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Welcome to Humans of Agriculture. This podcast series is dedicated to discovering more about our food system, from the people involved in it.
Along the journey we'll be meeting people from all walks of life from Australia and from afar. Join us as we find out how our communities and our culture shape what we eat, and ultimately who we are.
More people, More often, Identifying with Agriculture
Oli Le Lievre 0:02
Yeah. Well, today I'm sitting down with someone who I'm trying to think of how I do justice for you for an intro. And I don't think I can genuinely cover your career and what you do, but I think what I want to talk about is how you give other people opportunities. And I think how I got to know you was through VFX a couple of years ago, and I'll say it's a real show in terms of what you put on and the way that you create these conferences for people. But for me, we had an interesting discussion, and it was going, well, we're going to kind of do a reverse podcast interview, and then 24 hours or so before it changed, and you gave this vote of confidence, you're like, Ollie, of course, you can pull it off. It'll be fine. And I think for me, it was probably like, if I look at pivotal moments for me, probably professionally and for humans of Ag, it was going well. The platform that you gave me that day was to actually talk about who I am, what I do, why I'm doing it through humans of agriculture. And that opportunity is something which I've come back to many times. And so I just want to say thank you for that, because you probably don't know, and I'm sure it happens so often, where those little moments that you create and that space that you give people can really, I guess, help them kind of move forward and progress their careers as well. So thank you.
Speaker 1 1:12
That's a lovely compliment. And I guess, yes, it is something that I really that is absolutely the favourite part of my career, is when people like you can say and reflect on an opportunity that I've provided and that it's made a difference to you. And yeah, I like to think there's probably a few others that might just say the same. So thank you now,
Oli Le Lievre 1:35
Esther, where about see you joining us from? Because I think, as we've chatted, sometimes you're in WA sometimes you're in Queensland, sometimes you're in New South Wales. One time I think you were, was it in Africa or something like that? You are. Where are you joining us from? Today.
Speaker 1 1:48
Today, I'm joining you from the beautiful South coastal town of Albany, Western Australia, which is now my home. How long have you been there for? I've been in Albany just over 12 months. Yeah. Oh, cool. Have
Oli Le Lievre 1:58
you always been in Western Australia?
Speaker 1 2:00
I am a proud and loud and True West Australian. Yes, I grew up in the wheat gold from Western Australia, and I've never actually lived anywhere else other than WA. I've always thought I should, but I haven't. I've always kind of found wa home and had the privilege of work on a love for adventure, kind of taking me all over the place, but always return home to WA. That's
Oli Le Lievre 2:22
incredible. And I'm sure we're going to talk about your career and your business and everything that you do. But has it been hard to build your career aspirations and that network from Southwest? WA?
Speaker 1 2:34
Yeah, I often apologise for my geographic inconvenience to my client, but I think it's something I've always it's been a really cool thing to take to business, and also to my West Australian clients, that WA is a really long way away from anywhere else, and you are easy to be forgotten about, you know, at a national level, in advocacy and all sorts of things. And so I always have had the philosophy. I kind of assume people will forget about me over here in Western Australia. So therefore I've always been on the front foot. And I think when I've been doing jobs for West Australia's needing a national exposure, I'm never backward and coming forward about Hang on. It's okay. It's okay. You've forgotten this. I'll just remind you again. And this is what we are and what we do. And so I think it's developed a culture of being very proactive, because you need to be. And you know, if you need to get up at four o'clock to be on the Zoom call with someone in Melbourne at seven because of daylight saving, then we don't have it. Well, that's okay,
Oli Le Lievre 3:34
my God, and you have been running your own business for quite some time, but how do you go setting those boundaries and managing that
Speaker 1 3:40
probably, I think my friends and family would call me a workaholic. I love my work. I don't call myself a workaholic. Do I have boundaries? Yes, I do. I very rarely work on weekend, and I very rarely work after hours, really, but I'll work really hard when I'm working. So, you know, everyone is used to me dishing their phone calls with their family or friends through the day, because I kind of, I never waver from it, unless there's, you know, an emergency Esther, please call your mother if
Oli Le Lievre 4:12
I was to meet you for the first time down the road like and we got chatting, and I said, Oh, what do you do? How would you describe yourself?
Speaker 1 4:20
So yes, I find it hard to describe, but I guess I'm well, I'm an agricultural communicator. I'm a passionate agriculturalist. I love to advocate for best practice farming, and I do that across a range of mediums, and I guess portfolios most known for the conference stage where I bring, I guess I like to be able to bring people to the stage that people otherwise wouldn't ordinarily have had access to. And I'll take great deal of pleasure and privilege in doing that, and that's kind of been my signature stuff, but I do lots of other. As well, but that's the piece that people see. It's communication. 101,
Oli Le Lievre 5:03
I want to ask you a bit about passion. You said you didn't necessarily like that. Can you talk to me more about that?
