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This podcast is for and about soldiers of the Canadian Army.
Its primary goal is to provide them with useful information through thoughtful and open discussions that reflect their mutual interests and concerns.
Though soldiers are our primary audience, the topics covered on this podcast should be relevant to anyone who supports our soldiers or who has an interest in Canadian military matters.
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Captain Adam Orton: Hi, I’m Captain Adam Orton with the Canadian Army Podcast. This episode is about everybody's favorite: bureaucracy. But don’t hit stop yet. This particular flavour of bureaucracy involves how moving between the Regular and Reserve Forces or even rejoining the military requires a lot of paperwork and time, sometimes months or even years, which can make things really difficult when you’re trying to plan your life. Here with me is Major Matt Cooke from Army Personnel Management, AKA the G1 at Army Headquarters, and he’s going to tell us about how the Army is making your life easier when you want to make a change. Sir, welcome to the podcast.
Major Matt Cooke: Hey, thanks for having me, Adam.
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Capt Orton: So there’s a CANFORGEN that came out. And for those who might not know what that is, it’s a kind of general message that contains some type of order that tells people that something’s about to happen. So, what are we changing? What’s happening?
Maj Cooke: So there’s three big things that we wanted to change, and the first one being your ability to transfer from the Reserve to the Reg Force. So we’ve streamlined that. We’ve taken away a couple different administrative burdens and barriers that have created a multi-year waiting time in some cases. The second thing we’ve gone and done is expedited and supported your ability to go from Regular Force to Reserve. So we’re fully supporting the CAF Transition Group’s ability to do that for you. And then the third one is we’ve gone and changed one of the administrative processes for re-enrolment. So if ever you get out and have a secondary career and wish to come back and serve, whether that’s Reg Force or Reserve, we’ve gone and made that process simpler.
Capt Orton: I’ve definitely seen it happen where, you know, you have troops in the Reserves that are trying to get in the Reg Force and they can get stuck for like months or years. Why was that, that way?
Maj Cooke: Yeah, the CAF has a systems of checks and balances in for when we have lots of people, not lots of people, when we’re full. And as you can be fully aware, we’re short on people right now so we’ve changed those processes. The first one being the strategic intake plan. And that’s a fancy word to say, how many people are we recruiting?
Capt Orton: That’s right. The SIP.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, the SIP. So our strategic intake plan. I’ll give an example for that, is let’s say we have 100 infanteers we want to bring in for recruiting. Normally, we would set 90 of those positions to recruit civilians from the street. And then the balance, the 10 people, would be for internal component transfers. And what that would do is if we had 50 applicants, it would force us to do a board and rank them all from 1 to 50, and then only take the top 10. So if you’re just right on the bubble at 11 or 12, or anybody else beyond that, you’d have to wait an entire year to go back to the board. So this is where you ended up with folks who had three to four year wait times for a component transfer. We’ve gone and removed that. So there’s no maximum on how many folks can transfer into the Reg Force in the same occupation. So that’s a huge win because we don’t have to do that administrative board that’s held once a year.
Capt Orton: Yeah.
Maj Cooke: And we monitor that on a monthly basis to make sure that if we do keep getting more applicants, we have enough seats for all of them to transfer into the Reg Force.
Capt Orton: And then in addition to that, you know, especially if you’re doing ranking boards, then there’s the question of training and the different levels of training of some reservists and all of that stuff. So that’s a problem too.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, absolutely. And it requires you to be on top of your own administration, make sure if you’ve just completed a course, it may not make it to your military personnel resume on time for the ranking board. So that is a disadvantage to some members who just can’t make it happen in time. And it’s also held once a year at a very specific time of the year. So if you applied right after, who might feel that you’re waiting excessively long time, but we don’t have to deal with that anymore so we’ve removed that barrier and the Army monitors that actively on a month-to-month basis.
Capt Orton: And then there’s also the aspect of PLARs or prior learning assessment recognition, which is when you’re checking the level of training of somebody. And that in of itself is a lot of paperwork.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, absolutely. And as the CANFORGEN has pointed out, anybody with a DP1 qualification, so that’s your first level qualification after basic training, will now have their prior learning assessment pushed to while you’re in service. So once you transfer to the Regular Force, we will do that assessment at that point. And the reason we went and did this is that, as you can imagine Adam, at a Reserve unit, you’re a part-time member, you’re a private, corporal, whatever, trying to get a hold of your section sergeant, your platoon commander, all the way up to your unit CO having to sign this thing off and then sent to the Combat Training Center in Gagetown for evaluation. But we know that you are qualified in DP1. It’s evident on the records. So we’re making that assessment and transferring you and determining those gaps in training once you’re at the gaining unit. And as you can understand, the Regular Force training, they have more time, they can achieve more things in the same calendar days. So you may transfer without a grenade range or without doing unarmed combat. So the gaining units will do that for you. They have a training plan, they’re accustomed to it, and they definitely want to have an individual join their section and platoon rather than have nobody who’s waiting for training on the Reserve side. So instead of you, as a member, sending emails through your chain of command, waiting for weeks at a time, potentially months, to get your prior learning assessment back, we’ve moved that to after you have joined. So, for those members that are DP1 qualified, that is a huge win. For everybody else that is at the master corporal to MWO and majors and above, your prior learning assessment is still required before you transfer into the Regular Force, but what we’ve done is removed, again, that barrier for you to have to do it at the unit by replacing that with a process that the Army is going to do for you directly with a Combat Training Center. So, we’re going to make that request on your behalf so that you don’t have to run into issues where your chain of command is not there, not available, not able to sign document XYZ. So, the Army is going to do that. We have full-time staff dedicated to enabling component transfers, and that’s what they do on a daily basis. So, they know how the process goes, and they can follow up with that in a much more expedited way to support you.
