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We share stories of how the blood of Jesus has transformed ours and others' lives.
God says vengeance is mine. Right. So it's not bad he gets to do it though. Right. Truthfully, and this is where I think God's not just look what he did for us. Yeah. Like we do not deserve to be saved like we were. Right. We do not deserve to have Jesus pay for all of our sins. That's not fair. That's not just, it's not just that it landed on one man, but that's his system.
If I'm to be godlike and understand this example of grace. Yeah. Like your son did. I shouldn't want vengeance either and And the reason vengeance is his, I believe is because he does love us all so much. Every single one of us that he does want every last person saved. And the reason he wants us to seek his heart and look like him and be the love that brings people to him, that brings true transformation through Christ.
Yeah. Mm-hmm. Is so that people can be saved. Right. Not by us exacting vengeance.
Hey everybody. Welcome to the Red Ledger. I'm Donnelley Bell. This is Lisa Frazier. Hello. Today we're talking about justice and injustice. All of us want justice. I believe it's innately in us to desire justice, fairness, but we don't always get it right. Um, my husband likes to call me the justice warrior, the fairness warrior around the house.
Yes. Mm-hmm. And I do, I I like things to be right. Yeah. Um, I like them for me, but I especially need and want it for the people I love. Yeah. I get really burned if. Somebody wrongs my children. Yes. Even though they're adults. Mm-hmm. It was maybe worse when they were younger. Yeah. I'm sure. But the problem is with the world we're living in, it's a hurt, hurting, and broken world.
Yeah. And it's run by fallible humans. Right. And so we are going to see injustice. Mm-hmm. We've seen it since the beginning of the time with Kain and Abel. The Israelites with Pharaoh. Right. And even today we see human trafficking, racism, slavery still. Yeah. Slavery still. Still. Yeah. So I think that we need to learn how to deal with it.
Yeah. I agree. I agree. I agree. Meaning me and you. Yeah. I just joking. Yeah. But we need to start by defining the word justice. I think anytime we have a conversation, I think we need to all be on the same page. Right. Because we have social justice warriors, right? Yeah. We have people who want justice for different things that.
Yeah. Maybe our God and our belief system wouldn't find just, you know, I think right in the world. I think it's unjust. Or unjust. What is it? Unjust. It's unjust. Unjust, yeah. That we have normalized sin. Right. And made it. Okay. Yeah. We, I think we need to have a a, an understanding as Christians mm-hmm. As to what God's justice is.
Yes. What true justice really is. So when I just look at the concept of justice, it encompasses fairness, equality. Right. And that's kind of a worldly justice. Right. But God's word for justice is Right. And righteousness uhhuh in the Bible. Yeah. That's what the blue letter Bible said in the. Hebrew or Greek.
Anyway, that's, that's what it says in Strongs is that it is rightness. Yeah. And righteousness. And that is God. That's God's heart. Right. And our desire for justice is in our heart. I think he plants it in us. Right. I agree. And it's why we see it. We see it within our, our justice system. It mirrors the Bible.
Right. Or so we were told in college. Right? Yeah. Yeah. And, and it is, I mean, you can see God's justice. Um, I don't know if God's justice is like our justice system. 'cause we want it to be impartial and fair and balanced. Right. We don't want it to. Have any preference based on your race, your color, the amount of money you make, we want it to be the same for a rich person as the same for a poor person.
Right. Yeah. And God does say that in the Bible, right? Right. We don't want to have preference over either, but love both. Yes. And I, I see that that doesn't always happen in the Kingdom of Heaven or the way God operates. It wouldn't be where he could be bought off. Where I've seen. Right. I've seen, you know, some people bought off money can influence mm-hmm.
Power, you know, you can get more lawyers, you can get better lawyers and, you know, so not that, not that people that do things pro bono aren't great. I, I, a friend of mine is an excellent lawyer and, um, he's a justice kinda guy. I, and I love him and he, um, I. I know he's for the poor, he's for the meek, he's for the weak.
Um, he's, but of course he's gotta be paid for what he's doing on, on some level. Mm-hmm. At some point. But, um, but yeah, I've seen that Well, injustice. Well, and Jesus has called us to speak up for the poor and needy. Yeah. And so that is an excellent example of somebody doing that. Yeah. Somebody who maybe doesn't have the resources, but he has the talent, skills and ability.
Yeah. Standing up, we look at people who get away with things, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, or people who want justice. And in the iJust, I saw covetousness, right? Like, or this greed. So an oppressive quality. Okay. Mm-hmm. So you have somebody who's okay with being oppressive, oppressing people. In, in an injust situation.
Right, right. Yeah. It has to be somebody with power and authority. Yeah. And uses their influence. So I think of, I mean, there's so many We can look at our government Yeah. And how they use our tax dollars. Right. Yeah. That's great. I mean, in the olden days, everyone just knew that they were probably not being good stewards of that today.
It's a questionable thing, even with proof. Right. But yeah, there's an injustice in that. Mm-hmm. You know that I pay my taxes and it's not going to. Real things. Right. It's not, it's going and it looks like it's getting backdoored a lot to corrupt politicians. Right? Yeah, I agree. That's an injustice. That's a big injustice.
So, and you think they're just gonna quit doing it? No, no. Um, in our current political climate, it looks like they're gonna really fight for that power and to keep those, uh, dollars coming their way. Yeah. That's what it real, it definitely looks like that. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. It doesn't really bother them that we have to work till April or May.
Is it May now. Yeah. Just to make like all that money goes to taxes. Yeah. It doesn't matter to them. They're not gonna give up that power. No. When you have that power, um, to relinquish it, um, it, it, I think takes a lot. Yeah. And politically you can see the fight happening. Real. Yeah. You totally can. Um-huh. On social media.
I haven't been watching it because it does anger me, um, at a deep level. Yeah, it does. Me too. 'cause it's wrong. Yeah, it's very wrong. It's wrong. And there's not much I can really do about it. I mean, I can complain, I can speak up. I, yeah. And the best place that we can do things is on the state and local levels.
I mean, uh, if you really wanna do something, do something on the state and local levels, uh, in your, you know, in your community, that's, and, and most people don't even have a clue who's who, who their mayor is, who their representatives are. No. Um, and you know, 'cause you want the, the head honcho, you want the president to fix it all.
Yeah. You want, but it, it really, I agree with you. I think a lot can change at a local level. My brother's involved in politics and Wyoming and a lot has changed and does change because they do get involved. Yeah. I learned my brother funny, my brother too was involved in politics locally here and, um, behind the scenes mm-hmm.
Is, was, was my brother's, um, position. And it's something that he is really good at and he studies it and he is well versed and understands and knows what's going on. And one of the things that he's always said to me when I've had a grip or a complaint. Is focus on the, the local level. Focus on the state level.
