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What if you could get more of what you want in life? But not through pushing, forcing, or pressure.
You can.
When it comes to money, time, and energy, no one’s gonna turn away more.
And Kate Northrup, Bestselling Author of Money: A Love Story and Do Less and host of Plenty, is here to help you expand your capacity to receive all of the best.
As a Money Empowerment OG who’s been at it for nearly 2 decades, Kate’s the abundance-oriented best friend you may not even know you’ve always needed.
Pull up a chair every week with top thought leaders, luminaries, and adventurers to learn how to have more abundance with ease.
The more beneficial things you add in, it just starts to crowd out the things that, you know, the improper living things. It just they feel good, and they they start to create their own momentum. So grab grab just one thing. Drink a glass of water tomorrow morning right when you wake up before coffee, before anything else.
Kate Northrup:Hi. Welcome to Plenty. If you are watching this on YouTube, you'll see that we are on location today at an incredible summit in Palm Beach called Eudaimonia. And my first guest is doctor Erica Siegel who is the author of The Nourish Me Kitchen which is an incredible two part book series. One is a functional medicine guide at home.
Kate Northrup:You can look up anything. It is the first of its kind to be able to go and figure out what you need to do. And two is incredible recipes. The forward was written by doctor Zach Bush. If you know me, you know you I love him.
Kate Northrup:So in this episode, we talk about how to bolster your energy reserves, how to fine tune your intuition so that you can listen to your body as your best medical provider, and also some incredible tips on breast health and more. So enjoy the episode with the incredible doctor Erica Siegel. Welcome to Plenty. I'm your host Kate Northrup and together we are going on a journey to help you have an incredible relationship with money, time, and energy and to have abundance on every possible level. Every week, we're gonna dive in with experts and insights to help you unlock a life of plenty.
Kate Northrup:Let's go fill our cups.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Please note that the opinions and perspectives of the guests on the Plenty podcast are not necessarily reflective of the opinions and perspectives of Kate Northrup or anyone who works within the Kate Northrup brand.
Kate Northrup:Hey, Erica. Hi, Kate. I'm so happy you're here.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Thank you so much for having me.
Kate Northrup:Thank you. Thank you. Okay. So you went to medical school
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:And combined a traditional more of a traditional or allopathic with more of an eastern complementary. What do you you don't don't call it like, what do you call it?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. So I went to a naturopathic medical school. Yep. Four years of some sort of conventional training. Yep.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And I did my master's in oriental medicine. So I have my license in acupuncture. And the combination is really an integrative approach, an East meets west approach to medicine.
Kate Northrup:And, what was it for you? So, both of my parents are doctors. One of them is way traditional. One of them is super not. So, I've hung in the wellness world
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:My whole life. And I have found
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes.
Kate Northrup:That healers Mhmm. Tend to have a core story or experience from their own life that brought them to becoming a healer. Yeah. Do you have that?
Dr. Erika Siegel:And if
Kate Northrup:so, what is it?
Dr. Erika Siegel:I do have a core story. My core story is a childhood story. My family of four, we were just sort of humming along as a nice family in New Jersey. And my dad had a widowmaker heart attack when I was eight. He survived.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And he lived to be 89 because my mom basically took it upon herself to learn how to manage heart health and how to explore every avenue from conventional to alternative and mix the two in a scientific and aggressive approach. And he lived quite well because of her pioneering spirit and creativity. And I think I just learned that there were options. Yeah. That it wasn't just one system, that there are so many systems of medicine.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And why not choose the best of all of them to apply to And
Kate Northrup:what was did she have any medical training?
Dr. Erika Siegel:No. None. What was her background?
Kate Northrup:Like, career wise? She was an
Dr. Erika Siegel:artist, and she helped run my dad's law firm. Wow. But she what I think inspired her was that she knew that there were other options, and she's just someone who doesn't give up. So she just has a really strong spirit. And that inspired me to learn what I could from different avenues of medicine and different practices.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. That's so beautiful. And, I mean, it sounds like she really, in many ways, saved his life. Yeah. Oh, one 100 So beautiful.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. What I find is, as someone who's always been you know, I'm very out of the box when it comes to health. I always have been because of how I was raised. And, my father and other people that I come into contact with are very much like, allopathic medicine is God. So is surgery.
Kate Northrup:So is pharmaceuticals. Right. And, like, no availability for really anything else. My dad's not so much like that anymore, but, like, I know I I come up against this, and I know other people who are listening to the show Yeah. Do as well, where, like, maybe they're married to somebody Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Who's like, well, my doctor says to eat fiber one bars, and that's it. So I'm not gonna take a vitamin, or I'm not gonna like, da da da, and that's just the way it is. And they're not open at all. Mhmm. What do you recommend for people who have people that they love Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Who just are like really bought into the traditional system, and it's heartbreaking because they there's no wiggle room there.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. It is really challenging because we come up against that dogma all the time. True. That there's only one system approach. And if we don't know the answer, there is no answer.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right? That is often what we're told. If we don't know the answer, then there isn't an answer. Right. And I think what I share with people is they have to treat themselves the way they wish to be treated, and hopefully others will learn from their successes.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And we cannot convince others that something is right for them, but we can educate them, we can share information, And we can also share the way that we choose to live. So I appreciate in one of your recent podcasts, you shared that you you know that your body is your ally. And that it is sort of working on your behalf, and you listen to it. And so what I try to encourage people is listen to your body. Does your body say that this is a yes?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Or does it say that it's a maybe or a no? And I don't think that we should be overriding our own intuition. And so if your intuition says this food feels like a yes, or this practice, or this idea feels like a yes, then I think it's worthy of exploration. Mean, we've only been practicing allopathic medicine for the last hundred years or less. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Even much less than that. So what about the centuries of wisdom that preceded this time? And you also can't convince people, so you have to just back away with grace and say, I appreciate what you think is important for you. I'm gonna do what's important for me. And what I found in my life is a lot of people have kind of come around because they see the way that I live.
Dr. Erika Siegel:They see the way that I feel. They see what I'm educating people on, and they're like, well tell me more. Is there an option? Because maybe they've run out of options in the allopathic model, so they become curious.
Kate Northrup:And, you know, I've just met you. Mhmm. I walked in like ten minutes
Dr. Erika Siegel:ago. But
Kate Northrup:I will say, I was surprised when you told me you have a 16 and 17 year old
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Because you have a tremendously youthful, vibrant energy about you, and so that speaks volumes.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Right?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right.
Kate Northrup:And I'm sure people at this point are like, alright.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay. Tell me what you're Right. Yeah. I celebrated my fiftieth birthday this year. Oh, amazing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Happy birthday. Thank you. And, yeah, it's it's kind of interesting getting to this point of my career because I'm twenty five years in. Yeah. And now people are listening a little more closely.
Dr. Erika Siegel:They're like, okay. Something you're doing is working because you seem to be really healthy. Yeah. So And
Kate Northrup:also like Yeah. There's like healthy Yeah. But there's also life force.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Mentality is quite They
Kate Northrup:are not always right? They're not always the same. I mean, of course, they can come together, but Mhmm. One of the things that I know, you know, our listeners are really interested in is cultivating their inner energy reserves. And and to me, that's the same as cultivating your life force.
Kate Northrup:Yes. So when it comes to you know, I'm I'm sure you've you've worked with thousands of patients at this point. Many of them female, I would
Dr. Erika Siegel:have Yes. Many.
