Rivr Conversations

Inspired by Brent Drever’s Rivr Notes newsletter, this episode explores what it really means to manage your energy—not your time. We talk through the Four Energy Zones, why productivity isn’t just about hours on the clock, and how aligning your energy with your priorities can change how you move through the day. It’s a conversation about presence, rhythm, and showing up when it counts most.
 
View the Rivr Notes for this Episode > https://onrivr.com/rivr-notes/own-your-inner-energy/
 
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What is Rivr Conversations?

Rivr Conversations is a podcast inspired by Brent Drever’s Rivr Notes—a newsletter that sparks reflection and offers practical insight. In each short episode, expert Rivr Guides unpack the latest note, exploring themes of leadership, performance, and wellness. If you’re seeking grounded wisdom in under 20 minutes, you’re in the right place.

Andy:

Today's conversation is about something most of us overlook. Not how much time we have, but how much energy we bring to it. It's inspired by Brent's Rivr Notes post. Own Your Inner Energy. We'll explore how understanding your energy across work, rest, and everything in between can help you show up more focused, more creative, and more present.

Andy:

Because it's not just about managing time, it's about showing up with the energy that actually moves you forward. I'm Andy, your Rivr Conversations host and part of the AI team working alongside Brent, the creator of Rivr Notes and this podcast. Rivr Conversations is an extension of Brent's popular weekly newsletter, Rivr Notes. Each week, two of our expert Rivr Guides sit down to reflect on the latest note, sharing insights, takeaways and stories that explore leadership, performance, and wellness in a grounded, thoughtful way. With that in mind, let's step into the river and hear what our guides uncovered in this week's journey.

Lena:

Today, we're looking at something I think affects us all How we really make the most of our time and maybe more importantly, our output.

Reed:

Right. It goes beyond just filling up a calendar.

Lena:

Exactly. We're digging into some ideas from Rivr Notes. That's a weekly newsletter by Brent. It touches on leadership, performance, wellness, really interesting stuff. And our goal today is to kind of unpack Brent's framework.

Lena:

He talks about how energy, not just the clock, shapes our days, our effectiveness.

Reed:

Yeah. It's a fascinating perspective.

Lena:

Okay. Let's unpack this. So Brent starts with something we all know. Right? Time.

Lena:

It's precious. It's finite.

Reed:

Yeah. That number, eight thousand seven hundred and sixty hours in a year. You can't get more. It's the classic constraint we all work with.

Lena:

Definitely. We hear it all the time. But then he throws in a twist.

Reed:

He does. He asks, okay. You have the hours, but what kind of energy are you actually bringing to them? Yeah. Because that's the variable, isn't it?

Reed:

Time is fixed. Energy well, energy is all over the place.

Lena:

Totally. Some days you're firing on all cylinders, other days, not so much.

Reed:

Exactly. And he calls energy the wild card. It's influenced by, you know, sleep, food, stress, movement, your mood, everything.

Lena:

So you could block out three hours for a big project, but if your energy's low.

Reed:

Right. Those three hours might not be very productive at all. The energy level, he argues, makes all the difference. What's fascinating here is that shift in focus from the container time to content energy.

Lena:

That makes a lot of sense. So to help us grasp this, Brent shares this idea. He's developed the four energy zones.

Reed:

Yeah. And he's clear this isn't like hard science he's quoting.

Lena:

Right. It's his personal observation, a way he's found to understand his own daily energy flow. But it's a really useful lens, I think.

Reed:

Definitely. So the first one is foundational.

Lena:

Zone one, rest. Simple as that. Basically,

Reed:

Pure and simple sleep. But he emphasizes restorative sleep. Deep, slow. The kind that actually repairs and resets you.

Lena:

The non negotiable foundation as he puts it. Absolutely.

Reed:

Without enough zone one, everything else starts to crumble sooner or later.

Lena:

Okay. Then John two, chill.

Reed:

This is about light activity, low demands. It's not sleep, but it's definitely not work either.

Lena:

Like watching a movie or reading a book for fun.

Reed:

Exactly. Or maybe just catching up with a friend, you know, low key conversation. It's the quiet zone.

Lena:

Unwinding, restoring your baseline.

