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Are you a new parent or parent of twins and multiples? Do you want to thrive, rather than just survive?
Welcome to our show - a modern, step, by step guide to get you best set up for thrivival!
No outdated, frumpy or stuffy content - we're for NEW parents, we are new parents and we have found the best of the best experts, research and stories. If you're time poor - look no further - community and support building, efficiency hacks and tools, pregnancy, symptom management, partner support, body, bust, skin, hair, postpartum recovery, PND, logistics and travel, parenting twin psychology, childcare need-to-knows, returning to work and more!
I'm Emily, a twin and twin mum. I have researched extensively the best tips, efficiency hacks, expert advice. Books, white papers, medical papers, online groups, articles - sifted through it all, for you. I hope this podcast helps you best navigate this exciting time.
If you have guest recommendations or ideas, feedback - please DM my on socials or email hello@dwoh.group
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Podcast: Hey There Thivival
How to breastfeed or can I breastfeed?
Multiples are some of
the most search terms.
Online.
Today's guest is an internationally
board certified lactation consultant,
and formally worked at the
Australian Breastfeeding Association.
Her name is Emily Brittingham,
and today she's going to
take us through her journey.
She's highly experienced in breastfeeding,
being a mom of three single babies,
and then finding out as a surprise
gift that she was having twins.
Post that.
Emily's going to walk us through
her story as well as top tips.
How to prepare and should you
prepare during pregnancy tips
for partners and then also her
top tools and recommendations.
If you enjoy this episode, as
always, please rate or subscribe.
'cause that way the algorithm will send
it in front of more parents to help
them thrive rather than just survive.
Okay, let's jump in.
Emily: Emily, welcome to the podcast.
It's wonderful to have you here today.
I'd love for you to talk a
little bit about who you are
and why you're joining us
Thanks Emily.
I am also Emily and also a mum of twins.
I am an international board
certified lactation consultant.
I work in my own private practice, which
is called Melbourne Lactation Consulting.
I visit mums and babies in their homes.
I also do online consultations and some
prenatal education for expecting parents.
prior to being, qualified as an
I-B-C-L-C, I volunteered as a qualified
breastfeeding counselor with the
Australian Breastfeeding Association
for five, years also mum of five.
Yes.
Which is, very, very impressive
to run a business, have twins
and a total of five children.
Emily.
A question I'd love to ask
you is what's your why?
Why do you do what you do?
Well, prior to having my first child,
I worked in a completely unrelated
field, so corporate logistics world.
so it really was that profound,
transformation into motherhood that,
made me want to pursue a career in.
In helping mums and babies and my own
breastfeeding experiences, I really saw
a gap in continuity of care for moms
and babies and that's the reason that
I wanted to help, make a change and
make a difference with mums and babies.
Fantastic.
That's, a very common thing a lot of
moms can relate to is that, turning
of your career after having children.
So interesting to hear that.
another fun question for you.
how did you find out
you were having twins?
You've had three.
What's the story there?
I would love to hear about that.
so we had our family of three, which
we thought at the time was finished.
a daughter and two sons.
and then in the very interesting
and crazy year, that was 2020,
we had a surprise pregnancy.
So being, locked down and everything
that was happening at the time, I
went to the first scan on my own
partners weren't allowed in scans then,
All masked up and all
of that jazz for COVID.
And it was funny because I was
talking to the sonographer as I
came in and jokingly said, as long
as it's not twins, I'll be fine.
and he was having a little bit of
a giggle as well, and then he said,
oh, Emily, I'm gonna have to be
serious with you now because, look
up, there's two babies there.
Yeah.
I was just shock.
I could not believe it.
Right.
were you hyperventilated
under your mask at that point?
had a full blown panic
attack, actually, yes.
I had to sit up, take the mask off.
I had to do some deep breathing.
He was just so kind to me, honestly,,
he said, you're going to be okay.
You can do
yeah.
