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Casago’s private podcast helping our patners with educational information that can help everyone find success.
It's the Casa Cast.
We've got Orange Credo.
The Casa Cast.
Our company's neato.
The Casa Cast.
Created by Casa Go.
It's time for the show.
Let's go.
Hey, welcome to Casa Cast.
I'm Steve Schwab, your host.
Today we are with Michelle Gilliland
and Tim Wilson from B& B Finder.
Guys, welcome to the show.
Thanks for having us.
Yes.
Thank you for having us.
Yeah.
Glad to have you guys here.
So we just had you on an orange
meeting a couple of Fridays ago,
and there was a great response to
your offerings that you put out and
explanations of what you guys do.
Yes, there was.
And we had the fortunate opportunity
to meet with a couple of folks.
After your revenue manager,
Arthur, and some other folks.
Uh, and I think we signed up
another five or six or seven
that week, uh, Casago franchises.
So I think we're up to, I don't
know, Tim, probably 10 or 12.
That's great.
With more in the works.
I love your guys model.
I think that the other OTAs have
left a hole in the industry that
you guys are filling and we're going
to get to talk all about today.
So but before we get started
on that, Tim, you're originally
from Denver, Colorado, right?
I've lived in Denver,
Colorado for 25 years.
Yes.
I grew up in Indiana, went to IU, but have
been in Colorado for the last 25 years.
And you moved there for the skiing
and you stayed for the fishing.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I always tell people I moved here for the
skiing, but I caught the fly fishing bug.
And so I stay here for the fly fishing.
If there's one thing that you could teach
somebody like me, who's not a fly fisher
about fly fishing, what would it be?
I would say that fly fishing, you need
some patience, of course, so patience
is key, but really it's just figuring
out the right bug at the right time and
then you'll catch fish almost every cast
and that's when it becomes really fun.
Man, I'm coming fishing with you.
That sounds amazing.
All right.
Let's do it.
And Michelle, you're an epidextrous.
You are right handed, but
you play pool left handed.
Yes, it's odd.
I didn't discover that I played pool
backwards until someone called me out.
They said, Oh, you're left handed.
And I said, Oh, I'm right handed.
Like, well, you play pool backwards,
but I had already been playing for
so long that way I couldn't switch.
So I guess technically I'm not completely
ambidextrous, but yeah, a little bit.
So are you a pretty good pool player?
You know, I have, uh, I've
won a tournament or two.
Yes.
Shark.
All right.
Yes.
My first question for you guys is
what is the mission of B& B Finder?
Tim?
Yeah.
Um, yeah.
So our, our whole goal is
to save everybody on travel
and on their vacations.
We think that some of the other platforms,
channels that are out there that, you
know, a lot of travelers look to and
rely upon have gotten pretty expensive.
They really can impact a person's
ability to get away, whether
it's for work or for pleasure.
And so here at B& B Finder, we
are a couple things I would say.
Number one, trying to put the hospitality
back into the hands of the folks who
provide the hospitality, that being
the management company that manages
the properties that folks are renting.
But two, I would say cut out the
middleman and some of the excessive
fees and commissions that some of
the other platforms are charging
that really limit people's ability to
get, uh, the most out of their money
and the most out of their vacations.
And so we're just connecting travelers
directly to the companies that are
managing the properties that travelers
are renting and cutting out the middleman.
Yeah, you know, I've been talking about
it for years that when VRBO and Airbnb
had left a listing model that it left
a massive gap in the industry that
somebody having the listing model where
you go in and have a direct conversation
with your guests, you know, potential
guests was so much more valuable to the.
Property manager than going through,
you know, this paper booking now where
there's really a wall between you and
that guest of being able to have a good
conversation and be able to use the
cancellation policies and the local
rules, if you'd have it to make sure
that you're protecting your market.
And I think you guys really fill
that void in to the industry.
