The Studio Demands It!

S7 EP4 | Jim surprises T.C. with a demand to relaunch the Bond franchise. What unfolds turns out to be a full-fledged episode. Perhaps this could even make a good introduction to The Studio Demands It! Or maybe not. There's no way to know, unless someone does exactly that. 

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Creators and Guests

Host
Jim Burzelic
Host
T.C. De Witt

What is The Studio Demands It!?

Two screenwriters attempt to recreate, reimagine, or flat out fix, existing film franchises when 'the studio' demands...MORE FILMS! It's an exercise in creative thinking where they will challenge themselves to conceptualize, pitch, and craft a film based on the stipulations of a hypothetical Hollywood overlord. | Sixfive Media

T.C.:

Hello and welcome to the Studio Demands It! An exercise in creative thinking where we will conceptualize, pitch, and craft a film or series based on the demands from one of you listeners acting as a hypothetical Hollywood overlord.

Jim:

Overlord.

T.C.:

As professional screenwriters ourselves and massive cinephiles, we talk movies all the time.

Jim:

All the time.

T.C.:

And we'd like to believe that we can meet any demand thrown at us. We will be your screenwriters. I am T. C. De Witt and joining me as always is Jim Suddenly.

T.C.:

Burzelic. You snuck up on there.

Jim:

I did.

T.C.:

You snuck up on me there.

Jim:

I did.

T.C.:

I did. Okay. Jim, this is a Yeah. This is a special thing.

Jim:

It is.

T.C.:

This is a special occasion. For those of you new to the show or for those of you who want to introduce this series to friends, this is your sampler. Oh, really? Yeah. What what follows here started as a simple movie conversation that turned into a lengthy brainstorm that turned into an entire film or series, and is now an episode.

T.C.:

So this this is this right here, what you're about to hear, this is what we do, Jim. Yeah. We we talk movies all the time.

Jim:

All the time.

T.C.:

And and and do this. If you if you like what you hear, there are a 100 plus episodes of The Studio Demands It available to you right now. And you can jump around, you can choose an IP that you like and you wanna hear how we play with it. But, yeah, that that's that's what's about to happen here. Yeah.

T.C.:

Jim Jim threw something at me and we just brainstormed. Mhmm. And we came up with this this demand. And as you can see, it's labeled here. It's it's James Bond.

T.C.:

Yeah. Which is pretty funny, but we'll talk about that after the episode.

Jim:

Yes. We

T.C.:

will. If you like what you hear here, consider subscribing to the podcast and any Yep. Anywhere you can listen to it or Patreon if you're so inclined and wanna hear even more of this. Mhmm. But, yeah, that's what this is.

T.C.:

This is the sampler. So Yeah. For those of you who are familiar with the show, this is another free episode. This is another bonus. This is a this is an episode that suddenly occurred.

Jim:

Okay.

T.C.:

This wasn't just a suddenly conversation. This is a very special suddenly conversation. But this can also work as your introduction to the series. The next says, where should I start? Could point them right here.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Or you could point them in any of the other 100 plus episodes. That's up to you. Sound good?

Jim:

Sounds sounds good. Right? Like, it it it does that be well, hey. You're gonna listen

T.C.:

to Because

Jim:

I think this because it didn't start in the traditional format, we didn't sit down. We we started the mics because we knew we were gonna have a conversation worth worth something Mhmm. For for some someone somewhere Yeah. Ideally. But it was more like it was it was much more conversational than the episodes usually are.

Jim:

Yeah. Because it really was just like, oh, what what what you think what do think about this? Yeah.

T.C.:

Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

What would you do with this?

T.C.:

But it it did do what you're about to hear does do what we do. Yeah. Yeah. So with that said, this is The Studio Demands It. Jim.

T.C.:

You you said you have a thing to tell me.

Jim:

A notion occurred to me.

T.C.:

A notion occurred to you. Okay.

Jim:

As was the entire point to starting this is we talk movies all the time.

T.C.:

All the

Jim:

time. And we come up with weird things to talk about. And and you were repeating a file name that you had to go look and so you wouldn't forget it. It was one underscore zero zero two. Mhmm.

Jim:

And the zero zero got me thinking about James Bond double o seven.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

And one of the fun I don't know if it's a head cannon, fan cannon, but I'm pretty sure it's not it does not exist in the actual James Bond franchise. Mhmm. Partially because it it kind of undermines bits of the the the veracity of the character.

T.C.:

Okay.

Jim:

But it has been discussed to the notion that o o James Bond o o seven is a moniker. It's not the person's name.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Right? It's it's when you become the seventh agent, when you gain when you gain the the agent title o o seven Mhmm. That comes with the identity James Bond.

T.C.:

You are now James Bond, which totally held water until skyfall. Oh, really? Because they go to the Bond estate and everything. That's fine.

Jim:

I thought that was always a part of James Bond lore.

T.C.:

That's alright.

Jim:

But so my question, not nay demand Mhmm. Is you've been given cart near carte blanche Mhmm. To reboot James Bond.

T.C.:

Okay.

Jim:

Doing this. Establish James Bond o o seven

T.C.:

As my

Jim:

as as the the is it s a s? Or or m m I six. Yeah. As the m I six identity, how do you build that world? You know what I'm saying?

Jim:

Because the things you establish in this first movie of of a reboot of it Mhmm. Will theoretically move forward through the the canon of James Bond.

T.C.:

Okay.

Jim:

So, like, in your in your world bible

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Do you come up with the other identities, and how far out do you go? You gate it comes with a notion of double o seven. Mhmm. Right? So that is theoretically up to 999 agents.

Jim:

Oh,

T.C.:

see, it's called the double o program, which means there's only seven, at least seven agents.

Jim:

Why is it the double o program?

T.C.:

Because you have to have two confirmed kills on the books to reach double o status.

Jim:

I did not know that. This demand is a lot less interesting. It's not less yeah. That that's why I thought I I did not know that double o already had a meaning or connotation. Demand over.

T.C.:

No. That's okay. The your the let's say the double o agent program isn't based on the two kills, so there's not it's a double o one, double o two, double o blah blah blah. You're saying that there's 999 agents?

Jim:

It doesn't have to be. It can we can even stick with the double o counts as your two confirmed kills.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Does that mean that there is a junior program, which is a a single o?

T.C.:

I don't that I don't know. Was James Bond Junior

Jim:

Triple o?

T.C.:

James Bond Junior was a show.

Jim:

So

T.C.:

as far as, like, Ian Fleming goes, there are five double o agents.

Jim:

Why seven?

T.C.:

Seven, eight, nine, and eleven are just in his books.

Jim:

Oh, okay. Those are the that have been recognized. Yeah. But I'm assuming that the number numbers that weren't used were somewhere.

T.C.:

Well, the in Thunderball, there are there are at least nine agents referenced in Thunderball. Yeah. I I couldn't tell you which ones they are. Just know that they that there's a moment where they reference a bunch them. But in in Fleming's universe, he only ever he only ever named five.

T.C.:

That's not to say there are more than five.

Jim:

Okay. So o o eleven was one of them? That's Yeah. That sounds good. Also, if he's o o seven wait.

Jim:

Who calls him o o seven?

T.C.:

M refers to him, and so does q refers to him. So in in house, they

Jim:

Why why would they do that?

T.C.:

Because that I mean, if you wanna think militarily, the more you dehumanize an agent, the easier it is for them to do inhuman things.

Jim:

So the double o, in that regard, the double o is continuing to remind him that he's murdered.

T.C.:

You yeah. You are a killer. You have a license to kill. That is what you do.

Jim:

Alright. Killer seven. Yeah. Alright. Double o seven.

T.C.:

Killer. Killer. You are not a man to us. You are a weapon. That is that is the Which the nefarious darkness behind the all this.

Jim:

Given this carte blanche

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Would you incorporate that?

