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Join me, Jess VanderWier, a registered psychotherapist, mom of three, and founder of Nurtured First, along with my husband Scott, as we dive deep into the stories of our friends, favourite celebrities, and influential figures.
In each episode, we skip the small talk and dive into vulnerable and honest conversations about topics like cycle breaking, trauma, race, mental health, parenting, sex, religion, postpartum, healing, and loss.
We are glad you are here.
PS: The name Robot Unicorn comes from our daughter. When we asked her what we should name the podcast, she confidently came up with this name because she loves robots, and she loves unicorns, so why not? There was something about the playfulness of the name, the confidence in her voice, and the fact that it represents that you can love two things at once that just felt right.
Yeah, let's try and keep this one.
Keep it short today?
Yeah.
You're the one who never stops talking.
Yes.
I'm sure that's what the listeners do.
Yeah, I know.
I mean maybe on the podcast more than in real life.
If you talk to Scott about topics related to his garage, Formula One, 3D printing, organizational systems, business, he will not stop talking
Those are just a few topics that oh Nintendo.
No, those are just a few of many topics that you would not stop talking about.
So anyway, there's only one thing I won't stop talking about, and that's parenting.
Hmm.
So it just happens to be that that's what this podcast is on.
But if you had a podcast on any of those other topics I just listed.
Yeah, it's true.
I probably could
It would be all solo episodes and each a solo episode would be like four hours long.
Four hours long.
Come on.
You'd just be droning on about drones.
That'd probably be another one you'd be interested in.
You still won't let me get one.
Let us know if you'd like a podcast, just Scott.
Just
Scott's thoughts?
I don't know.
I already named it.
Holy sh are you serious?
Let us know.
I can That's an amazing name.
It would be great for him to have an outlet.
Me and everyone who sees him on a regular basis would be very great.
It would have I would not be on it.
No.
Or listen to it.
Yeah, exactly.
I know.
That's the only problem is no one would listen to it.
But that's okay.
Okay, you are already rambling, Jessica.
Is this for real?
Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.
I'm ready.
Welcome to Robot Unicorn, hosted by my parents.
Jess and Scott.
I hope you enjoyed the episode.
Let's talk about parental preference.
For whatever reason, I feel like we've done an episode on this, have we?
No, we haven't, but we have.
covered it in a lot of episodes, but we've never had one like just directly on this.
But we have talked about it a lot.
Well, I think most parents
have experienced this.
Yes.
If not maybe all.
I don't know.
It's apparently a sign of secure attachment, which we'll get into.
But I will say, in our own household, it's not that it's offensive
Like with our toddler, because maybe I get it now.
But like if any of the other girls prefer you ever, then
It becomes a little bit more.
It feels a little more offensive.
Even though I know I shouldn't have to sensitive.
I mean I'm so sensitive, yeah, exactly.
I mean, you could probably say the same in return, no?
Oh well I'm very sensitive, but I'm very open about that, even to the kids.
Because I will say there are times where the girls will prefer
one of us.
And usually it's not for just one day.
It's for a week or a month or whatever.
For whatever reason.
And then all of a sudden they switch to the other parent.
Yeah.
So anyways, I think it can be exhausting for one parent and heartbreaking for the other.
It can be very difficult.
Right?
Because exhausting, I think, for you, let's say, with the toddler toddler right now
She only wants me to put her to bed.
She really only wants me if she's having a meltdown.
It's like that.
She has been opening up.
She's opening up to you.
But for a long time, like she'd be having a meltdown.
You're right there.
She'd be like, no.
Like point at me.
Mommy!
Yeah, I know.
It's like I'm like needy but making dinner.
Dad can take care of you.
No!
Those moments are hard.
Yeah
So as a therapist, can you start by normalizing this moment for our listeners?
Just how common is this experience?
It's very, very common.
And I would say most homes have this at some point or another.
And I think when you're the parent being pushed away, it is pretty easy to spiral into thoughts like, what am I doing wrong?
Or does my child love my partner more than me?
So what's the most common misconception parents have about this phase and what's the first mindset shift you encourage them to make
First mindset shift I would say is stop taking it so personal.
We take it as a personal attack on our character and there's many reasons why kids have parental preference and typically they aren't personal.
Sometimes it can be if like let's say one parent just simply
is not a safe parent for them, right?
Then they are of course gonna be drawn to the other parent who makes them feel safer
But I would say for the most part, what I frame it to myself as for these little coddlers is their brains just get stuck on like it's hard for them to hold multiple thoughts at the same time.
