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The Harvester Podcast is brought to you by the Florida School of Preaching. Listen weekly to take a dive into biblical topics and thoughtful studies on things that matter to our eternal souls.
Welcome to the Harvester Podcast.
We are glad that you have joined us today.
As we continue our bumper sode series number three on lessons from the book of Job.
Lessons from the book of Job.
And so we are calling these bumper sodes because they are episodes in between seasons.
We are very busy this time of year, and it's hard to get all three of us, for us, Stephen
and I together on the same day for a recording.
So we are doing these bumper sods until we can all get together.
But the book of Job is a very interesting book, very intriguing, and one that's often
misunderstood because usually we study only the first two chapters and then the last
chapter.
But there's a whole lot of stuff that goes on in between that it would do well for us to
study.
And so we introduced a topic last episode called we called it Retribution Theology, and
we're going to continue with that uh today.
why retribution theology is wrong.
But before we get into that, let us consider again what that is.
Retribution theology, big fancy word, but it just simply refers to the idea that all sin
is a result of or excuse me, all suffering is the direct result of our sin.
That is, if I'm suffering just a little, then that means God has punished me
Punishing me for a little sin.
If I'm suffering a lot, then God is punishing me for huge sins.
And when we think about Job, that was the prevailing theology about suffering in Job's
day.
And be clear, Job thought this way, and his three friends thought this way.
For Job, he knew he sin to the extent.
Of the suffering that he was enduring.
He lost his family, his wealth in the first trial, if you will, chapter one, and then he
lost his health in chapter two, and he suffered immensely.
But he knew that he didn't sin to that extent.
Now he does not deny sin throughout the book.
In fact, he does talk about the sins of his youth.
But he knew he did not sin, so he's trying to figure out why God is punishing him like
this.
The three friends, on the other hand, uh they just knew Job had to have some big, huge sin
he's trying to hide.
And so they, being the good friends that they are, and we'll have a lesson on this coming
up soon in an episode, but they thought they were doing good by trying to get Job to
repent.
And so they start out.
Kind of hinting around that Job, you know, people don't suffer like this unless they've
sinned.
And so, you know, go ahead and confess your sin and God will restore you and everything
will be all right.
And so they're trying to get Job to confess sin and to repent of sin.
And so they are trying to, in in their mind, try to help Job out this way, but Job knows
he hasn't sinned to that extent.
And so he's trying to figure out himself.
And so Job.
kind of justifies himself at God's expense.
The three friends are trying to justify God at Job's expense.
And so both of them are wrong, but yet when it comes to Job, he is, you know, he's did not
sin with his lips.
He did not charge God foolishly.
But we will see some things in there if taken out of context, you would say, man, Job,
what are you doing?
You you you're accusing God of a lot of things here.
But
Job is searching for answers.
He's being honest and truthful, searching for answers.
God recognizes this.
And so even though he says some things that are off color, if you will, at least again we
take them out of context sometimes.
We'll see that in chapter 19.
But you know, God justified.
I mean, Job did not sin, and so we'll we'll take an exam examination of that.
But this retribution theology is prevalent even in scripture.
For example, in Luke chapter thirteen, there were present at that season some who told
Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.
And Jesus answered and said to them, Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse
sinners than all of the Galileans because they suffered such things?
I tell you no, but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.
And so in Jesus' day, now we do not have record of this, but it does fit Pilate's
attitude, Pilate's doings, uh, but there were some Galileans whose blood Pilate had
mingled with their sacrifices.
And people of that day thought, well, these guys must have been sinners, because that
would not have happened unless they were worse sinners.
And of course, Jesus his point here is don't worry about them, but worry about yourself
unless you repent.
You will all likewise perish, but again that retribution theology comes out.
Again in verse four, or those eighteen on whom the tower of Siloam fell and killed them,
do you think that they were worse sinners than all other who dwelt in Jerusalem?
Again I tell you no, but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.
Now here's the tower that fell on them.
Well, people say that's God punishing them for their sin.
But Jesus says, No, unless you repent, you shall all likewise perish.
So again, Jesus is teaching, don't worry about them, worry about yourself.
But incidental in there is this idea of retribution theology.
Then again, in John chapter 9, verse 1, now as Jesus passed by, he saw a man who was blind
from birth, and his disciples asked him, saying, Rabbi, who sinned?
