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The Pool Envy Podcast is where real, licensed pool professionals speak up. In an industry overflowing with DIY chatter and surface-level advice, we dive deep into code, compliance, and craftsmanship that set licensed contractors apart. Our goal is to educate and elevate the industry — teaching safety, sharing knowledge, and helping those who build and service pools do it the right way.
You're listening to the Pool Envy podcast. Code, compliance, craftsmanship hosted by Jason Davies. Let's dive in.
Jason D:Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Pool Envy podcast. I'm Jason, your resident licensed pool contractor and professional thorn in the side of unlicensed scumbags everywhere. And, of course, I say that with love mostly. Today, we're gonna talk about something that sounds boring on paper, but absolutely is not, unlicensed contract, permits, and why doing things right actually protects you, your house, your wallet, and your community.
Jason D:Let's all join together on this one. This is not going to be a doom and gloom episode, I promise. We are gonna keep it practical, empowering, and, of course, we are gonna have some fun with this one.
Spyder:Let's dive in.
Jason D:I filed yet another unlicensed contracting complaint this week. Go figure. That's me. I run into those situations a lot. People doing pool and electrical work when they're absolutely not allowed to do so, especially around schools and public buildings.
Jason D:And it got me thinking, this isn't just contractor drama anymore. This affects homeowners, taxpayers, and honestly, anyone who expects buildings not to burn down or electrocute somebody. So the goal of today's episode is simple. Help homeowners understand what really is at stake when you hire an unlicensed contractor or skip permits. Talk about how this plays out on the public side, school districts, cities, anybody spending your tax dollars, and give you some real what's in it for me reasons to care beyond because the code book says so.
Jason D:Because nobody wakes up one morning saying, you know what I wanna do today? More government paperwork. Let's start with this classic line. The unlicensed guy has been doing this for fifty years. Nothing's ever gone wrong, and he's cheaper.
Jason D:What's the big deal? Honestly, I get why that sounds convincing. But here's the problem. Nothing's gone wrong usually just means nothing's gone wrong yet, or nothing has gone wrong and been traced back to that person because the bumper warranty of two flashing red lights on the rearview mirror has gone out, or nobody with enough knowledge has looked closely enough to see how bad it really is. It's like saying my grandpa never wore a seat belt, and he lived to 90, so seat belts are pointless.
Jason D:Okay. Cool story. But it doesn't mean you wanna fly through the windshield to test the theory. Right? Let's think of Alice's adventures through the windshield glass.
Jason D:On top of that, there's a fairness issue. Licensed contractors are paying for licensing, continuing education, insurance, permits, and the joy of being audited, inspected, and second guessed on a regular basis. The unlicensed guy skips all of that, underbids the job, and if something goes wrong
Spyder:It's still illegal.
Jason D:He walks away clean, and that leads to a real what's in it for me conversation. Let's make this very concrete and very relevant. Imagine the scenario. You're a homeowner. You hire an unlicensed contractor to install a gas pool heater or a new light.
Jason D:No permit. No inspection. The price is great. You saved a few $100 and the guy has been doing it forever. A few months later, something fails.
Jason D:Maybe it's a gas leak. Maybe it's an electrical short in the underwater light. The worst case happened. Your house catches fire, and there's a serious electrical incident, and then it gets worse. The fire spreads to your neighbor's house next door, hence your neighbor.
Jason D:Now ask yourself, is the unlicensed contractor gonna be your friend standing next to you shoulder to shoulder as the insurance adjuster walks the site? Are they gonna show up to court and say, this was totally my fault. I'll cover the damages. I promise. Nope.
Jason D:They are gone. They got paid, and they're off to the next job because that's paying for the job after that one. You can scream all day about how the unlicensed contractor did the work. You can even leave Google reviews. But in the eyes of your insurance company and the legal system, you are the property owner.
Jason D:If the investigation shows there was no permit, work that doesn't meet code, and the unlicensed person doing regulated work, you've just given your insurance company a giant neon sign that says, please find a way not to pay this claim. And trust me, they will.
Spyder:Do not pass code. Do not collect $200.
Jason D:You might be looking at denied or reduced coverage, having to pay to fix your own house. And if your neighbor's home was damaged or somebody got hurt, potential lawsuits and judgments that can go way way beyond the cost of that original job or saving a couple pennies. So when somebody says worst case is that I'll just get a couple $100 fine if I get caught, that's just not reality. The actual downside can be life changing money, and some of those judgments may never go away. Let's play devil's advocate here for a second because a lot of people do think this way.
