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Do Good Work is not a label but a way of living.
It is the constant and diligent effort to achieve a new level of excellence in one’s own life.
It is the hidden inner beauty behind the struggle to achieve excellence.
It is not perfect but imperfect.
It is the effort, discipline and focus that often goes unnoticed.
The goal of this podcast is to highlight that drive.
The guests I have on this show emulate this drive in their own special way. You’ll be able to apply new ideas into your own life by learning from them.
We will also have 1on1 episodes with me where we’ll dive into my own experiences with entrepreneurship and leadership.
Every episode is designed to provide you with ideas that you can apply and grow in excellence in all areas of your life, business and career.
Do Good Work,
Raul
INTRO
Today on the podcast, I am
talking to Jeffrey Mead.
Jeff is the founding director of
entrepreneurship at Paul Quinn
College, and by 2028, every single
student there would have to have
launched a business generating
real revenue before they graduate.
It's not optional, it's mandatory.
An actual business with real life stakes.
On today's podcast, we talked about
the actual shift of what it takes
to take a first generation college
student's mindset from don't fail to
fail fast, and why most schools get
entrepreneurship completely wrong, and why
Jeff is open sourcing the entire model.
All right, let's get into the podcast.
PODCAST
Raul: jeff, I firmly believe that
there's gonna be two types of vocations
in the future and one is gonna be
employee, one is gonna be entrepreneur,
and I think one might be going away.
I'm curious to know, like, why
you're diving into, like, really
focusing on students in college
starting a real business and having
those entrepreneurial skillsets.
Jeff Meade: first thanks for having me
I I would say you know since schools
have been around they've done a really
good job at getting people employed
Like they the whole point of going to
school for the most part is you wanna
expand knowledge of students but you
also wanna make sure that after those
four years that there's a job waiting
for them And so we've kinda optimized for
that Schools know how to do that really
Raul: mm-hmm.mm.
Jeff Meade: But what we've seen and if
you've read any reports on what it looks
like it's hard for age students young
people to get jobs and it's just because
the world is changing Like we're we're
not sure what those future jobs look like
And what we've heard from employers is
we need people who can think on their
feet who can be creative who can adapt
to whatever it is the world is gonna look
like by the time they graduate college
And so for us our response to that is Oh
we know exactly how to do that It that
would be an entrepreneur Like you want
somebody who could think entrepreneurially
right Somebody who's creative who where
most people see a problem they're like
Oh this is a solution You know like I I
can figure out how to how to work around
this And so that's what we're doing It's
really helping students start businesses
in school Uh it it you know the program
is called Every Quinite is an entrepreneur
Paul Quinn is the college And for us
it really is we wanted to be bold and
we didn't want it to be an option And
we wanted to change the mindset for our
students really around do you create
something from nothing right lots of our
students are first generation students
and I think as a result of being first
generation students they've probably
grown up around a lot of scarcity in
their world And so just even the mindset
shift of thinking like an entrepreneur
one where you approach things out of
abundance Like how do we how do we look
out at the world say to ourselves Oh
I can fix this Right And and so that's
what we're trying to do with the Every
Quinnite is an entrepreneur program
Raul: No, I really like that.
I resonate a lot because, like,
everything you just said first gen
here in the US the one program that
changed my entire trajectory was an
entrepreneurship program back in college,
but it was only, like, 12 kids selected
at the entire school of business.
So I think it was not 100%
I think it was, like, one or 3% of
the business school or, like, the
entire ... and it was optional.
So, like, you didn't, like, you tried and
then you did have to start a business in,
in some cases, but, like talk me through
because you have a, a no optional 100%
by, what is it, 2028, where every single
student has to have a, yeah, real venture
that actually generates real revenue.
What are the requirements?
Is it a dollar?
Is it 100 bucks?
Is it a thousand bucks?
Like, what, how do you quantify
what a real business is?
Jeff Meade: so the real business is
it's it's so funny because when students
first get here And you know we just
launched I've been at Paul Quinn for
going on a year and a half now And so
I've just started this program with
our entering freshmen so the juniors
and the seniors and those folks they're
like Oh that looks cool it looks like
a lot of work Uh but but it is actually
modeled after my alma mater So I went to
Babson College which is known for their
entrepreneurship program that's if you Oh
Raul: professor of Absence.
Jeff Meade: world so
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: Babson does really cool is
they have what they call FME and so it's
like foundations of management experience
when we were there we called it freshman
management experience it's essentially
every freshman has to start a business but
you don't start it by yourself you start
it in a group And I always thought that
was really cool and and thought Man why
doesn't why don't more schools do this And
so having the opportunity I brought that
thinking over here and it really is every
student who comes in now has to start
generates revenue some of our students I
I've seen in this first couple months they
are starting businesses and it has been
hard to actually revenue and there are a
lot of pivots And so for me I'm like that
qualifies Th this is they have identified
customers right It's what I like to call
it is what we're doing is experiential
learning but there's stakes involved right
Um and so it makes it a it makes it real
So no we don't have a bar like $1,000
It is really you're going through the
Raul: Don't do it.