This man or his parents, that he was born blind?
Now again, the assumption is somebody must have sinned because these things don't happen
unless there's sin involved.
You know, imagine being born blind.
And of course, the man himself could not have sinned because he was born that way.
I mean, you know, so he's not sinful.
But again, the parents.
But Jesus said, Neither this man nor his parents sinned, but this is happening so that God
might be glorified in verse 3.
And so.
You know, sin is not the cause of all suffering.
It's not the direct result of all suffering.
Then again in Acts twenty-eight, verse three, this was assumed when Paul was bitten by a
viper.
In Acts twenty-eight, verse three, but when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks and laid
them on the fire, a viper came out because of the heat and fastened on his hand.
So when the natives saw the creature hanging from his hand, they said to one another, Now
note this, they said to one another,
No doubt this man is a murderer, whom though he has escaped the sea, yet justice does not
allow to live.
And so they assume that he had to be a very bad sinner, a murderer, because no one has a
snake jump on his hand and bite him and hang on uh excreting all that venom in him, he
must be a murderer.
But
Verse five says Paul shook off the creature into the fire and suffered no harm.
However, they were expecting that he would swell up or suddenly fall down dead, but after
they had looked for a long time and saw no harm come to him, they changed their minds and
said that he was a god.
And so they went from one extreme to another, but the point is he must be no doubt this
man is a murderer because he got bit by that viper.
And so that retribution theology in Scripture is
Uh is alive and well.
But again, it's it's wrong.
Now, here's some reasons why it's wrong as we get into this.
And I basically have two main points, and some of this material was adapted from Mark
Littleton uh in his article where Job's Comforters Went Wrong.
And this is in a book that's edited by Roy B.
Zuck, and it's called Selected Studies on the Book of Job.
It's kind of an anthology about that, but anyway.
some of this is material that's adapted from that.
But two main points why retribution theology is wrong.
Number one, because of what it does to human beings, what it does, what it implies, and
what it does to human beings.
And there's three sub points under this.
Number one, it becomes a reason to reject hurting people.
It becomes a reason to reject hurting people.
it divides and punishes people in the eyes of other people.
In other words, when we th if if we take this theology that this person is suffering
because of as a direct result of his sin, then we we get the idea of, well, he deserves
it.
He deserves this suffering, so we're just gonna leave him alone.
It and so everyone, you know, everyone began to reject Job.
Because they believe that he must have done some sin.
You know, his wife just curse God and die.
His friends, even though they had good intentions, when they came to Job, we see where it
led to.
And then also his kinfolk.
He'll talk about in the chapter how even his his own kolk has rejected him.
Because again, if we think that he's suffering because he is committing sin and God is
punishing him, who are we to interfere with
And take away God's punishment.
and so that false idea of retribution theology uh becomes a reason to reject hurting
people.
And when you think about the blind man in John chapter nine, and really when you think
about really all the people, well, maybe not all, but a lot of the people that Jesus
healed who who had these these diseases.
You know, the the woman with the issue of blood, for example, the man in chapter five,
John chapter five, that couldn't get to the well in time, and others, you know, they were
kind of the outcasts of society.
And one reason one major reason why that was is because, you know, they must have sinned,
they must have done something to receive this punishment from God.
But yet even the lepers, Jesus would touch them and heal them.
And so Jesus had a special place for that.
But this retribution theology is wrong because it becomes a reason to reject hurting
people.
Secondly, it forces people into a works mentality.
It forces people into a works mentality.
if a person believes that doing good wins health and wealth, then a person does good to be
healthy and wealthy.
And this, of course, was the
Gist of Satan's argument in Job chapter one verse nine, so Satan answered the Lord and
said Does Job fear God for nothing?
Have you not made a hedge around him, around his household and around all that he has on
every side?
You have blessed the work of his hand and his possessions have increased in the land.
But now stretch out your hand and touch all that he has, and he will surely curse you to
your face.
And so in other words, Satan is saying Job is only faithful, he's only serving you because
of this hedge you built around him with all this wealth of this family, his wealth, and
all this things that he has.
But if you take that away, says Satan, he will curse you to your face.
And so verse twelve, the Lord said to Satan, Behold, all that he has is in your power,
only do not lay a hand on his person.
So Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.
Now, as we already discussed in the first episode of this series on Job, you know, Satan,
you know, God is in control.
Satan has to ask God's permission for anything, and of course, in this case, God God
allows Satan to do that.
but again the point we're using here is that the health and wealth gospel is what Satan
accuses Job of adhering to.
In other words, you take that away, he'll curse you to your face.
Well, as it plays out in chapter one, Satan does take away all that Job has, but yet Job
still remains his integrity.
In fact, in chapter one, verse twenty, then Job arose after all this happened, tore his
robe, and shaved his head.
And he fell to the ground and worshipped.
And he said, Naked came I from my mother's womb, and naked shall I return there.
The Lord gave, and the Lord has taken away.
Blessed be the name of the Lord.
And all this Job did not sin, nor charge God with wrong.
So Satan comes back at him again in chapter two, verse four.
So Satan answered the Lord and said skin for skin, yes, all that a man has he will give
for his life.
But stretch out your hand now and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will surely curse
you to your face.
And so now Satan comes back a second time saying, Well, if you take away his health,
inflict his flesh and bones and he will curse you to his face.
Well, the Lord said to Satan, Behold, he is in your hand, but spares life.
And so again, God allows Satan to inflict his health, but yet uh in all that he still
remains faithful.
Even his wife said, Curse God and die.
And of course, because of his integrity, uh Job was there.
So we must not allow doing good.
be an excuse an exercise in selfishness.
And so this retribution theology is wrong because of what it does to human beings.
Number one, it becomes a reason to reject hurting people, and number two, it forces people
into a works mentality.
If I do good, then God is going to bless me.
In fact, I was talking to a brother in Christ not too long ago, and he was mentioning, you
know, when God answers our prayers the way we want to, that means we're doing good in
God's eyes.
Well, I don't know that I would agree with that fully, because we do know that God always
answers our prayers according to his will, so our prayers always get answered.
But what he means by that is I know I must be doing good in God's eyes because he let me
have what I prayed for.
And that of course is a version of this retribution theology.
And so that's not not true.
So it forces people into a works mentality.
And a third reason of why it's wrong because of what it does to human beings is
Is it does not promote true accountability.
Uh retribution theology does not promote true accountability.
On the surface, it may appear so.
If you sin, God will pay you back for it, so don't sin.
But actually, there's no real accountability because everyone does not get paid back in
this life.
Again, we brought this up last time, but in Job 21.
In Job twenty one, verses seventeen through thirteen, Job in his answer to Zophar, one of
his answers to Zophar, he says, you know, he's talking about the wicked prosper, which,
you know, if the wicked prosper, that totally refutes this retribution theology idea.
But Job says, How often is the lamp of the wicked put out?
How often does their destruction come upon them?
The sorrows God distributes in his anger They are like straw before the wind and like
chaff that the storm carries away.
They say God lays up one's iniquity for his children, let him recompense him, that he may
know it, let his eyes see his destruction, and let him drink of the wrath of the almighty,
for what does he care about his household after him when the number of his months is cut
in half?
And so payback doesn't always occur in this life.
Also in 1 Timothy 5 24, 1 Timothy 5 24, Paul writes the following.
Some men's sins are clearly evident preceding them to judgment, but those of some men
follow later.
Likewise, the good works of some are clearly evident, and those that are otherwise cannot
be hidden.
And so those verses there kind of address this idea as well, but only at judgment day will
accountability be rendered.
In Romans two verse six, speaking of God who will render to each one according to his
deeds eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory,
honor, and immortality, but to those who are self seeking and do not obey the truth, but
obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath.
Tribulation and anguish on every soul of man who does evil of the Jews first and also of
the Greek.
But glory, honor, and patience to everyone who works what is good to the Jew first, and
also to the Greek.
For there is no partiality with God.
Romans 2, 6 through 11.
And so we will be accountable on judgment day.
And so, but if true accountability were through retribution theology, then God would be
forced to judge people immediately.
after every good or evil deed.
And so retribution theology is wrong because of what it does to human beings.
It becomes a reason to reject hurting people, it forces people into a works mentality, and
it does not promote true accountability.
But there's another major reason why retribution theology is wrong, and that is because of
what it does to God.
What it does to God, it turns God into an arbitrary
gift dispenser.
