Matt Womack

Show Notes

The Interface Podcast Crew talks to Matthew Womack, Senior Cloud Engineer at IBM.  He shares his transition from COBOL to a data analyst role to user experience to cloud engineer.  He also shared some of his favorite meals to have around Chicago.  

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Interface is a podcast where we connect technology and culture through conversation. Interface is brought to you by EMPOWER at PROS. EMPOWER is dedicated to attracting, developing and retaining Black talent at PROS. PROS helps people and companies outperform by enabling smarter selling in the digital economy.

Matthew Womack
[00:00:00]
[00:00:00] Jennifer: Welcome to interface a podcast. We connect technology and culture through conversation. Interface is brought to you by empower. At pros. Empower is dedicated to attracting, developing, and retaining black talent pros. Pros helps people and companies outperform by enabling smarter selling and the digital economy.
I'm your host, Jennifer plumber also known as Jenny and today I'm my co-hosts are stear barns and Matthew, you know, I never spent your last day. I'm not loud.
[00:00:37] Mattiecakes: You're supposed to roll the R I can't do that. I can't do the art
side note.
Our guest today is Matthew Womack. I pronounce your last name correctly.
[00:00:59] Matthew Womack: Sounds good. [00:01:00]
[00:01:01] Jennifer: Uh, who's a senior cloud engineer at IBM. Thank you so much for joining us today. Of
[00:01:08] Matthew Womack: course. It's good to be here. Yeah.
[00:01:13] Siara: We'll just get into it. I guess I didn't, I didn't work on my transitions, but you know, we'll work on it.
Uh, thank you for joining us. Uh, how did you get interested in technology? How did you kind of get to this career? You know, what's your origin story? Yeah. Give us your background.
[00:01:31] Matthew Womack: Oh, I'll be happy to share that. You know, like, um, I would say on paper. So for me, I think I look, I feel like on paper, I look like maybe at the time, what was considered, um, uh, mostly traditional.
[00:01:45] Mattiecakes: Person that would get to technology. So from childhood, it's been very fortunate enough for my parents to be able to, for like, um, I think their first computer was something of, it was like an apple two E clone, [00:02:00] um, and, um, being able to have that in the household and be exposed to that. So that's, I understand that that's something that's like a blessing for me.
Um, but just always about, you know, I love video games. I still do, um, 40 plus and I still play video games. So that's something that kind of, I think I could attribute to getting me started my technology journey. So being in the household being fortunate enough to be exposed to technology. I think I have to give a big piece of that, um, to how I got my start and then our respond myself, even in high school where there's electives taking the programming class or, um, and then when it got to college, I just knew I was going to be a computer science student.
So I'm glad to actually say that. Um, before I go to further, um, like nutritional way of getting into technology, I would say that the barriers were definitely a lot higher. So it's [00:03:00] like four-year degree, you know, getting through this four year plus curriculum of, of stuff to be able to then interview at places and to, you know, get your career going.
So that was like the path that I took. I went attended Loyola university and I, um, earned a BS in computer science. One of the things. And so like for, for, for a long time to get into like a Microsoft or places or United IBM, it's like, if you didn't have a college degree that, I mean, you know, your resume would just get tossed to the side.
I guess we can get into that a little bit later. I'm so glad that that is no longer the case. And, um, but, um, computer science degree, I graduated. Um, my first job was at a credit girl called, um, TransUnion. And so I just right away, that was interested in my first [00:04:00] job. I basically was exposed to technologies that I didn't touch or even know anything about.
Like my first job actually was in what we call today, legacy systems. And so I was supporting an application that ran on the IBM. And we use, like, I know some audience may be familiar with this. It's like a COBOL programming and DB, two companies still use that. And this was years ago.
[00:04:26] Jennifer: I used to work at a water company that had an ASMR 400 with COBOL programmers.
[00:04:31] Matthew Womack: Yup. Yeah. I wish I stuck with it because those folks are making a fortune now. Yeah. There's like, I think the thing that I would like to touch on is that, um, and I forgive me about jumping around too much because I feel like there's so much. And please go, please rein me in before.
[00:04:51] Mattiecakes: I find that even when my very first job day, one of my very first job out of school, I found myself being put to situations that were completely brand new to me. [00:05:00] So even though I have this piece of paper sign that, you know, I did just enough in school to get earnest degree here, I am kind of back to square one.
It's just, you're sort of in school, but this time I'm getting paid for it. The
[00:05:13] Jennifer: internships, while you were an undergrad,
[00:05:15] Mattiecakes: I did actually a reason that I actually had an internship at Walgreens, the Walgreens corporate headquarters. I definitely encourage people. Internships are so key and crucial to getting your foot in the door, have networking experience because there's so many things that like school just don't teach.
And I find that like going into, like, for me of, at the time, Walgreens are still moving away from. People will wear suits and ties every day. Like them relaxing, their dress code was I could wear a shirt and a time
for me earning a paycheck, but then like go to work and kind of seeing like, here's exactly what it would be like. Um, really quickly what I did at Walgreens internship, the cash registers are [00:06:00] essentially a computer. Well, back then they were like their computers. And, um, the group that I was in was called.
Stores systems or the point of sale store systems. So my mentor was the guy when people will walk into Walgreens. Um, and in fact, I think this program might still be in effect to this day. You could walk into Walgreens and buy cigarettes. It says like, you know, if you're, um, you have to be, what does it say?
Like there's a little bit of a prompt that says, were you born on a certain day or something like that. And then the person that was my mentor was the person that worked on that thing. So the cool thing about, um, ups avenue Walgreens was that you could kind of see the stuff you work on in the wild. You can go to Walgreens and be like, oh, the guy that was my mentor literally is working on that.
And it's like all over the world, I just all over the country. So I really enjoyed that. It was really cool to kind of be able to do something at work and then see it live. Like when you go [00:07:00] home or your way you stopped into the wall. Yeah.
[00:07:02] Jennifer: It's also easier to explain to your family what you do.
[00:07:07] Matthew Womack: Isn't that something, when it comes to it, like I have brothers, my brother is a physician of a, um, like a sales rep guy.
And like, you know, when it comes to it, it's like, oh man, he does something with computers. I'm like, okay,
the doctor,
I have people like, can you help me with this? All the windows 98?
[00:07:34] Jennifer: No, not really.
[00:07:39] Matthew Womack: That's an interesting thing, you know, so I
[00:07:42] Siara: think that's interesting in the tech industry, probably a lot of people. That experience. Okay. So what exactly do you do every day? And then you got to figure out a very concise way of explaining during the day and you produce this. [00:08:00]
[00:08:00] Matthew Womack: That's something I kind struggle with, even in my current role, it's like, um, just to kind of give it to people in a way where it's like, oh, that's what it is.
I sort of, I work in that delivery too. Like what would be my 32nd elevator pitch it though? Um, and with the internship I did do that. So another thing I would like to highlight is that on addition to having a traditional sort of technology education and experience, I did attend a bootcamp. I made the choice to attend the bootcamp, and this is Matt talking grants.
[00:08:37] Mattiecakes: I'm a huge bootcamp fan. I, so in a way, like I've sat next to people who. You know, and to start the bootcamp, they were like, I use computer, you know, by the end of the bootcamp, they're doing super slick applications and we're talking a matter of like, I'm going to do one full time for, uh, three [00:09:00] months. And, um, I, it's definitely in the long story short, uh, you know, boot camps are all about what you put into it.