Jason D:Honestly, it's cheaper to roll the dice. If we get caught without a permit, we'll pay a fine. If we don't get caught, we save money. On paper, that sounds very logical. In practice, here's what it can look like.
Jason D:You go to sell your house, and the buyer's inspector finds unpermitted work. Now you're dealing with rushed permits, engineering letters, tearing open finished work, redoing things to bring them up to code, and maybe a buyer demanding a massive price reduction or just walking out of the deal completely. Or there's an incident such as a shock in the pool, a heater issue, structural cracking, whatever it is, and insurance starts asking questions. Who did the work? Was it done by a licensed contractor?
Jason D:Was a permit pulled? Was it inspected? Skipping a modest permit fee and shaving a few $100 by using the cheapest unlicensed person can turn into tens of thousands of dollars of pain later. So when people say, we can afford a fine, they're thinking about the ticket, not the fallout. Legal liability, civil lawsuits, loss of the home value, or just the cost to rip out everything and start over and redo it the right way.
Jason D:Shortcuts are fun until they become evidence. Now let's hit another very real concern that I hear a lot. We don't wanna pull a permit because then the city will know that we improve the property and our taxes will go up. I get it. Nobody is excited about paying more money in taxes.
Jason D:I own a home too. But here's the trade off. Most people don't think through this. On one side, you have a possible bump in assessed value over time. On the other side, you have a very real, very immediate risk that if something goes wrong or you ever go to sell, pulling a permit does several things for you.
Jason D:It forces a minimum standard. Someone other than the installer looks at what was done and says, yes, this meets code or nope, go fix it. It creates a paper trail that can help you later. When you sell the home, you can point to a permit, inspected work instead of hoping nobody asks. And it gives you an expert second set of eyes at a discount.
Jason D:And I know people like good discounts. If you're doing DIY work, that inspector is essentially a built in consultant. You pay the permit fee, and in return, you get a professional who'll come out and double check your work. So instead of viewing permits as the enemy, you can frame it more like this. I'm paying a relatively small fee to have an expert backstop my project and protect my future self from big problem.
Jason D:You, yourself, are still the hero of this project. You got to do your work. The inspector just makes sure that the hero doesn't accidentally wire the dragon's tail to the wrong breaker. And for those of you who are wondering, the dragon's tail is about nuclear fuel that went really bad. Let's be clear.
Jason D:I'm not anti DIY. I love people who are creative. If you're a homeowner who wants to do some of the work yourself, great. A lot of my clients do. Some people are very capable, very detail oriented, and genuinely enjoy doing it.
Jason D:What I am against is DIY with no permit, no inspection, and no understanding of how that work interacts with life safety systems, electrical, gas, structural, and so on. So if you are a DIY minded homeowner, here's the smart path. Pull the permit. Learn what you can. Follow the code the best you can, and let the inspector correct anything you missed.
Jason D:Then redo the work correctly according to the guidance and direction given. You're basically getting a professional question and answer department for your project, paid for at government rates instead of consultation rates. That's a pretty big win. Now let's zoom out from homes and talk about commercial and the public side of this. Let's think about school district, municipal pools, public buildings.
Jason D:When a district or city hires an unlicensed contractor, whether they knew it or didn't realize it, it's not just a minor whoopsie. It's a potential waste of taxpayer money. It's a safety risk for kids, staff, and the public, and it's a liability nightmare if something goes bad. If a school hires someone who is unlicensed to do electrical work or swimming pool work, and it falls in a way that hurts a child, nobody is going to say, well, that's okay. He's been doing it like that for thirty years.
Jason D:They're gonna ask, who hired this person? Were they licensed? Why did the district not verify their credentials? From a taxpayer perspective, you have every right to expect public entities are using licensed, qualified people, and permits are being pulled and that the district isn't quietly cutting corners to save money by rolling the dice on safety and liability. This is a big opportunity for good governance.
Jason D:Public entities that insist on licensed contractors and proper permits can say very clearly, we're not here to just check boxes. We are protecting kids and protecting your taxpayer dollars. That's an easy win to explain to the community if they choose to do it the right way. So how do we turn all of this into something positive instead of just a long rant? Here's my idea.