Kate Northrup:Most, in fact. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And so what do you find are the biggest energy sucks for women that are like draining our life force?
Kate Northrup:You know, other than maybe the years of waking up all night with babies and breastfeeding, which is kind of its own thing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. You know, I I actually talk about this a lot because I find that my most common, the most common situations that I see for women are that they're burning the candle at both ends. Managing work, managing family, managing community, parents, and they aren't really working on their own resourcing. They're not taking enough care of themselves and providing their body with what their body needs. You know, sleep and movement and good food and community and if we don't have those resources, we get very drained.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And there's a lot of shoulding on ourselves, right, as women, as people that are trying to keep up with this pace. We we need to do this. We have to do that. And there's a lot of pressure to show up in a certain way, and that's really draining. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So if we're if we're always just running, and we don't pause, and we don't drink that glass of water, or take ten minutes on the yoga mat, we will expend our energy. And then of course, there's just the natural processes of aging that we might not be really listening to and supporting. You know, we might not always be ready for power yoga. Sometimes we might need some yin yoga time. For years.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Pushing through, pushing We may also be masking our fatigue and not listening, masking it with caffeine, with sugar, with stress. So stress is a great way to motivate yourself to move through something. So if you aren't quite feeling like you have the energy, you might produce that cortisol response to get up and go and keep going.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And so we have all these ways of saying, oh, I know you're tired, but we're still gonna do this thing. And if you don't heed your body's call for rest and restoration, it's gonna get tired. Yes, it is. Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Okay. Mhmm. So someone's listening and they're like, I'm really tired. Yeah. And yet Yeah.
Kate Northrup:I feel like there is so much pressure and I don't get to Yeah. Care for myself or I don't get to right. So obviously, our lives is a very powerful healing
Dr. Erika Siegel:tool.
Kate Northrup:Yes. Okay? And, we can't always change the external. Right? Like, sometimes you have a chronically ill partner or parent.
Kate Northrup:Sometimes you have a very demanding job you know, you're the provider. You know, there's lot of Yes. So what are some of the because, like, I work in the realm of the external things you can change. Right? Yeah.
Kate Northrup:And, of course, the internal as well. But as a health practitioner, as a doctor, what are some of the ways that we can support our body's systems for, stress management or energy reserve support that maybe don't require you to, like, overhaul your entire life? Even though, quite frankly, I just wanna be super clear, like, that is worth it and probably the best place to start. Right. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. But
Kate Northrup:like, where should we start? Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Well I think weaving in self care as daily practice and being efficient with your time, and managing your time in such a way where you know that you've carved out eight hours for sleep. Yes, sleep. You have carved out thirty to forty five minutes for physical movement three, four, five times a week. Making those things such a priority that nothing budgets them. Mhmm.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And becoming efficient with cooking a bunch of food for a few hours when you can, putting in a podcast and chopping up a bunch of veggies so you know that you have good food to reach for. And most people that are really productive recognize that they they could kind of tweak some things to make the their life and their day more efficient Yeah. For taking good care of themselves. Starting your day with a full glass of water. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's an easy one.
Kate Northrup:Everyone has time for that.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes. Before you start with coffee.
Kate Northrup:If you have time to drink coffee, you have time to drink water. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. If you have time to scroll for five minutes, you have time for five minutes of body weight squats.
Kate Northrup:I love that. Yeah. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's just like being honest about how you're spending your time. If you're spending a lot of time doing things that you're like, I just need this to decompress, scroll, TV, whatever that might be. Alcohol. Maybe that decompress time could be a walk Yeah. Instead of a scroll, or a walk with a podcast, or talking to a friend while you do it.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Like, just kind of like brain hack your way into your own self.
Kate Northrup:Swaps. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm. Mhmm. And recognizing that five minutes of something is better than no minutes of that thing.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Yeah. Right. Because we so often let perfect be the enemy of good.
Dr. Erika Siegel:All the time. If you can't get to that one hour hit class that you want to do, you're going do nothing. Well, I will do push ups in the airport. In fact, that's like one of my gimmicks is I do push ups in the airport and video myself. It's great.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Because I'm going to sit there for thirty minutes Yeah. At the gate. Why not?
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Why not?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Get something done that I need to get I
Kate Northrup:love that. My mother is like the queen of doing a pilates mat workout at the gate and I used to find it very embarrassing. Yeah. But now I'm like you're
Dr. Erika Siegel:embarrass my kids all the time.
Kate Northrup:Such a wonderful weirdo. Right. We have
Dr. Erika Siegel:to be wonderful weirdos. I think that's the quote. It's like be a wonderful weirdo. Like, don't be afraid to do the thing wherever you are. Totally.
Dr. Erika Siegel:You know, like my bag is filled with like produce right now. My friends always laugh at me like, what produce do have in your bag? I'm like, oh, me see. I'm like, oh yeah. And apple, Carrot, red pepper.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Because I know I'm gonna want veggies today, and I might not get them at the hotel.
Kate Northrup:Okay. So let's talk about produce.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:I I do have some I have vegetable questions.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Oh, I love veggies. Like my
Kate Northrup:favorite So my husband went through many years of this crazy experience of, like, profound inflammation Yeah. Red man syndrome, like toxic steroid with not topical steroid withdrawal.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Oh, The
Kate Northrup:whole thing. Yeah. And one of the things that's, like, multilayered, and there were a lot of things going on there. However, one of the things that several people said to him, and I'm so curious about that Mhmm. This, is that actually eating quite a few vegetables was, like, high in histamines, and so he needed to, like, really reduce his histamine exposure.
Kate Northrup:So for a time, just for a time Yeah. He was really eating basically, like, beef Yeah. Brussels sprouts, and, like, some sweet potatoes, and that was it. But it was, like, very carnivore to bring down the inflammation. Right.
Kate Northrup:Can you talk about the philosophy of that? Because, obviously, we need to eat vegetables, and, like, that's common knowledge. Yeah. Yeah. Like, Chuck, what's what's the deal with like, when when are vegetables a problem, I guess, is my question?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Veggies, well, there is a high histamine list of foods, and there are a few vegetables that land on that list, like avocados oddly increase histamine. Not that they're gonna necessarily increase inflammation in everyone, but if your histamine load is at the line, it can toss you over where you will have a histamine response, which is more like a skin response as opposed to joint pain. Got it. When are vegetables a problem?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Vegetables are interesting because they have skins and seeds, and those can be hard to digest for some people.
Kate Northrup:Got it.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So they're high in lectins, and those lectins can be disruptive to the gut lining. There's also the fact that vegetables, if eaten raw, take a lot of digestive fire or power to break down. Yes. So even though salads are great, salads don't feel great for every person. So what I might educate someone on is I'll always ask them, how do you feel after you eat a raw salad?
Dr. Erika Siegel:And someone will say, you know what? I actually feel terrible. But I thought I was doing a good thing for myself. I say, it's not that the vegetables are bad, it's that your fire is a little low. Let's build the fire, and let's have you eat roasted vegetables.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Let's have you make a soup with tons of veggies, because those veggies are gonna be easy to digest. There isn't a one size fits all approach Of course not. To diet or to veggies, but veggies is where that's where we get our micronutrients, which is how our body heals and detoxifies. So I will never put down veggies as a category, but they can be rough on some bodies.
Kate Northrup:They're like really fragile Mhmm. And need some fire Yeah. Need some healing, need
Dr. Erika Siegel:some So most people can eat squash. That's always one that I'm like, okay, eat squash. If you're afraid of veggies, you can still eat squash. Most people do fine.
