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Dr. Neha Sangwan, MD and CEO of Intuitive Intelligence delves deep into the pervasive issue of burnout, affecting many in our fast-paced world. Dr. Mindy also shares her own experiences with burnout, launching "fast like a girl" into the world, sparking a quest to understand and quantify this phenomenon. Dr. Neha introduces a nuanced perspective, emphasizing that burnout isn't solely about resting but comprises various dimensions: physical, emotional, social, and spiritual. This conversation is a must-listen for anyone feeling mentally and physically drained, seeking clarity and tools for healing.
To help raise money for nonprofits that support, protect, and provide opportunities to women around the world, go to https://drmindypelz.com/glag/
To view full show notes, more information on our guests, resources mentioned in the episode, discount codes, transcripts, and more, visit https://drmindypelz.com/ep235
Neha Sangwan, MD, CEO and founder of Intuitive Intelligence, is a physician, engineer, author, speaker, and communication expert. She empowers individuals, leaders, and teams with effective communication tools that address stress, prevent burnout, inspire accountability and empower collaboration. She consults for top organizations like Google, American Express, Kaiser Permanente, and the American Heart Association. Dr. Sangwan has shared her work across three TEDx stages and authored two foundational books: TalkRx: Five Steps to Honest Conversations for Connection, Health, and Happiness; and Powered by Me: From Burned Out to Fully Charged at Work and in Life. Her work is integrated into a corporate mental and emotional wellness program titled Bridging-Me-We-World.
Check out our fasting membership at resetacademy.drmindypelz.com.
Please note our medical disclaimer.
We were taught that doing anything "like a girl" was a weakness. Dr. Mindy Pelz is here to prove it's your greatest strength.
A renowned advocate for women's health, Dr. Mindy is passionately committed to helping women embrace and trust their body's natural healing processes. Drawing on an extensive background in women's health, she's developed groundbreaking, science-backed approaches that help women work with their hormones, not against them, through every stage of life, from cycling to perimenopause to the wisdom of the years beyond.
On Live Like a Girl, Dr. Mindy helps you come home to your own body. Every Monday, she sits down with some of the brightest minds in health and wellness for honest, meaningful conversations that hand you the knowledge, tools, and science to do health your way. No more pushing through, gaslighting yourself, or shrinking to fit. Just permission to live in rhythm with the body you were designed to have and to finally feel at home in it.
Press play, and let's live like a girl.
Dr. Mindy: On this episode of
The resetter podcast, we're
going to talk about a hot topic
that is affecting many of us.
And it's burnout. So I have
brought you a burnout expert.
And this is quite a
conversation. So her name is Dr.
Neha Sangwan, she is a MD, and
also a CEO and founder of her
company is called intuitive
intelligence. And she has a
really profound way of looking
at burnout. And so as many of
you have heard me say, I pretty
sure I hit burnout this, at
least in the last year,
launching fast like a girl into
the world. And so I've been
really trying to quantify
burnout, how do you measure it?
How do we know what it is? How
do we know when we hit it? And
so I've had several discussions
with people. But no one has
really given the depth and
context to this condition that
is affecting so many of us as
Neha. And so I bring you a
really thoughtful discussion on
burnout, she has gone through
her own burnout experience,
which she shares in the
beginning of this conversation.
And she talks about how burnout,
this is the part I really love
isn't as easy as just sitting
your butt down and resting, that
there are many pieces of burnout
and understanding which part of
you is burnout? Is it physical?
Is it emotional? Is it social?
Is it spiritual, she walks us
through the different pieces of
burnout. So this is one of those
discussions that I'm going to
really encourage you to listen
all the way through. Because the
end is actually some of the
best, she really sums it all up.
But when I asked her and we got
talking about what her
definition of health is, and her
definition of health was
profound, I have never heard
anybody say it quite like how
she did. So I want you to hear
that. But she also talks about
at the end her own way that she
has now prevented burnout after
spending many years in a burnout
state. So I offer this
discussion to you with so much
love. I know so many of you are
feeling mentally physically
exhausted, and you're not quite
sure where to turn or how to
explain it to your loved ones,
or how to even understand it for
yourself. And I really hope from
the bottom of my heart, that
this discussion gives you a
whole new set of tools, a whole
new language to be able to talk
to the people in your life with
and most importantly, put you on
an incredible journey of healing
and repairing this beautiful
body that you get to live in so
that you don't live in a burnout
state. So here you go. Enjoy one
of the best discussions I
personally have ever had. With
burnout, you are in for one heck
of a treat. So sit back and
enjoy this conversation, hugs to
you.
Welcome to the resetter podcast.
This podcast is all about
empowering you to believe in
yourself. Again, if you have a
passion for learning, if you're
looking to be in control of your
health and take your power back,
this is the podcast for you.