Jason D:When homeowners and public entities collectively insist on licensed contractors and permitted work, the entire community benefits. You'll have fewer dangerous installations. That's a huge plus. Fewer catastrophic failures, fewer big insurance claims. And when there are fewer big ugly claims in a particular region, that tends to reduce the pressure that drives insurance costs up for everybody.
Jason D:I can't promise that you personally will see your rate go down a specific amount next renewal because you hired a licensed contractor. But I can tell you this, doing things right pulls some of the fuel off the pile. So what's in it for me? Well, protection of your own home and family, better odds that your claim is honored if something goes wrong, stronger resale value, and long term pressure against the chaos that drives insurance and repair costs up in the first place. I've personally reported multiple unlicensed situations in my area.
Jason D:Some of the folks have been getting away with it for years. I don't do it because I enjoy the paperwork. A lot of these forms are very long to fill out. I do it because somebody has to be the adult in the room and say enough. And that's the role you can also play without being dramatic.
Jason D:Here's a few simple practical steps. Ask the question upfront. Are you licensed for this specific type of work? And what is your license number? Verify it.
Jason D:Most states have online lookup tools where you can pull a name or license number and see what's real. Ask who is pulling the permit. If they say we don't need one or we prefer not to, that's a red flag, not a fun discount. If you see a pattern of sketchy behavior, especially at public facilities, report it. You don't have to make a big scene.
Jason D:Just document what you see and send it to the appropriate licensing board or authority. You're not being that person. You're doing exactly what responsible adults are supposed to do in a community. You're quietly raising the bar for everybody else.
Spyder:It's still illegal.
Jason D:We'll sparkle in some of those sound bites from earlier episodes like
Spyder:Are you an unlicensed scumbag?
Jason D:If you're offended by that and you are an unlicensed scumbag, that's kinda my point.
Spyder:Go directly to jail. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200, you big dummy.
Jason D:We've also joked before about code enforcement books can't complain because it's a book. It just sits there full of rules waiting for somebody to care. It needed some attention. So think of this episode as you and me cracking the books open just enough to keep you out of trouble without having to memorize every single line. Let me pull this together with a simple summary.
Jason D:Unlicensed work isn't just technically illegal. It's a way of transferring massive risk from the contractor to you, the homeowner, or the taxpayer. Ask for forgiveness later. It's a terrible strategy. The real costs show up in insurance claims, lawsuits, failed sales, and do overs, not just the fines.
Jason D:Permits are not bureaucracy. They're a built in safety net and a discounted expert review of your project. Public entities have the duty to do it right. When schools and districts use licensed pros and follow the rules, they're protecting kids and protecting your tax dollar. And you have more power than you think.
Jason D:By asking questions, insisting on licenses and permit, and reporting patterns of abuse, you're not being difficult. You're actually the hero of the story. If this episode made you think about a project you're planning or maybe one that's already been done, you're not alone. A lot of people are in the same boat. Here's what you can do this week.
Jason D:If you're about to hire a pro, verify their license and ask about permits. If you serve on a school board, PTO, HOA, or any committee that hires contractors, bring this up at the next meeting. If you suspect there's unlicensed work happening in a public facility, document what you can and ask questions, quietly, professionally, but firmly. Please see the podcast description for more information. I'll put links there so you can look up licenses in your state, find the local permitting office, and to see a basic question checklist you can use before you hire anyone.
Jason D:Share this episode with a neighbor who's just about to have a guy come over and take a look and hook it up, a friend in real estate or a realtor, a school board member who might not realize how big this issue is. The more people that understand this, the harder it becomes for bad actors to keep cutting corners at your expense.
Spyder:Let's dive in.
Jason D:Licenses, Florida, CPC 1460695, Wisconsin, electrical and HVAC, 1543940. Texas, t I c l, 1350. Rail, 635643. Thanks for hanging out with me today on the Pool Envy podcast. I'm Jason reminding you, if you're going to build it, wire it, heat it, or fill it with water, do it safely, do it legally, and make sure that the person touching your pool can prove they're allowed to.
Jason D:I'll see you next time.
Spyder:Thanks for listening to the Pool Envy podcast, where licensed pool professionals speak up. Hosted by Jason Davies, licensed across Wisconsin, Florida, and Texas. For more insights, subscribe and join us next time.