T.C.:

Yeah. The the the fine line to walk here is to separate this from Treadstone and the Bourne Sure. Identity universe

Jim:

interesting that we have to separate this from that when that came after Dave's role.

T.C.:

Right. But to create a a dehumanization of the double o's

Jim:

That kind of vilifies m I six Yeah. M and q.

T.C.:

Yeah. In in a sense. Well, I'm I'm actually imposing some pretty standard military tricks that America does to its soldiers. You know, treat them like machines

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

So that a, we don't have to mourn their loss as much because they were machines made to die. Mhmm. It's very nefarious stuff. Like the the dehumanization of soldiers is is a necessity of this thing Mhmm. That we need to have.

T.C.:

Soldiers must die. So they need to we need to be okay with them dying and they need to want to die essentially. They need to be prepared for that. It's it's dark stuff and exploring that within a double o story, that's kinda cool stuff to go like, I'm I plead I'm James. Right?

T.C.:

And if you think about the best writing of James Bond, I don't know which ones to point to, which characters call him James, which character calls him Bond, which characters call him o o seven. Jimmy. Jimmy. Oh god. But, yeah, the the relationships he has with people determine what they call him.

T.C.:

M calls him Bond.

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

Some M refers to she often refers to him as o o seven. O o seven. But in most cases, at least Judy Dench's Bond sorry. M. Bond.

T.C.:

Listen. Like, she she referred to him by his name. It was q. Don't listen to me, Total o seven. Try to bring it back in one piece.

T.C.:

Like, he was a bit more calling him a vet. Didn't call him James.

Jim:

Right. So right. The way his name and titles were used in those movies was not to dehumanize James Bond. It was it was it it actually spoke more to the speaker's character.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Right. Q is Q is a technical person and stuff like that. He would use the number. Yeah. Well,

T.C.:

let's let's okay. Let's say the double o program, tell me how many double o agents are. You you decide.

Jim:

My demand was to you. What do you want? Oh. What what do you like?

T.C.:

Let's have a smaller number. Let's not have it be a 100 characters. Let's have it within

Jim:

A thousand. Right. Oh my god. So when I say that, I again, I'm lore building. I'm not necessarily saying that that needs to be shown and established in

T.C.:

Well, the the reason I wanna pick a finite number is I wanna create a double o assassin. That's so that's there's double o agents being murdered by someone one by one. Mhmm. Now, tried and true at this point, it's in Bond. It's in Mission Impossible.

T.C.:

It's the the good agent gone bad being the villain. And I don't know if that's that might be where I'm going, like, having like, I don't know. I'm trying to think. Let me run through the Bond movies for a moment here. Trying to think if there's been a a dump an agent killer within the Bond movies.

Jim:

I feel like there had to it feels like something that would have come up.

T.C.:

I think

Jim:

Was that really just born territory?

T.C.:

Okay. Has I'm just running through. There's like I think it's the I think it's the it's the Dalton Living Daylights.

Jim:

Sounds good.

T.C.:

I think in in the Living Daylights, two double o h's get killed at the beginning. I don't think it's someone specifically targeting it's just enough that that sends James on his mission or he's like, I'm gonna find out who killed these two.

Jim:

It it does feel like there has been one where, like, oh, one of our old agents or ex agents Yeah. Is now taking out. But maybe that's just born.

T.C.:

Well, I'm just gonna say this. So having having the the double o program be 15. There's 15 double o agents. Okay. Double o 15 is the highest it goes.

T.C.:

It's just currently they don't have like a a number. It's just you are the you are a specific type of agent. You are the hammer or the gun. You are the man. You are licensed to kill has only been assigned to this fifth these 15 characters.

T.C.:

These 15 agents, they are a very specific type of agent. And then one of them gets assassinated. It's like, well, we lost one. That happens. Missions go south.

T.C.:

Oh, A second one gets hit. Okay. Missions don't go south like this. These are the best of the best. These aren't the guys who die.

T.C.:

We have other we have the single age the single low agent side.

Jim:

These are the guys who do this to others.

T.C.:

Right. So now that we've had two, that's a problem. Then a third, it's like we have a serial killer on hand. We have a double o agent serial killer on his hand on hand. Let's bring the agents in to figure this out.

T.C.:

And Bond's like, don't bring us all into one place. We should all be trying to figure this out. And so then exploring the double o program, why are these agents the best? Who are they to them to them each other? Mhmm.

T.C.:

And maybe it's in such a way, this doesn't work to the lore. In the lore, the a the double o agents meet each other. They know

Jim:

I each have given you the the the point to this demand, the reason I said it was a soft demand

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Is because I'm curious because I know in the past, big problems with James Bond.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

So this is this is a bit of a blank check Mhmm. To cut out the parts you don't like and and maybe establish something new. I'm just I'm just curious to know what that might look like. It might look like an entirely different beast Yeah. That could be renamed to something else.

T.C.:

Sure. Okay. I I if am I am I meandering too far away from what you thought I'd talk about?

Jim:

Not necessarily. It it's just what you're doing is you're you're sort of coming back and saying that's too far from Ian Fleming or what

T.C.:

the Broccoli's want and

Jim:

things like that. Or because I'm essentially saying keep the parts of Bond Yeah. That you like. Mhmm. What and and thus, what are those parts?

Jim:

And and, right, the whole notion of James Bond being a moniker that this character has earned or been given Mhmm. Would that extend to other characters? Do other do other double o's have assigned identities?

T.C.:

Yes. Do we get to

Jim:

meet those? Do we get to meet other bonds?

T.C.:

Yes. This Stuff like that. Not that James Bond double o five and James Bond double o four. Like, it's not Bond double the idea that they are given a a Sam whole

Jim:

Smith. Yeah. Yeah. Double o three.

T.C.:

I like the idea that once they reach double o status, they are given a whole new identity. You are now James Bond double o seven. That is who you are. Through and through, you exist as this individual. And now we have someone who's assassinating these people.

T.C.:

Here's a little thing I'm gonna add to this. The double o agents have never met each other. Part of the infrastructure of the double o program is that they do not know who each other are. So that if they're ever out in the field Sure. They they they never operate together.

T.C.:

Mhmm. And there could be a little meta joke in there because of people like Trevlin, Goldeneye. Goldeneye. Yeah. Sean Bean went bad.

T.C.:

Buy me a pint. Okay. Sorry. That that James doesn't even know the identity of all these double o agents, but now he feels compelled to try to they these assassins I'm gonna go protect them. We need to figure this out, and that requires learning who they have been told they are as opposed to who they used to be.

T.C.:

And so the humanity of these agents can be a conversation that is explored within this. Why are these why are they being targeted? Well, we're all a bunch of killers. We deserve to die. Okay.

T.C.:

Well, we were given to this as as we were given this authority and power and this responsibility because we're capable of being this. Alright. Why then are you who who were you before? It's sort of like, Open Range, the Kevin Costner movie. Like, don't I wanna die without knowing your name.

T.C.:

I don't know how it's like, just tell me your goddamn name. I'm James Bond. No. Tell me your name.

Jim:

Tell me your real name.

T.C.:

Tell me your real name. I gave that up a long time ago. Like, exploring the humanity of killers who became who gained their status Mhmm. By murdering. And now that's what spies do.

T.C.:

That's what soldiers do. That's what agents of the government do. But why why us? Why are we the perfect people to do this? And why now are we being assassinated and who's doing that?

T.C.:

You get to explore why we're being killed and why we became who we

Jim:

are. I think the why are we being killed needs to be like, you can explore I guess you could probably explore different things, different methods or reasons. Mhmm. But I think ultimately, it would come down to someone because they were made, they were chosen because they are living weapons

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

To the point that they follow orders.