Yeah, we're excited to do that and and
we agree it's, uh, I was going to say,
I think there was a time 10 years ago
when paying for placement and like a
monthly or annual subscription, it made
sense for folks that were great players
in the market for folks that just paid
a little bit of extra money for higher
placement, but didn't respond quickly
to travelers, you know, it became
probably a little bit of an issue for,
you know, Come away, Virbo, Airbnb
and fast forward now, though, I think
primarily we've got so many professionally
managed properties and the number one
goal for all property managers is to
respond as quickly as possible and do
all of the right things by the traveler.
And so we just thought it was
such a great time to bring back.
That pay for placement, because we know
the behavior of everyone that joins
our platform is going to be top notch.
And so you can pay more
to get higher placement.
But at the end of the day, yes,
you own the guest relationship
from the very beginning.
You get all the guest information.
As a matter of fact, we
think it's important that.
The property manager has the chance to
convert and close the sale, so to speak.
Right.
So instead of risking that sort of
redacted communication back and forth
for several days, sometimes weeks,
you get to have that conversation and
provide the hospitality that you would a
direct booking to the guests right away.
. What I like to say, too, is just that
whereas so many other companies have
gone to great lengths to, I would say,
prevent direct communication between the
traveler and the host of their property,
we facilitate all of that communication.
By linking to their websites, showing
their phone number, linking to their
email address, linking out to all
of their social media channels,
and basically giving the property
management companies that we work with
every opportunity to capture and book
that traveler directly versus losing
them potentially somewhere else.
Exactly.
How in the world can you be
hospitable if you can't have
a conversation with somebody?
We agree.
It's pretty tough.
And we're a hospitality industry
and a company to have a firewall
between you and the person you're
trying to be hospitable to just.
Just doesn't work.
So today we're talking about seven things
that you didn't know about B& B Finder.
Let's get started.
So number one, and I didn't know
this, you guys were founded in 1998.
That's true.
Yes.
And I think Tim, correct me if I'm wrong,
you've been around, uh, B& B Finder a
little bit longer than me, but we do like
to sort of call ourselves 25 year startup.
We were founded back in 1998.
Actually, I'm going to pass it to you,
Tim, you, you know more about the history.
Yeah, so we, uh, we did, we started
in 1998 and historically we had always
promoted professionally operating
inns and B& Bs and I guess about,
Oh, 14 months ago or so we opened
our platform up to working with
professionally managed vacation rentals.
And so historically we'd always,
we've always worked with small
and unique lodging and now we are
working with just, I would say
another segment of unique lodging.
And so, uh, yeah, it's been great.
We're having a lot of fun.
That's fantastic.
I had no idea you guys
have been around that long.
It even goes back further than
that, if you're interested,
but, uh, Eric, our owner, he
actually started bedandbreakfast.
com, uh, back in 1995, uh, which
for about 20 years was the largest
global platform for ends and BNBs,
HomeAway sold to Expedia in 2015.
And then, Expedia shut bedandbreakfast.
com down.
Now, if you type in bedandbreakfast.
com, you go to BRBO.
So Eric actually got back into the
business when he acquired B& B Finder in
April of 2019 from its longtime owner,
original founder, and a very friendly,
I would say distant competitor of
ours when we were at bedandbreakfast.
com.
John Benzac was part of that group, right?
He was part of the group
at bedandbreakfast.
com.
Yeah.
He was our COO at bedandbreakfast.
com and helped to orchestrate
the sale of bedandbreakfast.
com to HomeAway.
And then I think was probably involved
with HomeAway and Enxpedia as well.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's, he goes way back.
He's a, he's an icon in the industry.
So for number two, And I
think this is a big one.
It's free to list.
Correct.
Yes.
So, you know, I think when we
transitioned from primarily supporting
boutique lodging, bed and breakfasts,
for example, to property management
companies, where there's one, uh,
Property versus multiple properties.
It just made sense to open up
the ability for PM's to list
all of their properties with us.
And, you know, I just remember
back in the early days of home away
before the name switch to verb.
Oh, a lot of PM's didn't list.
A lot of their properties because they
just didn't have it in their budget.
Uh, it was before the
commission listing model.