Kate Northrup:Okay. Yeah. That's very helpful. Thank you.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. And
Kate Northrup:then I have another question about vegetables, which is what like, there is so much debate.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Here we are at this Eudaimonia Summit. Right? Yes. This is like a lot of conversations about longevity.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes.
Kate Northrup:I feel like there is some debate around animal products
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:And plant based. Right. And, like, whether or not, even from an environmental standpoint
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Like, plants, all plants are the optimal. I will tell you, I was raised vegan, macrobiotic, and like all plants I don't know if it's a trauma response or whatever, but
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:I feel terrible when I eat vegan. Mhmm. And so but people are like, well, from a longevity perspective, like the data is clear. If you want to live until 120, you've got to eat only plants. And I'm like, is the data clear?
Kate Northrup:What do you think?
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's really mixed, actually. In the blue zones, where people live to be 100 or over 100, what they have found that's common in their diet is that they have a plant forward diet. They tend to all have sweet potatoes and legumes as a mainstay of their diet. They also most of them do incorporate some animal protein in their diet. It's usually the the side addition as opposed to the the main attraction.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So I think if we can glean anything from that, and of course there are other variables. They live on certain latitude lines. Yeah. They live in community. They walk a lot.
Dr. Erika Siegel:There are a lot of things there. But as far as the diet goes, we there's research that suggests that a plant forward diet is a longevity diet. That doesn't mean it needs to be vegetarian. It usually means that animal products are not a mainstay of the diet. And what's really important to distinguish when we talk about animal products is the source.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm. So a cow that's been raised in a cage eating corn and being given antibiotics and pesticide rich food is going to have a very different meat than a cow that's been pasture raised, living its life, grass fed, grass finished. The fat's gonna be different. The inflammatory profile's gonna be different. There's gonna be less arachidonic acid, less tendency to cause inflammation in the person who eats Sourcing is everything, and really there's other there's other factors.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So when we're in a growth stage of our life, so kid, you know, raising well, if we're a child, if we're growing a child during pregnancy, we have higher protein needs. And it is harder to get those protein needs met with a vegetarian or vegan diet. And when we're older, and maybe we're not building quite as much muscle, we might not feel like we need to have as much animal protein in our diet. Really tailoring to the person at the stage of their life. And then there's variables like blood type, you know?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Totally. The O types tend to be carnivores. The A types tend to be they do fine with a veggie forward diet. But I think it is it's really individualized, and what I see in my practice is I see vegans that thrive. I see carnivores that thrive.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I see carnivores that don't thrive, and vegans that don't thrive, and so we're always trying to figure out what is, you know, right for
Kate Northrup:that Really tailoring.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. And really listening to your your own guidance. Does that food look good? Does it feel good in my body? How do I feel after I eat
Kate Northrup:it? Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Do I have more energy? Yeah. Do I have less energy?
Kate Northrup:Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Such a good point. And all those things are valid, how your own relationship with the food. What is arachidonic acid? Arachidonic acid is it's basically something that triggers an inflammatory response in our body.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Great. I've never heard it before. Yeah. I love that.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Okay. And then in your book, The Nourish Me Kitchen, this is part one is a functional medicine guide, which is amazing for, like, at home, like a reference guide. Yes.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Everything you need to
Kate Northrup:that being done before. Yes. And then part two is the recipes. In your nourish me kitchen, do you have sourcing info for people who want to get better about the sourcing of their animal products?
Dr. Erika Siegel:I do. I have a whole chapter dedicated to sourcing. So, what to look for with meat and poultry and eggs and dairy and fish and guides and quick resource guide, and even some websites where you can have things shipped to Because we really need to focus on our sourcing
Kate Northrup:of our food. Yeah. Mhmm. Absolutely. Actually, we found a local so it's like local ish.
Kate Northrup:It's like within state. Yeah. Grass fed beef, you know. Yeah. So we can get it shipped to us at least like locally so it's not coming from across the country because then there's also the fact of like, but now I'm shipping food.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Like, are we supposed
Kate Northrup:to be eating local? There's a lot crossed wires.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's really hard to do the right thing all the
Kate Northrup:time. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. It is.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. I think that's fair. Yeah. Okay. Most people
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Were not raised to trust their bodies. Right. Or to listen to their bodies. Yeah. So when you say I mean, I know what this means for me.
Kate Northrup:Yes. But for someone who was talked out of listening to their body their whole life, has only more recently started having that stronger sense of like, maybe I do have some power over my own choices and body. What are some of the signs that they might look for in that could be an intuitive nudge?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. I love this question because it's what I'm really trying to educate people on. We have been outsourcing our own wisdom for a long time. Yeah. You tell me what to do.
Dr. Erika Siegel:This person said this is what I will do.
Kate Northrup:My doctor said this
Dr. Erika Siegel:twice. Said, my doctor didn't say I should eat that, so maybe I shouldn't eat it. The end. How do we turn the lens inside? Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And one idea that I've come up with is fostering self care so well in your own routine that you you just get a really refined sense of what's right for you. And self care isn't just taking a bubble bath or having time with girlfriends. Self care is like the day to day. I'm gonna eat that beautiful soup. I'm gonna move my body.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I'm gonna get in some sunshine and drink water. Because as you feel more aligned and you feel better, then those little whispers of feeling off get louder. And you learn that, oh, that is not quite Yeah. It's like a whisper because, okay, I've been taking really good care of this vessel, and now I know that I can exercise in this way and get this outcome. And then the next day you show up, you're like, I didn't really have much to give.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Like, sure, I'm gonna show compassion that I didn't wanna go big. Yeah. But what is that about? Is it because I didn't yeah, it's because I didn't sleep enough last night.
Kate Northrup:And then you know because you're so much closer.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes.
Kate Northrup:You're closer. Like, it becomes subtler. Yes. Or it's always been subtle. Yeah.
Kate Northrup:But now that you know the difference, it's almost like intuition by contrast.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes, exactly. Intuition by I love that. And the fine tuning just becomes there's more and more trust there because you're doing self care through love, and then that love kind of comes through. And you sometimes I like to ask myself if I'm thinking about, okay, what do I wanna do right now? I I imagine the thing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Do I wanna take a walk? Do I wanna take a nap? What is it that I wanna do? And I if I can't like intellectually figure it out, I ask my body, well, how would you feel with a walk? How would you feel with a nap?
Dr. Erika Siegel:And usually, my body will sort of be like, yes, please. Yeah. Like, you can just feel
Kate Northrup:what it's saying. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I'd like that one, please.
Kate Northrup:Okay. I love that. Yeah. Okay. So as we wrap things up here
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:I know that one of the things you're really passionate about is breast health.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes.
Kate Northrup:So just like what is your if women are concerned about breast health, if they're just really wanting to take good care
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:What are some of the things that we might want to be thinking about to pour into our breast health?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. So I recognize that we have been sort of trained that the breasts are to be either feared, or they're just like for nursing or sensuality. They're not really just this part of our body to integrate with the rest of us. And so integrating the breast tissue with the rest of our body. Massaging the breasts, just like you would do your gua sha on your Put that lovely oil on your breasts.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Say hello. Massage your breasts. I do a whole thing about breast massage.
Kate Northrup:Is that somewhere on the internet that we link?
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's in the Internet. It's in my book. Okay, great. We've put
Kate Northrup:it in the show notes.