T.C.:

Yeah. They

Jim:

do not like, I guess, it it would also depend on on the lore you wanted to build into it, how much agency the agents have as in, like, how often I think it might be interesting to follow the notion of agents that follow orders because we have so many that don't. James Bond has deviated from orders

T.C.:

Yeah. So

Jim:

And or maybe that's that's integral to the entire notion. Oh,

T.C.:

I get the idea.

Jim:

But the idea being they've earned this title because they do the job assigned to them.

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

And perhaps to the notion of not not following orders, they follow the orders they're given. There is no rescinding orders. Mhmm. So orders are not given to a double o unless unless you you know you know you want them.

T.C.:

They they execute those order orders. And when they go rogue from time to time as if that's why it's so goddamn upsetting because they get self righteous or whatnot.

Jim:

Oh, maybe. But But but essentially, they don't think they they get pointed. They are they are weapons.

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

And so someone is basically just trying to disarm

T.C.:

Am I sick?

Jim:

The yeah.

T.C.:

And and here's here's another thing I wanna do. Let's maybe 15 might be too high of a number, but we'll leave it at that. When you need suave, tuxedo, sexy James Bond, you get double o seven. When you need blue collar blend in with the stick folk like blue Mhmm. Collar, muddy hands, oil on his fingers, you get double o four.

T.C.:

Like James Bond is the suave double o agent.

Jim:

Okay.

T.C.:

Like every agent has almost it's it's

Jim:

a So it's not just a name. It's also like a like a full behavior Yeah. Identity. Yeah.

T.C.:

You so like Okay.

Jim:

Sure.

T.C.:

Even even going so far as if this was built out into a series rather than a film, having a former Q be a double o agent now because there's a there is a double o moniker that is tech smart brain, not brawn, not bang bang shoot shoot, but very, like, computer techy savvy. Maybe maybe that would require a smaller number of agents so you have to don't have to think of 15 individual types. Well, like, if you need a female agent, you get double o three. Like

Jim:

So actually then the way I would I would build this is what we would do is we would sit down and we would come up with the different types of identities m I six would want to have.

T.C.:

Yes. Yes. Yeah.

Jim:

And thus the tech one would be one added much later.

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

So he'd be a number. So it's not that there's a finite number.

T.C.:

It's just as the world changes, you need to add new double o agents. I like that. Yeah. Yeah. So like double o one, like the very first agent

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

It's, like, the most basic soldier for like, if the double o program started in oh, man. When did the fur when did Casino Air all get ridden? '19 so 4030, '50, I wanna say in the forties, post World War two, probably 1950.

Jim:

The first the first double one. This is your chance to, right, to rewrite this stuff. Why not have it start during World War two?

T.C.:

So the first the double o one agent is maybe times have changed and people have changed, so therefore, things have changed about it. But, like, the most John Licari, Tinker Tailor, Soldier Spy type Sure. Yeah. Agent. The closest in this when people watch it, like, man, o o one is the closest to Ian Fleming's James Bond.

T.C.:

Like

Jim:

Oh, I was gonna say the opposite. Thinking about spies from world world war two or just spies in general Mhmm. They tend to be quiet type people. They they or not not always. Right?

Jim:

Julia Childs, I don't know if you describe her as quiet. Right. But they're they're more unassuming types. They are things like professors or historians Mhmm. People who have a context Smiley.

Jim:

Spy stuff.

T.C.:

Smiley from Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. Yeah. He's just like a dork.

Jim:

And so maybe that's who o o one is. Mhmm. O o one and the thing is they are an assassin. So they are incredibly unassuming. They're they're like, they don't have the shape.

Jim:

Yeah. Yeah. They don't have the behavior that you would ever expect. And that's sort of why then when a silenced pistol comes out, a person goes down, and then this person goes just disappears into a crowd.

T.C.:

I would call it, like, if this were a miniseries or a series that could extend multiple seasons given a successful first run Mhmm. It I'd call it double o. Like, the double like, just double o.

Jim:

Mhmm. And then

T.C.:

an underscore where the number should go. And so that it's like, this isn't a James Bond. This is this is about the double o program, Now, we're gonna explore. Now, the Broccolis would never do this because they like, no spin offs, anything. Mhmm.

T.C.:

They would do comics and books and allow that, but that'd Like, be movies exist. They must be but now it's in Amazon's hands. Jeff Bezos might be hearing this right now going like, I like the way these guys think. But, yeah, I would it would be this exploration of the double o program.

Jim:

By the way, not not to I a few minutes ago, when you said if if it was a show, I'd be like, what would that I thought it'd be called double o. Yeah. I I I'm on the same

T.C.:

Oh, yeah. You already thought of it too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

T.C.:

Yeah. And then, yeah, the big mystery in season one, who's the killer?

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

I hesitate to make it a double o gone bad. But whatever the the killer's rationale is, why am I killing you? You're already dead. What's your name, James Bond? No.

T.C.:

It's not. You're dead. You were killed and you became James Bond and that so you're already dead, so what does it matter if you die? The idea behind this entire program is killing people. Yeah.

T.C.:

Kill kill people to become killers. Like having that sort of anger about this whoever this this villain might be, that's their motive behind it. Like, you're already dead. I'm not killing anyone who isn't already dead. Mhmm.

T.C.:

You will be replaced by another one. You think you're the first James Bond? You think you're the first double o seven? There's at least eight of you. Right?

T.C.:

Like, Silva has a has a sort of joke to that in Skyfall Yeah. When he's like, I I was Ebb's number one agent, and he lists the years James Bond didn't make movies.

Jim:

Mhmm. Between Nice.

T.C.:

Between Dalton and Brosnan.

Jim:

Nice.

T.C.:

He's like, those were the years he was the prime agent. It's a great meta joke.

Jim:

That is.

T.C.:

And so having this killer say, yeah, I'll kill you and there'll be another one, and I'll kill that one too. That's what you do. You were made to die. Mhmm. You exist for a finite amount of time, then you are gone just like that.

Jim:

But to to that notion, the the replacing their identities, the first thought is you're given a fake identity, and then when you die, that identity is also erased. Mhmm. That matches more with spies. Right? You need spies you need spies to be disposable.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

But with this double o program, I think we can come up with a reason for it. I prefer that the name, the identity gets passed on as well.

T.C.:

Yeah. James Bond

Jim:

is always James Bond.

T.C.:

That's what I'm saying. Yeah. I completely agree with you.

Jim:

So to that end,

T.C.:

the reason

Jim:

the reason for doing that is because what if the spy world James Bond the world in James Bond is very transactional isn't the word, but temporary. And I know that's sort of the world you're building is this temporary world. What if we suggest a world that isn't? What if as we reveal the world of spies, it's it's a world of recurring ideas. The people are different.

Jim:

Mhmm. So maybe m I six aren't the only ones that have repeating identities. Mhmm. Because it's basically, think pieces on a chessboard. James Bond is your rook.

Jim:

Mhmm. Right? So you wouldn't if you replace your rook, you wouldn't give it a different name. It's always your rook. Correct.

T.C.:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jim:

But that means it's it's sort of it's sort of the same across the entire. So, okay, we're making it a show with maybe a few movies here and there. But so in this in this

T.C.:

world like a BBC, like Sherlock, where each episode is ninety minutes and then three episodes season.

Jim:

When we were talking about Ironheart earlier, I was gonna sort of drop that notion in there that that's basically what they're doing with the shows. Each show, each season of a show Is a movie. Is a movie.

T.C.:

A man this is how I start this double o show is in the apartment of James Bond and our James Bond main character in his apartment walking around and taking it all in because he has just become James Bond double o seven. And so this is the the previous James Bond double o seven's flat, and he is or or maybe not James because James being our protagonist would need to have the most ex he needs to be ready to go and not on the back foot. So o o nine. Like, we start with o o nine, like, just gaining status and in o o nine's apartments being, you know, Peter, Peter Franklin or whatever. Like, okay.