Yeah. Because that's what will end up influencing. Mm-hmm. And changing. But you have to do it here, right? Because the correction can hap happen big up there, but in it, it's easier probably to grab a hold of in like a local election. I just wanna read this to you, Proverbs 22 8. So it might bring you solace.
Whoever sows injustice will reap calamity and the rod of his fury will fall. Hmm. That just brought me some peace today
when I was thinking about the injustice of, of the world, you know, um, sometimes I wonder, one of the problems that I was having over the weekend with the injustice that we experienced was, I was wondering when is the justice going to occur? Mm. Because I didn't think it occurred, but through our conversation.
I think it actually did occur. Oh, that's gonna be interesting to unpack. Yeah. I think it already did occur to some level, maybe not how I would've thought. Mm-hmm. Or how I would've seen justice prevail. Right. Um, and I don't even think how God wanted it to. I don't think it happened the way God wanted it to.
Um, but he's a just God. He and he will work it all out, and he will. And he did. Mm. And there's still things to come. It's not over. It's not done. It's not done. You know, I, I've heard that saying, um, oh, I hope I don't get it backwards. You may have. Won the battle. But did you, you didn't, you, you may have lost the battle, but you didn't.
Or you can win the war. Win or lose the battle, but there's still the war to, to, you know. Yeah. You guys know. You're as telling the wrong person. I am known in my family for never getting one of those. Right. Yeah. I don't get a saying. Right. I know. I always, always, like, I insert the word monkey a lot. I don't know.
I get 'em wrong all the time. Yeah. So this is one of 'em. Okay. So we may have lost this battle, but there still is a bigger war. Right. Um, and so that was good. And that's okay. That's okay there. I got it. I know what I'm talking about. Let's do a podcast. Let's put this out for everybody to judge. It's scared.
Yeah. I can't wait. We were talking, um, about how fun it is when there's an injustice No. Or when they're, and how it brings out the best in us. Yes. Yeah. And I think this is, these are some of the problems we have when we're dealing with injustice. Right. We wanna see the finish line. Yeah. Um, or we don't understand why there's still injustice in the world.
Right. And that is, I mean, I as a reasonable desire. Right. Uhhuh, um, there's been injustice since the beginning of the time. Right. Like I said, Cain and Abel. Yeah. Right. Yeah. We have the Israelites, Pharaoh, we have the current injustices happening now, and we also know the end of the story. You know, and I've had, I've had other people who are not Christians.
Mm-hmm. They've asked me things like, well, why does God allow. Child abuse or you know, these injustices. And, and so, you know, that's a whole, that's a whole other can of worms. But I, I mean, it's the same principle. Like they're, they're, they're seeing an injustice here and they want it to be corrected. And I think with these social justice warriors and, and me, we want to see it righted.
Yeah. And we know it can be, and it can't be that hard. Okay. So let's just say racism. Okay. It can't be that hard. Right. But the problem is you cannot legislate the heart. No. You can't force a heart to not hate. Right. Yeah. You, you have to have a transformation. Yeah. And that only happens through Jesus.
Right. So, and I think discipline, maybe, maybe you can change your heart through discipline. I don't know. I don't know that my heart ever actually changed towards anything, until I met Jesus, I think the word. Mm-hmm. And Jesus. Who was the word? Who is the word? That's what changes my heart. Mm-hmm. Because it's the forgiveness, it's the love.
It's, it's, it's, that's what's changed me. It's, and okay. So if I look at, um, the last few years where we have really been talking about racism all the time. Yeah. All the time. And in my view, but I'm not somebody who's living with racism. It seemed to have been getting better from when I was a child. Yeah.
Right? Mm-hmm. And now it seems like it's getting worse again. Yeah. I agree. And it makes me sad. And I think the problem was if I'm, if, if I were to choose how to fix racism Yeah. Is. It's like people were trying to get forced people to change instead of changing their heart. Right. And you can't, it's like bringing people to Christianity.
You can't beat 'em over the head with this Bible. No. You know, that's why they call us bible thumpers. Right. Is because I think we do it wrong sometimes. Right. I agree. We just know this is truth. There's freedom here. You don't have to live in this bondage. I've done it. Yeah. Just do this, use this word.
Right. And they don't wanna hear that. No. They wanna be loved and that's what love is and what for how they are. Mm-hmm. But, and, and that's okay. Yes, you should be loved for how you are. Yes. But the way you're behaving doesn't necessarily exude love or is love, or it might need to be a behavior that has changed.
Mm-hmm. And so you have to be welcome or welcoming. Mm-hmm. Or open to receiving. The Jesus change, you know, the change that he brings, the change that, that corrects, that instead of standing so firmly in whatever it is that you're standing in. Exactly. And so I don't think anyone wants to join a club where people are hating and condemning them.
No, no. To the point of I have, um, some family members that we don't align politically. Mm-hmm. And I'm okay with it. I, I really, I mean, I, I'm okay with diversity. I don't, that's not the bigger picture. That's, that's, I don't care about that. We all kind of want the same thing. I think we just disagree on how to get it.
Yeah. I, I, I agree there. And, and so this person really attacked me all the time because did not like my perspective or view. And I thought to myself, why would I ever join your team? I. You are treating me so awfully and so poorly. Yes. And, and if you are representing this side, yeah. I, I don't wanna, that, I don't want join any part of it that I don't, I have, I, I don't wanna be any part of it.
Mm-hmm. No, if that's, I mean, it's one thing to bring to, Hey, Lisa, did you know that, you know, you, you, your view on this, you might wanna consider another view, a different view, da da da da da, x, y, z, you know? Right. Um, but not, you're a yeah, you're a this or a that, you know, I was called, if you don't agree with me, you're a, you're a stupid conservative.
And both sides do it, you know, and politic politics. Totally. Like both sides have names for each other. We all know what they are. Yeah. And it was just, you know, one of those mo one of those moments where I, I thought, I will never join No. Just based on this. Right. Why would I join this? So as Christians.
Let's pay attention. Well, that's what kept me away from Jesus. Yes. I remember in high school, uh, well, no, it was after high school. I was at my parents' house in, in, um, this small town. And, and there was a wedding that was being held at their house. And at that time, I, I smoked, you know, and so I was in their garage smoking away from the party, away from all these people.
Mm-hmm. And this person comes in and sees me smoking and says, you know, you're going to hell because you do that. And I was like, Hmm. And I said to the guy, which this is not nice, but I said, well, I guess I'll see you there since you're judging me. I was pretty witty and quick, but you know, I wasn't going to hell because I was smoking.
No, I was going to hell. 'cause I never chose Jesus. Yes. That, that's why, because I was afraid of Jesus, because of people like you that kept me away from him, that had all this judgment and condemnation that you put towards me because I didn't align the way you did. And what's the word tell us. Right. You, we come to Jesus because He love, they love the love of God.
