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Impact-driven leaders are committed to reaching a higher standard — in consistency, in quality, in intentionality, in relationships, and ultimately, in growth. In this episode Alex and Ben discuss the importance of these 5 areas and what it looks like to hold yourself to a higher standard in each one. They also share examples of organizations who have established and maintained high standards, and they caution leaders to avoid overindexing in any one area at the expense of others.
Information isn’t the gap between failure and success—action is. Path for Growth’s 1-on-1 coaching helps you create a plan and execute on what matters most for your business. Apply today at pathforgrowth.com/coaching.
Episode Recap:
- To be an impact-driven leader is to commit to a higher standard
- These 5 standards are necessary ingredients for making an impact
- How can leaders avoid overindexing on these things?
- What organizations have established standards well?
- 1. Consistency: If you want to build a consistent team, you must show up consistently as a leader
- 2. Quality: Focus on serving, selling, and scaling in that order
- 3. Intentionality: Your intention drives your attention
- 4. Relationship: When you invest in your people, it will pay off in dividends
- 5. Growth: If you don’t define healthy growth for your business, you’ll adopt the standards of people around you
If you’re ready to move beyond just gathering information and start executing on what truly matters, Path for Growth’s 1-on-1 coaching can help. Apply now at pathforgrowth.com/coaching.
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Creators and Guests
What is Path for Growth?
Path for Growth exists to help impact-driven leaders step into who they were created to be SO THAT others benefit and God is glorified.
So we were doing a three day in person experience in Colorado Springs, gosh, about a year and a half ago now. And one of the things that we always do for our in person experiences is we choose a theme that we're gonna center all of the content, of the conversation, all of the direction for the leaders in the room around. And we had about 40 leaders at this particular experience. And the theme of this experience was a higher standard. And the way that we defined a higher standard in the opening talk was the decision to be held accountable to an elevated benchmark.
Alex Judd:And so the first thing that we said is it's a decision. It's something that you voluntarily opt in for. And then you're saying, I'm going to apply myself to a higher bar, to a higher benchmark, to a higher standard. Right? That's the definition that we were operating with.
Alex Judd:And for the opening talk, one of the things that I thought would be a really cool exercise was to kind of ask the question, what are the nonnegotiable base level higher standards of impact driven leaders? Because we always say, you know, our company exists to help impact driven leaders, people that view their business, their career, their work, their life even as a vehicle to make difference in the lives of others. And so the way I came at this particular lesson is I just made a list of impact driven leaders. People that I look at and like, I'm like, man, those people really exemplify what we're talking about when we use that that name or that title. And then I also made a list of impact driven brands.
Alex Judd:And I looked at this list of impact driven leaders and impact driven brands, and then I just asked the question, what do all of these have in common? And what we ended up with is a list of five core attributes, five higher standards of impact driven leaders, and that's really what we're gonna be kind of diving into and having a conversation around today.
Ben Loy:Why higher standards and why these higher standards? Like, what specifically about these and, I guess, their nature? I mean, you can list them now if you'd like Yeah. And that would probably be helpful.
Alex Judd:So why a higher standard? Particularly for impact driven leaders. Well, we already said this. If you wanna be an impact driven leader, you're saying, I wanna make a difference. I I can't even remember who said this, but someone once said, everyone wants to make a difference, but no one's willing to be different.
Alex Judd:It's like, that's kind of true and probably more true now than whoever originally said that. Right? And so what we're saying here is these are the things that you may even run the risk of over indexing on. Right? These are the things that you're really gonna apply yourself to because in some ways, I would say these things are the necessary ingredients if you want to make an impact.
Alex Judd:Right? It's kinda like we're baking a chocolate cake, and there's none of that gluten free crap here. Right? Like, we're saying, you can't skip one of these. Right?
Alex Judd:It's not an option. There there's no one of these five that you're going to leave out if you're going to make a positive, healthy, sustainable impact is kind of the claim that I would make. So we'll list the five, and then these are what we'll dive deeper into in conversation if that sounds good. Number one is quality. Number two is consistency.
Alex Judd:Three is intentionality. Four is relationship, and five is growth. Now my hope is that no one listening to this podcast hears one of those, like, what? That is revolutionary. I've never thought about that.
Alex Judd:And and we all know I think it was Socrates that said learning is often remembering. And the issue isn't that we don't know these things. The issue is that oftentimes we don't do these things. And for me, some of the podcasts that I'm most interested in are the ones that recenter me to the things that actually matter most. So that's one of the goals of this conversation.
Ben Loy:You mentioned over indexing as, like, that that being a possibility. Can you explain more on that?
Alex Judd:Well, the way I'm kinda talking about these today is not all that dissimilar from the way we teach and talk about core values within companies and maybe core values personally too. And I'll never forget when I read in Pat Lencioni's The Advantage, brilliant book on organizational culture, One of his criteria for something to be a core value for a company is he says, you know it's a core value if you're willing to accept that it may get taken too far. And he said because otherwise, it's probably not a core value. It might be like a an aspirational value or a nice thing, but it's not a necessary thing. That that's kind of what we mean whenever we're talking about over indexing.
Alex Judd:We're we're saying like, it's possible to obsess over these. It's possible to become a little bit overboard on some of these things because you're so driven and passionate about making an impact. Now, we've talked about at length before on this podcast, like, don't think obsession, especially sustained obsession, is a good thing. But, you know, it's kinda like you might be a redneck if, well, you might be an impact driven leader if you are prone or have a propensity to going overboard on these things for a season or for a time.
Ben Loy:It also makes me think, like, there's a reason why there are five that exist or why often companies or organizations want to have multiple core values, because sometimes those other core values might actually add checks and balances to overemphasizing a specific trait or standard. Yeah. What are your thoughts on that?