T.C.:

This is my apartment now. This is the apartments of Peter Franklin o o nine. And then that's the first person that's killed. I don't know. I'm just trying to think of this.

T.C.:

The the notion that these are legacy names and titles that come with all the all all of the stuff. You are now this person. This is where you live.

Jim:

Is this show Gotham to the James Bond universe? Do we not actually follow James Bond?

T.C.:

Well, I I'm I I don't mind that. I would I would offer up this, that if the season is, we'll say, seven episodes, if the first three episodes are James

Jim:

Seven. Nice.

T.C.:

Not intentional, I'll take it. First three episodes are James. Episode four is someone else. Episode five is James, and then, another episode that belongs to someone else, and then end with James. Season two, half the episodes are James.

T.C.:

Season three, like, just slowly show other characters in yeah. Create an ensemble out of this.

Jim:

Okay. What do you think about this for for world world building? Mhmm. Right? Because the agents in James Bond, they don't especially the these agents, they don't take out other spy agencies.

Jim:

Right? It's it's not really about that. These these are more assassins Mhmm. Assassin type spies. They're not sitting there list wiretapping in a in a town in a foreign country for years at a time.

Jim:

Right. So other countries have their own spy agencies, assassin groups, and stuff like that. Notion of the the villains that do come along in James Bond

T.C.:

The the reoccurring villains, as you said before? You said that the ideas are reoccurring. So they're

Jim:

for the Possibly. Okay.

T.C.:

Well because you sorry.

Jim:

Sorry. Like, speaking of, like, for the American agency, it's the same thing. John Wayne is I don't know how the I don't know how the Americans could be different. Mhmm. They might also just call them agents or whatever.

T.C.:

Okay.

Jim:

If you have an idea.

T.C.:

I was actually gonna say, like, oh, we're virgin into We're Kingsman territory.

Jim:

We are virgining into Kingsman territory. And right. So I didn't see the Kingsman. And I actually, I don't think I saw the second Kingsman. Maybe that's bad.

Jim:

Maybe we can just

T.C.:

It's okay. It's okay. Just be better. You know I'm the one who says I've never heard you tell it. So don't worry if it sounds like something else.

T.C.:

I just wanted to acknowledge it for anyone listening going like, that sounds like Kingsman.

Jim:

But the basically, the big super villains that pop up in James Bond, they're presented as rogue elements. Mhmm. What if they are to a degree? Like like, literally, we can we could establish with the show that these that the nations have their spy networks. Mhmm.

Jim:

They also have the in in these villains that pop up are people who kind of pop up in between and are often funded by other other foreign agent. Yeah. No. I we're basically explaining normal. I was trying to find a reason.

Jim:

Why would why would a crazy man who wants to control the weather kind of pop up in this world? Why wouldn't he have he been dealt with earlier? Well

T.C.:

The idea that a weather controlled bad guy would keep coming up into play, you're you're moving into some supernatural territory or that

Jim:

No. I mean, super science.

T.C.:

Right. But to to suggest that the the weather controlling maniac keeps coming back

Jim:

Oh.

T.C.:

In another incarnation

Jim:

I'm I'm more meant people of of that, like, level of power in megalomania. Nah. It doesn't have to be the same plan.

T.C.:

Got it. The same Okay. That that's what I was misunderstanding. Although there is some meta humor in that

Jim:

There is.

T.C.:

Because of the rights to Thunderball.

Jim:

I mean, it's it's entirely possible that we are verging into parody, and we're just making our own version a James Bond focused version of, which is Archer was supposed to be. But basically, Venture Brothers or something like that.

T.C.:

Here here's where I yes. The the we're we're risking them. This is where we curb that. Having the first villain just be a killer of killers. It's small.

T.C.:

It's not someone trying to take over the world. It's a it's a it's a small issue that means a lot because these are the best of the best getting assassinated. We need to stop this guy. This is a huge deal for a very small number of people. Mhmm.

T.C.:

MI six is is very concerned about this. MI six is a very small branch of protective services within The United Kingdom, but in London, England. But it's a big deal. So it doesn't have to be this all encompassing world threat yet. Having having this be this this having the goal be to explore the humanity of these characters.

T.C.:

Why are you chosen? Why do you do what you do? Who were you before? Who are you? All those kind of human questions doesn't doesn't mean we can't have these exciting action packed adventures, globetrotting stories.

T.C.:

It's just that the what is at stake isn't the world. It is smaller than that. Honestly, it's why John Witt worked so well because all four of those movies, very small.

Jim:

Disagree. The the The first one was it quickly grew out of he he goes to the Middle East to find the man in charge of all assassins.

T.C.:

Okay. I guess I'm

Jim:

Or was that the third one?

T.C.:

No. You're right. Yeah.

Jim:

Yeah. I I

T.C.:

It's not someone trying to take over the world is what I'm saying.

Jim:

Sure.

T.C.:

The world isn't at risk. Their world is at risk. So having Okay. I see what you're saying. Having Bond having James Bond, o o seven, having them double o agents go against Smirsh and Spectre and Quantum.

T.C.:

We already have that's three different organizations. Smirsh was made when they couldn't have the rights to Spectre.

Jim:

What a replacement word.

T.C.:

I know. Right? So it doesn't have to be yeah. Villain wise, having someone who's a weathermaniac or like, when we did our James Bond this season Mhmm. We created a threat to the entire planet.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Appropriately so, we created a technocrat son of a bitch who needed to be blown up and we did it. We felt good about it. Yeah. Oh, vengeance was ours.

T.C.:

But in a scenario like this, what could send a show like this, a series like this, the distance is the humanity of these characters. And therefore, the threats being smaller to the world doesn't mean they have to be smaller to the characters. You get what I'm saying.

Jim:

Of. So so to that end, actually, I'm I'm thinking the way the narrative is formed is our characters in these episodes might even get sent on those missions, but we just we cut past them because it's not about doing the job. They do they they they assassinate people like that all the time, every every time they're activated. And that would be us up to us to determine how often that is. Mhmm.

T.C.:

The what I would model this after, and it's I bring this up whenever I can, is 100 bullets. 100 bullets seems like this one thing, and then the spiral keeps getting bigger and bigger and bigger until you realize, oh, this is a the the mechanism here is worldwide.

Jim:

Sure.

T.C.:

I wouldn't mind John Witt getting there. It just happened to get there in the second movie.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

So, like, something like this. The the joy of of this existing in whatever capacity it wanted to be would be getting to season three and finally getting to a familiar villain. Maybe that's where suddenly oh, it's sort of like Hannibal, the TV series. Like, they couldn't they took their time getting to Silence of the Lambs, so they told those stories in seasons and then had to stop because they didn't have the rights to Silence of the Lambs. They found a way to tell these very compelling character driven stories.

T.C.:

Two seasons? Three seasons? Did you actually I

Jim:

thought there were four.

T.C.:

Oh, man. Well, whatever the case

Jim:

There there were a bunch of seasons, and you're you're right. They they couldn't do Silence of Lambs. Yeah. But they did red dragon. It was great.

T.C.:

Yeah. Right.

Jim:

Okay. Well, so then oh, okay. So what if the what if this world what if okay. What if these these other organizations like Spectre and Smirsh and and and all these things. What if they are the equivalent of the spy agencies?

Jim:

They're just they're invisible. And so basically set up a world where m I six right where if you think about spies and and spy fiction, James Bond is kind of the Superman of them. Right. The problem is he's, oh, he's invincible. What stories can you tell with James Bond?

Jim:

That's boring. Well, okay. We need to be able to punch James Bond. So Spectre and these agencies, they are I I don't think the movies have done a good job of establishing how big and untouchable they are. Mhmm.

Jim:

A TV show could potentially do that. And and my point here is so so building this, m I six seems like this powerful well, it seems like just as powerful of an organization.