Dr. Erika Siegel:We should be massaging our breasts. We should get to know what they feel like. What does normal feel like? Not because we're looking for cancer, but because it's part of our body. It's really rich in lymphatic tissue.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It does a lot of detoxification. There's a lot happening in the chest region, and this is not for just people with large mammary glands. It's people with flat chests. It's male, female, and everything in We all have a chest, and there's a lot of action happening in the armpits and chest, and so massaging that area, and then knowing that the foods that you eat and the herbs that you take support this area or maybe detract from the health of the breasts, and I love talking about that. We can do a whole another episode about breast health.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay. And I wanna make sure that I talk about energy one more moment, because I don't think I gave you I want more. Need nutrition. We need to feed our mitochondria, which are the energy centers of the cell. They need those micronutrients.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So they need b vitamins, they need magnesium, they need glutathione, they need those nutrients in order to function. They also need the breath. We we cannot function without a lot of oxygen, and so that means a full deep inhale, a full big exhale. And these are the ways that we oxygenate and feed our body and our blood and our energy is by giving our body what it needs.
Kate Northrup:So beautiful. Lots sleep. Lots of sleep. Yeah. Okay.
Kate Northrup:So I heard sleep, the right vegetables for the right person.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Right protein. We need protein for energy every meal.
Kate Northrup:And I I can only imagine that your book Yeah. Twofer Yeah. Is a wonderful guide that covers all of this Uh-huh. Soup to nuts.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It really does.
Kate Northrup:Okay. So folks, that's where you can go. Get yourself the Nourish Me kitchen.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:It is a two parter. Number one is the functional medicine guide. Mhmm. At home, look anything up. Yeah.
Kate Northrup:You got your thing. Yep. And then number two is the recipes. Yeah. Thank you for being here.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Thanks so
Kate Northrup:much for having come to find you?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Nourishme.com. Oh, that's easy. Amazon. The bookstore on Amazon too.
Kate Northrup:Your website is nourishme.com?
Dr. Erika Siegel:You know it.
Kate Northrup:It's a great website. Yep. Okay. Amazing. Doctor Erica Siegel.
Kate Northrup:This was a pleasure.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Thanks, Kate. Such a pleasure.
Kate Northrup:Welcome back for part two.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Thank you. Thank you
Kate Northrup:for coming again.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's great to be here and great to be in this this studio, the womb. Yeah. The Plenty womb. Here we are
Kate Northrup:in the Plenty womb. We didn't have enough time the first time. We did not have plenty of time. And so we brought you back, and I'm so grateful that you were willing because there's more to talk about.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So much.
Kate Northrup:And one of the things that I've been diving deep into over the last year, I don't know if I had mentioned this when we were together before, but I was quite sick on and off for a year and a half Yeah. And was getting a fever every single month. Right. It was like fifty fifty whether or not I was gonna be well or not, which is bizarre because I do everything Mhmm. To take care of myself.
Kate Northrup:Mhmm. So I really started doing a deep dive on mitochondria and, well, really everything. But but for whatever reason, I was feeling very drawn to mitochondrial health
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:And energy levels in general Yeah. Given that mine were in the toilet. Yes. And so I'm excited to learn from you about your research, your clinical experience Mhmm. Around how can we have good energy?
Kate Northrup:How can we feel vibrant, especially in a culture that tells us, well, as you get older, you're just tired at the end. Is that true? Let's start
Dr. Erika Siegel:there. I think yes and no. As we age, our cells become less efficient. And in that way, we will have less resources for producing energy, but it doesn't mean that we can't feel great and vibrant, and it doesn't mean that we can't do a lot to maximize what our cells have, you know, available. And a lot of it is just improper living that accumulates over time.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So the aging process, yes, there's the natural decline of mitochondria cell health over time, but it's kind of an accumulation of stressors and oxidative stress that makes those cells less efficient. Mhmm. Yeah. And there's so much that we can do to intersect that and have it have a different story.
Kate Northrup:What are some examples of improper living? I love the way you put that.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Improper living gosh. Maybe that's not the best way to say it.
Kate Northrup:I actually really
Dr. Erika Siegel:like Just living is is stressful. Yes. It is. Right? It is.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Well, stressors that, can be very material, like the food that we eat if we're eating fats that oxidize quickly, or stressors can be actual stress, staying up too late, worrying, not tending to the body. A stressor can be an infection. That's an a stressor to the body. And not to say that that's improper, but to the cell, it's it's not It's not optimal.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's not optimal. Yeah. And a stressor could look like nutrient deficiency, dehydration. There's so many ways to stress the body. Overexercising can be a stressor, and all of these things will have an accumulated effect of stress on the cell and therefore less efficiency and perhaps cells that are really dying that stay around too long, the senescent cells that should be cleaned out, and our efficiency in cleaning those cells out actually goes down as we
Kate Northrup:age as well. Okay. So we're hanging out with essentially, like, dead or dying cells. Yes. So I have I we're coming back to that because I'm very interested.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. In terms of our improper living. Yeah. Okay. So we wanna feel amazing.
Kate Northrup:We wanna feel vibrant. What is the eighty twenty? So what what is the 20% of things? Right? Because as someone who is a total health nut, I read everything, I listen to everything, I'm like up on all the things.
Kate Northrup:I want to do all the things, and reasonably speaking, you know, I run a company, I have two little kids.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Wanna be flexible.
Kate Northrup:Just can't fit it all in, honestly. Like, my based on all the things I want to do, my full time job could be taking care of myself. Right. But it's not because it's actually doing other things. Exactly.
Kate Northrup:What are the 20% that you believe are gonna give us 80% of those results in terms of our energy levels?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay. As far as energy levels. Yeah. I love this question, and it will always come back to the pillars of health, which I know you are a big proponent of, and you live, and I've listened to your podcasts and your daily routines, and I'm like, yeah, she's doing it. You are really doing Tell me if there's one missing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:There might be missing. Okay. Yeah. And I haven't necessarily tracked exactly what you have in your routine. But you tell me
Kate Northrup:what they are, I'll tell you what I'm missing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Okay. So first is gonna be nutrition, what we bring into our body, the nutrients that we not only take in but absorb, so that is going to then require good digestion. Hydration, and that requires the right electrolyte balance in our body for our water to penetrate our cells. If we're talking about daily rhythms, exercise is gonna be absolutely part of that 20% that's gonna give us the biggest return.
Dr. Erika Siegel:The exercise can be a variety of forms. There's, you know, the resistance training, mobility. There's the high intensity, low intensity sprint training. It turns out that all these forms of exercise are supportive for energy production. If we're talking about on a mitochondrial level, they all increase the biogenesis or the the new mitochondria, and they also support the cleaning out of old mitochondria.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay. Cool. Movement is you know, it has gotta be on that prescription pad of, like, the first few things that are, prioritized for your daily life. Of course, we want to sleep, and we wanna prioritize sleep and do everything that we can do to optimize that window. There's so much information about sleep out there.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I'm sure you've dug into this quite a bit, but really, like, having the good patterns so the sleep hygiene is there where you're sleeping in the dark. You're getting to bed before midnight. You have a nice Oh my god.
Kate Northrup:Midnight, I'd be dying. I have to get to bed before 09:15.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Yes. Exactly. 10:00.
Kate Northrup:Before midnight.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes. 10:00 is ideal. I mean, what people should understand is that sleeping from ten to six is better than twelve to eight. Those eight hours are not comparable.
