Steel to Sharpen Steel with Brie Flora

Show Notes

Join Kosta and his guest: Brie Flora, Artist, Jeweler, Educator, Gallery Manager for Fiddlehead Gallery at The Silver Fern and Vice President of Art Round TN.

In This Episode: How artists and small business owners can scale and curate their craft to be more marketable, the value of supporting local artists and the difference in what you’re really buying, how Art Round TN is growing the development of artists in Middle Tennessee.

Visit Fiddlehead Gallery at The Silver Fern 
Address: 145 E Spring St, Cookeville, TN 38501

Current Exhibition: "Apocalypse Now" a solo exhibition of paintings by local artist Dax van Aalten running 9/29/2022 - 10/ 29/2022

Closing Reception/Silver Fern "Halloween" Party: 10/29/2022.

Upcoming Exhibition: Justin Blackmon will have a solo exhibit of his paintings on display for the whole month of November alongside Art Round TN's Art Prowl: 11/11/22 - 11/12/22.

Better Together with Kosta Yepifantsev is a product of Morgan Franklin Media and recorded in Cookeville, TN.

Find out more about  Brie Flora, The Silver Fern, and Art Round TN:
https://www.brieflora.com/
https://www.thesilverfernshop.com/
https://www.artroundtennessee.com/

Find out more about Kosta and all the ways we're better together:
http://kostayepifantsev.com/

What is Better Together with Kosta Yepifantsev?

Better Together with Kosta Yepifantsev is a podcast about business, parenting and living life intentionally. We're here every week to bring you intentional conversations on making your own path to success, challenging the status quo, and finding all the ways we're better. Recorded in Cookeville, TN, Kosta joins guests from all walks of life to bring fresh perspective and start your week with purpose. We're better together.

Brie Flora: As artists need to
learn business because they

learn all these skills, and they
get really good at art, and then

they're like, oh, go fly the
nest, leave college and then do

something with that. But then no
one knows how to talk about

themselves. No one knows how to
sell themselves. And

unfortunately, that's what we
have to do.

Morgan Franklin: Welcome to
Better Together with Kosta

Yepifantsev, a podcast on
parenting business and living

life intentionally. We're here
every week to bring you

thoughtful conversation on
making your own path to success,

challenging the status quo, and
finding all the ways we're

better together. Here's your
host, Kosta Yepifantsev

Kosta Yepifantsev: Hey, y'all.

This is Kosta. And today, I'm
here with my guest Bri flora,

artist, jeweler, educator,
gallery manager for fiddlehead

gallery at the Silver Fern, and
vice president of art round

Tennessee. Today we're talking
about Brees career as an artist

and entrepreneur, growing a
community nurtured by public

art, and how to market your work
to create a sustainable income

brief for anyone that doesn't
know you graduated in 2015. from

Massachusetts College of Art and
Design with a dual degree in

metalsmithing. Plus jewelry and
art education. Tell us about

selecting that program. And what
motivated you to pursue this

path.

Brie Flora: It's a mouthful,
isn't it?

Kosta Yepifantsev: Yeah, itis a
lot. It's a very interesting

selection.

Brie Flora: Because it's like
metalsmithing andjewelry. And

that's one major and then the
other one. Yeah. Oh, gosh. So I

always knew that I wanted to go
to art school that Okay, first

foremost, I was drawing on my
self in the walls when I was

little. So like, paint that
picture? Sure. Like I said,

before we started I grew up
mostly in Massachusetts. We

moved there when I was in second
grade. I heard of RISD, which

was in that's in Rhode Island.

And I think it was a middle
school and I got on MySpace. And

I literally crept hard to find
people, college students that

were in RISD to be like, Hi, I
really want to go to the school

one day, like, how can I get
into RISD? Blah, blah, blah, and

as like a seventh grader, and I
remember talking, finally

getting in touch with this one
girl who was like, I think, a

painter at RISD. And so she kind
of told me, Well, you need to

work on this portfolio, you need
to do this and that. So like,

from seventh and eighth grade, I
was like, Okay, gotta get into

high school and work on my
portfolio and do this thing. So

I always thought I was going to
do illustration. I went to this,

like portfolio review day that
happened to be at Mass art,

because it was the closest art
college to me, and I waited and

a four hour line to meet with
the RISD representatives. And it

went horribly. Oh, they were
really rude and kind of like, I

felt like my dreams were shot. I
like worked on this portfolio

for like, years. This was like,
in my head. They're, like one of

the, you know, nothing against
RISD. And I know, some

professors there and, you know,
people who went there, and it

was a great school, I get it,
like they're weeding out, you

know, the people, but it was
like, intense. And so it was so

sad. And I was like, Well, I
wasted the whole day waiting

here. And like, I'm gonna try, I
guess, but then the mass art

line was like, low, like, there
weren't a lot of people in line.

Also, there the school hosting,
I think a lot of people were

excited to talk to colleges that
came there that weren't, you

know, in the area, and I went up
there, and I talked to them. And

they focused on the same exact
pieces that needed work as the

Rizzy ones, but they talked to
me about it, okay. And they were

like, you know, this part of
this drawing of this tree or

whatever it was, is great. But
then what about, you know, this

kind of loses perspective, have
you ever considered working with

like mixing these colors or
whatever, they gave me feedback,

which I was like, okay, they
care, they care about me. And

even if I like, this isn't a
great piece, like they're giving

me feedback as to how to make it
better.

Kosta Yepifantsev: How do you
pivot from like, illustrations,

which just so that everybody
understands? And correct me if

I'm wrong. Illustrations is like
drawings, right? Yeah, it's

drawing. Okay. So like, how do
you pivot from drawing to

jewelry and metalworking? Yeah,
it's kind of intense right long.