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

I am suggesting we establish they are not. They they they're a they're a they're a light in a world of darkness. Right? Like, in a world of of invisible moving shadows, agent groups like Spectre are are moving whole worlds, and m I six is doing what they can to protect against it. Right.

Jim:

And the use of the double o agents, we early on in in the first several episodes, if not just the whole first season Mhmm. Right, is established as, oh, these are brutal people who've erased their entire for to do very brutal things. But in the scheme of things, what they do is surgery. I don't I feel like I'm not explaining it Yeah. Properly.

T.C.:

I'm I'm compelled by what you're saying.

Jim:

I'm running out of steam on it.

T.C.:

Okay. But here here's a here's a thought to discuss the you talked about Mhmm. James Bond being this invincible thing, and they they did kill him in No Time to Die.

Jim:

Start it was the then

T.C.:

Dan Craig was like, I'm not coming back. Blow me to smithereens.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

Man, that's how you start the series is James Bond getting killed in the cold open. And then now it's like, we're reassigning

Jim:

I was gonna recommend we we see his second confirmed kill.

T.C.:

That's how Casino Royale starts. Oh. We see both the kills.

Jim:

Oh. I did not realize that. Yeah. It's been a long time.

T.C.:

Double o status granted is the after is the last thing. Anyway, having it open with as traditional of a James Bond action sequence as possible and having him die and then being like, what's the cons what's the results of James Bond's demise? Now there's some meta commentary in that of once James Bond is done, the Broccolis take the time to figure out who should be the next James Bond and what should the next mission be. It's kinda what this would be. It's like we have James Bond.

T.C.:

Henry Cavill is the cold open, and he gets killed. And not in a funny way. Was dead serious. He gets killed, and then it's the results of that. We've we have an empty we have a we need a new double o seven.

T.C.:

Sure. The seven has been taken off the board. Kind of and so sorry to Star Trek Strange New Worlds slowly introduced James Kirk knowing that the future of the enterprise isn't under Pike, it's under Jim.

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

So having o o seven James Bond o o seven taken out at the beginning of this, and now what is the how do we proceed from he's the first o o assassinated. And now Oh. Now to to like you said, we don't follow James Bond. We're gonna follow a different agent through this story. And James Bond double seven, that slot isn't filled until end of season one or beginning of season two or halfway through season two.

Jim:

Okay. Sure.

T.C.:

And and then so the plot I already suggested, is having having an agent okay. Listen. The this whole program was we've had three agents assassinated now. This isn't a fluke. Mhmm.

T.C.:

One is bad. Two, oh, darn. Three, now we have a problem. 008, 009, 006, whoever we're gonna be. You I need to assign you to solve this.

T.C.:

Great. Show me where all the other agents are. Can't do that. That's kind of defeats the purpose of the double o program. How do you expect me to investigate and save all these people if you're not gonna tell me who or where they are?

T.C.:

Okay. This, then having that either 006 is going to get that information and say, this is the only way I operate. Or, or they go behind M's back and get the information themselves to start figuring out who these characters are.

Jim:

What if what if that's that's basically what they're told. Right? How am I expected to do this?

T.C.:

Like Yeah.

Jim:

It's why you were chosen.

T.C.:

And oh, yeah. Yeah. I like that. It's why you're chosen chosen. You're asking me to do the impossible.

T.C.:

It's not impossible because someone else is doing it right now.

Jim:

Oh, nice. I like that.

T.C.:

Alright. So then trying to break into MI 5 or MI 6, like, that's not working. Like, now I have to think like the killer. How would I deduce worldwide who these 13 other agents are?

Jim:

Sure.

T.C.:

And now we have a cat and mouse game.

Jim:

Nice.

T.C.:

Yeah. And and, yeah. There's there's some fun fun in that of, like, replacing double o seven and and having and maybe maybe they don't have to have individual personalities. Maybe they can be there can be similar enough spies that that they all, of various ages and styles and genders. It doesn't have to be suave one, blue collar one, tech one.

Jim:

Oh, no. I I like I do I do like the idea of establishing these are these are archetypes. Okay. We use.

T.C.:

Okay. Yeah.

Jim:

Mostly because, right, like, building to the to the larger world, I like the idea that it it's almost it's the secret like, think think of the world of John Wick. Mhmm. John Wick goes through the world, our world. No one knows who he is. Mhmm.

Jim:

That's like James Bond. He walks into a place. He's recognized as Baba Yaga, as John Wick, as this assassin. He's an assassin. No one should know who an assassin is.

Jim:

Mhmm. But he is still identified. It would sort of be the same, like when he shows up, I'm Bond, James Bond. It means nothing to you, the bartender, or concierge, or anything like that.

T.C.:

Yeah. But the people everybody listening.

Jim:

Yeah. They know. And as as we establish the world and as we show the world, we learn other personalities that other organizations have. Mhmm. Like, is that Blofeld is up to these days?

Jim:

Blofeld isn't Blofeld. There's always a Blofeld.

T.C.:

Title. Yeah.

Jim:

Yeah. And it's always the leader of Spectre.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

T.C.:

I have an alternate. I think it should be a o o. O o six is the one investigating this whatever. There is an alternate version of this where Moneypenny is assigned that she's the one investigating the double o's being assassinated just because I Sure. I liked how active they made Naomi Harris in

Jim:

I actually Skyfall. Oh, I really like that. That's our main character. Well, no. I I that that takes away a lot of the mystery

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

Because you said hold on?

T.C.:

No. No. I'm listening.

Jim:

Oh, I thought you said hold on.

T.C.:

No. I didn't. Oh. I was like, go on.

Jim:

Go on. It takes away the mystery if Moneypenny is the one put in charge. Mhmm. Because oh, it doesn't have to. I guess she could hurt she's just is she the right.

Jim:

She I'm stuttering. She is the handler Mhmm.

T.C.:

For Bond, is the idea here? Yeah. She she well, what I'm suggesting or what she is in the canon. Because in the canon, she's end secretary, which is Yeah. A a shame because they made her such a they made her a field agent in Skyfall and then took that away from her.

Jim:

I was gonna say, what if because she's she's going to be one of the few people who can identify all of the agents because when they're brought

T.C.:

in Oh, yeah. She knows she knows everyone.

Jim:

She's gonna know everyone.

T.C.:

So maybe that's if we have o o five be the main character, bring Moneypenny in or do we cut that out of the equation and go Moneypenny, you're the only one who knows who all these people are. Go. The way, there's a series called the Moneypenny Diaries, I think. It's like a series of novels. It's like three books.

Jim:

Or we make o o seven the main character. He's the one assigned to this impossible mission.

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

And the way he decides to get the files is he realizes one of the linchpin characters is Moneypenny, so he seduces her or tries to.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Okay.

Jim:

And that's what sets the relationship between our new bond and Moneypenny as this flirtatious thing.

T.C.:

Oh, and you know what would be great in a sad but wonderful way to this narrative is we not fridging her, but she dies and a new money penny replaces her. And money penny

Jim:

is So money penny q m, they all get replaced?

T.C.:

They're all replaceable, which just makes it that much more, like, frustrating to realize, man, none of us matter if we can be so easily replaced. And then it's like, no, you do matter because of this.

Jim:

What does m stand for?

T.C.:

Well, in more recent, it's it was his last name. It was m in

Jim:

Oh, that's right. Sure.

T.C.:

In Mallory. It was Mallory

Jim:

Is this oh, sorry. Yeah.

T.C.:

No. That's

Jim:

okay. Is it too cheesy if if it's it's a whole I there's gotta be a better term for it than just referencing Star Wars, but a whole Padme thing, Padme Amidala thing where Moneypenny is positioned as the secretary, but is actually m, and m is the the sit in figure. And they just weren't clever enough, they just used her first initial as as the decoy. No. And then what's m stand for?

Jim:

Your secretary Moneypenny.

