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From Here Forward shares stories and ideas about amazing things UBC and its alumni are doing around the world. It covers people and places, truths, science, art, and accomplishments with the view that sharing better inspires better. Join hosts Carol Eugene Park and Jeevan Sangha, both UBC grads, in exploring solutions for the negative stuff out there — focussing on the good for a change, from here forward.
[00:00:00] Carol Eugene Park: Happy New Year to our friendly alumni. Welcome to From Here Forward, the informative, funny UBC Podcast Network podcast. We're your girls, Carol and Jeevan.
[00:00:15] Jeevan Sangha: And once again, Happy New Year.
[00:00:17] Carol Eugene Park: I just love that you copied me, but I respect it. Happy New Year to you, to me, to us all. I hope you all made some fire New Year's resolutions because I didn't not to be a hater, but I just like New Year's resolutions I think are overrated.
[00:00:31] Jeevan Sangha: Really?
[00:00:32] Carol Eugene Park: Because you are, you're setting yourself up for failure is my take. I respect it. I support it. But I am constantly fighting for my life. I'm like, I'm gonna be like really good and journal. No, day two, I'm bored. I'm gonna try to work, no, she's dead. Like, you know, I just, nothing ever works for me.
[00:00:50] Jeevan Sangha: So cynical, But I, I get it, like I think when you're too rigid with your New Year's resolutions, it can feel really restrictive. And then you're just like, oh, January, end of January has come around and I haven't achieved any of it. But I think for me, it's nice to have things that we want to improve on or things that we want to implement into our lives without having it be like a, the weight of a resolution.
[00:01:10] And you know, in thinking about people who have done a lot with their lives, flawless transition. Today, we chatted with Bill Nikolai, a UBC alumni who is a multi hyphenate in almost every single sense of the word. In addition to working as an academic librarian for many years, Bill is also an actor, a teacher and, get this, a recreational paraglider.
[00:01:34] Carol Eugene Park: He can do it all, and as we start a new year, some people might be thinking about new opportunities for adventure, for growth, for improvement. I surely am not, but you know, who better to learn from than Bill?
[00:01:48] Jeevan Sangha: Totally. Bill was a great person to chat with, So, without further ado, let's glide into the interview.
[00:01:55] Carol Eugene Park: Okay. So, Bill, why don't you give us a little intro into who you are and what you do?
[00:02:00] Bill Nikolai: Sure. I'm a retiree, I'm a Q tip guy with gray and white hair. but I, have lots of passions and a lot of them have to do with adventure of one sort or another. Quick background. I retired as a librarian. Prior to that, I'd done a bunch of things, including working in Japan as an English instructor at various universities. I worked on a TV show for five years as a stand in, photo double, had a small role in the show. There's a whole variety of stuff that I've done in the past, so yeah, my life is actually a never-ending adventure.
[00:02:27] Jeevan Sangha: We are an alumni UBC podcast, so maybe to start, can you take us back to your years at UBC? What were they like, and how did they shape your, you know, your forthcoming interests?
[00:02:37] Bill Nikolai: Yeah, so it all started in 1975, which is, I know, ancient history for most people listening to this. But I did a BA in International Relations, which was a multidisciplinary subject area.
[00:02:46] I think it still is. You can draw from history, psychology, philosophy, all kinds of different courses. And I think it's because I do have an eclectic interest, like a wide range of interest. That, I followed up with a teaching certificate, so I am still actually in the BC Teacher Registry. Never really did much teaching at the public-school level, which is what I was trained to do during that one year.
[00:03:08] Did a lot of research instruction when I worked as a librarian. So subsequently after the teaching certificate did an ESL diploma, did a master's in education, ended up in Japan for some time, and then came back after my second stint in Japan and did a second master's degree at UBC. And this one happened to be in library and information studies.
[00:03:28] And that's what took me into the library world. I worked as an academic librarian at Vancouver community college before retiring just before COVID, which was the perfect time to retire. So. Yeah, all of my, all of my academic background was at UBC, and it very much shaped a lot of what I was doing.