Reed:

Yeah. Precisely. It's crucial to note it's not about productivity, it's about recovery while you're awake.

Lena:

Got it. Okay. Moving up. Zone three, active.

Reed:

This is what he calls your go zone.

Lena:

Right. This sounds like where most of us spend a lot of our waking hours.

Reed:

Probably. It's when you're alert, capable, functional. You're getting things done.

Lena:

Work tasks, projects, decisions.

Reed:

Yep. Problem solving, running errands, managing life stuff, maybe a standard workout. It's productive. It's purposeful. You're operating, you know, pretty well.

Lena:

Makes sense. That feels familiar. And then there's zone four. He calls this one magic.

Reed:

Yeah. Flow. This is the real game changer.

Lena:

So what defines flow or zone four?

Reed:

It's that state where you are completely locked in. You feel creative, sharp, productive, but it feels almost effortless.

Lena:

Like time just disappears.

Reed:

Exactly. Distractions fall away. You've got high energy, super focused. It's perfect for deep work, really tackling something complex or creative.

Lena:

He gives some examples, right? Like strategy work or key work outs.

Reed:

Yeah. Refining business strategy or maybe those really intense breakthrough workouts or, you know, writing when the words just seem to pour out.

Lena:

It's about alignment. He says everything clicks.

Reed:

But he's also realistic. It's not a place you can just decide to live in all day.

Lena:

Right. It's powerful, but maybe fleeting or needs the right conditions.

Reed:

Both. Right. Probably. It's high output, high energy, but you can't sustain it indefinitely. Here's where it gets really interesting, thinking about how these zones relate.

Lena:

Yeah. Because this whole framework really shifts the focus, doesn't it? Most of us, myself included, try to maximize time, pack more in.

Reed:

Right. We schedule everything. Meetings, tasks, gym, family.

Lena:

But if you're scheduling based only on the clock and not thinking about what energy zone you'll likely be in

Reed:

You're missing a huge piece of the puzzle. That's his point. It's not about cramming more stuff into the day.

Lena:

It's about matching the energy to the priority.

Reed:

Exactly. Aligning energy with priorities. And he shares a couple of really good personal stories to illustrate this.

Lena:

Oh, yeah. The ski injury one.

Reed:

A few years back, bad ski accident. He said for months, he was pretty much living in zone one and zone two.

Lena:

Just rest and recovery.

Reed:

Yeah. He physically didn't have the energy for zone three, let alone zone four. Even if his calendar might have technically had free time, his body was just demanding rest.

Lena:

That's a powerful example. You can have all the time in the world, but if your energy isn't there,

Reed:

you just can't force it. And the key insight there is realizing you shouldn't force it. Honoring that need for zone one or two, allowing yourself to heal and reset. That's actually the most productive thing you can do sometimes.

Lena:

It's counterintuitive to how we usually think about productivity.

Reed:

Totally. But essential. He gives the opposite example.

Lena:

Right. His current triathlon training.

Reed:

So now he's consistently in zone three for fitness, building that base. And then intentionally a few times a week, he pushes into zone four. Those really hard dialed in sessions

Lena:

for growth, pushing limits.

Reed:

Exactly. Right. And if we connect this to the bigger picture, his goal is to be able to hit zone four on race day.

Lena:

So the training is about conditioning himself to access that peak state when it matters most.

Reed:

Precisely. Fully present, locked in, enjoying it even though it's incredibly demanding. It shows how you can consciously work with these zones to achieve something specific.

Lena:

So what does this all mean for, you know, for us listening? How do we apply this?

Reed:

Well, Brent poses this great question. What if instead of just scheduling your time, you started thinking about mapping your day by energy zones?

Lena:

Okay. Interesting. How would you do that?

Reed:

He suggests asking yourself some questions. Like, when do I naturally feel most focused?

Lena:

That would be your window for potential zone four. Right? Your peak creative time.

Reed:

Exactly. Then when am I usually just grinding through tasks, you know, functional but not exactly inspired?

Lena:

That sounds like zone three.

Reed:

Probably. And when do I feel like I need a break, but not necessarily a nap?

Lena:

Zone two, the chill zone.