You

Brie Flora: know, I applied
there early. And that's the only

school I applied to and I got in
so I went and freshman year at

MassArt. You don't declare your
major yet. I think that's true

for a lot of places. And then
you take a bunch of classes, and

then there's end of the year you
do it. And I found printmaking

because I was like, Oh, cool.

It's it's like illustration, but
it's different. You're working

with these different processes.

And I loved the copper plates
and etching, copper etching, so

I signed up to be a printmaking
major. And then that summer, I

took a class a summer class, and
I worked as well. I moved

immediately moved downtown. So I
was in the dorms, freshman year,

found an apartment with friends.

We moved in June of 2010. And
then, yeah, I went to summer

classes, and I worked. So I took
that and I was like, wow, this

is really fun, like printmaking.

It's so cool, but I had this
Bernal I still have it to this

day a little bit of like
impostor syndrome, like, oh, I

can't do this blah, blah, blah.

And I was like, man, like, what
am I gonna do with my life like

I not all of a sudden I got
scared. I was like, I can't do

this. I can't be a printmaking
artist and make a living and oh

my god. And so I called up my
parents. And I was like, Hey,

I'm still interested in maybe
taking some of these classes.

But I think I'm going to do art
education, so I can assure that

I have a job.

Kosta Yepifantsev: What is art
education, like in terms of a

career? What did they do with
art education? So

Brie Flora: looking back at it
now, I wish I had looked into it

further, because there were
different sectors of art

education, there's the teacher
track, right? There's a museum

education, and then like
community education. Okay, I

wish I had done museum
education, which focuses a

little bit more on like
galleries and museums, and just

like a general education for the
like, population, whereas

teacher track is K through 12.

Yeah, and that's what I did. And
I don't really, I don't know.

Clearly,

Kosta Yepifantsev: I'll be
honest with you. I was gonna say

this until later in the episode,
but it's perfect. I only failed

one class in high school. And it
was hard.

Brie Flora: Yeah. Well, you
didn't have a good teacher then,

Kosta Yepifantsev: I must have
not I, you know, honestly, like

for me, and that, I mean,
obviously, like, it takes a very

special person to enjoy art, but
it takes like a very special

person, probably point 1% of
people that excel in it. I think

the process of creating art is
messy. And I lose confidence

once I start the process,
because like a blank piece of

paper looks beautiful to me,

Brie Flora: Don't use a blank
piece of paper.

Kosta Yepifantsev: Well, I see
that and that like concept in my

mind, just I don't even know
what to do with that, you know,

so every time I get started on a
project, I'd immediately lose

confidence, like within the
first like five minutes, and

then it'd be like, this is all
trash. I'm not even I'm not even

engaged.

Brie Flora: It makes you feel
better. It still happens to me

like that same thing.

sketchbooks kind of freaked me
out. I know. We're getting off

on a tangent and Oh, please.

It's interesting. Yeah. I mean,
it's something where I have so

many sketchbooks, and a lot of
them aren't full, or I'll start

like seven pages in I don't ever
want to touch the first page.

But I don't know if

Kosta Yepifantsev: that's like,
it's great. For like kind of an

artist or like

Brie Flora: I'll do sketches on
just random pieces of paper.

Okay. Yeah, I'm actually in the
midst right now. So just to

bring it full circle. I did do
so I did art education until I

was an I finished it. But when I
was a junior, so with art

education, you have to take two
two Ds which is like drawing

painting that sort of thing.

What you would know is 2d art to
3d. So ceramics, sculpture,

jewelry, things like that. And
then media. So film sound

something like that. So you
know, I got to play with like

old school film cameras and
learn how to splice stuff

together. Like I can't tell you
much about it. But I have

respect for that now. And then
yeah, I took a jewelry class.

And the semester before that I
had taken ceramics, which I do

love. I love ceramics one day, I
just want to get a wheel so I

can play just that's more of
like a hobby. And I had never

thought in my life of jewelry as
even an option or metal

smithing, I should say as an
option. Because right now I make

more jewelry. But I do consider
myself more of a metalsmith

slash artists. And then I do a
jeweler even though I make a lot

of jewelry, okay. And it was
just so cool. I was like, Oh my

God, you can make something so
hard, do whatever you want,

right? But then I was like, Man,
I found this thing that I love

when I'm a junior in college.

And I have a year and a half
left. Because I did. It's four

and a half years for education
for the student teaching

semester. But the head of the
department at the time, Joe

wood, he's retired now, and I
still keep in touch with him. He

was like, You need to switch
majors. And I was like, I mean,

I love jewelry and metalsmithing
but I am a junior like I can't

drop all of that. And at the
time, unfortunately, hopefully

they'll never hear it. Listen to
this, but some of my professors

and art Ed were like, well, we
don't really support double

majoring. They just didn't
because it is a lot of work. And

they were like you should just
have a focus in it. And I was

like, but then that what that
leaves me like one semester to

focus on jewelry, like I don't
want to do that. So I just did

it. And I asked my parents
because I'm lucky they helped me

through college and helped pay
for college. They were like if

you really think that this is
what you want to do, then we'll

support you so I'm very lucky in
that and I said I still want to

finish both degrees. I think
it'll be useful. So I took a

break from Arden I just stopped
for a minute and jumped right

into jewelry metal smithing and
then I actually finished I

actually technically graduated
from my jewelry metal smithing

degree first and then I had my
final semester where I did a

couple night classes and I
student taught at a call at a

high school nearby. So yeah, it
was six years I went to

undergrad congratulation ish
both degrees. I am kind of proud

of this was super nice. Earlier
when I like was graduating

people were like, you know that
you have some of the most

credits from anyone that's ever
graduated from this school

because I took summer classes
every year because I was like, I

want to take everything. I love
school. Yeah. So

Kosta Yepifantsev: Can I ask a
little off topic? Like, what was

it like going to college in
Boston?