[00:03:42] Even the little stint in, in, in television, it's an ongoing stint, I'm still working occasionally in, in the business, I took film courses at UBC, I almost would have done what would be considered a second major in film and television, took acting classes, appeared in one main stage production at the Freddie Wood. So yeah, a lot of what I did at UBC informed who I am and where I've traveled in life.
[00:04:05] Carol Eugene Park: That's a lot of stuff, Bill.
[00:04:08] Bill Nikolai: I just used up most of the podcast, I think.
[00:04:11] Carol Eugene Park: No, that's very cool. Before we get into your library and your acting stuff, you're in the world of paragliding, which is crazy.
[00:04:20] Bill Nikolai: Yeah. So, paragliding for those of you who are not really familiar with it, its basically foot launched free flight.
[00:04:26] Well, we're using a wing that's collapsible, very much like a parachute canopy, right? So, the first time I actually saw it live and in person was while doing a hike in the Fraser Valley, a mountain called Mount Cheam. It's probably the highest mountain in the Fraser Valley, it's a beautiful peak. Got up there and found a gentleman who was unfurling or unpacking a very large backpack.
[00:04:49] He proceeded to hitch himself into a harness along with his passenger, who I learned later was his wife, and they flew off the mountain down into the valley. And I thought that is the way to go. You put in the sweat equity to get up the mountain and then you take the easy way down, right? So, that was my first encounter.
[00:05:04] That's how I got really interested in it. The following year, I did what I like to call a crash course. And it was a three-day course where I kind of got introduced to it firsthand, hands on, did five solo flights during that first weekend. And then follow that up with a two-week intensive novice course the following year in the Okanagan where I actually got a rating.
[00:05:25] We are kind of a self regulated sport, and I got my novice rating a year later over that two-week period. So that's how I got into it, back a quarter of a century ago now, and I'm still doing it. So, it hasn't killed me yet.
[00:05:39] Jeevan Sangha: How would you describe being up there that keeps you wanting to, you know, maximize your time in the air?
[00:05:44] Bill Nikolai: Oh, wow. There's, there's so many things going on. I mean, part of it is the view. I mean, you're, you're flying. and experiencing a perspective that really only birds get to experience. And even if you're in a motorized aircraft, you're not [00:06:00] getting the same sense of, of flight because when you're flying a paraglider, you're flying basically low and slow.
[00:06:05] By that, I mean, you can fly very close to the terrain. You can see stuff like deer running through the woods. I've had hawks and eagles. curious birds circling in a thermal with me. Perspective is absolutely amazing. And it's, I think, similar to scuba diving in some ways. You're in an alien environment and, you know, you, you're seeing stuff that you normally wouldn't see unless you're watching something on [00:06:30] television or you're in an IMAX theater or something like that.
[00:06:32] But it's just a really different experience to be in there yourself. And it really puts you in the moment. I think that's something that I have to say about adventure in general is that you, You kind of forget about or put aside anything else that may be bothering you, worrying you, whatever it might be, and you're very, very focused.
[00:06:48] And that's something that's, I think, amazing about experiencing adventure is being in the moment, being in the present. And really being focused on something. There are lots of other things I could tell you [00:07:00] about flying, but you know, there's, there's the just the idea of, of being able to deal with a certain amount of risk, you know, anytime you're more than 10 or 12 feet off the ground, you're experiencing a risk.
[00:07:10] And that risk is coming into violent contact with the ground. So. you know whether you're climbing a ladder or you're hiking a steep slope or you're paragliding, you're dealing with the risk and you're trying to mitigate that risk and you're trying to manage that risk. And if you're successful, which hopefully you are more than just say 99 percent of the time, then.
[00:07:30] You experience a certain amount of self confidence, I think, and success in being able to handle that risk. And so often, we just never put ourselves in those situations where we can, we can deal with that. So that's, I think that's something that's beset for, for any kind of adventurous endeavor.
[00:07:44] Carol Eugene Park: My hands are sweating.
