Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
We think we are our thoughts. We think that what we're thinking is literally us. But when we start to have the intention to observe them, that means that if we're observing them, they can't be us.
Presence allows us to just be infinitely more efficient and effective in terms of our thinking and in terms of our tasks and in terms of our workflow.
Raising Men is a podcast about parenting, masculinity, and the lifelong journey of raising sons—and ourselves—to be men of courage, character, and purpose. Hosted by Shaun Dawson, each episode features real conversations with parents, leaders, and thinkers redefining what it means to raising men in today’s world.
Shaun (00:01.181)
Welcome back to Raising Men. If you watched or listened to our episode earlier this week, you know that Mark Crusen is an expert in staying relaxed and staying present. And this is something that I struggle greatly with. And so I have asked Mark for this little short episode to walk me through a guided meditation.
And and we'll just we're just gonna do it live for you guys right now and we'll see what happens. Mark, the floor is yours. I'm a little bit trepidatious about this, but I'm excited to get going. I I'd love I wanna learn a lot more about what you do.
Marc Krusin (00:46.52)
Cool. Hi again, Sean. Yeah, thanks for inviting me to do this. It's it's an honor, really, actually, and a pleasure. So I'm looking forward to
Shaun (00:55.54)
Me too.
Marc Krusin (00:57.592)
We're gonna start, as I was mentioning, we're gonna start with a we're gonna do five. This this meditation is gonna be sort of broken down into five little sections. And we're gonna start with just a very simple breathing exercise. It's nothing new, but it just helps relax the body a little bit. So what we're gonna do, I'm gonna explain it first, and then we'll do it. But it's just very simple. We breathe in for four counts. We hold at the top for four counts, and then we breathe out.
Four counts and we hold at the bottom for four counts. Alright, so I'll I'll I'll guide you through that. We'll do it a few times. You can close your eyes actually, that's not a bad idea.
Shaun (01:34.527)
Okay? Great.
Shaun (01:40.159)
All right.
Marc Krusin (01:42.35)
Okay, so breathe in. Two, three, four.
Two, three.
Breathe out. Two. Three.
Marc Krusin (02:04.494)
Breathe in.
Marc Krusin (02:15.502)
Breathe out two.
Marc Krusin (02:21.646)
Two, three, four. Breathe in, two, three, four. Hold, two, three, four. Breathe out. Two, three.
Marc Krusin (02:43.118)
Okay, we can open our eyes.
Shaun (02:46.829)
all right. You know, and if you're listening to this right now, you should definitely try this while we're doing it together. It's it's quite an experience. You can't you have to try it. You have to do it to to get the to see what it's like.
Marc Krusin (03:03.832)
Alright, cool. So if anyone's been doing that, hopefully now the body feels a little bit more relaxed. We can take another couple of deep breaths, just eyes open. Deep and profound. And let it all go. Once more.
Marc Krusin (03:24.248)
And let it go back.
Marc Krusin (03:29.24)
Alright, now we're gonna do an exercise which is called watching the mind. So we're gonna do this with our eyes closed, and what we're gonna do is simply observe our thoughts and count them. Alright, so every single thought that appears, when we have our eyes closed, we just count it. So why am I doing this? That's one. What am I gonna do next? That's two. I'm feeling uncomfortable, that's three. You get it? And so on. Everything that comes up, we just count it and we let it go.
Alright. So we're gonna do that for about I'd say a minute, no longer. And just be very easy with it. don't try and don't start wondering if you've counted enough, if you missed one or whatever. That doesn't matter. Just just count the ones that you're aware of. Okay. So let's just close our eyes. Close our eyes.
Marc Krusin (04:43.436)
Add all thoughts come. Don't push any away.
Marc Krusin (04:55.214)
It doesn't matter if you lose track of the number.
Marc Krusin (05:01.784)
Just keep going from what you thought you got to.
Marc Krusin (05:28.824)
And let's gently open our eyes. How many thoughts were there?
Shaun (05:34.12)
I yeah, I I kind of lost track, but it was it started off really, really fast and I was just ratcheting one, two, three, four, five, and then and then it was almost like I was suppressing the thoughts up until the point where you said, Don't do that. Like, don't push the it's it's like I was pushing them down and so I ended up with a count of thirteen, which I was surprised. I thought it would be a lot more than that. I my mind just races when when in my normal state of being.
