The Good Wife: Season 4, Episode 6 - The Art of War

This week on The Good Pod, Jason and Marissa break down The Good Wife Season 4, Episode 6, “The Art of War.” Alicia is pulled into a deeply emotional civil case involving a military rape survivor and private contractors with immunity, as Colonel Kuhn returns for a powerful storyline. We also see Amanda Peet guest star, Brian Dennehy bring the heat in court, and Josh Charles step behind the camera to direct! Meanwhile, campaign drama heats up as Maddie Hayward makes a bold move, and the Nick situation with Kalinda remains as frustrating as ever.

00:12 – Alicia takes on a troubling civil case involving the military
17:03 – Amanda Peet returns to the screen as Captain Hellinger
25:00 – Colonel Kuhn pulls legal strings from behind the scenes
41:00 – Maddie reveals her true intentions to Alicia
50:50 – Jackie’s new caretaker and a surprising connection
57:00 – Peter vs. Maddie: Governor race showdown begins

Like what you hear? Don’t forget to rate, review, and subscribe to The Good Pod wherever you get your podcasts. Want to support the show? Buy us a coffee at https://buymeacoffee.com/goodpod and help keep the courtroom drama rolling!

Creators and Guests

Host

Jason Reed

I’m a simple guy with simple interests. Pop Culture, Tv, Movies, Comics. Constantly chasing that nostalgia dragon. Podcaster talking Married At First Sight on A Perfect Match and The Good Wife verse on The Good Pod.

Host

Marissa Garza

MTv never told me the Real World would be like this // podcaster, consultant, and tv watcher

What is The Good Pod?

Calling all fans of courtroom intrigue and complex characters! Join us each week as we dive deep into the gripping world of "The Good Wife," "The Good Fight", "Elsbeth," and the entire legal drama universe created by Robert and Michelle King. Jason Reed and Marissa Garza, break down each episode, unpack intricate plot lines, and analyze the moral dilemmas faced by Alicia Florrick, Diane Lockheart, Elsbeth Tascioni, and their colleagues. Whether you're a longtime fan or new to these addictive shows, you'll gain fresh insights and catch details you might have missed.

The Good Wife S4E6
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[00:00:00] ​

[00:00:05] Welcome to The Good Pod, where today we're covering the Good Wife, season four, episode six, the Art of War. I'm one of your hosts, Jason Reed with me, someone whose crap doesn't suck. Marissa Garza. Marissa, you good? Good. Jason, you good? I'm good. I'm good. Good. Uh, yeah, a little, uh, you know, not, not a fun case to discuss this episode.

[00:00:29] A little troubling, but we did have some interesting developments that happened in this, uh, episode and things. Some we saw some characters that showed displayed a little more humanity this episode than we were used to. Uh, so we got all that coming up. Before we deep dive into the episode, I want to remind you of some free and easy ways.

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[00:01:10] Doing those things helps us get into the algorithm of people that would, that YouTube thinks would enjoy this content. So it helps us get into the eyes and ears of more people. So please do that, uh, as you are watching or listening, uh, to help, to help us out to do that. If you wanna just. Chat with us about any and everything.

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[00:01:46] Uh, you can go to buy me a coffee.com/good pod and, uh, put some money in our coffers. We greatly appreciate it. We've had some people do that as well. And it's, uh, yeah, I think it is the ultimate sign of your, uh, appreciation of this show. To do that. To help us. To help us [00:02:00] fledgling independent, uh, podcast, stay on its feet.

[00:02:04] Yes. Um, yes. We appreciate that. Uh, following outta the way, Marissa, let's get into the case. All right. Well, before we do that, I do wanna talk a little bit about this opening scene in the lobby because it kind of brings everything together at the start of this episode. We very rarely get a lobby scene, so when I, when we do, I, I wanna take note of it, and we see, uh, judge Kon from military court sitting and waiting, and very prim, very proper.

[00:02:32] We see, unfortunately, Nick Dow truck guy come in, plop himself down, talks to Judge Kon, we find out he did serve in Afghanistan as well, apparently, or at least that's what she, he's telling her. And then Mandy comes in, the person from the magazine. Nick is all like, oh, please stay. Please stay here. I'm like, you're so magnanimous.

[00:02:55] Oh my gosh, you're such a gentleman. And then also Maddie comes in, uh, you [00:03:00] know, so these are the main players of who we're gonna be, you know, talking about in this episode. But I liked how they started everyone off kind of in that same space, and then had our, you know, the usual suspects of law firm kind of walking in and out to like, interact with them at the start of the episode.

[00:03:15] Yeah. I, I love because we, we see will get off the elevator and see me like walk, just, you know, like a normal day. He is like, wait a minute, did I, did I just see Colonel? A AKA, the, the judge I spar with all the time. The military court, I couldn't have seen that. Right. Freaked out. He's like, uh, what are you doing here?

[00:03:36] And just like, to court marshal you. Ha ha ha. So funny, so funny, so funny. And he's like, uh, ha, ha, ha. No, but really, what are you doing here? He's like, oh, I'm here to see Alicia. Well, does she know you're here? Because like, obviously if she knew she was here, you'd, you'd like be in there. He's, she's like, I gave my names, like, no, no, no, no.

[00:03:51] Let me take you back. Let me take you back. And then they go into the conference room and Judge Koon's like, or Colonel Koon is like, we don't need you. Will [00:04:00] I don't need you. Bye will bye. And Will. This is like, I don't know how many times this has been, that Will has just been dismissed by clients so they can talk to Alicia.

[00:04:09] I was like, all right, will, you're long, no longer needed by. And this is the last we will see of Will for this episode. And you know why? I mean, I, you told me this before, this was very surprising and also makes sense. I enjoyed this reason why Little fun fact. This is the first episode that Josh Charles is directing of the Good Wife.

[00:04:30] And he, I, I was looking it up and in all, Josh Charles directed three episodes of The Good Wife One Per Season through Season Five. Um, so yeah, he is, uh, he's, he is directing this episode usually. And this is like a, this is quite a thing that happens in these type of shows. Like when an actor that's on the show directs the episode, they're not really in the episode.

[00:04:50] They, they make a little bit of a cameo and then they kind step back because, you know, being a director, you know, is, is, is a lot of work. And so I guess they don't have time to [00:05:00] act as well as direct. Um, so yeah, Will's going to take his exit off of the stage after he delivers Colonel Coon to Alicia and gets summarily dismissed.

[00:05:09] It was so funny 'cause even Alicia's like, but he's a partner and I'm just like fourth year colonel's, like I'm aware, I'm aware I by, uh, but basically she wants Alicia to take a case where a female JA officer was attacked, basically raped by a man, um, on the base. And because of the way that Modern Warfare works now, um, it was a person who worked for a contractor.

[00:05:34] And so this show is really, this episode in particular does a lot of things, well, one is kind of explaining the landscape of war in this moment in time because it's not just soldiers going out there, it is also contractors who contract with the military who apparently get the same rights. As people who serve in the military, one of them being that they cannot be sued or held liable for anything that happens while they're in the mil.[00:06:00]

[00:06:00] While not anything, but you know, for this particularly. Um, so this Jack officer's kind of in the middle here saying like, I can't sue the military, but I do wanna sue this contracting firm because I want some justice done somewhere. So basically Colonel Kon is like, Hey Alicia, we need you to take this case.

[00:06:21] Which I, again, Alicia is like, why me? But I thought it was a good pick. Yeah. I thought it was a good pick for her. So I think last time we saw Colonel Kon. Um, they had some, like, there was some issue, like it was the, the young lady that had bombed a village. Mm-hmm. And her contention was that she was ordered to bomb the village and there was some error or something.

