Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Beyond The Message is a weekly podcast that dives deeper into the weekend’s teaching. Released after each Sunday service, it offers thoughtful conversation, added insight, and practical reflection to help our community process and apply what they heard. Whether you're revisiting the message or catching up, this podcast is designed to help you go deeper throughout the week.
Welcome to Beyond the Message, the podcast where we take the weekly teaching at Christ Community Chapel and bring it into your week. Every week, I sit down with my friends and ministry leaders at CCC to laugh a little bit, to reflect, and then to figure out how to live out what we are learning. If you missed this week's sermon, no big deal. In the description below, you can find a link to that, and then come back and join us in this conversation. My name is Stacey DiNardo.
I'm joined today by Brooks Montgomery, by Sara Koons, and by Jamie Hewitt. Hey, guys. And to kick things off, I'd love to just ask you a question to rank something. K. We are heading into July 4 week.
That means a lot of vacations are happening. I'd also like to add, Brooks, you noted you're an outstanding vacation planner. I've gotten a few messages about that. So you know what? If, if your next vacation needs planned, apparently you're on it. There might be more of that.
So I want you to rank these three different different places and tell me why you would rank the top one, the top one, that kind of thing. I got it? Okay. Beach Oh, okay. Mountains, or city?
I don't know what Sarah thought it was gonna be. I don't know. Actually, that's the new question. Italy. Yeah.
Yeah. Beach, mountains. Beach, mountain, or city? City. Yeah.
I'll go. Okay. I I would go city, beach, mountain. Real I was wondering if you could. Now I I would say one of the top reasons why, I think one of the most important elements of a great trip, at least for me, is good food.
And, you know, having having a trip, planning around some good meals, some good places to grab food, fun, that's why city is pretty important. Now if you could combine all three, which some places you can. No. It's some places top city by the ocean. That's right.
I know. I'm like, well, where? Okay. So city. Got that.
Sara. I I think I know what yours is. I am beach, mountains, city. And for me, being by water is really important. So I know you can sometimes have, like, beach, mountain together, but those are those two are very close together, but city would definitely be last for me.
Yeah. Jamie? If there's water nearby, like, if it was a lake, like a mountain lake You're trying to change I yeah. You're just mountain. Yes.
Hands down. But I would think if there's no water, if it's just a dry, arid Dry mountain. Then I will choose beach, mountain, city. Okay. Beach, mountain, city.
Okay. I'm sure I would definitely do mountain Okay. Beach, and city. I love hiking and being on a mountain, so that would be So we should never plan a city trip together from the sound of it. No.
I'm not. You enjoy your city. I would. I would. I would go along if it was completely planned and you had a lot of great food.
Yeah. That's good. Third place forever. So so Well, just jump in. Before we kinda jump into actually talking about the sermon, couple things.
We're, filming this after services on Sunday, which is different for us. We're coming off of baptisms that we're singing. So cool. So we're pretty excited after just a great week of teaching, but then also getting to witness baptisms. And also, this is week six, I think.
Right? Mhmm. I think it's week six. Yep. And I would just share and if you guys wanna jump in, you can.
But I feel like it might be, a little bit sad to say this. But in preparing for No. It was In preparing for these podcasts, I feel like God is just using it so much to change me and to show me so much more about, scripture and about what is being taught. And so, I don't know. We're hoping and prayerful that God is using this in the lives of other people, but I would just wanna put it out there that I know it's changing me.
So that's a good thing. Yeah. No. I think it's go ahead. No answers.
Okay. I just I think that often, we go into church, we listen to the message, and then, I mean, we might think about it or talk about it with someone, but then it just it kind of, yeah, doesn't really, impact us outside of that. And so it has been a really cool practice to, spend more time listening to the message and talking about it and having good conversations. Even pastor Joe at the very beginning of his message said it's really cool that he spends hours Yeah. You know, in Yeah.
A a passage of scripture. And so I think this has been really helpful, and I I did. I felt very convicted. Like, well, Sarah, maybe you should do that every week, you know, because it really has changed, my thinking and, some different even actions in my life. So Yeah.
I was talking to somebody in the atrium this morning between services, and the way I described it is it just feels like I'm soaking in the the sermon and the passage more than I ever have because of getting to do this. Right. And I don't know if this was your intent, but saying this is the sixth one is like, oh, we're closer to the end of this thing, and I will be sad to be done with this. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let's start talking about this week. So we are in Genesis 18, and this is a passage where, again, the Lord appears again to Abraham.