Take whatever time you need.
go and have a drink, come
back and let's make sure that
everything's fine with these babies.
Which I did.
And he did.
And it was, and then,
it's all a bit of a blur.
I remember walking out to the
car park and just feeling.
So dizzy and unwell and having to
call my partner and tell him the news
and, he was like, oh, don't drive.
I'll come and pick you up.
Just like, it's okay.
I, I'm okay.
I took some, a few minutes to compose
myself, but did drive home and when I got
home he said, look, we'll make it work.
And I feel like that's just pretty much
what we've done every day, ever since.
Really that is the best
response you can have, right?
Obviously fear, I think, is really
common with multiples and then
with people like yourself that
have got, existing children.
but you do work it out.
So,
Yeah.
You Love to hear more
about that as we go along.
let's talk about your twin
pregnancy in particular.
wonderful that you'd had
a few pregnancies before.
love to hear, if there are any symptoms
or complications that you worked
through, as part of that pregnancy.
really lucky to have really
straightforward for all of my pregnancies.
Mm-hmm.
the singleton's, I absolutely
loved being pregnant.
I had a little bit of morning sickness
in the first trimester, and then that was
pretty much it, uneventful, as I said,
really, really lucky with the twins.
Look, in hindsight, I did notice a
lot more nausea earlier on than what
I'd had with the single pregnancies.
again, nothing eventful.
I, I really enjoyed being pregnant,
towards the third trimester.
It was a lot more uncomfortable,
a lot different to being
pregnant, with just one baby.
I would say by around week 29 30, at
the start of that third trimester,
I was really crying a lot, just
from pure discomfort and also,
Yeah.
three other children, not really being
able to stop or slow down for their
needs just because I was pregnant.
again, it was 2020 strange times
school, lockdowns and all of that.
So a lot of pressures.
having the
Wow.
home with me at the same time.
then my twins ended up being born 34
weeks, so really I didn't really have
too much longer to go after that anyway.
So there would've
been premature, 34 weeks.
And just a reminder for the audience
average in Australia is about 37, 38
that they, allow you to go to, in
most circumstances, with the twins.
And so what size were they at that point?
At 34 weeks.
so they were born at 2.3
and 2.4
kilos.
So good size for that
Wow.
That's
Yeah.
But still went
That's so good.
care just for prematurity.
Yeah.
yeah, I guess that's a very common thing.
And is it, and how did you find,
special care as well, just to
explain to the audience a bit about,
your, example of that scenario?
I mean that was really challenging,
I mean it's challenging for anybody
I.
that, twins or a premature baby is their
first, but because I think I'd had the
lived experience of having three babies.
at term and born healthy and coming
straight up to the maternity ward
and then coming home with me, it
was just completely different,
And I feel I wasn't really adequately
prepared for what it was going
to be like, which was, immediate
separation from my babies,
Yeah.
hold them until they were, 14 hours
old and then not being able to feed
them until they were 24 hours old.
So really brand new and whole
new learning experience for me.
Yeah, can understand,
especially unexpected,
Hmm.
which is why I'm hoping that, sharing
this really helps to explain to
the audience a few things that
they might expect and plan for
or talk to their doctors about.
Yeah, for sure.
What would you say were some
of your biggest challenge
areas and your biggest wins?
Going through the pregnancy?
Through to delivery.
So, biggest challenges, after
the twins were born, particularly
around breastfeeding, is that at
that gestation, they weren't able to
directly breastfeed, so they were being
fed through nasogastric tubes, which
is very typical for any baby that's.
Born prior to 34 weeks gestation.
they're not born with that
mature, suck, swallow, and breathe
pattern that a baby needs to be
able to breastfeed effectively.
that was challenging terms of,
me obviously being a lactation
consultant and having breastfed
three of my own children really just.
that deep desire to breastfeed my
babies, but also challenging in that
it was a whole new story in terms of
pumping, which I really hadn't had
to do with my other children as well.
so when a baby is born prematurely,
you need to pump to tell your
body yes, baby's born, and to help
establish your milk supply and
maintain that milk supply as well.