Speaker 1 5:10
Well, it's a bit it's just one of those words that everybody says on their LinkedIn profile. I'm a passionate person about agriculture, and I do too, but it's true. I love it. I
Oli Le Lievre 5:18
was listening to a really interesting podcast recently. It was with a bloke called Daniel Presley, and he was talking when he so he was an investor, and was talking about when people are pitching to him. And it was, well, what are the characteristics of a great pitch? He was saying he wants someone to talk about their passion, but to him, passion is, how does, how can they bring their origin story into it? So the further back in their life they can go to bring it to life, the better it is how they bring their mission into it right now and then, what their vision is for in terms of how their mission is going to help them achieve whatever it is they want to do, and how that kind of connects as a lifelong piece. It was really interesting. And something that I was like that is cool, because it is definitely a word that gets thrown around in that vein as a ag communicator and a passionate one. What would you say, like, what is your earliest memory in and around agriculture, and what is it that has really drawn you in to both the communicating side, but especially in this industry? Well,
Speaker 1 6:12
I started life as a livestock journalist, so and I was, I didn't go to university, so I was actually not even 18, I was still on my P plates covering RAM sales for what is now the farm weekly. It used to be the eldest weekly, owned by elders back in the day. So my first memory, really is of being a little bit conscious that I was really young and I had quite an important job, and I would take down my peak place as I drove into the Showgrounds or wherever the RAM sale was, because I didn't want people to know how young I was. And I guess that early sense of trying to be older and more more experienced than I was, because I was kind of the person that would have to interview crusty old stud breeders and, you know, talk serious stuff with them, and it wouldn't, I didn't think it would help if I knew how young I was. So that was, I guess, an early memory, and one that I laugh about now, because, of course, if I let them think I was 10 years older than I was then, well, God, how old do they think I am now? Did you?
Oli Le Lievre 7:24
Did you enjoy the work? I
Speaker 1 7:26
loved it. I absolutely loved it and and I guess it was definitely the entree to what I did next. So I spent mostly three years with the Rural papers. And in the job that was, it just created my little black book of special people. You know, my job was to to know as many people as I could. You know your photograph and your byline was in the paper, so kind of people knew who you were in that pond. And I guess back then, you know, that was way before social media people really wanted to know were journalists, because it was useful. It was your one way of your only way of getting your message out. And I suppose I really loved that, and I loved getting to know the people that I did. And I very quickly worked out that I wasn't a news hound by nature. That was not right, but I could see that I had enough interest and connection in the industry to sort of move that into more public relations, promoting people and, AG, and, yeah, one thing sort of grew to another.
Oli Le Lievre 8:29
So would you say, like, was the the interest, like more in the story and the narrative, as opposed to, kind of the news topic of the day?
Speaker 1 8:38
Definitely, definitely. And I think I grew up on a farm. Our parents sold the farm when I was 17, so farming was not going to be an option for me. So this was the next best thing. I would have been a farmer if I could have. I think, do you still think that now? No, not. Now very happy with the career choice I've had, but I did spend, you know, probably five or 10 years in that early stage, sort of being a little bit grumpy that I wasn't farming. I
Oli Le Lievre 9:06
came across a post, and I'm going to come to the post in a little bit that you'd, you'd posted 10 or 11 years ago. That'll make you wonder, what on earth I'm about to bring up my investigative journalist, but I'd say to anyone who knows you, you're progressive, you're you're always thinking, Where is the next opportunity? How do I bring that about? So in journalism, did you find at times it would be frustrating, or anything, or like, what was it that instigated the next career move for you?