But in this passage, we kind of feel and there's a sense that they're actually coming more these three men are coming more because of Sarah and to communicate with Sarah. And he's promising again and saying that a year from now, I'm gonna come back here and there will be a child. And Sarah laughs. Last week, we talked about Abraham laughing. And Sarah's laugh, though, is a little bit more maybe cynical.
That's what pastor Joe kinda used in terming it. And she talks about being old and worn out. You get this picture of really how discarded she is, of how broken she is, of maybe even how broken her marriage is. And that she would say, really, God? Now?
Why would you do this now? Even in it, I love that she denies that she laughs, which, again, is God keeps kinda going through Abraham going, why did she laugh? And she's like, well, I didn't laugh. And he's like, no, but you did. We see a picture though of just gentleness and how God is approaching her.
There were three points, and that is that God multitasks, that God uses different approaches with different people, and that God loves to flip scripts. So, without anything further, let's jump in and say what really stuck out to you. What do you wanna highlight out of that? I yeah. I mean, maybe it's just even now as we've been talking about.
We're in week six. Yeah. Just the unavoidable reality that God continues to see, God continues to approach. And it's it's not just Sarah. Right.
It's not just Abram. It's Hagar. Right? It's all these different people in the story that we could resonate with that could not be more different. Like, some some are, you know, products of brokenness.
Some are cynical towards God. Some are trying to practice faithfulness to him, but in the waiting, they fail. Like Yeah. There's only one type of person, and it's the type of people that God sees and approaches. You know, we we no matter what we do in our waiting, no matter what we do in our, experience of life and failure, continually being reminded That he sees that.
That God initiates it in grace to reconcile us, to redeem us to him. Just kind of overwhelmed by all the different characters, that is the similar action of God. The way he is. It's powerful. Yeah.
Yeah. And this is really just an emphasis of pastor Joe's second point, but the intensely personal way in which God does that. So there's a a shared way where there's only one type of person, people that God sees and moves towards, but he he does it differently and it's intensely personal. And so I was just thinking even this morning, you know, passages in the gospels, I think it's like Luke 12, it's a God knows the numbers of hairs on each of our heads. And like the the reality that who you are and the uniqueness of that matters to God Yeah.
In the way that he pursues everyone. Yeah. I I don't I know why this struck me this week, but as I was listening on process and thinking, it just God really impacted me with the fact that he is so intentional about everything that he does, and we see that throughout scripture. Right? But we are at the very beginning of the Bible.
We are in Genesis and Genesis 18. So this story, like the story of God's creation just started. That's true. Yeah. And it just made me think, like, we're just at the beginning of seeing God, his redemption and hope that he will provide for all of us.
It's just and so just encouragement to, like, keep reading. Yeah. Like, don't walk away from Genesis and the story of Abraham and Sarah and be like, oh, that's cool. But you'll continue to see God show up in very intentional ways throughout scripture and even hundreds and hundreds of years later to when he sends his son Jesus to fulfill those promises ultimately for all of us. So I think, yeah, I just think God just really impressed that on me this week as I was thinking about that.
Like, wow, God is This is just the beginning of the story. Yeah. And just kinda what you're saying, Jane. It's very personal personal Yeah. For each of us.
It was very personal for Abraham, very personal for Sarah, and that is something that continues throughout scripture. Yeah. I wanna go ahead and watch. This is towards the end of pastor Joe's sermon. So let's just take a look at this real quick, and then we'll talk about it.
Listen. Whoever you're praying for, don't stop praying. Whatever you're praying for, don't stop praying for it. Because God loves to flip scripts, to turn something completely on its head. God is a multitasker.
He is multitasking through you to people you know, people you don't know yet. So this was at the end of his point about flipping strips, which is just amazing. I when I listened back to this, I actually got really convicted at the beginning of that. He says, don't stop praying for people. Don't stop praying for situations.
And I think I just had this moment where I realized I have totally kinda stopped praying for certain people that I've, in my head, thought might be too far gone, which is actually really convicting because there nothing is out of God's reach. But the reality and we'll talk about the flipping script thing, but just that is what God does. That is what we've seen him do, and his power, is on display in that, and that's something beautiful. But I don't know if you have anything else on that script. But he also got to summarize those points again, so now they're fresh in our minds.
There you go. He did it, Theo. Well, I just I mean, I'll just show you're not alone in that. You know, I was like, I had some family visit this weekend. And I think family are people that are so close to you and you you've known them your whole life.