Yeah. The love of Jesus. The love of Jesus. That's why we come to him. Yeah. And why would people, why wouldn't we do it different than him? Right. I don't wanna do it different than him. Um, because I wanna be as fruitful as he was. Yes. I wanna be, because that's the goal of Christianity. Like you, we don't just get sick.
Well, I did for many years. You just get saved and then you do, you know, you do life. Yeah. Um, but as I grew closer to God, yeah. I realized I'm getting free of some stuff here. Yeah. There's some bondage that I am not living under anymore. There's a freedom here. And I want my entire family, I want everyone I know.
Yeah. And then the more you learn, and then I learned a little bit more about hell yeah. And you're like, oh, I don't even want my worst enemy to go there. No. Like, I can't even think of anybody I would want. To be separated from God like that, to not have a choice to live in eternity, not with God. Well, I never had that concept.
I mean, yeah, it was thrown at me. It was thrown at me a lot. Mm-hmm. That I did not belong. Mm-hmm. I was, that I was completely rejected. That was thrown at me a lot. So I knew I was totally rejected. Like, okay, I gotcha. I'm not welcomed. Um, but I did not have an understanding of what hell was. Mm-hmm. I didn't understand that.
It's the absence of God. It's the absence of love. It's the, I mean, air, you, you know, I hear people say, I think we're living in hell. I hear on this Earth, no. Okay, well there's light, so no, no, we're not. No, there's light, there's water, there's, you know, there's air to breathe. There's hope. There's hope. Yeah.
There's love. So no, we're not living in hell. It might be tough at times for many, for a lot, all the, you know, but we're not another reason we want people to. Know Jesus Yes. As Christians Right. Is so that they can have hope. Yeah. And light and love. Yeah. And live the abundant life that he promised us, right.
When we say yes to him. Yeah. So if we're gonna deal with injustice Yeah. We wanna keep that in mind. Right? Right. Yeah. We wanna keep in mind that we are representing Jesus. Yeah. That we're bringing people closer to him, not pushing them away. Right. And I think that is a problem for me when I react and Yes.
And respond. Like there's an emotion I get, especially if you mess with my kids. Right. You know? Mm-hmm. So for instance, we did a podcast, um, there's been a few podcasts and they'll pick on me and my son's on many of the podcasts, and I'm just like impressed that I have this young man who would even want to do a podcast with me and talk about Jesus.
Right. So. Like, everyone just clap your hands for him. Like Yeah. Do you not ever say anything bad about him? No. He, he loves the Lord. He does. And he's so eloquent with his words and, and, um, he's growing just like all of us. Yeah. I don't know how you could, I don't know how you could, uh, I know, but they do they find a way to say something on occasion.
Um, I'm so grateful they usually pick on me. Okay. But now there's two mama bears. Yeah. So what that No, I mean, I guess you're free after this one. Yeah. You'll see why, you know, I'm not gonna respond in anger anymore. Yeah. But I mean, and I do think there's righteous anger, but there are, you know, there's times when you get internet trolls who say really just rude, disrespectful things.
It's not constructive criticism. It's not a my, it's not a correction. I can, I can even take a harsh correction. Yeah. I don't like just cruelty. Yeah. You know? Right. I don't like you being mean. And, um, you know, my son's a bit of a. Uh, he's got a little bit of that, um, warrior in him too because it seems like I don't really care if they come after me as much.
Right. And he doesn't really care if they come after him as much, but both of them kind of get angry when it's the other one being attacked. Totally. Yeah. Um, and you do develop kind of a thick skin for, for this. Yeah. But there I'm protective of my guests. I'm protective of my son. Yeah. Uh, you know, it takes a lot to come on here and put yourself out there and share your story For sure.
It's, it's hard. It's hard like physically thinking about how you look. It's hard about like being worried you're gonna say the wrong thing. Right. And offend somebody. Yeah. And you know, the internet's crazy. Yeah. They can, they can be mean. Um, so and now it's recorded and it's out there. Yeah. Yeah. And I might change my view just so you know, on some things.
'cause I changed my mind on capital punishment recently. Yeah. So I'm just saying like, you know, give us some grace. Yeah. But also. I do understand how in the meat of the moment I can get emotional and charge off and type off some things that are not so nice. Yeah. I, I, um, I didn't have, um, the ability to type what I said, so I couldn't backspace or delete recently.
Um, so I understand 'cause it was an attack upon my son. Mm-hmm. And, um, and now I didn't say, you know, um, this past weekend I didn't say anything that I, I regret. Mm-hmm. I, I would say it again. Mm-hmm. I'm very comfortable with what I said. Now. My tone and my attitude behind it was very mama bear harsh.
Mm-hmm. Or, you know, I was, because there was some wrong going on against my son and I wasn't interested in sitting and watching it anymore. I, I thought to myself, how did Mary. How did Mary sit? Well, her son is just being shredded. How did she, you know, I've watched the Passion of the Christ. I've watched, um, the series, the Bible, um, I think it's from A and e, or I don't know, but I loved it.
It was 10, there's like 10 of 'em. Mm-hmm. 10 different, and, and, and that one, uh, wasn't as, um, gory or brutal as the, the passion of the Christ was. Mm-hmm. But I, I, I don't, it doesn't matter how many times I've watched it, I don't make it out of there going. Stop, just stop. You know? It's so, I mean, I'm so thankful for what he did, and I'm so thankful for that.
But it's brutal. It was awful. And scholars will tell you it was even worse than that. Yes. There's no way if I was, if I being a friend of Jesus, because I'm his friend now. Mm-hmm. And, um, there's no way, unless he said, looked at me. If he looked at me, then I'd probably be like, okay, I'm sorry Lord. But I would want to say, take your hands off him.
Stop. I, yes. I just, I don't know that I'd be able to keep my mouth shut. Yes. Which is, and I know that's not right because he, he was doing what he was, he was sent to do. Right. I understand that. But I still, it's, it's, it's hard to watch somebody in pain. Yeah. It is. And it's not easy, which is selfish. Right.
That's selfish. Well, it's selfish if we're not praying to God. Right. Right. And we're not doing his will. Right. If we're doing our will. Yeah. Right. Right. And I think. That's where we need to check our heart. Mm-hmm. What's our, what's our motive? I, is it to relieve some pain for us? Is it to exact vengeance?
Is it to get revenge? Right. And I mean, or is it because we're doing the will of God? Right. And I think those are all choices and we, um, you know, there's consequences to all those choices For sure. And you know, with what I went through this weekend, you know, we had prayed and, and talked about it and, um, what are we gonna talk about next week?