Let me start off by just
welcoming welcoming you Neha. To
my my amazing group of listeners
and to my podcast. I'm so
excited to have this
conversation with you. So thank
you for being here. Thank you
because I know how sacred
community is, huh? Oh, that's
super well said. Because, you
know, anytime I start with a new
guest, there's there's a moment
where I'm really thinking about
the listeners and like, what is
it that they need to hear? And
it's interesting, because with a
podcast, it's almost like you're
having a continual conversation
with the same group of people.
And and with burnout. This is
one that I haven't had this
conversation in many years. And
as a 54 year old, postmenopausal
woman who has been on a book
putting books out like you
multiple, you know, year after
year after year, burnout has
definitely come to the forefront
of my mind and how do we
identify it? And how do we where
do we know that it's time to put
a stop to all the yeses? And how
do we navigate this moment? So
I'm here you know, wanting to
pull information out of you from
my followers, but it's also a
personal these will be personal
questions as well, because I
would I would pretty much say
I've probably hit burnout. I
think I think I've
hit it and I keep dragging
myself through it.
Dr. Neha: Yeah, well, when
you're saying I think I might
have I, and you're even saying
the word, like, you're so high
functioning and go getting and
doing all this stuff, and I
always say, if someone's even
starts thinking about it, like
they're well, well in it, you
know, because Oh, no, it's Oh,
good. That's what it means.
Yeah. Like someone like you're
saying that after you, you know,
you have so much initiative and
so much momentum, and you're
trying to put out podcasts and
do all these things like, by the
time that you're noticing that,
yeah, it means it's real.
Dr. Mindy: That's so
interesting, because about two
months ago, I sat in my
therapists office, and I said, I
think I put burnout, how would I
know? You talked about how you
work with the, you know, these
high performing CEOs. And I
think one of the things that
happens with high performing
people is that we've learned to
just push through, like, it's
just, it's just, you know, you
just learn a job needs to be
done, you're gonna do it. If
your brain is yelling at you,
you learn to tell it to shut up
and you keep going. So what I'd
love to do to start this
discussion is really like, what
is burnout? Like? Can we make it
a tangible thing? Like how, what
is going on in my brain? My
body, like, tell me what it is.
So I can, I can have maybe a
little more respect for that
moment? Yeah,
Dr. Neha: well, I think it is
such an amorphous, overwhelming
experience. And most people
don't know what it is they just
have a vague sense of feeling
heavy or tired or exhausted, and
the weekend or a week off not
being enough. So let's let's
start with the research. When I
found out in 2004, as a hot,
busy, hospitalist physician, I
was 34 years old. So you and I
are about the same age going
through a lot of the same
things. When I burned out, I as
a doctor, I didn't even know
what it was. Because the people
who came to me I would call it
stress leave. And when the
employee assistance programs, so
if someone's struggling in a
company, or whatever, and then
they go to the EAP, EAP, EAP,
sends them to me, I had two
things I could do for people
that I thought were stressed
out, I could write them if I
thought it was, you know, a real
thing, I would write them a
prescription for time off, that
would be paid by their employer.
The second thing I could do is
give them
some cocktail of medications,
depending on the cut context of
what they were telling me. Do
they need antidepressant anti
anxiety, sleep medication,
there's like some cocktail of
medications I can give them to
help them with their symptoms.
That's really effective. Because
they're a bullet train almost
going into a brick wall. So my
job is to, like stop that from
happening, or if it's already
happened, slow their world down,
and help them through the
crisis. So
I had no recollection that that
that was going on. So I was
literally already hitting that
wall. And what I'm really
grateful for is that she
had the confidence to question
me, because for sure, I could
have prescribed the wrong
medication. She could have
talked about me to someone else.
But she had the wherewithal to
say, are you okay? And so one
thing I want you to know about
burnout is sometimes other
people in your life, recognize
it for you before you do, and
you want to be grateful for
that. You don't want to be
defensive. And you mentioned at
the beginning, this high
performing piece, the way I say
it is the way we became high
performing, taking care of the
house. Right, you know, perhaps
working, doing all these things
that we do is because we've
learned to push through our body
rather than partner with it.
Yes.
Dr. Mindy: And we do. So well
said. We do
Dr. Neha: it in so many ways.