Speaker 1 9:32
Just pure opportunity? And I could see that there was a need. There wasn't at that stage. There was not, you know, and we're talking quite a few decades ago here now. Oli, there wasn't an agency at that point that really specialised in agricultural communications and PR, plenty of PR agencies, some that sort of played around the edges with a bit of PR, but in ag, but they would generally have a portfolio of other clients. I thought. Oh God, there is an opportunity here. There's no one else doing this that's sort of a specialised ag person. And so that was the first thing. And then I very quickly worked out that, you know, when you sort of do a marketing plan for a client, it's pretty common. You might say, well, what's the event? What opportunities are there to sort of make an event out of this and showcase should work in that way. And before I knew it, I'd written a marketing plan to someone that said, you should have an event. And they said, Okay, Esther, how about you run it? And I went, Oh, okay, that sounds like a plan. So it was very disorganised. It was, you know, as you are when you're young, you know, it wasn't planned attack. It kind of just grew and grew. Yeah, my first event that sort of came out of that process was for the West Australian lot feeders Association in basilton, in a old shed. It went pretty well. I can, I can remember Oli. I didn't know how to sort a spreadsheet alphabetically at that point. So my name badges on the registration desk were a complete dog's breakfast. And you know, back then, you know, it was, it was always a challenge, even connecting a data projector. But anyway, we managed. And obviously went well, because the national representatives for the Australian lot feeders Association were in the room, and that led pretty much to be fixed, which was crazy. So I sort of went from this little tin pot show in Busselton to getting my first gig as managing BFX, and one led to the other, then very
Oli Le Lievre 11:29
quickly. And so did you still have the marketing business on the side like that was still absolutely running away, or marketing and
Speaker 1 11:35
PR, yeah, and I did a lot of stuff for agricultural sort of associations, not for profit associations. And so that was a really lovely kind of coupling of events and sort of looking after ag associations at various types. So across dairy, ag consultants, beef, grain fed beef, various industries that have sort of needed someone to sort of look after their affairs. That was kind of me and my team
Oli Le Lievre 12:00
at that point, at what stage do you reckon you you knew exactly where you should be, and this event space was really your forte and probably a superpower of yours.
Speaker 1 12:10
There was an event I did called celebrating agriculture back in 2008 and it was at a time when, you know, gosh, if humans and ag, it just started at that point, you would have been even more famous. I reckon Oli it was. It was at a point where there was so much negative vibe about the fact that the farming industry never celebrated itself. You know, there were no there weren't the advocates that we see now that really, you know, do this wonderful job like yourself, of taking positive stories and getting that not only reinforcing it to the industry, but getting it beyond farming. And it was sort of this era where I think we'd had a couple of crook seasons, and people were feeling generally not thanked for being a farmer. And the association of ag consultants in Western Australia asked me that. Well, they came to me and said, Oh, sort of got this idea. Fantastic chap on the name of David Falconer, was sort of at the forefront of this idea. I said, I think we just need to put on a party to celebrate farmers. And I said, Oh, what a great idea, David. And we sort of did this back at the envelope, kind of budget. And thought, if we could get 700 farmers at Burswood in a black tie walking up a red carpet that, you know, wouldn't it be good for everybody, kind of, like the brown Lodge, we ended up with 1100 people. I remember so much about that night, but it was interesting that there was actually a small cohort of sort of, kind of anti celebrators. And I know that there was a small cohort at that time that said, Why? Why are you trying to tell everybody how great farmers are? Because, you know, we're all going broke, and it's a game to be in. You shouldn't be celebrating. And there was a threat of a, you know, kind of a bit of a protest out the front. It didn't eventuate. Thank God. That small voice was more than outweighed by 1100 farmers partying. And I remember the food and beverage manager at birth would said to me at three o'clock in the morning Esther, I had never had a function like this in our venue that's still partying, that's that's so noisy, they're so, so happy to be here. And we could, literally couldn't get them out of the ballroom. They turned off the drinks, but everyone was just so pleased to be there. So I'll never forget that. And it was definitely, it was my beanfacts moment for you, it was my equivalent. It kind of just, it made so much more happen from that point that
Oli Le Lievre 14:35
is so cool. Talk to me on the business front, how has that changed and evolved over the years? And I know we were chatting about it on the phone the other day, and you kind of go through this stage of growth and then potentially reassessing options and looking at things across what you've already talked about, you've had this marketing, this PR business events piece, it's already pretty broad. So I presume there was at Stages quite a few people building around you.