And, and when you got the word justice, I was like, oh, cringe. Like, what do you got Lisa? And I'm like, not that, but I was, I agreed that that was, I was like, yeah, that sounds right. Oh, I wish it wasn't. But it sounds right. It was like one of those, you know, I've heard the don't pray for patience because of what you go up against.
Mm-hmm. And so it wasn't that I was praying for justice because. That's, I, I wasn't proud. I just knew that that was going to be something that we had to talk about. And I was like, okay, so there's potential for injustice. Mm-hmm. Or at least in my perspective of what I think is being, you know, well, God is so faithful in giving us content.
Yeah. He really is. He really is. I can just expose what's going on in my life Yes. For people to judge. Yes. Here you go. Please don't judge. And here's, here's the situation that we've got is we are imperfect people. Yeah. Trying to follow Jesus the best we can. And sometimes I don't do the best we can, to be honest.
Yeah. And but the idea is, is that we're kind of all in the same boat. Yeah. There's nobody really perfect out there but Jesus. No. But the point of sharing our imperfections with you is one to see that. Okay. We can help each other out. Like you can learn from our mistakes. You don't have to go down this road maybe.
Yeah. Yeah. You know, I Hopefully you don't go down this road. Yes. And hopefully that you can learn or you hear yourself in our story and you wanna correct too. Yeah. You know, um, with what happened this weekend, we went to my son's final. Oh, we didn't know at the time that it was his final, um, baseball. Of the season, but we went to the other side of the state to go watch.
They were in their super regionals when I heard super regionals. Can I just say, I thought of, um, dodgeball. That's funny. I was like, listen, cotton, we gotta get super regionals. We gotta go to super regionals. Okay. So we made it to the other side of the state and we had had some issues with my son and playing.
Mm-hmm. And I'm not one of the crazy parents that's like, you know, my son deserves a ribbon and a trophy for everything. No. I believe in fairness and merit and I know how hard my son has worked and I know what he has done and I know that he is a good ball player. And, and I will add this young man is ranked.
Yeah. It's not like he is, she's just saying, oh, my, my kid deserves to play. No, he's, he's ranked, he's good. He's, he's good. And so, because my husband and I had to step in mm-hmm. And say something. We're wondering if there was retaliation. I'm gonna show you parents, you don't come to me and mm-hmm. And question, you know, question my authority, my decision making process.
And you have that right to do that. Mm-hmm. You most certainly may do that. Mm-hmm. And, and we encouraged our son. Our son did go and do, I mean, we followed the proper, proper channels. Right. You know, it was the, the Matthew 1815. Go yourself to your brother if they've sinned against you. You say that, then you bring other witnesses.
Well, my, he's still my son. Right. And, uh, as a child, I mean, he just barely turned 18 less than a month ago, and he's still in high school. So I, it's my job to still follow through with some of these things. And so my husband and I, we did follow through and. And as we were over here, the first game happened and they won.
And my son never played and that was okay. Okay. And so, um, my husband's like, well, he'll play in the next game. And I was thinking, no, he's not gonna, I didn't say it, I just thought it. Mm-hmm. And so I was already starting to percolate, like get a little, get a little mad about it. And so the next day came and they played their game.
And I know in my heart that my son was supposed to play, I know he was supposed to, and he didn't because the pre the, the regular catcher that they have been using, he actually is coming off an injury and was still injured and was not even able to run, um, full speed and, you know. Mm-hmm. Because he was still limping.
So and so, I thought, okay, for sure. They'll use him to kind of ease, which they should. I mean, that's why you have two catchers. I don't wanna put this out there, but. Your son is also a ranked higher than this kid, right? Yes. Mm-hmm. Like substantially. I'm not saying that to be mean to the other kid. I'm just saying that to show that there's actually an injustice here.
And you're not a crazy baseball mom. No. No, I'm not. And you know, even if it's okay if people think that Yeah. But that's, that is not the case. Yeah. They can still learn. You can still learn the lesson if you think she's crazy. Yeah. You still can. And so, so I thought, okay, so he got to bat one time. Mm-hmm.
My son did. And he gets up there, he bats, and the bat completely breaks. And I'm like, well, this is indicative of the season. Wow. This is really interesting. Wow. And so, and it was a good hit. It was a decent hit. It was a single, he made it first. And, and so then they pulled him off, which was wise because a lot of times he'd get into a pickle and then get caught.
Mm-hmm. So he shouldn't be running, so he, they should pull him off for that. Right. Um, anyways, and so then. Nothing ever came about. He never played, he never hid again. He never did. And I'm like, now I'm starting to boil and I'm starting to get mad and I'm looking at my son and he's still going and getting the bats for the boys.
Um, he's high fiving 'em after each inning. He's still encouraging. He's sta you know, he's still doing all the things and I'm just sitting there going, are, are you kidding me? So they lose this game and I'm like, huh, now we gotta play one more. 'cause it was a double elimination. Um, and so they gotta play one more.
So I'm thinking there is no way that he's not gonna play. I have prayed for this boy. I am a faithful, I, I pray faithfully for him and the injustices that have already occurred this season. I'm like, Lord, you have got to come through. This is, you gotta come through on this. Like, I believe in the word and I speak the word over my son and I speak your word and there is power behind it.
'cause I have faith. So okay, I'm gonna watch you show up. And then I, there's this check again in my spirit. It ain't happening and it ain't happening. And I'm like, Hmm. So Cooper, I see Cooper standing in the dugout and he looks over at me and he's like, I'm not playing. And I was like, oh my. And I'm just, now, I'm so mad.
Mm-hmm. I am mad because I'm seeing this other kid who's injured out there playing, which is not just to him either. No, it's not. And I'm thinking, why are we doing this? What, what is the point? And I'm thinking, Lord, what am I missing? What, how, what did I miss? How do, how am I okay? I don't even get this. And so now I'm, I'm mad here and I'm like, and me and dentally, we talked about justice.
Here we go, here's the justice thing. And so I'm, I'm, you know, I'm upset. Um, there was a gal that came over and I, this season did not really engage with the parents. Um, and it's not because they're not nice, they are nice people. I just didn't, I just was being removed. Mm-hmm. Very, I just did not feel comfortable and wanted to just be kind of by myself and, and, um, so I didn't know who this gal was, and she came up to me and my husband and she says, you know, I think we should say something.
Are you going to play the seniors? And I was like, oh. And then she mentioned her son's name and I was like, I was like, oh, oh. And I go, oh yeah, her son's not playing. And I'm realizing that there's a couple other kids that hadn't played either. And so there's multiple seniors that haven't played and we are about to end the season.
And so not only are we going to end on a loss, but now we're gonna end on them not even being able to play. Right. And my son actually got more playtime 'cause he had one up to bat. So I'm like, okay, I'm trying to be grateful for this moment. Um, 'cause what's the saying? You know, you, if you're grateful, then you can't be mad.