T.C.:

That sounds like a perfect thing for something like League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

Jim:

But in

T.C.:

this, I I like m and Moneypenny being the separate entities as they've always been.

Jim:

Okay.

T.C.:

That's a fun notion that Moneypenny could eventually become m. Mhmm. That maybe it's not just you're my secretary, it is assistant to m. Moneypenny could

Jim:

Well, actually play up the notion of what's

T.C.:

Actually, that's a really good idea.

Jim:

Of what secretaries are. Right? Like, secretary of the state isn't just a person taking dictation and

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Preparing coffee and stuff.

T.C.:

Well, secretary in its original form is secret keeper.

Jim:

Perfect.

T.C.:

That that's what that's what secretary's root word. It's Latin Latin for secret. Confidential officer, secret keeper. That's what secretary means.

Jim:

Oh, how about this? Since we've we've stumbled onto this character. What if Moneypenny is sort of established is shown to be like, right, the initial notion is, oh, you are the the the secretary to m. Mhmm. But to use terms we understand as filmmakers, she is the the first assistant director.

T.C.:

Right? Right. Second next

Jim:

in line. Make well, not just next in line, but M makes the big calls, but Moneypenny, the secretary, makes sure it all happens. Mhmm. Yeah. You are late.

Jim:

You cannot be late. Right? In in movies, everyone to your places, we're doing this, this, and they're they organize everything. Mhmm. Right?

Jim:

They set the shot list for the next day. They do all of actual work Mhmm. While Em, the director, does the the kind of the the general strategizing.

T.C.:

Yeah. That making her more than just note taker, having giving her that much more agency. I like that. I like that money penny playing a role in the the active, operations.

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

Yeah. That's cool. That's a cool cool way to use her, especially because the Moneypenny Diaries, that trilogy of books establishes her very much as a very competent agent Mhmm. Who's now behind a desk for one reason or another. I had not read the books.

T.C.:

I'm just aware of them. Having her be part of strategy, part of planning, essentially, could be the next m.

Jim:

Mhmm.

T.C.:

I like that. That's fun. Who's our yeah. Who's this killer of killers in the end? Who it I I don't think it should be a a rogue agent.

T.C.:

I think there should be we've you've sort of made some good suggestions about this world at large having moving parts that are maybe it's someone who's like, these cycles need to stop. There's always been an MI six and a James Bond. There's always been a Spectre. There's always been the American equivalent over here, CIA, Secret Service. George Washington made the secret.

T.C.:

The the Mhmm. Enough of it. I'm gonna tear the whole system down.

Jim:

Oh, for the Americans, we can lean into that. The the the three fifty five.

T.C.:

The three fifty five. That's right. We could

Jim:

lean into the culprit.

T.C.:

That makes my heart happy because I love that lore, that American lore. Not enough people know that. That stuff is so cool. Yeah. Agent three fifty five.

T.C.:

Like, a female agent? Mhmm. Come on. The fact that James Bond hasn't crossed paths with agent three fifty five, what a what a what a missed opportunity there. I'm gonna seduce you.

T.C.:

No. You're not. Punch.

Jim:

Now granted, right, they made a movie out of it, and I don't know how many other reference right. There's the reference in why, but I don't know how many other things have been made based off of that. If we wanted to take everything we're developing here Mhmm. File off the James Bond, we could do a three fifty five.

T.C.:

Yeah. Yeah. I I mean, I love the lore of for those listening, three fifty five was a female agent during the American revolution chosen by George Washington himself, one of the first American spies. And the notion, the if you believe in the cloak and dagger conspiracies, though, is that title has been passed on to a female secret agent ever since.

Jim:

Why three fifty five?

T.C.:

You know, I don't know.

Jim:

We don't know.

T.C.:

I don't know why it was three fifty five. But I yeah. That you're right. We could we could scrape this all away and make our own little thing out

Jim:

of it.

T.C.:

But, yeah, it's fun to play with the IP for now.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

Why was she called 355? Why? Well, I'm just gonna Google it instead

Jim:

of guessing. Either way, what you've done actually, by suggesting that that's their motivation, they're not they may be they may have not been an m I six agent, they're a rogue agent of some kind.

T.C.:

Oh. 355 in the Culper Ring code book represents the word lady. 355 means lady. Lady. Agent lady.

T.C.:

Cool. I love it. I love it. Yeah. Having someone who wants to, like, burn the world down, burn the systems, like, let let anarchy rule, like, no longer to to touch base on the story I wrote recently, the idea of breaking down the system to a certain point and rebuilding from there.

T.C.:

I wrote I wrote my after the fall sci fi fiction, which was that. Like, what do you do if you strip down power to this level Sure. And rebuild from there? You're not gonna build the same thing. And so I was having someone who thinks if I strip down the security and checks and balances that are are killing us and controlling us from the shadows, making those calls, strip it down to this point and rebuild from there, we won't get the same things over and over again.

T.C.:

There won't you'll be you will be the last double o seven. I won't I won't let another one exist.

Jim:

Okay. So who would want the the first thing that occurs to me is it it at first seems to be this rogue factor. Mhmm. But how did they learn about all of this stuff? So instead, what it is is it that that's the story, but it's really somebody who is being fed slash funded Mhmm.

Jim:

By a couple of these other organizations, basically, by a couple bigger fish to essentially declaw the espionage state of The UK because they they want to take it over. They want to take them off the table, basically.

T.C.:

So some some power, money Mhmm. Money money and power, it's always gonna come down to some technocrat asshole. It's really in there.

Jim:

But it doesn't have to come down to an individual. It could come down to one one or more of these the these organizations.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Oh, so like Spectre or what have you. I wonder if there could be let me think here. M I six have it has the double o program if we the Culper Ring of America has three fifty five within this. I because I'm such a geek for three fifty five, I don't want to vilify that character.

Jim:

I don't think you would be

T.C.:

But

Jim:

of the Americans doing that. I don't think the the Americans would be sabotaging Great Britain through this.

T.C.:

I'm trying to think if there's any other established so, like, James Bond, double o seven, works for MI six. Agent forty seven from the Hitman series was part of that program. Yeah. Genetically engineered assassin. Agent or subject thirteen was the winter soldier in comics, like a num a numerical moniker.

Jim:

Numbers are fun.

T.C.:

Numbers are fun. So thinking historically, three fifty five is called for rings. That's American American revolution. The Soviet Union had a KGB agent code name number one.

Jim:

Okay.

T.C.:

So, you know, throwback to Russia, trying to, like maybe it's number one is

Jim:

I think I think the the world I'm trying to establish is there are the spies there are the spies of the nations

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

And then there are dark organizations.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

Like Spectre, like like the different spy organizations in, for example, Chuck. Mhmm. Right? Fulcrum, that's the one I mostly remember. And I know that was their equivalent, but they had two or three different organizations.

Jim:

And I'm I'm so I'm imagining like so there's this dark world Mhmm. Of these Oh. Organizations. Yeah. And they can be linked to to speak more to the world we now live in Mhmm.

Jim:

And actually has probably existed around us a lot longer. The world of corporations. Corporations are basically landless states. So think of a thing like, let's vilify I don't mind it. Let's vilify BlackRock.

Jim:

Right? Yeah. Do something equivalent of that. Find other other large

T.C.:

Okay.

Jim:

Faceless organizations that run big things that nations would be interested that hold national interests. Both those organizations have interests in controlling societies, and nations have interests in that. And so these these faceless ones, they span across borders

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

Which is a problem for the nations. Mhmm. So in that regard, often these nation the nations which are not necessarily friendly, right, like the the British and the American forces, they may have joint operations. Mhmm. But they're they're not, like, automatically sharing all their secrets with each other.