It can be challenging and it's not for everybody, but for me, the type of learner that I am, I think one thing I have to understand for myself in that definitely get in touch with like, what do I need to be successful? Um, I really admire the people that are like, I just decided to go to work in Google by the end of the year.
So I'm just gonna sit down and go to Starbucks and study eight hours a day. And there's people that can do that in effect. Um, I've come across a Facebook group where, um, I think a number of people are self-taught and that is incredible. I wish I had that discipline. Uh, but for me, I find that, um, in that same group has also stated that, um, I, you showed me the roadmap of how to learn.
I got it from there. So for me, the [00:10:00] bootcamp experience was I got to sit next to people that had all kinds of different experiences. I think there's an interesting bit of learning that comes from this person is looking at this stuff for the first time with eyes, fresh eyes for me, you know, by the time I got to my bootcamp, I've had 15 years of experience.
I've been at four or five jobs in my head. I had an idea of what I thought would about web development was, but to sit next to a person who could look at something with fresh eyes actually learned from that. So interesting. And actually for me, bootcamps, you get, um, you know, the support for jobs. Um, and then it's like, And I really don't like this, but it's sort of like, you know, I think jobs, you know, they, they it's like, well, you know, what were you doing for the last three months I was working.
These projects are kind of shows that you're kind of doing something. And then the networking for me, [00:11:00] like I literally got my very first job after, uh, out of bootcamp because I was good friends with a woman whose husband worked at my employer at the time where, um, which is like SIM your resume. And three weeks later I had offer and even just after one bootcamp finished.
So the networking piece, um, collaborative learning. Yeah. I thought that was just really valuable. So yeah, I'm um, I, I admire folks who can just pick up a book and run with it. You know, you have to know what your learning style is. Um, for me. Bootcamps Kim can, and then not all boot camps are credit equal to, so I think you have to definitely kind of vet them.
I think one thing to push back, if a person's interested in a bootcamp interview them, it's like, how do you prepare people to continue learning after the conclusion of the bootcamp? If whoever's running the program can give a good, answer that to your [00:12:00] satisfaction of, okay, they're going to give me the tools to not just learn the stuff, but what's the model for me to continue my growth and development.
I think that might be good. One to consider.
[00:12:09] Jennifer: Yeah. And I noticed your bootcamp is affiliated with a university as well. What should I think? That's the first one I've seen.
[00:12:17] Matthew Womack: It was, yeah. So like I'm home overall. Like the umbrella company is Trojan network. And then my local affiliate of that in Illinois, Chicago was a Northwestern university.
[00:12:28] Mattiecakes: And so I think, um, that did a couple of things for me. So Northwestern is a pretty prestigious school. And so by going to the Northwestern university boot camp, that sort of, so for me, like my choice of the bootcamp was strategic in that sense and that, um, you know, essentially like the bootcamp was in person at the time and it was on Northwestern's university, um, downtown campus.
And so I [00:13:00] think the university sort of gave some support in that regard in terms of having a space and all that. And it was easy to get to, but also I feel like to me, just like, it kind of opened up, it was just like, I would say that I would say that it would kind of opened up a little bit of a door, you know, in regards to like, if, if I'm, you know, I'm trying to get into the minds of recruiters.
I mean, you know, maybe if the audience, or if any of you guys have experience with like, you know, if a group of recruiters have number of resume, will what, what would they think of that? Yeah,
[00:13:33] Jennifer: it definitely stands out. Right. I mean, th that's a big name
[00:13:39] Matthew Womack: for someone with a computer science degree and the experience as what were the influences that made you want to do a bootcamp?
You know, um, one thing I recognized that actually my degree had sort of aged a bit. And so like for instance, my first class, my loony first class in undergrad was, um, learning, um, [00:14:00] Pascal, which is really not language that exists in the wow. It's almost like language that exists just to teach people how to do procedural programming.
But then having said that technology moves so fast. Like by the time I graduated sort of the first introductory course at my same university was Java. And so if you can imagine a person who's being exposed to object oriented programming, and then, you know, look at how Java was everywhere today. So it's like, just in the span of like couple of years, for me starting in 1994 to somebody starting a little bit later in the same program at the same university, it's like, it, things have changed so fast.
So even recognizing sort of where I got to my career, I had sort of went down this legacy COBOL mainframe later on, I kind of got exposed to, um, like Linux distributed systems, but a lot of it was still like I'm getting jobs and the strength of the stuff I did before, which was sort of like [00:15:00] an older, big enterprise.
Um, there's a machine literally like in TransUnion, for instance, we had a mate there literally mainframes in the building, like on premises, but people getting paid no good money to watch and monitor and deal with these things. 24 7. Um, so for me, I felt like I got to a point in my career where I wanted a kind of fresh star.
Um, and I want it to. And this skillset for me, it's like, okay, I want to add the skill set. And it wrote some short period of time. Um, I generally familiar with technology, but I felt like I needed some support in getting to that sort of in a way my, like my, my career moderates, that modernization journey.
So that was sort of my thought behind it. And were you working at the time? I wasn't actually. Um, that's another thing too. I like to touch on actually had some really interesting career decisions that I look back and be like, I wonder if it was a good [00:16:00] idea. I actually quit my job in 2014 X, so I landed at TransUnion twice.
My second time at TransUnion. There's some lessons I would like to kind of share that. Um, it's like, don't do what I did. Um, I was in a group when I first landed at TransUnion policy. My second time, when I got to trench. I really enjoyed what I was doing because it was, I was essentially like a data analyst.
I worked in the analytics division and my job was to take the data from our systems and put it in a format, such that my colleagues, where there's my manager, who was an economist, they can consume it and do something with it. And so they're looking at credit data that was the personalized, and then doing things with it, to understand what the markets are doing.
And at the time like student loans are getting well, there's some are super crazy now, but like, you know, do the presence of student [00:17:00] loans impacted, um, does it connect, indicate, you know, how people pay their bills and all kinds of really interesting questions. So what we're trying to make my career got to a point where, um, apartments change, people were moving around and then my position was eliminated.
And so at the time I had the option to take a package and move into a group. I would have be my first choice, but I thought, oh, well, we keep the salary is not what I want to do, but I can kind of stay there and try to figure it out. And at the time I was actually in grad school as well for, um, a user experience thing at the call that I completed while I was at the TransUnion.
I feel like though, that might've been a mistake looking back. And what I mean by that is it just, wasn't what I wanted to do, honestly. So I try to squid fit like a, a square peg in a round hole for myself. And I just wasn't successful in that role. And I frankly struggled with it, [00:18:00] but then I was afraid of, oh, well I don't have a job.
What am I going to do? I would say looking back, sometimes things can be blessings that present themselves. And it's just like to lean into that. And then the efforts. So at the time the timing was really eerily strange. I had just finished my grad school degree. Um, my job was technically eliminated, so I would have been released from the job, but then I would have had enough of severance money to survive, you know, for some months, and to maybe move into like my sort of user experience kind of degree, um, career that I, I just finished.