Right. So I was really going back and forth with, okay, I'm grateful. And so it was fake, right? It, it wasn't true. I was not really being grateful. I was just trying. But you were trying to be who you were supposed to be. I was trying, I was making the attempt. And so when this gal said, you know, let's, let's say something and I'm thinking, yeah, go ahead and say something.
I'll back you up. Because normally I'm the person. Mm-hmm. People say, Hey Lisa, go say something. And I'm the person that will bold. Yeah, you're bold and you will speak up for the people who need speaking up for, which is part of what we're called to do. Yeah. I will do that. And, but sometimes I sit back and go, okay, your turn and I'll follow you.
And anyway, so nothing happened, but there was another mom that said something to me, and this is where I probably, no, this is where I did not handle it well, because now the anger was coming out. Mm-hmm. Because, and I was directing it at this parent who I know is in good with. With a coach. Mm-hmm. And so now I'm going, 'cause you're a favorite.
You get this, whether that's right, wrong or indifferent, it doesn't matter. I I shouldn't have done that. Right. Right. Like, and I know that that's not right. Um, but what I said wasn't wrong. What I said wasn't wrong. Right. Wasn't incorrect. It wasn't incorrect. But how I went about it was completely incorrect because I wanted to have justice for my son.
Right. I want to unpack a few things that you said. Okay. Let's say, 'cause we can't know for sure the coach's heart. Yeah. I don't know the coach's heart, so let's just assume you're correct. And this is retaliatory behavior. Okay. This is the problem, right. This is where you have the injustice. We have an oppressive leader.
And you can have this in a church. Yes. You can have this anywhere. An oppressive leader who, um, wants the power Yes. Or wants whatever in, in this scenario, let's say everything you said is true and we know it for sure, right? This coach wants to maintain his power and he's gonna put you in your place, right?
And so he's going to punish your child. Yeah. See the injustice. And it's the same with the other, right? That's, this is why I put it, put that together was because there was others who had gone forth and said something. And so they, there's kind of a pattern there. And, and I've seen that with other leaders in mm-hmm.
Different areas in churches, in um, in businesses, in boyfriends. Yes. And, and it can be anywhere. It can be anywhere. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Where there is, and that this is where injustice occurs, right? Yeah. They, we have an oppressive leader who doesn't wanna lose power, maintain power. Yes. Um, we see it in, like we said earlier, in our politicians, and I just keep seeing this Epstein thing.
It just keeps coming to my head Yeah. Of where we have this women. Who are now women. They were children. Yeah. Who were marketed to rich and powerful people. Yeah. Right. And they wanna maintain their power, so they're gonna punish anyone who brings this up. Apparently the Maxwell lady, you know, she, she gets to go to jail, but none of the offenders are seeing, where are the offenders on that?
Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Where, where are justice? I don't care who they are. I don't care what side of the aisle they're on. No. That expose them. I'm sure it's on both. Expose them. I'm sure it's on Both is why it's not come to light. It's the oppression. And it is, it's that power that people don't wanna let go of.
And the important, the reason I keep bringing this up is we don't wanna become oppressors. No. We don't want to, as we gain power or influence in any way, any way of our life. Even, I mean as a, as a mother, as a wife. 'cause as women, if you're a woman watching this, we have great influence over our husbands, over our families.
Yeah. Uhhuh. And how do we wanna wield that power and influence. Right. Right. Well, and you can still, you can influence as, as a leader, you can influence and actually have more power. Yes. Through grace. Because look at Jesus. Yes. Look at Jesus. Yes. The p the power that he had with, with over. Demons. Mm-hmm. His presence, they scattered.
They scattered. They didn't, they didn't want to stay in it. That was just his presence. Mm-hmm. It wasn't, and it wasn't him like getting fistful or getting angry or it, it, it wasn't like that. He was very, I mean, he did, he did cast things out. He did, you know, when he cast the, um, out of the seven sons of Skiva?
Is that what, where it was No, no, no. Jesus cast the demons in the herd of pigs. They'd been previously with the two men. The demons had been previously in two men. Yeah. That's not what I was thinking, but I, I was thinking of Jesus being with the, with the men, and he cast the, he casts. It's not because he, he started flipping things.
He started being aggressive and angry. It was just by his words. It was just by his presence, his presence, his his grace, his demeanor. And it forced these things to, it forced them to change their location. Mm-hmm. They had to change their location. So the presence of Jesus changes everything. Changes everything.
Whether that be in us, and I think of your son when you said this, how he was out there high fiving everyone. He wasn't getting to play. He probably knew he'd been robbed, right? Yes, yes. For sure. And he was still out there high fiving, cheering on his team. Yes. Doing the right thing. Yes. Right. Yes, he was.
And being full of grace. Full of grace. Just like, I mean, I'm not saying he's Jesus, but I'm saying using Jesus as an example, right. Because he's been given grace. Uhhuh. He was given grace is what you had said to me earlier. Yeah, he, that's one of the things, 'cause I was so upset 'cause I saw his face. Mm-hmm.
He was devastated. This is his sport. This is what he wants to do. He was absolutely devastated and, and I'm just shaking my head going, I don't, you know. I don't, I don't see any justice in this whatsoever. And, and being in involved in baseball, in other sports and knowing how sports work, like, I don't know where we missed it.
Why you can't play? I, I don't know. And I'm watching this injustice and when I see my son, you know, afterwards we were talking about it and I was like, G you know, mad. And I'm telling him, why are you being nice to these people? And he's like, mom, God has shown me so much grace. I have to give it back. And I was like, oh geez.
And when you told me that the first time, what hit me was, oh, we've got an oppressive leader. We probably don't have a lot of believers. This is on a public school team. Yes. Mm-hmm. This might be the only Jesus some of those people see. Yeah. Yeah. And what an opportunity for God to change a heart. 'cause that's where it happens.
Even at Calvary. Right? Mm-hmm. This is where hearts were changed. Even the soldier who had tortured and mocked Jesus Yeah. Came to believe. After his grace when he says, forgive them God, they know not what they do. And you and I were talking about this, and it takes Jesus to change the heart. Yeah. Um, and in, um, first Samuel, it talks about David's heart was changed, not because David changed it, the Lord, it specifically says the Lord changed David's heart.
And, um, I was telling you this, that my son, last year at 17, he had the opportunity to go to Uganda, Africa on a missions trip. Um, I wasn't there. My husband wasn't there. I mean, he was so brave. Um, but I was really like, can my son handle this? I mean, and he prayed and he fasted and he was, he was very obedient to all the things that the leader had told him to do.