That's just their brains can't do that, right?
So it's hard to think, in this moment I want mom.
Especially I think a lot of times it happens to be the parent who's just around more, like the default parent, or the parent who's just
like spent more time with them.
Like so often if there's one home and one working, it's like the one that's home.
Yeah.
The research suggests it's most typically the birthing parent.
Yeah.
The mother who birthed them and feeds them and takes care of most of their needs while they're on maternity leave or whatever.
That is
Most typically the person that the kids are attached to.
Yeah, like I often say it's like the default.
So let's say the dad's a stay-at-home dad or the dad does all the bed times and the mom's like a shift worker, like she's out
You know, it's the one who's there the most.
And it makes sense because the child's like, I know what to expect, I know the predictability.
And
like I mentioned, their brain can't hold multiple things at the same time.
So then their brain can't think, I want mom.
I know mom comforts me in the way I want to be comforted.
And dad could probably do a good job too.
It's just like, I know what I want.
It just makes more sense
I want mom.
And then it's very hard for their brains to switch focus.
Let's get into the developmental science here.
Yeah.
The research shows this
phase often pops up between the ages of one and three.
So why then?
What what's happening in the toddler's brain that makes them suddenly appoint one parent as the CEO of
Everything from putting on socks to their bedtime stories.
Yeah.
I mean, again, at this age, children crave predictability, they crave routine.
and they start to notice their own patterns of like who does that for them, right?
So that's why I'm saying it's most often the default parent or perhaps the parent who
is the most predictable in terms of mood, routine, all of those kind of things.
So their brain will often just latch on to I know what happens when this person does this for me.
Like I think that's
often the case for bedtime.
Like for example, I usually have been putting our youngest to bed.
Now you do a great job and she actually loves when you put her to bed, but she doesn't remember that she loves it.
when you say daddy's putting you to bed tonight.
Right?
When you say daddy's putting her to bed tonight, her first reaction is always, Oh, I want mommy.
Yeah.
I need mommy.
But as soon as you start to do it, she's like, oh actually it's not so bad
Because her brain is like, I want to do what I'm most familiar with, which makes the most sense to me.
I know what I can expect from mom, so I'm gonna beg for mom to do it.
Yeah.
It's not that you do a bad job or she doesn't love you.
So I think that's important for parents to understand.
Yeah, and I think they're not purposefully trying to hurt.
No, not at all.
And that kind of leads into the next question because it seems as though saying I want mom or I want dad is the ability for
let's say our youngest to say that she wants mommy more than me.
Apparently it can be a sign of secure attachment because they know that I'm not going to just throw her to the side and not hang out with her or do anything with her anymore.
She trusts that.
She can still say that and
I'm still going to be there for her and do whatever she needs.
Yeah, I think that's also really important to note for the non-preferred.
I don't like that term, but for the other parent, right?
The fact that your child feels comfortable screaming in front of you, not daddy, I only want mommy, is a sign that she knows that you're not gonna fully abandon her
If she says that.
Like children who don't have a secure attachment would often feel very fearful to speak those words in front of the other parent.
So let's talk about the attachment theory then, which our research identified as a key framework.
for parental preference.
For everything.
For everything, yeah, sure.
The theory describes different attachment styles, secure, anxious, avoidant.
Can you briefly explain what those are and how that actually plays out in parental preference?
Perfect.
Yeah.
So the first one that you listed was secure attachment, right?
So secure attachment is
I can push you away and I know that you're still gonna love me, you're still gonna show up for me.
I'm not fearful of losing my relationship with you
So a child who is securely attached often can say things like, I hate you, or you're the worst dad, or I only want mom, I don't want you, because they don't have a frantic energy that says
If I say those things, you might not love me.
So actually parents can kind of rest assured that if their children are saying those things to them, it doesn't mean
That they actually hate that parent.
It means that they feel safe enough to express such a big feeling.
Right.
And you can still set boundaries around the words that they say and help shape those words so that they aren't so potentially hurtful.
But it's just important for the parent to know that
Now an anxiously attached child is afraid to say those things often.
Or they might say them just to try out the parent and just see what the parent does.
Us because an anxiously attached child isn't a hundred percent sure that no matter what they say their parents are still gonna show up for them or that their parents not gonna
Totally flip their lid and yell at them or get angry at them.