It sounds like you've got some
really relatable insights.
I know from my twin parent group, we had
a mix of those scenarios where from 28
weeks was the earliest through the latest.
So we had some that were in
the NICU and weren't able to do
breastfeeding immediately, What would
you say were your biggest wins?
what were you really
proud of if you look back,
Yeah, in terms of the whole parenting
journey overall, I guess just being, a
family of seven, a mum of five day is
a little bit of a win, to be honest.
getting everyone where they
need to go, and on time, and I
think when I look at myself and
my partner as a team, I feel like
adding the twins to our family, just
strengthened our teamwork so much more.
we, I think we both had to step up in
different ways in different parenting
roles that we hadn't previously.
and sometimes, although it felt
like we were passing ships in the
night with looking after that child
and bedtime with that one, and.
Someone doing the cooking and
someone doing something else.
I think it was really,
teamwork makes the dream work.
I'm, I'm proud of us as a
partnership mostly, I think.
Very interesting.
We had a twin dad on recently that
had one child prior, and he and his
partner, she said the same thing,
that they really came together
Yeah.
and got really efficient in terms
of a team, and that's what saw them
through and it really lifted them up.
So I think that's a, that's a nice.
Takeaway for the audience is that,
it's not the fear that one might,
feel is real, but knowing that a
lot of people like yourselves are
showing great examples of being able
to come together and there're being,
you know, many positives as well.
I like hearing that.
are.
Yeah.
Well that's really good to hear.
And then with the twin experience versus
the singleton's, any, major call outs
and again, we're speaking to people that
potentially will be in your situation or
maybe they're just interested to, to hear
if there's any additional kind of things
which would say are really prevalent.
Yeah, I think I found, I
spent a lot more time.
holding my singleton babies than
what I did my twin babies initially.
And look, that
Mm-hmm.
to do with them spending
time in special care as well.
But that's something that I found very,
very challenging, because I had had
the experience of having a singleton
baby where it's just you and baby and
it's physically Easy to carry one baby.
whereas two, it was more challenging.
They were smaller.
we went home without them
for a couple of weeks.
So I guess, what I'm trying to say
is I just had that longing to just be
sitting with my baby on my chest and not
having to worry about anything else, but
it felt, that felt challenging having
two, definitely different to having one.
Okay.
Well, thank you for sharing that.
I do hear that again as something which
a lot of parents notice, whether they've
had kids before or, or not, is that
interchange between balancing that and
I think that's a real, trait of it.
trying not to put too much pressure
on yourself because you can't pick
up two babies at once, I think is a,
Yeah.
know, perhaps a good call.
I don't know if you agree.
I, I definitely agree with that.
And even in, some of the moms of
multiples or moms of twins groups
that I'm in, I see people genuinely
asking the question, what am I
meant to do when both babies cry?
how are you meant to choose
which one to pick up first?
And I, I actually like reading the
comments on those, and I remember
exactly what I used to do, which
was lay on the floor between them.
I'm like, I just, I surrender.
I'm gonna lay here.
I'm gonna have you both under
each arm and if we're all gonna
cry together, then so be it.
But this is what I'll have to do.
Yeah, well that is actually
a very creative solution.
I can't even remember what I did.
I think I just felt bad and
kind of ran between them.
It's a,
but I love that.
question.
You
hack.
babies are crying, who do I, who do I,
tend to first, or, a common question with
breastfeeding is, what am I meant to do?
Am I meant to breastfeed both
babies at the same time or I'm.
I'm meant to feed one after the
other, or if you're doing mixed
feeding, am I meant to bottle
feed one and breastfeed the other?
and it's all a bit of trial and
error, I suppose, and finding out what
works best for you and your family.
Yeah.