That is, you know, how much good must I do before I'm good enough to be blessed in this
world?
How much bad must I do before I lose that blessing?
And so God is forced into having made such judgments for all the world to see.
And so he becomes an arbitrary
Gift dispenser Also suppose a person suffers bad things but disagrees like Job did.
And so one ends ends up accusing God like Job did.
Now I mentioned this earlier, but if you go to chapter nineteen, and this is why it's
important to look at the whole book, uh, in chapter nineteen, Job answered and said, and
of course, um, you know, Job is going up and down uh through these dialogues, and he's
answering Bildad, he says
How long will you torment my soul and break me in pieces with your words?
These ten times you have reproached me, you are not ashamed that you have wronged me, and
if indeed I have erred, my error remains with me.
If indeed you exalt yourselves against me and plead my disgrace against me, then know then
that God has wronged me and has surrounded me with his net.
And so he is initially answering Bildad there, but when he gets down uh in that chapter,
well, verse seven, if I cry out concerning wrong, I am not heard.
If I cry out, there is no justice, he has fenced up my way so that I cannot pass.
He has set darkness in my past.
Now that he here is God, he has stripped me of my glory and taken the crown from my head.
He breaks me down on every side, and I am gone.
My hope he has uprooted like a tree.
Now that he here is going back to God, know then that God has wronged me.
He has done all these things.
He breaks me down on every side.
He has also kindled his wrath against me in verse eleven, this is Job talking, and he
counts me as one of his enemies.
His troops come together and build up their road against me and
They encamp all around my tent.
He has removed my brothers far from me, and my acquaintance are completely estranged from
me.
My relatives have failed, and my close friends have forgotten me, and this is a reference
to those who have rejected him, again his even his own family and friends, those who dwell
in my house and my maid servants count me as a stranger.
I am an alien in their sight.
I call my servant, but he gives no answer, etcetera.
He goes on down here.
But again, he is he is, you know, God, God has done this to me.
God has done this to me.
Uh and again, how do we reconcile that with the fact that the book says he did not sin or
charge God foolishly?
And again, the only thing I could come up with here is because Job is searching for truth.
He's trying to find truth, and in that pursuit of truth, he is
making some statements and again in his mind he's going up and down in his mind like a
roller coaster, but he is willing to accept God's answer, which he does get in chapter
thirty eight and following, not that God answered him directly to any of his questions,
any of his challenges to God, but just the fact that God answered him and asked all these
questions was enough to show that God still cared for him, that God had not abandoned Job,
and so he recanted of all that he said.
But anyway, in his in his pursuit of truth, he makes some statements about God that are
not true, but um he is not a c well, yeah, he is not you know, he is he is asking these
questions, he's making these statements in pursuit of truth.
And you know, sometimes we and we have this with the book of uh in the book of Habakkuk as
well, that Habakkuk, you know, asks God how he can put up with Jerusalem's sin.
And God basically says, I'm not going to, I'm going to send the Babylonians to take care
of that.
Which becomes uh another question, maybe even more serious than the first question, how
God can you allow the Babylonians who are so wicked, even wickeder than we are, to come
and take care of us?
And then God gives him the answer, and then the whole of chapter three is a praise him of
Habakkuk to God, because he understands now and he accepts God's answer.
And so it's not wrong to ask questions even of God as long as we're willing to accept the
answer that God gives us.
Now, asking a God questions is not challenging God necessarily.
Now it can be, and that's always wrong to challenge God and to, you know, call his hand at
something, uh, but all questions are not of that nature.
And so even statements that Job makes in chapter 19, and that's done in pursuit of truth.
He's not calling God's hand, as it were.
Well, I guess he kind of sorta is in some some areas not there.
But again, it's it's it's he's accepting the answer that God gives.
And so that's how that can be reconciled.
chapter nineteen, some of the statements he says, and the fact that he did not sin or
charge God foolishly with his lips.
All right, but it turns God into this arbitrary gift giver.
lesser uh lesser people Job would have cursed God a long time ago, which is what Satan
wants.
And there seems to be a thing in Job about cursing God.
You know, Satan twice, curse God and die, and then his wife, you know, curse God.
Well, actually, Satan says, If you take away these things, Job will curse you to your
face.
And then his wife says, Curse God and die.