Brie Flora: It was fun. Yeah,

Kosta Yepifantsev: it was fun in
the city, too.

Brie Flora: Yeah, we're right in
the corner of like Longwood,

which is the financial district.

That's where like Children's
Hospital is and everything. And

right down the road. It's like
you're surrounded by colleges.

So BU is across town, but we
have Northeastern Wentworth

Emanuel just every Yeah, it's a
college town.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So you're
getting a degree in art. And

obviously, you have, you know,
business mind, because I looked

at your website, it's very
beautifully laid out. And you're

obviously selling jewelry. But I
am curious, like, were you

planning on making a living? If
it wasn't in teaching, were you

thinking like, okay, like, I can
do this, or in the back of your

mind where you like, I don't
know how I can monetize an art

degree.

Brie Flora: I'm still figuring.

I think a lot of artists,
especially when you some people

get lucky, right? And they just
like, especially now with

Instagram, it's like they just
hit it. And they have these

drops, right? Where they're just
selling out. And within minutes.

I mean, I have people I fall
where I'm like, Oh, my God, I

want this thing. And I like
wait, and then I try and get it

and it's everything sells out in
five minutes. I mean,

congratulations. That's amazing.

But that is not what most
artists deal with. So I do not.

Right now. I'm not making a
living solely off of selling my

work. Absolutely not. I work
part time for a nonprofit that

is in Massachusetts, where I
used to teach and do stuff

there. When I lived up there, I
facilitate online workshops. And

I teach online workshops. I'm
starting to teach more, and then

I help them with social media
and marketing.

Kosta Yepifantsev: Nice. What's
your website that you sell your

jewelry on?

Brie Flora: Mine is just brief.

laura.com Okay, so that's my
general gist. That's my website.

And then there's the silver
fern. shop.com. Okay. And we do

have an online store there. It's
growing, because it's just me,

so I have only worked on it so
much. So I have that I have the

out the shop, but I don't get
paid for anything. silverfern

right now. Okay. We're not at
that point. Yeah, I

Kosta Yepifantsev: see. Yeah.

And silverfern is by the MMA
place on spring. Yeah. 145 East

Spring Street. Fantastic. All
right, let's talk about the

local art community. So you've
entrenched yourself in the local

art community, you're helping to
grow and spearhead the

development of artists in Middle
Tennessee. Talk about art round

Tennessee, and your work as vice
president of their board.

Brie Flora: Sure. It's funny.

It's like I started 2021. I
joined around. And I will say

this, I'm vice president, and
I've never really I think I've

missed one meeting. But I as a
vice president, it's like, Oh,

it sounds like I have more to do
with what's going on than I

actually do. I will say it's
very much a group effort. Justin

Blackmon is our President right
now. And I'll say he's an

amazing president. And he's done
a lot. This last year, he was

great at organizing things.

Making things happen. We now
have brandy who is my co the co

owner at the silverfern and
Cassie, they work on the First

Fridays that have been
happening. So we have that

committee and volunteer and then
Emma Levitz, who I mentioned

before, I think we started and
then Jen Luna gendlin as the

executive director, and Emma is
like house forget her title,

because it's been up in the air.

But her and Jen are at the same
level. They just do different

jobs. Right. So like she works
on the website. And she just

does a lot they both do so much.

She does all the Emma does all
the grants, she applies for all

the grants that we get, and they
are not on the board. They are

the input like they are
employed. What is

Kosta Yepifantsev: like the
mission of all around like, what

are you guys trying to
accomplish for Tennessee, she

Brie Flora: read it straight off
the website, because I'll

disappoint everyone. But I'll
say in my words, like, we want

to create opportunity. So of
course, the last 20 years,

because I think last year was
the 20th anniversary, and it's

about bringing to light the
artists that are here, um,

because there's a ton Oh, yeah.

And giving them opportunities to
sell their work and show their

work. And now I think there's a
little bit of a turnover on the

board. There's new people,
right, like I'm new, I'm not

even from here, and neither is
Emma. Jen is Jen grew up here.

And so she has a lot of ties. So
there's like a mix of people who

have been in Cookeville their
whole life. And then there's

people who are new to Cookeville
and bringing in new ideas. And I

know that Jen and Emma are
working on another thing that we

want to put on next year, which
will be more of like information

so like sort of like a seminar
for artists, so people to come

talk business in relation to art
and things like that. The First

Fridays bringing that back this
year. They had done it a few

years ago but our Prowl, right?

That's like the big one. It
happens the second weekend of

November every single year that
Friday and Saturday, and it's

just about giving artists An
opportunity to sell their work

because it's, I mean, I guess in
a small town too, right? It's

like, How does someone start?

Sure. Now we're lucky because
we're a college town. But even

then, so our

Kosta Yepifantsev: leadership
Putnam group, there's four of

us. We just did the mural and
Baxter, and they had a ribbon

cutting during the Fall Harvest
Festival this past weekend. And

just seeing how proud people are
of that mural. And Manny, is the

person that painted it. He's
from Salina. He's painted a lot

of the murals around here, but
it's interesting when you talk

about the business of art, and
how people can find their niche.

And man, He sure has found his
niche because he works with

municipal governments. And he
paints murals. I mean, yeah,

like one and two, he's not gonna
He's not going to sway from what

he knows and what he's good at.