Jeff Meade: of what it takes to start a
business and so it's it has been really
fascinating to see the types of businesses
the business ideas that folks are creating
I like that the visions are getting really
big And so what we do is within the first
semester is we push people to think in
terms of an MVP right Like what's your
minimum viable product And so with that
we're like What is that that will actually
entice someone to buy your product in the
marketplace And so we want them to have
that big vision but it's also gotta get
a customer and you gotta convince them to
buy And so we've had people some of our
students are selling things for $10 right
$15 so it's just to get them And once
once you get that going then they're like
I get it And then we can start turning
the switch to how do we scale this thing
Raul: yeah.
No, that's key.
And even in the beginning I remember
in, again, my, in my journey and also
seeing others around me, it would
start just like that, how to reselling
items, and then from there, build,
build, they built, like, a figure
e-commerce businesses out of college.
So it's a real thing where you just
gotta keep trying and iterating.
I'm curious, and I, and I was serious
on the point that I think that
entrepreneurship is is a good answer for
the new economy that we're heading into,
as well as the technological evolution.
What are you guys doing to, like, empower
students with tokens, and how many tokens
do you allocate per student, or are you
paying for any of the subscriptions for AI
so that they can actually leverage that?
I honestly, this is, again, I'm an
optimist, I'm an entrepreneur but
also been in, in a program not the
same, but because I like the, the
rigor, 100% of our students have
to go through building a business.
That's, that's, you gotta,
you gotta anchor that.
But right now with the technology, I
think this is one of the best times
to be an entrepreneur because now
you can work on the speed of solving
problems and actually having the
technical know- how or execution and
power to actually deliver value faster.
Jeff Meade: a good good question And so I
think what's fascinating is when I first
got here my gut said you know we gotta be
all about AI Like every business should
have an AI component And then the more I
talk to students I realize maybe not every
business And and and what I mean is that
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: what I have been really
pushing them to do is is looking at truly
solving a problem right And I think that
the nature of being 18 19 20 and being
told you have to start a business is
you just come up with these really cool
ideas I'm gonna one kid said I'm a I'm
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: for small business I'm gonna
use AI and I'm like Great what type of
small business What problem do they have
Right So really pushing it to the core of
what problem you're trying to solve And so
as a result when we get down to the core
of it making sure you're solving a problem
people are willing to pay for the ideas
Raul: First for, foremost.
Jeff Meade: aren't fully focused on
AI Some of them are but we haven't had
a challenge with like tokens and all
that I mean the students have access
to all of that but no one's burning
through anything and they're not burning
it through anything because we're
so focused on the top of the funnel
stuff in many ways in terms of making
sure that you're solving a problem
and and then really making sure yeah
Raul: That's the key.
Jeff Meade: there that values that problem
being solved and then how are you gonna
deliver that to them And I think for us
as we talk through it what's happening
is once they can solve that problem
and and they can deliver their solution
to the marketplace then we wanna start
layering AI and other tools to optimize
But but you know they're just they're
they're not AI first let's say that
Raul: That's a good,
that's a good perspective.
And, yeah, and for, just to give
you my perspective, working in with
professional services, working with
other consultants, agencies, it's
less of transforming how you deliver
with AI, but more about integrating
the tech into your business model.
So it's ... The number one
thing will never change.
You gotta deliver value, which
is what you're focusing on.
What is the actual pain point that is
significant enough that they want it
get, to get rid of and buy a product or
service that doesn't exist, or that's
different to get rid of that problem?
That's never gonna change, and
I think that's, like, the basic
fundamental principle like Gravity.
But then, as, as you mentioned,
it's the same parallel.
How do we either deliver that value with
more value, go deeper, help them do things
we couldn't do before, or optimize on
the backend where how we run the business
is more efficient versus, versus not.
So it's good to see the young gen
still leveraging that, but then
also thinking first of problem
first, because that's gonna
Solving problems is, like, the, the
key thing for any, any work, really.
What are the mindsets that
have changed for your students?
Like, you mentioned first gen,
scarcity to abundance what are, like,
the real changes that you're seeing?
'Cause there's growth in,
like, the tangible growth.
You start a business or you don't.
You get revenue or you don't.
You get a customer, you don't.
Okay, that's binary, black, and white.
Growth also happens, like, oh, they
come in and they have a new idea based
on their pivot, or they see themselves
and their situations differently.
How are you seeing that shake out
in their own personal development?
Jeff Meade: say the biggest thing I see
is around confidence right And and so
Raul: Hmm.
Jeff Meade: I think that really comes from
like I already said that they're first gen
and in to on top of being first gen a lot
of our students are Pell Grant recipients
and I know this very well because I was
Raul: Hmm..