Creative solutions.
I love the floor hack though.
I think that's great.
Everyone's safe.
You are just doing your thing.
Okay.
Well look, thank you so much
for sharing your overview and
a bit about your experiences
Let's kick into pregnancy and preparation.
So again,
we're, we are talking about all
things breastfeeding, lactation,
and so
we want to start with,
preparing the audience for.
What you can do or possibly consider
in that early stage before they're
there and wham bam, you're into it.
Well, I guess the first piece
of advice I have to expecting
parents is knowledge is power.
So whatever information you can access
about breastfeeding, if that's what
you're choosing to do, or that's what
you're hoping to do when your babies
are born, really learn about that.
Before giving birth.
birth education is also really important.
There's been lots of research to show that
having a positive birth experience can
directly impact breastfeeding outcomes.
So again, that's another
instance of knowledge is power.
just really trying to get as much
prenatal education as you can in,
because once the babies arrive.
It's a whole different mind
frame that you're going to be in.
Your brain's not going to have the
capacity to take on new information
like it can when you're in pregnancy.
So anywhere from, 20 weeks onwards I
would advise is a really good time to
start thinking about what education you
and also your partner, want or need.
to have really the best
start to feeding your babies.
another really good tip, especially
for mums expecting multiples, is
to have a think about expressing
some colostrum prenatally.
So having a multiple pregnancy
increases the risks of your babies
being born earlier or your babies
being born by cesarean section.
And those are two instances where
having some prenatally expressed corum
is going to be really, really helpful.
a in ensuring that your baby does
receive colostrum for their first feed.
And B, just giving you that skill of
hand expressing so that once baby's
born and if they're not breastfeeding
directly, you are able to keep
continuing expressing by hand and really
helping to establish your milk supply.
Fantastic.
Really good.
And, I have a question on that, but I
wanna jump back to the earlier question.
So with education piece, what sort
of areas would you be learning
about in preparation Is if there
were top level categories that the
audience could know to look for.
Yeah, I would look for a course
that, is labeled as prenatal
breastfeeding education, or really
targeted to pregnant parents.
The Australian Breastfeeding Association
has one specifically for, those
expecting multiples around breastfeeding.
So
Fantastic.
Great.
Yeah, is a bit different to a
singleton, but any information
you can get is really helpful.
So you'll learn about things like how
breastfeeding even works, and having
that foundation knowledge helps you
understand how to recognize maybe when
things aren't going optimally, and then
what you can do to get things back on
track, or how to even recognize when
things aren't going right and when
to seek some professional support.
because I find a lot of parents
expect it, that it's something
that's just gonna come naturally.
And something that I hear really often is,
mom say, well, I'll breastfeed if I can.
and then just leaving the rest up to
chance, but having this knowledge of how
breastfeeding works, what happens to your
hormones post birth, how to make sure
your milk supply comes in effectively,
how to help your baby feed efficiently.
They, that, those factors, sorry.
That's what's really going to help
you meet your breastfeeding goals.
Okay.
Those are great tips and I must say I
don't, again, it's very fuzzy because
I was so hormonal and pregnant, but I
don't know that I really looked a lot up
and I did hear about pre-ex expressing
colostrum, but just didn't understand it,
wasn't sure it was possible to be honest.
I was almost surprised when I was able
to breastfeed because it just seems
like, it was not something that I was.
Used to.
So I think knowing about the
education, and why are really,
really valuable tips there.
Now what about, for partners?
Is there anything, again, if partners
are listening or the birth mother is
listening, would like to give their
partner a couple of ideas, anything that
they can themselves know as well, given
that they're not physically breastfeeding.
I strongly encourage partners to attend
any sort of, educational sessions
that the birth mother is going to.
Although, physically, Partner is not
going to be breastfeeding the baby.
You are really the support person
and the cheerleader for mum.