Alex Judd:So it's almost like how do we make holistic sustained healthy impact? It is a really good question, and it's not by saying, oh, man. This is our season of growth. And then after our season of growth, we're gonna have a season of consistency. It's like, no.
Alex Judd:I think healthy sustained impact, which we're now adding qualifiers to this. We're not just talking about impact. Right? It says, I'm gonna find a way to simultaneously grow and be consistent and prioritize relationships. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, we're we're gonna do all three. And to the degree that we have to abandon some to focus on others, we're not applying ourselves to healthy growth, which is obviously what our company is all about.
Ben Loy:Low hanging fruit, what are some telltale signs that maybe you don't have enough established standards in your organization or in your team?
Alex Judd:Oh, that's an interesting thought. I'd love to know your response to this question too, But I guess what I would say is what I often run into, especially with impact driven leaders, is not that they don't have standards. They don't have what you said. They don't have established, defined, formalized, and documented standards. And so the telltale sign is they are frustrated because they have all these expectations in their head of how they think the business should work or how the team should operate or how interactions and communication should occur.
Alex Judd:And then they walk around their office or they observe an interaction, and they actually like the team member. Right? It's not like they they think the team member is an idiot or something like that. They actually like the team member, they think they're a good person. And they just look at them like, how do you not get this?
Alex Judd:How do you not understand? Because they think that everyone just sees the world the way they do. They think that everyone has their standards. And in reality, we all have standards. Right?
Alex Judd:The standards that we either tolerate, that we adopt, or that we inherit. And a good leader helps their team intentionally adopt the standards that they wanna apply across the organization as a whole.
Ben Loy:What are some examples of organizations or teams or individuals who have established standards well?
Alex Judd:I mean, Chick fil A stands out. And then if we wanna watch our waistline a little bit, I would say Lifetime Fitness is probably a little bit more of a healthy approach than Chick fil A. It's always funny to me because Chick fil A has such established standards, I legit think people go in there and they're like, I'm making the healthy choice today. It's like, you are literally eating fried chicken. It's like it's like but they convinced everyone, like, oh, we're so good as an organization.
Alex Judd:They're a healthy organization, so it's healthy food. It's not healthy food. Yeah. You're still eating fried chicken and french fries. But, I mean, my pleasure is probably the greatest example.
Alex Judd:I I don't know if I've told you this story before. One time I was in a Chick fil A, and someone dropped a piece of trash on the floor, and I just bent down and grabbed it for him. And they said, oh, thanks so much. And I said, my pleasure. And then I looked down, and I was wearing a red shirt, and I was like, they definitely think I work here right now.
Alex Judd:But, right, that's a standard that is literally, like, so ingrained, my pleasure, that it has transcended beyond the counter that now their customers understand it and even come to expect it. Right? When I think about lifetime fitness, this goes to what we talked about on a previous podcast episode, language creates culture. I scan my, entry pass on my phone for lifetime fitness, and then I walk in, and the first thing the person at the desk says is enjoy your workout. They always say that, and you can tell that's an ingrained standard.
Alex Judd:The other thing that stands out to me is a a lot of those things are like customer interaction and interface. There's two other things that stand out to me about Lifetime Fitness that are clearly standards that they've established is if I tell them, hey. I'm bringing someone on a guest pass, which they have an unbelievable guest pass program that I think for them is actually just brilliant marketing. Right? But the first thing the person at the desk and I have done this at multiple locations around the country, the the person at the desk will say, okay.
Alex Judd:Why don't you come around back here, and I'll make sure I get you set up on this iPad to get your guest checked in. So they've clearly understood that we do not want a line backing up as the first thing people see, or we don't want people crowding the desk. So the minute you have something that is gonna take a little bit longer, you bring them around to the back of this circular desk that we have at the front. Pretty awesome. The the final one that stand out, and then I'd love to hear your thought on brands that exemplify high standards or that hold standards well, is at Lifetime.
Alex Judd:Well, let's talk about a previous gym that shall not be named that I used to go to. Right? This gym did not have as high standards as Lifetime, and stuff would break. And literally what they would do when stuff would break, which was literally all the time. And sometimes it's like, that's the only machine that you have that's broken.
Alex Judd:And it would be like, I mean, the equivalent of a kindergartener riding with crayon on a sheet of paper broken. Right? And it's just like that that is a small thing. But one of the things that we're about to talk about in these higher standards of impact driven leaders is the way you do anything is the way you do everything. Right?
Alex Judd:What does Lifetime do? They literally have this templatized printed sheet that says this machine is currently out of service. It will be repaired by blank. And then they write in the date. Yeah.
Alex Judd:And so they are basically saying, and it even has an apology on it, I think. They're basically saying like, man, the value that you pay for isn't currently operational. However, we are making a commitment to you that it's gonna be backed by x y z. So in some ways, they're making a decision to be held accountable to something in that way. And that's just, like, such a small thing that for me, as someone that's paying a monthly fee to go there, I'm like, yes.
Alex Judd:That is worth the extra that I pay to go to this gym versus the kindergartner that wrote broken and crayon on a machine.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Well, first, I think the most shocking thing to me from the Chick fil A story is that you're wearing a red shirt.
Alex Judd:This is years ago. Years and years ago. This is a previous I've been born again. Into black,
Ben Loy:I guess. Yeah. That's right. But, yeah, I mean, I know I've shared with you the two that stick out to me the most are both organizations I've worked for or companies I've worked for, and the first one is is First Watch, the breakfast cafe. Mhmm.
Ben Loy:They at the time, I actually got hired into a locally run breakfast restaurant chain Mhmm. And they got bought out by First Watch. And so I was there to witness them come into a preexisting organization and completely rebrand and establish their standards for what excellence was. And so it gave me a really unique opportunity to actually help open five different restaurants in the Tucson area and see those standards, like, played out and trained multiple times over and over and over again. And one of the things that just really stuck out to me was I mean, in many ways, I think you you touched on this.