And, um, so he, he was great in his preparation and before he had even left. There was a change in my son and I know his heart was changed. 'cause I know the Lord changed it. The word changed it. Right. If we want to deal with injustice. Yeah. Okay. Um, I think there's some very practical ways to do it. First of all, we reflect Jesus.
Yes. Right. That's first and foremost. We gotta change our mindset. Yeah. We reflect Jesus. We be Jesus. We be the light. So you gotta put on the whole armor of God before you go out. Yes. Get dressed. Don't go out naked. Right. Don't go out there exposing yourself. Yes. To put on that armor and be mindful, which is not what I did.
I, I knew potentially what the challenge was going to be. 'cause you already knew this was happening. Yeah. And I, I had prayed. We had prayed, my husband and I had prayed. I know my daughter was praying. I know my son was, I even know my mom was. Um, my friend who showed up, she was praying, um, but I don't know that I took the time to say, Lord.
Shut my mouth or help me with my emotions or help me with my unbelief because as I'm getting emotional about it and seeing this injustice, it's because I'm not believing mm-hmm. That God is going to come through or that he's sovereign. Right. Or that Oh. Or that this is okay for your son. Right. Right.
That, and I think this is the difference between, and I get trapped in this too, especially with your kids. Yeah. I don't know what it is, but um, that's that worldly mindset versus a kingdom mindset. Yeah. And you know, God has a big plan. Yeah. And I just keep seeing, I know this is, I just keep seeing Jesus in this, obviously.
Yeah. Right. Just like him. It is finished. He went up there, he walked up in Calvary. His grace, love, and mercy brought people to God. Yeah. Your son's grace, love, and mercy over this whole situation is bringing people to God. Yeah, for sure. And e even if it's planting a seed. Yay. Yeah. Like even if it was, this was God's plan the whole time.
Yay. The amount of parents that saw this and it was, it was uncomfortable for other people. Yes. They were uncomfortable for, because they were like, oh my gosh. They were, they had so much compassion and they were seeing it, and, and I really hope that they reflect on Cooper. Mm-hmm. And not necessarily his mom who was emotional.
Um, which forgive me Lord, and whomever else, you know, but, well, I don't know. I, okay, so I'm gonna have a quick sidebar on the emotions. Yeah. Emotions are co, emotions are useful, right. Jesus. Wet. Jesus was sad and angry. Yes. Like it's okay to have emotions. Yeah. Right. For sure. And I think that the church gets this messy Yeah.
And I don't like it. I don't like it how it tells us we're not supposed to have emotions. 'cause we are, they're indicators that something's wrong. Right. Something's wrong. Well, the Lord knows who I am. Yep. And so as much as he has me do things, I have to be bold at times. He knows that that boldness is sometimes gonna go off the edge.
And it has. Yeah. And he knew it would. He knew it would. And so I know I'm forgiven and I'm not giving myself leeway to do that because there is correction immediately that's coming upon me. Right. We don't abuse his grace. No. We learn from it. No. And we grow. Right. No. And I expose it online and, and you and I are not the same people we were five or 10 years ago.
No, no, I'm not. Those mama bears. Well, I, I'm embarrassed. I could, I I would be too embarrassed to maybe even share some of those stories at this point. Yeah, for sure. You think I'm ma making mistakes now? You should have seen me before. Yeah, totally. Yeah. So I really like this story 'cause I like to liken it to, um, Jesus's walk, right?
Yeah. So there's empathy. That's the first thing Jesus does. Yeah. Right. He has empathy for whoever he is with. Yeah. Whether it be, um, Martha and Mary with la uh, about their brother Lazarus dying, right? Yeah. In John 11. John 11. Mm-hmm. I can't remember that still. Yeah. Just talked about it a minute ago. Just a minute ago.
Yeah. Anyway. And you see him compassion with having compassion with the woman at the Well, yeah, with the woman. Um. Who is gonna be stoned to death. Yeah. Right. You see, time and time again, Jesus going through these things where there's an injustice. 'cause I just don't think it's just to stone somebody to death.
Right. When they weren't stoning them men for the same thing. Right. I don't think that's justice. Right. No. It's all the thing. Yeah, I agree. So, but he's, he has compassion and love. Yeah. And that's what he shows up with. Yeah. Yeah. He does every time. Every time. Then he's always in prayer. So this is kind of my, my list of how we should deal with injustice.
Right. We, we develop a, a kingdom mindset, understanding that we're not gonna have justice. Like it doesn't come the end of the story. It tells us we are not gonna see it. We're not gonna see that. Yeah. So we develop a kingdom mindset and understand that our plan might not be his plan. Right. So Lisa's plan of her son playing and in that game didn't happen.
Not at all. And you know, as you say that, here's the stark difference between the two of us Uhhuh. So my son was in the dugout. He was speaking in tongues to himself. Oh, praying. So he was in prayer. Yep. And his mom is sitting in a chair stewing. Where was my focus? My focus was not on the Lord. It was on the injustice.
Yes. And, and his was on the Lord. And that's why he was able to. Smile and wave, he was able to go pick up. He wasn't grabbing those bats and throwing, he was not, he wasn't, he's like a golden retriever. Just happy, happy, good, and always happy to see everybody like, Hey, you know? I mean, he'll push back when some of the kids, or people push, you know, he'll push back.
He's not, he's not like that, but, but he was just happy. And I understand where you were as a mom and this is his senior year. Yeah. Like I understand the frustration that this is his last game. Yeah. Or you, I mean, you didn't know it at the time. I didn't. Well, I kind of did. I was like, but I'm thinking. You can't play these kids.
Mm-hmm. I mean, we're losing, they've 10 run us like Right. Play 'em now. Who cares? It's done. And by the way, people, we get, there's bigger injustices in the world. This is for an example. This is example because we're going through it. Yeah. Like she's just going through it right now. Yeah. Right. So yeah, we went through it over the weekend.
Yeah. It's fine. It's done. Yeah. But, but it's it'ss a good example of your son showing up like Jesus, having the kingdom mindset, having the empathy, being in prayer. Yeah. And reacting with God in obedience. Right. I'm guessing. I mean, 'cause that's what Jesus did, right? Yeah. He said, God, I, I don't know if I really wanna take this scup.
Are you sure? And God said yes. Yes. And he walked on. Right. Okay. Cooper could have said, Hey, I'm not gonna go and show up for this game 'cause I know how this story ends. Right. He didn't. And he showed up. He showed up. He did, he showed up with a smile. He showed up with grace and he was, he showed up for his team and he was willing to give it back, you know?
Yeah. When, when the parents, as we're watching this injustice are like, you know, just discu, we're like, we got bigger fish to fry than to play this game. Right. And this is just, it's dumb. It's dumb. Why are you doing this to kids? Like this is to kids. This is leadership and, and are you being a good steward?