I was scared. I was scared. I was like, oh, I can't not have a paycheck. And you know, all this stuff. And I decided to take this sort of transition and it just, it was kinda tough. And then I thought, well, I have this. So I, I tried, I struggled on that for about a year and I did move away from the job. I thought, you know what, in order for me to really step out, [00:19:00] I'm going to actually leave the job because this is not working for me.
There, there was a little bit of me being in the wilderness. So, and I'm telling you I'm at this point late thirties, you know, I'm not a spring chicken. So it was like BS, computer science, masters, and, you know, human computer interaction. I'm like, I don't have a job. What the hell? What am I doing? Oh, what the heck?
[00:19:24] Jennifer: I think we can be PG 13 here.
[00:19:29] Matthew Womack: And I say this, like, what am I do it? And so for me, like, um, I had some, a little bit of really interesting experiences of being involved in like some side projects and then working with some friends on some things, but I sort of sort of languished in this sort of middle space of not being employed, uh, Medicare to me.
Um, I think I went to a job fair and then someone I ran across, it was like, oh, what's your bootcamp. And then that sort of, kind of sparks the idea for me to be like, I can modernize my career, [00:20:00] give this a try. I think this could give me the boost that.
[00:20:05] Siara: I love that. Um, you were, you know, self-aware enough to say, you know, even though this, this thing that I actually liked is unfortunately ending, I could move on to this thing, but I know that I'm not going to enjoy, you know, I think in our culture, it's very hard to take that risk.
Like you said, what's my mom gonna think about me? How am I not? You know, how am I going to survive without a job? And, you know, I think teaching younger people the skills of how to, you know, make sure that you're a saving for a rainy day so that you're more comfortable with taking the risks and not being in a job that you know, that you're not going to be happy with.
And then second fold also recognizing that I have to constantly be a student, you know, being a lifelong student, [00:21:00] You've got to learn new skills. You got to stay up with the times. You cannot just stay in this role and knowledge have is the same for the next 15, 20 years. And again, taking a risk and say, this is going to take me more time to, you know, take this class or do a bootcamp, or what have you.
Um, and really kind of diversifying, I guess, your personal portfolio, you can say to, you know, I have my traditional, but I need to learn these other things to make myself more marketable and more valuable so that I can, there are so many avenues that I can take now that I'll probably never be without a job.
[00:21:42] Matthew Womack: I tell you, I think you can end the podcast right here.
This was church. I'd be around the collection plate. That's it? I mean, I think that the thing, if anything, lifelong, lifelong. And if I got to [00:22:00] go to do another bootcamp or Korea, or at this point, I think I feel like enough. I can kind of do self learning, but, um, if a book I feel I could get some value out of a bootcamp, I'll do another one.
Um, you know, that's kind of learner. I am. That is exactly it. Yeah.
[00:22:13] Jennifer: I can guarantee you another 10 years, there'll be a new set of things. That's the thing. And you have to learn it.
[00:22:21] Matthew Womack: Things are changing so fast. I mean, even it's stunning, like I just, you know, with cryptocurrency and blockchain and jeez artificial intelligence, and even the stuff that I'm wearing at work, like I'm stunned, you know, working in technology, reading this stuff for fun.
And I'm like, whoa, my mind blown all the time. And I work in this stuff. So it's like, things are moving so fast, but yes, you're so perfect. I mean, I, yeah,
[00:22:49] Siara: I mean, I'm in that boat right now, trying to self, teach myself some new skills. So. I can learn this new thing and again, be more marketable, just adding more [00:23:00] things that you're good at so that you can say I'll probably never be without a job.
I know how to do this, this and this.
[00:23:07] Matthew Womack: Absolutely, absolutely. I'm telling you that's it. And I felt like the, um, what I'm really excited to get to is that it gives the mind my little pivot, like the barrier to learning while technology so low. It's really like if you have the time and the inclination, you know, there's so many people I follow on Twitter.
Like I'm so inspired by young people, particularly, um, this number of young black women that are just like, I'm just so in awe of them, because like, um, you know, like, oh gosh, there's one young lady. Um, I believe she's self taught and it's just like, you know, she has active, she's very active in contributing to dislike.
Um, just this, like the, the, the black tech Twitter of just her experiences. Um, she has quite a following. You know, I mean, there's so many gases, just something of some names, but, um, it's just, I, [00:24:00] I'm so glad to see, especially younger people kind of like shining the way, um, for people to kind of figure out like how to get into technology.
In fact, um, even at the moment there is, um, Afro tech, 20, 21 happening, and that was one of the links I wanted to share and talk about. There is a cost to that, but the one thing I Holland in this, there's a submit resume button at the top of the actual check. So for people who, you know, if you're not able to attend it at all, I don't know exactly what happens when you submit the resume.
But like in terms of the current stance, like I'm a big fan of free code. My apologies, the fuck I'm jumping around. But in terms of lowering the barriers, the free free code camp, Chris, like, you know, free, I literally tell people who are like, oh, I think I'm interested in. I got free code camp.com go free.
You know, when you look at the page of like, I got a job at Amazon and [00:25:00] it's a curriculum that goes from here's how you do your first front end web page to then data structures, machine learning, Python programming. It's like you get, you go through these. Um, and it's all free living. It's free, it's free code camp.
It's free now of course you give your time and you do have to kind of work and study, but it's a really well done site where you can do on your iPad. It looks like, you know, you can, it's like web based. So you can literally on your, even on your phone, I guess, like I haven't tried it on my phone, but I'm sure it would work.
And there are people getting jobs at Amazon and Google offer this free code camp. And if people can understand like what that means, like, you know, these places typically paid pretty well. So we're talking like, you know, folks who are like, oh, You know, a server or, you know, an unemployed. And now I have a job that we're not just talking to you, earning a living.
We're talking like, especially for us, like black [00:26:00] people, you're changing the destiny of your family's legacy
[00:26:04] Jennifer: money. Yeah.
[00:26:06] Mattiecakes: That's the first resource that comes up for like learn programming on Reddit. And just to clarify for the audience and whoever's listening, it's free code camp.org. If you want to visit it,
[00:26:18] Matthew Womack: I definitely encourage people and there are other, um, platforms.
Thank you, Matthew. And then on YouTube, you will,
[00:26:25] Siara: oh, I call it used to give university. You can learn anything
[00:26:31] Matthew Womack: literally, if you're at a back-to-back and somehow could get magically get paid to watch YouTube. There's so much content with free code camp that, or, or people walking you through. Oh gosh, you name it.
Artificial intelligence. How to do certain types of. Um, automations with Python or learning front ends or learning about flask or you name it react. How do you know get started with three act? I'm literally going from turn the computer on to you have this thing deployed [00:27:00] somewhere. That's a react thing that you can add to your portfolio that then, you know, as you do that, you can understand it better, then it's just, yeah.
So, you know, and I'm not paid or sponsored or anything cold camp. I just find that for me. That's the one thing that I've seen that, um, it's just a matter of donating your time to it and then, you know, open
doors for you.
[00:27:21] Jennifer: So, um, cause you mentioned you have people from different backgrounds. You have, you have more experience in the technology field.
[00:27:30] Siara: Did the. Prepare you for the interview process and like what kind of questions would be asked in an interview process?