Ben Loy:Like, in any gym across America, if a piece of equipment is broken and the staff knows about it, there is a there is an expectation that there's gonna be at least a sticky note on it that says, hey, this is broken, like, don't use it. Right? Mhmm. But going beyond the bare minimum and establishing a set of expectations and standards that communicate excellence, it just takes an extra layer of intentionality. So with First Watch, one of the things, you know, you have your five steps of service, which are an industry standard of just like the steps you need to take, the actual physical actions you need to have and interactions you need to have with the table to get them from walking in the door, sat at the table, to food ordered, bill dropped, and then they leave.
Ben Loy:And so that's something you can look up on Google. You just type in the five steps of service of waiting a table, and, like, it'll show up. They, however, established an entirely new set of rules, and they called them the 10 commandments of first watch. And you had to have them completely memorized and essentially mapped out from start to finish what serving a table under the standards of First Watch and their core values and how they wanted people to experience their restaurant, looked like. And that was greeting a table within two minutes with a cup with a pot of fresh hot coffee, and if they have coffee, leaving that at the table.
Ben Loy:You know, orders taken within, I think it was four minutes, food arrives within ten minutes, bill is dropped off halfway through the meal so that they don't feel rushed, but at the same time can leave whenever they want, and then clearing the table and making sure that they're they're taken care of. And then I think their last commandment was like, accomplish all prior commandments with, like, a posture of hospitality and a smile or something like that. And so it was just there is the expectation, there's the five steps of service of, like, here are here are the five things you need to do per the industry that result in, mostly, like, people coming in, being fed, paying and leaving. And then there's the standard they set, which was, here are the standards we have put in place to to create a culture that gives the customer a good and consistent experience when they walk into our restaurant.
Alex Judd:What's so cool is I I don't even really remember how it came up, but I have been kind of enamored with First Watch's service for quite a while now because there's so many things that I look at, and I'm like, that feels intentional. And I you know, they're they're a scaled company now. Right? So it's same everywhere you go, which anytime I see that, I'm like, that's remarkable. And then I I can't even remember how it came up, I think I was talking to you and you were like, oh, I worked there for and I was like, praise God.
Alex Judd:We get to go under the hood. This is gonna be really fun. But, here's what I think it can be really tempting and easy to believe as a leader. If you're in the quick service food industry or something like that, you're like, man, the thing that First Watch has cracked the code on is they've got some reservoir of really great people that they hire that are just, like, they just show up great. And and, man, First Watch has somehow cracked the code on finding exceptional talent.
Alex Judd:And if I could find the exceptional talent that First Watch is able to hire, then we would have the same results as First Watch. And in reality, that's actually not what it is. It's they do hire good people, and I'm sure they have a hiring process, but then they just establish standards that they say people like us do things like this, and they create a culture where, you know, if you have a really emboldening and honestly, think biblical view of people, it's like most people most of the time are actually trying to do the best that they can and you can really serve them whenever you create, hey, this is what winning looks like within this role within this restaurant.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. I think the other example, and this is a much more intense and extreme example of when standards are done really well, would be the Coast Guard. Like, we actually just crossed over the twentieth anniversary for Katrina about a week ago, and you just look back at the way that they respond to to hurricanes and the natural disasters. And specifically, on the aviation side, which is what I was familiar with, the intentionality in the way
Alex Judd:that
Ben Loy:they establish standards across the fleet and across the country is really incredible. And the way that that looks is, you know, in the in the context of Katrina, right, storm goes off in New Orleans, thousands of people without power, without access to resources, stranded often, and you can pull a pilot from North Bend, Oregon, and a flight mechanic and a rescue swimmer from Atlantic City, New Jersey, and you can stick them in an aircraft in New Orleans basically overnight, and they're talking the same language. They're operating under the exact same standards in the same aircraft, and can accomplish the mission and, honestly, save thousands of lives because those standards have been put into place and established. And there is actually, like, a team exclusively dedicated to maintaining those standards and establishing those standards across the fleet year round.
Alex Judd:And I think you share with me that the Coast Guard is uniquely effective at that in terms of our nation's armed forces. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. So, I mean, that that's so cool.
Alex Judd:I think sometimes we think whenever we talk about scaling a company, we say scaling company is incredibly complex. Right? And the reason why we say that is because it's incredibly complex, but we think that the route to scale effectively is equally complex. And in reality, how do you counter complexity effectively? It's simplicity.
Alex Judd:And so often, the thing that I see in companies that want to go from one location to two locations or two locations to five locations or things like that. We work with a lot of companies that are at that critical juncture of saying, man, we've crushed it at this location. We now wanna do multiple locations or multiple business units or things like that. We work with a lot of people that are doing that. The people that do it effectively are the ones that make ruthlessly simple and and they document it.
Alex Judd:What are the things that we do that make us successful? And it sounds like that's what the coast guard has done really, really well.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Yeah. Doubling down on what's working. Mhmm. Yeah.
Ben Loy:Let's talk a little bit about consistency. What is the difference between consistency and intensity? And, I guess, what are some of the challenges there as a leader that seem to creep in?
Alex Judd:So, yeah, let's go from the organizational viewpoint of things now to the individual person. I mean, the way I experience it is, like, you will have seasons of intensity. Right? And and I guess the way I'm thinking about intensity right now, it is where you are maybe living on the edge of failure. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, you are exerting yourself in a very, very deliberate and forceful way in multiple arenas of your life. Right? I mean, I I would say personally for me, like, got married in the past two years, had our first kid. First kid gets diagnosed with an extremely rare genetic disorder, and we've got a business that is experiencing a lot of growth right now and a lot of fruitfulness. But part of that is we've had a lot of changes on the team, and it's only a five year business.