So often with anxiously attached children, you either see them walking on eggshells
around their parents, like I'm never gonna say anything that might potentially upset them, or you see them trying to push their parents away just a little bit to see what might happen.
Like, will they actually show up for me?
Maybe I'll say this and just see.
It might be a little bit of a different nature of the way that they're testing their parents just to see if their parent will keep showing up.
for them.
So the avoidant child is different than the anxious one where the anxious one's trying to test the boundaries.
The avoidant one is a little more shut down.
I'm always a little bit more worried about the avoidant one where
They're already quite fearful of what the parent's response is gonna be.
They're already quite sure that their parent might not be showing up for them.
So they're either going to just really try not to stir the pot.
around that parent and they might like let that parent put them to bed and like they don't want to say anything because they know their parents going to lose their cool.
Or they might be so so so so clingy to the other
parent, right?
And a desperate attempt to try and avoid relationship or avoid being with the other parent.
So yeah, it's important to understand the three.
I feel like for most of our listeners, like we're working on that secure attachment, right?
So I don't want them to overthrow
think every behavior that their child has either.
But you might reflect back on your childhood experiences and be like, oh I was definitely this.
Well there was the a fourth one which was I don't know why I didn't write it down, but I think it was called disorganized attachment or something like that, where it kind of
the child doesn't know what attachment feels or looks like or whatever and so the way they act is challenging to pin down.
It's very confusing.
Disorganized attachment's very like
child's very confused.
The parent is often very confused.
The child doesn't know who do I trust?
Who do I turn to?
Where can I release my big feelings?
Right.
So sometimes they might try, sometimes they might pull away, sometimes they might walk on eggshells.
And a lot of people who grew up in childhood trauma can relate to that.
And those attachment styles in childhood often they stay with us throughout our whole lives.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Okay.
For the parent who is being rejected.
Mm-hmm.
What are the do's and don'ts in that moment?
I mean the research suggested and you've also talked about this too, this kind of formula of acknowledge and then boundary.
So can you give us some examples of what that sounds like in real life?
Maybe for a toddler who refuses to let you help them get dressed.
So I think what
Often happens is that then we get into the pattern of being like, yeah, okay, fine, mommy can do it.
Right?
Like we don't want to deal with the meltdown
So we just let the preferred parent take on everything, which actually just makes the parental preference like even more solidified in the child's head.
Schedule or something like that.
It's kind of like the strongest way to uh solidify a behavior.
Right, and I totally get it.
Like we've had that so many times where our kids are like, no, I want mommy to put me in bed.
I'm like, fine, I'll just do it.
You don't want to worry about the meltdown
But what that often happens is like just proves to the kid, oh yeah, so mommy does a better job, right?
So the non-preferred parent should not fear the child's meltdown around wanting the other parent
Like the child needs to know that you feel confident in helping them navigate their feelings.
Right.
So first is validating.
I totally get it.
I would love it if mom put me to bed too.
Like she does such a good job.
I've seen her put you to bed and I know how much you love it.
I get it.
It makes sense that you want mom.
Like just validate the way that they feel.
And it's my turn tonight, and I'm really excited to put you to bed.
And if it
If that's hard for you, that's okay.
I can handle it.
Like the child needs to know that you can handle their emotions.
You're not afraid of it.
You look forward to spending the time with them.
And I think what often happens is people start to kind of just get angry at their kids, like, I'm doing it, like get over it.
It's me.
But then that can again lead them to just prefer the other parent.
Who's not getting angry at them, right?
So you have to walk into that showing your child that they can trust your leadership and that you can handle their emotions
you're looking forward to spending time with them and then see what you can do to try and make the best of the time that you have with them.
But the first few times that you hold that boundary that like, look, I'm helping you with your clothes.
Not mom.
It's me today.
They might just protest the whole time, right?
Because their brain is stuck.
Not because they hate you.
And it's important for them to see that you can handle that.
Okay, that makes sense.
Hey friends, so at pickup last week, our daughter asked Scott a truly
kind of tricky question in front of her younger siblings.
Scott was telling me that when he heard a question like this, he used to panic, but this time he had a plan.
And he said to our daughter, thank you for asking.
Let's talk tonight when we've got privacy.
And that's a line that he learned straight from
our new body safety and consent course at Nurture First.
So this new body safety and consent course is taught by me, so Jess, if you listen to this podcast, you know me.
I'm a child therapist and a mom of three and I have taught body safety and consent education for years.
This course takes all my years of experience teaching this education and gives you calm, age-appropriate language for body parts, consent, and boundaries.
