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Modern Multifamily is an interview-style podcast where we talk with leaders across the Multifamily industry about ways we can keep moving it forward. Topics include and are not limited to: technology, innovation, proptech, and improving renter experiences with a focus on positive impacts on both industry operators and suppliers.
Modern Multifamily — Dana Pate (Founder/CEO, Stitched Marketing) with Mike Wolber
Recorded 2026-09-10
Mike (0:01)
Dana Pate, welcome to Modern Multifamily.
Dana Pate (0:04)
Mike Wolber, thanks for having me.
Mike (0:06)
I'm fired up. You are the first guest as I'm bringing the podcast back. And we just spent a little bit of time talking about why I'm doing it. But before we jump in, Dana, I just want to say thanks. I think of you as one of the leaders in the industry. You've done a couple incredible things over your career, including scaling up one of the biggest, baddest management companies, and now successfully making the transition into building your own business while you touch both sides of our industry. So we'll have a lot to talk about, but I'm excited to dig in today.
Dana Pate (0:35)
Yeah, well, I am incredibly flattered. When you texted me literally, like, twenty-four hours ago, I feel like, and you were like, "I'm bringing the podcast back. I want you as my first guest." I was like, okay, no pressure. I'll bring it. But the feeling is absolutely mutual. I've followed your career as well, and you've done some incredible things and continue to. So I'm stoked to record one of our many amazing conversations that we've had.
Mike (0:56)
For sure. Let's jump in. Let's start a little bit with where you're at today, and then we'll jump back. I do want to talk to you a little bit about, like, your time at RangeWater. But you're building Stitched Marketing, and I think you're doing a good job of building this in-public consultancy where you're, you know, straddling both customer operations as well as engaging with a lot of the leading technology businesses in multifamily and proptech. Just tell us a little bit about the story of Stitched Marketing.
Dana Pate (1:03)
Sure.
Dana Pate (1:09)
Thanks.
Dana Pate (1:22)
Yeah. Where to start? This could be a long... this could be the entire podcast. Yeah. So I was on the PMC side, like you had mentioned, for about 15 years or so. And so in launching Stitched about two and a half years ago, which is crazy to think about. It's like a baby. Like, the days are long, but the years are short. I feel like it was literally just yesterday. I was at a point in my career when I launched Stitched that I
Dana Pate (1:49)
found myself directing more than doing. And I missed kind of getting my hands back into things. And so I actually interviewed with a couple of different groups when I was thinking through that transition and just couldn't find the right fit. I was very fortunate where I was previously that I had a great, like, balance. I really enjoyed the people I was working with and the work I was doing. But when you scale and you grow and you change in your career, you know, your perspective just changes and your definition of success changes. And so
Dana Pate (2:17)
in launching Stitched, I do walk a very fine line between the property management company world that I came from and the owner-operator side, and now the supplier-vendor side, which is the most incredible challenge. And being able, to your point, to, like, straddle the line, but see behind the curtain and understand the perspectives of both. Like, "Hey, we have a solution to a problem we think you're having." And then me being able to identify if it's truly a problem and for which groups it's a problem for.
Dana Pate (2:45)
So it's kind of like a matchmaking play where I get to work with groups on both sides, but then essentially bring them together to figure out their tech stack, to optimize their marketing team and their marketing efforts, and really just impact more than one company. That's been the most incredible thing. But it's also been very nice to walk downstairs to my office instead of drive an hour and a half in traffic each way when I was working in Atlanta.
Mike (3:12)
Is this your first time working remote?
Dana Pate (3:15)
Yes, yeah. I always had a nice car because I was like, listen, I cannot sit in this traffic and not at least have a nice leather interior and a good podcast to listen to.
Mike (3:25)
Sure. This is my first time working remote as well. And I think there's way more pros than cons, especially, like, as you're raising littles, like we both are. And I am curious, though, as you just think about, like, building this business. I've engaged with so many consultants over the years, and so many, like, come in, they, like, give you a couple ideas, but they don't actually, like, do anything for your business. And outside looking in, it feels like you're actually, like, doing the work when you engage. Like, you're either
Mike (3:53)
building an event strategy and executing it for a PMC, or you're, like, augmenting a go-to-market for a technology business and actually changing the way that the market perceives them, like, from a consumer perspective, like LinkedIn and in person. I have to assume you're being selective along the way too about how you're, like, picking and choosing. So tell me a little bit about, like, that side.