And I'm kinda old, so I've had a lot of life, like, to get to know. And so Not that old Jamie. It's easy to be like, oh, that's never gonna change. This is the way. And so, yeah, I just think I had a similar conviction.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, the second point that pastor Joe talked about was that God uses different approaches with different people. And I think there's just a lot a lot there, especially the contrast that we see between Genesis 15 where God is making this covenant with Abraham. There's flaming torches.
There's this fire pot. There's sacrifices happening. There's darkness. It's this, like, crazy, powerful, terrifying, holy moment. Mhmm.
And then you see him approaching to communicate with Sarah and in gentleness, kindness, kind of through another person. So we've talked about the personal nature of that, and and that is a wonderful thing that's happened to you too. But I wanna ask you guys, when you came into relationship with God, is there one side of the spectrum or the other, whether it's God's holiness, the fear of God, or this grace, gentleness, kindness that was one or the other for you. Yeah. Just start right there.
Yeah. I I know for me personally, I mean, obviously, the mystery of God, what is revealed. There's, parts of us that we might emphasize and gravitate towards. And even me, I just was thinking when Pastor Joe was preaching in that, there's one place where Jesus talks about his heart, in all of scripture. And it's in Matthew 11 where he talks about, he is gentle and lowly in heart, which is funny because if I was to go up to someone and say, man, you're really gentle and lowly, like, some people would probably be like, I don't know if that's a compliment.
Yeah. I don't know if you're trying to, like, give me a backhand compliment here. But I feel like even in my own, experience of coming to place trust in Jesus, his gentleness, his lowliness, that the God of creation, that the God who, is majestic, is holy Yeah. Is sovereign, humbled himself. He saw and approached us in the same way he's been doing in Genesis.
He sent his son to literally, see, approach us in his humility, offer up his life as a ransom for us. Yeah. I think that that action of the shepherd that Jesus approached, just that That's kinda what you would more Yeah. Gravitate rather than Exactly. Yeah.
Yeah. Just profoundly, impacted, I think, kind of the basic understanding of the the mission of Jesus. Yeah. I I think it's so interesting that he articulated that point about, hey. We're all different in how we, approach God and how he has approached us.
But I think just the at the core of who I am and the especially when I was younger, very, justice oriented, very black and white person. So that part of who God's character of being, holy and righteous and just and all these things was something I could really resonate with, the right versus the wrong. But I think that's also the place where I could get kind of messed up a little bit in how I thought about who God was and how he cared for people. And then I had someone who is very close to me, give me this quote from AW Tozer, who's, he's a pastor, he was an author, and he said, what you what comes into your mind when you think about God is the most important thing about you. And I thought, oh.
And and what he was trying to communicate to me in that is that, hey, Sarah. God is more than just Yep. Righteous and holy and just like he's kind and he's loving and he's humble and He's merciful. And I think you need to, to understand that, in order to grow in your relationship with the Lord. So I think what's cool about our sanctification process growing up in the Lord is that we can grow in those areas and learn more.
And I think I do have learned to understand who God is more in those areas of my life, through lots of different things, but I think that's that's a really cool thing. I have one quick thing to interject to get Yeah. Have this time to process this. One thing I realized this, last couple days is even the worship that I am drawn to and connect to most. So I was listening to a song that was talking about our God being a consuming fire and this power and might, and I was like, I don't know if I get this that much.
I really like goodness of God. I like the it speaks of but it's but it's true. And made me realize, like, oh, I maybe need to kind of press into going, like, because both are awesome and true and important. And Jesus displays them Yeah. In his life on the cross, they're displayed.
So it's it's yeah. It's Jamie, what about you? Yeah. What do you think? I I mean, I'm trying to remember back what it was like.
I think I was utterly disinterested in God. And so probably, like, in some sense, my my arrogance needed to be humbled in a sense to see my need for God than before his rescue of me would have meaning and and values. So probably more God pressing, like, his holiness on me that I would see the value and the beauty of the cross in a way. But, yeah, I think similar to you being like it's both, I think of there's a verse in Isaiah 40 where he's where God humbles the mountains and raises up the valleys. And I was thinking of that with Sarah and Abraham.
It's like, hey, Abraham has this, like, holiness that's That's right. Maybe in he literally, you know, gets pushed to the ground and then, Sarah has this very kind, you know, gentle. So, I think both Yeah. Are so is the the nature of God. And if you only see one side, and I think Joe, you know, would have pointed to this, like, you're missing out on who God is.
Yeah. And in no way, you know, he was making the point in no way should you, say to somebody, oh, the way you experience God isn't isn't the right way. By no means. But I do think if you lean or gravitate towards one side of that much more than the other, looking at, you know, there's some passages in scripture you can look at that we can even maybe highlight, in a little bit that can maybe just point to both and point to the power and the majesty of God as well. That's one thing I love.