Are you being a good steward of kids? You know? Yes. And that's kind of where our mindset was. Um, just because it was wrong. Yeah. It was. And it's okay. And God, we are called to speak out. Yeah. I think we have a scripture right here for just to that occasion. Yeah. That I wrote in my many notes. It was Proverbs 30, oh, Proverbs 31.
Speak up. For those who cannot speak for themselves, defend the rights of the poor and needy. Yeah. But here's what we have to balance that with. Prayer, prayer and timing. Yes. Meaning, okay, God, I know this is true. I know the word's true. So if you tell me to do it, I can do it, but I also want to have your permission to do it now.
Yes. Yeah. It's knowing his will versus my will. Yes. My, I did know that. Because we can manipulate this for sure and say, oh, the word says this. I, I, this is my job. Well, this is how I can tell the difference. My will was me yelling at this, you know, we already tried that, blah, whatever I said, versus the way je Jesus would not have handled that that way.
I mean, he did flip a table. He did, but he would not, I, I, I, I'm pretty positive. No, no. Probably not in this situation, but it, it, I get, but I'm, I'm saying. Jesus flipped tables. Jesus walked in compassion. Jesus was calm, Jesus was angry. Yeah. Like it, he had all of those emotions and he did have all those reactions.
But I will say this, not one time did he do one of those things without God's blessing. Without God's blessing. I did not have God's blessing. He not, yeah. He did not flip a table without having God's blessing. Well, maybe I had God's blessing. I don't know. I didn't seek it. Right. See, that's the thing, like in that, the hindsight, right?
Yeah. You can kind of see, and I hear from the Holy Spirit, so, right. And so, and I can check, you know, like, okay, but I didn't. I think that's the importance is before we react, and I, I say this as, you know, I didn't do this myself this week. You know, reacting to my husband poorly. Yeah. And probably being an oppressive person myself in those moments.
And, um. You know, I, I, I'm not above that. So that's where, you know, I'm at, in this conversation, I'm speaking to myself. Right. I'm not speaking to you. Yeah. And it's in the reaction and then it, is it vengeance in my heart. Like do I want him to be punished or do I want him corrected? Right. Yeah. I, I usually, I usually seek the correction.
That's, that's my heart. You just finder than me. That is my heart. I want the correction, my, because I don't wanna be punished. Revenge is different than vengeance. To me. Vengeance. God says vengeance is mine. Right? So it's not bad. He gets to do it though. Right. He gets to do it. And truthfully, and this is where I think God's not just He, look what he did for us.
Like, we do not deserve to be safe like we were. Right. We do not deserve to have Jesus pay for all of our sins. That's not fair. That's not just, it's not just that it landed on one man, but that's his system. But that, yeah. That's grace. Yeah. Right? Mm-hmm. So there's, there's grace in his system, um, where the scales don't really equally balanced.
Right. And in our era, so if I'm to be godlike and understand this example of grace Yeah. Um, like your son did. Yeah. Like my 18-year-old did. Um, I shouldn't want vengeance either. I. Right. And, and the reason vengeance is his, I believe, is because he does love us all so much. Every single one of us that he does want every last person saved.
And the reason he wants us to seek his heart and look like him and be the love that brings people to him, that brings true transformation through Christ. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Is so that people can be saved. Right. Not by us exacting vengeance. Yeah. I, I, and I, I'm pretty positive that if anybody knew I was a Christian there, it's 'cause they were a relative or a friend of mine.
And, you know, and so I, I am sorry and I repent for that. I mean, uh, people saw that I was hurt and mad and, and, um, people saw you were human and you, you, you got corrected. Yeah. And it's fine. And you're gonna be different next time. There won't be a next time. Well. Yeah. No, but yeah, there wa Yeah. When I am presented.
But you have a daughter. I know, I know. That's why I'm saying there won't be a next time you have a daughter. When I presented with that situation, that scenario or something like that. Mm-hmm. I have a, I ha I now see how the other choice right. Is better for me than this one. It's, it's so much better for me to handle it in grace, because I just have to allow that, you know, it's like, I think of the tornado.
You've got the tornado and you've got the eye of the storm. Mm-hmm. And if you're standing there and you can be there and you can look up and you can see the clear blue sky. But if you allow that storm to pass, that's when everything will settle. And you can actually get a purview of what's really going on.
Mm-hmm. And what has been damaged. Right. And what hasn't. And what can be repaired and what can't be. But if you're just like, if you just stay running with the, if you, I'm not a storm chaser, right? I don't wanna chase the storm. I need to allow it to pass. And I need to remain calm. You know, we said this before, Jesus walking on the water in, in the, in the storm and you know, Peter's out there and when Peter got nervous, he sank.
Mm-hmm. And, and the storm's going on. And, and you know, you've got the, you got the disciples in the boat and Jesus in the boat and they're waking him up. He's resting and sleeping in that storm. And I did not rest in that storm because I didn't think the Lord was gonna come through for me or for my son.
See, this is the other thing. This is step number six in this trusting that God is sovereign. Yeah. It's part of the kingdom mindset, right? Yeah. That God is sovereign. And I think when we can find that place of rest, and I, I'm just saying, um, as a theory, 'cause I don't have this down either. As a theory, it seems like, wouldn't that place of rest be, oh, okay, I'm gonna hang out with God here.
Yeah. I'm gonna rest in you. I'm gonna pray with you. I'm going to know what I'm gonna seek you for my next steps. Because some people say, well, we should just pray about it. Well, yeah, but sometimes there's action involved too. Pray. Yeah. We pray to say, Hey God, this is happening. We pour out to him and say, Hey, do you want me in this coach?
Yeah. Hey, do you want me in this coach? Do you, do you want me to take action? Do you want me to be quiet? And he'll tell you, yeah, he totally will. But he, he'll tell us. Yeah. And, but we can't really. Hear from him in that place of anger. Right. No, you can't. And, and, or I don't want to. I should say maybe you can.
I don't know. I've not, I've never been able to do it. That doesn't mean it can't be done. Well, and I believe that you, I mean, you have these opportunities for growth. I'm not saying that God presented this, but I am saying that there's a, God always gives me a way out of temptation. And I was tempted to be mad Yes.
To, and I was tempted to get into unbelief. Mm-hmm. And I did. I was in unbelief. It, again, it didn't turn out the way I had hoped. My son did not play in three games. He, I mean, he bat, he batted, um, but he did not play in three games and. They lost in his high school career, was essentially over with that, that that's how it ended.
But that's, that's the ends end of his story's. It's not the end of his story. And he's story. He's going to Arizona, he's playing. He's good. He's good. He's good. And the lessons he learned from this, the humility Yes. And the grace. And know how much his mom loves him, even though it was a mistake. Oh, he saw how much you loved him?