[00:06:43] And I think, I think Alicia and the judge had kind of come to head about like, but these, these, these children are all dead. And the colonel, the judge is like, well, I mean, listen, that's, it's the war, that's the art. That's quote the art of war. Uh, so I think when, I think when Alicia left [00:07:00] last, the judge, she had this.

[00:07:02] They didn't have the greatest of, uh, of confrontations after that case. So at least she's like, oh, like you, I was the one you chose for this. Like, why Yes. Even says like, last time we met, it wasn't that great. Yeah. And it's like, Nope, we need you. Like this is, we need you. And it, it is proven quite soon why we need her because we go and we meet Captain Hellinger, who is the afo mentioned JAG officer who was raped in this case.

[00:07:27] And I gotta tell you, Jason, I have not seen this woman on my screen at all. Hot minute. Yeah, I was happy to see her here. But what has gone on with Amanda? Pete? Where is she these days? Do we know? That's a good question. So Amanda p is kind, was kind of like a, I would say late nineties, early two thousands kind of darling.

[00:07:45] Right? She was darling's the wrong word. She, she was on a lot of things. She was on a lot of stuff. I think she broke out in the comedy whole nine yards with Matthew Perry and Bruce Willis. Uh, she was on Studio 16, the Sunset Strip. She has been [00:08:00] around. Uh, but nothing that like stands out. I'm trying to look up her, IM d right now to see what she was la what she was last in.

[00:08:08] Uh, let's see. Your friends and neighbors. Oh yeah, yeah. The Apple tv, which on Ham. Yep. Uh, so that she's in nine episodes of that. So that's where she's most recently in, uh, oh, a TV mini series based on fatal attraction. I remember that. That was in 2023. Uh, dirty John in 2020. I don't know. Okay. Yeah. So she is, she's been around.

[00:08:29] Oh, Brockmeyer. I, I know what Brockmeyer is. So she's been here, she's been around. She just hasn't been like out there, out there like we're, we were so used to seeing her pretty much in anything and everything for quite some time. So, um, I'm glad, I'm glad she's still doing stuff because she's, you know, she's pretty good.

[00:08:46] She's a pretty good actress. Yeah. Uh, here she's playing again, captain Hellinger, who is a JAG officer who has been raped and she thinks she can do this. She thinks she can, you know, defend herself in court. And she's like, don't worry, Alicia, I don't need you. But [00:09:00] Colonel Kon is like. You need her because she knows civil law and you don't.

[00:09:05] And so why don't you just at least let her read the brief? And when Alicia reads the brief, she's like, yeah, this, the judge is gonna throw this out. Like, you're using too many adjectives. You're not doing all this stuff. You don't have the information you need to really go further. And so, um, captain Hellinger iss like, well, how do we do that?

[00:09:22] And Alicia's like, consultation over, do I have the job? Because I will help you if you want. Yeah. She's like, uh, I'm gonna need to get paid if I'm gonna say one more. More. Yeah. Good for you. Good, good boundaries there, Alicia. Yeah, we do. I, I like this because it kind of, it kind, it's interesting to show. The evolution for Alicia, because season one, Alicia might've been like too worried about saying the wrong thing.

[00:09:49] Doing the wrong thing makes she's too green. But this is like Alicia's in her, in her bag in this moment, she's like, I'm gonna school this young kid about how to like practice law in the, in the [00:10:00] civil way. But she's like, it's like, Hey, you, you want me to help you? You gotta pay up. Pay up girl. It was like kind of really coming to her own it.

[00:10:08] It was a moment for me to be like, Alicia's really like that. She's that girl. She's like, she is like, she's, she's, she's hurt. Well, and she, you know, has been a mentor, even though the mentorship didn't work out, she has. Mm-hmm. It had, you know, moments where she's doing. And even in this episode, I think she kind of sees a little bit of her old self in Captain Herher because Captain Andrew is like very eager.

[00:10:31] Like, what about in this? Mm-hmm. So we, we get to see a little bit of that here as well. Uh, luckily for us, the viewers, this case has been assigned to Judge Abernathy's Court. Always delight, always a fun time. Um, he opens up this court session by saying, I hope everyone's staying cool on this. Very hot day in November 0.1 for global warming.

[00:10:51] Mm-hmm. Point one for zero and he is like, okay, I won't talk about it anymore. But he's like, he's there. He realizes, okay, we're, we're here in [00:11:00] in court. There's a military woman in my court. So he then also makes this personal. Thoughts known here of like, I respect the uniform, even though our government decides to do really, really not the good things with you.

[00:11:11] But it's interesting, his stance in the military because it's, it kind of cuts both ways. He's like, I respect the military, but I don't agree with all things they do. Like, he, he kind of, he kind of both sides it in a way. I mean, also Judge Abernathy, I would love to see you in 2025. Like yeah, that would be, I would love to see something in his court.

[00:11:30] Uh, but yeah, I liked, I liked how he said that, but Martin s security is here and being represented by, by a man that I like. He, he is a legend to me. Okay. I dunno why. I think it was just like something, my dad like watched a lot of Brian Duney stuff. Yeah. And so like, anytime he came on, I was like, it's Brian Duney.

[00:11:51] Yeah. I, so I. Just by looking at Brian Dennehy, I was like, I know this is Brian Dennehy. I know this is a [00:12:00] guy. I can't say I've watched a lot of Brian Dennehy things. I, I looked up his INDB. I was like, I mean, nothing I would really watch. He seems to have been the, uh, titular, I don't know if he's a detective or a, like a person because it's, I forgot what the name was, but it was like, it was like the, uh, kind of like how, uh, blue Bloods guy, Tom Selleck.

[00:12:22] Mm-hmm. It was this like, uh, he's some other sheriff or something. His sheriff name. Uh, cool title name, uh, Bri Brian De. He has like five of those TV movies. Yes. Yes. Yeah. So where do you know Brian, didn't he from Marissa? Well, I think I know him from a bunch of stuff. Again, like I said, that my dad watched, but I did see him in a play in person.

[00:12:43] Ooh. Uh, when we, uh. I was very lucky to have parents that took me on like field trips and we would go to the theater and see things in Brian Dun. He was in this play and he just has like this presence. It's like, I don't think that when, 'cause I too was looking back through his [00:13:00] IMDB and I was like, why did do I remember so much?

[00:13:03] You know, like, why is he having this reaction in me seeing him again? And I think it's just because he just has a presence mm-hmm. And is so dynamic at what he does. 'cause here I really, I really liked his, I didn't like his character, but then I really liked his character. Yeah. Yeah. By, by by the end, they really, they really like, they really, uh, what am I trying to say?

[00:13:23] Uh, not legitimized, they really like, oh, why is the word escaping me? They, they redeem his character by the end of, by, by the end of an episode. Very much so. But in right now, he's playing a lawyer who, who's like, just call me Bucky. Mm-hmm. Bucky, uh, representing the, the, um. The company as opposed to the military here, Martin L Security.

[00:13:46] And he is arguing basically like they're immune from any si civil liability liability because they are part of the military. And there's this case that's basically said that like if there are people that are working on a [00:14:00] consultative basis with the military on military operations, active operations, they're covered by the same hierarchy, the same everything that the military is.

[00:14:10] So people can't sue the company. So like, okay. So if, if for, for some reason there's like a contracting company that would like be friends with, like an organization maybe that sounds like a, something you'd put in your beverage to make cold. Um. You know, and they like, I don't know, threw Tear sat you and you like had to go to the hospital because there was something there.

[00:14:39] You could not sue that consulting company because it was acting on government orders. Just hypothetically. Yeah. If that was the thing that would've happen. Sounds so farfetched versus, I don't know what you're talking about. I mean, that's why I chose it because like, you know, you just kind have something, how'd you come up with that fiction in your head?

