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Episode 356: Join us in this enlightening episode of The Bible Guys where we dive into the practical and spiritual aspects of one of the most famous teachings of Jesus: "Give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar and give to God what belongs to God." In this discussion, we explore the dual citizenship we hold as believers and citizens of our country, and how to navigate our responsibilities in both realms.
Whether you’ve been following Jesus for years or you’re just starting to ask questions, there’s a seat for you here.
Join Jeff and Chris for honest conversations about Scripture, faith, and the everyday stuff we all navigate. With humor, personal stories, and plenty of back-and-forth, The Bible Guys explore what the Bible says and how it connects to your life.
Subscribe, bring your questions, and get to know the Bible one conversation at a time. Head over to TheBibleGuys.com for more information!
You're listening to The Bible Guys, a podcast where a couple of friends talk about the Bible in fun in practical ways. Good Morning, morning, good morning, good morning. You've done that at least one time a week, a week for it feels like forever. It's three weeks. Yeah, I know, that's so funny. Hey, keeping a promise. Good morning, It's it's Monday. If you're tuning in live, not live, but what real time, real time. I guess if you're tuning in on Monday, it's Monday morning. If it's if it's Monday morning for you, good morning on Monday, thanks, Jeff. I mean if you're like, if you're keeping up with the current releasing, I'll say it. If you're up to date, up to date, I guess yes. Well, anyway, if you're listening on the day this was released, Yeah, that's what you're trying to do. That's what I try to say. Okay, Okay, So Chris, that was a lot Tougher name is Chris. This is Jeff Forrester, and we are the Bible Guys. There we go. So we love or dad joke competitions, yes, sure, and as Maveratt, we love them so much that one of our listeners came and they left this dad jokes calendar on our desks, right, which is going too Yes, very nice. Yeah, it was used as good as mine. I have not looked through all of the pages of the case. This one is three hundred and sixty five days of unbelievable jokes. That's what it says. Yes, my favorite one February six says dad, are we pyromaniacs? Yes we are? Son? Oh wow wow, yes we are. So that's great. Anyways, well, today Desiree has put together our dad jokes. Okay, here they are and we're going to read five each. I got the first one. Here goes. I don't trust stairs. They're always up to something. Okay, okay. My wife keeps asking me why I have so much candy. She doesn't know that I always keep a few twigs up my sleeve. Oh my goodness, I get a few twigs. Yeah that's speech impediments. No, I'm I'm imitatingly, I'm joking. All right, Here we go, truly, whoa wah one. I'm so good at sleeping that I can do it with my eyes closed. Oh that's terrible, but it's true. Yeah, it's sure. You never see any kids like sleeping with their eyes partly open. Oh creepy, creepy. Yeah, okay. Uh. I was asked if I could clear the table after dinner. I needed a running start, but I made it. That's actually really good. That's a good one. That's a good one. That's a good one. All right. I used to hate facial hair, but then it grew on me. Okay, that's okay, that's pretty good. Where do pirates get their books? Where? Second hand stores? Yeah? That was rough. That's the roughest one today. Okay, that's the rough rough one here. Yeah, all right, here you go. We're like, we're trying to like it. Here we go. I used to be able to play piano by ear, but now I have to use my hands. Yeah. So, so I knew a guy. He was famous, famous preacher. He was a Vietnam vet. He was a Navy seal and he got hit by a white phosphorus grenade. Shouldn't have lived, but he did. But he had really really bad burns all over his body. And uh he uh, the fingers on his right hand, the three you know, his ring finger, and those three fingers were stuck. So he just had a pointer and then on the other one he had two fingers that he could use and that was it. But his hands had gotten and he lost his ear, one of his ears, so he had a fake ear and he could play the piano. One of his therapy things was to play the piano. So he'd play the piano and he'd be sitting there playing like that. He goes, hey, did you know play by ear? Every know? And he goes ding ding ding ding ding ding ding, and he'd play it with his ear. He'd take his ear, he take his ear off. Yes, Dave Reaver was his name. So funny. Yeah, that's he's hysterically funny. And then all the old ladies would pass out and yeah it was Yeah. I would have probably told that story too, because when you hear the phrase piano by ear, that would be hard to forget. Yeah, okay, here's the here's the Oh no, you didn't tell your fourth one. My son was afraid of jumping a hurdle, but eventually he got over it. Okay, Yeah, I like to clear the table. One clear the table is great? Yeah, that too similar. How about this one? Have you heard about the new corduroy pillows? No, they're making headlines. That's pretty Yeah, that's a good one. That is a good one. I'm currently reading an anti gravity book. I just can't put it down. That's a good one. It's clever. It's okay, it is clever. Clever, it is clever. Yeah, well, okay, I give it a C minus. Today, all right, should we go through the calendar? I mean we used to try to redeem the day. Well, how about we just do one from the calendar? Okay, it's like a bonus one. What do you call one hundred? Baby sheep rolling down a hill? A lambslide? Oh, that's pretty good, Okay, a lambslide. I was thinking when you said one hundred, I thought, okay, is it called like, you know, is this something with one hundred? You know, like a legion or something that's I got hospitalized due to a peekaboo accident. They put me in the ICU. Oh my goodness. That's a good one. Really, that was a good one. Well, thank you to the person who gave us these. They will it will make my day every day for the next three hundred and sixty five. That's great. Well, hey, today we are picking up in Matthew twenty two, Mark twelve, and Luke twenty all three of these we're reading these because again we're in a series where we're reading chronologically and also in parallel, and this story is recorded in all three of these gospels. Yeah, okay, so Matthew Chapter twenty two, Verse fifteen, it says, then the Pharisees met together to plot how to trap Jesus into saying something for which he could be arrested. They sent some of their disciples, along with the supporters of Herod to meet him. Teacher. They said, we know how honest you are. You teach the way of God truthfully, you are impartial and don't play favorites. Now tell us what do you think about this? Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or not? But Jesus knew their evil motives, You hypocrites. He said, why are you trying to trap me? Here? Show me the coin used for the tax. And when they handed him a Roman coin, he asked, whose pictures and title are stamped on it? Caesar's there, replied well. Then he said, give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give to God what belongs to God. His reply amazed them, and they went away. In Mark chapter twelve, verse thirteen, it says later the leaders sent some pharisees and supporters of Herod to trap Jesus into saying something for which he could be arrested. Teacher. They said, we know how honest you are. You are impartial and don't play favorites. You teach the way of God truthfully. Now tell us is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or not? Should we pay them or shouldn't we? And Jesus saw through their hypocrisy and said, why are you trying to trap me? Show me a Roman coin and I'll tell you. When they'd handed it to him, he asked, whose picture and title are stamped on it? Caesars. They replied, well, then give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give to God what belongs to God. And his reply completely amazed them. And then in Luke chapter twenty, it says, watching for their opportunity, the leader sent spies pretending to be honest men. They tried to get Jesus to say something that could be reported to the Roman governor so he could arrest Jesus teacher. They said, we know that you speak and teach. What is right, and are not influenced by what others think. You teach the way of God truthfully. Now tell us is it right for us to pay taxes to Caesar or not? And he saw through their trickery and said, show me a Roman coin whose picture and title are stamped on it Caesar's. They replied, well, then he said, give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give to God what belongs to God. So they failed to trap him by what he said in front of the people. Instead, they were amazed by his answer, and they became silent. Give to Caesar that which is Caesar's. So we often say that we like the life application study Bible. Yeah, and by the way, they don't. They don't even know that we say that. Probably I don't think so. However, there is an actual picture of the coin that was shown to g not the coin, but an example. Say what, that's amazing, A how did they get that coin right? Right? And shown to Jesus, And this is the coin of Tiberius Caesar, who reigned from fourteen a d to thirty seven a D. And anyway, but look at he's he's sort of like a I don't mean this disrespectfully. He's got a really big nose, he's got big eyes. I'm not sure if this is a actual perfect rendering of him, but he was the Emperor. He would have made sure it's just right. Yeah. Well he kind of looks kind of looks, you know, a little goofy, a little hawkish. Yeah maybe. I mean, honestly, if you look at it, if you, if you, if you googled this, you'll know exactly what we're talking about. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but he looks that way. Well, I feel like an Italian could comment on that coin better than say it, thank you, thank you a Swiss guy? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm Italian by the way, for those who don't know so, but didn't you know I'm a quarter Swiss. I did not know a quarter? No? Yeah, yeah I am. I'm finally impressed with that, are you? Oh yeah, you like Swiss cheese. I love Swiss cheese. Oh well, there you go. Figures And and I don't want to offend anybody, yeahrrect, you're right, But anyway, I just thought that was interesting. And so Caesar, uh, there's different Caesar's whose that's the title, And this is Tiberius. And I also think it's amazing that they were so amazed. So Jesus uh talks about money in such a way to where think about it, it feels like it's meaningless. Whose pictures on here? Well, then give it to Caesar, right, as if the coins don't even matter, right, it's not mine he made it, didn't give it to him right? Right? And they were amazed. And uh and by the way, I think also think that it's interesting that the scripture gives us insight that Jesus knew their hearts. It says that he knew their motivations, right. Uh, So I often wonder all the time, I wonder this, did Jesus see it in the way that everybody else could see it? Or Jesus, did Jesus use his superpowers and know like maybe they were fantastic actors and nobody knew that they were trying to be deceitful. And except for Jesus, I think he's smart enough that at this point everything that comes to him from the phariseesus fake. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. And they're certainly making their grand standing here. Oh you are so smart and you always give the right answer and you're so truthful. So the reason why this is a trap is that the average Jewish citizen hated paying taxes to Rome. Sure, so Rome had conquered Israel. Israel was not free. They had conquered most of the known world at that time, right the Mediterranean world, and so when you paid taxes, it went to support the government, certainly, but it went beyond that, you know, it supported the elite people, It supported the pagan temples, it supported everything that the Jews were again, and then it was taking their money to do it. And then there's just so much fraud and all those things, and it was supporting your oppressor, right, so were their oppressor was able to continue oppressing them because they were collecting taxes to be able to continue to oppress you, you know what I mean. And so it was this vicious cycle. They hated it. And so the reason why this question was so clever was because if Jesus said, yeah, you should pay your taxes, it woul sound like he supports Rome and he's an anti you know, Israelite guy. Right on the other side, if he decides to play to the people, which is what the Pharisees think, Jesus is always doing. They think he's always just playing to the people. That's why they're he's the king of the Jews, right, and they're so frustrated with him all the time because they're always like, the people love him so much, so they think he just tells the people what they want to hear. And so they thought he would say or they were hoping he would say no, no, no, just just do whatever you want to do, because that corrupt pagan government they don't deserve your money. They use it in the wrong way. They're supporting evil temples, all this stuff. You shouldn't pay your taxes. Well, then now they can go to the governor and go, hey, governor, this guy he claims to be the king of Jewseys telling people quit paying taxes. The only thing that mattered to the Romans was taxes. They didn't care about the people at all. They just wanted the taxes. They continue feeding the war Masipan one of the taxes, and peace, and they only wanted peace so that people can pay taxes, right right, that's right they wanted to. And by the way, Tiberius was Caesar. This this Caesar at that time, he was famous for continuing this policy of we're going to maintain peace. It's going to be strength that maintains peace. And the whole purpose is when nations are prosperous, they produce a lot more resources and then you can tax them even more. Right, that's how the rich you're richer. Yeah, and so, but the wars, whenever you think of the Romans being such, you know, great warriors, the war has always happened on the edges of the Roman Empire. They're constantly expanding. It's because they had a giant Ponzi scheme. Essentially, if they didn't keep taking more land, eventually the entire system would implode. Right, So they kept having to take more land, but they were collecting taxes on the inside interior in order to be able to supply the things on the outside, so that they would be able to gain more land, gain more taxes, be able to keep the rich richer. Right. Then, that's what the whole system was, and it worked. It worked for hundreds and hundreds of years, but so the people hated it. And this was a really tricky question. So for Jesus to go just give to Caesar what Caesar's give to God, what's God's totally takes away all the punch on both sides on most of how they thought they would catch Jesus. Yeah, well, there's a sermon in there that you that you alluded to. You said, people the Romans probably thought that Jesus was going to tell the Jews what they wanted to hear, right, Yeah, these leaders, the leaders thought Yeah, the leaders thought that, right. And by the way, people still want that out of church and out of the Bible and out of Jesus today. Right. They want to hear what they want to hear. Right, And so some you know, you and I do with that because we're pastors, but people come in through the church doors and and you know, so so on a on an upper level, you and I and others pray about what should get said of the fifty two weeks of the year, right. And I always believe that there are things that people want to hear, and then there are things that people need to hear, right, yeah, And those are sort of the two categories. And so Jesus often said things that people needed to hear but did not want to hear. So Jesus was not that Jesus said things that people. I mean, it challenge people, rub people, the wrong way. You know, got people to understand and commit that, you know, I mean, he said to the disciples, and he's about to say, if you follow me, you're gonna die, right, right, and then and then Peter for instance, still follows them, right. And so yeah, he said things that people didn't want to hear all the time. Yeah, and he corrected their lifestyle. They were constantly looking for loopholes in the law. And he was saying, hey, if you just look at a woman to lust after, it's the same as committing adultery. If you just write you if you get angry enough that you would kill somebody, it's the same as killing them. He goes beyond a lot of times. He watches things up talking about motive. Now, whereas they had viewed their entire face system being built around just obedience or disobedience, right, and now he's questioning motives. Jesus really goes after it. But I think it's it's one of those things, you know, when the Bible says that sin is like a cancer in us, right. And I remember when when I had cancer, I didn't want to hear the doctor tell me I had cancer. But I needed the doctor to tell me I had cancer because I had to do something about it, right, right, And that's how Jesus did it. Jesus came in and my doctor came in. He was very compassionate. Hey, jeff, I think I have news you don't want to hear. But we've got a plan, right, And that's what Jesus did. Jesu didn't come in he said, oh, you bunch of BOMs, you bunch of sinners. Jesus said, hey, I got some things you don't want to hear, but I've got a plan. And by the way, your cancer free for how many years? Yeah? Three years? Three years, three years. So I have some more tests coming up, but yeah, it's really good. Right, So thank god, thank god we got in time. Thank god this this doctor came in. I got bad news, right, that's a jarring thing. But I've got a plan. Let's do