbed me and said, look around. And we did.
Lauren (23:49.506)
The adults. Yep. Uh huh.
Teri (23:55.148)
And he's like, everybody's on their phone. And I'm like, my gosh. He goes, the next thing we host, I'm having a phone basket by the front door. I will text everybody and give them a heads up. He executed on that plan and it went fine. It went great. I think we'll have to see what this round of holidays brings. We did not have the nieces and nephews who were 16 and up put their phones in. It was more like the 12 year old.
12, you know, so that had to put their phone in. You do as they get older, you do run into your teenage nieces and nephews being like, I'm texting my boyfriend. I'm like, sorry, this is my phone. I'm not getting off of it. And I also think my question for the group is, what do do if you set that expectation about no video games, no screens, et cetera, and your child decides this is the year that they're going to push back in front of everybody?
and they're just going to go on because that will likely happen. And so, you know, this is the year we're just we're either going to sneak it, we're going to sneak it and you're going to catch them or they're going to in front of family, extended family cause a scene. How do you handle that?
Wilhelmina (24:57.965)
No.
Vanessa (25:10.19)
So I'm thinking of like, Lauren's question, your question. So I think that if it's important to you that no one's on the screen, right? So if you're hosting, right? Let's just say you're hosting. If it's important to you that no one's on the screen, I think what you said Dan did last year was to make sure everybody knows in advance, right? Like you can't just be like, up at the house. But I think that's hard. think when it comes down to the teenagers not doing it, it's really their parents that need to like, right? Like if you've told the parents, hey, this is the expectation, then it's really the parents' job to say,
Lauren (25:25.26)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (25:32.558)
Right.
Lauren (25:32.578)
Correct. You got it.
Vanessa (25:39.759)
this is the expectation when you go over to Aunt's so and so's or Uncle's so and so's or Grandma's house is that we're not using it. So I think as if you're hosting, like that shouldn't be punted on you for that, right? Like you've asked this, the family, like this is what the expectation is. however, in a scenario where like you've told everyone and then you have now family who are not, you know, who...
Lauren (25:51.703)
Right.
Vanessa (26:04.844)
like a parent who is not letting their teenager do whatever they want, then I think that that's hard. I don't know. think depending on my relationship, I would go to the parent of that teen and say, hey, remember, I wouldn't confront the teen personally. I would say to the parent, remember, we said that we were going to do this and take that conversation to the adults to see if they would. Again, I don't know. It may not change anything. They may not, depending on their
Wilhelmina (26:04.857)
I'm playing.
Wilhelmina (26:09.771)
or you're getting the sneaking.
Teri (26:11.607)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (26:33.078)
I think this is where you have to be careful not to parent another kid though, too. So I, yep, as a host, I think to answer your question, Terry, the devices are just going to be hidden for my kids so that I don't even have to have that confrontation with them. They're just not going to know where they are. I would have the conversation beforehand. This is an event. This is like, you've got family here. This is so fun. There are so many like cool things about this. You will see.
Vanessa (26:34.208)
expectations. Well, as I said, I would never say it to the kid, right? I would never
Wilhelmina (26:50.467)
Yeah, me too, me too.
Lauren (27:01.12)
some of the other kids on their phones. I think this is, I'm saying it out loud. I'm working through it with you guys in the moment. You're going to see other kids on their phones, their devices. That's not my jam. Like what we're going to do is we're going to learn how to talk to people and look them in the eye. We're going to learn how to do a game or watch a football game or go outside and throw the football or whatever. That's what, and I get to decide that as a parent and other parents that are here are going to make different decisions. Then
Wilhelmina (27:13.743)
you
Lauren (27:30.338)
you do the follow-up, which is you tell them, like, this is going to be challenging and I know you can handle it. Like, you work with them on managing their frustration in the moment, even before it happens, by going back to the priming, right? And I think, you know, I think it's okay for you to, I don't know, is it really bad if I, you know, you just kind of say that out loud? Like, I know this is not your mom's choice as a parent, but other parents are making different choices now.
Vanessa (27:46.604)
the expectation.