Kate Northrup:Of the the like, I mean, I know in Chinese medicine, it's like liver time, but what's your
Dr. Erika Siegel:It is associated with the Chinese medicine rhythms in the twenty four hour cycle, but it's more about the circadian rhythm, our melatonin production, and our stimulation of hormones and synthesis during the night. So growth hormone is happening at night. We are doing a lot of liver metabolism and production and a lot of healing, and we are we're an organism part of this planet that responds to the light and dark circles just like the flowers and the everything else. And although we can override it pretty easily with, you know, our modern day living, we do a lot better when we get into the natural rhythm, which is really like, you know, really kind of winding down at by sunset and asleep soon after and getting up with the sun. Now, of course, it's different depending on latitude Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Where you live. But generally prioritizing sleep is gonna be one of those 20%. Prioritizing rest, which is different than sleep.
Kate Northrup:I think that's a pillar that I'm missing. Mhmm.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. The rest piece is really interesting. It's very hard for productive people like you and like me to say that is as important as this other thing, because it can feel wasteful. If I sit and just meditate for twenty minutes, is that as important as getting those dishes done or Right. You know, responding to emails?
Dr. Erika Siegel:And it turns out that it is. When we rest, it's not just a break from stimulation, but it's an opportunity for our nervous system to get into the parasympathetic. Thank you for the deep breath. Yeah. Just like, okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Do that
Kate Northrup:too. Rest now.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Right. Yeah. And that's that's so key. We can rest without it being, you know, marked off in our our day.
Dr. Erika Siegel:We can rest while we're driving. Yeah. We can rest while we're waiting. We can say, oh, I'm gonna be here for two minutes. I'm gonna breathe.
Dr. Erika Siegel:That counts. Yeah. So the non sleep deep relaxation. Do you know that acronym that's becoming more
Kate Northrup:No.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Popular? Nonsleep deep relaxation, it's like the yoga nidra
Kate Northrup:Yes. Meditations. Is it literally n s Yeah. D r? Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Got it. Because antihuberman's talking about it now. So now everybody's like, NSDR, NSDR. That's hilarious.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. So I
Dr. Erika Siegel:love that. It's basically like allowing the brain to relax but not sleep because
Kate Northrup:sleep is Really, this is not so much about like, it is and it isn't. Right? It's not just your body being at rest. It is your brain. Right?
Kate Northrup:Because I think we can be like, oh, no. I'm sitting on the couch scrolling on my phone. I'm resting.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Exactly. Thank you for pointing that out. It's really the brain because the brain is so metabolically active. Talking about mitochondria, the brain cells, the neurons have the most percentage of mitochondria of any cell in the body. It is like always on, always working.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It consumes the majority of our calories, and it produces the majority of our ATP energy because it has so much work to do. So if we're always navigating life and all the stimulation that's coming in, our brain gets tired. And if we say, okay, brain, you're gonna have a break right now. I'm gonna close my eyes. I'm gonna reduce all the input.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I'm gonna maybe do a progressive relaxation, which is like what yoga nidra talks you through. You give your brain an opportunity to start cleaning out the cells that are are ready to go and to have a different experience to go into the parasympathetic state, which is the the rest and digest and heal state. Yeah. So these these moments of rest, those are crucial.
Kate Northrup:That's great. Yeah. I I love that. You know, yesterday I was driving to acupuncture, which is inherently restful as well, but I decided after I got off the phone with my friend, I was like, I'm just gonna drive in silence. Right.
Kate Northrup:And it felt so nice for fifteen minutes to just be with myself. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Reduce the input. So even though
Kate Northrup:my brain was still active because I was driving
Dr. Erika Siegel:But it was one less
Kate Northrup:It is. Because Driving is sort of somewhat autopilot.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Yeah. I like how you brought up the idea of just turning the radio off when you're driving, just reducing one level of input, and we know being parents that when we had young children that going to the supermarket in silence and just driving the car or just shopping felt like a vacation because it's less input, less sensory input.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Totally.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Which is important for our brain to, refresh itself.
Kate Northrup:So really what you're saying is Mhmm. This non sleep Sleep Deep relaxation. Relaxation. NSDR is reducing stimulus, certainly reducing physical activity, but also reducing input so that our brain Yeah. Can rest.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And we
Kate Northrup:can do that
Dr. Erika Siegel:in degrees. We can do that in different degrees.
Kate Northrup:Okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. The Yoga Nidra is an example of bringing the attention inward, so you aren't totally just, you know, letting your mind go, you're actually bringing your awareness inward, which usually will slow the breath and allow you to feel into your body. And that's that's really enough input just to like be connected in that way.
Kate Northrup:Yeah, Yoga Nidra is so amazing. There's a wonderful book called Daring to Rest, and then there's another one by Tracy Stanley, which I cannot remember the name of, but anyway, you can check those out. It's such a beautiful practice. Okay. So so sleep Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Movement, and rest. Good nutrition. Good nutrition.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Of course, we could go into that forever, what that means. Right? Like making sure you're hitting your macronutrient needs, protein, fat, fiber, carbohydrates. Well, I I call fiber a macronutrient.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's not. But Yes. Protein, carbohydrate, fat. Yeah. And then, of course, the micronutrient needs.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Our body needs so many literal minerals and vitamins for all the cells to do their work and everything in between. There's there's a lot of information there. I like how you talk about that one of the pillars to your health is having proper light on your body and in your eyes.
Kate Northrup:It really has made the a huge, huge difference in my well-being.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I am getting that. I'm starting to learn that for myself, and learning the science behind it is is what excites me always about something, especially a newer or a more popular or newly popular pillar of health, it's like, well, why? What's what's going on there? And it turns out that the mitochondria are reacting to that that light, in real time.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So, being around the infrared or the red the red light, the long wavelength light will stimulate more mitochondria production, biogenesis, and repair. So that's, looking outside and being outside around sunrise earlier part of the day and sunset. Doing that alone can change your brain, change your energy, make you feel more alive. Of course, can do red light therapy with all the the cool gadgets. And I really like how you are pretty strict about your blue light exposure.
Kate Northrup:I'm very strict because I notice I feel hungover. First of all, I feel dead at the end of the day when I've looked at a screen all day without my blue light blockers. Mhmm. And if I have been on a screen at night without them, I feel hungover the next day, like I was partying until 2AM.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. It actually damages mitochondria
Kate Northrup:So that makes
Dr. Erika Siegel:to be exposed to blue light. Yep. In real time.
Kate Northrup:So with red light exposure Mhmm. And mitochondrial activity, do we is it just through the eyes, or is there also benefit of actually exposing our skin to the light?
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's eyes and skin, so they each have different effects on the mitochondria. Of course, the skin requires the light on it for production of vitamin D, but there's also mitochondrial benefit that's different than eye exposure. So ideally, you start every day with the blinds open, and you see light. And I know you get up before it's light, so but, you know, as soon as
Kate Northrup:the
Kate Northrup:light's
Kate Northrup:coming
Dr. Erika Siegel:yeah.
Kate Northrup:I mean, I do my best.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Yeah. But it's ideal to get some of your skin or as much skin contact as you can to get some of that, you know, five, ten minutes in the morning, five, ten minutes in the evening, getting it on your skin actually has additional benefit.
Kate Northrup:And obviously sometimes it's too cold to do that, but even just getting it in your eyes. And what I had understood is that it's not the same through a window as it is when you're actually just seeing the light. Is that true?