[00:07:46] You're talking about, you're talking about heights. And I am I'm so scared of heights. I'm just, things are moist. A lot of things have changed over the last few years, climate change, whatever, etc. Have you noticed like, oh, like this looks different [00:08:00] from maybe a few months ago or years ago? Anything that's stuck out to you?
[00:08:05] Bill Nikolai: Yeah, maybe not so much in paragliding, but something maybe a little more mundane. Mundane is not the right word. Hiking. You know, yesterday I was looking through some old photographs that they go back to the early eighties, and we were hiking locally and I'm thinking specifically of a place called Wedge Mount Lake.
[00:08:21] And it's a fairly rigorous hike. It's just north of Whistler. You're gaining about 5, 000 feet of elevation over the course of [00:08:30] two and a half hours or so. And at the end of is a glacier, and that glacier, in the photographs I was looking at yesterday, that glacier was calving directly into the lake. In other words, the glacier was probably about 25 feet in thickness at the lake's edge. And now, I mean, I haven't been up to Wedgemount for a few years, but my understanding is that that glacier has receded tremendously. It's back, probably couple of hundred meters at least. [00:09:00] I could be wrong, but I think it's in that neighborhood.
[00:09:02] So, so yeah, definitely when doing things in nature locally, there's definitely evidence that change is happening. Paragliding, maybe not so much because I mean, I'm not a cross-country pilot. I should explain that. In paragliding, some people like to go vast distances, I'm talking like a hundred or two hundred kilometers in a single flight. So, if you do that on a regular basis, I'm sure that you're going to see some geographical changes that, you know, we can assume are, are largely due to the weather. [00:09:30] So yeah, perspective is everything.
[00:09:31] Jeevan Sangha: Speaking of perspective, perfect transition.
[00:09:34] Big question coming up. What lessons do you think paragliding has taught you that you've been able to apply in other parts of your life. I know you mentioned like being in the present, but is there anything else in terms of that entire process or perhaps the certain level of risk that comes with it that you've been able to apply into other aspects of your life and your growth as an individual?
[00:09:57] Bill Nikolai: Yeah. I mean, I think anybody who does any kind of [00:10:00] aviation would probably agree that you, you really need to be aware of and you need to mitigate. risk. And when it comes to paragliding, often weather is a, is a big risk or it can be. And so, you know, because you're essentially flying a very slow aircraft, top speed is only maybe 50 kilometers an hour. And in the air mass, you're subject to some serious problems. If, if the weather takes a sudden turn for the worse. I mean, more so than a powered aircraft, because you can power through violent updrafts, especially if you're say an airline pilot, [00:10:30] you've got a very big aircraft flying at very great speeds and you can, you can basically just fly above a lot of that stuff or just go through it very quickly.
[00:10:37] So yeah, so every, every time I fly, I'm looking at the weather. I've had, you know, a few instances over the 25 years that I've been flying that have made me think about my decisions. I mean, I can think of one in Okinawa where I was about to do some soaring on the seaside. And it was going to be very low altitude soaring just back and forth along a beach.
[00:10:57] And I should have known better, but looking [00:11:00] offshore in the distance, I could see some dark clouds. And of course, when dark clouds dump rain, they push air ahead of them. And so, in this case, that offshore cloud dumping rain pushed essentially what we call a gust front towards the shore.
[00:11:12] And I was pretty much yanked off of my launch. And then I just remember the man who was leading the local Japanese flying club, yelling at me, fly the glider, fly the glider. And I tried to fly the glider, and I flew it right into the mangrove forest that was right behind launch.
[00:11:27] So, there's no damage done not to myself, not to the [00:11:30] glider. But it did take about a half an hour for people to come and help extricate me from the mess that I found myself in. Mangrove forests are very tangled.
[00:11:38] and more recently, a couple of years ago, I had an incident by that, I mean about, I'd say a third of my glider collapsed and put me into a fairly tight spiral, a spiral dive. And it was probably due to wind shear, air masses kind of moving in opposite directions. and it took a lot of quick [00:12:00] thinking and some luck that, that got me out of that situation.