So mum is going to be heavily hormonal
and healing from birth, whether that
be a vaginal or C-section delivery,
and having to breastfeed two babies.
maybe it takes a partner having
a little bit of knowledge as
well to recognize when to call in
professional support or again, to give.
Give a little bit of tips on positioning
and attachment if they've been at that
class and remembered some things for that.
It's gonna be really
handy to do it as a team.
if you are a partnership that's decided
to do mixed feeding, how are you going
to make that work best for both of you?
I don't think it's all about,
or should all be up to mum to
learn about breastfeeding or baby
feeding, because yeah, it really
is both parents' responsibility.
That's, really good.
advocacy mom will be hormonal, physically
recovering, and, the exhaustion,
which I guess both parents will
have, but from the pregnancy stage.
Yep.
So advocacy, stepping in when she,
can't remember, or, perhaps their.
I don't know, too hormonal and if, I
mean, if they can offer tips, fantastic.
I mean, take as much as you
can, but I, I, I love that.
I think playing that like team
again, team role with a person.
they're not full of the hormones, they're
not physically recovering from something.
They can step in, say, Hey, I
remember this, or I saw this.
that's a wonderful idea.
And just being a cheerleader,
carrying, birthing, and feeding
two babies is such an amazing feat.
Just remind your partner
that they are amazing.
sometimes we don't hear it,
and that's really important too.
I think.
Fantastic.
and in our case we did do that
mix where there was expressing
as well as breastfeeding.
So with that, is there a certain
day that need would need to start?
because my understanding is.
if you leave it too late, the
babies cannot take a bottle.
And then it's, it stays with mum,
doing those rounds the whole time.
So is there a certain point that
if they were looking to share, the
breastfeeding, but that should start.
Yeah, look, it's difficult
with twins because they can
be born a little bit earlier.
We're unable to predict exactly what
is going to be happening from birth.
So there's some babies that will be
born and might be fed via a nasogastric
tube for a little while, or might be
fed via syringe for a little while.
There might be some.
Some that are going straight
onto bottles if they're needing
supplementation early on.
in the case where a baby is born, close
to term is healthy, is breastfeeding
well, or babies, in this case two babies,
in the circumstance there's only been
breastfeeding, but the family want to
introduce a bottle for convenience so
that it's not always left up for mum.
I would suggest introducing it
within the first four weeks of birth.
at that stage, babies still have
an involuntary sucking reflex.
So they will suck from a teat
when it's placed in their mouth.
Some babies, if you introduce a
bottle after this point, after
that involuntary sucking reflex has
gone, they can refuse bottle feeds.
And then you find yourself in a situation
that you were talking about where
it's just all left up to mum to be
breastfeeding 24 hours around the clock.
long story short, if.
babies have been exclusively
breastfed from birth.
You would want to be ideally introducing
a bottle before that four week mark.
And I also, in my experience,
I've seen it's a fantastic way for
that partner or support person to
bond as well with the children.
In your experience, would you
say that's sometimes correct?
Mostly correct.
Yep.
That is dependent a lot
on the family's wishes.
So I would
Mm-hmm.
mum's looking to exclusively
breastfeed and that's that
family's goal, there are certainly.
Other things that dad can do to bond,
Mm-hmm.
if he's wanting to be involved in the
feeding and the family's goal is to
have, a, as a true partnership, to do
some bottles, to do some breastfeeding,
then yeah, of course that can be a
lovely time for dad and babies too.
And I think it is all about choice.
It's all about what works for the family.
Some people have got fly
and fly out partners or.
Shift workers and things like that.
So I think it's just finding the best
solution, knowing what your options are,
and then, navigating the best you can.
Yeah.
And what other supports you have?
if you're a single mom expecting
multiples, are you gonna
Mm-hmm.
systems?
Are you going to have other
family members that you'll need
to, be bottle feeding babies?
So, yeah, as you said, completely
dependent on your individual family
situation and what your wishes are.
Okay.