[00:14:56] I don't get it. Um, but that's the basis, right, of [00:15:00] what's trying to be argued here. And um, so basically what I love about Judge Abernathy is he's like, if I could, I really would just like side with you, but you have to prove that Martin Health Security is subjective to the military or is not subjective to the military.

[00:15:16] Hi hierarchy for me to like continue let this case go forward. Right. And at this, this whole time, uh, captain Hellinger, a k Laura is looking, and she's like, they're going after affairs and she's, and Alicia knows that this case is co coming up. She doesn't even like, hesitate anything like that. And at the end of this little court scene, uh, Laura goes, you're good.

[00:15:40] And Alicia's, I've had a lot of practice. She's like, no, take the compliment. And I just, I really appreciate this entire episode from the perspective of, of a woman. Because like did you say of a woman? Of a woman? A woman. Woman. You said a woman. A woman. A woman. A woman. A woman. [00:16:00] A womb. A womb. Ann, get it? I think I, I think I just uncovered the origin of the word woman.

[00:16:07] Yeah. Watch out. History channel where you're, look at me. Look at me being smart.

[00:16:13] I think, I don't know. I, I just. It's hard to accept compli and you, and I think, like, at least for me, I, it reminded me like I've done things, but I will always say, oh, that's just because I practice a lot, or that's just because I did this a lot, or, oh, that's the thing. And I don't really accept any compliments.

[00:16:28] So the fact that Alicia, Alicia doesn't really accept any, that I was like, okay, this is not take, this is not a me thing. This is take her from some of the talks to Marissa on a weekly basis. She does not like to take compliments. She does not like to take thank yous or anything like that. Um, I'm working on it.

[00:16:42] I'm working on it. I, I know, I know. Um, I, I think Alicia here, like she sees this case and she's like, she's like, she tells, uh. Hellinger at the, at the end was like, let's win this. Like let's win this shit. Because it's like, we're she Elise's ready to fight for this? She's like, she, she's passionate about this, which rightfully so, because [00:17:00] this is kind of a, this is a very gross thing that happened to Captain Hellinger.

[00:17:04] I think Alicia does take this, like, take this on as, as a personal vendetta. Like if not vendetta, but a personal fight too. And that the government is the barrier here. The government is the thing that is not allowing, and, and what I really like about this entire setup is that, you know, we were introduced to, to Colonel Kuhn for many episodes.

[00:17:24] Not many, but a couple episodes. And she's very, by the book, she's like, this is what the military is, this is what I can and cannot do. And she knows that Hellinger was raped and she cannot do anything about it in her world. So she had to go outside of her world and lean on Alicia here to kind of move this forward.

[00:17:43] And that is like what women have to do all of the time. It's like James Brown was right. It's a man's world. And so like women have to. Figure out how to maneuver within this. And this was an example of like Colonel Kon being able to keep her integrity and keep her herself [00:18:00] safe in her world, while also trying to help Captain Hellinger.

[00:18:04] And we really, we've really done the work with Colonel Kon throughout all of her appearances. Uh, 'cause this is, this is yet another like, recurring character that we get an episode from at least once a year or once a season, I should say. Yeah. I love it. And, and she's, you know, when we first meet her, she's just like.

[00:18:19] Super cold Super by the book. Super. Like I have no emotion person. Uh, the, the second me, second, third meetings, we see like a little bit of humanity from Colonel Coon in different situations here. It's like she has a, she has a passion for this maybe based on past personal experience, things for her in the military.

[00:18:40] And we see her really being like a champion for Captain Hellinger in this moment. Almost like a, like you could, you could see, you could see that maybe like Kon is like a mentor to Hellinger. Yeah. She takes, she takes this under her wing so seriously, like, so much so as to like seek Alicia out and to do other things that she's gonna do later in the episode to make sure [00:19:00] justice is done.

[00:19:00] So like that is a real, like, it's a really great full moment, full moment, uh, character moment for, for Kat, for Colonel Kon, which I wouldn't even be surprised if like, this is the last time ever that we see Colonel Kon because it really feels like a full circle moment for this character to get this like.

[00:19:16] A really kind of personal story. I hope it's not because I enjoy, I enjoy her a lot and I also enjoyed like how sassy she was with Will at the beginning of this episode. We that point where she's like, I'm here to court-martial you. Ha. I also think it would be interesting to see Alicia and Colonel Kuhn face off again.

[00:19:38] Yeah. Where Alicia thinks they have some sort of like camaraderie now. Like Yeah, we good. Right. Colonel Coon's like, no, that's, I got a job to do. We not, we not sisters like you. I'm still a judge in your court. So I, you know, to go back to that kind of like stoicness of Colonel Kon after we saw such personal story for her to be like, Nope, I know we had a thing, but I'm still gonna be an impartial judge, so don't try and [00:20:00] suck off to me.

[00:20:01] I'm gonna show you so much that you can't suck off to me that I'm probably gonna like. Do stuff get, make it harder for you. Make it harder for you. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, that would be interesting to see afterwards. But I just wouldn't be surprised if like, this is like a full circle Colonel Kon moment.

[00:20:14] Maybe this is like her swan song of being on the, but yeah, like you said, I would enjoy, I, I, it is always enjoyable to see Colonel Kon in the mix. Her and or the like. Guy with the glasses in military court. I like him too. Yeah, he's cool too. Uh, okay. Back, um, in the case we have the CEO on the stand and basically here, Bucky Brian Dehe is saying like, you answer to the chain of command, right?

[00:20:39] So you're basically like in the military and the CEO is like, yeah, if we didn't do that, we would have chaos. So Alicia's response to this is like, oh, okay, you're part of the chain of command. What rank do you want me to refer you to? And like, everyone's like, okay, even Abernathy is like, I get your point, but you really kinda like, you still gotta prove it.

[00:20:58] Shut it down. Yeah. You, you [00:21:00] still gotta go, you still gotta do the work. Like that's not enough. So I think here we see that there is a comradery between Hellinger and Alicia because Hellinger is feeding Alicia rules on the penalty for insubordination in the, in the military. Different things about, um, the.

[00:21:15] The difference between an ask in an order and an email from the good old CEO here that basically is joking with the military, saying like, we're gonna go on strike until, um, we get what we want, which is considered insubordination. And Alicia makes this man read from the book and say, if there's any insubordination in the military, you'll get court marshaled.

[00:21:37] And did you get court marshaled? No. So she has proven that they are not part of the overall hierarchy that they are testing is like protecting them. So Abernathy says, okay, here we go. Like, let's get the case going. So they put Ricky Waters, the man who is accused of rape. AKA actually did it 'cause they make that pretty clear [00:22:00] this entire thing.

[00:22:02] Um, he's on the stand. He's again a consultant that is working with the military and he has the audacity. This is how I knew he did this. He's on the stand and he turns to Captain Hellinger and goes, Laura, I didn't mean anything by it. And Alicia is like, shut up. Like, do not, do not even try. No. Cut it brother.

[00:22:22] Don't do that shit. Like, he's like. Like, do not address my client. And if you do, it's Captain Hellinger. Okay. Like, yeah. And, and a lot of TV and media. That's an instant, like, oh, he definitely did it. Like yeah, he definitely did it. He, he he's that, that's how you know he's guilty. Uh, yeah. I like how he's like, sir, do not address my client, and if you do address my client, put some respect on her name and call her captain the Hellinger.

[00:22:48] Okay. Yeah, it was great. It was great. Uh, his side of the story is like, Hey, look, we were, we're getting drinks at the bar, and she kept hitting on me. And I, you [00:23:00] know, our offices are close together. So I followed her back to the office and she like, apparently took mistake or she took offense to my rebuffing of her advances.