Speaker 1 14:58
Yes, there were so. So I had, I traded as Esther Price promotions. I thought of that name when I was 20. Oh let God, terrible night. And so I built it. I had six people working for me full time. And I guess that was at a point when we were running 12 major conferences across the country. Was kind of an awkward size. I was sort of, it was hectic and and I guess that was a point where I really, I took some great advice from a wonderful conference manager who was retiring and selling her business, and she said, oh gosh, you're just such an awkward size. Esther, you're not big enough to be big and you're not small enough to be boutique anymore. You're going to have to decide, because you can't stay where you are. It's just that awkward piece where you've really if you're going to grow, you've got to not be doing what you're doing. You've got to be working on the business, not in the business. And I remember thinking, Well, I don't want to work on the business, because I love working in the business. You know? I imagine if I didn't get to be the person convincing Oli that suddenly he needs to do a 24 hour pivot and jump on the stage in a different role. You know, who else could I trust to do that? I want to be the person to make those calls the finessing of the big shows. So I actually decided to sell the business, and with it the contracts that went with the events that I had, which meant, then that I was I couldn't work in the events sector for three years to give the person who bought the business some space to develop it. And I sort of just, I shrunk to just me, and went back to some very highly enjoyable exec officer work again for the ag industry, predominantly in dairy. And then I picked up a lovely one in the sheep industry at that time. So for three years, I just poked along in that sort of space. But then my old client started coming back and saying, Oh, can you just come and help? We kind of miss what you do with the stage. And it was interesting, because in managing events, I never used to charge for my curation, if you like, because it was a really difficult line item to put in a quote, people didn't get it. But it wasn't until I wasn't there that those events went, Oh, now we see what you do. Can you just come back and magic people along like Oli and getting to do stuff he wouldn't otherwise do. So I'm really lucky now to be back as busy as before. It's just me, but I've surrounded myself with a team of just fantastic colleagues who all have their own small businesses, and we come together a lot on projects, and I've kind of, I guess, introduced a lot of them. They might not have been out of the ag sector, but I've introduced them to my wonderful world of Ag, and it's a great way of working. And I don't think I'm being I'm not any less busy, but I've got to say I'm enjoying it and life more than ever.
Oli Le Lievre 17:58
So how long ago was that the I guess the sale happened the
Speaker 1 18:02
same 2014, so just 10 years ago. Now, yeah, yeah, and so yeah, the last decade largely on my own in a workspace. But I'd have to say probably my some of my greatest years, I feel I'm I actually don't mind being a bit older, because people actually do quite respect your experience, and I guess I have a fair bit of it now. You know, my little black book of clever people, wonderful names, has just continued to grow, and you kind of intrinsically know what works, who can work, and particularly taking people that don't necessarily believe in themselves and their capacity to to make an impact on the stage. And, gosh, that's rewarding when, when you can give someone the confidence to get up there and tell a story in a way that makes a difference to the crowd, but also makes a difference to them, you know, and helps them on their way. So that's cool to do.
Oli Le Lievre 19:00
I look at sometimes, when I look at it, and people will tag themselves as speaker, and these other things, I go, Oh, like, it's just some aspects of it, which is just makes you feel so uneasy. But I want to ask you, and this is from a genuine point of curiosity for myself, and very selfishly, I guess, well, that's what kind of what kind of what the podcast is ask things are interested. Because this is something that I'm I have been working through, thinking about looking at options for myself, and going when you were running your business and you were call it the front man, and enjoying that, how did you work out for yourself, whether it was about bringing other people in or and I guess giving them that opportunity to take the spot where you were so you could move in different ways, and maybe, how did you trial, trial it, and how did it work for you? But then two, how did you also go, well, it's okay for if that's where your strongest, that you own that spot.
Speaker 1 19:55
I kind of wish I had that time again, because I don't think I was a good. Good boss, I think I can bring people along like really well when I need them to in short spaces of time. And I think I was so focused on my clients and perhaps less focused on the people that were working for me. So if I had my time again, I would spend time with so many of the wonderful speakers I've had who talk about managing people, and I would really try and apply that to my own rules, because now I get so much reward out of helping other people, and I didn't do that well in my business. But when I think about young people that I know I'm mentoring at the moment, you know, I celebrate their successes. So heart felt. Lee, that's not the right word, but it means a lot to me, and I now know that I can really help other people. You know, I love, I love really supporting a great chair and making he or she look great in whatever capacity I love, supporting a young newbie, sort of coming in to, you know, help advocate their pathway through. And I wished I'd done that with my staff, which I didn't. And had I, had I done that? Oli, maybe I would have gone from six staff to 20 staff and made it bigger. So, yeah, it's an interesting reflection on on my time,
Oli Le Lievre 21:23
before we come back and talk to where you're at today, and maybe what have been some of those secrets of success for you. The post I was going to bring up, and I didn't even know LinkedIn, went back this far slash that it was around I was looking on your LinkedIn, and 11 years ago, there was a post from you saying, to video conference or not to video conference, and asking the audience, and one that was so far ahead of the times, what's your take on it today, to video conference or not to video conference,
Speaker 1 21:50
it's brilliant, isn't it? It's, it's, what's my take on it? Use it when you have to. There's nothing better than the person in you know, the real person there. But if the real person can't be there for whatever reason. Well, our technology now is pretty reliable, and pretty much you can fill a big screen a quality image and a quality sound, and for the audience member, more so than the person making the speech, it can be good as long as the person making the speech has the capacity to do that well in their office, you know, in this sort of environment. But that reminds me of another amazing show idea when I think this was in 2005 or six, well before all of this technology, and I was asked to do a dairy industry conference that linked up all eight dairying regions on one day. And it was linked to some federal government funding that was all around drought at the time. And we actually did it, you know, to the point where we were in touch with the CEO of Telstra putting pipe under the main street of Mount Gambier into a hall where we were connecting the Mount Gambier dairy farms, to the ones in Bunbury, to the ones in moama and the ones in Warrnambool, which is where the head office was. And it's just amazing what we did to connect people by video conference. It was called dairy live, and literally 1500 people from across the nation in eight venues came together. I had a country our anchor at every every venue. We had 17 different camera operators because we joined in people from Belgium and Chicago at the time to talk about various things. And you could ask a question in moama and have someone in Brussels answer it, and it worked. But the space that we use to connect all of the gear and run the show and produce it was just about size of a conference room itself. You've just never seen so much gear, and for two hours we eat it. So, you know, 2000 I think it was 2007 actually. And today you do it in a in a blink.