Dana Pate (4:01)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (4:12)
I am now. That has been, yeah, there was some early mistakes that I made. I think I was so nervous that I wouldn't get a lot of yeses that I said yes to every opportunity that came across my inbox, to the point where I started finding myself, you know, working with really great people and really great companies, but the alignment sometimes wasn't always there, or, like, my project scope. I was like, "Yes, I, yeah, absolutely, I can also do that."
Dana Pate (4:40)
But then when it came down to it, I was like, this isn't bringing me a lot of joy. It's actually not as impactful to the business as you probably think it is. And I'm glad that it looks like I'm doing a lot of the work, because I definitely feel like I am. I'm a team of one. I have a couple of independent contractors that do some reporting or some, you know, creative work for me here and there. From an IRS perspective, though, my husband and my children do work for Stitched. So they send some packages on occasion.
Dana Pate (5:07)
They post for some Instagrams for me. And they handle a little bit of the finances. We'll see how that works out with accounting this year. But I really feel like those early clients that I had helped form. And so now I am much more specific, to your point. Like, it's my name and my reputation that helped get me in the door, but it's also my name and reputation that's going to help continue me being able to consult.
Dana Pate (5:34)
And so the second I start getting myself into, like, a sticky situation where I'm like, hey, like, from a value perspective or from a reputation perspective, this just doesn't feel like we're going in the same direction. It feels very much like a relationship. Like, it's like, I would love to be friends, but I just don't see us pursuing this any further. And so there have been some breakups on both sides, I would say, and taking that kind of on the chin and looking for the next opportunity. And
Dana Pate (6:03)
again, I've been very fortunate that there hasn't really been any gaps in that perspective. So when one door closes, one door has truly opened. I've always been a fairly optimistic person too. So I think it's one of those, like, if you think of the glass as half full, then good things are gonna happen to you. And I'm like, listen, this situation happened and it didn't work out for this reason, but it also now leads me to learn from that. I can, you know, reconstruct my scope of work for the next group. And also, like, again,
Dana Pate (6:32)
be choosy with who I align myself with.
Mike (6:36)
Do you think through it, like, I'm curious, if you look at proptech specifically, then we can maybe talk a little bit about how you support management and, like, owners or owner-operators. Do you think about it at all in terms of, like, hey, I can only work with one company per category? Do you find yourself working with competitors ever? I've always wondered on that side, like, man, if we share our secret sauce, even if we're, like, under NDA, like, is this person also advising, like, a core competitor on their go-to-market or positioning? That's, like, always, like, a spicy side. Like, how do you handle that?
Dana Pate (7:02)
Yeah, that is an excellent spicy question that, full force, I have had to deal with some of that as of late. And I also think that because the proptech space, very similar to the PMC side, there's a lot of acquisitions happening. There's a lot of, like, "Hey, we also expand over here into different product types and different regions." It's the same thing happening on the proptech side, where, hey, we were just this one thing. We were a one-point solution, but now we naturally see, like,
Dana Pate (7:32)
our business model growing. And I've been with a few companies that the project started as one thing. And then very quickly into the relationship, they were like, "Hey, pivot. We're actually going to also be doing this and adding this scope." And it's gotten a little messy from my perspective, from, like, an ethics perspective, right? Like, it goes back to the reputation piece, where I don't want to align myself with every single company. I want to make sure that the ones that I'm choosing
Dana Pate (8:00)
are authentic. Like, I believe in the product, I believe in the people. I see that it's a solution for my friends on the PMC side. And so I think as more companies have scaled outward into different categories than they originally maybe were, the box that they had, that has gotten messier. And I will say that I have been trying my best to manage that in terms of, when I see that happening, be very upfront
Dana Pate (8:26)
that, hey, like, I just want to let you know that I have another client over here that's doing this, this, and this. I don't work with, you know, 20 different groups. So it is nice. I try and keep my number around, like, five or six during one given, let's say, phase, to make sure that I'm not overstepping. But it's definitely getting trickier, which leads me to invite more people to join the consultancy space, because I would love to be able to be like, "Hey, unfortunately I've already got a group that kind of
Mike (8:49)
For sure.
Dana Pate (8:55)
meets those needs, but I would love to, you know, show you somebody else that can help you out there."