Alex Judd:And so for me, the past probably six months to a year have felt like a season of great intensity. And in some ways, chaos can be used to describe some of those arenas. Now I think it can be really easy to fall for. It's a lie. Is that, man, if I feel chaos or if I feel like there are certain things out of control, then I just gonna kinda have to throw up my hands and say, well, this is a chaotic season, and I'm just gonna basically surrender to the chaos.
Alex Judd:And in reality, I would say it's the exact opposite approach is probably most helpful is that, man, in seasons where certain arenas feel chaotic or unknown or uncertain, that's when it will benefit you the most to basically subdue some of that chaos into order in your life. So whether that's like, dad gum it, I am going to wake up at the same time every single morning, period, end of story. Or I am, you know, I do five at five every January. Like, I don't care what's going on in the outside world. I'm going to do five miles at 5AM, six days a week in the month of January.
Alex Judd:And it's wild how you could look at that and be like, okay. Well, this is a really tiring season. Is that actually the best thing to do? I I've done it now for, gosh, like, nine or ten years or something like that. I have never had a year where it wasn't the right thing to do.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. Right? Because it's like I enter into the day after doing that, and it's like I've established, I've I've accomplished something during the day, I've sweated. I've put my mind on the right things, and I enter in so I might be tired, but at least I'm able to counter the chaos with the level of consistency. Right?
Alex Judd:You know, it's why we focus in coaching on leaders establishing a high return habit before they do anything else in their business because we believe that if you wanna put your business in order, you should start by putting yourself in order. And the cool thing about that is you do not need to change everything. What we say is what's the one thing that you would do? And that's an important question. Would do.
Alex Judd:Not could do. Would do. What's the one thing that you would do that if you were to do it, it would make you know, it would have a larger ramifications for every other part of your life. And what's crazy is people choose pretty simple things, but those simple things when they do them every day, oh my gosh. The the ripple effect of that is just so powerful.
Ben Loy:Yeah. So we talked, I guess, about personally, then when you're when you're carrying that beyond yourself, what are some practical considerations to take when trying to communicate that consistency beyond just yourself?
Alex Judd:I honestly think the most practical consideration for me if I want a consistent team and a consistent organization is I have to be a consistent person. Like, I actually think that is the most practical because I don't think the consistency of your team, like, let's what's the proper principle based way to say this? Your organizational consistency will never exceed your personal consistency is is how I would think
Ben Loy:of it.
Alex Judd:And so so often, visionary leaders say we just need to be more consistent. We need to be more consistent. And the first question I would ask is, do people experience you as consistent? Because to the degree that you are, I bet your organization almost can't help but follow in some ways. But to the degree that you're not, some ways, you're being hypocritical because you're asking the organization to do something that you can't do.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Yep. Tell me about a time that showing up or being consistent was ruthlessly inconvenient at the time, but then, like, paid off in dividends later on.
Alex Judd:This is a deeper story that, you know, it it's actually currently right now in the book that we're writing. It's the way that I start the book, so we won't tell the whole story right now. But my first job out of college, I actually got fired from. And it was it it was that would be dramatic for anyone. Right?
Alex Judd:It was I would put it in the category of traumatic for me mainly because if I struggled with idolizing anything whenever I was, you know, in my early twenties, it was work, right? And suddenly and I think that was actually part of the problem. Like, I ended up getting fired from my job, and, I mean, the slate basically got wiped clean for months, right? And I still look back at that and I say, like, that single, like, it was four to six month period was my fork in the road moment, right? Where it's like, you are either gonna lay down and just quit on life because you feel like life has quit on you, or you're gonna take responsibility and you're gonna choose to see this season redeemed.
Alex Judd:And one of the things that happened right before I ended up losing my job was I had done a couple I had done a handful of marathons, and I had done a few half Ironmans. And I would always go to the gym, and I would see this guy from my church at the gym all the time, this older guy, really successful businessman. Love the guy. His name is Dirk. And still stay in touch with him anytime I go back down to Austin.
Alex Judd:He would always just encourage me. He's like, when are you gonna do a full, Alex? When are you gonna do a full, Ironman? Like, come on. When's it coming?
Alex Judd:And like we talked about before, he believed more in me than I believed in myself. And finally, he asked me one day at the gym. He said, dude, you done all these half ironmans. When are you gonna do a full ironman? And I said, man, I want to.
Alex Judd:It's just it's a lot of time, and it's a lot of money. And he said, Alex, if you make the time, I'll make the money. And he showed up church the next Sunday with a thousand dollars cash and handed to me. Wow. Yeah.
Alex Judd:That's that's
Ben Loy:how much an Ironman cost.
Alex Judd:Right? It's an expensive high maintenance sport. Yeah. And and so he took away all my excuses. There's more we could talk on that story, but unbelievable, like, vote of confidence.
Alex Judd:So that happens. I sign up for the iron man, and then literally, a few months later, I lose my job. And so now we're in this blank space period, and I have this decision of am I gonna quit on life, or am I gonna keep moving forward and see this season redeemed? And the thing that kept me on track was I have that finish line in, like, five months, and I've gotta be ready for that. Like, I can't I mean, there's no off days when you're getting ready for an Ironman.
Alex Judd:Right? And I had this huge training plan laid out, and it was ruthlessly inconvenient. That is the exact phrase I would use Sounds about right. To, like, have to get ready for that. But I praise God for the fact that in some ways, like, I had such a massive reason to be consistent in that season because, doing my daily workout to get ready for that 140 mile triathlon had so many, like, effects, ramifications, implications for me opening my bible after I finished working out, for me praying, for me taking the job hunt really, really seriously and thinking about the next, you know, 10 of my life really, really seriously.