Teri (27:59.06)
Everyone makes their own choice. yeah, one thought I had one thought. Yeah. One thought I had for this coming round of holidays is a lot of teenagers and young adults will do a phone stack when they go to restaurants. So they will all stack their phones in the middle of the table so that and they're face down usually. And they do a phone stack and then they just have dinner. And so I thought about having people do that. Like, let's do a phone stack in the dining room, on the buffet or by the front door.
Lauren (27:59.552)
I don't know. mean, it just, right. It's like.
Wilhelmina (28:02.263)
Other family, other rules.
Vanessa (28:21.486)
That's a good idea.
Teri (28:25.752)
And you can go check it periodically, but otherwise phones are here and you can check it once an hour or whatever, just to sort of model what teenagers and young adults are already doing. That's just something that I've thought about to make it a bit more collaborative.
Lauren (28:40.866)
But if.
Vanessa (28:43.756)
I like the idea of saying like, we're going to do like, give you an opportunity at some point to like check your phone. like, maybe if this is something that's important to you, and you're sharing that with your guests, like we're going to try to, you know, keep phones away, but we will have opportunities for anyone who needs to check it, right? I guess there's some instances and obviously for the teens, like they need to check their phones. I like that idea that you can, that way they feel like, okay, I will have a time where I can look at my phone and then I'll put it away. So I think that's a good way to compromise.
Lauren (28:44.074)
If there's
Lauren (29:10.05)
But as a full grown adult, how would you feel if somebody like I, so I don't feel like I'm as attached to my phone. I wouldn't really care one way or the other, but there is a part of me. There is a part of me, not about the phone, like telling me what to do. That's kind of annoying. I don't think I would tell people to do that in my home. I think I would hope that. Yeah. I think I would hope that we could engage. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Vanessa (29:17.42)
I wouldn't either if I was out of, yeah.
Teri (29:24.812)
Yes.
Vanessa (29:27.768)
to like not, to like not bring your phone. Yeah, I mean, I don't know that I would either, but I was just saying, if you feel so inclined to have like a phone free zone, I think these are some good strategies to like make sure you tell people in advance, so like maybe give them opportunities to check their phone, right? Like just whatever, like.
Teri (29:30.604)
Yeah.
Teri (29:37.065)
Right. Right.
Lauren (29:40.618)
Yeah. Yeah, I just think you have to be careful about in the same way you have to be careful about telling other people how to parent. And you can really only parent your own kid. Now, again, if you're the host, you get to decide what all the kids have access to or not. I'm a big fan. Like, yes, I do not have to have the iPads out available to anybody that's there. They can just be gone or the switches or whatever. But I think it's it's it's a little tricky if you're
Teri (29:52.885)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (30:10.176)
telling people what to do with their property, right? Like if they want to go into their phone and not engage with family during a family event, like I have empathy for them, like it's kind of sad, right? Like and it's like, okay, you're doing your thing and you're not talking to people, like that's really kind of sad. But what are you going to do?
Teri (30:13.282)
We'll speak.
Teri (30:24.45)
Right, that's on them.
But I think that also takes us to the question of parenting other people's kids and everyone parenting differently, right? We all parent differently, all of our kids are different. And one of the questions I have encountered is how do you manage extended family when your child is neurodivergent? So whether that's autism, ADHD, learning disorders, intellectual disabilities,
Lauren (30:36.61)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (30:51.151)
Mm.
Teri (30:57.16)
on and on if your kid does not present as neurotypical and whether that's joining everyone at the table to eat, trying a variety of foods, following the plan, like Lauren said, if that helps them regulate to be on a screen in the corner on the phone playing a game, because that helps them decompress. Screens always tend to help kids decompress, whether they're neurotypical or neurodivergent, unfortunately. And so what do you do when you
Lauren (31:15.286)
Mm-hmm.
for good or
Wilhelmina (31:20.099)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Teri (31:25.024)
are worried about your kid's behavior in someone else's home because they might not follow the rules. And how do you manage when an extended family member says, why isn't he sitting down to eat? Why is he running around the whole time? What are your guys' thoughts about that?