Thank you.
now let's move on.
So the, next, pieces we'll ask you to
talk through, breastfeeding day one, and
the key considerations and milestones,
if you wanted to just guide through an
overview of the main considerations.
After you, hit go.
Yeah, so once your babies are born,
you have colostrum in your breasts that
are ready for your babies from birth.
It's actually there from around week
16 of pregnancy, and that is why
you are able to express colostrum
Wow.
in your pregnancy if
that's what you wish to do.
So.
there and ready as soon
as your babies are born.
And your babies have a really
tiny, tiny tummies and colostrum is
small in volume, but it's a highly
concentrated version of breast milk.
So it's all they need in
the first few days of life.
So we would expect babies that are born at
term, born healthy to have active sucking
reflexes and to feed well from the breast.
up until around day two or three.
All they're needing is colostrum.
If they're not breastfeeding directly,
you could be expressing that colostrum
either by hand or with a breast pump
and giving it to the baby however
they're being fed, whether that be via
a nasogastric tube or via a syringe or.
via a bottle once your milk comes in.
So around day two or three is when
colostrum begins to change to mature milk,
and that's when it rapidly increases in
volume and starts to look a little bit
more like pasteurized cows milk that
we see on the, Supermarket shelves, So
that colostrum, that first milk that's
highly concentrated is often quite thick
and yellowish, and by day two or three,
it's much more abundant in volume.
And that whiter color.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
Fantastic.
So, week 16, it starts getting made.
That's.
Yes.
I had no idea about that,
but good to know it.
It is there for those who
are not sure, like I was.
and then day three, the milk comes in.
I think that's a really good point for
people who don't know that as well as
it does take a few days for them for the
milk to come in if, if that is the result.
Again, depending on your situation,
It
but I think to know
that there's a process.
Yeah.
And that's all to do with your
post birth hormones as well.
So although it's there in your breast
from week 16, your pregnancy hormones are
stopping that milk from really flowing.
Once your babies are born and
their placenta or come out that.
triggers a really big hormonal
shift, and that's what starts the
production of this mature milk.
So it takes around three days for the body
to really recognize that's happening.
In that time, your baby's
just happily having colostrum.
That's all they need.
And then around day three, we
are really looking at that,
that abundant milk volume.
Wow, that's so interesting.
I'm learning a lot today.
okay, great.
And so we didn't touch
on, pumps actually.
So again, with multiples, I don't
know what the global standard is, but
certainly in the hospital I was at,
they put you straight on the pump.
So what.
Is the process there with multiples,
and any kind of tips around that too.
Yeah.
Again, that can depend on the
gestation that your babies are born.
if you are put on a pump straight away,
it's assumed that both babies won't
be feeding effectively or efficiently
from the breast for all feeds.
Look, if you are having your babies 38.
39 weeks, it's possible that they will be
able to feed directly from the breast and
you could skip the pumping altogether.
if for any reason a baby can't have
all their feeds at the breast, that
is why a breast pump is introduced.
Okay?
So we've had that hormonal initiation of
lactation, but by pumping, we're telling
the body, yes, the babies are here.
We need to keep removing milk so
that the body keeps making milk.
generally what would happen is
you would pump within two hours
of your babies being born and
then every three hours after that,
Okay, great.
I'm pretty sure that's
what's happened with me.
Interesting.
so it's not always the case then,
so sometimes the parent might not.
Okay, great.
Well look, that's good to let people
know that they've got a choice there
as well, that, you know, you don't
necessarily have to have to do it.
So something to consider.
Okay.
so mastitis, just quickly, could
we touch on, I guess the causes
and any tips at a high level?
Yeah, so mastitis comes from
inflammation in the breast.
A really common cause in the early days
is oversupply, and when you've got two
babies and they're possibly doing a little
bit of breastfeeding, and you're doing a
little bit of pumping as well, sometimes
the body's thinking, oh my goodness.
