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Best Beginnings is the podcast for everyone working in or caring about the early years. Hosted by George Looker, CEO of Babyzone, each episode brings together leading researchers, clinicians, practitioners, policymakers and parents to explore the evidence, ideas and innovations shaping how we support children and families in the UK.
From infant mental health and attachment to workforce challenges and systems change, Best Beginnings goes beyond the headlines to have the conversations that matter most in early childhood.
New episodes drop every Tuesday.
Best Beginnings is brought to you by Babyzone, a national charity operating free, evidence-based family hubs across England for families with children aged 0–5.
00:00:00:01 - 00:00:11:03
Unknown
The My Baby biome study, we found out that 90% of babies are missing one or more of the key species of gut bacteria they need for this proper immune development.
00:00:11:03 - 00:00:20:13
Unknown
Without them, the bad bacteria essentially take hold. It's like in a garden, you let the weeds take over
00:00:20:15 - 00:00:53:10
Unknown
Welcome to Best Beginnings, a podcast from Baby Zone, where we talked to the people who are working hardest to give every child the best possible start in life. We talk a lot on this podcast about a baby's brain and their attachment and the environment around them. Today we're going somewhere we haven't been before their gut. My guest is Doctor Stephanie Cutter, a scientist and entrepreneur who spent years studying the infant gut microbiome, the community of bacteria that lives inside every baby from birth.
00:00:53:12 - 00:00:58:20
Unknown
Stephanie is co-founder and chief executive of Persephone Bioscience, and she led
00:00:58:22 - 00:01:19:07
Unknown
the My Baby Biome study, one of the largest studies of its kind ever carried out in the United States. What her research found about the state of gut health in today's babies is striking, and it turns out it matters for a child's immune system, for the allergies and its long term health in ways that most of us have never been taught.
00:01:19:10 - 00:01:20:19
Unknown
So subject that
00:01:20:20 - 00:01:37:13
Unknown
might make a parent feel slightly behind or a little alarmed. So let me say this at the outset nothing in this conversation is about what anyone has done wrong. So much of what shapes a baby's got is set by things that a parent doesn't choose. What Stephanie's research offers isn't another thing to worry about.
00:01:37:13 - 00:02:01:14
Unknown
It's offering a clearer picture of what's happening inside our children in those very first months, and why it seems to have changed, and what the science can and can't yet tell us. So this sits right at the heart of what we try and do in this podcast, talking about the earliest, most invisible parts of a child's start in life and bringing them into light so that every family can make sense of them.
00:02:01:15 - 00:02:05:23
Unknown
Stephanie, welcome to Best Beginnings. Thank you so much for your time today.
00:02:06:02 - 00:02:07:08
Unknown
Thank you for having me.
00:02:07:08 - 00:02:26:17
Unknown
And as I said in the journey, I'd love to hear about your journey. Stephanie, around you've worked obviously at the moment as a scientist covering the gut microbiome, but you've also looked at cancer immunotherapy and and various other fields. What led you to infant health?
00:02:26:19 - 00:02:52:13
Unknown
It was really through a discussion with a pediatric scientist about infant gut health during our oncology journey, studying the gut microbiome of cancer patients so that we can develop therapies, essentially, that fixes their microbiome so that they can respond better to treatment is during that time that scientists came to me and said, you know, we know how you're fixing the microbiome of cancer patients.
00:02:52:15 - 00:03:08:05
Unknown
Why don't you fix the microbiome of babies? And that was very alarming to me, because at the time, my daughter Elizabeth was six months old. This is during Covid. She was sitting off camera and I didn't know what problem he was talking about.
00:03:08:07 - 00:03:30:14
Unknown
And we have similar aged children, but and it's sort of fascinating really. Again, same when I was reading your research around the challenges and the struggles that scientists have in terms of understanding this field, and then also from a parent's perspective, there's a lot of ambiguity and a lack of clarity to, I guess, you know, take us to the beginning.