Vanessa (31:42.287)
I think it's similar to priming our kids. I think you need to prime your relatives, really set boundaries and that expectation in advance and say, this is what my kid is going to do or not do before it even happens so that there isn't a situation, or at least you're trying to minimize the possibility where someone can say, why isn't Johnny sitting with us right now? know, or.
Lauren (31:48.95)
Yeah. Yeah.
Lauren (31:58.978)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (32:08.587)
Right.
Vanessa (32:09.132)
why won't Johnny hug me back? So I think you have to, as a parent, feel comfortable setting up the expectations that other people will have of your child and just know that that's not gonna happen. I have a cousin whose son is on the autism spectrum and his birthday was over the summer. And she did such a nice job of, when it was time for the cake, to just stand up in front of everyone and say, thank you all for coming so much. My son is so excited that you're all here.
He does not want us to sing happy birthday. So we're just gonna stand here. We're gonna take a picture with the whole family and the cake. And that's what it was. There was no room for anyone to say, what? I mean, she just did such a nice job. I mean, and she did it in such a pleasant way where it was like, thank you all for coming. So wonderful to see you. We're not singing. This is what we're gonna do. Come take a picture with us. And that was the end of it. Nobody said anything. And if you're wondering like, why is that a big deal? In our family,
Wilhelmina (32:45.775)
That was it?
Lauren (32:46.195)
I love that. Yeah.
Teri (32:47.701)
Love that.
Lauren (33:00.834)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (33:07.116)
when it's a birthday party, you sing in English, then you sing happy birthday in Spanish. And then depending on which family member, you may also get a third happy birthday in Portuguese. So it's actually a big deal in our family to sing happy birthday. And everybody was just like, got it. There was not a single peep from a person. And it was just like a nice way of getting ahead of it.
Wilhelmina (33:24.249)
went along with it.
Lauren (33:25.398)
Yeah.
Teri (33:25.432)
Right. Yeah, because that can be a sensory overload for kids on the spectrum. That happy birthday can be, that can be really challenging.
Lauren (33:31.276)
Right, right. Well, that and the singular attention on the child in that moment, for sure. You know, it's interesting though, Vanessa, that takes a lot as a parent. I applaud your cousin for doing that because I think part of the issue that people run into is potentially not wanting to demonstrate that vulnerability in saying, this is what would be helpful for my child or let me help explain my child's behavior.
Vanessa (33:31.564)
Absolutely. Yes. Attention. Yeah. Attention. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Teri (33:36.822)
Yeah.
Vanessa (33:45.964)
He's very confident.
Lauren (34:01.206)
But then in not explaining it, it's a lot easier for people, good or bad, to then judge the behavior. So if you as a parent can show that willingness to say, like, I'm going to do this because this is what's best for my child, even though I might receive judgment or it might make me uncomfortable, then good for that parent because educate, like,
Wilhelmina (34:08.141)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (34:24.382)
I don't fault members of a family if they'd especially if they are from pre older generations that don't understand different aspects of childhood functioning, especially as we understand it now, this is all very new still like in its early stages in terms of understanding it. And so if you can even just say something so brief like that, like here's what we're going to do. Here's why period end of story. You really have set your child up for success as well as
the other people in the room that otherwise might not understand what was happening to no fault of their own.
Vanessa (34:59.34)
Yeah. Yeah. And I think.
Wilhelmina (35:00.057)
Well, and Lauren, I think that to be able to do that, because I know that I, if I start to feel that like judgment from others around something my kid's doing, I start to get a little bit dysregulated myself, especially if I'm hosting. So it's like, I'm hosting, I'm trying to like navigate this. And the minute I get dysregulated, I am not parenting.
Lauren (35:19.138)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (35:22.924)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (35:29.655)
the way that I would like want to parent. So I actually think another tip is to take a breath, take a beat, maybe take a break, go to the bathroom for a second, take a breath. And then if you need to, and then so you can step into what you need to do as a parent for your kid to parent the way you need to, which might be to be like, hey, this is what we're doing, or hey, why don't you go, you know.
step over here, even though you know you're getting the stares or the glares, that you are not letting kind of the room dictate how you want to parent, which I think takes a lot of self-regulation and staying grounded in like what you value as a parent and how you want to parent. And I, in addition to that, I think that I know that I've gotten this comment, I know I have
several patients who navigate this, which is the, you never acted this way, or you didn't do this, or your brother didn't do this, kind of implying, and it's not necessarily coming from a place of maliciousness.