Alex Judd:And in so many ways, I really think that the man that I am today, praise God, is a direct result of the fact that I had to be consistent in that season. Wow. Yeah. I don't think I've shared that with you before. No.
Ben Loy:Yeah. That's that's incredible.
Alex Judd:Yeah. I mean, it was a good question, but that's why that I mean, I I would not qualify myself as a very consistent person before that funeral And so, yeah, like, that's why I'm so passionate about sharing this with leaders around the country now is because you have no idea the type of person you could be if you would just be consistent. Mhmm.
Ben Loy:Yeah. That's really funny because I feel like when I met you back in was it 2022, I think, when you moved Mike. Yeah. Yeah. I I feel like consistency was one of the words I most likely would have described you as, like, a consistent individual.
Ben Loy:You know? Yeah. That's really interesting.
Alex Judd:And that's why I think you and I are both passionate about physical challenges in some ways because they enforce consistency in a way that, you're almost embodying it, and it affects other areas of your life. Right? And and so I would say if you want to be more consistent in your business as a leader, I actually think that's really hard. I I think that's harder for me. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, I I'll have seasons where it's like, wanna consistently write for an hour every single day. And that's really hard because you don't get the same payoff at the end of that hour. At the end of a workout, though, you get the payoff. And so what I would tell people is if you're looking for a way to instill consistency, do it in the physical realm first, and and don't be shocked when that starts to have a lot of implications for your work, for your marriage, for all those other areas. Mhmm.
Alex Judd:Right?
Ben Loy:So the next one on here is is quality. And one of the things that stuck out to me in the story you just shared was this guy creating an environment for you to be consistent, right? Mhmm. And like grow inconsistency and and pursue this thing. And I guess what's the difference with creating expectations for the people that are following you versus creating an environment for the people that are following you?
Ben Loy:Yeah. And how is that related to quality?
Alex Judd:Well, in some ways, I think expectations versus environment or expectations versus culture might be what we're talking about. If we're talking about organizationally, might be expectations are the first nine commandments of First Watch's 10 commandments. Culture is the tenth commandment, right? Because I think, you know, you could probably say it better than I could, like people at their table in the first two minutes or or, you know, you're interacting with the table at the first two minutes and the first, you know, ten minutes they've ordered their food, right? They get you you set all the basically, the expectations for how the service operates.
Alex Judd:And then the tenth commandment was heart of hospitality and service essentially. And it's like, you could do one through nine exceptionally well, and if you suck at ten, it's not gonna matter. And so we need the standard expectations so that people actually have the tools to win. But then we have to pair that with the culture, which in some ways, culture is just your organizational attitude. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, we you have a personal attitude that you want, and it's really easy to express. It's really easy to be a positive person when you're around other positive people. It's really easy to be a hospitable person when you're around other hospitable people. And so I would say focus on what are the attitudes that you want people to personally hold, and then how does your organization how is your organization set up so that that type of person just says, oh, man. I'm just around my people in some ways Yeah.
Alex Judd:Is what I think of.
Ben Loy:So when do we start to deviate from quality?
Alex Judd:I think that's a really good question, especially in the context of impact driven leaders because there's no one that we work with, right, that, like, is actively trying to create a bad service, bad product, or even mediocre. Everyone is very committed to quality. How do we unintentionally drift? And I think we mess up the order of operations is essentially, I think, what happens. And this actually connects to what we already talked about at the very beginning, which is we over prioritize growth.
Alex Judd:We over index. Right? We lean so far into growth. And so the order that I think is proper in terms of the way we're approaching how we are growing our organization is, number one, get really clear and consistent on the question, how do we serve? Right?
Alex Judd:What do we serve and how do we serve? And and that's you really understanding both your customer base, your product, and you getting maniacally consistent and deliberate about making sure that your product really meets the needs and solves the problem of your customer. Right? So how do we serve and what do we serve is the first question. The second question is how do we sell?
Alex Judd:But we go off the rails on quality whenever we ask, how do we sell this before we get into how do we serve people? That's why we had, we had chips and guac with your brother the other day, right? And your brother's growing a business specifically for training, like, world class professional swimmers because your brother's a professional swimmer to teach technique and run clinics and provide coaching for swimmers around the country. It's an unbelievable business that's already seeing, like, pretty incredible success early on. And it's interesting talking to your brother, like, it's almost like money is a side thing for him.
Alex Judd:Right? It's like, he's so deliberately focused on how do we make sure these kids their parents see that we can help them learn these techniques, we can help them improve in the pool, we can increase their water confidence, all that. And then how do we set up our coaches that we're going to hire to be able to make a living outside of Olympic years? And he's so focused on those two things that it's like those are taking the lion's share of his attention and energy right now. And it's like he's asking it in order.
Alex Judd:He's asking how do we serve? And then you can start to say, once we've got that, how do we sell? A lot of people, they say, what's going to sell? And then we'll figure out how to serve on the back end out of order. And then the third question is how do we scale?
Alex Judd:And it's supposed to be in that order. How do we serve? How do we sell? And then how do we scale? But I see a lot of companies out there that they create something mediocre that people don't actually want, and then they ask the question, how do we scale?
Alex Judd:It's like, dude, like, go back to the beginning Yeah. And just focus on serving people really well.
Ben Loy:Yeah. And I mean, really, the thing that I I hear across a lot of the topics we've already hit is in is that piece of intentionality.
Alex Judd:Yes.
Ben Loy:Right? Like, being ruthlessly intentional about what are you about, what is your purpose, where are you going, and then what are, like, what are the steps that you're planning to take to to get there. Right?
Alex Judd:Which that's the that's the third higher standard of impact driven leaders. So number one that we talked about was consistency. Number two is quality. And then number three is establishing a sense of intentionality. Right?