00:03:30:14 - 00:03:46:17
Unknown
What was the sort of the finding that you found most revealing as you embarked on the research or, or what is it that you're seeing when you're when you're talking to the number of parents that you are and children that you're interacting with through the studies that you've run recently?
00:03:46:19 - 00:04:13:05
Unknown
It's kind of two main things that have been really ultimately surprising. One is just the true impact of modernization. Again, it's nothing us as parents have done, but it's really having children. In this modern era, we have been impacted by antibiotics. The microbiome of babies has been impacted by C-section births. Infant formula, poor diet have all had this impact on the kinds of bacteria these babies receive.
00:04:13:05 - 00:04:52:20
Unknown
But more importantly, the microbiome of an infant and a young child really impacts the development of their immune system for life. That's how the immune system gets trained. And without that proper education, the immune system develops errors and it can lead to higher risk for developing food allergies, eczema, asthma and many other chronic conditions. I think what surprised me most was one that not just these modernization factors are impacting the child's microbiome, but how prolific in our research, the largest study done in the US to map the infant microbiome.
00:04:52:21 - 00:05:04:06
Unknown
The My Baby biome study, we found out that 90% of babies are missing one or more of the key species of gut bacteria they need for this proper immune development.
00:05:04:08 - 00:05:33:12
Unknown
Well, it's quite striking isn't, as you say, the the scale of the challenge that we're facing and the fact that this is something that seems to have emerged recently. You spoke about some of the underlying factors. I guess if you could talk us through to the to the nonscientific audience to, to people like to me, what what's going on in the baby's gut, right from, you know, pregnancy through to birth in their first thousand days.
00:05:33:14 - 00:05:44:18
Unknown
What does it almost kind of look like? What would you kind of how would you articulate it? And then what does thriving look like? And then what does the sort of the challenge more challenging situation at like.
00:05:44:20 - 00:06:15:03
Unknown
That is a fantastic. So we think in utero not much is going on from the child's microbiome perspective. It's been obviously something very difficult to assess, but really at birth is when the child gets their microbiome. Babies born vaginally really inherit not just microbes from their mother in the birth canal, but the mother's gut microbiome. There is this exposure to the mom's stool, essentially, that exceeds the child.
00:06:15:05 - 00:06:48:07
Unknown
And this is very much in contrast to babies born via C-section. Antibiotics are given during that procedure because it's a surgical procedure, and the first microbes that these babies inherit at birth is really what's from the hospital as well as skin. Right. And so from the hospital, you're potentially getting potential pathogens, other infectious organisms. So that early birth mode is highly important into kind of that set point or what the child seeded with.
00:06:48:08 - 00:07:14:02
Unknown
From there, it's really how the child is fed in those first few months, you know, whether they're breastfed, mixed or formula fed breast milk has all the right prebiotics or food for the gut bacteria, namely Bifidobacterium. They thrive in the presence of human sacrifice. The main prebiotic in milk formula, for the most part, does not contain that that repertoire.
00:07:14:03 - 00:07:47:02
Unknown
And so that starts to cause a, you know, somewhat of a difference there. And then in terms of what's thriving for an infant, you want the infant gut to be rich in Bifidobacterium. These are very important, what we call keystone. They're the key members of the baby gut. Without them, the ecosystem collapses. These keystone Bifidobacterium thrive with breast milk, and they put out special signals that only really they can that tell the immune system to develop properly.
00:07:47:02 - 00:07:50:23
Unknown
They reduce the inflammation to allow proper development.
00:07:51:03 - 00:07:58:07
Unknown
Without them, the bad bacteria essentially take hold. It's like in a garden, you let the weeds take over
00:07:58:08 - 00:08:11:02
Unknown
and, you know, as the child progresses in solid food, that transition in weans, you really want to nourish that garden, right? We don't want to nourish the weeds, essentially.