Mike (9:02)
Yeah, Sarah Graham did a post earlier this week kind of just talking about, like, whether or not it seems crowded. And I feel very similar about, like, the podcast space as I do the consultancy space. I think there are a lot of people in it, but I think there are only a couple winners. And I think there's a lot more room for people to really go full send versus to, like, put their pinky finger into it. So to me, like, you have a better perspective here, but I think there's room to run here for people to come in, two to three X their W-2 income quite quickly.
Dana Pate (9:04)
Yes.
Dana Pate (9:22)
Yes.
Dana Pate (9:31)
Yes.
Mike (9:31)
And also, like, really build something that could change generations for their family. Do you disagree, or do you see it the same way?
Dana Pate (9:37)
I 1000% agree. I think it would be more of a fun conversation if I disagreed, but I'm right there with you. Like, the more the merrier. And I know that's a very, like, you know, pageant queen response, but it's so true. Like, what I do really well, or what I've grown, my, like, my niche that I found now is very different than two years ago when I started Stitched, that I was saying yes to everything. And so now as projects and as people reach out, I always still say yes to the conversation. But then I am very selective of if I'm going to actually put a proposal together, or
Mike (9:42)
Okay.
Dana Pate (10:07)
if this is really... they might think they need something from me, but when I'm talking to them, I'm like, I think actually it sounds like you need more, like, sales support. Let me refer you to somebody that specifically does that. Or if you want a website redone, maybe yes, I can do it. But again, like, is that the best use of my time, your time? Let me refer you to somebody that's a specialist in that regard. And that's where I think, like, the more the merrier in that space. But to your point, it also can look very easy.
Mike (10:35)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (10:35)
And I think LinkedIn has a way of, it's any social media, right? Like, here are all the amazing parts of my life. Yeah, like, we're traveling, we're partying, we're getting swag, like, look, we're all, like, buddies around a conference table. I love when posts, and Sarah does also a great job of this too, so big shout-out to her, but I love when people get real about it, because it's a lot of hard work and a lot of late nights and a lot of checking your ego at the door.
Mike (10:42)
Yeah, for sure. Yeah.
Dana Pate (11:03)
Because I will say, as a consultant, they don't have to take your recommendation, right? And you can't feel a personal way around that. You just need to be like, okay, well, this is... you're paying me for my opinion and a plan and an execution strategy. And if you'd like to go a different way, then maybe we should go a different way, right? And that's how some of those relationships have steered. But
Mike (11:24)
Cool. That's, like, a really cool perspective. I have two kind of more topics I want to hit on in the consultancy world before we talk about RangeWater. First, I've seen so many people, we both know them, who have made the transition, been super public about it, and then very quietly, didn't do a big announcement, but they're back to being a director or a VP of property marketing or a COO or whatever it might be within, like, three to six months. Like, they failed and they didn't own it and they just, like, moved right back. What makes people fail?
Dana Pate (11:30)
Yeah.
Dana Pate (11:40)
Yeah.
Mike (11:54)
Like, when they go after this. Like, I'm really curious, because we've probably seen a hundred people we both know make a big splash about, like, winding down. "It's gonna be amazing. I'm going out on my own." And then, like, a quarter later, they're back to, like, mid-market property operating, which is great. Like, they're good at it. But, like, why do people fail when it comes to really going for this type of consultancy, fractional work, whatever you want to call it?
Dana Pate (12:00)
Yeah.
Dana Pate (12:20)
Yeah, I think there can be, you know, a plethora of options there. I think a lot of it has to do with setting the right expectations when you go out on your own. I mean, if I had a dollar for every time somebody was like, "It's so great, you're your own boss now." Absolutely not. I'm not my own boss. If anything, I report to more people now, because every client is now a new, you know, group that I'm working with. I have my point of contact, but then there's also the inner workings and politics of each company
Dana Pate (12:50)
that you're, you know, slowly unraveling as you're getting in the door. I think there's also the misconception that, again, because you're out on your own, you make your own schedule, you do your own things. You do miss out. And the things that I do miss about the other side is the team aspect, right? Like, I'm a part of many teams now, but I'm also not a true part of that, right? Like, so yes, I can wear the logo, I can wear the T-shirt, but that camaraderie that comes with, like, we are all one thing,
Dana Pate (13:20)
hundred percent in on this. This is our North Star. This is what we're running towards. We're showing up to events together. We're celebrating wins. We're pivoting around losses. Right? Like, there's a specialness that has that, when you're on your own, yes, I have a lot of, like, friends and cheerleaders that support me. And you've always been, like, an incredible advocate for me, and I appreciate you so much. But that only goes so far. And it's hard, too, whenever you have a problem.