And it was interesting, and it
was very impressive watching him

talk about his career and how
he's grown his career. The whole

point that I'm trying to make
is, as you're talking about art

Prowl, and as you're talking
about bringing education to

artists, about how they can
break career, how hard has it

been for you to just get to
like, step one?

Brie Flora: Yeah. I mean, like,
my dad was a sales guy. Okay. I

did not follow in his footsteps.

But I think I probably got a
little bit of that from him and

your jokes, he goes, Well,
you're a salesperson, you gotta

go to art craft shows and sell
your work, and you got to talk

it up. But it is uncomfortable,
right. And it's like, I went to

art school, I didn't go to
business school. Artists need to

learn business, because they
learn all these skills, and they

get really good at art. And then
they're like, who go fly the

nest, leave college, and then do
something with that. But then no

one knows how to talk about
themselves. No one knows how to

sell themselves. And
unfortunately, that's what we

have to do. So yeah, I think
part of I will say what what I

like being a part of with around
Tennessee, and part of what I'm

trying to do at the silver fern
is create opportunities for

people to kind of fail or not
fail, but like to have a little

bit of failure. I mean, I won't
name names, but I've had some

artists in town, like they bring
in work and the quality is not

great, right? And I'll be like,
well, this might break. It's

good, but you want to bring this
back and fix it. And we have had

certain things like that junk
over. Certainly I will, I'll put

it in the shop. You know, I have
like a range of things. And then

we've they've learned from that.

And they've they've grown from
that. And they figured out

pricing, I help people price
their work, which is crazy to me

because I still struggle with
pricing my own work, but

everybody under prices is under
prices themselves. So it's like

I had a few people in my life.

When I was in college, put some
professors Moni grant court who

was a jeweler I worked for she
was a mentor to like learn those

things from right because I
don't necessarily learn it in

school in class, you learn it
from experience,

Kosta Yepifantsev: you know,
it's it's easier though. And I'm

not going to put words in your
mouth. But I think sales

selling, whether it's yourself
or your product is an art and

you need to be kind of have a
creative mind because it's like

a mixture of acting. Because
like what you do when you watch

like Netflix before you go to
bed, it may be like your true

self. Sorry, I'm projecting. But
the acting part is what people

want when they're buying
something. Obviously, your

product has to be very good. But
yeah, the point that I'm trying

to make is because you have kind
of this artistic and creative

side to you, you're probably
going to be able to be a better

salesman and pick it up faster
than most people.

Brie Flora: I don't know if
that's always true, though,

please.

Kosta Yepifantsev: We'll expand
on that though. What makes it

hard for you

Brie Flora: artists are weird.

We're all weird, right? We're a
bunch of weirdos and sometimes,

you know, I think I'm okay at
it. It gives me immense anxiety

because it is an acting thing. I
also was a waitress.

Kosta Yepifantsev: Nice. Did you
like that? No. How long did you

last? Three, four years? Oh,
wow. Yeah. only lasted three

days. So Oh, yeah, I'm there.

Yeah,

Brie Flora: I worked at the
country club at TCC. It's the

first country club in America.

It was crazy. Yeah. But that
being said, it's like you have

to be waiters. They're actors.

Right? You have to you have to
put on a front. Yeah. So that's

all that's exhausting. And I
will say some people even as

creative as they are right. But
creative brains. Sometimes

you'll be in your studio. But
how do you translate? Yeah, it's

not true for everyone. Yeah. And
that's not a bad thing.

Interesting. And that's why
galleries exist. Yeah. Because

not everyone can sell their own
work. Oh, that's

Kosta Yepifantsev: a good point.

Because they are like creative
in their space. But when they

leave like their their nest,
it's a totally different

Brie Flora: craft shows. And
that's where you're meeting the

actual artist and sometimes not.

But mostly I'd say 90% You're
meeting the artist, a gallery.

You're not meeting the artist.

You're meeting the gallery
owner.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So let's talk
about being a small business

owner and kind of scaling like
do you feel at this point, you

are scaling and curating your
craft to be marketable, and how

do other artists kind of follow
in your footsteps?

Brie Flora: That's such a hard
question. Um, I am always trying

to figure that out within my own
work, right, let me just talk

about just marketing, my
artwork, I am trying to get back

into drawing. And some of that
is drawing on metal with a

powder coating process that I
do, then some of it is just

sterling silver. Still, I'm
getting back into that. Because

the powder coating the color
work that you've probably saw on

my website that's 233 ish years
old, very new.

Kosta Yepifantsev: I thought it
was beautiful.

Brie Flora: Thank you. But I'm,
I'm a little squirrely and like

the way I work and so I have a
few different bodies of work. So

I have, you know, the silver
work, which is still funky, it's

still me, but it's a little more
refined, like maybe a classier

and higher priced thing. And
then there's the fun sort of

floral shapes and powdercoated
work. And now I have my newer

work, like my art jewelry, and
which is what I feel most

passionate about at times, which
is either sculptural, mostly

brooches, and they are
illustrated, so I'm wearing one

right now. And they're just fun.

I just don't really have to
like, think about it being worn,

right? So that's like, Okay, I
have a facet of myself. It's

like, you have to make jewelry.

You're a jeweler, and you have
to sell it. But then my true

self comes out. And I'm like,
well, in undergrad, I was making

sculptural stuff that just
rested on the body, like it was

sculpture, but it related to the
body. So I'm an artist who's

using jewelry as a means to try
and make work just as I'm trying

to teach my workshops. Yeah,
both of those are income right

in my head. So my jewelry is
still art, but it's not what I

joy or love doing. That's not
where I feel most creative,

okay, because I'm still thinking
about someone else. So when I'm

marketing those things, like how
do I like they're all together?