[00:27:37] Matthew Womack: It did absolutely. Like, I, I do remember us having maybe like a mock kind of, sort of experience where it's sort of going through, um, kind of practicing, like walking through like say, like get help for instance.
Um, also just like, what are some questions that they can ask? Like for me, I was a little lucky in a way that I've sort of had technical interviews before. So even though like, I feel like [00:28:00] in this, it was, for me it was similar, but yet different, but similar, if that makes any sense, but I wouldn't say that for folks who were completely new to technology, um, a good bootcamp will prepare people.
That's actually a really big part of it in addition to, um, the support services and getting help with people's resumes, mock interviews, um, having people get in front of folks and then pitch. Project or things like that. So a good, a bootcamp should have those resources that can help people get more comfortable with that technology.
Um, those interviews can be they're nerve wracking. They are
[00:28:40] Jennifer: big on the other side, and I'm not like we're doing some intern I'm interviewing right now. And I try to make them feel comfortable because I mean, it's very nerve wracking because you're basically like here's a program. Prompt, please code it.
Get your Sensex. [00:29:00]
[00:29:00] Matthew Womack: Yes, that's it. As a person. Who's trying to remember, um, like a good and a good for me. Like I've been in good ones where I didn't get the job, but it felt more like a conversation. It's almost like you're, you're working with friend on something. So like for those where it feels like a conversation and you're sort of showing how you work and then you're also leaning in, on your own experience and being like, you know, I'm trying to remember.
I know here's what I want to do. So it talking out loud, um,
[00:29:34] Jennifer: you got to differentiate, so it's kind of, and I've had discussion with people, like, should we be giving people these challenges or should we ask them to code on site? I'm still kind of old school. I'm still kind of like, no, we should ask, but you don't have to know the answer. You just talk it through, relax.
Like I tried my best. Let's it we're going to get through that. It's just, you know, what's step one or what do you think is the first thing you need to do and, you know, [00:30:00] talk them through if they get stuck and then just kind of giving, I like to get feedback, like, okay, so you were a little rough around this.
Maybe you need to learn the collections framework and job a little more. You don't see very comfortable with it. It's something like
[00:30:12] Matthew Womack: that. So this is an issue that is so invaluable for people to get that feedback, because I know so many times, I think some of the critiques that I've heard about people and interviewing and experiences is, you know, where did I go wrong?
What, what, what was something that needed to work on? And then you reach out, oh, thank you for the interview. It's just something that could have done better. And it's like, you know, when there's like, you don't get that feedback. It's that people don't know how to like, you know, obviously that report card so that you can know where to course correct.
Um, and then one of the things I read on Twitter, it was so powerful. It was a question that stated, um, asked how did it go? Oh gosh, I'm going to paraphrase it. But it's like at the end of the interview, a person could use this. Um, is there anything in my resume that is [00:31:00] not present that gives you pause or something like that?
I've heard that one. You got, I feel like that one's a hard one to ask though at the moment. Absolutely. So it's like kind of opening up the door to like, you know, is there something that is not there or over it, or I guess it'd be a book that's not there and then it kind of helps cause then it could be, um, here's another thing too, that would like to kind of talk about super quick.
I think my last job was like, almost like when I think about how everything kind of fell into place for me to end up at IBM, it's almost like a heist movie where things kind of magically fall into place and I'm disliked, you know, all of these things that seem to be unrelated. You know, but then it ended up being, it was this very perfect things that enabled me to kind of get to this new experience when I first started and also like who you are as a person, how you carry yourself can really have impact [00:32:00] across even your career.
Um, when I was interviewing for the job that I was referred to by my, um, bootcamp friend whose husband worked at the place that I have formerly worked at, I was working with HR recruiter. She was like, wow, that guy is so nice. He was so nice. So before I stepped foot in there, I was known as nice man. I was the nice guy, so nice.
And so I, um, so the, when I had my interview that, uh, my friend's husband who was there, who's basically walking through an interview. I mean, I, I still have to do my code and stuff. I had still had to do the. Well, I nailed all that. I did mess up on the react part, but by that point I did get some of the things I need to get done.
Right. But everybody was like, they really wanted me to succeed. I'm a nice guy. I had the connection. I was kind of at that point, friends of mine now to long story short. So they were like, Hey, you're such a nice guy. There's a woman here who has this. Um, it's like a lunch and learn series. [00:33:00] You guys should work together to, you know, she's a little helped with just pulling that together and talking to people across the company is a good way to meet people.
So like, why did you learn? Well, I'm trying to get my foot, you know, hold on this job. But I guess, you know, I mean, it's not going to hurt anything. Right. So I became friends with this lady and then I got comfortable with speaking in front of people. I'm reading people across the company. And so that was something that was doing.
So this was outside of my job description. I didn't have to. Yeah, things that I became and I liked to do that. And I was meeting people and then something that people who were at was that my job for, for many more years, they're like, well, how do you know that person? So I met him at lunch. And so I did all that.
I think that kind of led to some really interesting opportunities. So then when I was interviewing for IBM, w the first thing, um, my interview asked me, he's like, oh, tell me about this lunch and learn thing. And as it turns out, presenting in front of people [00:34:00] reaching across the organization, there were, I talked about that almost more than my technical stuff, as it turns out like that really was a big part of what got me pulled into my current role.
Um, another thing too, um, in my job, things were changing quickly at, at my last company. And it ended up that I ended up in this operations role. So kind of lean back on you remember? I was like, oh, this operations thing, you know, here we go again, I'm doing something I'm not crazy about. But then I saw the value in that, like, um, you know, I had a colleague where he was like, I want to do operations.
I want to be a colder. I'm going to push stuff out. Um, okay. I'm going. I kind of thought back to my TransUnion days, I was like, oh, but the one thing that I saw that was really variable for me, that I did sort of get that engagement back was that I was going to be exposed to cloud technology. So Azure, it was like, well, okay.
I like that. It's something that I could take with me. So that was important piece for me to like the thing I would say that was [00:35:00] different from my prior experience was that was like, I got that experience at the, um, at trend union was more like, you're sort of in this place of like, I didn't quite see the future.
I saw a future in like understanding how Azure works and cloud technologies and transitioning things into Azure and being comfortable with that and maybe getting a certification in that such. And so all of those things kind of came together to, for me to end up in my current role, which, um,
[00:35:34] Jennifer: so what are you doing in your current role?
[00:35:36] Matthew Womack: Sure. As, uh, and it's interesting as a senior cloud engineer. So I got a quick little thing about my, um, how the senior came up. Essentially. I work in a group called client in engineering and our goal is to help our clients take their sort of traditional it workloads and get, and modernize them into like a cloud environment.
So [00:36:00] it's like, you know, moving things into, um, we have a product called. That is a, um, a flavor of a technology called Kubernetes where it's, um, it's all about ticking, um, applications and putting them, you know, instead of it running on a computer in a basement, somewhere like on premises, it's a flavor of a distributed platform where you could run it anywhere.
IBM has their own cloud service, but you can run your, um, stuff in Amazon or Azure. So one of the selling points of IBM misses open hybrid cloud vendor lock-in is something that like, as, you know, scares CTOs and lactic leadership. So we're saying, you know, what, run your stuff where we want to run it, but we have services and things.