And so we wanted people to every PM to
get exposure for every single property.
And then if they choose to pay for higher
placement for certain properties or
all of their properties, that's great.
But at the end of the day, um,
it's a win win for both of us.
We get more inventory on our site to
provide more options for travelers.
You get to advertise all of
your properties at no cost.
Yeah, it's free.
It's great.
So for number three, and this
kind of ties right into it.
Exposure to your company and brand.
You promote the company.
We display the logo.
Yeah.
So, so again, I would just say
that's kind of another example of us
trying to give all of the exposure
and branding to the management
companies that we are promoting.
So, uh, what I love is that every
property on our site is found within
their geographic sort on our site.
So their listing, uh, you know, maybe it's
a listing in Austin, Texas, for example.
But when you're on that actual listing.
You're going to see a brief
description about the company that's
actually managing that property.
You'll see that company's logo.
And then if you actually click
on the logo for that management
company, you'll go to what we call
a property manager profile page.
Which is almost like a website within
our website for the management company.
Uh, all of their properties are
going to be listed on this page.
Uh, there's a date search on this page
where if I search dates, I'm exclusively
searching this company's inventory.
I'm not going to be shown other
properties from other companies.
Uh, we, we keep the
guest in house with you.
Once they key in on your management
company, but that manager profile page
displays your phone number, your email,
your social links, your website, and it's
also a way for you to potentially pick up
additional properties to manage as well.
You can talk about yourselves as
a management company, you know,
that would be homeowner facing
in addition to traveler facing.
Yeah, I think to add to that as well,
Tim, that was a great explanation.
In addition, you know, I remember
watching the news one evening and
hearing a story about an Airbnb
and I thought, well, that's not
an Airbnb, that's a Casago rental.
You know what I mean?
And it dawned on me before I joined
B& B Finder and then all these
days after just the fact that.
We are advertising the vacation rental.
Someone isn't booking an Airbnb or a
Vrbo, they're booking a Casago, right?
And so how great is it that they can come
to B& B Finder to book a Casago, right?
Not to book a B& B Finder.
So that's part of it too.
And part of our mission is really
just giving the, I guess, sort of
credit for where credit is due.
All of the beautiful properties that
you guys rent are yours, not ours.
Thanks.
Yeah.
There's an entire, I don't want to
say theft of it, but there's been an
entire rebranding of the industry by
Airbnb and verbose, you know, and it
started with Verbo and we're like,
Oh, stay in a Verbo or stay at Airbnb.
And it's really taken away from
the local heroes who are doing
the true property management every
single day and the hard work and
rebranding all their work into an OTA.
And it's unfair and it's actually
not good for our industry as a whole.
Yeah.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
So for number four, you guys
said there's no call centers.
You're based in Austin and you
pick with the phones yourselves.
That's true.
Yes.
From experience, whether it's a cell
service provider or a cable provider or,
um, any, any support line that you call
when you're on hold and you feel like
you're going in circles in this industry.
Going back to the hospitality aspect
of it, we believe that you should
be able to reach someone easily,
and we don't want to make it hard.
And so for most folks, everyone has my
cell phone number and my email address,
and you can call me at any time.
If you call me at midnight, chances are my
Phone is turned off and I will not answer.
Um, but this goes with everyone at our
company and that's why we chose the email
addresses that we did so people can find
us easily and that's why we display our
direct phone numbers out on everything.
We do have a dedicated support team
and so if there is an issue or a
question or a challenge or anything
that someone needs to discuss, if I'm
not the person that can solve it, I'll
certainly get you to the right person.
Yeah, we pride ourselves in that and
as much as any company grows, it's
nice to always have a direct line
to a real person and not have to go
in circles for days before you feel
like you're getting a problem solved.
Yeah, it's very much that local
property manager feel to it, right?
Like, Hey, you can call me.
I'll get a fix for you.