Alex Judd:I think, the word intentional actually gets overused, especially in leadership culture in that we forget what it actually means. Right? We think that, oh, I wanna be an intentional person. We think that means I wanna be a good person. When you say I want to be an intentional person, I want to be an intentional leader.
Alex Judd:I wanna be an intentional husband. What are you saying? You're saying, I want to be a person, leader, husband that operates with a decided and desired sense of intent. It means that I have an aim. It means that I do exactly what Stephen Covey talked about, which is mean means I'm gonna start with the end in mind.
Alex Judd:And we wash that out when we think intentional just means good. Right? It was so cool. I was texting back and forth with one of our customers earlier today, and he's thinking about coming with a member of his team to our next in person experience in Austin that we're doing focused on long game leadership. And I was just going back and forth with him on, like, the decision that he's working on, and he said, hey.
Alex Judd:I I think we're gonna come, but I'm not a 100% yet. He said the thing that we talked about this weekend is my wife sitting down and making a list on what would have to be true for me to go on this trip and for it to be a win for you and the family for me to go. And I read that, and I was like, praise God. Like, if you end up not being able to come, that's totally cool because, like, that's the type of intentionality that we're talking about. Right?
Alex Judd:And it's it's just having the guts to ask the question, what does winning look like?
Ben Loy:Yeah. I think it's Matt Chandler says a lot, in the context of your relationship with the Lord, if you're not, like, you're being formed by something. Mhmm. Right? And just what you're being formed by is a matter of how intentional you are being with your relationship with the Lord.
Ben Loy:Like, you're either being formed by God and by His word, or you're being formed by something else. And it's really your choice based on how intentionally you want to be on what that is.
Alex Judd:Yeah. The principle that stands out to me from that is, like, your intention drives your attention, and your attention forms you. Right? I I I'll never forget. There was this was years ago now that we were we had had a family dinner, and my grandma Williams was at the table.
Alex Judd:And I can't even remember the context of this, but, like, someone wasn't listening to what you're grandma Williams is a personality and a half too. So this was just a moment. Right? And, someone wasn't listening or someone wasn't getting what she was saying, and she just said, pay attention. Pay attention.
Alex Judd:And I heard that, and I was like, that's the first time I realized, like, oh, we literally deem attention as valuable because we say you pay. It costs you something to give your attention. And so, like, we don't hopefully spend money recklessly because we know that, like, my money is gonna create a return of some type. Mhmm. And and the same should be true of our attention.
Alex Judd:And where our attention goes is oftentimes best directed with intentionality. Mhmm. Saying, man, this is what I want to focus on in so many ways.
Ben Loy:What are the enemies of intentionality?
Alex Judd:The first one that comes to mind for me is ambiguity. And what I'm particularly talking about there is ambiguity of vision. If you don't know where you're actually going or you don't know what you actually want, then it's hard to be intentional. It's hard to get traction on anything. Right?
Alex Judd:We've already talked about this some, but distraction. Right? Distraction. Dis is a partner away from traction, sustained progress towards a worthwhile goal. Well, so often we get distracted because we haven't described what our worthwhile goal is.
Alex Judd:That's why our father, who art in heaven, hallowed be your name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done. Thy kingdom come. Like, what are we actually saying there?
Alex Judd:What what is the kingdom of God? The kingdom of God is that which is most good, right, beautiful, and true. And so when we are saying, I want the kingdom to come, we are saying, I want that which is most good, like perfectly good, right, beautiful, and true to exist here on this earth, to exist in my life. Right? And I wanna be an ambassador in helping that come to pass.
Alex Judd:Well, it's an exercise in intentionality before a meeting to say, how could this meeting run-in such a way that I would be able to describe it at the end as good, right, beautiful, and true? How could this podcast run-in such a way that, man, we would look up at the end of our recording, we say that was good, right, beautiful, and true. You know, how could I relate to my wife whenever I get home from work today, and I would be able to lay my head down on the pillow at the end of the day and say that was good, right, beautiful, and true. That's an exercise in intentionality. And what we're really saying from a Christian perspective there is, man, I want a piece of heaven to invade my marriage, to invade this recording, to invade this meeting, and want to be a part of that coming to pass, which is, I mean, in some ways, just invigorating.
Ben Loy:You know? I mean, one of the things you just communicated was how that intentionality can can affect and seep into the people around you and the relationships around you. So the fourth thing we're gonna talk about is relationship.
Alex Judd:Mhmm.
Ben Loy:When it comes to leading others, how does your relationship with them weigh into your your impact and ability to elevate them?
Alex Judd:So let's lay out two scenarios. There's someone on your team that is a good team member. They're a culture fit, but they're struggling right now. And you're feeling like you you need to challenge them a little bit, like they've either become complacent or there's something that's drawing their attention away, and it's not good for them. It's not good for the company.
Alex Judd:It's not good for anyone. Right? And so, you know, your role as leader is I I need to really challenge that person. In option a, you have zero preexisting relationship with that person. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, you you don't know their spouse's name. You don't know their kids' names. You don't know anything about their life outside of work. The last time you talked to them was two or three months ago, and now you have to go in and challenge them and, you know, basically say, need you to, like, perform at a higher level than what you are, and I believe you're capable of it, but I need you to perform higher. That's option a.
Alex Judd:Option b is you know them, you've met their spouse, you know their kiddos. Right? Like, you you talked to them last week, and you know some of the circumstantial things that are going on in their life. You have regular conversations where you just curiously ask questions about what they're working on and how you can help and what's going on in their world and all of that. And that's the context within which you need to have a really strong heart to heart with this person and say, hey.
Alex Judd:I need you to level up. You could use the exact same script in both scenarios and say, hey. I really care about you. And because I care about you, I need you to level up and perform in a higher level. Stop being complacent.
Alex Judd:Move the ball forward for us in this area. Option a, it's not gonna carry any weight. Option b, it could change their life.