Deliver value to you, wherever your stuff is, and you don't have to transition, transitioning things and modernizing. It can be big, scary, difficult, um, expensive things to do. And so I did is by leveraging [00:37:00] open-source technology and leveraging ways to deliver value, no matter where it lives, whether it's on premises or they call it edge computing, close to where the application is or wherever.
So we're all about helping our clients to accelerate their transformation journey is from the old way of doing things to this newer fresher, distributed, you know, happy place of having things run in the cloud. So that's like the, the main, main, main thing. And, um, we're split up across different sort of like we tend to have clients that are in certain parts of the country.
So as things opened up and it's safer to travel, there's an idea that we'll be kind of going through our clients if they need a ride. Did I answer that. Okay. Does that make sense? It makes
[00:37:48] Jennifer: sense to me,
[00:37:52] Siara: I'm the culture nut on, on this little I'm like, yes. All of that sounds great. [00:38:00]
[00:38:00] Matthew Womack: What has been, it's been good though, like, um, you know, I really appreciate it.
[00:38:03] Mattiecakes: I opinion, like in the way that for instance, my managers manager is, um, an African-American fellow based out of Atlanta. So for the first time in my career, I report up to a man that looks like me, you know, in a technology role. So it took me only like a bunch of years to get to have that. So that's what I appreciate about IBM is, uh, it's a huge company, many people across all around the world.
But when I jumped on my calls, there's like, I would say another thing about my, you know, I've always been the only black person, I would say 99% of the time, but I see people that look like me across the organization and that's really. Um, so that's my Mondo. I got my IBM sort of lag. I'm kind of waving great place to work.
I know it's not as, it's not a Google or Amazon, but
[00:38:56] Jennifer: yeah. So I got my start at IBM. And so maybe we can [00:39:00] transition to the question about what companies should do. So when I was finishing up undergrad, I think I went to a career fair. It may have been NSBE conference. Um, national society of black engineers talked to IBM.
They invited a bunch of rep, you know, I think it was blacks and Hispanics to Atlanta. Um, and we were there for a weekend where they just kind of told us about IBM, there was some mixer. They actually had us take like a logical test. And, um, they were the ones when they got my test results. Cause I was a math major.
I wasn't really as computer science minor, but I wasn't really thinking, I want to go be a programmer. I was a senior, like, I dunno what I'm gonna do. And they were like, oh, based on your test results, you might actually, you know, we think you'd be really good at this. I was like, oh, that's someone who I didn't code until I took my first programming class in [00:40:00] undergrad.
So, you know, they invested the time into that. And I think, um, and when I ultimately went to work there, there was lots of faces that looked like me, you know? And, um, that was an excellent experience. So that was in the nineties. And that was 1998. So today, what, what, what do you think companies could do? Is there other programs that IBM is doing that you think other companies could duplicate?
[00:40:29] Matthew Womack: Absolutely. Like currently they have something called the summit program and that is really a great sort of like kind of school. Corporate kind of pipeline of making a space for people. Um, certainly like, you know, people of color, um, older effect who, um, he is such a loss of job during the pandemic, went to a bootcamp and, you know, here he is, IBM, you know, kicking [00:41:00] til like, you know, like he was doing this stuff his whole life.
And so like the summit program, um, is they give a space for, um, people to be involved either as mentors. Um, so I think, um, to answer the question of like, what can corporate companies do, I think making a space for even the employees, um, and the time too, and then also kind of put some, um, you know, make, you know, have a program that literally kind of reaches out to underrepresented communities.
Um, and then, uh, enabling people who are currently employees. To participate in some sort of way, like, you know, can I be a mentor? What can I do to, um, you know, like contribute my time to help, you know, um, get people onboarded and comfortable. Um, because so far, like I've only been there for about five months, but to me it's and they throw so much learning at you and Jenny, [00:42:00] as you've seen, it's just like, I mean, like having a program to literally.
Reach out to people. And then also, um, having people who are at the company, so creating like, you know, business resource groups, like I'm in the part of a very dynamic, um, like the black resource group where, uh, it's really all about the diaspora. There's people all over the world. Like I saw, I've seen people from Brazil talk about like, you know, because someone helped me with, um, you know, my English, you know, can someone, um, you know, uh, I have a nephew who's entering college.
Is there something that can do to, so, so like, I love how IBM creates a space for people. Like once we get there, what can we do? We're empowered to reach back and get involved. Like for instance, um, I shared a post about the summit program in a group and it got like a lot of hits and I'm so glad to do that.
And I really hope that people can follow up with the links. [00:43:00] Um, I told folks in that group, whatever way you must support, um, you know, like if five or 10 people. Who responded to that can get pulled into that program for like internships or early career, um, um, opportunities. So like, I feel like for, you know, for companies to really make, to go that direction, like, you know, creating a program to do that, and then also allow existing, um, employees to participate and help get people forward technology, I should say.
[00:43:39] Siara: Um, I mean, that's the reason why the four of us are on this call right now is because we are a part of an employee resource group, um, dedicated to our black employees. And that's exactly what we do. We, you know, try to be a source of, you know, knowledge and skills. For black employees, I'm excited that we're [00:44:00] developing right now, a program that is reaching back to, um, school, age kids to an underrepresented communities to say, Hey, I have a job in stem and this is how I got there.
And this is how you can get there. There are also, um, because, and I've mentioned this in a couple of other episodes when I was in school, stem was not a thing that was, that was discussed. There was no computer science. I think I said, I took a computer science class and it was a bunch of stuff in Excel that I can't even give you any specifics on.
You know, there wasn't a big push, but I think getting stem in front of those communities to say, you know, the tick-tock that you're using or these programs that are on your computer, there are real people behind those applications and all of those things that you're using. Now it doesn't cost very much to learn those things.
There's no, these bootcamps [00:45:00] available there, all these different resources to get you involved while yes, we need doctors and we need lawyers and we need the firefighters and all of that. But you know, technology, I think, you know, is going to be there. And this is another avenue that you can take that you can be very successful and make a lot of money, create wealth for yourself and your family.
Um, there's just so much opportunity there and we need more black nerds creating stuff because they're out there.
[00:45:35] Matthew Womack: Absolutely. I was here all set. And then another thing too, for people who may be older, you know, this is a, for young, just for young people, thirties, forties, fifties. I have a friend. I'm going to throw her name out there.
Is that okay for me to do all the user experience side, I'm such a fan of hers. Um, her name is Sampson. [00:46:00] She, we went to, um, w when I was well, uh, went to the grad school to do the user experience thing. Um, I mean, you know, we, we weren't spring chickens at that time. Um, and she might be a great person to have on your show too.
Cause I think she sees so amazing. Um, but she went from, you know, being a journalist to she's currently as of today, or not currently at the moment, she's the vice president of machine learning, um, like this, his whole effort to make sure that there's ethics and, um, and, uh, understanding of how AI and, um, and people intersect.
And so she's running that at capital. So, and this, you know, no black woman from Chicago, same neighborhood, you know, when she made her transition, you know, you know, [00:47:00] it was like, you know, we were, you know, we were like kind of mid career. And so I say that to say, you know, if you're 50 watching this, if you're 60 watching this, it's never too late.