Uh, , you're in alignment with that same
sort of idea of, you know, with Casago
where you want to talk to the owner of
Casago when you're in Fort Lauderdale,
you can call Andres and talk to the owner
of Casago, Fort Lauderdale, or, you know,
Mike Ryman or, you know, in Redwoods,
whoever you're speaking to is the person
on the ground taking care of business.
And I think that's pretty cool
that you guys are doing that.
Well, and I would say we're
doing it all the way to the top.
I mean, when Eric Goldreier, our CEO
does a podcast or an interview or
whatever, a webinar at the end of
every podcast or webinar, he has his
email address there on the screen
for anybody who wants to reach him.
And so, uh, we're,
we're an open book here.
That's amazing.
That's a whole lot of email time.
Good for him.
We didn't promise a quick response, but
well, and sometimes you might afford
it to me or Tim, but that's okay.
At the end of the day, someone's
taking care of somebody, right?
So my assistant has been with me for
20 Three years now, Janet, you know,
and uh, yeah, I'm telling you right
now, Janet's listening to this podcast.
She's saying, please do
not put your email on.
That's awesome.
She's been great by the way.
Thank you.
Yeah.
She's, she's amazing.
If, uh, I'd be working at a gas
station and probably getting fired
from it today if it wasn't for
Janet and not at the front either.
I'd be in the back somewhere
cleaning toilets and, and failing
at that as well without her.
So very, very, very lucky to have her.
So for number five, and
this is kind of cool.
I didn't know this a 10 minute onboarding.
Yeah.
You know, it's interesting.
I am a huge promoter and supporter of
Airbnb and Verbo and the other OTAs.
I think the more places your properties
are listed in the higher conversion, then
the more bookings you can get, the better.
And so whatever works for you, I think.
Um, you should do that.
I will say, you know, it was a huge
frustration for me at Vrbo for many
years, because people would say it
would take them five minutes to get
signed up with Airbnb and only two weeks
or a month to get signed up on Vrbo.
And I'm like, what is happening?
Well, you know, our signup process,
we've, we've, we've basically decided
that was a number one priority and
goal for us was to make the onboarding
really Easy and simple and fast.
Make it easy for folks to
join and do business with us.
And I think we attribute that to
our certified API connections.
We do have really good relationships
with our software partners.
And at the end of the day, it's
a less complicated API because
we're not merchant of record.
So all of your casago PMs are
merchant of record, and we have
a really great relationship in
connection with streamlines.
So, I mean, at the end of the day, you
give us your API key and some credentials
and the feed happens and you're listed.
We put, I think, did we say 10 minutes?
It's been as as low as seven and it's been
as high sometimes as like 30 depending on.
What we're distracted by when we're on the
phone, but yes, it's very easy and simple
And it's a we're very proud of that.
I was just gonna say I don't it's when we
tell people that most of the time I think
people think we're joking Uh, and then
when we actually go through the exercise
and onboard their properties almost every
single time at the end they'll say Wow.
You weren't kidding.
That was maybe the easiest
onboarding I've ever experienced.
And so, uh, we have a
lot of fun with that.
That's really cool.
And I think it's really
smart of you guys to do that.
Turning on the inventory in a
frictionless way is so important.
Our partners, they're busy.
It's a lot going on every day.
So.
Good job on that.
So for number six, you
said no travelers fees.
Yes, that is a huge part
of our business model.
We Know that we're in an era of
travel where folks are travelers
specifically are Finding a place on
a verbal or an airbnb or a booking.
com and then they're going to try to book
direct Maybe they don't know how Maybe
they don't get to the right direct person
um because they've started realizing
there are a bunch of fees and they could
probably get that same exact or even
I don't even know a quicker connection
and experience with the property manager
by not paying a bunch of extra fees.
And so, , that is a huge part of our
business model is fee free for travelers.
We pride ourselves on that.
So I'm going to add number seven for
myself, and I know this is unscripted,
so I hope you guys don't mind, but the
fact that you're not charging those fees
on a per reservation basis is helping
fight margin compression for our program.
Franchise owners..
Adding those extra fees, , we end
up taking a smaller piece of the ADR
because, , when you're adding on a
lot of those extra fees going , into
the nightly rate, that compresses
our margins, , and our profitability.