Asking me, you know, this is
just like a, you know, the, the

Royal how, right? And I think
it's just, it sounds corny, but

like, Instagram sucks, right?

Like, it just sucks. And we all
have to do it right. And I used

to let it get to me, like if I
made something that I really

liked, and I'd post it and
they'd be like, Oh, literally 25

likes great. Like, no one's
seeing this, what the heck, or

no one likes it. Yeah. And now
I'm just like, oh, I don't care

anymore. I'm just gonna stay
consistent. I'm gonna post

whatever I want. And I think for
artists, unfortunately, it's

like, Don't get caught up in
that, like, be good. And get

yourself in a schedule, like
either post once a week. And

that's what you're doing or post
three days a week. If you want

to do videos, do videos and
stick to that. But I would say

do whatever you want to be
consistent about it

Kosta Yepifantsev: is like
social media and Instagram and

Pinterest and Etsy. I mean, are
those the mediums that you

primarily use to sell your
product? I don't

Brie Flora: use Etsy. Okay. I
know some people that do I just,

I just personally don't, I
didn't like the look of it. And

I think it's full of not just
art anymore. It's not just

handmade anymore. So I didn't
want to be in all of that. And

then you're competing with a lot
of people. And then they do take

a cut, right? And it's just I
don't I wanted to full control.

So like my website is
Squarespace and I use their

design things. So I'm on
Squarespace, being part of

things like art round Tennessee,
right? I'm on their website

Society of North American
Goldsmith, that's shortened to

snag. I'm a member, and I'm also
on their directory. And then you

just have to get yourself out
there. Right, right. So you go

to craft shows, go to craft
shows, talk about your work.

Yeah, try and get into
galleries, if you're into

teaching workshops, teach
workshops, but yeah, Instagram,

in my opinion, and
unfortunately, tick tock now,

great ways of marketing yourself

Kosta Yepifantsev: and
inexpensive ways. You don't have

to travel. You know, you just
have to make a video right time

is money. There you go. I think
it's important for people that

are listening that want to have
a career as an artist to really

understand how many different
avenues you're taking. It's a

hustle. Yeah, just so that
somebody will say, Oh, yeah, I

like those earrings. I'm gonna
put those in our in our store.

Yeah, you know, which I think is
essentially, you know, when you

think of something like, Pardon
my ignorance, but like Brighton,

right, I mean, obviously, it's
jewelry, and it gained

popularity. And is that kind of
like

Brie Flora: Brighton. That's
right. Oh, it's,

Kosta Yepifantsev: I only know
it because my mother in law buys

at all time.

Brie Flora: It's like kinda like
Pandora. Kind of Yeah. Okay.

Kosta Yepifantsev: I have a
great story on Pandora. If we

have time. I want to tell I'm
gonna read it here. Okay, so

let's talk about your jewelry
specific. Okay, before we do

though, I do want to ask, Why
are art galleries? And

specifically like when you go on
vacation and they sell all those

pictures and paintings? Why are
they so expensive like 10 have

1000s of dollars for pictures
and paintings, like photographs.

Yeah, kind of, you know, like
you go to Key West and there's

galleries everywhere. Expensive,

Brie Flora: some are worth it.

Some are not, I'll say that, you
know, it's like, it's just is

what it is. It's sort of like
the, you know, the banana with

tape on the wall that went for
what? Almost a million dollars

or whatever it was. Art is crazy
in that sense. Um, paintings,

paintings and photographs. Well,
I don't do paintings and

photographs. It's hard to say I
have my wall. I have two uncles

who are painters. It is time.

And it is materials. But I will
say this, the gallery market.

It's a love hate relationship,
because I obviously I'm a

gallery manager now. But you
know, it's new. It's not like a

big gallery or anything. But
something to know when you go

into any store like that, like
so we were saying before, you

know, artists, a lot of artists
don't sell their own work. So

that's a gallery. Okay. Well,
they don't make all that money.

They just get a cut, they get a
cut, or did they sell 50%?

Really? Yeah. Wow, most
galleries most times, if unless

you are buying directly from an
artist, that artist is getting

50% of that number. Sometimes
they get 60%. Sometimes they'll

get 70%. It just depends on the
deal. And then you know, there's

wholesale, that's a whole other
thing. And even then Wholesale

is usually 50%. So

Kosta Yepifantsev: do you ever
buy paintings or gallery? Like I

have never

Brie Flora: bought I have bought
ceramics from a gallery before.

Everything I've bought from a
gallery has been under or at

$100 About because I'm not
rolling in the dough. And all of

my awesome artwork that I have
is a trades with other artists.

Nice.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So last
question, and then we're gonna

get back to it. Sure. Have you
ever considered looking at say,

for example, at Restoration
Hardware, okay, and this is just

my own personal preferences. So
you're probably thinking like,

this guy doesn't know what art
is. But like, Have you ever

thought about just creating the
pieces like you were talking

about sculpting and they have
those busts that they create in

those like pieces of block that
they I guess cheese? Well, maybe

maybe it's more on here, you
know, but I'm just saying like,

Have you ever thought about just
making and selling that because

I mean people like literally,
like you said sculpting I

immediately thought like, man,
it'd be cool to have like a

stone bust in like an office.

You know, like, like your Yeah,
like my dog. Well, that's an

urn, actually. So, full
disclosure, I had a black

Doberman that died named Pasha
and we bought a Doberman head.

You can see it on the now or
never podcast when we record

it's usually behind me on
YouTube on my YouTube channel,

and we put his ashes inside of
there.

Brie Flora: I have a necklace
with my dogs, Ashley.