Oli Le Lievre 23:58
Oh, my God, to turn back the clock and imagine to grabbed a few dollars worth of zoom shares back then as well, would have been pretty handy. Have you had a moment where, and maybe that's one of them, but had had another moment which stands out as just going, like, as incredibly significant, just looking at it and going, Oh my God, how on earth have we actually pulled this off and achieved it.
Speaker 1 24:21
Yo, that was up there because that dairy live show got produced in literally under two months, because was all linked to when funding was available. So I do you know the team that my mates, life long, mates that I did that show with that that would have to be up there with, Oh, my God. How did we, how did we take that off? But probably actually, just recently, you spoke at Dairy conference in Hobart for me two years ago. Well, this last dairy conference was in Melbourne, and we actually opened with a Ukrainian dairy farmer. Well, he actually wasn't a dairy farmer. He was he represented dairy farmers of Ukraine. So. And the journey I went on to, I guess, find we wanted the story of resilience that was coming out of Ukraine. Like, hey, Australian dairy farmers, you probably haven't got too much to worry about. You don't have rockets trying to, you know, blow up your cows. And so the vision was, yeah, kind of just set the scene and sort of give everyone a little gentle nudge about we've got a fair bit to be grateful for in our dairy industry in Australia compared to what these poor people are going through. But my journey to find that person and to negotiate for him to be able to leave the country and come to come in person, because I didn't that was one of those examples where I did not want to, like, if you pulled out, I would have given emergency call to Oli and said, Can you come and be the keynote speaker with 24 hours notice? Because it wasn't going to work my video. I wanted to wow the crowd. And, you know, a couple of the Zoom meetings I'd had with Andre in the prep lead up. You know, I never quite would know what he was dealing with at his end behind his camera, as I was trying to sort of get him ready for what I needed him to do for us, which almost seemed a little bit selfish, because I wanted him to make us cry. I wanted him for us to to make our farmers go, oh it's not so bad being a dairy farmer in Australia, after all. So I wanted him to tell it warts and all. I just wanted the story, and I think he wanted, he just wanted to give me the data and how good the industry was, which wasn't what I wanted. So I had bit to get through. But moreover, I was not even really sure he was going to be able to turn up until he literally got there. And when he did arrive in Melbourne, and we went to lunch on his first day in Melbourne, and down on the on the Yarra, and a helicopter went over, and he literally started shaking. And I said, Oh, what is it that you know is from you know, what's remarkable about being here? And he said, to think that I shouldn't be running for shelter when you know, an aircraft has just flown over. And he left Ukraine at two o'clock in the morning, left his family home, where a missile had just flopped. It just landed, literally 500 metres from where his wife and children are. And he said to me that, yeah, that Zoom meeting that he wasn't really concentrating on, there was rocket fire. You know, there was rocket fire. That was remarkable. And so just managing him, and I guess he probably, and I completely forgave him of this. You know, his culture was such that just the Secretary, I think, you know, I don't think I can write a fancy title, like I'm the executive producer of dairy conference. But he didn't see that, and that was fine. I was going with that completely, just trying to get the best of him, and I wasn't sure until he stood up the next morning opening presentation, and his opening line was something like, you know, gee, it's a long way to Australia. You don't seem to have any neighbours. And we've actually got lots of neighbours, and we don't like them very much. And the whole crowd just broke, you know, 700 people broke into a really good belly laugh, which relaxed him. And he went on to give exactly what I asked him, which was the story. And he got off stage and gave me a big hug and said, Now I understand Esther what you wanted and why it, you wanted it. And my final piece of that story was that we actually then raised some substantial funds for and we had a couple of pieces of wonderful cow art that we put up for auction, and were able to send back a pretty decent donation to his association, which made us all feel good.