I've been watching it happen
ever , since we RBO in the early days
came out and, , little by little.
That compression happens and you guys
are directly fighting that for us.
So the more reservations that come through
B and B finder, the more profitable
each one of our franchises could be.
So I really do see that as a, as a
net positive for our, our partners.
And so for number eight, you guys have.
A freemium service, and there's a
pretty big difference in the opportunity
between the different levels.
Can you tell me a little bit about that?
Yeah, so we, we have basically
four levels of listing.
There's our free standard listing,
which is available to everybody.
And then we have our
premium listing levels.
Uh, and in premium, we have what
we call bronze, silver and gold.
Uh, if anybody's been doing this for a
very long time, those names might sound
familiar going back to the VRBO days.
They actually got that from us
originally back at bedandbreakfast.
com when HomeAway bought our old company.
Uh, so we brought it back here at B& B
Finder, but as the precious metals might
suggest, gold is listed first, randomly.
Followed by our silver listings,
randomly followed by our bronze listings,
randomly followed by our free listings.
One of the things we love here at BNB
Finder is that if you're in a market
where perhaps we don't have any premium
listings, we're never going to tell
you that you should upgrade to gold
so you can be first because there's no
need to, you could be first by simply
being bronze that might make you first.
And so Here at B& B Finder, we're all
about, I think, recommending to you
what we think actually makes the most
sense for you, as opposed to what
might make the most sense for us.
Uh, we want to give you the best advice
to work with us in the best possible
way so that you're happy working with
us and you want to keep working with us.
And that makes sense.
Everything pretty easy.
I think for everybody.
Yeah, exactly.
I was just going to add to our
engineering team just released a
really great port to the aggregates.
All of our listings and all of the premium
levels and free standard levels advises
based on market where someone should
or shouldn't upgrade their properties.
And so if anyone has questions about
that, we have really good reporting
on that and be happy to share..
And Can you guys tell me a little
bit about the difference in traffic
between the premium services?
We'd love to tell , our partners a little
bit about the different opportunities
when it comes to traffic multiples.
Yeah, so the numbers we'll share here,
these are site wide average numbers,
but our premium listings definitely get
more exposure than our free listings.
And the way that works from what
we're seeing in our data anyway, is
that our bronze listings, On average
on the site, get about 42, 43 times
the exposure of a free listing.
Uh, we can also see that a silver listing,
for example, gets roughly, it's about
140 times the exposure of a free listing.
And then if you're a gold listing,
you're, you're literally getting 220
times the exposure of a free listing.
Now.
Couple, I guess, considerations,
you know, we might have one market
where there are six properties.
We might have another market where
there might be 1, 500 properties.
And so these multiples are
going to be skewed by the
size of the market, of course.
So those numbers I was sharing,
those are site wide as an average.
But, uh, yeah, it's,
it's a lot more exposure.
And I would say bottom line is The
folks we're working with have the
control and flexibility to use us
the way it best suits their business.
Uh, and so you guys can, you know,
do whatever you want with us.
We're, we're here to support you and we
want to help you in the best way we can.
You know, often in the portfolios that I
personally manage, sometimes we'll see a
property that's having some weakness in
a season and we're not exactly sure why.
But we're priced competitively.
, we're doing all the right things.
We think that we're placing well and
being able to pick and choose like,
Hey, let's throw a little more love.
On to this property to get it back up to
where it needs to be is really a great
option that we have with B and B finder.
Cause you can say, okay, look,
we need to save this homeowner.
This homeowner needs to get, you know,
when you get this homeowner to a certain
number to make sure that we don't churn,
he doesn't leave or he or she leaves.
So why don't we go ahead and throw a gold
listing on this property and see if we can
get them a few extra bookings to make sure
that we stabilize that account , and do
the right thing by that homeowner, right.
Okay.
That's super interesting, Steven.
And it's interesting.
I've heard, I've heard a number of
managers that we work with share
similar sort of examples as to
how they might use B& B Finder.