Jim:

To that same end, like, rather than vilifying the Russian one, Russia is sort of the same type of thing. Russia is this known quantity. So their agents, they're just not as on friendly terms with the British or Americans or or things like that.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

And maybe they would be interested in destroying one another, but it's these invisible groups Mhmm. That are sort of the bigger problem worldwide Yeah. Because they tend to do things like pit these nations against each other for their own interests. Thus, it is up to the spies to kinda prevent that kinda stuff and to fight those proxy wars kinda thing. Yeah.

Jim:

But so just like sometimes the Americans and the Brits will work together to to an end to take down some other group. Mhmm. I'm suggesting two of the two or more of these invisible groups have made an alliance to take down m I six.

T.C.:

Mhmm. Okay.

Jim:

And they are funding this person with a chip on their shoulder. Through whatever Okay.

T.C.:

I like that. I having to be an individual who's being siphoned information and funds for a collective purpose, but he's he's a freelancer.

Jim:

Maybe.

T.C.:

He's like, I I work for who I work for these forces. My they've been I've been given assignment just like you, James. My assignment is you and all of your people. Yeah. And I've been and well, you know, I'm gonna find out who's responsible for this.

T.C.:

They're all responsible for it, James. They all want you dead.

Jim:

And and you could get into rhetoric and dogma if if if you'd like the character to be like, because he works for these organizations. Organizations And, and like, there are there are players in the world that are in the dark. Mhmm. And they don't wanna be in the dark anymore. But you you and to make space, they need to take out someone who's in the light.

Jim:

They're basically the light and the dark essentially is who is public facing, who has

T.C.:

Oh, man.

Jim:

Who has positions in the world and who doesn't. And basically, they want to rise up as a kingdom of their their own essentially.

T.C.:

I know the thing. Gotta replace Yeah. Yeah. Their protectors. I love it.

T.C.:

The the the opening credits of this movie just fell into place and James Bond style chess pieces, chess boards, like Sure. Black and white, the light and the dark, like, playing with the moving the pieces. You called the Bond a rook earlier. I even know who we can pull from canon to end up being this guy, the man with the golden gun. Oh, sure.

T.C.:

Scaramanga. I believe you. Francisco Scaramanga. He's he's, it's Chris Ferli from the man with the golden gun. Oh, He is a freelance assassin who works for whoever pays him to do what he does, and he's a killer of killers.

T.C.:

So I didn't we sort of came a long way around to make it him if we want in canon to have it be be him and that that revelation is like, oh, I found the man who did it, the man who figured out the assassins. It's you. Who are you working for? Everyone. Yeah.

T.C.:

What? I'm working for all of them. They're all paying me. You think, look at this island, look at everything I have. It means nothing to me because I thrive on this, the chase, and you found me.

T.C.:

Oh. A lot of, you know, like, very flamboyant Sure. Supervillain kind of stuff. And and the fact that, like, it's not as easy as kill one guy and this is all over. Fine.

T.C.:

We can face each other. I'm gonna kill all of you. You're gonna kill me, but they're still out there. You're still out there. This never ends.

T.C.:

Oh, isn't it delicious? Like, it it it yeah. Thematically, having it be multiple countries and and multiple organizations all siphoning into one individual to do the dirty deed. It's thematically great because that's what we're having m I six ask this double o agent to do. It's also talking about the inhumanity of all of this jockeying for position moving across the board, cyclical nature of of this versus this.

T.C.:

It it plays really well.

Jim:

Yeah. But what move does the gun make on the dashboard?

T.C.:

Gun jest. Hashtag gun jest. Oh, yeah. Yes. Yes.

T.C.:

Good call, man. That crow killed him. I think that camera will oh, yeah. Now you how long how long did you let me ramble? You would be, like, two minutes ago.

Jim:

No. I just thought

T.C.:

of it. I just

Jim:

you're going on about chess and I was thinking about moves and stuff like that.

T.C.:

Gun chess. Hashtag gun chess, everyone. If you listen to this, please. Yeah. And and having this result now to be fair

Jim:

To be fair?

T.C.:

This could fit in a two and a half hour movie.

Jim:

So far.

T.C.:

Now that we know what ultimately it ends up being, there's no reason we couldn't explore it in a two and a half hour movie.

Jim:

We we could explore it in a two and a hour movie, but it ultimately ends James Bond hasn't saved the world. He's just stopped this one guy.

T.C.:

Right.

Jim:

And all he is is the messenger. Yeah. An errand boy. Yeah. Sent with a grocery bill.

Jim:

Because ultimately, I'd also wanna build into his model, the Golden Guns monologue Mhmm. Is he's just been hired to do this. And you weren't you were meant to know, like, wasn't supposed to be a secret Yeah. That this was happening. Yeah.

Jim:

Think of this as a calling card. These players are telling you their move. Mhmm.

T.C.:

Your move? Yeah. Now it's your move.

Jim:

Or or maybe that maybe that's even his last last lines before James Bond kills him. Your

T.C.:

move.

Jim:

Yeah. Some some something like that. Right? So so we know the and James Bond is not much the wiser. He just knows the one person who and maybe he got a a lead on how he got his information because we didn't cover that.

Jim:

How did he figure out

T.C.:

How did James go?

Jim:

Yeah. No. No. How did how did Golden Gun figure out who all of these spy where they look. So right.

Jim:

So that's the other thing. If we then go to this upper world where to us, the normal world Mhmm. These spies are unknown things that that come and go with with the the wind. Mhmm. If to the spy world where names are calling cards like that, basically, would know kinda they wouldn't I I I it would be we have to figure out exactly what that means.

Jim:

Right? Because if you inherit the identity of James Bond, you're inheriting his apartment as well. You're inheriting

T.C.:

No. No. Yeah. Yeah. That's I see the problem.

Jim:

That means it's all sitting still and everyone knows where you are.

T.C.:

That I I realized it as I was describing it, that fallacy Yeah. Anyway. So how did how did Scaramanga figure it out? How did the Mammoth Golden Gun figure out? It could be as simple as like, I deduced there were at least a dozen of you.

T.C.:

And I deduced that of the dozen, you specialized in very specific jobs, missions. And so I have spent the better part of the past five years setting up those missions for you to accomplish. And once I started seeing recognizable faces, it doesn't take long to put two and two together to realize there's your 12, there's your six, there's your three. Like, that that

Jim:

So do we wanna make him a mastermind who's been doing this or has have the organizations fed him this information from having

T.C.:

They hired him. He used their resources. He he's even so prideful, like, and they don't. I they gave me what they needed. I took what I needed.

T.C.:

They don't know. They didn't figure this out. I figured this out. He didn't it's not like he went to them and go, there's one. There's one.

T.C.:

There's one. It's like he he like, I will kill them and then tell you. Just keep giving me the money and the resources to do it. It's just like let the pride be sort of a contrivance to protect the agents at large and the names and whatnot. Maybe.

T.C.:

Yeah. Sure. And and, yeah, Bond defeats this guy. He must he will I actually think I have a name for this. If this is a movie or the subtitle of every season is a Bond title, it's one or two.

T.C.:

You tell me what you like better. Live to die again or live to kill again. James Bond or double o's Double

Jim:

o's we're gonna do all of this and these are these are monikers, they're not things like live to die again.

T.C.:

Okay. So o o, live to die again is the name of the first miniseries. And then the second miniseries is Double o, and then whatever that plot ends up being.

Jim:

Okay.

T.C.:

I just I'm sitting here thinking about it, like, to Die Again came to mind.

Jim:

I'm like Mhmm.

T.C.:

That sounds like a James Bond movie

Jim:

It does.

T.C.:

Or a title. Yeah. So Double o, Live to Die Again is is season season or series one

Jim:

Sure.

T.C.:

Use BBC terminology

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

Of this this miniseries set in this world. And it ends with a victory, but also this big picture of the fight will never end. There will be more. James Bond will return.

Jim:

So all of this, I I want to you you've built a personality that suggests he can be removed, but I also like the notion that Golden Gun is also not just Scaramanda? Scaramanga. Scaramanga. It's not just him. He, like James Bond, is just the latest iteration.