Dr. Erika Siegel:It is not the same as through a window, but there is benefit through the window. So, you know, first level So again, it's
Kate Northrup:like the amount you can do is good. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yes. And and this will affect not just mitochondria, but melatonin production. Our whole circadian rhythm is going to depend on these light dark cycles and trying not to override them. So as the night comes, trying not to be in bright lights and computer light because, sure, you'll still stay awake. It will keep you up, but it's not it's not the right kind of energy.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's not an authentic energy.
Kate Northrup:So tell me more about the right kind of energy and authentic energy. What is what do you mean by
Dr. Erika Siegel:that? Yeah. So, well, we think about energy in a bigger sense. We think about, okay, our cells need fuel. So that goes back to the nutrition piece, right, to be able to break it down and do the thing and that's that's real energy.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Our mitochondria use that food and light for their job of making the right kind of energy, real energy, which is ATP. And we are also feeling the right kind of energy from proper thyroid function and adrenal function. These hormones are producing the things that we attribute to feeling energized. Okay. The wrong kind of energy is when we override a system and we put stressors into the body to tell the body, hey, we need to we need to run from this tiger.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Sorry. We need to stay up and finish this report. You're just gonna have to show up. And that's the wrong kind of energy because that's gonna be fueled by cortisol, adrenaline. It might be fueled by caffeine.
Dr. Erika Siegel:That's the caffeine at the wrong time of day or for the wrong constitutional body type, is the wrong kind of energy. It will it will tell you you're not tired, but it's sort of, you know, borrowing from Peter to pay back Paul.
Kate Northrup:Right. So it's like a Band Aid on a on the indicator light on your car sort of thing to being like, my car's fixed. What's the constitution for a body that would not be ideal for caffeine?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. And this is so important for people to ask that of themselves. Like, how do I feel when I have coffee or green tea or black tea or chocolate? Because all of these things are gonna contribute a different type of caffeine and other constituents. And some people feel really alert and awake and alive from that, and that's okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:That's good because it increases blood flow to the brain. It increases blood flow to the muscles. And if and if that's a match for your body, great. Some people, when they intake those substances, they might feel energized and like they can do the task, but they're also gonna feel anxious. And they might feel wired but tired at the end of the day.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So they're they're really putting putting additional strain on their adrenal glands to mount sort of a stress response as opposed to a healthy caffeine response. And that is actually dictated by our liver's detoxification of caffeine. Okay.
Kate Northrup:And how easily or Yeah. Whatever or effectively our body is.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Exactly. People will Metabolism. Cycle it, and it'll just go round and around and around, and they have coffee, half a cup of coffee in the morning, and they can't sleep for two days.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. It's interesting because I have friends who can like down an espresso at 10:00 at night and go to bed, and I can't really have caffeine past 11:30AM.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. They're hyper, metabolizers of caffeine. Interesting.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Yeah. It blows my mind. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:They also can metabolize other things more efficiently. So people that tend to be slow at metabolizing caffeine might be also slow to metabolize toxins in the environment, Tylenol, pain medication Alcohol. Alcohol.
Kate Northrup:I mean, that's why I can't drink because I can have a half a glass of alcohol and have a hangover.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I just can't do it.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. It's just my body is like, please don't do that. Yeah. I do I do fine with coffee, but again, it can really only be like a cup, maybe two Right. And can't be past really eleven or 11:30.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. And that's just from getting to know myself. But I will say I gave up coffee for a year because my adrenals were everything was a total mess, and I really hated it.
Dr. Erika Siegel:You hated not being on coffee.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Not having coffee for a year. It was brutal. Uh-huh.
Dr. Erika Siegel:For a year. Yeah. That's a long time.
Kate Northrup:Like, I got past a couple weeks, and I was like, actually, I feel great. I missed it every day. Oh my gosh. I felt like Yeah. I felt about it the way I have a I I do have a couple of friends who used to be heroin addicts, and the way they described the feeling that they had about missing it every day was like, I feel like
Dr. Erika Siegel:Feel the same coffee.
Kate Northrup:I'm not, by the way, I'm obviously not fully saying that it is the same thing, but it was an interesting thing. And then when I went back, I was like, no, no, I'm just better. I'm better I'm a better person with coffee. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Huffier with it. And some people find that, they think that coffee is their match, but it's really green tea is a better match or herba mate or
Kate Northrup:a different kind of Mhmm. Sourcing. Yeah. Yeah. I used to be a mate person.
Kate Northrup:I love that stuff.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Maybe I'll go back.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's very clean burning.
Kate Northrup:It it, like and it feels it it, like, tastes like drinking the forest.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. It's very earthy. It's so
Kate Northrup:great. Mhmm. Yeah. So okay. Maybe I'll maybe I'll add that in Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Or, like, do a swap. Right. Okay. So can you tell me I have a feeling that many women in our community might have some adrenal fatigue, but it may not be showing up on their labs, or might have some thyroid sluggishness, but it's not fully showing up on their labs. Yes.
Kate Northrup:Can you talk about the difference between sort of standard of care and what your doctor might be looking for on the labs versus how you might know you actually need support? Yeah. When your doctor's like, everything's normal. Yeah. And you're like, I don't feel good.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. This is the story of so many women. Right? Yeah. I don't feel well.
Kate Northrup:This is what was going on with me. All my labs were fine. There was zero issues, and I was like, I'm sick all the time. Yeah. I'm clearly not okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Exactly. There's a lot that we can't test for appropriately, or or let's say are is usually are not usually tested Yeah. Regarding adrenals. So the adrenals, the thyroid, and the ovaries, work in a triangle with each other.
Dr. Erika Siegel:They are it's like a three legged stool and they all require, support from each other for optimal functioning. The adrenals, which are two little glands that sit right above the kidneys, as you know, they produce adrenaline, cortisol. They also have jobs in blood pressure. They have a lot of jobs. And when we ask our adrenals over and over again to override our desire for sleep, our need for food, our desire for rest, we start to, get into adrenal compensation.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So the first the first trend will usually be overproducing cortisol, and then we will start underproducing cortisol. When we overproduce cortisol, we might feel the wired but tired. We might just feel like amped, but we probably also feel pretty productive. And this is very typical for women, especially women who work and have kids. They're just like going on all, you know, all cylinders all the time.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And then when they drop off is when they usually come into the office, and they're like, I don't know what's going on. I I don't have the same zest for life. I don't have that get up and go. I usually can respond to a stressor, but then I'm crashing in the afternoon. So what's usually happening is their cortisol production is now going down.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Their DHEA production is probably going down, which is going to affect the hormones, the ovarian function.
Kate Northrup:Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And it all, you know, comes together in this constellation of just feeling tired, maybe brain foggy, not a lot of motivation. And sadly, the standard labs on a blood test aren't going to point to any of that. If you test the adrenals through the urine or through the saliva, you specialized testing, you can check to see what does my cortisol level look like over a twenty four hour period, which is how it should be evaluated. Okay. The blood cortisol test, the first thing in the morning blood cortisol test, all it tells you is that moment in time, and it tells you also what it looked like for you to get up, get to the lab, drive there.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So it's not an accurate representation of your morning cortisol. Like fasting. All of that. Yeah. So the only reason that cortisol is really tested on a lab test, blood test, is to see if someone has, Addison's disease or Cushing's disease, like a real deal adrenal, pathology.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Everything else is adrenal dysfunction or like not being optimal, which is completely being ignored by most doctors and what so many people are experiencing.