If you have an inkling to do it, there are, there are people in their fifties and sixties transitioning into technology. They really are. So I want to, I don't see a lot of attention on people who are older or mid career, and certainly like people of color and older and mid career. It is very, very, very possible communities exist for, for us to, um, engage in this week, see people like yourself.
So I'd want it to encourage people, no matter your age, whether you're 15 or 50.
[00:47:47] Jennifer: Yeah. And that diversity of background, you know, product teams need that, you know, slice as well. Because if it's just, you know, uh, a group full of, we all will, [00:48:00] you know, got a computer science degrees and then we all did this, and then we all did that.
And then the innovation, or, you know, it's not going to be there. You need people with different ideas, different perspectives, the challenge people. And I think that's just like another way to kind of slice and dice. It is the way people are educated, the experiences they had, their age, all of that kind of comes into factors of being creative and having creative teams, which people may not think is programming is creative to me.
But I think it's the creative team, I think.
[00:48:33] Mattiecakes: Absolutely.
[00:48:35] Siara: I think the beauty of the tech industry where you may not get it in most places. Yeah. There's so much diversity up and down, especially when you think about age and experience, it's in a traditional, you know, industry. It's normally the people who've been there 20 15, 20 years, you're learning from them.
But in tech it's typically flip. You have [00:49:00] newer people who are coming into the industry with fresh eyes, they are learning the latest and the greatest, and they are imparting their knowledge to those who have, have more experience in saying, okay, here's the new way of thinking about this, but here's how things have changed.
And as you mentioned, the way that, you know, some industries are dying and there's still an opportunity for older individuals to come into this industry and learn something brand new and pivot their careers. I think that's such a unique thing. And tech where you really don't get that in most other industries.
There's so much opportunity for people.
[00:49:41] Matthew Womack: Absolutely. Absolutely. I definitely, I just feel like, you know, I, I, I've seen people in friends around me. They're like, oh, I'll get this job. Like I have a friend who has counseling experience and my band I'm like, if you had to go to a bootcamp or however you get to your journey of getting to that [00:50:00] first, uh, you have this finance, this counter experience, a FinTech company will love to have you in terms of, you know, you got all this great working experience.
You, you, you, you can look at accounting program, you know, if it's working on that, cause you can pull out a pen and a piece of paper and add up stuff a bit. So it's like you have so much, you know, skills, your skillset. It's perfect for being the voice in the room of like, Hey, I don't think this would work.
I don't think this would go with the legal impact of, um, you know, of, of what, what we're doing. And so, yeah, I just, uh, I just, I felt like, you know, as I'm a little bit older, I do see a lot of people were we're either under, um, underemployed and I love what Sierra said. It's like, you know, we definitely need our, you know, uh, teachers, educators, and things like that.
But for people who have an interest or inclined to look into [00:51:00] technology as a person who I just felt like there's so much opportunity it's so it's such a great, you know, like for instance, I'm working from home, I'm not sitting in traffic, it's cold, you're touching the thing, I'm going to the bus, you know, and that's such a blessing and approvals position to be in.
I just feel like I definitely would like, for so many more of us, like, I want there to be more black face. You know, in the room. So you know, of whatever company that people land in. Um, cause you know, I still have the idea that especially these bigger companies, like you look at some of the problems like Facebook has having again or Metta, I should say now I think there needs to be people in the room that look like us to drive, to, to create the space for conversations that need to be had because at the end of the day, AI and all these things is created by people, as you already said, they have so perfectly.
I think organic said that as [00:52:00] well, this stuff's created by people, you know, it's not like algorithms or something, you know, they didn't kind of come from the mountain tops on tablets, a couple of kids with some hoodies or whatever came up with this stuff or people. And it's like, if not the right people are in the room, we're going to start having these.
That's why we're seeing the CS kind of disparate outcomes of. No AI li mislabeling people or, you know, oh, we didn't think to have a data set that included folks because literally in their day-to-day lives, they don't
[00:52:33] Jennifer: interact with those folks. This is what occurred to you. You know, it doesn't occur some things that happened.
[00:52:38] Siara: And I'm just, how did this even make a light of day who was in the decision making team to say that, yes, this is, this is what we should push out. And then you completely ignorant your blind spot is so it's so appearance. It's just like, how, how did this happen?
[00:52:57] Matthew Womack: Exactly. It's funny. It's like, [00:53:00] wow. So it's just like, just like the more that we diversify our technology landscape.
I mean, as we'll have better products that work better for everyone. I mean, it's, it's, win-win really okay.
[00:53:13] Mattiecakes: My Micro's muted, but I was trying to say that it's from that old philosophy of not seeing. Oh, I don't see color.
[00:53:21] Siara: Yeah, yeah. Yes you do. Yes, you do. Right there.
[00:53:28] Jennifer: There are races and there are people with, you know, different experiences in their daily life is very different than your daily life.
And being able to incorporate that in the innovations that you're doing.
So I think it's time for the heat yet.
Uh, it was a first, Matt mentioned a couple of things, I think so maybe. [00:54:00] You are the guest, so we shouldn't allow you to go,
[00:54:05] Matthew Womack: um, currently what's happening at the moment and I'm not affiliated with any way, but there's effort check 2021. Um, I think it started yesterday, Monday, sorry. Oh, gosh, there's been already,
oh my goodness.
This likes this week, but, um, yeah. Um, I think it's happening through the 13th. Um, it looks like it's really dynamic.
Um, I don't know what the, I know there are tickets to, um, attend and I think even yesterday there were some like, uh, like Atlanta or LA and Chicago, even there was like a little mixer for people to get together. But, um, one thing I did mention earlier in the podcast was, or an episode of the set up. On the link that concluded that about Afro check 2021 at the top, there is a [00:55:00] submit resume.
And so for people who may not be able to attend or have the time, um, does it hurt, does it like it costs anything and it didn't stop me from kind of click on the link, definitely throw your resume in there and see what happens. Hopefully there could be, um, maybe there's some mechanism that can connect people to opportunities.
Um, so I didn't want to, um, and if people have in clinic, uh, an inclination to tin, um, definitely check that out. Cause that looks to be like really interesting. Um, gosh, that's my one thing that jumps out, uh, mentioned
[00:55:36] Jennifer: that works cool. Who wants to go next? I want to go math and next I stepped on you last time.
So I want to make sure you get the opportunity. Okay.
[00:55:50] Mattiecakes: I can go. Um, so I'll give some context back in may, um, epic games and apple had a, um, legal dispute over their app [00:56:00] store because, uh, epic wanted to sell like ex their own. Cause when you buy something through the app store, it goes through apple. And so they get a 30% cut.
And so epic games wanted to be able to sell things in their game, Fortnite like externally. And, um, so they added a button that sent you to their, their site. And basically it was 30% cheaper to buy the end game currency through their web. And of course that got shut down by apple. And so back in may, this went to, uh, like a lawsuit because they brought them to, for an antitrust, like they had a monopoly on the app store.
And so they'll the judge found that they weren't, um, they didn't have a monopoly, but they ruled against apples, anti steering, which is the, like, you can't go to a different site and pay. And so they had 90 days to like, implement something to get rid of that. And so, um, they were putting it on pause [00:57:00] cause they were going through, um, like I dunno, the legal term, but then so today a judge ruled that they, they can't put it like appeal.