Oli Le Lievre 28:39
That's amazing. I've heard, I can't remember who through but anecdotes of what of people talking about what they were going through, and the fact that the milk tank is in armoured vehicles now, and whatnot, like what it actually takes to pick up that milk every single day, to keep the supply chain moving. It gives you chills. Listening to you explain it. I can only imagine what it would be like to have been in the room, yeah,
Speaker 1 29:00
and Oli, what a privilege that I have, that I get to meet, you know, like you, you get to hear remarkable stories in my job. Angela, so absolutely.
Oli Le Lievre 29:08
So let's go from talking about others to talking about you, and this when you've had that fire in the belly, still that and I guess others tapping on the shoulder, going, there's others out there, but we want Esther. What, what has that been like? And, I guess, how have you, have you managed the intensity of work, but also being able to, and I know that you've got an interest in, I'm going to say hiking, that's definitely, it's mountaineering, probably, or thereabouts. Has that always been a passion and interest, or, like, has this fitness thing come in to support, I guess you stepping away from work, but actually be able to perform at your best. I
Speaker 1 29:47
guess I've always, I used to teach aerobics at the mobra Hall in cogent, or south of cogent. You know, I was a very young mother, as my strategy for, you know, keeping on top of it. But I think I. After I'd sold the business, and sort of was really, sort of coming back into the event space as a consultant and loving it, and getting really busy again. I guess along with bit of age comes some wisdom and going, what? How you can't work at this? What's the other What's the other thing to do? And yeah, I did. I started to get into hiking, you know, and few really cool places and and they've worked out if I'm going to do this, I probably need to be a lot fitter than I actually am, because otherwise, hiking hurts. There's no point in going off to have fun and then being a lot pain. So best way to fix that is to get a bit fitter. And I guess I also started noticing people of my age getting less fit, and I'm going, Well, I'm 50, or it was not me more, a bit more than that now, but it was at about that time of turning 50 where I went, Well, hang on a minute. I don't think I'm going to accept that just because I'm getting older, maybe I've never been how fit can I be? I've been wondering about that. And then I found I'd done Kilimanjaro, and I'd done a couple of big hikes in Peru, and then I found this, this mountain in the wenzhori ranges in Uganda. Actually, an African tour guide had told me that I'd never heard of the wenzhori mountains. And I came back and did a bit of research and started watching clips of people climbing it. And I realised that to be able to do this, you're going to have to be, you have to learn a whole bunch of new stuff, Easter like, you know, crampons, ice axe on ropes, but looks like a really cool place to be. And there was sort of No, no other Westerners really doing that. So that kind of, and once I sort of say something out loud, and I must have said it out loud to somebody that sounded quite good. And I thought, I think I'm committed. I think I'm going to Uganda to climb a mountain. And beginning of 2022, I actually started a training programme with a retired, very senior member of the Special Air Services regiment, and he used to be really involved in training the SAS soldiers and once a week for eight or nine months, it was like you had to get fit for training on Friday, because you never knew what was going to be thrown at you in order to prepare for what could be a reasonably dangerous mountain. And my trainers philosophy was you have to learn. You have to learn how to get to 95% of your capacity. You always need 5% in case someone's going to bump you off on the top of the hill. But learn what that feels like. So I built a level of cardio fitness that I'd never, ever dreamed that I would have had, as well as a lot of strength training, because one of the parts of climbing the margarita peak in mount on Mount Stanley, is you've got to get over a couple of very significant glaciers which are moving. And there's the chance that you're on ropes, but you could slip down. And if you if you slipped, you needed to be able to haul yourself up basically on your own body weight. So my little goal was to be able to knock out three chin ups at 54 or something. And I never done a chin up in my life before, until then. So I was, yeah, I got really strong, and I got really cardio fit, and I made it to the top. Like it was, it was the best thing I've ever done was still say, you know, like just, having the opportunity to six days climb over glaciers I had, I learned, I went and learned how to use crayon ponds and an ice axe, and you're on a 200 metre glacier at almost four or five o'clock in the morning, not being able to see how much more of that 200 metres you had. And I remember thinking, Tim would tell me, you've got to know where your 95% is. And I reckoned I was pretty muddy close to that 95% without actually knowing how many more metres I had to go in this glacier. But I didn't stop. I continued with the excellent training I'd had, and got to the top of the glacier. And then from the top of the glacier, it was probably only another hour and a half to the actual peak. So it was the best feeling, the best feeling, and to do it and not have any any aches and pains, you know, like to actually, I actually did it easily. I know the guides were remarkable, and were constantly remarking about how quickly I could recover. And I knew that was all my training, and it's something that two years later I take with me.