You'll learn how to teach your kids that no means no, you'll learn how to teach them to read facial cues, you'll talk about safe and unspeakable.
safe touch and you'll even teach them about their uh oh feeling.
There's guidance inside this course for the real life stuff like tickling that goes too far and even the difference between a secret and a surprise.
We made this course at Nurture First because research shows that body safety education helps kids speak
up sooner and we want that for our family, for Scott and I, but also for you.
So check the course out at nurturefirst.
com/slash body safety and to save 10% use the code
robot unicorn.
And just full disclosure here, we are the creators of this course and we're so proud of it.
You've talked about having a pretty structured approach to
for rebalancing duties, especially for routines like bedtime.
And it often involves starting small, prepping
a toddler for the change and maybe even using a visual chart.
Can you walk us through what this might look like for a family that wants to have start having parents alternate a bedtime routine?
You know, let's use that as the example.
when we had our third baby, you did the older girls bedtime every night and they started to prefer you.
They wanted you to do it.
And then when I got back to being able to do it after being postpartum, they were like, No, we want dad.
Dad only knows how to do our bedtime.
Like I remember our oldest said, You don't know how to do my bedtime mom.
Only dad does.
And I was like, ugh, what do you mean?
Right.
So it's like, okay, things are gonna be different now.
Like we're gonna go back to like dad doing one night, then mom doing the next night.
They know that might be hard.
Both parents have their own special way of doing bedtime, but that's okay.
Like we can handle whatever feelings you have
You have to take the lead sometimes.
Like sometimes we wait for kids to take the lead.
If they're really strongly preferring one parent, chances are they're not really going to change that unless you lead that change.
So you do have to step in and be the steady leader that your child can rely on in those situations and let them know what the plan is.
Like they can have a say, but like don't let them dictate it.
Because if they do, it's gonna be one parent every single night.
So outside of just you're in the moment for that bedtime routine tonight, is there something you can do ahead of time to kind of get them prepared for it?
And so it's a little bit easier.
Like I wouldn't spring it on them.
I would tell them ahead of time, like early in the day, like even at breakfast, like if you're making a change.
And you could give them like even a calendar, like, hey, this is what it's gonna look like.
One night dad, one night me.
Like I mean you could write it on your a chalk.
Board or something in your house, right?
So so that they know.
Like I remember when we were starting to make that change, our middle daughter was like, So it's your turn tonight, daddy's turn tomorrow.
And like she would like have to kind of think it through
in her own head.
And then I like it when each parent has their own kind of special flavor that they bring.
Like we've talked about how you can be really playful with the kids at bedtime.
I like to like read them books
There's like certain things, certain songs maybe one parent sings so that the child can look forward to like the special thing that that specific parent does at that time.
So I was as a part of this, I was kind of looking into the I guess parental dynamic
two.
And there's something interesting that I've found.
So in couples therapy, I'm sure you know of this, there's a concept called the pursuer distancer cycle, where one partner's anxiety causes them to chase and the other's anxiety causes them to withdraw.
And it seems like
What's that called?
That's like in dyadic relationships, like just two.
But then this is more of a triadic relationship.
So there's three.
There's the child and the two parents, one preferred and one not preferred in that moment.
How do you think this dynamic plays out?
in a family struggling with parental preference, not just between the co-parents, but also between the rejected parent and the child.
Yeah, for sure.
That's why I was saying when I was explaining the attachment styles, like I feel like we see our own attachment wounds show up in this.
Where if you've always been anxiously attached or you've always been
Seeking someone's love.
Oh, I didn't even talk about that in terms of the anxiously attached where sometimes if they sense that one parent's withdrawing, they'll pursue them even harder.
Right?
Because it's like, oh I wanna keep you close.
I wanna keep you close to the closed.
Yeah, that's what this pursuer distancer cycle would be.
Yeah, so I missed that actually when I was talking about anxious attachment earlier.
Sometimes you see that and the child like wants only one parent because they can sense
a distance between them and that parent.
And if you have that kind of trauma, then you might start to withdraw or shut down.
Or if you're the one being rejected
all the time by your child, you might just be like, fine, they don't like me.
And you might back out, which is the worst thing that you can do because your child is like giving you a message, right?
Either way, that they need connection with you
And that they care about you.
And every child wants to be in good relationship with their parents.
So if you notice yourself withdrawing, check yourself and be like, even if my child's pushing me away, they still need me.
So
The research I found was not related to that.