Teri (36:43.382)
Right. That what they remember from 35 or 40 years ago is, no, I mean, it's accurate. So we'll take that, put that to the side. Right.
Wilhelmina (36:48.143)
It's accurate, completely accurate. Yes, so one, it's accurate, always, right? And, but yet what it sort of implies is, well, I must have done this better than you're doing it because your behavior, like clearly was better, meaning I was a better parent and you had better behavior because I was a better parent. So you're not doing as good of job, which is not necessarily what they're saying.
Vanessa (36:49.068)
Yeah. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (37:17.881)
They're not necessarily wanting to say that, but that's what that comment implies.
Vanessa (37:21.198)
comes across.
Teri (37:22.52)
But that's generational, and we actually touched on that when Anna Hammond joined us. But when I say generational on our part, meaning that we think our kids behavior represents our parenting, as opposed that it says, again, like it's all about us. Like, our parents judgment must be about me. Like everything's about me. And my child's behavior is about me versus generations past were a bit more individuated.
Wilhelmina (37:26.264)
Of course it is.
Vanessa (37:29.742)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (37:36.396)
Hmm.
Lauren (37:40.502)
Mm-hmm.
Teri (37:51.606)
where the child's behavior was more about the child than about the parenting. There wasn't such a focus on they did a good job parenting. It was more like the kid was the kid.
Wilhelmina (38:00.439)
You don't think that ever, you don't think that comment ever implies just a little bit of like, hmm, you didn't act this way.
Lauren (38:08.13)
It might, but I think it's also important to recognize why the possible judgment bothers you. So if I'm thinking about me, it's because I care about the people saying it. So it does come from a really good place. I care about the older generation of my family. And if they're saying something that I'm perceiving as judgment, that bothers me because I care about them. Right? So like, it's nuanced in that regard of like, and that's actually, I, when
Wilhelmina (38:16.079)
you
That's accurate. Yes. Yes.
Teri (38:20.342)
Yes. Right.
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (38:30.275)
Because I care. Yeah.
Teri (38:31.362)
Right, and I care what they think. Yeah.
Lauren (38:37.814)
When I think about that, and I talk about this a lot with my clients in terms of, and actually even with my kids, if you're anxious about something, it's because you care, or you want to do well on that exam, or you want to perform well in that activity, that sport, whatever, anxiety informs you about how you feel about this particular event. And I think judgment does the same thing. It's, okay, I actually care about their opinion. And that's, I perceive it as okay.
Wilhelmina (38:47.727)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (39:07.852)
Like I love them, I care about them and I care what they think about me. But then it does roll right into what Terry's saying, is, and we then judge ourselves for our child's behavior when sometimes our kid is tired and didn't eat because they don't like the Thanksgiving meal and we didn't prepare that and we should have fed them in the car before we got to Thanksgiving. And like it is what it is, they had a meltdown and it's not a reflection of us. It was a reflection of that circumstance during that 30 minute period.
Teri (39:22.048)
a kid being a kid.
Wilhelmina (39:23.129)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Right.
Vanessa (39:26.798)
Yeah.
Vanessa (39:38.323)
I think in having this conversation, I'm thinking like even more importantly, think, than priming your kids is priming yourself for what is going to happen and what's not going to happen. I think that you that's actually where you start is priming yourself for the interactions you're going to have. You know, one of the things that I thought of. Yeah, I. Yeah, no.
Wilhelmina (39:46.039)
Yes. Yes.
Teri (39:49.336)
Hmm.
Teri (39:56.856)
Nobody has changed.
Wilhelmina (40:01.377)
Yes, yes, this this holiday is going to be like a holiday before it. We did, we did.
Teri (40:04.994)
Shocker. Yes. Yes. Yes.