Mike (13:46)
Sure.
Dana Pate (13:50)
It's like I come home and I, you know, my husband, Kevin, comes in the door and I'm just like, "I have this whole thing." He's like, "I don't know what you're talking about. I can't help you." Like, I don't know what... I'm like, "I just want you to listen," right? Like, I'm like, let's, like, throw some spaghetti at a wall to fix this. And he doesn't understand it. And so not having, like, a counterpart to bounce things off of. I mean, I guess Claude is that to me now, but it only goes so far, right?
Mike (14:11)
Oh god.
Mike (14:15)
Yeah, I mean, they say it's lonely at the top from a seniority perspective, which, the more senior my career's gone, I definitely agree with that. But I also think there's probably not a lot of empathy for, it's also lonely when you're on your own and you're a team of one with a few part-time contractors. And now instead of one boss, you have 50 bosses. So that makes a ton of sense. That work dynamic is largely different. There's no playbook for it. And it's probably a rude awakening for a lot of people. And they jump to the other side and realize,
Dana Pate (14:19)
Well, well.
Dana Pate (14:35)
Yes.
Dana Pate (14:41)
Yes, yes.
Mike (14:45)
"I actually had it pretty good over here."
Dana Pate (14:47)
Yes, yeah. Like, the grass is definitely not always greener. And I definitely do not, you know, look poorly on them for trying, because just having the guts to try and go out on your own is, like, half the battle. And I even told myself, I gave myself a six-month window, essentially. I was like, if I make, you know, if I make no money and nothing comes of this, I know I can always go back. And that's, like, the safety net of multifamily. It's so relationship-driven that, like, wherever you fall, you're gonna
Mike (15:09)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (15:16)
fall somewhere. Someone's going to catch you. It might not be the person you thought was going to, but someone's gonna catch you. And so I think going into it with that perspective, but you have to check your ego at the door. I think it also goes back to what I mentioned earlier, too. You get on this side and you don't have the title anymore. You don't have, like, the clout. You don't have a lot of the authority. Like, one of the things that I do at Stitched is, you know, go into smaller marketing teams and mentor them and build them up and,
Dana Pate (15:42)
you know, position them so that they have a lot more clout in the organization and thinking more strategically. But when I go in there, like, I'm not their boss either. So, you know, depending on how that relationship unfolds, again, I'm making recommendations. I'm not giving directives. And so that can be hard for someone who's used to giving the orders and people following through and reporting up to them. And it's like, no, I actually, I'm doing a lot of the work. Like, there's not an assistant. There's not, like, a junior marketing manager I can throw this to. So it
Mike (16:11)
For sure. That's huge. I'm gonna save the last question for the very end. I just, like, want to talk to you a little bit about, like, who your ICP is, but we'll, like, make that the closing. Let's shift back to your, like, most recent run on the management side. You went from around 40,000 to around 90,000 units between 2019 and 2024. And if we just, like, pause really quick and, like, look around the industry, we are seeing so much consolidation. And we talked about this a couple of weeks ago on our advisory call,
Dana Pate (16:12)
It's just different.
Dana Pate (16:38)
Yes. Yep.
Mike (16:41)
just around, like, management companies getting gobbled up. We're seeing a lot of companies actually consolidate marketing under ops and remove the marketing function, I think purely out of forcing functions of budgets. But you experienced, like, hypergrowth, like very few people have. You were part of a winning team. We're also seeing a lot of losing teams right now. If you were just to, like, synthesize that experience, I'm just curious. Like, we can walk through this.
Dana Pate (16:51)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (17:01)
Mm. Yep.
Dana Pate (17:08)
Yeah.
Mike (17:08)
What were some of the, like, lessons as you, like, built the plane while you were flying it? And you went from... yeah, like, I just, like, love to hear what that was like.
Dana Pate (17:12)
We were absolutely, yeah, building the plane. That was absolutely the analogy that we used in most of our meetings when we were talking about pipeline. We were like, all right, what's broken now? Like, just fix it so we can keep going. Yeah, I joined the team in 2012. So I was right before even, like, that big growth spurt. So I saw the company, in the, you know, decade-plus that I was there, go from four properties to 400. And that, to your point, like... but I will say that I didn't know any better.