Oli Le Lievre 34:26
Would you say when you get to 95% is it more mental or physical challenge? Oh, yeah,
Speaker 1 34:32
it's both. It's like my mental strengths, I reckon, is all the better for the physical training. Yeah, now
Oli Le Lievre 34:40
I've put two and two together. I reckon we chatted at one stage, and maybe it was before or after the conference, and I think you'd just been somewhere to do glacier training. Yeah,
Speaker 1 34:49
there's only one place in Australia where you can actually scale an ice wall out of gingerbrein. And yeah, I'd spend a week out there in the mountains with the Australian School of mountains. Near and learning that technique.
Oli Le Lievre 35:01
Let's talk to what actually happened before you managed to put foot on the ground where you needed to be to start the expedition.
Speaker 1 35:11
I decided I had two ways I could have got to the foot of the mountain. So the Rwenzori Rangers are on the border of Ugandan and the Congo. So on the farm, western border of Uganda. Capital of Uganda is in Entebbe. And I could have driven from Entebbe, or I could have flown. And I, I chose to fly, because it was just me. I was, you know, it was all, yeah, didn't have anyone with me, and I saw that'll get me there quicker. And the plane didn't land well, Oli, I think, is the is the simple summary. There were, it was a 12 seater plane. It was a brand new plane, two beautiful Ugandan pilots who, when I think back, didn't actually give us a safety briefing as we left. Anyway, there were three passengers, and we're all getting off at three different airstrips. And My stop was at the foot of the mountain, so My stop was to be the second stop, but as we were coming in to land at the first stop, which is right on the edge of the Queen Elizabeth National Park, we were magnificent flying conditions. It was most beautiful day, but there were buffalo on the airstrip, and the pilots came in and sort of bombed the buffalo, but the buffalo didn't move. And for whatever reason, they kept doing the same thing. They they did another four circuits, each time, trying to bomb the Buffalo and maybe hoping that someone would, I don't know, come and shoo them away. But they didn't. And so on the fifth attempt, they actually came in over the buffalo to land, which meant that there was literally only 25% of the strip left. And by that stage, you'd had enough. I'd had I'd had very good vision. I knew that this was going to end really badly when the wheels went down over the buffalo, thinking, There's no way this plane can stop. And there's, there's a building at the end of it, and the building was a medical centre for the local village, and the plane ploughed straight into that medical centre. So that was up there in the level of excitement. And I can remember thinking it's going to crash, and then it crashed, and realised that, you know, seconds later, I was still completely intact, and that's where my two fellow passengers, so you'd survived the crash, but there was smoke coming out at the obviously, it was pretty badly bashed up. So the male passenger, who was a local Ugandan, got the passenger door open for us, and so we were eventually able to get out and get out of that plane. When I think back, and I kind of relate this, I think, only to my training in some way. I was so calm, I was the person keeping the other two calm. And my heart rate was actually not high at that point. I was just in control of all of that, until I got out of the plane. Then, you know, then the enormity of what happened kind of hit me. And then the other tricky bit was that my gear, my crampons, my ice axe, all my, you know, some zero gear, was in my very expensive, waterproof bag under the fuselage of the wrecked plane, and I was due to start climbing the next day. So miraculously, I still my phone was in my hand. I still my phone still worked. So once we sort of got taken to a place where there was internet, I can ring firstly, the guys that were supposed to meet me at the airstrip where I was supposed to be to say, I'm terribly sorry I'm not there. Not going to be there today either. But can you go and get me out? But my bigger problem at this point is I don't have any gear. And you know, New Year's Eve and Uganda, you're probably not going to find a set of crampons or even a decent sleeping bag or anything to go up the mountain with. So that became my focus, just calmly managing the process that needed to get the plane to a point where they could eventually, like six hours later, get my gear out, and the trekking company came and picked me up the first thing the next morning, which meant quite a long road trip, but I started the climb at 10am the next day, right on schedule, and I think because it was so intense in terms of the climb, you had to concentrate 100% everywhere you put your foot, you were thinking on for six days, and so I had no time to really kind of process. I was just had I was just so happy. I was that was my overwhelming emotion. I was so happy that I was okay and I can continue, because I just spent 12 months planning for this and I wasn't gonna let her silly old plane crash get in the way,
Oli Le Lievre 39:48
a silly old plane crash, please. That's what I want to ask. I was gonna ask, like, why did you continue on? And did that thought of the after effects of shock or anything like that come into your mind?