Vanessa (40:07.246)
Yes, I think we talked about that in our last like dealing with the holidays you know thinking of parenting and one of the things that I like kind of stuck out to me when we brought this topic up was when I really was little and sleep and You know, I say to parents stick to your guns stick to your stick to your schedule stick to your plan You you got to get there late. That's fine. Get there late. You need to leave early Sorry, leave early. You got to go take a nap. Go take a nap. Like we were so like
Teri (40:20.12)
Hmm.
Teri (40:29.112)
Should I leave there early? Yep.
Vanessa (40:36.166)
protective of her sleep, especially when she's young. I still like, we still are like, you know, want her to get to bed on time. But when with all the naps and, know, coming from like a large Latino family, you know, for Christmas, for example, you get together Christmas Eve, you stay up till midnight and you open your presents. And I was like, that's not happening with my kid. And I get it. I survived it. We all did. We did it. And I got some flack from people, you know, like I was the sleep.
you know, police, whatever. I'm not selling your kid to go to bed. I'm putting my kid to bed. But that's just like an example of, you know, stick to your guns. You got to do what's best for you and your kid. And it's OK. Sometimes people might be disappointed and, you know, you just have to do kind of what's best. Now that she's older, like we're definitely more flexible. But when she was younger, I was like, that's great. That's when the party starts. But we'll get there when, you know, when we can.
Lauren (41:06.274)
Mm-hmm.
Lauren (41:29.194)
And I will say there, so I was just like you Vanessa as well. I was asleep like, my gosh. That said, and I know that this is, it's all over the child psych research, but Dr. Becky really hits this a lot too. There is a point at which we do have to kind of flip the script and start to, work on helping our children deal with frustration and challenges and things like that. Not when they're toddlers, right? Like, but there is a time period at which we have to say like, Hey,
Vanessa (41:32.686)
Thank
Teri (41:32.812)
Same. Same.
Vanessa (41:51.293)
for sure.
Lauren (41:57.462)
this is what our family does. And I know it's not what we do. And so here's how we're going to prepare for it. It's going to be really hard for you to stay up because we still go to bed at nine o'clock and the rest of the family does not and blah, blah, blah, blah. There is a time at which we need to take responsibility as parents to say, like, sticking to our guns is not about appeasing our child all the time and protecting them. we do need to teach them to tolerate frustration in these situations.
Vanessa (42:19.947)
Absolutely, yeah.
Lauren (42:27.33)
there's nuance there when you're maybe, don't even know if it's new versus as like a new parent versus as the kids get older, but there are different situations in which it's like, okay, now it's on us as parents to work with the child as opposed to everybody else.
Vanessa (42:43.758)
Yeah, well, I think that a good example is the screen time. So if Aunt Lauren called me and said, we're not doing screens, then it's my job to tell my kid, I'm sorry, but you're, you know, like that's an example. Like I'm going to say to my kid, this is how, like, there's not going to be any screens there. And I get that, like, you usually do a screen to, you know, I'm using screen as an example of whatever you fill in the blank. This is, this is how we're to do it. So I absolutely agree that there are going to be situations where you have to help your kid get through a situation that they're not used to. um,
Wilhelmina (42:44.441)
Well, and I
Lauren (42:47.318)
Yeah.
Lauren (42:53.952)
This is what we're gonna figure out, yep.
Lauren (42:58.858)
Yeah. Yep.
Vanessa (43:11.768)
figuring out that again beforehand, if you can, if you know that that's something that's gonna be different that you're faced with. But that's, yeah, think there's both sides to it, right? Setting them up for success by making sure they have the things that they need, but then also setting them up for success by saying, here's what's not gonna be there and what's not gonna happen that you typically does happen for you or that we do at our house. It's gonna be different at someone's house.
Lauren (43:17.814)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (43:35.779)
Well, and I think that multiple things can be true. We talk about this a lot, right? And so within a family dynamic where you have lots of different family members together, people can have a perspective that is an honest and accurate portrayal of how they're feeling and someone else is doing the right thing for them. And those two do not go together. And it doesn't mean that either one of them is wrong.
Vanessa (43:41.889)
all the time.
Wilhelmina (44:05.935)
And Vanessa, I'm thinking about your example because I remember there was a Thanksgiving a few years back. My nephews were still very, very young. mean, they're young still. But somehow the timing of like we had worked on dinner, we had gotten it already. And then like they ate and left within like 20 minutes. And we were like.