Dana Pate (17:42)
So when I graduated college, I got right into student housing. I went from student housing to a conventional lease-up, worked my way up to the corporate office at Greystar. That's where I met some of, like, the Tracy Bowers, who took me under her wing with Matrix and RangeWater eventually. And in that, like, trajectory, I hopped so quickly up the chain, which again is another nod to multifamily, that when people see talent, like, things move so fast that you can really grow. Because we were
Dana Pate (18:11)
running so fast, and I didn't have a slower group to compare it to. I was like, this must be how it always is. This is just normal. So my normal was doing, like, seven pitches a week and traveling to different cities and, you know, working really late as a team, but, to your point, celebrating hard and, like, winning and going after it. And I didn't know any better and I loved it. Like, that was definitely, like, that's that entrepreneurial spirit. Like, it was a startup and we grew it.
Dana Pate (18:39)
And then as that changeover happened, like, I mean, to your point, growing a team was the most rewarding, but also the most challenging. And I learned so much along the way by making tons of mistakes, but also having great conversations with peers and other people in the industry that were kind of growing along with me. Those were, like, the most impactful years. And those were really, like, I look back at those days very, very fondly.
Dana Pate (19:05)
And even the missteps, again, going back to, like, the optimism factor. Like, even the missteps of things that I was challenged by, and me eventually leaving, right? I left on the best of terms, because those relationships, like, I still go back to. They still hire me. So it's, you know, great to be able to work with them, but just on a different side. But that hypergrowth, it takes a special person to be in a startup versus, you know, an established company. Very similar to when you're on site,
Mike (19:20)
For sure.
Dana Pate (19:34)
a stabilized property manager is not the same as a lease-up manager. And so you really have to have that mindset of, hey, things are gonna break and we're gonna fix them. But nothing's gonna be perfect, and that's okay.
Mike (19:38)
Mm-hmm.
Mike (19:46)
I love that. That's so quotable. I'm curious, like, marketing back then versus marketing now. I know it's only been a couple years since you left, but AI has become a thing. And it was not a thing. It kind of feels to me like we feel like we've made a bunch of steps forward in terms of how marketing is being run for property teams, but, like, between you and me and the thousands of people that are gonna listen to this episode, I
Dana Pate (19:55)
Yeah, I'll have it. Yeah.
Mike (20:12)
I really don't think that we've actually taken that many steps forward in terms of how, like, marketing decisions are being made. There's still a lot of spreadsheets. We're still using CRMs to, like, gauge what sources are working, even though we all know the property website was not the driver of that guest card. So I'm just curious, like, as you look at where we were a few years ago versus where we are now, I'm still feeling palpably frustrated about how decisions are being made, especially as an operator at Apartment List.
Dana Pate (20:19)
Yep.
Dana Pate (20:27)
Yes.
Dana Pate (20:36)
Yes.
Mike (20:41)
I'm curious, like, how you're seeing it as you're coming in and you're helping multiple PMCs augment marketing strategy. What's going on? Like, why are things still moving so slow as it relates to, like, marketing optimization, improving spend, making faster-paced decisions? It feels like we're moving too slow.
Dana Pate (20:46)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (20:57)
I know. We are, and I am 1000% in agreement there. Like, the frustration is real. I would say, I think on my side now, seeing how other PMCs operate, because I do work with several and I have over the last couple of years, there's two different camps that I see them in. There's one, there's the larger groups that now have just so much red tape around every decision. To your point, like,
Dana Pate (21:22)
marketing is now being absorbed under ops, or every marketing decision goes to operations, goes to legal. Like, there's so many more steps with those bigger groups. And that's, I think, for a number of reasons, like compliance, legalities, regulations. Like, there's so much that's tied now to what is publicly, you know, shown on a website that's just not as simple as it was. Where some of the smaller groups are so hesitant to bring in change. Like,
Dana Pate (21:48)
I have one client that I'm working for now, and they're gonna listen to this, and I say this with love, and they know that I'm frustrated about this. I've just been trying to get a reputation management tool for their portfolio for a year and a half now. I've introduced lots of different groups. We've had lots of demos. Like, I'm like, this is a missing piece of what is going to help us, like, get to the next level, to help aggregate reviews, respond, like, just something simple. Let's use technology for good, right? And I cannot get that over the finish line. And so, but both of those groups, just, they
Mike (21:54)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (22:18)
they move so slow, but for different reasons. And so I think that's where, like, the technology adoption, where there's so many great proptech companies that are coming out of people's garages, you know, every single day, or there's other groups like yours where, you know, they're seeing the problem and they're making innovations and investments to, you know, solve those inner workings to make the product better and to really expand their reach. But at the same time, like, the decisions are just so slow to adopt.
Mike (22:26)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (22:45)
And then you have the adoption of the technology. Just because the contract is signed does not mean that you have buy-in from the people that are using it. And so I think that's where you're getting a lot of conflict. And because we always say, like, you know, we're always, multifamily is so behind on technology, from, like, even, like, a mom-and-pop perspective. Like, we do have some antiquated ideas around, well, we're not fully occupied. We must need more leads. We need more traffic.
Mike (22:49)
Mm.
Dana Pate (23:12)
That's still the number one question. When I get brought into, like, a portfolio or a struggling property, they're like, "Well, we just need more leads. And if we have more leads, then we'll solve it." And I'm like, or it could be, like, let me get my list of other issues that I uncovered during an audit process. And so we're asking the same questions that we asked 10 years ago. And if we keep asking the same questions, we're gonna get the same answers. And so it's just, like, this ongoing cycle of, you know, minimal growth to that extent.
Mike (23:25)
Yeah.
Mike (23:41)
Yeah, I think about this all the time, because I actually think I could come into a property management company, even though I've never worked for a PMC, and I think I could really help these teams think differently about whether or not you have, like, a demand problem or a conversion problem when it comes to just, like, how you manage a sales team. Because I think about, like, my business, I always think about leading indicators of outcomes. I don't think about
Dana Pate (23:58)
Yes.
Dana Pate (24:05)
Mm-hmm.
Mike (24:07)
conversion rate. I'm thinking about my pipeline coverage. I'm thinking about how many demos a seller's running in a given day. I'm thinking about response time. And all of that stuff happens way before quota or revenue. And it kind of feels like, because times have been so good for such a long time, that the industry is still learning how to, like, pick up intensity, pick up the speed in which they inspect.
Dana Pate (24:12)
Yeah.
Dana Pate (24:26)
Mm-hmm.
Mike (24:30)
But also, to your point, understand that because you purchase technology doesn't mean the technology's gonna, like, do anything for you. And, like, this requires a handshake with your vendor partners to make sure that you're both, like, moving together, because dusty software kills deals for sure. You sign it, it gets dormant, we get canceled. I know that all day. But it just feels like there's so much opportunity, but it's sort of just, like, out there. And there's this, like, state of paralysis that I'm still feeling that kind of feels like
Dana Pate (24:37)
Yes.
Dana Pate (24:47)
Yep.
Dana Pate (24:55)
Yes.
Mike (25:00)
eventually the pace is gonna have to pick up. I just don't know what's gonna happen.
Dana Pate (25:03)
Yeah, I'm in the same boat. And I also would think, too, like, each PMC is so different than the next. And that's something that's been very eye-opening, again, being with one group and knowing the inner workings of that for, you know, the decade of my career, and then now having a sneak peek behind the scenes of multiple and seeing, like, first of all, the titles are all different, the structure is different for every single organization. So that means that the decision makers, how they handle things, what PMS
Dana Pate (25:32)
integrates with another PMS. Like, everyone still doesn't play in the same sandbox. And I think, too, until we get all of our proptech, you know, supplier partners in a room where we can really work together on behalf of the industry, like, we're always gonna have that friction. And it's such a word-of-mouth industry, too, that if one person has a bad experience, then, I mean, that kills deals more than anything else that I've seen.
Mike (25:59)
I'm curious if we shift gears to, like, the tech side of what you're seeing at Stitched. It kind of feels like there are certain areas of the, like, tech ecosystem that have gotten, like, really, really crowded. But over the past couple of years, there are also a couple areas that kind of feel like there's just, like, more green space than we've ever seen before. I mean, since G5 and LeaseLabs got rolled up under RealPage, we've really got, like, Apartment SEO, Apartment 247,
Dana Pate (26:01)
Yeah.
Dana Pate (26:15)
Mm-hmm.
Mike (26:27)
Repli and Resi, that's, like, about it, is, like, standalone. I mean, you've got RealPage, there's a couple others, but it really feels like it's not that crowded in, like, websites and digital marketing. In, like, the ILS space, it does not feel that crowded at all. But a decade ago, it sure as hell was crowded. But then you look at, like, you know, leasing AI, there's about a thousand options right now for AI leasing, and they're all very good. PMS is getting quite crowded because so many people are attacking SMB and mid-market.