Speaker 1 39:58
It never. Ever even remotely entered my head that as long as I could get the gear, I knew that, you know, I I couldn't do it like you can't get cold, you can't get wet, you can't you've got to be as comfortable as those circumstances can make for you. You know, I couldn't have done it if I'd sprained a wrist or hurt an ankle, but my my body was not hurt. I had a couple of scratches on my arms, you know, I drew a bit of blood, but, you know, like so there was just nothing in my head that made me think, why would I not carry on? I'm Why would I not carry on? I know the the owner of the tracking company, an amazing guy called John Hunwick, who's actually an Australian, a 75 year old ex military man who was just, who I just adore. He's just built this amazing, amazing network of trails in Uganda and helped so many Ugandans in the process, he was insisting he had daily contact with my guide to check in. I think he kept thinking I was going to crash at some point, I just kept saying, No, trust me, I'm fine. You know, I'm loving every moment of this. The guides are fantastic. I sure as hell not gonna let anything happen to me. You know, they were overprotective, probably, and I literally never missed a beat. I've never had any ill effect at all. I do think that's part of the fitness programme that has to have attributed to it, because there's a picture of me standing in front of the plane with my hands in the air, literally half an hour after the crash, and it looks like I'm off off to a party. I mean, my office just I was just so grateful that I'd been spared. I mean, it could have ended really badly.
Oli Le Lievre 41:44
It is one heck of a story. Oh my god, and a good one to be able to, yeah, well, that trip in a hole never, ever forget it, will
Unknown Speaker 41:52
you never, never, never,
Oli Le Lievre 41:54
what's next for you on that front Oh, well,
Speaker 1 41:58
I'm about to become a grandmother, which I'm really excited for I haven't, and my kids keep saying, Well, you know, they're vetting every idea I have, in case they think I won't come home. So I've got an extra responsibility now, because I'm about to become a grandmother. I don't have the next trip lined up, per se, although I'm really keen to go back to Uganda and there's another John Hunwick has is opening up a trail in the in Mount Elgin National Park, which is on the Kenyan border of Uganda. And I just love what he's done. And I love that sort of adventure, because it's not yet like most people go where haven't heard of that. You know, you're not sort of one of 1000s climbing up Kilimanjaro. You're with a few Ugandans and nature and the most remarkable country. So that's on the agenda, I think. And I've promised my kids I'll be appropriate and sensible, behave like a little bit more like a grandmother. Is
Oli Le Lievre 42:52
there anything else that you want to talk about? Is there anything that you want to touch on that maybe we haven't the
Speaker 1 42:59
only one thing, I guess, I don't know how many listeners you have that are my sort of age, but I guess I just want to say you can do anything, if you set your mind to it. And for me, a menopausal woman, to actually have a goal of getting fitter in your 50s, I think I've been better at work since I've been fitter, you know, I've I've and I guess it's my little call to action. You know, you can set yourself a goal, get some good help, learn how to push yourself a little bit, and you don't necessarily do that without good help. But I think that physical call to action is something that I would love every one of my friends and colleagues and whomever listens to this podcast to go, you know, on that age, and I could do that too, because you can, it's just a decision. And I think that level of fitness, core strength and balance, you know, I've just just lost my father to under two years ago. Now, you know, looking at as you age, that importance of balance and fitness just becomes more and more important. So I think that's my one message that I'd add if I can. Thanks Oli,
Oli Le Lievre 44:13
absolutely now Esther, thank you so much for taking the time and having a chat. Well, your story and what you do is incredible, and maybe it's something that needs to be on the stage a little bit more as well. So I'm very grateful that you came on for a chat. It's taken us a couple of times, and I think, yeah, hopefully one day in the future, we've kind of got dreams down the track of bringing together some of these incredible humans of agriculture that we've either had on the podcast previously, or we'll get to have together at some stage in the future. Would love to do some sort of event so I know who to call. But no, thank you so much for taking the time and having a chat with us. I think there's gonna be so many people that are really going to enjoy hearing your story.
Speaker 1 44:55
Thank you, oligious, it's been an absolute privilege to talk to you. Well,
Oli Le Lievre 44:59
I. That's it for another episode from us here at humans of agriculture. We hope you're enjoying these podcasts and well, if you're not, let us know. Hit us up at Hello at humansof agriculture.com get in touch with any guest recommendations, topics or things you'd like us to talk and get curious about. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend. Rate, Subscribe, review it. Any feedback is absolutely awesome, and we really do welcome it. So look after yourselves. Stay safe, stay sane. We'll see you next time. See ya.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai