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Join Peter Englert, a pastor, and Dr. Ron Hall, professor and pastor, as they delve into the book of 1 Peter. This book helps readers cope with suffering in an antagonistic world by offering hope in Jesus. Whether you're exploring faith or a long-time follower of Jesus, read through the book of 1 Peter on your own or with a group of friends with insights to better understand this book of the Bible.
1 Peter 4:12-19
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[00:00:00]
Peter Englert: Welcome to the Reading First Peter podcast. I am Peter, not that Peter, but I am Peter. I'm a pastor and a podcaster. I'm here with my friend, professor, Dr. Ron Hall, um, almo. We're gonna add Bishop in there. I know I've thrown that in there a couple times, but hey, we're on the home stretch in one Peter 4, 12, 12 through 19.
How do you feel?
Ron Hall: We're doing well and uh, every chapter is loaded. And, uh, we're, we're not going to the full depth, but we're giving enough for everybody listening to be able to, uh, probe deeper.
Peter Englert: And the reason why we do the podcast in this format is whether you're with your small group or you're doing this individually. We wanna just kinda give you a way to study this. So without further ado, here's one Peter four, 12 through 19. Uh, Peter says, dear friends, do not be surprised at fi at the fiery ordeal that has come on you to [00:01:00] test you as though something strange were happening to you. But rejoice in as much as you participate in the sufferings of Christ so that you might be overjoyed when his glory is revealed. If you are insulted because of the name of Christ, you are blessed for the spirit of glory and of God rests on you. If you suffer. It should not be as a murder of. Or a thief or any other kind of criminal, or even as a meddler. However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name for it is time for judgment to begin with God's household, and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God? If it's hard for the righteous to be saved, what will become of the ungodly in the sinner? So then those who suffer according to God's will should commit themselves to their faithful creator and continue to do good. I I heard that hum. That there's a lot [00:02:00] there. So, uh, Ron, why don't we start kinda big picture at like, what we usually do to really help understand the nuance and then we'll jump into specifics.
So why don't you give kind of an overview of some of the important big picture things that you see in this passage.
Ron Hall: Well, first of all, with American Christianity, we have an aversion to the idea of suffering 'cause we want a Christianity that is totally palatable for us and we want sermons and teaching. That lift us up, that pick us up and help us have the idea of a bright future that God wants to prosper us, all of the great things he wants us to do.
Whereas one Peter comes along the letter to a suffering church and says, Hey, as a Christian, you're going to suffer. And if you're gonna take a stand for those things that are right at your job, among family, your own relatives, uh, you're going to be paying a price. [00:03:00] And so Peter is reinforcing this theme of suffering that he presented us in chapter one, chapter two, chapter three, all the way through in chapter five, where how we respond to suffering makes all the difference.
So this is that. That's the big picture for the letter. And this is just reinforcing the theme, the kind of suffering we'll experience,
Peter Englert: So let me ask you this. Why do you think Peter repeats himself so much? Because this isn't the first time he's talked about suffering. It's not the first time he's talked about, suffer for the right reasons, not because you're a criminal. Um, and why do you think he repeats this? What, what's your inkling on that?
Ron Hall: Well, I think if we step over into second Peter, Peter said, knowing that his time of departure was at hand, he wanted to put them in remembrance. And I think this is another one of putting them in remembrance, that as [00:04:00] Christians, you are going to suffer. You know? And Paul had the same type of teaching, so.
Peter's parallel with Paul Acts 1422, and that we enter the kingdom through much tribulation. You know Jesus in John, you know in this world you have tribulation be of good courage. 'cause I've overcome the world. And Jesus said, if they persecuted me, they will also persecute you. So Peter is reinforcing and ultimately in chapter five, to let them know that there's comfort.
When he says in verse seven of chapter five, casting all your care upon him, for he cares for you and your adversary, the devil roars about it. Or as a roaring lion looking for someone to devour, but you resist him steadfast in the faith. So Peter is wanting to help them be strong in the faith, strong in the Lord.
Peter Englert: So why don't we, why don't we jump right in here? Um, I think. We've said this before, we've hinted at this, but I, I just wanna pick up [00:05:00] at verse 12. There is this beautiful reality of Christianity compared to other religions. And I know that other religions talk about suffering, I, I think a lot of times we're like, how can a good God allow suffering?
We talk about sin entering the world in Genesis three through Adam and Eve's choice. But the rest of the Bible, I mean, you quoted three scripture that said, in this world, you will suffer. so I think about, for those of us that struggle maybe with, we call it the, the Odyssey, about how, how can a good God allow suffering? think what first Peter is even saying is there's a reality of suffering in a broken world. But then as you go on, you know, he continues this theme of, Christ suffered too. You know, Jesus is not calling us to go somewhere where he hasn't been.
Ron Hall: Yeah, and that dips back into chapter two. He bore those [00:06:00] stripes that we might be healed. It's spiritual healing and Matthew, it's physical healing. And so Christ left us an example that we should follow. He didn't retaliate. He, he worked with the people that were attacking him to stand his ground right down to the crucifixion with his trial.
So, and, and, uh, in, in Hebrews chapter five, verse seven, Jesus learned obedience through the things that he suffered. So that whole theme of suffering. For Messiah, Jesus is threaded throughout multiple passages within the New Testament. And so here we have that, uh, that reinforcement.
Peter Englert: We've mentioned this before also in in the early church, not just the New Testament church, but the early church in like the hundreds and two hundreds, they actually believed that martyrdom was one of the highest forms of discipleship. I think we can, I'm [00:07:00] not saying that we agree with that idea.
Obviously things changed when Constantine came into power and Christianity has had a whole different trajectory since then. But you can kind of see where people would get this because know, Peter's again, making the point of saying. suffer because you broke the laws that are actually the 10 commandments that Jesus talked about. No. If you suffer for the right reasons, that brings glory to God. And I think you can kind of see this radical teaching of no, we, we accept suffering for the right reasons.
Ron Hall: Yeah, well remember Christianity is founded upon, uh, suffering with the crucifixion, and then as we move into acts, especially chapter seven, we have the martyrdom of Stephen. You are right with the idea of martyrdom was handled, uh, elevated as being the greatest badge of honor. And [00:08:00] that was like that in the early centuries.
Uh, a famous, uh, one of our, our, our church fathers, a man by the name of Polycarp, who was a contemporary with the Apostle John as the famous quote, 80 and six years, I have served him and he has done me no wrong. How then can I deny the king who has saved me? And he was burned at the stake. And the, the testimonies, these are not in the New Testament, but uh, come out beyond it.
'cause remember he's in the nineties contemporary of John. And, and the writings are that his face was a glow, uh, with joy, kind of like a Steven being stoned at to death. And he looks up and he sees Jesus standing at the right hand of the Father. So the, uh, the, the way they face martyrdom is incredible. I just wanna follow, uh, two thoughts through, uh, number one, it was after Constantine that, um, being single became the [00:09:00] badge because martyrdom was not as common at that time.
So then you practiced celibacy, which was adopted by the Roman Catholic Church, and in the early years, Roman Catholic priests did not, and they could marry, they didn't have to stay celibate. It wasn't until later years that then your real commitment was showed, uh, by being, uh, single. Uh, but I go back to one other thing.
That theme of suffering carried through in so many places within scripture, we referred to the gospels, but the Apostle Paul dealt with the enormous amount of suffering that he experienced. And for us to look for adopting a Christianity that divorces itself, uh, from suffering is foreign to the New Testament.
Peter Englert: Well, I just wanna pick up there because if you read one Corinthians seven, what you said about celibacy, you know, Paul in there. Um, and again, I think even to your point of [00:10:00] certain things that we valued and that they changed, Paul makes the comment about those, you know, he, I wish all of you were celibate so that you could serve God.
And then you go to second Corinthians 10. We've referenced this before, but the thorn in the flesh, and Paul says, I had this vision. I asked God to take this away, but God didn't and, and this is, and it, it had to be something suffering. And there's a lot of debate on what that actually was. Was it physical?
Was it spiritual? But again, all of it matches with Peter of what he's saying, that there's this consistent. And we can go to the Old Testament, the Book of Job. Um, you know, we can look at the Psalms. Each of them, there's been this consistent on suffering and how God interacts that we just can't escape from, from the Bible.
Ron Hall: And that's hard for us to take because, uh, when we look at our contemporary world in America, we're immune [00:11:00] from a lot of what's taking place around the world. Imagine being a Christian today in Iran. Uh, imagine what it would be like in some. Uh, countries where, uh, well, India, Christians are despised. Uh, India is predominantly Hindu and their president is Hindu.
And if there are any Indian folks, uh, you know, listening now, they would know more. The background, I would assume is, especially if they have family members there, uh, the reproach upon Christians and it's difficult to be a Christian in places like that. And so our, we are. We are a little more distant from the suffering here in America, but other countries are, are not experiencing that around the world.
Of course, there is the whole voice of martyrs, uh, that proclaims the effects of suffering that are taking place, uh, with Christians. So we're a, a [00:12:00] theme that's in keeping with the New Testament, and it's a reality that's in keeping with the church since that time.
Peter Englert: So let's hold that thought just for a second because I, I want to come down to, verse 17. Um, you know, it seems as though Peter makes this huge pivot with the judgment of God. Then he, he makes this comment, if it's hard for the righteous to be saved, what will become of the ungodly? Now, there's a lot of reasons why Peter might've said that and taking that pivot, but what's your perspective on what he's trying to say in that pivot from suffering to what God is doing?
Ron Hall: Well, you, you look at before suffering is a Christian, and you've already brought this out. We wanna make sure we're not suffering for the dumb, stupid, idiotic things that we're we're doing. I knew one guy, he wasn't performing at work. He was, uh, [00:13:00] loading trucks and the truck drivers were upset because the guy wanted to get up on pallets and preach the gospel when they wanted their trucks loaded.
So they didn't like him saying he's a Christian. It didn't mean anything to him. He wasn't, and then he, he complained that he was suffering for uh, Christ. He wasn't suffering for Christ. He was suffering for the dumb, stupid, idiotic things that he was doing himself. So we wanna make sure that we're suffering for, uh, the right reasons and that we don't have to have shame.
I think Peter is doing that shift and it's a sobering verse. If judgment's going to begin with a household of faith, wherein lies the end, uh, than of the ungodly. He's turning around and saying, if you're a Christian, you better be suffering for the right things and God is going to go ahead and zero in on judgment with the church itself.
And you wanna not come up on the loose end of it.
Peter Englert: You know, so it's [00:14:00] definitely sobering.
Ron Hall: I, I also.
Peter Englert: it as encouraging as like the suffering that you face does have meaning. have significance. But the other thing it, it makes me think about what Jesus said about, you know, that the rich, it's as if they're coming through the eye of the needle. Um. Like, I think that there's something, beautiful that, that Peter is trying to bring out about like, it's not just this bad news sobering verse, but this is the beauty of the gospel. You can't save yourself and it costs Jesus' life, death on a cross and resurrection from the dead. so, yeah, I think, I think there's an intentional sobering, but then there's an intentional encouragement in all of that.
Ron Hall: Um, yes, I agree. Providing that you are open for the Lord to be working through your suffering.
Peter Englert: Exactly.
Ron Hall: Now, [00:15:00] we dealt with this last time in the early verses if anyone suffered in his flesh, he ceased from sin. Going back to verses one and two and here is the continued theme of suffering and uh, you know. I, I want our listeners to realize I don't have a corner on the market with the suffering because we'd easily wanna say physical suffering or is it spiritual suffering in the world, and maybe it's a collection of all of them because suffering physically in the world as a result of the fall.
Back to Genesis three, you mentioned in the beginning. So we, we trace suffering back to that. A fateful event within the Garden of Eden in Genesis three, but here we are living with the consequences. So it's, it's, it's a, it's a tension and I think we probably could include, you know, the physical as well as the rest of them.
Paul included the physical, uh, when he was, uh, writing to the [00:16:00] Galatians. If it were possible, you pluck your eye out of me and it, it could have for me, it's probably because of his being stoned and beaten with rods. That it very well could have been a physical, you know, struggle that he was facing. And in first Corinthians, uh, you know, second Corinthians 12, uh, that thorn in the flesh that you were referring to earlier, there's some form of suffering, uh, that he's undergoing.
So I think it's making sure account that we're suffering for those things that are really spiritual before the Lord.
Peter Englert: Well, and just your points well taken because the ver verse 19 closes with, so then those of those who suffer according to God's will should commit themselves to their faithful creator and continue to do good. I, I think this all goes back to, um, living in a contentious world, living in an antagonistic world that, you know, our call is not. Just to [00:17:00] disappear. Our call is not just to suffer, but actually when we're committed to God and we suffer, we're still called to do good.
Ron Hall: Yeah.
Peter Englert: as we kind of bring it to an application, I feel like all of those things are important. Um, you know, what are some things I, we've kind of entered into it, you know, is it physical?
Is it, you know, persecution? You know, what is it? As someone who's reading it and thinking about their day to day and thinking about suffering, how would you encourage them to apply this to their lives?
Ron Hall: Uh, first of all, just a little more on 19.
Peter Englert: Mm-hmm.
Ron Hall: there are things that we read in the Bible that we don't necessarily like, and this is one of them. If you're suffering according to God's will 'cause we don't wanna believe that and suffering that we face. We don't wanna say, oh man, God did this. But in scripture we see that over and over again, that being a Christian does [00:18:00] not exempt us from the consequences of the fall.
So I, I think the application overall, we wanna, first of all evaluate are we in the faith? Are we walking with the Lord so that the suffering we're experiencing, maybe with the attacks of people or maybe in your family, because you're standing to be a Christian, are they justified or is my family just hearing that I'm blasting them, beating them over the head with a big Bible or something like that and telling them they need to get right.
Or is my suffering truly the consequences of the righteous life that I'm living before the Lord? So it's making sure your suffering's for the right reasons and being honest, brutally honest with yourself. And yes, recogni reconcile the reality that God's will can include suffering for all of us. And so that's, that's an important application.
I think it's putting it in perspective. This, this [00:19:00] passage causes us to evaluate our lives. We wanna live under the blessing of the Lord, and if suffering's involved in being a part of that, then we need to accept that
Peter Englert: I love that. And one of the things that made me think of is, uh, Saint John of the cross wrote about the dark night of the soul and the dark night. It could be
Ron Hall: suffering.
Peter Englert: just feeling this disconnection from God. He actually, it's way more vague, but. When I think about what suffering does to us, I, I think about this quote that he wrote and, uh, I just wanna read it. It talks about God. God takes us into the dark night. He weans us from all the pleasures by giving us dry times and inward darkness. doing so, he's able to take away all these vices and create virtues within us. Through the dark night, pride becomes humility. Greed becomes simplicity. Wrath becomes contentment. Luxury becomes peace. Gluttony becomes moderation. Envy becomes joy, and sloth becomes strength. [00:20:00] No soul will ever grow deep in the spiritual life unless God works passively in the soul by the means of the dark night.
Ron Hall: Yeah.
Peter Englert: And, um, I, I just think that. I love what you said about the suffering or like evaluating the why, but I I also think on top of that, in value evaluating what is happening in us.
Ron Hall: Yeah. And that, that's back to the verse I was quoting before of Paul out of second Corinthians. Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith. So we have to do that self-examination and, and coming to terms with that. And that is a. A reality that we're all going to experience dark nights of the soul, some to deeper degrees, uh, than others.
Imagine, uh, right now when we're doing this, there is all the suffering going on down in Texas with the, the flood. And how do you, how do floods you come to [00:21:00] terms with families that were Christians and their girls are at a Christian camp and they're taken out. How do you And I've been struggling with that.
Uh, if I were a parent. Knowing my child is gone at a Christian camp and the tragedy of it, I mean, there's all kinds of second guessing going on, but what do you do in the midst of that suffering that God is going to be faithful just the same? And I can't say he is not a loving God because those things happen, but I have to be able to say, okay, Lord, I, I surrender to you in the midst of this, even though I don't fully understand it.
Peter Englert: Hmm. What a powerful place for us to close in prayer. Uh, Ron, you wanna take us home?
Ron Hall: Lord, we thank you that you are so gracious to us. Help us to respond responsibly and with a heart that's open to you with the suffering that we face. For those listening, their [00:22:00] suffering might be at work and a difficult boss and different, difficult. Uh. Coworkers that they would respond with your grace and not, not become prey to the gossip and, and the innuendos against other people they work with, but instead they respond in a Christ-like manner.
For those going through physical suffering themselves or with family members, God, we pray that you be gracious unto them and we pray for these people also with what's happened in Texas and the suffering they're going through. Those that are believers that they would sense your arms of embrace around them.
We pray in Jesus name, amen.
Peter Englert: Thank you so much for joining.