It that's the word I was looking for. They can't appeal it and they have to change it. So they have 30 more days
[00:57:14] Jennifer: to do it. So epic has 34 days, no apple.
[00:57:18] Mattiecakes: Apple has third. So they don't even let them in the, they don't let epic and the app store anymore, but apple has 30 days to make it where anybody, any developer can like put something where it's like, you can pay externally instead of going through the app store.
[00:57:35] Matthew Womack: Oh, that's good. So kinda like, whoa.
[00:57:45] Jennifer: So, but apple and epic, like epic is not a subsidiary of apple. They're just have their application on the app store and.
[00:57:58] Siara: Through that happened was like, [00:58:00] no matter what you sell, we're going to get 30% that's. Yeah.
[00:58:04] Mattiecakes: So everything goes to the app store. And so what they did was they wanted to like send customers to like an external website where they can pay directly to them bypassing the app store. And so what the judge ruled is that's legal that other apps can do that now.
[00:58:24] Jennifer: Interesting.
[00:58:26] Matthew Womack: I got to tell you that those, um, that, uh, like my nephews are really, really into fortnight and it's like, that looks like people are like the skins and the, the, I think that generated, we talking, I think it was in the billions or there, they made like 20 or $12.4 million in like the week or so that, or whatever it was that they had the external button working.
Wow. That's really something. So, what do you guys think about that in terms of, so it's like kind [00:59:00] of, you know, apple has been known to have like this very like engaged, um, sort of like folks are happy to stay in that ecosystem and I guess they generate so much of their, um, sort of value out of like, you know, we're going to the app store, I'm paying my 2 99 or to the services.
Um, w what's what's your take on that? I, I think openness is always good. Like being at a company that talks about open hybrid cloud, I feel like more being more open can all be kind of help. Uh, certainly the, the consumer, um,
[00:59:32] Mattiecakes: I think it helps the consumer, but then there's like that, like an open ecosystem is as more like privy to an attack and security risks.
So there's a trade off.
[00:59:43] Siara: I agree. I can see both sides. I prefer to stay in my apple bubble. It's just cleaner for me.
[00:59:53] Jennifer: It's making plenty of money. So[01:00:00]
[01:00:00] Siara: also agree. You want to go next? Do you want me to go?
[01:00:04] Jennifer: Uh, I think I went last, last time. So you go last, last, last time. So what do you, I dunno, I'll go next.
So Matt, you were talking about kind of legacy systems and different things. Um, so I've been managing for the last five years, so I don't code too much, but back when I was jQuery, it wasn't thing like this and jQuery that, and I've picked up that it's not the latest and greatest anymore. Uh, but I came across this article called.
Y outdated jQuery is still a bit the dominant JavaScript library. Um, it was written by Richard McManus on the new stack. Um, and it basically say 78% of the [01:01:00] top 1 million websites still use jQuery, which I thought react was everywhere. Um, and I don't know how you measure the 78% of the top 1 million websites.
I hadn't read too much into that, but that's what it says and react is only 14%. So Jake gray is out there alive and well. Um, well maybe not still alive. Well, it seems like it's in a maintenance mode. There's not too much going on there. Um, but they tried made it to a WordPress, uh, that WordPress. That interface is using jQuery.
So a lot of people were using WordPress though. A lot of people were using jQuery, but I thought that was interesting, especially when you talk about, we recently, we had an application that was based on, um, a flux. And so in the beginning of the year, right, they ended the support for that, and it was a security impact.
And we spent a lot of [01:02:00] man hours re you know, re rewriting all that, um, to react and, um, you know, thinking about the debt that that is when you have, when you're using the technology, that's kind of, um, going away, not supported anymore, which means it's going to be harder for you to maintain Hardy few to enhance.
And, uh, it's. It's probably 78% because it takes a lot of effort to remove all that. So if there isn't anything pushing it like a security guys or something, it's probably just gonna live there for awhile. Um, so I just thought that was pretty interesting
when you make something good, it stands for
new technologies will come and go. jQuery will be here. We know nothing. It will be here forever. Um,[01:03:00]
yeah, I'm trying to think of what language is like on a, on a space shuttle somewhere. Some, some language, no one who's anymore. Oh, that's going to get me or something like that. I don't know if it was for. Uh, is right into interface podcast at Prozac com. If you know what language that is, that's still out on the space stations that nobody uses anymore.
Uh, but yeah, it's that, that it takes and the planning it takes to rewrite everything that already works is there's a lot of stuff out in the wild that is going to linger there. I lost someone it's like, no, this is an explicit problem that I want to invest in to duplicate the same thing that it does.
It's been months to do that, but it doesn't really change anything. So, um, that's the fun of it being in the temple.[01:04:00]
Exactly. All right, Sierra.
[01:04:06] Siara: Right. So my heat check. Today. I saw him not on tech crunch. I'm a Twitter and Viacom, CBS announced global content partnership plans for Twitter watch parties. So I feel like all of these social media platforms have gone through some kind of rebranding in the past year, Instagram
video, then
Facebook,
all of it that it's had in the past month or so, and now Twitter, which I have Twitter downloaded on my phone. I don't use it very much. And so I was reading this and I was like, okay, let's see what this is going to be. And I'm assuming that this partnership is to [01:05:00] drive more users to Twitter. Um, I just recently bought a house and I cut the cake.
And, you know, so now I have all of these different streaming apps that I'm using, but I actually missed, you know, watching live TV. I also just bought my mom every time she comes to visit me. She's like, I just want to watch the news. I just bought an antenna for my living room TV so that I can watch regular, you know, local network TV, ABC, CBS, or what have you.
And so this was interesting to me because, you know, during the pandemic people would have watch parties where, you know, I know Disney enabled a platform Disney plus where you can have several people watching the same thing, kind of live commentary. Um, and so this partnership is going to open the door for news sports events to be streaming live as well as entertainment, um, uh, [01:06:00] events.
And so I'm like, this is cool, I guess, but yeah. Considering I don't use Twitter. I don't know that this would drive me to use Twitter more. And so I'm interested around the room. If you know this partnership with drive, you use the Twitter platform more. If you're like me and you've kept the cable.
[01:06:24] Jennifer: So I'm, uh, like a fandom nerd, like anything like dune recently came out anything more.
I just saw terminals, you know, and I obsessives really watch them content and then go to YouTube to watch the reviews. And even like TV shows that are like, you know, you're binge watching and like, I don't have. I don't think any of my friends have this obsession that I have. So it's definitely kind of be by myself.
I think I [01:07:00] would be interested if I could real time interacting with people that are also interested in that content. So it's not like, you know, I go through this and then I wait for something else to get posted. I kind of kind of be in the moment with it. Um, but I'll have to look out for that.
[01:07:15] Siara: Okay. Fair enough, matt. What's your thing.
[01:07:20] Mattiecakes: I know YouTube does that, like some people will have watched parties on YouTube. I personally don't use Twitter. Um, I actually, well, I'll look at Twitter people tweeting stuff during like the NFL games. Um, but I don't use Twitter other than. So really it doesn't affect me for watching live TV.
That's, it's more of a inconvenience to watch live TV. So I just kind of avoid it.