Yeah, for sure. And you stood up for him? Yeah, because he, I mean, I did say to him, do you want me to do something? Mistake? I don't know that it was, I think my allowing my e emotions to be, so I think the mistake was not praying first. Yeah, for sure. Mm-hmm. But I, I don't know that what you said or did was a mistake.
Yeah. I don't know. I don't know that it is either. I wasn't there. I don't think what I said was wrong. It was very correct. Would you have delivered it better? I could have. Did you think about it? Yes. I could have delivered it better. Yeah. Sometimes I have a tendency to be. Sharp. Me too sharp. And that can come across as combative.
Okay. Because I essentially am combating what you're saying or doing. Right. Because I will challenge it because I don't have that fear. Just because we believe for our son to play in the baseball game doesn't make it happen. No. Right. And it doesn't mean that he's gonna, it doesn't mean that, it doesn't mean I'm right either.
No. But it but it, your beautiful son gave a, a huge testimony to who Jesus was. Yes. He sure did. Even to me. Yeah. And me, and I hope the, for the people who was watching, who are watching too, and I think, like we said earlier, there's only one way to solve injustice. And I, I don't think we get to see that No.
In this lifetime. Um, we, we get to see that in the next one. Right. Um, where there is no injustice, but. We can change the world. Yeah. We can change our world around us. And you know how you were talking about politics at a local level? Yeah. I think we do that with our heart. Yeah. When we change our heart and let Jesus invade us.
Yeah. And every part of us, and we reflect him, it creates a ripple effect within our own family. Yeah, totally. Which obviously has in yours. Yeah, for sure. And your son has leaped off your shoulders. 'cause like you said earlier, I don't know if you said it in this podcast or another one where, you know, Cooper hasn't had all the years that you did to, and the programming to undo that you've had.
Right? He he started at about six. Yeah. Getting, um, Jesus, right. Getting, uh, the word spoken into him. That started for me at 39 ish. 40. So, so there's still undoing, there's still a lot of undoing, you know, and he gets to leapfrog off of where you are now, which is the beauty of it, which is why we're seeing him shine.
Yeah. It's why we're seeing him shine so much and it's so beautiful. Yeah. And one of the, one of the justices that I, I do believe will happen is I said, Cooper, when you grow older, when you have kids, I don't, I don't know, whatever it is that, that the Lord leads you to do with your life, if he ever has you coaching your child or other children, I guarantee you, you will take a softer approach.
You will take a, an approach that is more inclusive, that is more understanding and more reflective of the Lord versus the world. And this is how we change the world. Yeah. Right. Is is by looking the heart change, but also by being better from watching those who didn't get it Right. Right. You know? Yeah. I mean, none of our parents got it.
Right. We didn't get it right. Right. I mean, I'm sure my kids have learned how not to do things for me. Right. Yeah. I know. My kids got that one down, down for sure. So I think. You know, um, because there is so much injustice in the world, we need to pray about it and see where do you want me, like, if it's a cause, let's say it's human trafficking, maybe if that just makes you itch, maybe it's because you're supposed to be involved and helping eradicate that.
Right. And it doesn't mean screaming on social media likely. Yeah. It might mean joining a cause. Right. Right. Yeah. But I, it's again, pray, pray, pray and see where God wants you. But ask him, ask him specifically, do you want me in this fight? Right. How do you want me to show up? Right. Because we are called to speak.
We are called to, um, walk with God and defend the oppressed. Yeah, we are. We are. And that, that is one of the things that, that I've, um, that has always been in the forefront and, and in the back of my mind mm-hmm. Is being a good steward of that, which has been given to me. Mm-hmm. And these kids have been, they're his first.
Mm-hmm. They're his first. Right. And I know that. And so I'm honored. To be their mom. And I know I didn't get it all right. But I know that I can say I've done my best. Mm-hmm. And when I didn't do my best, I, I repented. And I've even, you know, I've apologized to my children. I, you know, we've had discussions and I've said, you know, I didn't get it right and I hope you can forgive me.
And I, I love it when my children say, mom, I forgive you. And they hug me and I'm like, okay, this is the time I want you to learn from what I did. Mm-hmm. And make note in your heart, don't do this. Well, apparently they have learned. 'cause you have a son who has a great amount of humility. Yeah, he does. Yeah, he does.
He's really, and he knows God. Yeah. So, um, kingdom mindset, pray. Yeah. Walk in obedience. Yes. Forgive mercy and love. Yeah. I mean, those are the big examples. Jesus showed up on that cross and your son showed that day, like, he's not angry. He has mercy and grace for the whole situation. And, um. Yeah. I think we really work on getting closer to God and changing our hearts so we can change those around us.
For sure. And that's how we change things. Yeah. And it, it's not, it doesn't happen fast. And I think that's the problem. People want instant, they want things resolved. I mean, I do too. I'm not saying I'm above that. 'cause I am. That's what I want. I I, who wants a child to suffer? Nobody. Right. Nobody. No. Um, well, that's not true.
Yeah. That's not true. Yeah. But I, I, I, I thought there would've been this, you know, with the prayers that I had had and mm-hmm. I thought, oh yeah, I'm gonna see. Okay, we'll see. Yep. We'll see the glory of God out there. We did. I know, but not how I thought is, isn't he always how he works out? Yeah. Yeah. It's never, and I love, love this lesson.
I'm so thankful for it. Yeah. And I'm so thankful to see Cooper that way. Like, I'm like, praise God, you know, I'm impressed and I'm impressed in his character. I impressed. Yeah. Like I learned from him in. I wasn't even there. I was like, I'm impressed by this kid's character and God is doing something mightily in, in the children in this next, um, age.
You know, like I just, when you see God working, when you see that forgiveness, when you see that understanding, that mercy, that grace, when you see that it is so, it's so humbling and beautiful, and whether it's through your child, somebody else's child and these young adults, I, I just am impressed. It is. I, yes.
It gives me hope. It renews hope, doesn't it? When the kids got it. Yeah. Like better than me. Yeah. I'm like, okay, we're gonna be okay. Yeah, we're gonna be okay. Because it doesn't seem like it when you look outside, right? Yeah, no it doesn't. Um, I just wanna thank everyone for listening. Um, be sure to like and subscribe.
It helps us and next week we are gonna be talking about on the podcast my trip to the Dominican Republic that God told me not to take and I went. Disobedience and the evil demonic and spirits that I encountered, um, I had not believed that the devil was really a real thing before this point. Right. And so we're gonna share that with you and why you walk in obedience besides just the obvious, right.
God is trying to protect us. That's right. And, um, look forward to seeing you then. I guess we don't get to see you guys, but look forward to your comments. Thank you for supporting us. Thank you.