Reed:

And finally, when do I absolutely need to just shut down and recharge?

Lena:

Zone one, sleep, non negotiable.

Reed:

Right. The idea is to start understanding your unique rhythm. We all have one, even if it fluctuates.

Lena:

And then try to design your day around it, at least to some extent.

Reed:

Yeah. He shares his own pattern. For him, mornings are often solid zone three time.

Lena:

Good for execution, checking things off the list.

Reed:

Exactly. But for the big ideas, the creative stuff, his zone four often kicks in later, maybe evenings. Brainstorming, building, exploring. Right. And just knowing that helps him structure things.

Reed:

He doesn't try to force big creative work into his zone three time if he can help it.

Lena:

That makes sense. But, you know, reality check. What about people with demanding jobs, fixed schedules, kids? It's not always easy to just follow your energy flow.

Reed:

Oh, absolutely. And Brent acknowledges that directly. He says this isn't about perfection. Life happens. Yeah.

Reed:

You'll definitely have days where your body is screaming for zone one, but your calendar is packed with zone three demands. That's just life.

Lena:

So it's not about feeling guilty if you can't perfectly match energy to task.

Reed:

Not at all. He emphasizes that's okay. The goal isn't to create some kind of perfectly optimized rigid system. That's probably impossible. Anyway.

Lena:

So what is the goal then?

Reed:

It's about awareness. Yeah. Becoming more aware of how you operate, what your energy patterns tend to be.

Lena:

Just noticing.

Reed:

Just noticing. And then where you can, trying to honor that energy. If you can learn to do that, even imperfectly,

Lena:

you get more from your time.

Reed:

That's the idea. You focus better when you're in the right zone. You create more effectively. You probably stress less.

Lena:

And maybe enjoy the process more too.

Reed:

That's what he suggests is the real kicker. You actually enjoy your days more when you're not constantly fighting against your own energy levels.

Lena:

It's a really compelling idea. Time is finite. Yes. Energy is also finite in a daily sense, but aligning them. That seems to be where the real potential lies.

Lena:

These insights from Brent's Rivr Notes are quite powerful.

Reed:

They really are. It shifts the perspective significantly.

Lena:

Makes you think, doesn't it? What's one small shift you could make, maybe even starting tomorrow, to just honor your energy zones a bit better.

Reed:

Yeah. Maybe it's protecting fifteen minutes for a zone two break instead of pushing through or trying that creative task when you naturally feel more zone four potential.

Lena:

Could even a tiny adjustment change how your whole day feels? Maybe make things click just a little bit more, something to consider.

Andy:

That's it for this week's episode of Rivr Conversations. Speaking on behalf of Brent and myself, big thanks to our expert Rivr Guides for another thoughtful discussion. We always appreciate the unique perspectives they bring to these conversations. To close out each Rivr Conversation, I like to describe the photo featured in the Rivr Notes newsletter. It's not just a stock image, it comes from a real adventure.

Andy:

After all, the best ideas often come from staying curious, embracing new perspectives and engaging with the world around us. This week's photo was taken at the close of the day, just as the sun slipped behind the trees and handed the sky over to color. Streaks of orange and deep coral clouds stretch across a canvas of fading blue and soft lavender, like the whole sky is exhaling after a long day. The silhouette of the trees frames the bottom, grounding the scene in quiet stillness, while everything above feels alive and glowing. It's the kind of sunset that doesn't ask for your attention, it just earns it.

Andy:

You don't rush through a sky like this. You stop, you breathe, you feel it. A moment of natural energy, pure and effortless, reminding you what it feels like to be present. If you'd like to read the full Rivr Notes article, including all the amazing photographs, you can find it at OnRivr.com. That's Rivr without an e.

Andy:

And be sure to subscribe wherever you listen to your podcasts so you never miss a conversation. Before we go, a quick reminder: The opinions and viewpoints expressed in this podcast are solely those of the presenters and our AI companions, sharing personal reflections and perspectives. We're not legal experts, medical professionals, or therapists. This content is for informational and entertainment purposes only, so please consult the appropriate professionals when you need advice or support. Thanks again for listening.

Andy:

Rivr Conversations is an OnRivr, LLC production.