[01:07:43] Siara: I do miss college now that it's football season. I do miss being able to watch an entire day of Nanjing on the couch, I think colo or paramount. And you could do that
just saying,[01:08:00]
[01:08:04] Matthew Womack: I think I could see, I, you know, I'm very hesitant with Twitter because it seems like, you know, not that I'm wanting to throw controversial stuff up there, but it seems like Twitter has been like the downfall of so many people where, you know, you throw something out there and it's like pops up later. So I'm just like, whoa, that kind of, you know, I'm more like a consumer of Twitter and don't really feel too much out there.
Um, you know, that's interesting, like, I know for instance, um, There's like this sort of like clubhouse type of functionality at Twitter has where it sort of mimics clubhouse. And so like in this way, this watch party thing sounds like it's sort of trying to add this other way that people could connect outside of just no, 180 characters.
I feel like I would try it. I think I would try it. Um, yeah, I'm sort of just, I feel like I'm, I have a, I'm more of a YouTube person than anything. Like, I feel [01:09:00] like it's been so many, I paid extra money to skip the ads. Cause I literally just, I felt like I've probably watched YouTube more than anything, whether it's like real videos is lab content, creators that I like, but, um, I think Twitter had something like that.
I would try it. I would try it here.
[01:09:19] Siara: I, I would, I would try it once. I don't. I also think that's what it was just a cesspool of negativity. And on, off the handle with this. I don't want to deal with this, but maybe, I mean, I'm interested to see what happens with this partnership and what the plans are, um, and stay tuned.
I'll let you know if I'm using Twitter to watch events,
[01:09:44] Matthew Womack: we can all jump on a feed or something and
[01:09:50] Jennifer: yeah, maybe, um, someone can, we can live podcasts and people can, one day you're not giving me more ideas.[01:10:00]
So, Matt, uh, thank you for being with us today. How can people get in touch with you?
[01:10:08] Matthew Womack: I would say the best choice. I did say I'm on Twitter, but I don't use that as much. I'm definitely active more on LinkedIn. So, um, feel free to reach out to me on LinkedIn. Um, I should be on there as Matthew S Womack. Um, But yeah, that, that would be the best way.
Like the other ways I'm like, Hey, you know, I'm on there, but more like, it's just, you know, you know, just kind of hanging out, looking at what everybody else is doing, you know, more of a, you know, observer, just like, oh, that's cool.
I encourage people to reach out. Even if we're not connected. Like I, you know, I try to respond to every one, especially for people interested in getting into technology. Um, I'm always happy to talk to people and get some time 15 minutes just to be like, Hey, here's some resources or what's your journey, or what can I do?
And I'm, [01:11:00] I'm a connector. I'll connect people like have a framework set. Um, I can connect you to people and be like, all right, y'all have your conversation, the conversation. So for people, see, like I'm connected to people that could maybe be like, oh, I'm going to talk to them about what Microsoft's like or something like that.
[01:11:21] Jennifer: Yeah, that's a, that's a powerful superpower to, I I, yeah, it's knowing the
[01:11:29] Matthew Womack: connector
got to come up with a costume.
[01:11:37] Siara: Uh, Matt, before we let you go, I was reading up on you before today's recording and you're in Chicago and Chicago has a ton of great food. I know that you're a foodie. Give me your top three places to eat in Chicago. I just visited earlier in the year. I don't want to come back, but give me your top three.
Oh
[01:11:55] Matthew Womack: gosh. Oh my goodness. I'm on the spot. [01:12:00] Um, Ooh, let's see. I like, oh my goodness.
[01:12:10] Mattiecakes: You know what? There's a place I live in the Hyde park neighborhood. High park is known for really. Great. Like even black experiences. Um, I do. Let's see.
Oh my goodness. What's a good, you know, I, I will say like we have, um, for people, our people, like for people who are vegans, I feel like there's like this vegan sort of explosion happening. Um, there's a number of black owned vegan places. So like, um, I think there's something there's a place called Murjani that before that that was good.
Um, I had a good experience. I like to put this place up there. Um, I don't know if anyone was [01:13:00] familiar with, it was a restaurant in Dallas where, um, a gentleman by the name of Kevin had like, kind of went viral for some interesting reasons about sort of this establishment. Um, he has a restaurant in Chicago, so eczema last, that experience.
And cocktails by Kevin. I think actually we had a really good experience. I think they had a little bit of a Rocky star, um, and outside of like, you know, it's, it's not, it's a little expensive, but I really enjoyed it. It's a local restaurant in downtown Chicago, which is amazing. So, um, that was really good recent experience in terms of pizza.
That's
[01:13:42] Siara: what I want to know. You know what
[01:13:46] Matthew Womack: the deep dish pizza is cool, but that's really for like our friends and family that come from out of town. So we're going to do like a town Fiesta we're going to do like , which is, um, still a black owned, [01:14:00] um, experience. I think, I think they're the rich Geosys if I'm mistaken, but I think that's like the biggest black, like at least the pizzas in stores across the country, too.
Um, but if you have to do Chicago. My take is that Luma lobbies is the go-to for deep dish Chicago pizza. There's geo Donald's. It's like the execution is a little different. If you're a, if you're a really achieves person, I would lean towards Giordano's. Cause that's like a cake. If you never want extra cheese on Giordano's.
Cause even for a cheese person, that's too much. Um, but so if you're feeling extra cheesy, but overall I would say the pizza for the deep dish is my personal favorite. When I do that, then we have to always read the other cool places that are like, you know, different pizza styles, um, around, you [01:15:00] know, what the club's style or the chart style or.
I can't think of some other words that would be so cool places. We've got our MacArthur's, we've got our uncle remixes and, and Harold's Harold's chicken with the mouth sauce, which stores, um, gosh,
[01:15:23] Jennifer: sounds like we need black owned restaurant podcasts, foodie pockets.
[01:15:29] Siara: I'm like, I'm going to hit you up on LinkedIn.
I need you to send me the list because I want you to go back just a food tour of Chicago,
[01:15:39] Matthew Womack: Chicago, heavy spoiled though, too. And then Pilsen, like great. So, um, you know, TexMex and Mexican-American.
[01:15:50] Jennifer: We live in Houston. We live in Houston.
[01:15:53] Matthew Womack: Oh, you know, what's up?
No. Cause I was told that like, you know, there's Mexican cuisine and a lot of the stuff that [01:16:00] we enjoy, it was really more like text mix. Cause it's like Mexico, you know, it's just more like going to see the heart, you know, certain things. So I try to be very careful respectful of the cuisine.
[01:16:10] Jennifer: Know I was just going to be a little snappy as a text that I am not going to go to Chicago for good tech.
When you go, I'll let you be the judge to say, if Chicago can touch what we have here, Matt is going to send me a recommendation and I will let you know my reviews.
[01:16:32] Matthew Womack: I would, I would make the trip just for that. Sure.
[01:16:38] Jennifer: Yeah. We'll give you some recommendations. Barbecue,
[01:16:45] Matthew Womack: barbecue. Oh my gosh.
[01:16:51] Jennifer: Awesome. Well, thank you so much for joining us today. Thank you to our listeners for listening to this episode. Uh, just the way [01:17:00] we kind of struck up a conversation with them that go find somebody after what they did. I'm sure I'll have a great time talking. We'll see you at start.
[01:17:15] Siara: We're still working on our closed.