Kosta Yepifantsev: I love that.

So anyway, the point I'm trying
to make is why not like Target

exactly what you know people
want.

Brie Flora: That is a lot
harder. Okay. It

Kosta Yepifantsev: is okay.

Yeah.

Brie Flora: Well, I mean, trying
to like, that's a man. I mean,

yeah, you could make what you
think everyone wants, then

that's a soul sucking for the
artists because, like, think

about everything that artists
does. It's part of them. Just

like we all have a little bit of
impostor syndrome. Every artists

a little narcissistic. I mean,
you have to admit that like,

we're not narcissists, but we
have narcissistic tendencies. I

will say, some might disagree
with me, but like you're making

art. Right? Right. You're
putting something into the world

that didn't exist before. So why
make something that everyone

already wants? It just doesn't?

That doesn't make sense to me. I
mean, that is part of my thought

of like, some of the jewelry I
do being like, Okay, this is

still me. But then how do I make
this thing and this is what I

hate? How do I make this wanted
by many? It's a balance, you

gotta find that in school. I had
more mass art. And honestly, I

feel happy I do. I'm happy about
this. I had a lot about craft.

So basic craft, I had to learn
how to like make my own tubing,

make my own hinges, totally
everything from scratch, like

nothing I make is pre bought.

Everything comes from wire, or
she or I melt something down. So

I feel so lucky. I learned those
skills. And then next to that it

was all about the concept. Yeah,
the art side of things. So a lot

of it was not about selling or
thinking about the customer. It

was more interest in art based.

Yeah, so

Kosta Yepifantsev: not how to
create a successful art

business. But that's a mean, I
guess that's something that you

learn outside of school. Now, on
your website. Your earrings

range anywhere from 65 to $185.

And I think it's important for
people to know when they could

go on Amazon and purchase a pair
of earrings for say, five to $15

why it's valuable to support
local artists and the difference

in what they're actually buying.

Yeah,

Brie Flora: I like to be really
candid about prices. So the

cheapest thing I've ever sold
that I've made myself with is

$20 and the most expensive thing
I've ever sold was 1200. Nice.

And not everything I make is on
my website right now because I'm

just like I said before juggling
a lot of jobs and after the

pandemic, things have just been
nuts. I'm slowly but surely

getting everything on there.

Yeah. I was thinking about this
this morning. I was trying to

think more about it, because we
could talk about this for a

whole hour. Sure. So sustainable
fashion, right? That's like,

really in right now. It's the
same idea. But I think it's a

little bit easier to think about
it in the perspective of an

artist. So as a society, people
are trying to buy clothing more

sustainable, but a lot of it is
still coming from these big

companies, and they're using
these words, and even then you

still don't know what you're
buying sometimes. Well, if you

buy from an artist, you know
exactly what you're buying.

Absolutely. The jewelry you can
get from Amazon or anywhere else

or even at some of these, like
fashion companies. Like if it's

gold, it's not real gold a lot
of the times or it's plated, you

know, some of these places are
it's plated or gold filled or

things like that. But where are
they getting the metal from? Are

they mining it?

Kosta Yepifantsev: Not
ethically? Yeah, like a conflict

territory or making it

Brie Flora: right? Yeah, I
worked for a company in

Nashville. I'm not going to say
the name. Their idea is good.

It's about supporting women. And
a lot of the women who worked in

the Nashville spot with me,
we're coming out of like, bad

situations, right? So they're
learning this skill, and getting

paid pretty well. I had to push
for like, ventilation, I had to

push for proper tools. So
they're not hurting themselves.

I was like, this is like an
ocean nightmare. And that was a

company that wanted to do good,
right? Yeah. And by the time I

left them, and they they're in a
much better place now. But it

was still just kind of like
sketch,

Kosta Yepifantsev: is it?

Because they had to have such a
low price point to sell their

jewelry, or sell their product?

Is that why they did

Brie Flora: it? Frank? It's
like, everybody wants to be the

cool thing, right? Yeah. So all
these fashion companies, they're

like, well, if we're gonna have
clothes, we also have to have

jewelry. And then we have to
this line of jewelry, and we're

going to be sustainable. And
we're going to be doing this for

women. And it's like, all these
positive good things. But in

reality, it's hard to do that.

And it's hard to do that, right?

I don't have an answer or like a
full opinion about that. But

they asked if I wanted to design
for them. And I was like, no,

not an absolutely not, I will
help train the new people. And

then I'll take your designs, and
I'll make prototypes. I worked

for them from home. And I would
make like 100 units of jewelry a

week, if not more. So it was
like a ring with a bar on it.

And that sort of stuff like
boring, whatever, what you were

kind of saying before what
everybody wants

Kosta Yepifantsev: such new.

Brie Flora: But like, you know,
so there's stuff like that. So

it's like when you think about
what you're buying, and all of

that was still like their price
points, those that stuff was

cheaper. Yeah. Why? Because you
had like 10 women making it in

an assembly line. But still not
properly. Like they honestly

weren't properly getting paid,
in my opinion. And it's not

sustainable. And some of them
were feeling sick. And then they

were like their burgers were
green because they're sanding

brass all day or like, you know,
and stuff like that. And and I

kept saying like, Yeah, I mean,
I deal with that my own studio

because I'm one person and I
know the risks. And I have masks

and I don't have proper
ventilation right now, but I

have a respirator and I can do
this, this and that. And it's my

body. I'm not forcing other
people to do this. So the price

thing is truly about the artists
time. Is it one of a kind, is it

not one of a kind and think
about this like you go to school

right for like say you're a
doctor and you go you do this

many years, then you go get your
Masters and you go get a

doctorate degree and you got to
pay off all those loans you put

in the time, I had a man come up
to me at a craft show once being

like it was I think a necklace
and it was like $800 And he was

like, why is this $800 I could
get this online and he was just

being really rude. And I was in
a sassy mood that day. But I was

just kind of like well look like
I went to college. Yeah, I put

in my time. I was an unpaid
intern for six months and then I

got that job and I worked my way
up. How long do you think this

took me to make sure it's sweat
equity? Right? And then also how

much silver do you think is here
right now let's weigh that out.