Kate Northrup:So you need a saliva test or a urine test Yeah. Over twenty four hours Yes. For an accurate read on your adrenal.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Exactly. Because you'll do five samples
Kate Northrup:Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Over the course of twenty four hours. I really like the Dutch test. Yeah. It's actually available to folks, not even through their doctor. They can get it online.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Cool. And it will map it out over twenty four hours, like what does that curve look like? What does your total output look like? And then you have an idea of at least what does that day look like for cortisol output.
Kate Northrup:Right. Okay. And it's still just a day, however. It's a better indicator than one moment in time when you're going to the Much better. I'm curious.
Kate Northrup:One of the senses that I have had because I've of various places I've read and listened is that one of the things that can be not such a great idea when you do have some degree of adrenal fatigue Yeah. Is intense exercise. And that's tricky when you're someone who is working on the pillar of making sure you get movement, and then there can be in our culture this idea of more is more, and I used to be a dancer, and I struggled with body stuff and whatever. And so there's still some programming around if it's not hard, it doesn't count. Right.
Kate Northrup:But I wonder is, like, how do we gauge how intense our exercise should be? Mhmm. Because obviously you can get movement without it being intense. Yeah. Right?
Kate Northrup:Like stretching is Yeah. All sorts of things.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Well one in I I agree. So exercise that is too much for an individual will stress their adrenals, and so that that's where you have to figure out who what am I you know, what is my body asking for? One indication of is this exercise too much or just right is how do you feel after you exercise. If you feel fatigued after exercise, like not just like, oh, that was great. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I've that was a great workout. But you're like, woah, need to go lay down. It that's too much. Okay. And that means it's usually the adrenals are that are like, hey, that was just too much for me.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I'm already stressed all the time. Yeah. So, you know, that HIIT training might not be the right match for someone who is like always burning the candle at both ends.
Kate Northrup:Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:However, I do like the efficiency of HIIT training because you can do it twice a week and get a lot of benefit. And a lot of it is intuition. Like, if you feel like, gosh, I really would rather take a walk than a run, like today, I just wanna walk, then that's probably the right thing for you to do. But go for the walk. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:You know, the the walk is going to be therapeutic for most people, and it is really hard to know. But intuition will take you very far with what's the right match for me with exercise. For, women middle age and up, you know, we we both are dedicated to strength training. That is so important for our health and it's actually really good for the adrenal glands because it doesn't stress the adrenal glands quite as much. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Muscle, building muscle, the hypertrophy of muscle takes a lot of effort from the body, but it's not really stressful effort. Oh. I really like muscle building as an important pillar of the movement piece because it's not terribly hard on the adrenals unless you're like heavy heavy lifting, and you're going for max. That that could be a lot. Okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:But if you're doing eight to 12 reps of something, you know, a few times, the body likes that, and it's it's a good stress without usually being too big of a stress.
Kate Northrup:Okay. One of the things that you spoke about earlier that I wanted to circle back to was, building up dead or dying cells
Dr. Erika Siegel:Oh, yeah.
Kate Northrup:And not releasing them. Yeah. And you said movement is one of the ways to release them, but what are some of those other ways that we might be missing? Mhmm.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. So we, so the process of cleaning out dead mitochondria is called, autophagy, and that is stimulated by anything that we do to support mitochondrial health, but most specifically we'll see that with, some of the, like the good stressors, like intermittent fasting cleans those cells out, hydrotherapy, so either sauna therapy, cold plunging, cryotherapy, all of these things will clean out dead mitochondria and dead cells. Also, we have a lot of antioxidants in our diet that will help clear out dead cells. Like chlorella is a great example of something that will quite literally grab and clean out dead cells.
Kate Northrup:Cool. Mhmm. I love that. Yeah. Do you put that in your smoothies and stuff?
Dr. Erika Siegel:I don't like the taste of it. So I It's kinda gross. I eat the little yeah. I do not I've done that. Yeah.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And the color is like intense. It's really intense. Yeah. I like a combination of spirulina and chlorella together in like little tabs, and I down the hatch because they they supply the mitochondria with all of the nutrients that they that it needs to function. It's like, you know, top five foods for mitochondrial health, the stuff, the algae.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay. Should we? Should talk about we're jumping around, but it's okay. Right?
Kate Northrup:Yeah. No. That's how I am.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I am too. Okay. So if we're talking about foods for mitochondria, like what are the foods that the mitochondria love? And just to back up a little bit so people understand what mitochondria are, they're the little energy centers in the cells.
Dr. Erika Siegel:We've got thousands of them in our cells. They are basically what create your cell's currency. So not just energy, but efficiency. Like, job that it the cell needs to do, the mitochondria help it help it Yeah. Do it better.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right. Okay. So when we talk about what is going to improve mitochondrial health from the nutrition standpoint, foods that are high in minerals, high in polyphenols, and high in antioxidants. So all the colorful stuff. The ones that top the list for that are pomegranates, kiwi, walnuts, omega three fish, blueberries, all those colorful berries, and the the algaes, the spirulina and chlorella.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Okay.
Kate Northrup:Mhmm. Awesome. So ideally, you know, you would be getting these into your diet every day, a few times a week, that sort of thing.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Getting these things into your diet. Also, electrolytes, even the powdered ones that come from the supermarket, they are so important for mitochondrial health and act as a nutritional source for the mitochondria because it gives them the micronutrients that they need for the electron transport for them to, you know, pass the electrons down the line.
Kate Northrup:But like back in the day when there weren't electrolyte packets that you would order from Amazon or get them at the grocery store, how did people get electrolytes?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Fruits and veggies. That is our primary source of electrolytes. Yeah. I mean, a cucumber and celery have as much sodium, potassium, chloride, manganese, magnesium that you need. Great.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. So you don't need the powders. Coconut water is a great source. Uh-huh. But fruits and veggies should be our primary sources of electrolytes.
Kate Northrup:Great. And what about, like, making those infused waters? Does that help with electrolytes if I was to put, like, cucumber and strawberry and some water or not really?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. It's gonna it's going to contribute somewhat. A pinch of salt in there, sea salt, would bring that to the next level.
Kate Northrup:Okay. Great. Mhmm. Awesome. Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Okay. So I know that we are jumping around, but I wanna go back and make sure that we addressed all of the pillars of health. Okay. Yeah. Because I'm not sure that we got to
Dr. Erika Siegel:all So we did nutrition, sleep, rest, we did movement. Well, of course, there's the pillar of I think I consider this a pillar even though it might not be a daily practice, but it's like integrity with yourself, like tuning in, listening, whether that's the decision making of do I sleep in or exercise or do I eat this food or not, or the real deal honesty about like, is this the right job for me? Is this the right relationship? Because if we are not aligned in, you know, what's like true to us and we're live kinda like living a lie, like, you can't you can't supplement yourself out of that. Right.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It can support you. But just the recognition, even if you say it's not the right job, I know that, and but I'm choosing to stay, at least you're like, you're still in integrity with yourself because you're acknowledging it.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. And you're making a conscious choice. Right. Yeah. That one is so important.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It really is.
Kate Northrup:Now when it comes to, you know, the last chapter of your book here
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Which is the first part of the nourish me kitchen, the second part is recipes, the first part is all the knowledge and the wisdom
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right.
Kate Northrup:Is about aging gracefully. Yes. And obviously that's something that I think everyone is interested in, or at least the listeners of this show. Uh-huh. So clearly mitochondrial health is related to aging gracefully.