Oh.
It was more the opposite.
So it's more that, let's say, if our toddler is
kind of pushing me away and going closer to you.
You are actually feeling potentially extra touched out and want Oh, I see.
I want to withdraw.
Yeah, so you want to withdraw, which essentially makes the child chase after you, which makes you want to withdraw potentially even more.
Yeah.
And I'm also at the same time potentially trying to
Pursue the child who then withdraws from me and pursues you and it ends up becoming like this dance of like I'm pulling away.
Yes.
And I think to look at it from that child development lens, the more a child feels like their parent is withdrawing for them, the more anxious they're gonna feel
feel and the more desperate they're going to be to pursue that parent, which is often why on the days when you're most touched out, stressed out, having the hardest time
Your child clings the most, whines the most, has the most difficult time, has the most meltdowns, which makes you feel like pulling away even more, which makes their behavior ramp up even more, and it's all in a frantic attempt to keep you close.
Doesn't feel like it, 'cause
It's like, well, I don't want to be with you when you're like this, but a child has no other way to try and frantically keep you close, right?
So when you notice yourself withdrawing because you're just so touched out, think to yourself,
when I withdraw like this, their behavior usually ramps up even more.
And so it's about finding, even maybe outside of bedtime, if we're talking about bedtime, those moments of connection.
with your child, relationship building with your child for both preferred and non-preferred parent.
Because when you have that right relationship, those frantic behaviors can soften.
Because your child doesn't need to have them to keep you close.
We'll try it tonight.
See how it goes.
Well, so this leads to my next question.
You tend to let's say with our toddler, I think you kind of like putting her to bed every night.
I do.
So it makes it more challenging for me to actually be able to put her down, even though I would love to.
Because you're like, oh no, it's okay, I'll do it.
Like
I want to do it.
You love doing it.
I want to put all three of them to bed every night, but that's just me.
Is it ever okay for parents to just lean into the preference?
For example
Like let's talk about our example.
You just want to put her to bed every night.
You're not trying too hard to get me to help me put her down.
I guess it's like the question would be, is it working for us?
Because if you're telling me, Jessica's not working for me because I want to put our toddler down and you're taking those moments from me, then I could say I have to fight harder
Well you you also have a role to play in this where you're like, that's fine, you can put her down.
Right?
Like I don't you're not showing me or telling me
that it's a problem for you.
But if you start to say, Jess, I feel like you're stealing these moments from me, like I would also like a chance to put our three year old to bed, can we
balance this a little bit more so I get more opportunities to put her to bed, I would be like, no problem.
But I'm not hearing that.
So then in my head I'm like, well if he doesn't care either way, I absolutely love putting her to bed.
So I want to keep doing it.
You know what I mean?
So
It also does come down to communication between the parents.
So this is me telling you that I would like to put it down?
No, no.
That's exactly what I thought you would say.
Knew it.
Uh okay, but here's another example.
Uh if one parent is a natural at like let's say me, at rough and tumble play, and the other is the go-to for quiet story time.
Is there a point where we should stop fighting the preference and just divide and conquer based on strengths?
Where is the line between honoring a natural connection and reinforcing an unhealthy balance?
Where is the balance?
That's my the question, right?
Because I think it could be easy to say, and I have seen this before, well you're just better.
You're just better at putting them to bed.
So you can do it every night.
And then the other partner just sits and plays video games while the wife puts all all their kids to bed every night.
I would love to do that.
You know what I mean?
So like I feel like that could be weaponized really easily to say, well, you're just better at it.
Right.
Like whereas a lot of things are a skill that you need to learn over time.
Now
Where I would see this working is like when you put the kids to bed, you are more rough and tumble.
They are chaotic when you put them to bed.
It is loud.
Much to Jess's.
And so
When Scott does bedtime, there's a lot of screaming and shrieking and racing down the halls and a monsters everywhere.
Whereas when I do bedtime, it's like okay girls, let's go to bed and
Great, lean into that when it's your turn, but you still get to do bedtime.
You know what I mean?
Like I think I would hate for someone to be like, oh, okay, so that's great.
Yeah, my wife is really good at doing bedtime, so she should just do it every night then because she's a natural at that.
Whereas like I'll just
Rough and tumble them up straight before bedtime for her because that's what I'm good at.
Like you know what I mean?
So unless it's a preference Unless everyone's okay with it.
And
Like I'm cleaning up the dinner table and the dishes and all that or something.
Everyone has to feel good about the plan.