[00:23:10] And, you know, you can see that I was in my office because I sent an email at oh 10. Oh. 10, which is 10 minutes after midnight. Mm-hmm. I'm not good with the military time peeps. I'll just let you know that. Um, and after this is like put out in court, he's just like, please don't let that be true. Please don't let that be true.

[00:23:28] And Colette is like, he sent the email. Yeah. It's true here. It's it's true, it's true. But there's good news because there was also another email sent from the office next door, which means somebody should be around as a witness. Mm-hmm. Uh, turns out, you know, military is gonna military and they're not letting, uh, Sergeant Wade Comp, I forget his last name.

[00:23:49] Compton. Huh? Compton. Compton be subpoenaed to come back to the US to be in this case. So, so both Alicia and Captain Hellinger go to Colonel Kuhn and are like, Hey. [00:24:00] Like we're in a bind here. Is there anything you can do? You know, Heer, she understands right away. She's like, Colonel, captain, they leave Alicia's like, what are we doing here?

[00:24:11] Like, are you gonna help us or not? Like, what is, what is going on? And Kun iss like, I can't, if I could do something, I would do something, but I can't do something. But it turns out she could do something. This is why I love the military cases, because there's always like one little bending. Like loophole, one little thing in there that can kind of make the whole case.

[00:24:32] At the beginning of this episode, Colonel Kuni lets us know that she's working on a panel about the mainstream of gender in the military. So she calls Sergeant Wade Compton in for this panel in Chicago and says, Hey, I got a question for you. What do you think about this? And he is like, uh, I guess it's good.

[00:24:51] Yeah, it's it's fine. It's okay. It's wait. Wade is like so confused why he is here. He is like, [00:25:00] y'all called me here. From Afghanistan? From Afghanistan for this. I wasn't down the street, I was a across the world. And you maybe get on a plane to just say, I'm fine with ma of gender Extreme. Be confused. I don't blame him.

[00:25:15] He is like, what the hell? Uh, but yeah, of course. There, you know, and I, I loved Colonel Co be like, there's just, there's just no way I can, I can do anything to make this happen. And then in her head, she's like, no, I got away. I'm just messing with him. I'm gonna, I'm gonna get him over here. And so, yeah. And the way that this comes about, just like, hey, like, yeah, I, I can, I can legally throw my weight around to do something and it also benefit you because this guy's back here in America, which is what you needed.

[00:25:44] So girls go get 'em. Yeah. And it's really cute because in both Alicia and Hellinger are in the courtroom when, uh, Wade is like Sergeant Wade is. Questioned about this, and Colonel Coon makes it super clear. She's like, [00:26:00] yep, that's our only question. Thanks for coming in. Have a great day. And Alicia gives her a little head nod, and then like the next thing, like, Hey, do you have some time?

[00:26:08] You know, like, we could use some help. And he's like, it turns out I have a lot of time. Mm-hmm. And so he ends up going on the stand. He testifies that he did hear a struggle during the night, and she, she did resist, you know, advances. And this is where again, Brian Zhe, this is where he, he earns my heart because he takes a look and he just like, looks at that, uh, waters man.

[00:26:30] Yeah. He is just like, you did do this, you jerk you. He did do this. Yeah. Like, okay, fine. Because Wade, Wade like lays it out there, like in vivid detail about what happened. Like he heard a struggle. He ripped, uh, Kevin Heller's like, uh, shirt, like he. There was like even talk of a demotion because like all of this stuff, and it, it was hard because Wade answered to waters, like Waters is basically his boss.

[00:26:59] Yeah. So [00:27:00] props to Wade for coming in here and, and acting. Because at first, you know, uh, Bucky is like, Hey, yo, we can't, that's hearsay. He can't, like, you can't make it. Let him testify and which is, you know, I didn't know this was a thing, but at least he's like, neither hearsay is disregarded. If the testimony he gives actually works against his own interest, which is what this would be because he's basically pissing off his boss right now by testifying against Ricky Waters.

[00:27:27] So, so why, why would this man come up here and lie if it's something that, that what he says is gonna work that against his own interest? It's like, oh, that is interesting. That is something that actually makes sense about the law. Not, not the fact that contractors are immune from, uh, from, uh. Litigation. I was like that.

[00:27:43] That's crazy. But this is actually makes sense and is, is interesting. So, uh, you know, props to Wade for, for doing this. Uh, I don't know why he, you know, I don't know. I wish I could have seen a little bit more of what Alicia and Haler said to him to convince him to do this. Yeah. Because it just went from, it just went from them [00:28:00] confronting him, and then he just in court the next, the next moment.

[00:28:03] I wish we could have seen his, if he had some hesitancy and they would then he said whatever to convince him, because, you know, he, he didn't, he, he's known this the whole time, but he didn't come forward because he was nervous about this. But whatever Alicia and Helen Drew said, got him to agree to come here, or maybe, you know, captain Coon.

[00:28:22] Had a little help in that aspect of like, you'll be protected if you say something. I don't know. I don't know. Um, but okay, so Bucky had looked over at Waters, did the thing, but then Yeah, like you piece of shit, he's looking at like, you piece of shit, but I still gotta do my job anyway. Yeah. And I mean, he does, he does do his job.

[00:28:41] He's like, oh, okay. Well if you heard all this, what time, what time did you hear this around? And poor innocent Wade. He's so cute. He's just like, I was waiting to email my girlfriend because of the time difference. So I knew it was like around midnight. It's like, oh, midnight night you say. Interesting.

[00:28:58] Here's the papers that show [00:29:00] that waters was called to active duty at midnight that day. So technically he is covered by the military hierarchy and Abernathy is like, I can't do anything here. Like he is, he is like, this is it. If you can prove that any of this happened before midnight. I can help you, but I cannot help you otherwise.

[00:29:21] Boy, loopholes help and loopholes hurt as well. Ooh. Yeah, because, because waters, in addition to being a contractor, was also a reservist. Correct. So, so yeah, he was, he was called from reserve to active and I af you know, at the time of the attack, so like you said, technically he was a active military person.

[00:29:41] So he is, um, he is immune from this type of litigation, which was like, ugh, bummer. Bomb town. And so Diane and Alicia kinda have to sit Laura down and Laura's such a lawyer. She's like, but I didn't feel scared until after midnight. And Alicia and um, Diane are like, listen, but did you think like you were [00:30:00] in danger at all any time before midnight?

[00:30:02] Like, can you do this and stop being a lawyer? We're your lawyers like you think about this as a woman? How, how, how much did this play in your mind at the time? So she goes on the stand and she's like, you wouldn't take no for an answer. I was, you know, feeling, I was feeling scared the whole time. So basically she sets the case for a prolonged assault.

[00:30:25] Bucky comes in and says, that's so cute. Just like cute as in trait, not as in cute as in anything else. Because I have this text message that you sent to your friend. On your way home from the bar to your office. And it doesn't sound like you're in fear for your safety at all. 'cause you say, good thing I have the day off tomorrow I'm off to catch some Zs.

[00:30:44] The fact, the fact, the fact, not that I have feelings about this or anything uhhuh, but like women can, it's like you're not gonna text, Hey, by the way, you don't like, especially in the military context. PS by the way, [00:31:00] I am walking from a guy, you know what I mean? Like some girl now I think it's a little bit more commonplace and especially 'cause like we do things like sharing locations and stuff like that.

[00:31:08] Like we've, but in 2012, like I don't think that women don't report for a reason. This is one of the reasons it's crappy because it's not as if she realized she was being followed in that moment. She thought it was over because she extricated herself from the bar. She thought that it was over the, the.

[00:31:32] Troubling activity of him, like not taking no for an answer. Started here. She thought she got away from it, but she didn't. So it was a prolonged encounter. We just had a little bit of a break until she realized that she was being followed by Ricky Waters and that's at when the assault took place. It was just like, I was like, I was like, that's bullshit.