00:08:11:04 - 00:08:34:09
Unknown
that sense and and I guess how much of this window is continues to be open through a child's early years? Or are we very much looking at those first few weeks, months? What happens if, for example, you know, how much this can be reversed, how much of this can be put back if it's if it's not there from the very beginning?
00:08:34:11 - 00:08:41:04
Unknown
Or is this something that once you once you've moved to foods and solids, you can't get back?
00:08:41:06 - 00:09:06:20
Unknown
Really, the child microbiome is very plastic. During those first thousand days, we see that the microbiome starts at birth with around 12 or so microbes in blossoms over the first 3 to 4 years to hundreds of microbes like you and I. Looks much more like an adult. So any time in that journey, you can really have an impact on that child's microbiome and restore the most critical period, though, from an immune system.
00:09:06:20 - 00:09:20:14
Unknown
Development with the microbiome is in those first three months. So first 100 days to about six months old. That's when the immune system is really at its peak development and then continues to develop through toddlerhood.
00:09:20:17 - 00:09:40:12
Unknown
Well okay. And so tell us more about your my baby biome studies. You said one of the largest studies of its kind in the US. How did that come about? What did you need in order to be able to gather such a vast evidence base? Why was it such a success in terms of the findings?
00:09:40:12 - 00:10:09:01
Unknown
Thank you. So once I had that conversation with the prominent scientist in pediatrics, I started to look into the literature and notice there's almost 10,000 papers, academic publications on the infant microbiome. There have been some fascinating studies around the world talking about this problem, but nobody had gone in depth enough to develop a product that could fix it, as well as truly understand exactly what's missing from the baby gut.
00:10:09:02 - 00:10:33:08
Unknown
I also noticed in the United States there was really a lack of large studies. We really didn't know the state of the microbiome in infants in the US. And so almost four years ago, we launched the My Baby Biome study. It's a seven year observational study, largest ever in the US, representing our demographics. And, you know, racial ethnicity in the US.
00:10:33:10 - 00:11:01:20
Unknown
Babies from 48 out of 50 states. We collected a lot of dirty diapers, essentially. And that's how we look at the microbiome. And, you know, we looked at over 400 babies. As I mentioned, this is a multi-year study. The children are now about four. And we have published on what we've seen up to age two. And here in the States is where we saw that about nine out of ten babies are missing one or more of these bacteria, Bifidobacterium.
00:11:01:20 - 00:11:21:19
Unknown
But much more importantly, by age two, the majority of these children, because they had low amounts or no amounts of these key bacteria, were 3 to 4 times more likely at developing what we call a topic disease conditions. That's food allergies, eczema, and asthma.
00:11:21:21 - 00:11:39:13
Unknown
And why had no one done this before? Why were you the first person to stumble across this question and go, right, I'm going to find the evidence because presumably, as you say, there's lots of literature about this as a as a challenge. What was it that made the stars align for you and your project?
00:11:39:15 - 00:12:02:21
Unknown
I think it's really because we had been studying the cancer microbiome and working with cancer patients for over five years by that point, and had really figured out a way to collect stool in a scalable manner. But also the analysis on stool, you know, the microbiome space is in our research and science is very much emerging. It's new science, cutting edge.
00:12:02:21 - 00:12:25:14
Unknown
And as as we've developed our programs in cancer, we've gotten a lot better with understanding what's happening in the gut. And so the timing was right in terms of our abilities to collect stool sample from hundreds of people that actually thousands of stool samples. And then the right analysis and then isolation of the gut bacteria from stool.
00:12:25:16 - 00:12:49:22
Unknown
And I guess, again, for the layman among us, the experts, why is the gut so important? What is it that the gut you spoke about the link to, to allergies and other health health issues later down the line? Why is it so important that the gut microbiome is is supported right in those early, early days?