Teri (44:31.394)
done that. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (44:32.441)
That didn't, well, and we felt frustrated because we were like, so that didn't feel great because my favorite part of Thanksgiving, that's my preference because my favorite part of Thanksgiving, no, no.
Teri (44:40.28)
That was not my preference.
Vanessa (44:43.394)
Yeah. But I will ask, did they tell you that that was going to happen? So OK, so then to me, it's like if I was going to go to someone's house for 20 minutes, I would have said, like, hey, just so you know. Yeah.
Wilhelmina (44:54.543)
Well, no, they worked earlier, but like once it came to the meal.
Lauren (44:56.384)
I was just going to say, but were they there for multiple hours beforehand and thought dinner was going to be earlier?
Wilhelmina (45:01.527)
No, we said what time dinner was gonna be, but I think there was like fussiness starting to happen and things like that. And then they just, they left. And here's the thing, I actually understand that too. Like I get how that is. And so Vanessa, to your point, like they were trying to stay on schedule. They knew if they like went longer, the meltdowns were just gonna get more. They were gonna put down tired kids. And I got that.
Vanessa (45:16.59)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (45:30.403)
Like I get that. I also was like, that didn't feel great. So maybe next year we need to address this and have dinner earlier. Or I think last year, the year after that, was sort of like, hey, let's, I think I made a comment about like, let's spend a little bit more time at the table or something. I didn't say it quite that obviously, but I was like, kind of like, we put all of this work into making the food and my favorite part is sitting around and talking as we're eating. And so.
Vanessa (45:37.422)
Yeah.
Lauren (45:57.45)
every time. It takes 10 minutes.
Vanessa (45:58.041)
Yeah.
Wilhelmina (45:59.727)
10 minutes! I'm like, hmm. It was like, they weren't wrong in what they did and I knew that, but I also wasn't wrong with like being a little bit disappointed by it. So it's like two things can be true and we can't.
Lauren (46:02.56)
every time.
Vanessa (46:13.016)
Right. But I think, and yeah, absolutely. But I think that also requires some communication too, right? So if you're the only, especially if you have a small family, I'm thinking like, when I was going to these giant family parties, me leaving, one even noticed that I'm gone, right? Versus if I'm going to like an intimate one-on-one thing, then I'm gonna be like, Yeah, like I wouldn't be like, hey, it's time for us to, right?
Lauren (46:27.712)
Right, correct.
Wilhelmina (46:28.516)
Yes.
Wilhelmina (46:32.315)
yeah, half the table just left. Yeah.
Lauren (46:35.552)
Right.
Vanessa (46:39.094)
I would have approached the host and said, hey, just so you know, like, is there any flexibility here? Totally get it if it's not. Like, you know, we're going to have to like leave it this time. So I think.
Lauren (46:49.074)
Or, and what I used to do at Dana's house for tailgates when Sam and Jack were little is I used to bring the pack and play and put them down in the middle of a tailgate. I will, Dana's husband Tunde, Dana's my sister, Tunde's her husband, has said now with little kids, he's like, I never understood what you were doing in the middle of a tailgate when you would take the boys upstairs and put them down in our room, but it allowed us to stay longer. And like now to your point, Wilhelmina,
Wilhelmina (46:55.855)
Mm-hmm. Yes.
Vanessa (46:57.03)
yeah.
Vanessa (47:09.149)
Hahaha
Teri (47:09.442)
Mm-hmm.
Wilhelmina (47:15.949)
Yes.
Lauren (47:18.524)
things can be true. At the time, I'm sure they were like, this is the wackiest thing I've ever seen. And now it's like, wait a minute, tailgates can be six hours, and that's a really long time and she wanted to stay longer. And now I get it, like, whatever. Like, so yeah, I think some flexibility and perspective taking goes a long way in just having a positive experience during the holidays.
Wilhelmina (47:24.035)
to get it.
Wilhelmina (47:29.55)
Yes.