I mean, even as a church, I love our intentionality to preach throughout all different parts of scripture. Because that kind of sense when you are reading a passage and God acts in a certain way and perhaps your curiosity is piqued and you're like, wait a minute. Yeah. What is God doing here? Right?
What what the kinda having the guidance throughout all of scripture Yeah. To see that God at his heart is always pursuing his people in love Yeah. But also Yeah. In his holiness. Yeah.
And that's why studying scripture in community, in the local church, right, is so so deeply important. Mhmm. Well, let's talk about, our God being a God that loves to flip scripts. This made me think of a story, and I I just thought it would be fun to share of any examples we have where we've seen God just do what only God can do. To kick things off, back a number of years here, there was, a guy that walked through our doors.
I happened to encounter him, and he said, hey. I'm an atheist, and I don't, you know, really know what I'm doing here, but I started reading this one book by CS Lewis, so I'm here. And over the course of the next couple weeks, you know, encountered him. He kept coming. He kept coming.
Well, long story short, what I would say is, first of all, learned and, you know, his testimony is one that he was extremely, really, really depressed. He was really battling porn addiction among some other things. And, today, he is a missionary in Japan. Isn't that amazing? Exactly.
I mean, God did this incredible work in his life. He did thank I mean, amazingly, he used even our church and people here to surround him. And I mean, even cooler, this guy, his his family are not Christians. And I've encountered them because I kinda know them in the community, and they're just like, we, you know, we're not we don't believe this yet, but we are so thankful what in the world what's going on plan. Yeah.
And so that's just an amazing again, only God can do it, and he loves to flip scripts. Anything you guys have? Man, the first thing that I thought of was I thought about this couple who were young, grew both grew up in not, like, not against God, but just non Christian homes. Didn't have a lot of, like, experience with that. They got married young, and then they had these men, you know, who reached out to them.
They started being curious about who God is, and talked to them, and they gave their life to Christ. And then this guy who kinda was an angry guy, and, you know, kinda was doing things on his own, living his own way, decided when he gave his life to Christ, had a call to ministry. And, gave his life to Christ, went to seminary, came back, started a church. Do you know what that church is? It's this church.
It's this it's Christ Community Chapel. I see what you did there. I see what you did there. But that's just That is so cool. That's Jim and Barb College who are there.
I mean, they're my parents, but he's the founding pastor, and it's like I mean, to this day, this 75 year old would say, I can't believe God used me. Yeah. And as a If you do this and, like, what and why these stories are so cool is because it's a testament to what God can do. Absolutely. Like, it's not him.
It's not it's it's it wasn't my dad. Yeah. But there was people. It's not what God did. That's why I love these stories.
And, like, a testament to the script being flipped is it's hard for me to comprehend that being your dad. Like, knowing what I am your dad, like story what? So it it's like paradigm exploding that God could do that. Yeah. So That's awesome.
That's one of the things, I mean, on on a monthly basis in the life of our church. It's like seeing baptisms. What you're seeing Jamie, you did such a good job in Wes reminding us kind of of the wedding ring example. Right? It's a sign.
It's a symbol that a flip or a script has been flipped. And being able to, you know, that being able to see that on a continual basis in the life of our church that God is working, God is moving, even in your own story, if it feels painfully slow. You find yourself in waiting. Seeing what he's doing in people's lives in our neighborhoods. Like, that's why baptisms are so powerful.
Encouraging because even if you've been a Christian for thirty years, I mean, just watching, like, God, wow, look at that. Like, that's it's I mean, I get teary eyed every time. Totally. I watch a baptism because I'm just like, wow. God is so good.
Well, one person that got baptized today, I just shared with you guys right before, but I happened to be able to do, the interview, talking to him to hear the story, and, battling a disease that is probably gonna take their life, and but just said, God has changed me. I want my whole family to know. I want this church to know. I want everybody to see. I want God to use me.
So I'm getting in there. I'm getting baptized. And I'm like, that is just it's it's amazing. It's mind blowing. But that even goes back to the multitasking part.
Yep. Like, that that decision of being here for families to use it. Yep. And that's I even when we were talking about the script getting flipped, it's not only from not being a Christian to becoming a Christian, but even the whole ministry of Jesus and making all things new. Right?
It's dying to sin as a Christian. Yeah. Right? How many guys even have said whether it's anger, whether it's greed, whether it's pornography, whether it's a broken marriage, like, as a Christian to continually experience, man, what God has done in my own life by flipping a script. I love Not a one time thing.