Marc Krusin (06:04.32)
Yeah, yeah, cool. And that's exactly that's exactly how it works, is because we're aware, we're becoming aware of our thoughts, right? Which is a big, big difference. So we think we are our thoughts. We think that what we're thinking is literally us. But when we start to have our the intention to observe them, that means that if we're observing them, they can't be us, right? We are the consciousness that observes them, so we are not our thoughts.
And as soon as we have the intention to become aware of them, they automatically slow down a bit. Because we're we're the still presence that's observing them. And they come up and they go and they come up and they go. So this is the big difference, you know. The big difference is that we we are not our thoughts. We we are the awareness that can observe them.
Shaun (06:54.579)
Yeah, that's a really profound observation. And I it's it's it's pretty interesting what happens. I I mean, I was surprised. I mean, like I said, my mind just constantly races. It feels like I it it feels like a hamster on a treadmill. And I but but it kind of like like it was like the act of being observed made them shy.
Marc Krusin (07:21.558)
Mm-hmm.
Shaun (07:22.004)
And and and then they weren't coming as much. And that that's a unique experience for
Marc Krusin (07:28.408)
Hm. Yeah, cool. Yeah, the average human being thinks about ninety thousand thoughts a day, I believe. so that's a lot. But it all it takes is the intention to become aware and observe and and yeah, that that that will automatically slow or or it won't, you know, maybe sometimes, but the important thing is to just allow.
Shaun (07:36.457)
Yeah, that sounds right.
Shaun (07:48.052)
Yeah, and I I think my I I feel this urge to put a value statement on that, right? I like like, okay, well, am I thinking too much or am I thinking too little or but I I mean the what I'm getting from you is that that's that's not part of it, right? It it's it in fact you need to be non judgmental about it and you need to it's just an observation. Just there's
There's the thing. That thing is two feet long. And it doesn't mat it's not supposed to be anything different than two feet. It's not supposed to be two feet. It's just it there's no suppose. It just is the thing. And that's all right.
Marc Krusin (08:25.836)
Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So and in fact what we're gonna do now is we're just gonna close our eyes, quite briefly, and we're just gonna observe the thoughts. So no counting this time. We're just gonna do exactly the same thing, but we're not gonna count them. All right. So we're just we'll just close our eyes and allow the thoughts to come, notice them.
Ideally don't hang on to them and make them bigger, just notice them, allow them, let them
Marc Krusin (09:11.822)
aware of what's being presented.
To you right now.
in your mind what's coming up.
Marc Krusin (09:34.232)
How attentive can you be?
Marc Krusin (09:41.272)
Can you be attentive to the space that exists between thoughts?
Marc Krusin (09:51.126)
What's that like?
Marc Krusin (10:08.269)
Allow everything to be as it is.
Marc Krusin (10:14.188)
Many thoughts, great. No thoughts, great.
Marc Krusin (10:21.708)
Neither one is better than the other. No need to get caught up in that.
Marc Krusin (10:30.262)
It's just the experience as it is. We allow it whatever it is.
Marc Krusin (10:48.108)
Right, let's gently open the ice.
Shaun (10:55.347)
There was there's an interesting thing that happened to me just then, which is that on a number of occasions I would have some thoughts come in and then I would start chasing them. And the visualization that occurred to me was last week I I I went on vacation to Utah and ended up riding the ski lift to the top of a mountain. It's
Marc Krusin (11:10.296)
Uh-huh.
Shaun (11:24.413)
you know, springtime, so there's no snow. And but so I'm standing on the top of a you know, what is would be a bowl in ski season. And but now it's just grass. And I'm you know, it's on the top of the mountain and it it it feels scarier when there's no snow for some reason. And I'm looking down over this bowl and that's what it was like with with the thoughts. It was
It was like when I'm when I'm being observant of them, it's like I'm just looking over the bowl. And well, there's, you know, one path and there's another path and there's another path. But then, you know, my reflex is that the thought occurs to me, and then I just go chase it down. I've got to figure out what I'm doing next. And so, you know, I'm gonna have to drive to this place and do this, and then this I'm gonna have this meeting and all that stuff. And I start going I start going down the slope.
Marc Krusin (12:23.598)
Hmm.
Shaun (12:24.047)
And and then I I realized, no, no, wait, that's not what I'm supposed to be doing right now. I'm supposed to be just standing on the lip of the bowl, just watching the different paths I could take. And that was the that was the metaphor that that occurred to me as I was going through that.