00:12:50:00 - 00:13:16:07
Unknown
The microbiome is the gatekeeper of the immune system. You know, 70 to 80% of our immune cells exist in the gut. And so what we feed through our diet feeds are microbes. And that has a tremendous impact on our overall immune system, our immune health, whether we get disease, how we fight disease. The microbiome is our partner in all of that.
00:13:16:07 - 00:13:30:07
Unknown
And so the health of the microbiome, right. And hopefully lack of inflammation is really critical, not just for us adults, but for the child in how their development essentially happens.
00:13:30:09 - 00:13:43:12
Unknown
And you spoke about a few of the factors that have kind of perhaps influenced the change. And obviously there are things that sometimes are out of a parent's control. Cesarean birth, maybe that you're unable to breastfeed.
00:13:43:13 - 00:14:01:18
Unknown
What is it that, you know, for those parents that might be listening, they might be kind of anxious or concern that they haven't done? You know what, they could know their very best for their children. Obviously, we're not saying that they've done something wrong. What do you say to those parents? What do you do to help them?
00:14:01:20 - 00:14:31:20
Unknown
It's pretty easy to restore back the right bacteria, right. And incorporate one thinking about diet, you know, and as the child starts to wean and eat solid foods, is really incorporating a wide variety of nutrition in terms of fiber, probiotics, in terms of fermented foods, and really trying to cultivate that ecosystem, letting the child be outside as much as possible, you know, letting their microbiome thrive.
00:14:31:20 - 00:14:55:05
Unknown
But in infancy, in early toddlerhood, it is important to try to put back these missing bacteria and the kind of two component together that come together to help are the right Bifidobacterium that we describe in the My Baby biome study, but also the right prebiotic. And these are prebiotics from breast milk that can be found as as supplements as well.
00:14:55:06 - 00:15:01:15
Unknown
And so you really can kind of give that I would say playbook to the child's microbiome.
00:15:01:17 - 00:15:21:14
Unknown
Yeah. And I was reading about the Artemis trial with the symbiotic sort of over that you've supported lots of toddlers and infants with, I guess. And I think you reported some encouraging early results. What is it that changed for the babies that were receiving that?
00:15:21:16 - 00:15:46:03
Unknown
In our study the symbiotic is a pre and probiotic. The missing Bifidobacterium with the right prebiotic from breast milk. Of course the study demonstrated safety and tolerability which was the biggest point but also much more importantly, colonization, which means it gets into the child's gut and it grows and thrives for infants, we really want to see very high levels of these Bifidobacterium.
00:15:46:05 - 00:16:05:06
Unknown
Upwards of at least 50% of the child's gut should be just that type of bacteria. And that's really what we observed. And it's very encouraging that a simple fix of just giving a symbiotic to a child for a few weeks, we can restore those beneficial microbes to their gut.
00:16:05:08 - 00:16:19:08
Unknown
And I'm sure as all of the parents that listen to the podcast thinking about sleep as well and the impact on sleep for their young children, there were some interesting findings that you had as well relating to sleep, is that right?
00:16:19:10 - 00:16:48:22
Unknown
Absolutely. We saw statistically significant improvements in sleep amongst toddlers, and we've been seeing encouraging sleep metrics with infants as well. And, you know, what we hypothesize is really we're reducing discomfort. That's what the microbes do. They provide that kind of healthy balance in the gut. And the child is observable happier. There's less constipation. We see a lot way better sleep, less diaper rash, better mood.
00:16:48:22 - 00:16:53:00
Unknown
And for toddlers, we saw better appetite as well.
00:16:53:02 - 00:17:15:03
Unknown
And I guess for the parents that might have children with colic or other sorts of, you know, as you say, eczema or other tummy troubles. From a health perspective, what are the interventions you're seeing that are the most effective? What what advice do you have for parents from from that standpoint,
00:17:15:05 - 00:17:44:02
Unknown
We're seeing remarkable results with Bifidobacterium. There's been a number of studies, for example, in colic, that have noticed and looked at the microbiome of babies suffering with colic and noticed a depletion of key species of Bifidobacterium. Very much what we've been seeing in the My Baby biome study and associated with crying episodes. And really inflammation is kind of and just general discomfort for the child.