Ben Loy:Mhmm.
Alex Judd:Right? Relationship. Relationship is the single thing that makes a difference. That's not why we engage in relationship, but it is one of the practical pragmatic effects of doing business in relationship because, you know, it's the old school quote. People don't care what you know until they know that you care.
Alex Judd:And I would maybe modify it a little bit and say people don't care what you know until you show that you care. And so you specifically asked a question about helping other people elevate. That often involves encouragement, but it also sometimes involves challenge. And if you challenge people outside the context of relationship, it will feel like condemnation. And the and nine times out of 10, they will bucket and go the other direction.
Ben Loy:Yeah. It kinda goes back into what we talked about with expectations versus a leader creating the environment in which they can challenge. And, like, part of that environment is relationship.
Alex Judd:That's right. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, I had a realization gosh. It was probably a year and a half, two years ago now.
Alex Judd:We have a remote team. Right? And I had a realization that, man, Olivia in particular. Olivia directly reports to me. She's our coaching manager, and, she's a dear friend, and she's someone that I love working with.
Alex Judd:But I had the realization that, like, we're both busy people. And if I'm not careful, the only time Olivia hears from me is when I have feedback for improvement or when I'm asking her for something. That is, like, when she that's when she sees my phone number show up on her phone is worth one of those two things. And so I just had this realization. It was actually in prayer one morning, and I just said, no.
Alex Judd:No. No. Like, we're gonna do something different. And so that day, particularly, I had a little bit of flexibility in my schedule, and I remembered she had done a panel a couple months before that actually wasn't related to work. She got invited by a local church in the area to facilitate a panel of women in business, and she facilitated that panel.
Alex Judd:And she had sent me the recording, and she said, hey, if you have time, I'd love for you to just check that out when you have a moment. And I said, I'm gonna listen to that, and then I'm just gonna make a list of all the amazing things that she did, and then I'm just gonna call her and give her that list. And so I I listened to it, and I gave her a spontaneous phone call. And I swear, she picked up the phone and she said, hey, Alex. Like, here we go again.
Alex Judd:Right? Is it feedback or is it a request? And and I and I just said, hey, Olivia. I I just had something real quick. We can do the two minute version or we can do the thirty minute version, whichever you prefer.
Alex Judd:Just let me know. And she said, well, gosh, I I wasn't really expecting this phone call, and I was literally just sitting that kids down for lunch. And so could we do the two minute version? And then if we need to schedule the longer version later, we can absolutely do that. I said, yeah.
Alex Judd:It's totally fine. I said, we'll do the two minute version. Olivia, I just made some time to go back and watch the panel that you facilitated, and I was just so blown away by how confident you were, by how intentional you were, by how prepared you were. I made a list of five things, but we probably don't have time to go through all of them now. But I just wanna say, you asked such good questions and you've clearly done your homework.
Alex Judd:You did such a good job of engaging both people on the panel and people in the room. You did an excellent job of providing examples to make you feel relatable, but not making it about you because that wasn't the focus. And I just wanted to say, I'm just so proud of you, and I just love the way you represented us on that panel that day. And that's it. And she said, okay.
Alex Judd:Maybe the thirty minute break. Right? And and it just was eye opening for me, right, of, like, man, I don't want my people to only hear from me whenever I'm asking them for something or whenever I'm giving them feedback. But, again, this is what you mentioned at the beginning, that requires intentionality. You have to carve out time in your schedule and intent to say, like, they're gonna experience me in a different way, but what we're really focusing on here is that's an investment in relationship.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Well, I think in that context, and I think even in a broader context, especially in the culture that we live, the greatest risk we run with the people around us is that we have transactional relationships. And that phone call bridged that gap from being a transactional relationship with her to an actual, like, relationship with Mhmm. With feedback and encouragement, and it it just added an extra layer of depth that probably in the context, know it probably was already there in that context, but maybe just hadn't been engaged in the same way. So that it's cool that you recognized that risk and then took action to fight against it.
Alex Judd:And I I actually loved sharing that story too because it's not like I had the proactive wherewithal to be the amazing leader that recognized the risk. No. I was doing it wrong for a period of time, and and I had that realization. And so what why I love that is because that means we might be talking to people right now that look up and maybe like, oh, there's people on my team that the only time they hear from me is when they're doing something wrong. Well, the good news is is literally you can make one phone call today that changes their experience of you in that regard.
Ben Loy:Yeah.
Alex Judd:The final, I would not say it's a point that we'll be able to spend much time on here today, but I think it it would be our way of setting up a future podcast is you and I just recently listened to it was a lecture that Tim Keller gave to a group of marketing and sales professionals in New York City. It was so good, and maybe we can link that talk in the show notes because his take on it was just so nuanced and helpful because he's obviously a pastor. Right? He's you don't really expect to hear him in that in that environment necessarily. One of the things that he said that I've been chewing on and really thinking about as it relates to organizational culture and leadership and how we teach and think about leadership is he said we run the risk societally today of taking things that maybe used to be and should be covenantal and commoditizing it, and that's really dangerous.
Alex Judd:And so the reason why I bring that up here is what we're really talking about there is friendship is a covenantal thing.
Ben Loy:Mhmm.
Alex Judd:Right? Friendship is one of those things that it's like, Ben, as a friend, I'm your friend regardless of how you perform at your job. Right? And I have people that, praise God, like, we don't work with them. And regardless of how I do as a leader at Path for Growth, they're gonna be my friend.
Alex Judd:Right? And that's so helpful for me, and that's so good for me is that I I have those covenantal relationships. Now we run the risk of things that are actually contractual or commoditized, like those taking over things that are covenantal. And so the the reason why I bring this up here is if you're a really relational leader, you and people love the work, you run the risk of them having their only friends be at work and them having their closest friend be you being their leader, and maybe you're their only best friend that they have. And I actually think that puts you and them in a really, really bad spot because now they need that job.