How many people or things
am I actually feeding?
I dunno what's happening.
And it goes into an oversupply.
So an oversupply is when you
are actually making more milk
than what your babies need.
that happens, it's more likely
that you're going to get.
Blocked ducts in your breast.
So when that happens, you get
inflammation in the breast tissue.
If that inflammation isn't
treated correctly or promptly
enough, it can lead to mastitis.
The easiest way to really avoid getting
mastitis is just having frequent
milk removal without overstimulation,
which sounds simple in a sentence.
like I said, when you've got two babies
and you've possibly got them on the
breast sometimes and on the pump at
other times, it can be easy to get
that out of balance a little bit too.
but I think what's really important
to know, which I find a lot
of people don't know, is that
mastitis doesn't always have to.
Be treated with antibiotics.
So first and foremost, we treat it
conservatively at home, and that
is just making sure the breasts are
being emptied frequently, without the
overstimulation of pumping if it's not
needed, using a little bit of cool on
the breast after feeding or pumping
because we're treating inflammation.
And
Mm-hmm.
anti-inflammatories, that's
usually enough to stop it
developing into an infection and
needing the use of antibiotics.
Fantastic.
Really good tips.
And so a bit of cooling on the,
the bus is what you said, right.
So, okay.
So a bit like a bruise.
Keep the inflammation down.
ankle rest, ice, and anti-inflammatories.
That makes it sound so simple.
I, I haven't had it, but it, it
always seemed a bit of a mystery
to me, so it's good to hear.
with all five and it was not fun.
Yeah.
I have heard.
Yeah, it's not good.
Okay.
love to hear from you as well.
Top tips or products that you found
were fantastic through any of your
pregnancies, and then obviously
specific to your multiple, pregnancy
and having children as well.
Yeah, not product in particular.
Actually, I really like to
recommend saving on product and
using that money on services
instead, support services.
instead of going out and buying a
breastfeeding pillow in your pregnancy,
I would so much rather you spend that
on prenatal breastfeeding education.
you really don't know.
with the breastfeeding pillow,
whether it's going to suit your body.
They're different on different
on different torsos You don't
know what, which position you're
going to be comfortable in.
I would experiment with pillows from home.
I mean, I'm saying this from
experience myself, I did.
the gadgets for the twins and the
expensive fancy pillows and I ended
up just using the pillow off my bed.
So, but yeah,
All right.
about saving on products
and using it in other ways.
Or even if it's investing in
something like a postpartum
doula after the babies are born.
if you don't have a lot of
family support, really I.
Believe there's a lot more
value in those types of things
than in particular products.
That's great.
And maybe that's again, a good hack for
people if they're looking to get gifts
or high teas or whatever it is that
people do to celebrate becoming parents.
Perhaps it's, requesting a voucher for
services booking or something like that.
I haven't heard that, that as a idea yet.
okay.
Let's, keep on going and just
quickly, so a doula is a person that.
Helps and birth do you have a
better, description as to who a
doula is for those that don't need?
focuses on care of the
mother after giving birth, so
Mm-hmm.
mother while she's caring for her babies.
Got it.
Okay.
Excellent.
now, on the topic of when to finish
breastfeeding and weaning, is there
a time, any general guidance on,
look, there's
what's.
from various health authorities.
So the World Health Organization recommend
breastfeeding for two years and beyond,
and then a little more locally, we're
guided by the National Health and Medical
Research Center of Australia, and they re.
months and beyond.
And look, the and beyond just means for
as long as a mom and baby want to continue
breastfeeding, there's no upper limit.
but 12 months is, the
basic recommendation.
they also both recommend exclusive
breastfeeding for the first six
months, but I also just like to
remind parents that, if you're
not able to exclusively breastfeed.
Any breast milk that you are able
to offer your babies is beneficial.
So if your journey looks like using
a little bit of breast milk and some
formula, or direct breastfeeding
and pumping, that is absolutely fine.