00:17:44:02 - 00:18:12:15
Unknown
And so, you know how we think about Bifidobacterium bacteria because there are these keystone, the foundation members of the gut, they really do provide kind of a reduced inflammatory environment. And this is very different to other, I would say, over-the-counter products, other species of gut bacteria that parents may have seen, like Lactobacillus products. That's different because they just are different bacteria.
00:18:12:15 - 00:18:26:07
Unknown
They work differently. The Bifidobacterium get in and grow in the gut and also may only provide a temporary relief, whereas the Bifidobacterium are are there and hopefully they're for life type of thing.
00:18:26:09 - 00:18:34:01
Unknown
And I guess, you know, there's obviously a lot of these things that are gut related. There may be other things that are not related to the gut, and it's just your child.
00:18:34:02 - 00:18:52:04
Unknown
I mean, I guess how much how how much exploration is there in terms of the impact within that cohort of families? How many were impacted by the sorts of support that you were describing? How many of them? It didn't actually work?
00:18:52:06 - 00:19:16:09
Unknown
Most of that is ongoing. We're trying to do larger studies. The Artemis study was with 114 infants and toddlers, actually the largest symbiotic study done in the US to date. So we are actually exploring that right now on a much larger scale. Of course, to your point, there's always babies that may not be responding to this. This may not be their issue.
00:19:16:09 - 00:19:27:18
Unknown
And that's where I think pediatric and, you know, connecting with pediatricians is absolutely critical because there could be an underlying condition that's associated with what we're
00:19:27:20 - 00:19:45:08
Unknown
And I guess, you know, you said about the science and the science is obviously evolving in this space. And a lot of the work that you're doing, as well as others trying to find out more, I guess when you're talking to parents, you know, again, we're going through a phase of learning, of deeper understanding of the challenges.
00:19:45:08 - 00:20:06:13
Unknown
How do you describe that in your in your settings when you're working with early years professionals, practitioners, mums and dads and carers, when they're asking you about the science and they're asking for clarity and, you know, black and white answers, whereas presumably you have to operate various shades of gray as well.
00:20:06:15 - 00:20:37:23
Unknown
I think that's been one of the biggest challenges, you know, and also education. We have a lot of research and a lot of findings. They don't need to know all the details. They just need to know the high level points. I would say that is the biggest challenge and it's learning, but how we are improving that so that parents and practitioners can benefit is that specifically at our company, we have a practitioner program and ambassadors who provide our samples to patients.
00:20:37:23 - 00:21:02:01
Unknown
And across across the US, we have over 500 practitioners, and we seek feedback through case studies, through parent reported feedback, pediatrician reported in. That allows us to really learn more about, well, this is what they're seeing. And this is not addressing these problems and addresses these problems. So I would say it's very much a learning process right now for us because it is so new.
00:21:02:01 - 00:21:03:01
Unknown
But that's how
00:21:03:04 - 00:21:12:21
Unknown
And what's next. What's on the horizon in terms of developing the studies that you're doing and advancing the science and understanding?
00:21:12:23 - 00:21:46:18
Unknown
Well, we're very excited about the results of the Artemis study and want to continue to do clinical research. You know, our My Baby biome study demonstrated that children with a particular species of Bifidobacterium, Bifidobacterium brevet were five times less at risk for developing these atopic disease conditions food allergies, eczema, asthma. We're very much interested in exploring much more robust clinical trials on how we could potentially reduce risk to these chronic conditions, and maybe even
00:21:46:20 - 00:21:55:23
Unknown
and I guess realize that we operate in slightly different systems with National Health Service here in the UK and in the US, it's a very different model.