Vanessa (47:42.371)
And I think you brought up a good point. I think you brought up a good point about how they weren't parents at the time. And so I think that this conversation is actually really helpful for people who maybe their kids are grown now and they may be forgotten like how it's like when kids are little and you're like, yeah, like that sleeps a big deal, right? Or have not had kids, don't have kids, never have had kids and they are struggling with, you your requests to like, hey, I got to leave or whatever.
Wilhelmina (47:42.499)
Also keep that pack in play.
Teri (47:44.982)
I had.
Lauren (47:48.374)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Lauren (47:59.645)
Ha ha.
Vanessa (48:09.198)
I think this can be really helpful or even kids like when you're a parent of a kid who is neurotypical and you don't have a kid who is not, that also is very different, right? And I don't think that, you we all work with kids who are, you know, and so we know what that looks like. Some of us even have kids who, you know, are neurodivergent. So we get that, but I don't think every parent who...
Lauren (48:27.478)
Mm-hmm.
Vanessa (48:35.69)
understands what it's like to have a kid who's not and who can't be as flexible, right? Or who, you know, whatever, you know, fill in the blank here. So I think this is a good conversation for everyone to kind of listen to and get that there's why someone might be doing something or not doing something during the holidays and, you know, how that can affect them. You know, I personally can say like, I was bummed when I had to leave, but I was like, OK, but I know that I'm doing the best thing for, you know, our daughter at the time or.
Lauren trying to figure out a way like, okay, yeah, I can go take a nap with her in a spare bedroom, right? Like sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't. I mean, we walked around Disney and made sure she had a nap time at Disney. I I all the things, the kids slept in the stroller, like we literally walked around the park while she nap, you know, so like, you can also think outside the box a little bit too, to be able to give your kids what they need.
Teri (49:26.112)
Another tip that I would include, especially given all our kids are school age, elementary age, tween, teen, is as we move away from having to be maybe hopefully as rigid about leaving early, et cetera, and kids do get to hang a little bit longer and maybe stay up a little bit later, is letting kids be a part of the magic and giving them jobs and including them.
And that might mean the tree doesn't get decorated exactly how you like, or the cookies don't look perfect. But I think if we can include kids and give them jobs or communicate with our extended family, whoever is hosting, hey, it would be really cool if blah, blah, could help you with the potatoes for the mashed potatoes, or let's make Christmas cookies. Let's decorate houses, whatever, any jobs that you can give kids, include them in routine at the table. Yes, at the table or create new traditions that your kids want to come up with.
Wilhelmina (49:55.214)
that.
Wilhelmina (49:58.913)
you
Vanessa (49:59.299)
Mm.
Wilhelmina (50:18.574)
the table.
Teri (50:24.197)
I think is really key as your kids are in school age and then even teenagers. And I'm a big fan of,
Wilhelmina (50:28.621)
I asked, yeah, I love that. I asked Maddie and Griffin just yesterday if they wanted to make a side dish for Thanksgiving. And Griffin's like, well, I mean, I guess if it was easy. I'm like, he's like, what about mac and cheese? And I was like, that would be perfect. I was like, then there's mac and cheese for the kids and you guys can team up and make that together. And so like, that was one way I was trying to like, right, yeah.
Lauren (50:28.704)
I love that.
Lauren (50:37.994)
Aww.
Teri (50:44.012)
Yes. Yep.
Teri (50:51.19)
and let them do it. Yeah, let it be their version. It's okay if it looks weird or doesn't taste great or whatever, but letting go of that perfectionism and just letting them do it and have that experience.
Lauren (51:05.494)
Love that.
Vanessa (51:07.567)
All right, any last minute thoughts on our topic for today? Those are some good tips and strategies. Yeah, all right, ladies. you got one more. Yeah, I think that's a good one for everyone, the parents, the not parents, their children. Awesome. All right, ladies, thanks for joining us today, everyone. Please join us next time on The Shrinkdown.
Lauren (51:11.914)
I think that's a great way to end.
Teri (51:13.4)
My last one would be just remember their kids. One more. It's really simple. Just remember their kids. Everybody needs to remember their kids. Yep. Yes, their kids.
Wilhelmina (51:18.371)
Yes. Yep. Yeah.
Lauren (51:20.928)
Yeah, it's true.