Dana Pate (26:42)
Yeah.
Mike (26:57)
Just curious, like, what you're seeing on the tech space, like, winners and losers, like, any companies you're excited about. I'd just love to get your take.
Dana Pate (27:02)
Yeah, no, I'm seeing the same thing. I think BI is another play that I would add on to. There's just, like, a dashboard for your dashboard for your dashboards. Like, if I hear that again... and that's even with my own groups that I'm working alongside. I'm like, hey guys, like, we can't all be the same thing to everybody, right? Like, we need to find our differentiator. And that's, I think, the challenge in that space right now. That, okay, if you're gonna go in and you're gonna go in hard under this one umbrella and then choose to expand on that scope,
Mike (27:17)
Mm-hmm.
Dana Pate (27:30)
it's, how do you get your clients to see you as anything but, right? Because even, like, a group like Repli, big fan of those guys. They started as, you know, websites, but they're doing so much more now in the, you know, attribution and analytical space and reporting. But to get their client base to think of them as more so than that is a challenge, right? But there's other groups out there, like, that are doing totally different things. I don't know, have you talked to George at Rely? He's... it's an
Mike (27:58)
Just on LinkedIn. I'm obsessed with that guy. He seems super cool.
Dana Pate (28:01)
He's so great. He's so great. I'm chatting with him later today, actually. So, hey, George. He's obsessed with Benihana. So if you ever want to meet up with him, he's probably gonna take you out. It's a whole thing, just an aside. But his, you know, he's talking about doing, you know, essentially, like, automated due diligence, which has been such a pain point for so many organizations. Like, we had to send out, like, teams to these on-site properties to do all these manual checkpoints and audits, whether we were acquiring property or not.
Mike (28:09)
Of all places. Okay. Okay.
Dana Pate (28:31)
But his system essentially, like, leverages AI technology for good and actually, like, can compile those reports for you. And so those are the kind of technologies, like, the ones that, we have a problem that people have been screaming about in one way or another for years, but there's been no true solution, because maybe it's not as sexy. Like, due diligence, not an amazingly sexy, like, category to run into compared to, you know, like, a leasing CRM or, you know, lead nurturing system or whatever else.
Dana Pate (29:00)
And so I think some of those are the most interesting. But the challenge is definitely going to be for all of these groups, it's finding your place in the tech stack. Because some of these larger companies, again, with all the red tape, with all the consolidation, they all have their own preferences. And if you don't fit in that box, it's almost impossible to get in. And then on the smaller group side, they're either afraid to commit or they just don't have the bandwidth to support that once it's in place. So
Mike (29:30)
It's one of the reasons why I think a lot of companies should stop with the obsession with the NMHC Top 50 and start with an obsession with this, like, beautiful SMB and mid-market segment. Because, you know, the riches are in the niches. I've learned that in my career. I know you've learned that in yours. It's real. And, like, you know, there's a company called PestShare out of Boise that's, like, helping companies put, like, tech infrastructure behind pest control.
Dana Pate (29:37)
Yes.
Dana Pate (29:42)
Yes.
Dana Pate (29:46)
Mm-hmm. Put that on a T-shirt. Yeah.
Mike (29:59)
It's this beautiful category-creating opportunity. But I look at the same thing as, it's like, how do they find their wedge? Because it's like they're in the untroubled and unaware stage when they talk to customers, and they have to help customers get over that so they can see that this is actually a huge problem for maintenance, for resident sentiment. And I've heard of Rely because our founder actually just invested in them. And so I'm eager to see how these kinds of companies find, you know, go-to-market fit. Because once they do, I think they're gonna have
Dana Pate (30:06)
Yes.
Dana Pate (30:22)
Nice.
Mike (30:28)
absolute home-run outcomes as businesses.
Dana Pate (30:31)
Yeah, no, totally. I think it's just, it's interesting to watch from the sidelines, but I agree. And that's honestly a lot of my recommendations to some of the proptech groups that I've done consulting for and continue to. It's that they are all obsessed with the top 50 and they put all of this attention on enterprise sales, but that is a long game. So, like, you, at some point, you need to keep the company afloat. And the people that keep your company afloat are those, you know, mid-market,
Dana Pate (31:00)
quick to make decisions, great partners, can help you build and test in a smaller scale so that it can help you get ready for those larger ones. But you just gotta have a different strategy for that, too. Because, to your point, there's an educational component that's a little bit different in talking with those folks. And then there's also just, you know, the implementation piece, because they don't have huge teams to make sure your tech works. So you need to make sure that you're fully supporting the rollout and the ongoing conversations.
Mike (31:27)
100%. For anyone on, like, the go-to-market side on the tech space, like, listening, it is one hundred percent easier to go from, like, a mid-market shop to an enterprise shop, to move upmarket, than it is to move downmarket. And I think too many people get that wrong. So let's shift to the last thing I wanted to ask you, Dana, which is Stitched, and, like, who is your ideal customer profile? Like, a lot of people are gonna be listening to this
Dana Pate (31:31)
Mm-hmm.
Mike (31:55)
that know you from LinkedIn, but they don't know you and they don't know Stitched. So as you think through, like, the proptech companies listening, the management companies, a lot of owners that I'm starting to connect with, what are some of the attributes of these companies that would actually say it's probably worth reaching out to Dana to get on her, like, shortlist of opportunities to find a way to collaborate with you?
Dana Pate (32:15)
Yeah, no, I appreciate the setup, Mike. I will say, like, I've had champagne problems. It's been a very, like, amazing growth path that I've been on, that a lot of the people that I work with or have worked with have all been, like, friends of friends. Like, everything has been a referral. I haven't had to do too much marketing other than, like, literally just putting myself out there, right? And just being authentic about the things that I'm doing and projects I'm working on. I would say my ICP is more... it's twofold.
Dana Pate (32:42)
I still love the property management side of things. And I get a lot of fulfillment in working with some of the mid to smaller market groups that either don't have a marketing team or have a very small, like, junior level, that I get to feel like I'm making a real impact with the individuals that are there. And, like, you know, we're joining weekly calls and I'm building them up and I'm challenging them to just think differently. And those are the most fulfilling, in the fact that I see the most growth
Dana Pate (33:10)
from those, whether it's, again, like, seeing someone that's a junior marketing manager be promoted to more of a director level because I've been helping them along the way, or being able to introduce certain vendor groups and suppliers into their ecosystem that changes the way they do business, and it's much more efficient, optimizational kind of concept. And then on the, you know, tech supplier side, I get a lot of fulfillment
Dana Pate (33:36)
in making an impact. So it has to be an organization that's probably either in somewhat of a startup phase, or at least, like, they're looking to cross the chasm from, like, they have some established, you know, clientele, but they're having some challenges with either marketing messaging, branding, you know, how are we going to be able to, like, grow our concept, essentially. Because I've sat in that seat. So it's very easy for me to be like, well, give me your demo.
Dana Pate (34:04)
Let me look at your website. And I come to the, you know, day one with, hey, this is the impression that I get. Yeah, here's my list. Again, recommendations. And then from an execution standpoint, it's nice to be able to work with their team and follow through, because I'm still constantly learning. I'm just a very curious person by nature. And so I think regardless of which side of the business you're on, I'm definitely looking to partner with people that are open-minded
Mike (34:11)
For sure.
Dana Pate (34:30)
and want to move fast, challenge the status quo. Like, let's break things together, but know that we're gonna fix them and we're gonna, you know, celebrate wins and we're gonna, you know, navigate challenges together. Those are the best. It's, again, very much similar to a relationship, right? Like, you wanna be, you know, hand in hand with someone that's kind of in the trenches with you. And those are the best groups, that we can just be honest with each other. We can have tough conversations, but, you know, at the end of the day, it's just a mutual respect.
Mike (35:00)
Hell yeah. I love the fact there's, like, a culture side of this. Like, fast is fun, and you're looking for people that want to, like, zig a little bit or go fast. I think that kind of, like, commitment also means that you're also finding a way to find energy in your work, which means you probably find more and more success as you compound over the next couple of years.
Dana Pate (35:02)
Right.
Dana Pate (35:06)
Yes.
Dana Pate (35:17)
Yes, I hope so, at least. We'll see. Never say never, but I'm having a lot of fun with what I'm doing right now, and I, yeah, don't see myself going back. So
Mike (35:27)
I love it. Well, Dana, you're an absolute legend. For anyone listening, head to StitchedMarketing.com to learn more about her firm. And she's super easy to find on LinkedIn. But I can't wait to see you in Maine. And thanks a ton for joining today.
Dana Pate (35:38)
Yeah, sounds great. Thanks, Mike.