00:21:55:23 - 00:22:20:05
Unknown
But what would your guidance be to policymakers that might be listening to this podcast or people that are working in the healthcare space, both in the US and the UK and globally? In terms of what would you like to see change people doing differently, advice evolving that goes to parents but also clinicians?
00:22:20:07 - 00:22:49:20
Unknown
That is a fantastic question. I think for us, there seems to be, you know, huge difference between what we term as a dietary supplement as well as a therapeutic. And what we're finding is that these these bacteria that are supposed to be, you know, this is what Mother Nature intended in the infant gut, as well as all of our microbiomes as adults, putting them back, should it be considered a therapeutic if they help the child health?
00:22:49:20 - 00:23:21:06
Unknown
And I think somehow figuring out the middle ground where we can put these back but not be held back by regulations on the therapeutic side, which could take a long time for these innovations to get to families, practitioners and children. So that would be my my ask is how we can do more to explore that middle ground. Not necessarily be a therapeutic, but not also something that's highly just in one category and can't be deemed as super beneficial.
00:23:21:09 - 00:23:41:22
Unknown
Because I guess, you know, we started this conversation talking about the way that the modern world had changed and made it less likely that all of these microbiomes are going to flourish in early babies. And the findings, I mean, what is it about modern life, modern living, that you think we might be able to turn the clock back on, or is there anything that we can do?
00:23:42:00 - 00:23:53:22
Unknown
You spoke about some things that parents can do, but what is it that you'd be looking for across wider society? I guess when it comes to changing our mindset,
00:23:54:00 - 00:24:20:15
Unknown
The few things that can really impact the microbiome diet. We don't do enough in Western populations to make our microbiomes thrive. You know, typically our diets don't have enough fiber. Fiber is the most important thing we can do to really nourish the gut, along with fermented foods and really trying to focus on that as part of diet. And I would say second is antibiotic stewardship.
00:24:20:15 - 00:24:49:21
Unknown
Antibiotics are absolutely important and they do save lives, but sometimes they are overused. That overuse does have an impact on our microbiome, and especially for young children, much more detrimental than it is to adults because they just don't have that ecosystem in place. It really can destroy the child's ecosystem and put their microbiome development behind. And so those are the kind of two major things I would say from a modernization, how we can try to
00:24:49:23 - 00:24:58:05
Unknown
Yeah. It's interesting because, you know, a lot of people hear the word bacteria and go, oh, that's something to get rid of. That's not something that you want in the system.
00:24:58:05 - 00:25:04:16
Unknown
And I guess, how do you how do you flip that instinct on a on its head for a parent?
00:25:04:18 - 00:25:30:06
Unknown
I know, I know, and we think there's a hypothesis called the hygiene hypothesis is that we have been to clean. And that's what actually has been detrimental to our microbiomes are just general ecosystems everywhere. And we do think that that's having actually a tremendous impact, because babies, if they don't get the microbes at birth, they're still not getting them from family members or their environment.
00:25:30:07 - 00:25:50:14
Unknown
We know that. And so I think that's something to just generally think about. Antibacterial soaps are great, but maybe we should use them sparingly. Right. And we do want our kids to get dirty. We do want to expose them to all of these different things in nature. So I think it's just something to really consider. But we do know that
00:25:50:16 - 00:26:21:21
Unknown
And I guess, you know, obviously post-pandemic as well. And, you know, there's been a lot of changes in behavior subsequent to Covid era. You mentioned five or so years ago. Have you seen any changes in terms of, as your study continues, the parents that are kind of next generation coming out of the pandemic versus babies that were born during it, or any other trends that seem to be shifting.
00:26:21:22 - 00:26:48:10
Unknown
What was interesting was during Covid, because of lockdown and being inside, there was several studies done of babies born during that era and that they tend to have these microbes, and namely because there's a belief that there was maybe less antibiotics, less exposure, and they tended to have higher levels of these key bacteria. But after Covid, it went back.