this. And it worked. And so I think that that's that's what Jesus does. But the Pharisees and their religious leaders, because they did constantly try to pander to the people, they project. You tend to project what you do on others, and you project your motives on others sometimes, and so because they were constantly trying to manipulate the people. They just assume that's what Jesus was doing, was manipulating the people better than they were. Yeah. Right, have you ever told something to somebody that they didn't want to hear? And it's based on biblical truth, It's based on sort of maybe challenging them. And then they respond by saying, don't judge me. Oh yeah, yeah, dude, I'm not judging you. Isn't that one of the most common things in this world today? Yeah? So, you know, in a loving context relationship, I could set my brother down, for instance, I'm just hypothetically saying, which I've done this in the past, by the way, you know, and set them down. Hey, listen, I want to challenge you. I see this is happening in your life. This is not a good thing. Right, And then and then if they respond with don't judge me, it's like, wait a minute, I'm not judging you. I'm actually, you know, challenging you in the way that God asks us, which, by the way, side notes, since I brought it up, we're supposed to, as Christians lovingly judge insiders, but the Bible tells us that we're not supposed to judge outs those outsalls literally uses those words in Corinthians, right, which we have an entire podcast on that. Yeah, that idea from several months ago. Yeah, he does. Jesus says, you know by their fruit, you will know them right, Right, So you don't have to be judgmental while you're looking at the fact that the fruit somebody's putting out they claim to be an orange tree, but they're putting out bananas. Well there's something wrong there. Yeah, that's not being judgmental. You're claiming one thing, you're putting something else out. And in that case, then if you really love that person, you're willing to make a you know, have a conversation about it and lovingly try to correct if they refuse it. Hey, that's that. So you know, at the core of this passage, Jesus is identifying the fact that we have two responsibilities. We're citizens of this world and we're citizens of heaven. Right, so we have a responsibility to our government, and then we also have a responsibility to Heaven. When those two conflict. We know, in the Book of Acts, John says, you know, we'll obey God rather than man. Right, But in the in this instance, Jesus is acknowledging. Hey, governments are necessary. They're a thing that happened. You should, you know, maintain your responsibility as a citizen of your nation. But I would say this for Americans. Here's a little here's an interesting thing in America, Chris, who is Caesar? In America? We are Caesar. We are Caesar. That's right, if you ask them. I've asked so many people this question and they always go, oh, the president of Caesar. No, not in America. Right, It's not the five hundred and some odd representatives and justices and you know, administrative people. It's it's not them, it's us. We are Caesar. And so in this situation, then you and I have to be because of your vote, because of the influence and the power that you have as a free citizen, relatively free citizen, and the relative power of your vote, then you have to use your power judiciously in the same way that in this situation. Tiberius Caesar was a pretty good guy, you know. The note says his administration was characterized by wisdom, intelligence, prudence, and duty nice right, and he did a great job leading the empire. At that time. It was a peaceful time as a prosperous time. And it's in that context that Jesus said, let Caesar do Caesar's thing. Well, you and I were citizens of heaven. We should be doing the work of God. But we are also Caesar in our country, and we have to leverage our ability to influence the movement of our and the direction of our nation. We have to do it biblically and godly, in a godly way, using prudence and wisdom and duty and all those kinds of things. So in our situation, he's talking directly to you and me, and we're one of the few people in history that have the kind of power that he's talking about here. That's awesome. Yeah, there's a there's a note in the Bible here that says Jesus avoided this trap by showing that we have dual citizenship and then which you already talked about, and then it references references one Peter two seventeen. So I looked it up in the NLT version and it says, respect everyone, and love the family of believers, Fear God, and respect the King. Oh yeah, right, So it's talking about that same thing. It's talking about we're citizens of heaven and we're citizens of the earth. Right, that's right, that's neat. So any any last parting thoughts, I would say, are people going to listen to this podcast and have questions about their own taxes? Like, I mean, you know it's by the way, it's tax season, isn't it. Sure? Yeah, so taxes are coming up. Yeah. I think you know, the more educated you are, the better you are at managing your The more educated about taxes, yes, you are the better. The more educated yours to what you need to pay and what you shouldn't pay. I don't think you should pay anymore. And you have to pay right, And then I think that you need to leverage your vote and your influence so that your taxes are used for better things. And then and then what about cheating people out of there? What about cheating on your taxes? Well, Jesus is against it, not for it, that's right. Well give the Caesar that was just caesars. That's right, that's right, that's right. And and so our government is all about we the people. So we should be giving our money and you know a portion of our resources to the benefit of the people. Yeah, yeah, okay, Well that's uh that's looks like that's about our time, so hopefully we will see you next time on the Bible guys. H