Yeah.
And like that's the thing about me putting our three year old to bed every night
I feel great about that plan.
There's no piece of me that's like, oh Scots and me, can we do this?
If there was, I would tell you.
But I genuinely love putting her to bed.
Oh, I know.
It's so cute.
She only falls asleep if I'm looking at her, so she'll always hold my face and say
Mommy, look at me.
And I have to look at her until she falls asleep.
Although I will say last night was the second day of school, so she had the most epic meltdown.
Yeah.
Then I was like Scott could have uh Scott can take this one.
Oh yeah, I could have taken that one.
No, you have to take the good analytics.
If kids are harder to put to bed usually then there's more of a fight.
Fighting for the opposite.
Yeah, yeah.
But our kids at this point they have not always been easy to put down by any means.
Have they not?
Well, I guess as babies, no, but maybe like little puzzlers.
I feel like once they got past about two years old, they all became pretty easy.
Pre pre two years old.
Yeah, we struggled with the like little toddler and baby age, but once they hit two
Which is like the age of that's kind of what we're talking about here, right?
Yeah, yeah.
It's the the one to three year old range.
Yeah.
And I think like for us by around two, they all
Kind of allowed both of us, although our youngest, I think, because you And our middle preferred me for a long time too.
Yeah
Yeah, yeah, true.
But again, I think it makes sense because when we had, let's say our oldest, we kind of could both do it.
I feel like she didn't she was fine with either one when we had
our second, then you were more doing her bedtime related stuff.
I was doing the oldest.
Yeah.
And then when we had her third, I was doing the older two and you were doing
The youngest.
The youngest.
Yeah, exactly.
So then it kind of makes sense that but because we haven't had another child, then you've just kind of we've kind of continued with that a little bit.
Okay.
I think this phase can be emotionally taxing.
I mean, especially if you have had a new sibling in the family.
So
I don't know.
Or whatever whatever situation is.
That's a good example for the pursuit.
Like you'll probably get more of a pursuit for the one parent if you n if they have a new baby.
Right?
And m now mommy has a baby and mommy can't put me to bed anymore.
Well I'm gonna desperately want her.
Right?
That makes sense.
So for the parent listening right now who potentially feels hurt lonely or rejected by their own child, what do you want them to hold on to?
It's what I said at the beginning, it's not personal.
Don't let your child push you away.
Yeah, it's also developmentally appropriate, right?
It's developmentally appropriate.
But that's all of parenting.
Like kids always will try and push you away in an attempt to see will you stay?
And I think parents need to remember that
This is not their parent pushing them away.
This is not someone else who's hurt them pushing them away.
This is their child who desperately wants to know that they are loved and cared for.
And they'll sometimes say hurtful things.
or push your buttons or make you feel offended, but that does not mean that you should withdraw.
Keep loving them and eventually they will rest in your love and you will stop seeing so much franticness in their behaviors once they know that you're good.
Yeah.
Right.
So I think that's just that's the core.
Uh and then finally if we look at the bigger picture, what would you say the long-term benefits are of navigating
this phase, let's say, for us as a calm, unified team.
Is there s anything our child is learning when they see both of their parents handle their big feelings and preferences with confidence and love?
Yes.
Because if one parent all of a sudden starts pulling away or yelling at them, they're gonna learn which parent they can go to, right?
And oftentimes this is when kids learn
Oh, I can only go to dad or I can only go to mom, right?
And so it goes back to what I just said, like don't let them push you away.
And you'll see that they can continue to go to both parents.
Maybe it's for different things
But we want our kids to trust both of us as the strong and reliable leaders that we are for our our homes.
So I think that's the real huge thing that you're teaching even in these early years.
All great
Beautiful.
I feel like so there's a few episodes of recording today and this was one of them that I felt kind of called out in.
Mm-hmm.
And I'm also it was also my attempt to call you out on letting me put my uh our youngest to bed sometimes.
But yeah, I found it quite interesting.
I think it's the idea or remembering that
they're not trying to hurt you when they prefer one or the other and that it's actually a it makes sense for them just based on their brain development.
Yeah.
I think we'll make it easier.
For a lot of people.
I think so too.
Whenever I've taught that, it's been like a breath of fresh air for parents.
I think it's it's really important to know.
So I'm glad we had this conversation.
Yeah.
And thank you for listening.
Hopefully you enjoyed it.
If you have any comments or questions, let us know.
Perfect.
But yeah, we'll see you next week.
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