That's not taking away from
the benefits of breastfeeding.
just try not to get hung up
on that exclusivity word.
like I said, any amount that you are
able to offer your babies is actually
beneficial for their lifelong health.
That's great.
words of wisdom there.
And I think that there is so much advice
about what people should or shouldn't do.
And again, I think hearing you
mention that everyone's got their own
scenario and, do your best, which
is if you've, if your milk comes
in, try and get as much as you can.
but at the end of the day, you know
it's working with your situation.
And as long as a baby's healthy,
At
know, that's.
That's
you
the main goal.
you have carried, you have birthed,
and you are raising two babies.
it's, it's incomparable
to raising a singleton.
I've done it.
and so, yeah, I agree
with you so much, Emily.
You are doing your best.
and you always just have to do what
works best for you and your family.
Yeah, absolutely.
And I think in my, again, this is coming
from my twin friends that I've spoken to.
there can be a lot of grief as well
around if you can breastfeed, if
you can breastfeed exclusively,
if that's what you wanted.
We had some people that's.
What they want to do.
They just, they felt a lot of pressure and
they felt like that was the right thing.
That's what they wanted to do.
And that can, have its challenges.
So being kind to yourself.
And then also, if you do need to do
mixed feeding, get the best advice
from doctors, professionals, et cetera.
But at the end of the day,
You are doing your best.
I'd say I don't think there's many
parents out there that aren't doing
their best and trying to not feel guilty.
I'm sure Emily, you come across,
mothers that perhaps feel upset if
they're not able to achieve the goal.
They're hopeful.
I do, and breastfeeding grief is
a very real and valid emotion.
even actually a book about healing,
breastfeeding grief that I recommend
have recommended to families, which
is a really logical explanation of
why you would expect to be able to
breastfeed your babies and why you
are now feeling these emotions at not
being able to meet those expectations.
And it's just a fantastic read
for anyone who's experiencing
those emotions, um, to understand
why and how to move on from them.
Yeah, and I heard there's a
hormonal change as well, isn't it?
After you finish
breastfeeding, if you started,
is.
Yeah, even if you've had a really
successful breastfeeding journey and
you've met your breastfeeding goals,
it's normal to feel, quite a sudden
mood shift when you do completely wean.
And again, that is hormonally
related, so having an
Mm-hmm.
of that can help you move
through those feelings.
But just, yeah, understanding
that it's normal.
Yeah.
great advice.
What do you wish that most, breastfeeding
mothers knew that they normally don't?
I think a lot of mums really expect or
think that breastfeeding should come
naturally, but what they don't understand
is that it's actually a learned skill.
So it is the first time.
If this is your first pregnancy,
it's the first time that you
are gonna breastfeed, but it's.
Also the first time that your
babies are gonna breastfeed as well.
So it can be like a little dance
that you have to learn together.
Sometimes someone might mess up the steps
and that's okay, but it can take a lot
of practice, really for breastfeeding
to feel comfortable and natural.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
That's a really, good call out.
Okay.
So we're gonna do, a quick wrap
up in terms of what you've covered.
we've talked about who
you are and your story.
Such an amazing story.
I think it'll be really inspiration.
preparing to breastfeed for birth
mothers, partners, or support people.
Breastfeeding the different
phases and talked about pumping.
We talked about your top
recommendation, which is services,
so everybody note that down.
And you have a wonderful course
as well, which I will link
at the end of the episode.
for those who can do online consultations
and then we also talked about the
mindset expectations and what we
wish, mothers knew or families knew.
Any final comments before we wrap up?
Uh, no.
I mean, just good luck to you
if you're like expecting twins.
It's magical.
It's special.
The world is so fascinated by
twins and They are fascinating.
I've just loved being a twin mom.
And yeah, good luck to
you if you're listening.
Thank you so much, Emily.
It's been great having you on.
Thanks for having me.