[00:31:56] Like I literally typed my notes like she did. She didn't even know, she didn't follow though at the [00:32:00] time. She, she sent that, that text message. I was like, that's, that's bs. It was very much bs but unfortunately Alas Abernathy, after giving the situation much thought as he would, uh, starts off his judgment and, you know, it's not gonna be good because he is like to be denied.

[00:32:19] Justice once is horrible, but to be denied twice is exceptionally cruel. But unfortunately there's nothing I can do here. He was an active member. He can't be held responsible or, or liable for these, for these actions. And the case is dismissed at this point, river, or, uh, Ricky, I keep saying rivers. 'cause of the other one.

[00:32:40] Ricky Waters stands up and is like, thanks Bucky, thanks so much. Bucky's. Like, no way man. Like, bye. I cannot believe Get lost. Believe you exist here. Like, get out of my world, get lost, loser. I was like, oh, good, Bucky, good for you. I, I didn't wonder if like Brian Denny was like, [00:33:00] maybe show I'm a good guy, but like having this moment where I don't, uh, I don't shake his hand.

[00:33:05] We're not doing that. We're not doing that. And then he has, again, water says the audacity. He's like, well, if Bucky doesn't like me, I know what I'll do is I'll go, just make sure that I'm good with Laura. Right? Oh, like the person. So he walks over there. Ed Kon has no, no time was like, stand down, get outta here.

[00:33:21] And he's like, okay, I'll go now. She was, Kon was amazing. Her voice is like step back. Okay, cool. All right, cool, cool, cool. Uh, and I mean, listen, to have the unearned confidence of a mediocre white man is, uh, you know, a, a desire. May we all, maybe we all Yeah, for real. The audacity and the unmitigated gall of this man to decide to do that, to think he is, that's just okay.

[00:33:48] Now af knowing what he did, it is like, bro, you suck real bad. So, so bad. And you know, here [00:34:00] Hellinger recognizes her world. 'cause Alicia's like, we're gonna appeal. This was gonna happen. She's like, no, you know, I got him in court. That's more than I thought we would ever, we would ever get. Um, but what do I do now?

[00:34:12] And I was just like, well, you pick yourself back up and you go back out there. Mm-hmm. Um, the case of the week. Um, anything else though that I missed there, Jason, or anything else you wanted to comment on before we go through the other elements in this episode? No, I think, I think we got it. I think we, we covered it all.

[00:34:31] Yeah. I enjoyed it. I do enjoy this little military, uh, side sidebars of sorts and I like that it was on like civil ground and not in military court. We had, uh, some things happen with the firm. This episode, it was actually kind of funny because Eli's office is being used. Because Clark, of course, is like renting out offices, putting people in offices, trying to do all this stuff.

[00:34:56] And when he's confronted about it, Clark is like [00:35:00] this, well, it's just gonna have to happen. This is crap. This sucks. Yeah. Like all of this stuff. And Diana's like, what is going on? And also like Clark tells Eli like, look, you're, we're gonna get your business no matter what. You're a partner here. You get 5% off the top.

[00:35:14] Like, I don't know what to tell. Like you can pull this whole like campaign. When I win the campaign thing, we're gonna get more money, so I should deserve an office. But it's gonna happen whether you have an office or not because Yeah, you're here and, and Clark's like, listen, Bru. Yeah, I've been here in two months.

[00:35:29] 'cause you, y'all, you're busy, you're off, uh, gallivant with Peter on his campaign. So we decided since you weren't gonna show up, we can make some money by writing out your office. Eli of course is like, that's ridiculous. This will not stand. And like, and Clark gives him the, the riot act of like, you ain't going nowhere, bro.

[00:35:45] Like, 'cause Eli's like, I bring a lot of business here and I could bring the governor's business here because. Clark's like, come on in, come on bro. It's gonna happen anyway. You, you gonna come here either way. So why are you even playing these games? Which just, which not many people [00:36:00] shut Eli down. Eli was just like, ah.

[00:36:03] And he just turns and walks away. Well, and you by again, like Dan is like, he is right. Like, you know, this is, this is what's going on. And so there's another scene later in the episode where Diane and Clark are kind of reviewing the books. And again, we get this, like, this all sucks. This is crap. Diane's like, what the heck is going on?

[00:36:22] But she notices that Clark has been talking to Carrie a lot in this episode. So she goes over to Carrie and is like, Hey, what's going on with your buddy Clark over here? And i's like, well, he wanted to help. You know, I could talk to him, but also Diane, I just wanted to let you know, like, is Will mad at me because like, I haven't been on any criminal cases yet and this, this is.

[00:36:45] Pure carry negotiation because he is like, you want me to go talk to Clark? Get me on some criminal cases. And Diane knows it and she's like, oh yeah, sure, yeah. Lemme take a look. Lemme see what's going on. Turns out Clark was just reading Steve [00:37:00] Jobs's bio and apparently this was like a symptom of it because it happened at the state's attorney's office as well.

[00:37:05] And in the end Carrie did end up getting some criminal cases, so it works out for him. Yeah, I loved, I have Diane's little smirk while she relies Carrie with, and she's like, oh, there's my mentee's, there's my boy there, there's a guy. I've been, I've been training, you know, don't give something up without getting something.

[00:37:19] Good job, Carrie. So yeah, this, it's very interesting. Like, you're a, you, you know, rub my back, I'll rub your back or it's scratch. I was like, rub sounds wrong. I was like, you scratch my back, I'll scratch your back. And I was like, good, good thing come this little, uh, you know, little. Negotiation in, in here and, and come to something, which means we're like one step closer to seeing him back in court and facing one of his coworkers, hopefully Geneva Pine.

[00:37:46] That's right. It'll probably be Matan, but hopefully Geneva Pie. Gimme Geneva. So we'll see what happens there. Uh, on the Lin Front, luckily small, small amount of news to report on this episode. Um, but Nick ends [00:38:00] up losing the bid. To the, to the city for his tow truck business. Um, he's so pissed. He's like, but I had a black guy.

[00:38:07] Yeah. And I did all the right things by Chicago. Like I had all the stuff's. Like, well, he had the other person had a black guy and a female, so you should thought all that. Uh, you know, 'cause Alicia, Alicia has had enough of Nick. 'cause Nick, Nick comes in, he's all pouty. He like kicks the desk. Alicia's like, oh man, what the hell?

[00:38:28] And, and we, not only that, Carrie's also got eyes too. Mm-hmm. He's like, Hmm. They're, they are both like, good, he lost the bed. Just get him the hell out of our, our life. Yeah. Carrie, who still doesn't, who, who knows now something's going on with Nick Kalinda, but he doesn't know the exact things that's going on with Clinda and Nick.

[00:38:48] But I'm trying, he just, he doesn't like it. He does not like how Nick talks to Kalinda. And so he is carrying the situation. Mm-hmm. And so Alicia tells Clinda and Clinda iss like. [00:39:00] Cool, bye. Like she has like no response at all. And Carrie tells Alicia later in the episode like, Hey look, there is a way that this bid could be invalidated because it turns out on the other team there was a government, someone who, a government employee, and you can't bid to the city if you work for the city.

[00:39:19] So therefore we could have it inval, invalidated if we wanted to. You get my meaning, Alicia, wink, wink, and Alicia's like, I'll handle it. Don't worry about it. Like, oh, Alicia. I did not think though that this was her way of like handling it. So she, they go out for a drink and tells she, we don't even see the RESO resolution, I think of this handling because they go, they have a drink, tells Kalinda like, Hey, we could do this.

[00:39:47] Do you wanna do this? Do you love him? She says, no. Is he dangerous sometimes? Well, what is it? I have a hard time staying away from him. Yeah. And then that's it. How many times is Alicia [00:40:00] gonna ask if this man is dangerous? She's asked. She's asked like a thousand. Is he dangerous? She's told you the answer several times.

[00:40:08] Um, but yeah, I, I think it's more, this is more of a, like we see, but we, but the problem is we still don't know like why a NDA cannot stay away from this man. No. She says, I have difficulty staying away from him. And I'm like, is this a mirror for Peter and Alicia? Like, Alicia can't stay away from Peter. Is that what we're trying to do here?

[00:40:30] But also like, what was the resolution? Are we getting Peter, are we doing the bid or not? Like, I have no idea. I will find out in subsequent episodes, I'm sure, but I would love to just hear from Kalinda or see like, you know what would've been great? A flashback. Yeah. I know this, this, this show does not do flashbacks a whole lot.

[00:40:47] Um, but I would love, I would've loved a flashback to Kalinda and Nick. When things were good between them and when we, they had good moments. Just to give me some context of why [00:41:00] CO's doing this, like why co is this? Yeah. Is it choosing to stay with this man? Uh, or if it's not with them being good, unfortunately, it's more likely that it's something that happened bad in her childhood that keeps her linked to such a toxic situation.

[00:41:15] Um, but we have no context here other than what we see, which makes no sense to us at the moment. Yeah, because I, I, I get the whole, you know, you're in a toxic relationship, but you can't see your way out of it. You know, you feel like you, you feel like you belong there. You feel like you can't leave for whatever reason.

[00:41:34] But I, I need more context. And we're, we're gonna say that to her blue in the face. Every episode that Nick is in, we're gonna say, we don't get it until, until, nonetheless, they show us why Clinda is so enamored with this man, because all we've seen is real bad stuff. So I was like. And out of character stuff for Kalinda.

[00:41:53] Yeah. You know, like we even, like, she wouldn't, Blake did mean [00:42:00] things and she didn't stand up for it. This man is doing mean things and she lets it happen and Yeah. Understand. So I don't really is why understand why is she taking shit from this guy? Yeah. Well she hasn't taken shit from any other person in, in our orbit.

[00:42:14] Um, yeah. You know, so it is, it, it needs more, it needs more explaining, it needs more, it needs better writing to be honest. Uh, for sure. For sure. Uh, to wrap up this episode, we did have some things going on with the campaign and just to remind everyone, Mandy Magazine, think Mandy Magazine and then think, Maddie Money.

[00:42:34] Okay. Be important. Maddie, from the magazine questions. Maddie with the money, um, in the lobby while they're waiting. 'cause they're both, they're both there at the start of this episode and um, it's like, well what do you think about that story about Peter sleeping with the campaign manager? And we don't see Maddie's reaction, but we learned later.

[00:42:52] She just like up and left the office. She did not say anything. And Mandy on her way to like [00:43:00] talk to Eli is like, Hey, they're running the story. And Eli's like, you're running a story that has no truth. Well, it's topic conversation now, like mm-hmm. You gotta run it. And by the way, like Maddie was here. But she, she just up and left and he's like, Betty, I'm like, oh my gosh, where is, where is she?

[00:43:18] Um, and Eli is like, okay, we gotta take care of the story. Kalinda, what can you find out? Can you find out something that we can use on Mandy to stop her from printing the story? And at the same time, this really doesn't go anywhere, this episode, but I'm sure we'll later. Colin is very distracted in this whole conversation with Eli and brings up the picture that, um, Nick got from Lana's apartment.

[00:43:44] He basically asked Eli like, are you being investigated by the feds? It is about you, or this about me? Yeah. It's not sure because either one of us could be investigated by the feds for many different reasons. We not forgot who it's, it's bad no matter what. Yeah. Like this is happening. [00:44:00] And so then Eli brings in Christian Shuttleworth who played a reporter at the beginning of the season who wrote a story about Peter and basically lets it go of like, Hey, so you know, just so you know.

[00:44:12] Maddie, the person who got this story, um, her cousin went to jail while Peter was in, uh, the State's attorney. So therefore we think that this is retribution for that. And Kristen Genworth's like, I don't know, but I guess I'll check it out. And Jason, you found out some really interesting trivia about her because like, we don't, we only see Christian Genworth for a very small period of time in this episode.

[00:44:36] Yeah. She's just like there and then not. You know, I was on the IMDB doing my thing like I do, and under the trivia portion it was revealed that c uh, sorry, I gotta call Kirsten. Kristen Chenoweth suffered an onset injury while taping an episode of The Good Wife. It doesn't say this is the exactly the episode, but I am assuming since it was in this episode's trivia, that was probably [00:45:00] this episode that a piece of lighting equipment fell on Kristin Chenowith while she was taping The Good Wife.

[00:45:07] And it was like pretty big injury to her. It took her months to recover. She had like, was knocked unconscious. She had to form sentences again when she woke up. It was a pretty big, uh, big deal injury that happened to her. And Mercy, you said you had recalled this happening like in the real time? Yeah, I re yeah.

[00:45:26] 'cause I was like, oh my God, is she ever gonna sing again? Like, what's going on? Like. Bad news. Bad news, you know, like I just remember being worried. I'm not as concerned these days as I was back then for reasons, but Yeah, but we'll just, we'll just put it that way. Um, but I was concerned because, you know, she had become pretty popular through the wicked of it all, and then there was pushing daisies and she's making her, you know, she's around, she's doing her, doing her stuff.

[00:45:52] And I was just like, oh no, what's, what's gonna happen? But I remember the story of that and I also think like, [00:46:00] I think the rumor mill got around because for some reason I thought she got struck by lightning, but I don't know if she also got struck by lightning somewhere else. Like I don't know if that's like something else that to her.

[00:46:09] So we have, or Kristen with, yeah, we'll have to keep, keep her eyes open for other, because she was also on the West Wing and I don't know if that happened like on the West Wing as well or if that was with her character. My mind is kind of. Kinda a little muddy on that part, but yes, she was injured and out for a while.

[00:46:26] Yeah. So this might be the last we see of, uh, Peggy, AKA Chen a good wife. Yeah. And that will, that will be why, because that was a wild story that I, that I was like, oh, I did not know this had happened. I didn't realize it. Yeah. Yeah. So, but good on Eli for like, trying to find a way to make this work. Um, and also, I mean like, this is the bare minimum.

[00:46:50] He feel like good, good on Eli or trying to extort someone to do something he wants probably, but like, obviously for his uhhuh, you know, like he would, he didn't give [00:47:00] up. He didn't just say like, okay, the story's go going out. And Peter does tell Alicia like, Hey, the story's coming out. This is what it is.

[00:47:07] They are really like hitting us over the head with like, Hey. Peter's being communicative. Right? I know we've seen a couple times now he's directly calling Alicia, telling her all, telling her ever up to the minute details about what's going on. He's like, oh, okay. I, I guess it's a a way of don't fall for it.

[00:47:23] Don't fall for it. Yeah. I, I know mercy. You, you, you can't believe Peter did anything good, but he, I think they're, they're going outta the way to show like, Hey, he's trying to be a good guy. He's trying, he's trying to, he's trying do, do right by Alicia in this, in this instance, he's, yeah. And at the same time, Jackie is back and she, she had a care worker, which I was like, excited to see, but then she of course fires her right away.

[00:47:45] And I'm like, literally is like pushing pushes her away. Like, Jackie, come on now. Yeah. It was not great. Not great. And while on the phone, Peter's like, Alicia, do you know like anybody else? She's like, no, but why don't you try a man? Because maybe that'll [00:48:00] go a little bit better. And so we get to meet Christian.

[00:48:03] Christian is here he is. I think the perfect antidote to Jackie because Jackie's like, I don't need you. And he's like, great, I'll just collect my paycheck. Like, that's what it is. Yeah. Although he's Cuban, which does take Jackie a while to kind of accept Yes. As, as you would expect, if you know anything about Jackie.

[00:48:22] It's like, it's, it's, it's interesting to see because, you know, uh, it is like, because Alicia, Alicia has this moment of like, oh, I know exactly what to do. Hire her a man. It's, it's good to see this is the reason why people come to Alicia. She has these like epiphanies. She has these good advice ideas and give, gives Peter exactly what he needs this moment.

[00:48:43] A way to pacify Jackie. Yeah. And I love Christian because Jackie of course like, is like, Peter, I do not need this. I do not need this man or anything like that. And Cian like. Responds. I was like, great. Then I won't give, you know, I'll just collect my [00:49:00] paycheck. She's like, don't do not eavesdrop. He's like, well, don't talk so loud when you gossip.

[00:49:04] Like perfect gives perfect match. He gives as good as he gets. Yeah. Which is, which is what really is helpful here because he is like, I'm not gonna take your shit. Like, you know, I'm, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna push back on you. I was like, oh, okay. Yeah. And I gotta tell you, unfortunately, when you're at that age, that's what you need.

[00:49:21] You need someone, one who will call you out on your stuff and serve it right back to you, because that's just, at least that has been my experience with my grandparents. Yeah, for sure. It like that. I, I, I forgot to look up Christian. Oh yeah. Who is he? As we were doing our research, uh, Yu Vasquez, who. Very recognizable.

[00:49:44] Uh, Marissa, you might recognize him. Uhhuh from Severance Uhhuh. Yeah, he was, he was in the first season. That's you? Oh yeah. He was in a bunch of other stuff too. Like who else was he though? Uh, he's in, he's in movies. Bad Boys. Two American Gangster. [00:50:00] Yes. Captain Phillips Yu uh, Russian Doll. Yes. So he is, he is, he is, he is got a career.

[00:50:07] Like I, I know he was recognizable to me. I was like, oh yeah, I, I've seen that guy before, but just totally forgot to look him up. Thank you. Um, be before this. So I just kind of on the fly. He was trying to, uh, just trying to look it up. So yeah, he's, he's been in quiet a few things. He is, he is. He's known.

[00:50:21] He's definitely known. He, yes. And I loved him in Rushal. Rushal is also a good show anyway, but I'll talk about that. I have a whole other podcast about that, but not on the, the Rush Doll pod. Yeah, if you wanna check that out. The rush, the Rush Pod posted by Meza. It was a while ago, but it's out there. Um, okay, so yeah.

[00:50:40] Yay Christian. Yay. You all hopefully ha will be around a little bit more because we do see later Jackie's trying to read an ad and he's like, well maybe if you wear your glasses. Yeah. I mean by the, maybe you would do Okay. By the end of this thing, uh, Chris and Jackie are humming it up, which really weirds peter out 'cause he is like, uh, 'cause at first Peter [00:51:00] likes the fact that Christian's like pushing back.

[00:51:01] He's like, oh yeah, this is exactly what you need, Jackie. Go for it. And then he look at like. Is C Christian, is Christian trying to bang my mom like, what's going on here? No, because he's like talking about dancing Uhhuh and we just gotta teach you the, you know, teach you the ma, I think it was the Mambo.

[00:51:14] We just gotta teach you that and you're gonna be fine. And then also like Eli's like, listen, she's happy. She's out of our ear. Out of her face, like mm-hmm. Just let it be. So we got that going on. And then we also find out that Maddie has plans of her own. So Maddie was at the office, not to talk to Eli, but to talk to Alicia because she wanted to tell Alicia.

[00:51:36] And she does go later in the episode and tell her, Hey, P by the way, I'm gonna be running for governor. That cool? Cool. Are we cool? Are we good? I know it'll probably affect our friendship, but I, you know, I thought Peter could be our feminist candidate, but obviously based on this news, it's not gonna work.

[00:51:55] So I'm just gonna self-fund and I'm going to run for governor. I [00:52:00] do have to say, um. I currently live in a state of Illinois where the governor self-funded of his own, um, elections, and it works out pretty good. I still got rights. I still got stuff. I'm just saying just FYI, uh, this is not a foreign concept to me now, but, um, when Matt was doing it, probably not a good idea, but, uh, I was like a billionaire that runs for office.

[00:52:25] What could go wrong? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, like we're very, like, it's very skeptical and I don't think, yeah. It's very weird living in a state that run by a billionaire who's a governor who also like, has a brain and mm-hmm. That like, does very weird. But, uh, yeah. Maddie is, this is like, again, this is 2012, so this is like when this whole, I think like Bloomberg is doing some stuff, like we had some of these people entering races and.

[00:52:55] So she stops by and I thought, like, what do you think about this? Because Alicia goes [00:53:00] over and says, Hey, Eli, PS by the way, Maddie is running for governor. And also, I kind of told her some things because she befriended me. So, do you buy Maddie's line of thinking here? Saying like, I befriended her, and then like, I didn't know I was gonna run for governor, but I it just ended up doing it.

[00:53:15] Or do you think from Alicia's point of view, like she was used the whole way? So it's interesting. Right. Well, let's talk about Alicia's reaction to what Maddie told her as well. 'cause Alicia, I think it immediately is suspicious and like, oh, okay, so you used me this whole time. Is is like Alicia's thought?

[00:53:35] Yeah. Like as Maddie's trying to tell like, oh, we can, you know, we can still be friends and all this. Alicia's like, uh huh, sure. Yeah. Right. So basically she gets monosyllabic and be like, like whatever Maddie says, she's like, Uhhuh. Yeah. And like mm-hmm. She has, she has Alicia face of like. I'm agreeing with you now, but I want you outta my face.

[00:53:51] Like, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And Maddie's, Maddie sees it. She's like, okay, well I guess I'll just leave. And so like you said, she goes, she runs, she literally runs to Eli's like, Hey, [00:54:00] emergency, emergency, Maddie's running her governor. She knows some inside Goss that I told her about Peter.

[00:54:08] Every Eli's was like, you told her about you and Will. And she's like, oh, no, I didn't tell him about me and Will. Um, but yeah, there's some other, some other stuff, just some other like, I guess like annoying stuff about Peter or things, how she feels about Peter and his, all of his scandals. So, but, and I think about it and I say, well, at.

[00:54:28] The genesis of this was not Maddie seeking out Alicia. Alicia fell into Maddie's lap via Diane asking about Right. The, the leasing rental agreement of their building. So sh But she, Maddie asked to talk to Alicia about that, did she not right, but it, but without Diane coming to her. Sure. Okay. Okay. Maddie wouldn't have necessarily had a reason to, unless you wanna go all the way back and be like, Maddie bought that building because she knew it was Alicia, the building Alicia worked in, and she just knew Diane would [00:55:00] come to her about the lease.

[00:55:01] Um, but I, is there is, is there something to say that once Alicia did fall into Maddie's lap, Maddie, just start thinking, oh, this would be a good idea. But also I th I think Maddie, I think Maddie talking to Endear star is part of what kicked this off, because apparently Maddie does not believe at all about.

[00:55:24] What Alicia's saying, what Eli's saying, what Peter's, for some reason Maddie believes in De a Star, which I'm like, but if you believe in De A Star, you believe that Alicia's okay with this. I refuse to believe the person that you are calling a friend Maddie. You would know that is, would not be okay at the open marriage.

[00:55:41] I'm like, I don't know. What do you think? Like do you think this is a, this was a sinister thing that Maddie did? I tended to think, no. I tend to think this is the idea she had after she met Alicia. I also, I agree with you. I think it's something I [00:56:00] like when we're introduced to her character. She's very much like, this is who I am.

[00:56:04] I've set up my whole life to like live by my values to do all this stuff. I'm trying to be the best person I can be, even though I have all this money, like trying to have my money do good. Um, I think it's really messy and I think it happens quite often in friendships in terms of like, let's be friends, but then also.

[00:56:24] How small is this world? You know? Like somebody knows somebody who knows somebody. And Maddie also was in like Eli's circle and stuff like that, and she's very involved in the political scene anyway, as an advocate, as um, a donor as things like that. So she's trying, she sees this as a, as a way to live her mission to help with her things and use her money for good.

[00:56:54] I just think. It's unfortunate and it's messy in terms of how this, I'm like trying to think, is there another [00:57:00] way she could have gone about it? Is there she did have, you know, the decency to one come to Alicia and say, Hey, I wanted you to be the first person to know before we announced that this is what's going on.

[00:57:11] So I do think that there was something like that. But I also understand from Alicia's point of view of like, I don't have any friends. I try to talk to the one person, like first I was friends with Kalinda and that went that way, and now I'm friends, you know, with this lady and this lady's, you know, doing this.

[00:57:27] And so I, I kind of understand both ways and I think it's just like the consequence of unfortunate events. Yeah, for sure. And you know, I wanted, I wanted to give Maddie the benefit of the doubt and then she goes and tries to Yeah, boss up on boss up on Peter. I was like, oh, like, oh, you, you are a shark. And because Maddie basically goes and tells Peter like.

[00:57:53] I'm gonna crush you 'cause I got money. You don't. And, but hey, I'll also, [00:58:00] if you drop out now, I'll let you, my lieutenant governor, well, like, she's also like, listen, you're not gonna be governor either way. 'cause I'll either crush you in the dumb in the primary because I have money. If you win, Kristi has more money than you like.

[00:58:12] Yep. You and I'm gonna pull the female vote. I'm gonna hurt you so much in the primary that you ha you stand no chance against Tiva. So if you wanna be involved in government at all, the best thing for you to do is kind of just like, drop out now and become my lieutenant governor. And, which I was like, Maddy, you claim to do this because you don't like Peter because Peter.

[00:58:35] Why would you wanna work with him? Right. So like, but why are you now wanting him to, he's not getting him to be governor, but he's gonna him to be lieutenant governor. I was like, Hmm, that's weird. That's not cool. Who do you think is advising her campaign? Uh, I mean, Stacy Hall is, is, is the first name that leap to mind.

[00:58:55] Yeah. Um, which, which would be an interesting way, we haven't heard anything about, um, [00:59:00] Eli's ex in a while, so I don't know. You haven't, yeah. If that's still going on. But I wouldn't be surprised if Stacy, because Stacy Hall seems like the perfect person to be on Maddie's side. So I would be surprised if Stacy Hall comes back in that form.

[00:59:12] Um, but yeah. What'd you think of what Peter said to her? He was like, the, the worst, uh, worst thing than a liar is a hypocrite. 'cause they don't know they're lying. It was like very interesting. Yeah. I mean, well, a couple things were revealed in that one he's going to use, and I think he does care on this.

[00:59:29] Like you used Alicia. And that's not good with me. But he's going to say that to like anything, like, you did this wrong against my wife, I'm gonna, you know, like he's, that's, that's his play. Um, but I think when it comes, he says, I have no problem. He admits to a couple of things before the hypergrowth. I have no problem trusting a mobster, a con man.

[00:59:50] So those are things that he admits to doing. But I cannot trust a hypocrite because the hypocrite doesn't even know they're lying. And [01:00:00] I, I get like, sometimes he's been a hypocrite sometimes, you know, and also like the hypocrite, a hypo, uh, the definition of a hypocrite is what somebody who says something and does the opposite, right?

[01:00:14] Yeah. But what Maddie has done in this situation is that she had said something that was true for her at the time. And then she has switched her opinion and is now acting on what's true for her at that time. And people are allowed to change their, I think this is like where we get into like the whole cancel culture of it all and like this is like where we are right now as a society of like people can't change their minds.

[01:00:33] They posted something like 800 years ago and held to which I do think that people should be being able aware of what they posted, but like people, we don't allow people to change. And so I think that here we're, Peter's doing the same thing to mad of saying like, you're a hypocrite. When I think, I don't think the label sticks well.

[01:00:50] Is it a hypocrite? Because it's like you say I should be governor because I'm a horrible person, but you think I should be you lieutenant governor, like. Maybe [01:01:00] you, you, you condemn me for these acts, but then you, at the same time you asked me to work with you, like Yeah, that's true. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I guess then in that case, sorry, I was like, I, my, you know, my first line is like, Peter's wrong.

[01:01:13] Yeah. I, I love, like, as Maddie enters, like, you know, Peter's sick of making these financial calls. He is like, I'm done. Is there any more financial calls? And Eli is off somewhere being like, of course there are more financial calls. Eli's being a little, uh, exhibitionist by like listening in a little opper.

[01:01:29] Yeah. Peter, mad convo. Uh, so that was an interesting like, you know, end of that storyline, but that, that is, that whole thing is what gets Peter to say at the end of this, let's do this. Like mm-hmm. Let's start it. So just as Alicia was like fired up to do the case, you know, uh, after she had met with, um, Laura and everything and had her time in court, like, I now kind of, not fear, but I would not be surprised if some of.

[01:01:59] Peter [01:02:00] and Eli is more under the table during year work kind of comes out. Yeah. Because of Maddie entering the race. Yeah. Although we don't have to worry about Mandy because Mandy got fired. Uh, or maybe we do because maybe she'll start a blog. I don't know. I don't remember. But I love that Mandy Mandy's like, Eli, you gotta be fired.

[01:02:19] He's like, oh, sorry. I'm so sad about it. Uh, I do feel a little bit bad, I guess. Like, good on you, Eli. Good on you. Um, okay, so that was our episode. Good folks. Um, Marissa, you wanna tell the good folks where they could find you on the interwebs and what you're talking about? Well, Jason, besides right here on the Good Pod, both on podcasts and on YouTube talking about both the Good Wife and sba, you can find me on Whirlwind Podcast Network, talking about Pretty Little Liars when I'm previously honored at a time or talking about Star Trek, the Next Generation with my sister or on our podcast, the uss new episode.

[01:02:57] Coming soon. New episode coming [01:03:00] soon for the US s sisterhood. Yes, that is true. New episodes coming soon, and other than that, you can find links to everything at it's me, marissa g.com. Jason, that's what's up with me. What's up with you? You can check me out. Talking about all about love shows. I, I'm curious as to know if any anyone just knows me for this podcast.

[01:03:19] They're like, why is Jason talking about reality? Love shows. It's, uh, it's my main gig to be honest. Uh, I, I, I am wrapping up talking about Loves Blind Season nine with my co-host, Asia Welch, Mary Kowski. Uh, let's just say we are happy to be wrapping that season up as it was a hot ass mess. Uh, we just, we just, uh, released our reunion recap in the last few days, so check that out.

[01:03:42] You can also hear me and a Welch talking about the show made at first sight. Uh, that is our main. Gig, we were talking about it on the Rod has Podcast Network on the love at first sight feed. If you just type in love at first sight, you'll find the feed for Mary first sight. And the same feed has that levels blind content I was just talking [01:04:00] about.

[01:04:00] If you just can't get enough with those things, you can join me and Asia over on Patreon where we have bonus content about Maria First Sight, where we talk to Maria first sight past participants about their thoughts on the current season. So that's where you can find me and all of my fun musings and fun things to talk about.

[01:04:20] Uh, so that was, uh, that's the episode for this week, you all, and until we see a next time, stay good.

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