Alex Judd:They need that job not just for income. They need that job to be a socially stable person that has community. And what I would say is we need to be coworkers that that treat people like friends, that act like friends, that even operate with some of the standards of covenantal friendship. But we need to never forget, this is not a covenant. This is a con contract at work, and it is in everyone's best interest for you to have covenantal friendships outside of work and not to look at us to be that for you.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Yep.
Alex Judd:We that could be a whole podcast. Absolutely. One
Ben Loy:of the things I really appreciate about that lecture and, honestly, I mean, we talk about it a lot, like, the last topic, which is growth. Right? What is the difference between what most of the world communicates as growth? So in in the concept of the lecture with Tim Keller marketing, right, growth is such a commonly tossed around term in those in just that field, and it can mean a lot of different things. What is growth in the context of of establishing higher standards and what we're talking about, and then what is maybe growth in the context of what other people think when they think of growth within business or an organization.
Alex Judd:Yeah. I mean, vanity metrics is that, you know, what's our top line revenue? Even to a degree, like, it's much less of a vanity metric, but profitability can be a vanity metric. Right? You know, it's it's like, oh, revenue.
Alex Judd:Right? Revenue is a vanity metric. We're focused on profitability. And suddenly, you're making that, well, look at how profitable we are, and you're just trying to impress people with big numbers. Here's what I've seen.
Alex Judd:I've seen people have massive revenue numbers that are not becoming more of the person that they were created to be. I have also seen people have massive profitability numbers that are not becoming more of the person that they were created to be, and their organization isn't becoming more of the organization it was created to be. And so this is why I would challenge everyone out of this conversation today is think about the standards that you're intentionally adopting. Because if you don't intentionally adopt the standards of what makes me into more of the man, the woman, the leader that I'm called to be and what makes this organization more of what it's called to be, if you don't get clear on what God is calling you to in those areas, you will just adopt whatever is around you, and you will pick up and even by osmosis, you will inherit the standards that are already around you, which may not be your race to run. Right?
Alex Judd:Because we could say growth. You you know, you need to have year over year 20% profitability to be an organization that looks really attractive to a buyer five years from now. And that could be a metric of healthy growth if you're called to sell your company in five years. If you're not called to do that, you're called to make incredible investments into your team members five years over the course of the next five years, you're called to generously give 33% of your profits away, which some of the companies we work with do. If those are the things you're called to do, then it would actually be disobedience to apply yourself to the other path in some ways.
Alex Judd:And so I say all that to say nothing that I just talked about is wrong. I I really believe that. It's nothing is inherently wrong. But if you don't establish what the standard is, I actually don't think you're probably even gonna stick with it long enough to be able to follow through on it because your spirit isn't behind it.
Ben Loy:Mhmm.
Alex Judd:So what I would say a good standard for healthy growth in the context of these other four higher standards is is to to think about it as, like, what's gonna make me into more of the man, the woman, the leader, the Christ follower, the community member that I'm uniquely called to be, and what's gonna make this company into more of what this company is called to be? And in some ways, we're actually reverting to a question we talked about earlier. What would this look like if it were good, right, beautiful, and true? And in light of that, how do I just take daily steps towards that, I think, is what faithful growth actually is.
Ben Loy:In closing out, is there anything you want to say about, or anything additional you wanna say about the five higher standards we've talked about today?
Alex Judd:Yeah. Well, let's review them. It's quality, consistency, intentionality, relationship, and growth. And let's just take four of them, quality, intentionality, relationship, and growth, and then say we're gonna do those four things consistently. And what you will not do, if you apply yourself to those four things, you will not make a massive impact overnight.
Alex Judd:What you will do is you will set up a sustainable framework that if you apply yourself to the fifth one, which is consistency, over time, you're gonna look up. And we might not always be able to draw a direct line to the way you impacted everything, but you gotta kinda have the faith and the assurance and the good cheer of knowing, like, I'm faithfully doing what I'm called to do, and I just know there are dotted lines all over the place that result in impact. And then I would say, how do you stay ruthlessly consistent with it? I would just say, if it's about you, you won't. You are not a good enough reason.
Alex Judd:That's where you have to say, man, that they may see the good deeds and glorify the father in heaven. Make it about drawing people's attention towards heaven, and that's an incredible motivator to say, I'm just gonna keep going. I'm gonna keep making deposits. I'm gonna be Johnny Appleseed, and I just keep planting seeds, and then we're gonna look up and we have an orchard. Praise God for that.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. Thanks, Alex.
Alex Judd:Well, there you have it. Thanks so much for joining us for this episode. If you want any of the information or resources that we mentioned, that's all in the show notes. Hey. Before you go, could I ask you for one quick favor?
Alex Judd:Could you subscribe, rate, and review this podcast episode? Your feedback is what helps our team engage in a sequence of never ending improvement. We wanna amplify what's valuable to you and obviously reduce or even remove the things that aren't. Also, you leaving a positive review is what helps us connect with, build trust with, and serve other leaders around the country. So thanks in advance helping us out on that front.
Alex Judd:Are you a leader that wants to grow your business in a healthy way, serve people exceptionally well, and glorify God in the process? Go to pathforgrowth.com to get more information about our community of impact driven leaders and schedule a call with our team. Hey, thank you so much to the Path for Growth team, Kyle Cummings and the crew at PodCircle, and the remarkable leaders that are actively engaged in the Path for Growth community. Y'all are the people that make this podcast possible. Y'all know this.
Alex Judd:We're rooting for you. We're praying for you. We wanna see you win. Remember, my strength is not for me. Your strength is not for you.
Alex Judd:Our strength is for service. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go.