[00:12:03] But, while I was only 200 meters off of the surface in North Vancouver, over a bunch of houses, and in 10 seconds I lost half of my altitude. So, I was moving down at over 30 kilometers an hour for about 10 seconds, and you know, a lot of things went through my mind at that moment.
[00:12:26] I managed to put in the correct inputs to stabilize [00:12:30] the glider and, and get myself out of that situation, but I still had a bunch of decisions to make as I was no longer able to go to my usual landing area. I had to kind of thread the needle between a couple of trees and skid out a landing on a on a lawn.
[00:12:43] You know, I had, I had a little bit of PTSD after that for about a week. So, I would say that's certainly something that that paragliding has kind of taught me is to try to prepare and mitigate the risk.
[00:12:55] And that, you know, it's probably a good life lesson for anybody. Whether you're in business or you're [00:13:00] studying for an exam at UBC. I recall a history test that I, it was history 432 as a matter of fact, history of the great powers of the 20th century. And I studied two solid weeks for the final exam.
[00:13:12] And what I was trying to do was figure out what was the minimum number of questions that could possibly be posed on the test, you know, that I could answer. And so, it took me two weeks. I mean, I, I figured out that if I studied this question, that question, and I think it was about seven other ones I would be [00:13:30] sure to be able to answer at least three of the questions that would appear on the test.
[00:13:35] so yeah, preparation, it was all about preparation and mitigating the risk that I would encounter something that was unexpected. And yeah, so, you know, that's, it's not a bad life lesson.
[00:13:47] Jeevan Sangha: Who would have thought there'd be a tie between history 432 and paragliding?
[00:13:53] Every UBC student has the one test they remember in detail.
[00:13:58] Bill Nikolai: Oh, yeah, yeah. That's [00:14:00] that's definitely one test that I remember. I mean, I was lucky. And it all worked out.
[00:14:03] Jeevan Sangha: And another question for, for when you're up there, and this might sound silly to you, but like no music, nothing like you're just up there, like fully present in the moment.
[00:14:15] Bill Nikolai: Well, you know, I do have friends who fly with music. One friend, Rod. Rod, if you're listening to this, I do appreciate your music on launch sometimes. Other times I'm trying to focus what I'm doing. but no, I mean, I have. Early on, I, when I was living [00:14:30] in Okinawa, I did fly with some music.
[00:14:32] But I just thought it wasn't for me. I mean, in Okinawa is often flying solo, but locally here, we all use Two-meter band shortwave radios. And so, we want to be able to communicate with each other. And so, I, I tend to avoid music.
[00:14:44] Carol Eugene Park: So, you've worn many hats over the years from librarianship, academia, acting, and paragliding. I'm curious how you see those interests connecting with each other, if at all.
[00:14:54] Bill Nikolai: Oh, wow. They, they are, I mean, I guess the outlier would be probably the librarianship. You know, getting [00:15:00] back to academia and UBC, et cetera, I've always been interested in information and organizing it, sharing it, helping people find it.
[00:15:09] And so it was almost a logical kind of graduate. Degree to do librarianship seemed to be a good way to kind of ladder up and leverage the previous academic background.
[00:15:20] And I honestly, I found it a fascinating area to be in. I mean, everybody has these stereotypical ideas of librarians, you know, the shh and the bun and you know, like, [00:15:30] but it's it's really not like that. It's, it's all about helping people find and organize information, which I think is more important now than it ever has been.
[00:15:38] in this age of misinformation and, and, and fake news. So, what ties it all together? So, I mentioned that the library part of it is kind of the outlier, but the, the rest of it really is kind of tied together by, by adventure, I think in some ways you know, my Linda and I moved to Japan.
[00:15:56] Almost on a whim, I had an opportunity to substitute [00:16:00] for the brother of a friend who is going to finish his PhD. So, I, I had the credentials to teach English at a university in Japan, but this job just kind of happened along and we had no idea you know, what the circumstances, the living circumstances would be, or even what the salary would be.
[00:16:14] We just decided to take a leap and go there and, and it worked out really well. And that's kind of, Been the trajectory throughout my life. I mean, if an opportunity presents itself, then then go for it. The the film and TV stuff the bulk of [00:16:30] that was five years on a sci fi show called Stargate SG one.
[00:16:33] And. That was an adventure. Every day was new. We were doing something different, and you know, one thing led to another. I was photo doubling one of the actors. I'll never forget one day where I was asked to photo double the, the actor and it involved holding a gun and then falling to the ground which doesn't sound like a big deal.
[00:16:54] It's not really considered a stunt, but I had broken a couple of ribs just prior to [00:17:00] that doing, ironically, Pull ups in my underground parking at the condo, and just to fall on the ground holding this big ass gun was, was actually really tough. Like, it hurt like hell, but anyways yeah, there's, there's always some adventure.
[00:17:16] I subsequently got a small role in on a TV movie called First Target. And in that one, I was actually asked to do a stunt and the stunt involved getting kicked by a very beautiful woman and knocked into [00:17:30] the water and then drown and. So, you know, there's adventure in all of that, right? I mean, there's the danger of actually really getting kicked.
[00:17:38] The English teaching was travel, so that's adventure. And sometimes it, it does turn into misadventure. You're not expecting it to be super adventurous, but it can happen. I recently published a story in the Vancouver Sun about a trip to, to France where My wife and I lost two iPhones and a wallet all during the same trip.
[00:17:59] So [00:18:00] it was, it was a trip where we were doing some bicycling. We're doing a bunch of other stuff, but the story on that trip for me, at least as far as what I was putting into print was the misadventure of getting pickpocketed. Three times, actually, on the same trip.
[00:18:17] Jeevan Sangha: That's hilarious and crazy. I can't even imagine, you know, I think actually this ties in really well with the next question, which I think I'm so inspired and impressed by this like [00:18:30] constant hunger for adventure that it seems that you have, like, it's this like long sort of desire to experience new things or the same things in different ways.
[00:18:38] And so I'm wondering what you might have to say to people who, you know, maybe they're not seeking adventure in the conventional sense. Maybe they don't want to go paragliding, but people who are feeling like they're in a rut and maybe want to spice things up and want to find, you know, new things to experience in their life.
[00:18:55] How do you build that into your life? Where do you start?
[00:18:57] Bill Nikolai: Oh, wow. I think there's a few things [00:19:00] that you can do. One is figure out what are your fears? Like, what are you afraid of? What are you really afraid of? You might want to avoid some of that, but, but there are things that you Maybe mildly fear that your kind of interested in, you know, it could be public speaking.
[00:19:14] it's something that a lot of people are very afraid of. It, it, it could be a lot of different things. So, figure out what it is that you, are somewhat afraid of, but you would like to try and then give it a shot. Challenge yourself and, and also figure out what your benchmarks are.
[00:19:28] Like, if you [00:19:30] know you can do A, think about possibly stepping it up to do B and, and just see if it's possible. You know, I, I, I like to, Cycle. For a while I was toying with this idea of trying to ride Vancouver to Seattle in a day. And I guess I was 56 at the time and I decided to give it a shot.
[00:19:52] I mean, I started at four in the morning, I believe out of Vancouver and ended up in the train station in Seattle at [00:20:00] 6 PM. And then I jumped on the Amtrak and headed back to Vancouver an hour later. But it was. Challenge that I'd set for myself, and a lot of things had to come together. The weather had to be just right for it to happen, but it was, it was super fun and yeah, set yourself a little challenges, figure out what you're capable of and try to aspire to doing something more and there's lots of rewards to be had with that.
[00:20:21] Even, even travel. I mean, one thing about travel that I find, and I've talked to other people who find the same thing, is that you find that by breaking out of the routine [00:20:30] and experiencing something new, just about every minute of every day when you're traveling, you slow down time. And, you know, there's some, some evidence for that.
[00:20:38] So maybe, maybe this aspiration to travel, experience adventure is just a, a way for me to deny mortality and, and try to live forever because, uh, You know, I'll be on a trip and my wife will agree with me, we might be gone for a week and it's felt like a month.
[00:20:54] I mean, it's just because there's so many new things coming at you every day. And it [00:21:00] doesn't all have to be crazy risky, but yeah, there's new stuff all the time. Got bitten by a dog once in Phuket. Which doesn't sound like a big deal, but it broke the skin. and I was happened to be right by a public washroom with soap and water.
[00:21:13] I washed it all up, but then I started doing some internet medical advising and discovered that 10 percent of the dogs, at least in Bangkok are rabid. And if you contract rabies, you're basically toast. And so, so that little morning adventure of going for a run turned into a little bit of [00:21:30] a misadventure in that I.
[00:21:31] Ended up at a clinic getting a rabies shot and then, and then packing syringes of rabies vaccine with me for the rest of the trip you know, throughout Thailand and into Laos. So, yeah, so lots of things can happen when you decide to break out of your routine, whether it be through travel or something else.
[00:21:48] but you know, in thinking about adventure the last day or two, because I knew I was going to be on this podcast, I was thinking that it really does change as time goes on.
[00:21:56] You know, you may find yourself reevaluating [00:22:00] what you're comfortable in doing as you, as you get older or as your circumstances change. So just to divulge a little bit of personal medical information here, a year ago, I had a massive blood clot. So, you know, that's, that's all gone pretty well, but I am on anticoagulants on blood thinners.
[00:22:15] And so I, I'm kind of currently reassessing my, my willingness to do things that put me at risk of bleeding. So, you know, that's potentially going to change some of the things that I do. So, it's, it's a constantly evolving thing, [00:22:30] dealing with risk in, in your quest to seek adventure. it's funny, I was just, I was at the gym this morning, and next to me was a woman who I'm guessing was late 70s, maybe early 80s.
[00:22:40] And she was just telling me about this 112-day cruise that she did. And there were 47 ports of call, 2, 000 passengers. 20 people died on that cruise through various circumstances. So, you know, I don't think of cruises generally as being super adventurous, but I was quite impressed with that statistic.
[00:22:59] You know, [00:23:00] mentioned that one woman who I think was in the cabin next to hers lost a husband on the cruise and that the next port of call he was cremated and then he was brought back on board and she finished the cruise. And I thought, wow, that's, that's an amazing story. I mean, yeah, so your sense of adventure can dictate what you do, but it also can change over time.
[00:23:21] It can change depending on the circumstances.
[00:23:25] So you, you wouldn't be Carol, you wouldn't be the person who would put a tarantula in [00:23:30] her hand on the tarantula farm in Costa Rica.
[00:23:33] Jeevan Sangha: This probably isn't the best time to tell you that we're going skydiving for our next episode. So
[00:23:40] Bill Nikolai: I've never skydived.
[00:23:41] I think it's just far too dangerous. No, I'm joking. skydiving doesn't scare me, but I've chosen never to do it just because it's such a short experience. Like I'd rather be in the air, you know, for a half hour, an hour, two hours, whatever. Right? So, I have to tell you that some of these guys who do the cross-country paragliding, they're into [00:24:00] hardcore adventure and they'll be in the air for six or seven hours.
[00:24:03] And and so, you know, peeing is an issue, And, and so some of these, these guys will fly with condom catheters. So, they'll, they'll run a tube down their pant leg, and they'll be able to just pee into the atmosphere when they need to.
[00:24:21] So a lot of young people, myself included, we struggle with who we are in terms of, you know, our different interests outside of our careers, or [00:24:30] even the whole dilemma of like, who am I after I switch careers?
[00:24:34] Carol Eugene Park: So, I'm just curious how you label yourself as someone who has a lot of outside of just being a paraglider.
[00:24:41] Bill Nikolai: I once heard someone refer to me as a poser, but I've thought about it ever since. I don't really like that term, but I don't know. I mean, I think anything I've ever done, I've always done with an eye to what could it possibly lead to while at the same time, really enjoying the moment.