Capt Orton: So, if I understand correctly, basically what we’re talking about, at least for the Reserve to Reg Force thing, is you’ve either removed the PLAR or shortened the chain required to get there, which in of itself is a pretty serious piece of administration that requires a fair amount of time. And then on top of that, you’re not trying to hit that board at the right time to do the whole thing. So you’re just firing people through as quickly as possible and shortening the chain on a lot of the administration.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, we have lots of vacancies in the Regular Force, so everybody who applies will get an offer. And ideally, our offers are coming within 30 to 45 days if you’ve completed all the necessary paperwork that we have in our checklist that is sent out to you and available on the component transfer website. So if you do all that properly, our goal is to get that out to you, like I said, within that 30 to 45 day window, give you that offer so you can make that life choice. All we ask is to make sure that you put some consideration into where you want to get posted. If you put three positions in Petawawa, it might be hard for us to get you there because the needs of the CAF are always considered there. But we’ll work with you to support your transition as fast and as best as possible into serving into one of our Reg Force units.
Capt Orton: So that’s the Reserves to Reg Force side. How about the other way? How does that work?
Maj Cooke: Yeah, no, that’s a great question, Adam. Like, all of our Reg Force members are skilled and qualified, but sometimes it’s hard to navigate that transition piece. So in the last few years, CAF Transition Group has really taken the whole transition piece from end-to-end. They take you through a whole bunch of different trainings and pieces to understand what you want to do. But one of the key things that we’ve partnered with them to do is explain the benefit of joining a Reserve unit when you transfer. You’re typically skilled, you have a lot of training, you have some experience, some deployed ops, etc. Bringing that back to those Reserve units is vital for their growth and training in the future. So that conversation is now happening at every transition interview as you are looking to leave the Regular Force. The second piece that we’ve done for them is an administrative piece where you had to find your own position number. And as you can imagine, if you don’t know the area where you’re going to retire because you’ve never heard of a Reserve unit there, it’s hard to find the position. It’s hard to find the point of contact. So what we’ve done is we’ve gathered all that information in a readily accessible tool that is available on all of ECN for members wishing to transition. And it’s also fully available and the transition advisors are trained on it to help you find a position number for you, let’s say in Vancouver or in Winnipeg, wherever you want to go, we can look it up and see if there’s something there for you to go and support that Reserve unit.
Capt Orton: Yeah, and it is a daunting process. Like, you would think it’s really easy, but like, I’ll use my personal example is like when I was in Shiloh, when I left the Regular Force and moved back home to Ottawa, it’s like, I don’t know military units in Ottawa. And it was only thanks to somebody in my chain of command who happened to have knowledge of it that made it happen. So having access to somebody who can help you with that seems pretty important.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, tool and training. So the CAF Transition Group is going through a lot of training of all their new folks that are coming on board to make sure they understand that the Reserve is a full bona fide, like, opportunity when you’re releasing from the Regular Force and also equip them with that tool to help you search, right? If you’re a specific occupation and you want to go to a specific area, here’s what’s available. If there’s no availabilities, they have that link back to the Army here to kind of figure out what we can do to sort out a position for you so that we don’t lose your skills and capabilities.
Capt Orton: And then finally, you mentioned people who are trying to get back in and those levels of qualifications in that process. What’s going on with that?
Maj Cooke: Yeah, so the goal there is the same thing with the component transfers. We want to defer your PLAR to while you’re in service. We know that you’ve been in the Canadian Forces in the past. You’ve done so much training. You’re qualified. And so your skills are still there. Some things like certifications, like if you’re a diver, have to be repeated yearly. But your overall basic qualification as an infanteer exists. You’re there. So we’re going to bring you in and we will figure out on the unit side what additional training that is. So whether that is, like I mentioned earlier, that grenade or that unarmed combat that needs to be completed, we can do that once you’re in. But we’re removing barriers for entry at the recruiting level. So, re-enrolment is the same piece. We’re going to move that prior learning assessment to when you’re in service.