How much time do you think I put
into my marketing how much money

I spend on boxes, packaging,
everything it because most

artists are everything right? So
like even with the silver fern,

we paid a local artist Jesse
Phil to to design our logo for

us. But other than that, Brandi
and I do everything, so I do

everything. silverfern I do
everything for myself. I work

part time for a nonprofit. I
volunteer for a number I'm on

the board of a nonprofit. So
it's like, you know, yeah, yeah,

no, I for someone's job because
I don't have a salary. I don't

have health insurance. I have
health insurance. I have to pay

for it right and it's crazy.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So when you
were Making 100 pieces of

jewelry working for that company
in Nashville. How many pieces do

you typically feel comfortable
making in you feel like you're

putting out your best product
and best effort without just

like blowing up? Yeah,

Brie Flora: it depends on what
I'm making. Okay, I used to hand

pierced, which means HANSOL
HANSOL. Okay, everything. So

like all those floral pieces go
on my website. And you know,

it's the kind of this like
abstract flower, all those

negative spaces, I would drill
the holes feed through the tiny

little sawblade and handsaw
everything, I have three bulging

discs in my neck and a old
shoulder injury. So I was like,

I can't keep doing this, right.

And I also missed doing that
more one of a kind stuff. So I

did start laser cutting, I made
a file of all my designs of

those types of designs. And I
use a company called Send, cut,

send, and I can get them laser
cut. So they're rough cut, but

they're all cut. So I usually
have to like stand them down, I

still do all the soldering and I
powder coat everything at home,

I have a try powder coat setup.

So some of my prices of that
work dropped a bit, okay, and

people told me not to do that
they were like, don't drop your

prices. And I was like, Look, I
want people to be able to buy my

work. And this is allowing me to
make you know, my silver work

again, or like the brooches I've
been doing that are more one of

kind that will range from 100 to
$2,000. Right. So like, make my

art stuff, anything that's like
$800 or more honestly, a lot of

artists are like I'm making
this, but I don't know when I'm

gonna sell it. I'm not like
banking on this selling. It's an

art piece that I really want to
make. And if it sells that's

amazing. That's how I think
about it. Absolutely.

Kosta Yepifantsev: We did a
podcast when we first started

with a lady who focused on
sustainable fashion. And she was

essentially talking against fast
fashion. Yeah. And so you kind

of have bring the perspective of
sustainable jewelry.

Brie Flora: It's a dormant, it's
fashion, right? Let's steal that

perfect.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So I mean,
what do you think society needs

to do to pivot away from $5
earrings on Amazon that look

like $15,000 You know, earrings,
because I'll be honest with you

when I was a kid, like I bought
those $5 rocks, and I put them

in my ear and I'd Pearson and
and to walk around. So like what

do you how do you do that?

Brie Flora: Education? Also, I
don't want to knock that stuff.

Because at the same time, it's
like rights privilege, right?

Not everyone can afford this
stuff. So there's the

understanding of that. And that
then creates a very different

conversation about privilege and
what's going on in our country

right

Kosta Yepifantsev: now. We could
spend a whole nother podcast

talking about a knock.

Brie Flora: Like I have friends
that buy you know, cheap

jewelry. I'm not offended by
that. Not every not my work is

not for everyone. And you know
if somebody questions the price

and is rude about it, sometimes
I'll say Well, hey, I can't even

afford my own work. But this is
this is my work. And yeah, it's

such a conversation. It's such a
hard one. And then there's the

you know, kids too, it's like
are you going to discourage a

kid if they want to use their
allowance to express themselves?

I've bought really cheap fun
made brooches or earrings by

certain artists or crafts people
right? Like maybe they don't

have the same background as me
but truly the quality maybe

isn't as nice maybe it'll fall
apart in a year or two. But if I

look at it, and it makes me
laugh, or it makes me smile, I'm

gonna buy it right. So I don't
know it's such an it's such a I

think it's society it's
education. So they at least know

what they're doing right? You
know what you're doing you know

what you're doing when you're
ordering towels from Amazon

versus this was hand woven, blah
blah blah but like not everyone

can do that. Right?

Kosta Yepifantsev: 50% of
Americans can't even afford a

$400 emergency expense. So I
mean, they probably aren't going

to be buying you know, $200
earrings

Brie Flora: which we could talk
about the silverfern in that way

because Brandi and I want to a
support artists and makers and

small businesses because it's
not just art in there. It's also

handcrafted wellness. So brandy
brings the wellness side I bring

the art side we do have some CBD
tinctures we have just like SAVs

and we have skincare we have
small batch skincare. We've got

loose leaf tea and herbs and
things like that. And it is all

ethic that's our mission. Like
everything in here is handmade

and ethically sourced. So yeah,
not everyone is going to come to

us for a card or a print or a
cup right? Because it's probably

maybe a little bit more
expensive than some other

places. There are some other
awesome stores in town that are

great boutiques that you can get
gifts but let me tell you what

not all of that is made in
America, if not all of it is not

made in the American Yeah, so
this is all 50% is made either

in Cookeville or in surrounding
areas. Nice. So you're

supporting us as a small
business, but you're also

supporting many artists, or it's
people I've just met doing shows

around the country. So some
people, I went to school with

some people I met at craft
shows, and I got their card, and

I reached out to them, and that
is consignment.