Yeah. I love though the point you pointed out the multitasking because it is. Like, think about how God is using those people around us that got baptized today to help change others in their lives or that are just witnesses to it. Yeah. I mean, I with the script being flipped, which is hard to say.
That art test. Yeah. I'm being flipped. Three times. I had a conversation with a young adult in the hallway this morning, and in the course of that, we were just talking about life transitions.
And in that house I'm at, I remember being I was 16, non Christian, and grew up in a family, we weren't going to church, had totally disinterested in God. By 23, I was going on staff with a full time ministry, getting married. Like, my whole life trajectory had been radically transformed over six years. And, you know, so much of that happened even in those first few years between 16, 18. Like, it it's just wild.
When I think back to what I was looking for in life and where I saw myself going, the script that I had planned out, it was so different. And it is wild to think of where, you know, God has led me. Like, so that's wild. Well, let's close out by, if you have any challenge for people listening as you think about what was taught this week, I'd love to share that and share that with anybody listening. So I was thinking the, like, the idea of these different conceptions of how God connects with us and which one you maybe gravitate towards and making sure to intentionally try to think through the the opposite maybe competing Yeah.
On the other end of that spectrum. I'm not saying it's black or white, one or the other. But the idea of, hey, if you tend to only think of God as loving, gentle, gracious, all of these things which he is, then you and I might be missing out on the side of God that is holy and Powerful. Powerful and and vice versa. Like, if that's where you tend to feel and you struggle to feel God's grace, maybe intentionally taking time to see God Yeah.
In a way that is different than your default way of seeing him. Yeah. Let me just jump into I because maybe I was so convicted in hearing that, I would just ask the question, is there someone or a situation you've given up and praying for? And, God is bigger than it, and he is, you know, beyond able to do what we can't even imagine he can do. So That is a really good one for me.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So as I was spending time, you know, listening to this, I was, walking and praying, and this this song, kinda I mean, obviously, I think God gave that to me, but it's it's, Christ is enough. It says Christ is enough for me.
I have everything I need in you. And then the refrain goes to, I have decided to follow Jesus. No turning back. The cross before me, the world behind me. No turning back.
And what I thought about was, like, it's so easy for us to want to turn back. Right? To go to kinda look back or or maybe try to figure out a solution to a problem, outcome engineer something. But the truth is Christ is enough for us, and what we need. And the fact is the grace that God gives us every day is what is enough.
And we'll we see that fulfilled in Jesus and his life, his death, and his resurrection. So my encouragement is just, like, every time you kinda feel that temptation to look back or or let the world overwhelm you with stuff, like, look up. Yeah. You know, lean in to what God has said and, and to this remarkable grace that God has given us, in his son Jesus. So that was just I I know it's not a challenge.
It's more just like, hey. Remember. Yeah. Mhmm. No.
That's great. Yeah. I'll be brief. I I, I feel like sometimes it takes me a while to learn things. Right?
Kinda have to get knocked over the head a few times. So now that we're in week six, I leaned over to Lydia, my wife, and I said, I think I'm horrible at waiting. Like, I am really, really bad at waiting, and this is why. I think I have and this would be the challenge. I don't think I I realized that the promises that I kind of thought God would fulfill Sure.
Were never promises. That yeah. And we talked to this a little bit last week. But just now coming to grips that us as followers of yeah. It takes me another week.
Us My bro, because I feel that all the time. Yeah. It's just us as followers of Jesus. Yeah. That's true.
God the promise that is the grand promise for all of us is that we're gonna see Jesus face to face. Right. Death, tears will be no more. Mhmm. Right now, that's that's something we're waiting for.
And so when, you know, my my waiting right now, oftentimes in conversation, I can show frustration, I can show anger, at times with God, being totally transparent. And I don't often wait as a form of gospel proclamation. Yeah. Waiting as telling people, hey, I've got faith and trust That's right. That that's not how my story ends.
Right? Even if God's not granting something I'm asking for that my wife and I are praying for, there's a promise that is so much greater Yeah. That is ours and that is secure. Yeah. So having conviction of the right promise, fuels your waiting to be a form of gospel proclamation.
Yeah. Well, thank you guys so much for joining me today. It's been a great conversation. Can't wait for week seven. Thanks so much for tuning in to Beyond the Message.
We're so glad that you joined us before you leave. Make sure to take a minute to subscribe so you'll catch next week's episode as well. All week long, we have content for you on our app, on our YouTube channel, as well as on the website for Christ Community Chapel. So check things out there so that every week you can grow right where you are. Thanks again for tuning in.
We'll see you next time.