Capt Orton: Yeah, and if I think about it, having spoken to some people who are going through it right now, it’s one of those things where you’re used to having points of contact within your institution: you have your chain of command to ask questions to. And their recruiting center is that sole point of contact for you, but they’re also doing other stuff. So being able to get in and then solve all the problems in the way that you already know how because you’ve been around for long enough seems like a good move.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, and like you said, they’re super busy doing a lot of other assessments and they have a lot of different files to manage. So, by removing one additional administrative burden that we’re doing internally, we acknowledge that our members who have served in the past still have a great amount to give and are fully qualified still. So that’s our goal is to help both the Canadian Forces recruiting system, if you decide to come back to the Regular Force, or on the Reserve side or Reserve units, we just want to eliminate one of those additional administrative pieces so that you can come in as fast as possible.
Capt Orton: It seems that it has a potential impact, at least at the unit levels, in terms of bringing in a lot of people and then maybe doing some admin in terms of their learning assessments and things like that. What have you heard from the units and the potential impacts on them?
Maj Cooke: We’ve had some chats with the units and through the sergeant major net, we understand that they would prefer to have a soldier in a platoon, in a section, that is 90 to 95% trained and needs that little extra training package, because right now we’re suffering from vacancies everywhere. So they’re quite happy to bring these members onto the range, to put them in a classroom to train them, because otherwise, the rest of the time that they’re not in that training, they’re useful to the platoon, section and company. So that’s very important for us to help enable that so that at that field unit, they have people that are able to be put on task to support the organization.
Capt Orton: Yeah, and the training cycle is already running too.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, exactly.
Capt Orton: So it’s just like you insert them into the training cycle and off they go, they do the thing and conceivably gets up to speed.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, exactly.
Capt Orton: What are some of the challenges or like the weaknesses of this process? You know, like, what’s slowing people down or what could cause problems?
Maj Cooke: In the overall process?
Capt Orton: Yeah.
Maj Cooke: So, just be cognizant that there’s human nature in every process that we do. And that’s kind of why we took this approach to bring on some of those processes at the Army level. Because as you know, when you’re going to the recruiting center or you’re going through your unit adjutant to get things signed, people’s availabilities really dictate when emails will flow, when documents are signed. So, the Army is very cognizant of that and is trying to lead with our partners to remove some of those things that require the member to put a lot of the effort in. The member’s already put a ton of effort in raising their hand to change component and go to the other one. So, we want to make sure we’re taking care of them by removing that additional effort and burden that may have them change their minds because they’re willing to transfer now. Let’s make it happen now and not make them wait.
Capt Orton: Yeah, because, you know, people are at points in their lives where today’s the day or this month is the month. And sometimes, you know, if it doesn’t happen, then they’re going to go and do something else.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, exactly. And we’ve seen that with the timeframes where we had multi-year waits. This year was a great year for you. But next year, you’ve gotten this really good offer from the civilian side to join your trade and occupation. So now you’re no longer available. You might stay in the Reserve, you might transition out, but we’ve lost that opportunity to bring you in.
Capt Orton: Now, we might have people listening that are like maybe stuck in an old process or, you know, it feels like they’ve been waiting for a long time. What should they be doing if they’re just like, well, what about me?
Maj Cooke: Check your spam box first. We’ve sent out emails to all those that are in the process. Keep in touch with us. Be open and honest with what you’re looking for when we have those discussions. We’re going to try to place you in the posting positions that you want, but also be aware that the CAF has needs. So like I said, if you’re always putting Petawawa, if we can get you to Petawawa, we’ll do as much as we can to do that. But we may need to send you somewhere else. So be open with the process. Follow up with us. We’re also human, so if ever we don’t get back to you right away, follow up. The e-mail will be shared, and you’ll be able to reach out to that transition member that we have here in the Army Headquarters. That’s his bread and butter. He does that every day. He takes care of all the folks that we currently have in the process. So just make sure you keep that open communication with them.
Capt Orton: Any concerns about that structure being able to handle the, kind of, influx of demand? Or it sounds like by removing, kind of, the amount of PLARs that need to be done on the front-end, maybe that just makes it more manageable?
Maj Cooke: As you can imagine, if PLARs are moving slowly or through the different chains of command at the unit, we were also heavily involved in those emails moving back and forth. If we consider the fact that we’ve now removed the requirement for all of our privates, corporals, officer cadets to captain from having to do a PLAR before joining or before transferring, the amount of work that our team has done is drastically decreased. So now they can spend more time focusing on you, focusing on finalizing your transfer, because they’re no longer having to go back and forth to you, to you and the unit, to you and the CO. They’re dealing with more complex issues, which is the postings, which is our senior NCOs and senior officers that need a bit more of an assessment. But yeah, we’ve freed up a significant amount of time in processing by transferring this administrative process to while you’re in service.
Capt Orton: You know, you gotta love a good win against bureaucracy.
Maj Cooke: Absolutely.
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Capt Orton: It doesn’t happen often, so you got to celebrate it when you got it. All right, well, thanks a lot for taking the time to explain this all to us.
Maj Cooke: Yeah, thanks Adam for having me on the show.
Capt Orton: That was Major Matt Cooke from Army Personnel Management, AKA the G1 at Army Headquarters. And I’m Captain Adam Orton for the Canadian Army Podcast. Orton out.
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