Kosta Yepifantsev: So as you're
talking, I'm picking up on all

of the things that you're
involved in. I'm trying to like

quantify the amount of time that
it probably takes you to do all

of these things. And I'm
starting to like run out of

available time. In my head.

After this podcast, you're about
to travel to a craft show. I'd

like to kind of ask you about
the emotional toll that it takes

the feeling of kind of
overwhelming pressure, and how

does that affect your ability to
be creative and design new

things on a daily basis?

Brie Flora: Yeah, it really
affects it at times, pandemic,

man, I got depressed, I will
fully admit that some artists

were like, well, I'm home. I'm
just going to make work. My

studio is at my house. And I
tried for a while and I did some

Instagram sales. I was I was
lined up to do 20 craft shows

that year around the country. It
was gonna be my biggest year, I

had been doing it for like three
years. So I was still fairly

new, you know, getting out, and
I lost every single one of them.

They all got cancelled. And I
had no other form at the time of

income. Yeah, so I was just kind
of like, oh my god, what am I

doing? So what do you do? Um,
like I said, I did a lot of

Instagram sales. I was just
like, discount heavy discount my

work, like every artists was
just like, Please buy something.

Kosta Yepifantsev: I mean, you
got to pay rent, and yeah, eat

sale sale.

Brie Flora: Then I taught some
online workshops. I applied for

some small grants. I got a
little bit of help from family.

You know, I was lucky. But yeah,
it was really tough. It was

super tough. But that's when I
got my part time job back with

metalworks. So like jewelers
were teaching full like stone

setting classes online casting
online enameling. I just

finished teaching a three week
one day a week. But the process

I do with powder coating and
illustrating on top of powder

coating, I had 15 students in my
class. And it's tricky because

you're not with them. And you
have to have like, set up all

these cameras situations with
your phone, and it's on Zoom.

It's all on Zoom live, right? So
I started doing that. And then

Brandi and I, she I go to her
for acupuncture. She's an

acupuncturist. So all those
injuries I talked about before

we became friends, and she was
nice. You need to see an

acupuncturist. And I was like,
Oh, well, that actually helped.

And she was like, wouldn't have
gotten my master's if it hadn't.

And I was like, Oh, you're that
I felt like such an idiot. But

she's amazing. It has changed my
life. So that was part of why I

was like, Hey, would you ever
want to work out of like the

back of a gallery or shop and
you know, I think she was happy

where she was before. But she
definitely wanted to change. And

she wanted to focus also more on
some of the herbs and tinctures

that her clients were wanting
and expand on that. So when I

said that, she goes, Yes, let's
do it. And you know, she's 10

years older than me. So she has
more experience with being a

small business owner and like
doing her own thing, and I have

the creative brain, but I am
business oriented, but she

reigns me and I will say that

Kosta Yepifantsev: and I think
essentially, if I could

summarize kind of what you just
said, even though it was

extremely difficult the pandemic
and the changing environment and

the amount of work that you've
had to do back Yeah, bounce back

and you never let it get you
down.

Brie Flora: I did though I did.

And I carry I'm going to
therapy. Hell you should all

everybody go therapy. So what's
helped me with the stress it is

making time it is like all that
I work every day. But some days

I'll work a half day or some
days I'll work just a few hours.

You feel

Kosta Yepifantsev: guilty when
you do. Yes, I do too. I do.

Everybody does. I feel like
that's grinding.

Brie Flora: But ya know, it's
like bouncing out knowing that

you can't work yourself to the
ground. I started playing tennis

again. That's been great.

Because that was like a big part
of my childhood. I was art and

tenant like I did a lot of
sports but I was also deep into

art. So that's been nice. Just
getting outside going for walks.

Yeah, there's a lot there's I'm
still figuring it out.

Kosta Yepifantsev: Thank you so
much for coming. I mean, this

has been just an absolutely
fantastic conversation. I

honestly never thought that I'd
be this interested talking about

art, but I just can't wait to
learn more. I can't wait to meet

your friend Emma. Who does the
starving. Oh gosh. And I'm going

to ask her if she's like down to
carve like buslee Because I want

one that Jessica is gonna get
mad when she hears this because

you know, I keep trying to input
some design features on this

house that we're remodeling. But
babe, if I could just have like

a bust to put in the office. I
would be so happy anyway. Yeah,

we always like to end the show.

on a high note, who is one
person that makes you better

when you're together?

Brie Flora: That's a hard
question. And I know we have to

wrap up. So I'd say my community
in general, it's just hard to

pick one person. I'm lucky that
I have so many artists, friends

that inspire me all the time.

You know, Brandy is a business
partner, my partner, David, he's

great, but I guess one if I had
to pick one person, it would

honestly be my dad. Like he's my
best friend. He's not an artist.

He's always been supportive. We
are super nerdy. He's actually

going to come visit in October
and get his first tattoo. We're

both getting Lord of the Rings
tattoos together. So um, that's

my I would say my dad. Yeah.

Morgan Franklin: Thank you for
joining us on this episode of

Better Together with Kosta
Yepifantsev. If you've enjoyed

listening and you want to hear
more, make sure you subscribe on

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leave us a review or better yet,
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friend. Better Together with
Kosta Yepifantsev is a Kosta

Yepifantsev Production. Today's
episode was written and produced

by Morgan Franklin post
production mixing and editing by

Mike Franklin. Want to know more
about Kosta visit us at

kostayepifantsev.com. We're
better together!