And that even in chapter five and f chapter one, verse five, and following, Job was afraid
his children would curse God, and so he would offer sacrifices for them, which again shows
that he lived under the patriarchal system.
Okay.
But um, you know, we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ.
All right.
But, you know, Job does make some statements about God.
But because Job had his priorities right, uh he did not curse God.
Uh now how many have rejected God because they have believed this health and wealth lie?
When tragedy happens to them, they cannot figure out why it happened, and this causes us
to be judges of God.
In fact, uh I want to make this state and I may have mentioned this earlier in an episode,
but if you go back to Job chapter one and those first
three verses are very crucial and they set up uh the situation in Job.
In Job chapter one, verse one, there was a man in the land of Uz whose name was Job, and
that man was blameless and upright, one who feared God and shunned evil.
And so God was first in his life.
Then it talks about his family, and seven sons and three daughters were born to him.
Then it talks about his possessions, his stuff.
And his possessions were seven thousand sheep, three thousand camels, five thousand yoke
of oxen, five hundred female donkey donkeys, and a very large household, so that this man
was the greatest of all the people in the East.
And so we see in those first three verses, Job put God first, family second, stuff third.
And that is the order we have to have things if we are going to endure.
suffering if we're going to endure trials like Job did.
Because if we put family first, and there's many people that make this mistake, if we put
family first and something happens to family, what's that going to do to our faith?
If we put stuff first, and you know stuff can disappear in a heartbeat, and st something
happens to our stuff, then what's that going to say about our faith?
What's that going to do to our faith?
But if we put God first, and nothing can happen to God,
Nothing can destroy God, nothing can diminish God, except ourselves, of course, but they
don't diminish God, they just diminish our our attitude toward God.
But God cannot be taken away, God cannot be changed, God cannot love us, and so if we put
God first, no matter what happens, we still have are grounded in God.
And so we have to have it that way.
God first, family second, stuff third.
And we will be able to endure like Job did.
But this retribution theology is wrong, not only because of what it does to human beings,
but because of what it does to God.
It turns him to an arbitrary gift dispenser.
And then secondly, it limits God's person and power.
It binds him to a process that is impossible in any practical sense.
He is no longer free to operate in human events as he sees fit.
But he he is bound to this reward and punishment, reward and punishment of things done in
this life.
And of course that's not God.
And God is not slack, as Peter would declare, second Peter 3:9, God is not slack
concerning his promise, as some men count slackness, but he's long-suffering to usward,
not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
And so
How many of us would be around if God immediately punished us for our sin?
In fact, I'm glad he didn't.
You know, we we study like Nadab and Abihu, for example, Leviticus chapter ten, verses one
and two, they were struck dead immediately when they sinned.
We looked at Uzzah in Fer Second Samuel chapter six, and he was struck dead when he
sinned.
We look at Ananias and Sapphira, Acts chapter five, they both were struck dead because of
their sin.
And so if God did that to everybody all the time, as retribution theology would demand,
then none of us would be alive today, because we have all sinned and come short of the
glory of God.
And so God's wrath was kindled later on in the book at the three friends because they
claim to speak for God.
But when such a claim is made, a person better be sure his facts and principles are right.
And so this uh retribution theology is not correct, it is wrong because of what it does to
fellow man and what it does to God.
It paints humans uh in a picture that is not true all the time, and it paints God in a
picture that is definitely not true.
but God is sovereign, but he never interferes with our free will.
And so we do have free will to serve him.
And every single human being, whether they are suffering or not, is made in the image and
likeness of God.
And because of that fact alone, that fact alone deserves our attention.
Every human being deserves or is is well deserved, I don't want to say entitled, but
deserves to be treated with respect and dignity.
Again, whether he or she is suffering.
People need to be treated with dignity because they are made in the image and likeness of
God.
And so this retribution theology is wrong on all points.
And so let's not hold that and let us realize that God is good all the time, whether I'm
good or not, and that my suffering, as we discussed last episode, may be a number of
things.
But God is still God and He loves us.
And he wants us to be saved and to be with him for eternity.
We thank you for tuning in to this episode, and we will continue lessons from the book of
Job for a few more episodes until we start another season.
But we would appreciate your feedback.
You can contact us through email or any other way through social media.
But we do appreciate you listening and we look forward to being with you again.