T.C.:

It's all about legacy. It's all about handing it off, and may may you know, Danemaw of the of the season after Scaramato has been killed and and and our hero has completed the mission. We'll make it Bond. Right? He takes the golden gun back to m I m I five, m I six and says, you know, let's let's keep this off the board for now.

T.C.:

Let's let's hope better more eloquent than that, but let's let's, for now, be happy that there that there is not another maybe I can't find the words to say.

Jim:

No. I I I think I understand the note. The the idea being you killed

T.C.:

The man with the golden gun.

Jim:

The man with the golden gun, and you produced the gun he had. But ultimately, that is it's another chess piece on the board and it's off the table

T.C.:

For now. For now. Yeah. There you That's it. Yeah.

T.C.:

Yeah.

Jim:

Just just like the three agent three three, four agents he killed through this season

T.C.:

They're off the board.

Jim:

They're off the board

T.C.:

For

Jim:

now. For now. Until we can find a new one. Yeah. That's always the the worry of getting killed too fast.

Jim:

You can't replace your organization. Yeah.

T.C.:

So, yeah, the man with the golden gun is off the board for now. Yeah. Like, some that's a great there's a better way to say that, but that's the right idea.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

Mhmm. K.

Jim:

Also, I wouldn't wanna I I would I want to change it to it's not the man with the golden gun. It's just golden gun.

T.C.:

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And and the reason because it could be the woman with the golden gun. It could be the

Jim:

That and the reason that that the the the gun is actually made of gold because that's a signature, but the reason that piece, that that group, that organization, whatever is called that is because they specialize their what they specialize in is killing people. Mhmm. They can kill anyone anywhere because they are the golden gun.

T.C.:

We are I am the golden gun. Now I and now I will kill you. Bang bang bang bang gun fight action sequence fight fight fight your move. Yeah. And now in in doing this, given James Bond an adventure, we've created a villain.

T.C.:

A villain who's part of a much bigger picture, but so is James. The double o's being being a much bigger organization. Understand there's there's a global reach to all of

Jim:

this. Mhmm.

T.C.:

All done within this first story, this first chapter. Hell yeah. So, yeah, that's what I would do with a blank check if I could do a James Bond. Alright.

Jim:

There you go. There's a soft demand.

T.C.:

Yeah. A soft demand that actually turned into a full episode. I'm trying to think how to handle this right now. Okay, Jim. This is what we're gonna do.

T.C.:

We're gonna take a really quick break here, very brief. Here's some messages from Six Five Media, and we'll come right back, and we're gonna wrap up, this this wonderful experience that we just had.

Jim:

Cool? Cool.

T.C.:

James Bond. Yeah. Again? Yeah. How?

Jim:

I don't know why it came to mind. Yeah. What were because we were talking the previous episode was

T.C.:

We just did Freaky Friday. Freaky Friday. Yeah. Did Fight Swap.

Jim:

Yeah. And and I'm not exactly sure why that that up.

T.C.:

That sorry. The the episode has ended and now Jim and I are just sort of like Oh, yeah. The you're still listening because there's more to listen to here. Yeah. But we've just satisfied the demand if you're if you're actually listening for the first time.

T.C.:

Thank you. And if you like what you heard, seriously, 100 plus episodes for you to choose from.

Jim:

Should we do the outro here? Is This

T.C.:

is what

Jim:

I'm doing. This is the outro. Gotcha. Yeah.

T.C.:

Yeah. We can we can just chat for a little bit and Uh-oh. Sure. Which honestly, to give more of a preview or a sampling of how Jim and I discussed the episodes after the fact, that's what this is right here. We're what what you don't know for a first time listener is we have struggled with James Bond in the past.

T.C.:

Yeah. If you're a long time listener, you've already heard this story. So go go listen to the lore again. But anyhow Yeah.

Jim:

Get out of here. Oh, yeah. So I'm I'm not exactly sure why that popped into my head. Yeah. I actually really don't know where that came from, but the notion of, like, well, okay.

Jim:

What would because because I know you you have you're a little more vocal about your hang ups with the James Bond franchise

T.C.:

Sure. But now

Jim:

that and things about it.

T.C.:

Now that we've attacked this multiple times, I realize how much I I have come around to really enjoy James Bond for Sure. Particular elements of it and giving a blank check to do whatever I want, you were very clear. Keep keep the good stuff. Keep what you wanna what would you do? What you wanna explore?

Jim:

Right. You heard it. You just listened to the episode. Was a soft demand. Exactly.

Jim:

See see see what you would wanna explore. And the thing is that that wasn't the freedom we'd ever we'd given ourselves previously. Mhmm. The first time we attempted, it was very strict. We we need to make James Bond as James Bond, and James Bond fits into a very tiny specific shaped box.

T.C.:

Mhmm.

Jim:

And I remember because we tried recording and, like, you were bristling from from word one. You were like, I wanna do away with all of it. I wanna kill that James Bond.

T.C.:

That sounds like me.

Jim:

And I was like, well, you you can't have any fun with a with with some sexy time and James Bond. You're like, no. No. And the second time, I think, is the episode that actually got to to Spectre.

T.C.:

We rewrote Spectre.

Jim:

Yeah. And because that was rewriting a movie, it was much easier approach that way. Mhmm. And I don't know, just kinda sitting as as we as we were. You were you were doing some some post recording work initially.

Jim:

Just sitting here, the notion occurred to me to, what do you think about this? Yeah. And I would turn on the mics and record it. And went way longer than than usually the the little ones do.

T.C.:

Yeah. No. Yeah. Like, where if you're if if you look, we have our suddenly conversations, which tend to be debriefs after watching something or or a conversation point suddenly striking us. Our mainline episodes are very much like what you just heard.

T.C.:

And this is all not new. This isn't news to anyone who is familiar with the show.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

As someone who might be a new listener, I hope that you enjoyed what you heard. Yeah. And we hope that you come back and listen to some more. Alright. Cool.

T.C.:

So that's it. Now now this is how we typically end the show.

Jim:

Oh, we don't do the bumps?

T.C.:

We're oh, yeah. Well, I guess we can do the bumps. Yeah. What did you think of

Jim:

Sorry. No.

T.C.:

I'm forgetting. I mean, that's it for this episode of How did we do? What did you this actually, yeah. I should be telling you new people this. Yeah.

T.C.:

You can let us know how we did. Yeah. Wherever you're listening to this, you comment. If you're listening on Patreon, please comment here. But you can message us directly at Studio Demands It or on Instagram at Studio Demands It.

T.C.:

And as we've said multiple times, you can you can you can subscribe if you want. It helps us get out there in the algorithm. We also have a YouTube and a TikTok with video contents, including material not heard on the show. Jim?

Jim:

You can come join the conversation on our Discord by going to our website studiodemandsit.com, and there is a link with an invite to the Discord server. You can also join us on Reddit at r slash studio demands it, where we discuss movies all the time there as well.

T.C.:

Yeah. And as you probably know at this point, we have a Patreon for a couple bucks a month. You can get episodes early, commercial free, no interruptions, as unless except us interrupting ourselves. Sometimes we're interrupting interrupting ourself.

Jim:

Yeah.

T.C.:

Yeah. As well as extended double length episodes and movie commentary tracks with episodes hidden within those. And you can also just show some love by subscribing for free. A massive thank you to Six Five Media who helps us put this all together. So thank you.

T.C.:

Listen to some of those other Six Five shows if you're so inclined. And Jim, now Yeah. Do you have anything else? Else? No.

T.C.:

Then now this is where we stumbled at the end of that episode.

Jim:

Yep. I think we said it all in the episode that didn't know it was an episode.

T.C.:

Yeah. There you go. Thank you everyone and we hope you come back soon.

Jim:

See you then. Bye.