Marc Krusin (12:38.178)
Yeah, that's great. I mean, yeah, I love that because it's it's actually just illustrating the fact that we we are the observer. We're observing. And that that's all the difference in the world. And the more we become the observer, the more we come back to being the observer.
The easier it becomes, the more natural it becomes as a mechanism within us. That's all it takes really. It's just about training a mus training an awareness muscle to come back from the vortex of thought to just a state of presence, to a state
Shaun (13:14.269)
Yeah, yeah. It it goes back to what you were saying is that we are not our thoughts. We are the entity that that that observes our thoughts and we can dive into it when we want to, but but that is something that we get to choose to do. And that means that you can control what your reactions are, you can control what your thoughts are, you can control those things if you choose to do that and if your muscle is strong enough. And I can see how that would really be helpful, like
in the day to day grind of being able to stay detached if you need to. but also being able to dive in and, you know, roll your sleeves up and get into the fray as well.
Marc Krusin (13:49.262)
Uh-huh.
Marc Krusin (13:56.152)
Right. Yeah and
And and we can only come back when we remember to, right? So we can be lost in thought and that the that's no deal. There's no it's not your fault because you're lost in it. The the only time you can become aware is when you realise that you have that choice, right? A lot of people beat themselves up because they've been lost in thought for twenty minutes, you know, following a useless trail of thought and and they know it's not serving them and why was I, you know, so lost for twenty minutes? But you you were lost, so there was nothing you could do.
Shaun (14:04.411)
Mm. Mm-hmm.
Marc Krusin (14:30.498)
As soon as you become aware, right? It's not your fault. There's nothing you can do. You become aware, just come back. Just come back to this moment.
Shaun (14:33.747)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, there's so much judgment. I I man, and I my brain absolutely does this. It's everything it applies a value judgment to it. And and that's that's an important aspect of the skill, I would imagine, is just being able to release that value judgment and just like let it go and and not not impose it.
Marc Krusin (14:58.466)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Alright, so we're gonna do the last phase now of this this guided meditation. This is more profound, really. It builds on what we've done to this point. And it is just about you know, we're just playing with that awareness muscle again. All right. Awareness is something that it can seem a bit abstract as a con as a concept, but it's really just noticing. It's it's about noticing.
So anyone can notice something. So if I were to say now, notice your big toe, your right big toe, you wouldn't have a problem at all with that. It's the easiest thing, right?
So but we're so we're gonna do something similar. we're gonna close our eyes first time round.
And we're just gonna notice our left knee. Just let your attention be on your left left knee.
Marc Krusin (16:05.998)
So obviously you don't have to look at it. You can just let your attention be there. We've got our eyes closed, you can't look at it anyway. But allow your attention to rest on your left knee.
Marc Krusin (16:21.346)
Don't force it. Just gently allow it to rest there.
Marc Krusin (16:33.878)
Now let your awareness be on the back of your head.
Marc Krusin (16:42.828)
Or notice the back of your head, to say it more simply.
Marc Krusin (16:57.25)
Now notice your whole body.
Let your awareness be on your whole body.
Marc Krusin (17:09.112)
Gently, easily, softly. Don't force it.
Marc Krusin (17:17.132)
Another way to put it would be to just have your awareness on your body.
Your attention on your body.
Marc Krusin (17:38.594)
Now let your awareness be on the space that's between you and whatever you're listening to this podcast on. So whether it's the speaker in your car, the speaker at home, a device that you've got in front of you, just let your awareness be on the space that exists between yourself and your device.
Marc Krusin (18:14.924)
On the space between those two things.
Marc Krusin (18:24.64)
Our awareness is so often on
The content.
The object but now we're letting our awareness or our attention rest on the space between ourselves and the object.
between ourselves and our device or our speaker, or whatever it may be.
Marc Krusin (18:55.85)
Again, don't force it, just allow it to be there. And it's not precise, you don't have to get it right.
There's no getting it right actually. Just let your attention be there. However that may look.
Marc Krusin (19:21.122)
Right, so now we're gonna let our attention be on the in the space within the entire room. Or if you're in a car, the space within the entire car.
Marc Krusin (19:37.614)
Again allow your attention, your awareness to gently rest on that space.
Marc Krusin (19:58.252)
How lovely, how peaceful to just allow our awareness to be there. We're not forcing our awareness, we're not forcing our minds to do anything, we're just allowing it to rest, our attention to rest on the space around us.
Marc Krusin (20:18.486)
Our minds are very thankful for this because they don't get a lot of chance to just rest.