Kate Northrup:Yes. What do you think people miss that might be a less obvious aspect of I mean, we know we need to sleep. We know we need to be outside, we know we need to be moving our bodies. Right. What do you think ages us faster, or not so gracefully, that folks are missing?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I mean, it's the recognition that our day to day environment is, probably the biggest, source of our oxidative stressors and things that are aging ourselves. So our face products, our our body products, our cleaning products, the pesticides and hormones in our food, the chlorine in our water. And are we doing everything we can to mitigate that exposure? I think that some communities are really dedicated to that.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Some people are really dedicated to that and other people are like, you know, what can I do? Not realizing that they do have a lot of power in, you know, where they're spending their money and what they're introducing their body to, exposing their body to. Yeah. Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. And I think because it takes a slow toll over time Exactly. It doesn't feel as important Right. Or, like, even a thing. It's like, oh, no.
Kate Northrup:Windex is fine. Like Right. This is not a problem. Like, using Clorox on my I mean, of course, now I'm throwing brands under the bus. Right.
Kate Northrup:Anyway, just what you know, whatever. What have you. Or like aluminum deodorant or something. Right? You don't it's not like you put on a deodorant with aluminum, and then the next day you're sick.
Kate Northrup:Exactly. It's twenty years of exposure, thirty years of exposure. So I think that's something important.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And that's such a good point because, like, we can have a glass of wine and wake up the next day not feeling great. So we have that immediate feedback. Yeah. But just like you said, you use a product and you're like, I guess I'm fine. But it's these microinsults that really age our cells and our cellular function.
Dr. Erika Siegel:And sadly, there's so many that we can't do something about, but when we have a choice, I highly recommend, you
Kate Northrup:know cleaning products and and with the water you drink. So what kind yeah. But what kind of filtering?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Well, I like the the Pure water filter. That's what I use at our home. I don't do, like, reverse osmosis, and there's there's a lot more that I could do with water. I mean, there's really cool, like add hydrogen to your water, alkalinides, and I just like to make sure it's at least very clean. Right.
Kate Northrup:So no fluoride, no chlorine.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. So the the Brita water filter, it's going to be better than nothing, but it's not really at the level that it could be. Okay. The the counter water filters that or, like, the pitcher ones, they just they just don't filter enough. So water filtration, having a filtration on your shower or your bath.
Kate Northrup:That's one we need to do. We don't do that. We need to do that one.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. There's there's, units for the bath, for the tub. You just you could just screw it on and it will, reduce the chlorine that's coming through because you're just if you're taking a bath I take baths all the time. You're literally sitting in chlorine.
Kate Northrup:Does adding in Epsom salt help at all with that, or is that just some other benefit?
Dr. Erika Siegel:I don't think it has an interaction with the chlorine to to reduce that, but it has a lot of benefits.
Kate Northrup:Okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Alright. I'm a big fan. I take a lot of Epsom salt baths. Yeah.
Kate Northrup:No. It's amazing. I mean, obviously, the magnesium is incredible. It's great for your nervous system. Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:But also if you're soaking in chlorine, there's some drawbacks there.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Right.
Kate Northrup:Okay. Yeah. So I think I mean, I I absolutely think that water is one of the most important things that we can be Yeah. Tending to. Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:And I think because they're again, coming back to what we talked about at the beginning, there are so many things we could be doing. So it's like, okay, we have to work with the time, energy, and money that we do have, knowing that when we put deposits in and tend to our sleep, add in some non sleep
Dr. Erika Siegel:Deep relaxation. Thank you. Yes. I know. Takes some rest.
Dr. Erika Siegel:But
Kate Northrup:anyway, some rest. Yeah. Right? Adding these things in that that bank of time and energy, and I believe even money, will actually get Yes. Right?
Kate Northrup:So the more we do the 20% that gets us 80% of the results, the more reserves we'll have to then add in over time.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, for your audience that is interested in so many different things, health and abundance, wealth wealth creation. The better you feel, the more vital you are, the bigger ways you can show up in your life, more productive you can be and, you know, create more and have more coming back to you.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So this isn't just about being able to run the marathon or get through your day or look good when you're, you know, middle age and beyond, but really what you're able to make happen in this world. And Yeah. You know, I know that your your community is really working and striving towards that, and I just what I wanna tell people is that your health is worth it. This you are worth it. Your body is worth it.
Dr. Erika Siegel:This is this is your your temple, and, you know, honoring it is is is valuable.
Kate Northrup:Mhmm. I think it's the most important thing. Yeah. Because anyone who's lost their health or has a loved one who has Right. You got nothing.
Kate Northrup:When your body's not working right Yeah. It you you literally everything nothing else in your life can work. And so putting in those daily deposits of that 20% that gets us 80% of the results really does matter. And it is amazing how much it can make a difference. Like I added in proper light hygiene and sauna.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Mhmm.
Kate Northrup:And those two things Mhmm. Have dramatically changed. You know, I did a few other things, but those two things have had such a profound impact. I have not been sick since July. Amazing.
Kate Northrup:And that's incredible Yeah. After what I went through. Right. So I'm, you know, I'm a huge proponent of we can do, you know, what is that? It's like twenty minutes, fifteen minutes, a few days a week?
Kate Northrup:Yeah. You don't
Dr. Erika Siegel:have to do it all.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. It's not it's I did not have to, like, revolutionize my entire life in any way.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So Yeah.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. Thank you for your wisdom. Is there any, like, final piece that you would wanna make sure people know around vitality and tending to their energy?
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. I think that people should try to invite in the things that appeal to them the most when we talk about all these things that you can do. Like, what sticks out as something that you feel like you could get into the fold of your life easily instead of feeling like you have to do all of it or do something really different and weird? Like, if it appeals to you, like, oh, saunas, that sounds nice. Do that.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Cool. Do that one thing. Like, try to make it easeful and something that can really just go right into the rhythm of your life. Like, one of the things I teach parents when they say, my kid will only eat mac and cheese. And I'm like, okay.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Add broccoli to it. Would could your kid eat it with broccoli? Yeah. That could happen. Alright.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So you already have you have this pattern, although that might not be an ideal pattern, mac and cheese for every meal, but now you've added something in that's beneficial. And then the more beneficial things you add in, it just starts to crowd out the things that, you know, the improper living things. It just they feel good, and they they start to create their own momentum. So grab grab just one thing. Drink a glass of water tomorrow morning, right, when you wake up before coffee, before anything else.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. That's a really nice invitation. Yeah. Thank you.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Yeah. Thank you so much. And it's all here in my book. Like, I go through mitochondrial health, adrenal health, thyroid. Your book is so robust.
Dr. Erika Siegel:It's really robust.
Kate Northrup:I what a body of work. I mean, unbelievable.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Thank So
Kate Northrup:so where can people get themselves a copy of the Nourish Me Kitchen and and follow you and
Dr. Erika Siegel:learn everything about on my website, which is nourishme.com. The books are available on Amazon. You know, it's all there. I have a lot of blog posts with lots of information. I have a, new one that I'm posting this week on mitochondrial health, so it'll really dig into the nuts and bolts.
Dr. Erika Siegel:So we covered some bit here, but you can read, online about that. And, yeah, I just encourage people to educate themselves. Education is power, and it gives us empowerment to make the right choices for our body. Amazing.
Kate Northrup:Thank you for
Dr. Erika Siegel:being here.
Kate Northrup:Thank you for coming back. Thanks.
Dr. Erika Siegel:I'll come back again.
Kate Northrup:Yeah. The best.
Dr. Erika Siegel:Thank you so much.
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