Jeff Meade: Pell Grant recipient And so
putting myself in their shoes and and
interacting with them what I realized
is that when you're first gen usually
not always but usually your family puts
so much stock into you all the right
things and not messing up right Like
just make sure you check the boxes and
find a really good job Like we put all
we can to get you to that place so don't
mess up And so imagine the family that
has armed a student their child with all
that information and then they show up
to me and I'm like we're gonna fail fast
I've violated everything that they've
just heard They're like No no no no I'm
not supposed to fail I'm I'm supposed
to minimize failure at all costs And so
they see failure as like a ding to their
identity right And so what I have to do
build that confidence up and transform
their way of thinking like no failure
is actually learning and it is a safe
place to fail here that they've never
experienced that because they have been
the chosen ones You are the chosen one
in your family when you are the first to
go off to college so I think the biggest
thing I've I've been facing is is just the
confidence like don't know if I can fail
or I don't wanna dream that big because
I don't wanna disappoint myself or have
to tell somebody that I failed So that
that is that is the challenge that we are
seeing now And and it's work It's it's
definitely work but but I recognize what
it is we just have to try to overcome that
Raul: So, like s- failure
is a learning l- feedback.
It's safe to fail and what, what
else is, like, another key thing
that, or cornerstone that you focus
on for them to change their mindset?
'Cause what you're saying, literally,
is, is affected there because
I live that, but even for the
professional or, like, the executive
right now who is high performance,
it's the same mentality, "I can't
Jeff Meade: Yeah No I liked how
you sum summarized that really
quick I'd say the other one is
Raul: fail.".
Jeff Meade: probably I'd say this it's
the there's definitely something about
it being a safe space Like I I feel
like we've all worked in environments
where you wanna take a chance but you
get penalized for taking that chance and
and for for many students that penalty
has been in their grades right And so
actually just creating an environment
where they do see failure as part of the
learning process but they also see it
as step on the journey Like you have to
go through this This is like an emotion
this is part of the experience because I
can't teach you the other things unless
you actually feel this pain what this is
like right Probably similar to sports like
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: gonna lose a game right But
how do we get back up and play again
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: Um and and but in
academics we never teach students
that We never teach that you're gonna
lose right Losing has always been
Cs Ds and Fs but so changing that
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: has been So I would I would
say for the professionals really like
how do you create this space where people
are comfortable with failure and not not
failure over and over again but you want
people to make new mistakes Uh uh you
wanna create an environment where Yeah
Raul: take risk.
Jeff Meade: you definitely wanna create
a safe environment you don't want people
making the same mistake over and over
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: Right
Raul: not reckless, but no, you're
s- you're essentially helping the
students mature, because I think those
are the, the two big, the two big
R's, like, risk and responsibility.
Responsibility, you gotta business,
you gotta uphold, you know, what
your family's expecting, balance that
with risk taking, and I think that's
getting people out of the shell.
You're doing the podcast, I saw
your website, you're all, you're
doing, like, writing and speaking.
How are you open sourcing this, and
to use, to use that language, but
how are you helping either share this
framework so that either ... 'Cause
universities have to pivot.
I don't care which university
you went to when you're
listening to this, to, to this.
Again, different stories,
different iterations, but,
like, they're gonna change.
Like, it's overexpensive and the
value prop is no longer there.
So they're gonna have to change
regardless of what happens.
How are you, Jeff, like, open sourcing
this or the framework or sharing
the teachings or the insights?
Like, are you writing a newsletter?
Like, what, what are you doing for this?
Jeff Meade: It it's something that that
I was talking about with some other
professors so so one thing we do have is
we are trying We we do do case studies
so we've started case studies and it's
so funny with with case studies is
that they take forever to get out into
the world right And and it's because
Raul: Yeah.
Jeff Meade: you know they're peer reviewed
they have to go through all these steps
and and like I said I've been here a
year and a half and we've been moving
on case studies but we've only had two
right Like one of them got published by
Sage the other one is being reviewed by
HBS a Harvard Business Review Publishing
but I was like This has just taken too
long and so what I wanted to do was
create and what we're trying to do is
create a podcast that that can really
just help people think through we're
doing here so that other folks can do
it as well but our model is is very
much open source We think this model can
be applied to a lot of dif to a lot of
small schools across the country and so
I definitely want people to take up Yeah
Raul: too, like,
Jeff Meade: I want people to take
Raul: you know,
Jeff Meade: doing
Raul: like a, a department.
No, I like that.
Yeah, I think that's the fastest
path to, to sharing that frameworks.
Even the most powerful tool that I used
back then, and I still even reference it
to this day, is the business model canvas.
It's just a piece of paper.
Forgot, it was Eric Reese or whoever,
what whoever it was, but that little
tool, I mean, I think if you, if you
develop that too for, for what you're
running, make it simple, open books
podcasts, whatever it is to get the ideas
out there, but that's pretty exciting.
Jeff, for the audience, where
can people go to learn more about
you and your work at Paul Quinn?
Jeff Meade: The the easiest way
is if you go to Paul Quinn's
website if you go to paulquin.edu
then back/entrepreneurship you will
see that we're working on right
now and to see all the stuff that
I'm involved in in terms of how I'm
sharing out the information you can
go to my site and that's jeff-mead.com
and mead is spelled M-E-A-D-E.com
you can see all that we're doing here
at Paul Quinn and and all that I'm
doing around venture-based learning
and that is my way to answer the
previous question how we're trying
to get the material out to everybody
Raul: Well, I'll put those
links in the show notes.
Jeff, thanks again for being on.
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