Marc Krusin (20:34.766)
Okay, and now we're gonna notice that this moment is happening. This moment is happening right now.
And it's still happening.
Marc Krusin (20:51.298)
And there's no escaping this moment. This moment is actually all there is.
It's all there ever is.
This man is golden.
Marc Krusin (21:07.352)
Perfect just as it is.
Marc Krusin (21:11.554)
We can't resist it because it is here and it is happening. So to resist it is futile. Allow it, notice it.
Embrace it. Love it.
Marc Krusin (21:33.58)
Or if you can't love it, just be okay with not loving it. That's fine too.
No need to force anything.
All we're doing here is being aware.
Marc Krusin (21:57.102)
And let's gently open our eyes and we'll keep our awareness on this moment.
Marc Krusin (22:04.524)
Just allow our awareness to stay here this moment as it's happening right now.
Marc Krusin (22:14.05)
Easy.
Shaun (22:19.633)
Easy peasy. Well, you know, I
Shaun (22:25.855)
When I was when I was in high school, it was it felt like a real superpower to be able to multitask. And, you know, it was it was kind of like how many things could I get going on at once? And that was the measure of how productive I could be or how smart I was or those sorts of things. And as as I
Marc Krusin (22:43.854)
Sure.
Shaun (22:54.461)
Became an adult, I realized that that was not a powerful thing. There's a con there's a cost to context switching. And the real power, the real strength was in being able to isolate one thing and work on it obsessively until it was totally complete, and then move on to the next thing and then obsessively work on that thing.
And I feel like there's a similar kind of misconception about about our thoughts. That I mean, I feel like thinking a lot of thoughts and thinking fast, and that's what intelligence is. That's what productivity is with respect to, you know, my brain. And what there's another thing there.
Which is it it it's like that context switching thing. There is a cost to being immersed in the forest of thoughts. And that cost, there there's a real strength and a real skill in being able to withdraw from that and look at the top of the forest and see the way that the paths go in there. And then you can dive into the forest and be more efficient about how fast your thoughts are going. And and that's something that I think.
is really worth getting good at. And it's not I've always I I feel like I've resisted it a lot. I I feel like, you know, this kind of meditation and mindfulness practice and all of that exists in some other place that it isn't applicable to me. but I think I'm wrong about that. I think I would really I think I would really benefit from from honing that skill a little bit.
Marc Krusin (24:43.274)
yeah. Yeah, I mean I can say from personal experience it's I used to be a huge thinker too and I I realized that a lot of those thoughts were not really helping. I I thought it was fundamental. I thought my intellectuality was my highest quality, but the reality is the solutions come in a moment where we're it's much we're much more spontaneous. It's it's much more intuitive, you know, we have an intuitive knowing that the solution
Shaun (24:54.718)
Mm-hmm.
Shaun (24:58.974)
Yeah.
Marc Krusin (25:12.342)
what it may be. And and that or, you know, and and the presence allows us to to just be much more infinitely more efficient and effective in terms of our thinking and in terms of our tasks and in terms of our workflow. but relationships too, you know, we're aware all of a sudden of the people around us and how they're reacting. It's I I'd say the benefits are, you know, myriad really.
Shaun (25:13.545)
Yeah.
Shaun (25:34.857)
Yeah.
Shaun (25:39.677)
Yeah. Well Mark, thank you so much for introducing me to this, this gentle introduction. I definitely am interested in learning more. Tell me more about where tell us again where I can look into what you're doing and get involved in some way. how do how do we how do people find you?
Marc Krusin (26:01.388)
Yeah, well the meditation we teach is the organisation is the Bright Path is Shires. So the Bright Path is the Bright Path dot com is the website, so it's easy to find a course on that in in your local area. We do online introductory courses. You could email myself directly, Mark at Marc Cruzin.com and we can get in touch that way.
Shaun (26:28.287)
That sounds great. Well, and I'll I'll put well all of those links in the show notes so that people can find them easily. Mark, thanks again for for doing this and we'll we'll definitely follow up later on and and talk about w w we we should do something maybe in six months or something like that and and see where where we've gone with this. If anywhere.
Marc Krusin (26:29.171)
The point is specific.
Marc Krusin (26:51.81)
Hmm. That'd be amazing. Yeah. That'd be great. yeah, thanks so much again for inviting me on to do this. Been a pleasure.
Shaun (26:54.783)
Well, thank you, my friend. Good talking to you.