00:26:48:12 - 00:27:12:16
Unknown
That trend continues. So there is something we know that is going on in between these systems that we're still learning about. But Covid Covid did have an impact, but it had the opposite of what we might think, because the babies were at home and they seemed to be exposed to less germs and maybe even, you know, having less viruses.
00:27:12:18 - 00:27:14:21
Unknown
It's unclear, but they seem to
00:27:15:01 - 00:27:36:01
Unknown
Wow. That is yeah, that's a fascinating kind of outcome. That's not what I was anticipating you saying. And I guess, what are the biggest kind of misconceptions that you tend to hear or you typically get from parents, but also clinicians when you're talking about your work and your studies, what are the biggest myths that you have to bust?
00:27:36:03 - 00:28:18:10
Unknown
One is that breast milk solves everything, and that breast milk has all the right probiotics and prebiotics. That is partially correct. However, what we're seeing is that there are the gut microbes or gut microbes. They're not part of breast milk. So these key species of bacteria are found in the gut. They're very oxygen sensitive. So what we've seen in our studies, and this is case globally, is that if a child is missing these key bacteria, the breast milk prebiotics end up feeding the wrong bacteria in some cases potential pathogens and kind of growing the weeds.
00:28:18:10 - 00:28:44:07
Unknown
So breast milk can't really recover this. And so that's a big misconception. The other is my child was born vigilant and they're breastfed. We see that every baby now basically has some kind of deficiency in their gut microbiome. Again, even what we think is nature, it is. But it's been disrupted. So that's kind of the key misconceptions we see.
00:28:44:10 - 00:29:12:13
Unknown
We also see that because these products have been on the market much longer. What I meant lactobacillus, they're commonly found in yogurt or milk based products. These natural probiotics, they help maybe temporarily. They may or may not work. But they're not the normal residence. They're not the key members of the gut microbiome. And they've only been, you know, the reason why they're really prominent is because they have been in food for such a long time.
00:29:12:15 - 00:29:22:18
Unknown
Again, gut bacteria. We're only recently really understanding these gut bacteria. So that's probably why people haven't really heard of them and
00:29:22:20 - 00:29:42:18
Unknown
Yeah. Fascinating. I guess, you know, as a as a parent, how much of your research and study have you sort of been able to observe in your own household and seeing your daughter, or is there, you know, you have a sort of you have a separate lens from that perspective?
00:29:42:20 - 00:30:10:13
Unknown
Absolutely obsessed. And my daughter is obsessed with her microbiome, you know, diet. We consume kefir every morning. Fruits and vegetables. We talk about the microbiome, the importance of feeding our our friends in our tummy. So it really has changed my lens a lot. I think of everything that she's eating and how it impacts her gut, but also her immune
00:30:10:13 - 00:30:34:04
Unknown
Yeah, and I guess at Babyzone, we work with thousands of families across the UK, but some from very challenging circumstances in in deprived neighborhoods. What would your message be for for those families? But also, how can your work, the work that you're doing, help those? Like you said, the wide range of backgrounds of families in your study as well.
00:30:34:04 - 00:30:53:16
Unknown
In the US, what are you seeing across different socioeconomic backgrounds? But what is your message, I guess, to families that you know isn't necessarily quite as easy to go into a supermarket and buy probiotics or other other types of things?
00:30:53:18 - 00:31:28:15
Unknown
And here in the States, I think that was another surprising factor is that we saw that across wide socioeconomic levels, we saw the same impact. You know, this does you know, this issue is for every this is an issue for for every baby of every family. And of course, every family, you know, has different challenges. And my advice is, is to really think about through diet and through the nutrition that we're providing to our children, how we can incorporate the best fiber.
00:31:28:16 - 00:31:56:05
Unknown
You know, how we can make sure that they are getting the right fruits and vegetables consistently. They are getting the right whole grains, you know, beans, even fermented foods, if that's something that's accessible, yogurts, you know, just thinking really about the basics and how closely to the soil that somebody can eat and really, you know, encouraging them from day one, I think can make
00:31:56:07 - 00:32:04:05
Unknown
Yeah. Fascinating. Yeah, I think that's right. And a lot of the parents we work with, they want their best, they want the best for their children, and everyone wants their best for their children.