[00:24:54] I, I never held a job for more than five years until I started my library job, which was in [00:25:00] 2000. And. eight. So, I went back to UBC to do my MLIS degree in 2006. And at the time I was 50 one of the older students in the in, in the class. I did graduate with the highest GPA in the class though.
[00:25:15] I have to throw that in there. But how do I describe myself?
[00:25:17] If anything, a vagabond of the sorts. I mean, it's good to be an expert, but there's something to be said for being a jack of all trades and being interested in everything and knowing a little bit about, [00:25:30] a lot of things Having said that, I wouldn't claim to be an expert in any one thing.
[00:25:37] Drives me nuts when I hear people talk about something that they really know nothing about and do things like vote based on misinformation and information that, yeah, something that they think they, they know a lot about, but in fact, they know very little about whether it be economics or, or whatever foreign policy.
[00:25:54] So, yeah, I think it's, it's, it's good to, to know. A little about a lot of things, [00:26:00] but, but unless you really are an expert, don't claim to be one.
[00:26:03] Jeevan Sangha: Absolutely. It's so fun chatting with you and hearing about your life and your interests.
[00:26:07] Bill Nikolai: Well, thank you both for having me on. I, I was a little nervous about it.
[00:26:10] There's a certain amount of risk in coming on to the, any kind of podcast, but you guys have certainly made me feel comfortable.
[00:26:15] Jeevan Sangha: Thank you so much for this conversation.
[00:26:18] Carol Eugene Park: I know I say this about like 90 percent of adults that I meet, but I would like to be Bill when I grow up.
[00:26:24] Jeevan Sangha: You are grown up, but I get what you're saying. I took so much away from our conversation with [00:26:30] Bill today. I mean, thinking a lot about risk management, I've been thinking a lot in the new year about getting out of my comfort zone a little bit, you know, in measured ways, trying to figure out ways to challenge myself so that I'm hashtag growing or whatever.
[00:26:43] But also, I was thinking a lot about just how much Bill does and how much Bill is passionate about. And I've always really related to this idea of like being a jack of all trades, In the sense that I'm interested in a lot of different things, and I don't always know how to implement them into my life.
[00:26:56] And I think his conversation was like a really nice reminder You can kind of just like [00:27:00] invest time in the things that you enjoy doing. There's like endless possibilities and the different kinds of things you can implement into your life. What did you think, Carol?
[00:27:07] Carol Eugene Park: I mean, it was really refreshing hearing from someone of Bill's generation talking about the fact that like, you can do a bunch of different things and not pigeonhole yourself into a particular career or identity. And it, it does kind of remind me to not generalize a whole older group of people. But it was also weird because as he was speaking about being a jack of all trades and [00:27:30] no expert, I could feel in my body discomfort because I have incredible imposter syndrome and not being an expert in one and not identifying myself as one thing makes me spiral because I'm like, Well, then what am I?
[00:27:47] So, I was really grappling with what he was saying, but I did appreciate that he has this love for life, which I feel like for a lot of burnt-out people, we're like, every day is a new day, and I hate it. But he was like, let's seize the moment. And I would like to get there at some point, but right now I'm just like, seizing means I'm getting out of bed and having a cup of coffee.
[00:28:07] Jeevan Sangha: I think there's a lot of pressure to find like one way to fit into the world or one way to like categorize yourself.
[00:28:13] Carol Eugene Park: Yeah, it's just, it's like, I don't even know. I'm just, I'm a girl trying to figure it out. Who's broke.
[00:28:18] Jeevan Sangha: I identify as a member of the human race.
[00:28:21] Carol Eugene Park: I like that. What a great way to end this beautiful conversation. Anyway, thank you for listening. Make sure you catch our next episode by subscribing or following our show on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if you're feeling your feels, please drop us a review. You can find me on Blue Sky at Carol Eugene Park.
[00:28:41] Jeevan Sangha: And me at Jeevan K. Sangha on X, formerly Twitter. From Here Forward is an alumni UBC podcast produced by Podium Podcast Company.