You know, another one has said to me,
Oh, so if I, you know, if I take on a
new owner and I really want to show them,
you know, right out the gate that I'm
aggressively marketing their property.
I could bump them up in tier for those
first couple months to show them, you
know, Hey, we're doing all these things
for you to get you all the business
we can, or maybe you've got, you know,
a cranky homeowner who's wondering,
Hey, where are all my bookings?
And how come you're not doing more for me?
Well, this is a lever that you can pull
to try to do more on an as needed basis.
Uh, and so again, that's, that's, I
would say our mission here is to, to
give you the control to, to do what
you need to do to get the business
that you need in a cost effective way.
Fantastic.
A couple last questions.
And, uh, this one's really serious.
Michelle, can you repeat any of
the songs from the Beastie Boys?
Well, of course, I mean, their first
album, License to Ill, a lot of
people think that it is their sort
of most amateur or juvenile album.
But yes, I can.
It's my go to for karaoke, several
songs from off of that album.
Yes, I'm a big Beastie
Boys fan, as you can tell.
So since the podcast is audio only, I'll
just tell everybody out there that as
I'm talking to Michelle, uh, behind her
is a book called the Beastie Boys book.
And so I thought I would
just throw that out there.
So guys, as we're winding down, what
is your favorite thing about Casago?
I have to say the very first Casago
video that I saw, I'm not sure if it's
the one that you did with Matt Landau
or if it's, it was a different one.
I've seen several where you basically
go around and talk to lots of
franchisees and their experience and
sort of their, their business before
and after it brought me to tears.
It was, it's just so.
Heartwarming and genuine And joining
your friday meeting last week, man
Everyone just seems so happy and so Uh
stoked to be a part of the casago team
and that's my favorite thing I mean,
you can't buy that kind of happiness.
You know what I mean?
That's pretty incredible Thank you.
Well and not to piggyback on michelle
there But I would agree just being on
that call with you guys last week where
I want to say there were upwards of
probably 50 Different Casago franchisees,
and then just team members there.
But just seeing how everybody
interacted and how personable
everybody was with each other.
And I was just the whole time I was
thinking to myself, wow, what an
amazing resource that must be for
all of you guys to have each other.
In all these different markets and to be
able to talk about all of the different,
call it challenges or successes or
different things that you guys are
experiencing in your own franchise, but to
also be able to come together and share.
And I just thought, holy cow, what
a Awesome thing you guys have there.
It was, it was really
neat to be a part of that.
I've only seen it one other time in
my professional experience anyway.
And it was a web design company who
during COVID would get together for a
weekly zoom call with all of our clients.
And they would all kind of commiserate
about how they were managing COVID.
And so seeing that you guys are
doing that, I just thought how cool.
Awesome.
I thought it was a really cool thing.
So anyway, that's my thank you very much.
Yeah, we're very proud of our community.
You know, this community is
actually become our strongest suit
of all the offerings that we have.
, we can certainly put out support.
, we put out thousands of hours of support a
year, a lot of resources . But what we're
finding is this community as they grow and
take on the challenges themselves and help
each other is becoming the most valuable
part of the entire, uh, community.
Offerings that we have.
So thank you for recognizing that guys.
Thanks for coming on the show.
We sure appreciate it And everybody out
there, , if you get a chance to make
sure to get onto bmp finder It's a free
service and then obviously if you want
to have uh, you know A better rankings in
there or you can always go to the premium
services There's no risk in it getting
on there and showing your homeowners that
you're on another channel is always a good
thing And the bookings that you get bring
along along with the The commissions that
you don't have to pay is a fantastic
way to proliferate your listings again.
Thanks so much for coming on guys.
Thank you so much for having us.
I mean, this was awesome and we, we
really appreciate all your support
and everything that you guys do for
the industry, and we're just, we're
happy to be here partnering with
you guys in every way that we can.
. Likewise.
Yes.
I second that.
Thank you, . Thank you.
They ought be, just don't call in their b.
C.