00:32:04:05 - 00:32:22:02
Unknown
So, you know, I guess any piece of advice that you might have one, 1 or 2 sort of tips or tricks that you have and you've been on your own parenting journey that you would share?
00:32:22:04 - 00:32:54:23
Unknown
I have a child of been fortunate. I have a child who loves vegetables. But there have been times when she doesn't like vegetables. So, you know, I have I think, you know, some things that I've learned is trying to sneak in these goodies wherever you can. Oatmeal, for example. Oatmeal pancakes make things a lot of fun. You know, eating nutritious should be a lot of fun and something that these children can, like, take forever and be be excited to partake in.
00:32:54:23 - 00:33:14:03
Unknown
So I've learned a lot of tricks about squeezing in different fruits here and there, different veggies and different forms, but make it fun. So I would say that would be my one tip. And I think the other thing is explore the outdoors with their child. Let them get dirty, let them go in the puddles, let them dig in the dirt.
00:33:14:05 - 00:33:20:14
Unknown
Let them eat dirt if they can, you know, have that exposure to the
00:33:20:16 - 00:33:39:04
Unknown
Yeah, well, that's a great message. And I guess the last sort of question I've got is around, you know, we've spoken about the challenge that's become more acute. And you say it's more prevalent that these children are growing up without these microbiomes and there's a deficiency in their gut.
00:33:39:05 - 00:33:55:21
Unknown
What gives you optimism? What gives you hope that we're going to be able to solve this challenge, that we're able to kind of make progress on this level, make progress on this at a scientific level, but also across society,
00:33:55:23 - 00:34:26:07
Unknown
I think I have so much hope. I think one is that we've seen scientifically, actually, how easy it is to put back these microbes, the through symbiotic in our clinical studies, and how quickly it takes hold in the gut microbiome and allows a child to thrive. We've seen children thriving on our product for more than a year now, and really can see that impact and hope to see down the road long term impact in reducing some of these chronic diseases.
00:34:26:08 - 00:34:54:11
Unknown
I think separately, you know, for families, I think there's much more of an awareness now in terms of how important gut health is, because we can all see the impact. We see it through tummy aches. Constipation was a young child crying diaper rash. We see children very uncomfortable and sometimes appetite mood impacted by their gut health. And I think people are really becoming aware of it.
00:34:54:11 - 00:35:07:22
Unknown
So I'm very hopeful that one, we have easy solutions now that parents can implement along with nutrition and other factors. But I think second, people are aware in are hungry
00:35:08:00 - 00:35:08:08
Unknown
well.
00:35:08:09 - 00:35:17:05
Unknown
And that's a nice positive note to close the conversation on. So thank you so much for your time, Stephanie. That's been brilliant chatting with you this afternoon.
00:35:17:10 - 00:35:43:17
Unknown
What strikes me most from this conversation is how much is happening inside a baby that we simply cannot see. And also how much of it was shaped by choices and circumstances that are entirely outside of a parent's control. This is exactly why this podcast exists, to make sure that no parent is carrying any of this alone, and to keep bringing the best evidence straight to the families who need it.
00:35:43:22 - 00:36:08:22
Unknown
If you remember one thing from today, let it be this your baby's gut is doing important work right from day one, and understanding it isn't about guilt isn't about the choices that you've made. It's about knowing what questions to ask. Thank you for listening to Best Beginnings, a Babyzone podcast. For more evidence informed support on babies and the early years, please subscribe to this channel if you found it helpful.
00:36:08:23 - 00:36:12:23
Unknown
Share it with someone who might need it. We'll see you next time.
00:36:13:01 - 00:36:13:08
Unknown
We.