Like I'll tell you mine when I
was a busy doctor in the
hospital, crazy to high school
16 ounce MOUNTAIN NEWS was a
king sized Snickers bar and you
could get me through 36 hour
shifts without sleep. So each of
us has a The strategies, the
coping mechanisms, the ways that
we figure out when our body is
giving us important signals, how
to override that to get over the
deadline to get over the next
meeting the next day, the next
week. And so while that serves
us, so in the end, it ends up
not serving us, but for a period
of time, for sure. Okay, so what
is burnout? Let's talk about
backup, if burnout in 2004. And
2003, it was not even
acknowledged as a, you know,
medical like syndrome. It was
like, you know, I think maybe
there's this extensive tiredness
and fatigue and things like it
was nothing. It wasn't until
2019, that the World Health
Organization said, Okay, we
think it's prolonged unmanaged
stress at work at work. Like my
whole thing is like, it doesn't
matter whether it's at work or
at home, there could be a
special needs child at home,
there could be a troubled
relationship at home, there
could be your sister who's
struggling. And of course, it
could be unmanaged stress at
work. But this is what I want to
say, I think the who is going to
come around the World Health
Organization. Oh, I
Dr. Mindy: Oh, I'm so happy.
Well, that's amazing. Well,
Dr. Neha: yeah, I don't know
when but I think someday, it
won't just be labeled at work.
So wherever you have stress that
is causing, this is how I say
it. But wherever you are, from
burned out to fully charged, can
be measured by whether you have
a net gain or a net drain of
energy on a physical, mental,
emotional, social, and spiritual
level. Okay, so each of us comes
here, as uniquely as our
fingerprint. In the end, it's
the same exhaustion, but there's
been an ongoing drain of energy
for a long time. So the
definition of burnout is a
triad. The first part is yes,
physical mental emotional
exhaustion. Sec. Second is after
that's been going on for a
while, your physiology Mother
Nature's like, made to
beautiful, have a machine it a
jaw. Yeah.
Dr. Mindy: Thank you.
Dr. Neha: I know, right?
Strongly
Dr. Mindy: agree, I strongly
agree. And we don't give it at
Mother Nature, enough credit for
what what the this amazing body
we get to live in. So yeah,
Dr. Neha: and it's this
adjustment that goes on inside
us, whether it's our blood
pressure, heart rate, moving all
of this, we can recover,
sometimes with sleep, etc, then
we start doing these things that
are like, Hey, can you make my
coffee this morning to make it a
double, I'm having a rough week.
And we start to adjust on the
outside as well. So we've been
exhausted for a while. And then
the second piece of the triad
comes in, which is a combination
of two things, really an
undercurrent of cynicism, where
your mind joins in the fatigue,
and says something like, no
matter how hard I work, or I
try, I don't know that it's
really going to make a
difference. And so now all of a
sudden, your thinking becomes
the undertow to this exhaustion,
and, and, you know, challenge
physically, mentally. And now if
you start doing things like even
if you're lonely or isolated, or
working at home, or whatever it
is, you start pulling away from
anything social or interacting,
because you just don't have the
energy even though you need it.
You want the community you have
this thing called
depersonalization, where you
start pulling away and you start
referring like I did that day,
the general the guy in 636, I
didn't say Mr. Jones, I didn't
say Miss, you know, whatever.
I'm starting to deep
personalize. Okay, so we have
the exhaustion. We have the
cynicism slash depersonalization
asserts going up. And then the
third part of the triad is
ineffectiveness. And I gave you
a really good example of that,
when I hit that wall of saying
the same thing five times in a
row and not registering the
answer.
Dr. Mindy: Yeah. So I think
that's, that is beautiful. And
thank you for the spectrum.
Because, you know, I resonate
actually, with everything you
said, the place the last place
that I find my brain getting
hooked on is the ineffectiveness
because it you know, I think,
again, we I'm speaking not only
for myself, but for many of the
women that listen to this
podcast is it's hard to see in
effectiveness like it would take
somebody else maybe from the
outside in like that nurse did
for you. Like it how do you know
if you're being effective and
when you're in a situation where
you have to perform at work you
need to perform in your family,
like You know, you just have to
keep on going whether you're
effective or not. So what is our
measurement of effectiveness?
Dr. Neha: Well, let's take them
through the phases now. So you
know the triad of burnout. Okay,
let's start burnout goes across
phases. So this is not the same
exhaustion. The third part of
these phases is exhaustion.
That's not the same as the
physical mental emotional
exhaustion I spoke to you about,
but hold on here. So we'll start
phase one is the alarm phase.
The alarm phase is kind of like
the moment you've jumped on a
treadmill, that's going a little
too fast. And it's that
experience, it's like your heart
skips a beat, someone cuts you
off in traffic, it's like that
experience, you're you're
leveling up. And you're kind of,
you know, a little bit
irritable, you might feel a
little overwhelmed, like, Oh,
this is too much. The way you
might feel this in your body is
heart racing, stomach turning
intestinal issues like gut
issues, diarrhea, constipation,
something just doesn't feel
right. So in that space, first
of all, you always go and get
that checked out, because it
might be something physical. But
if you get a clean bill of
health, from your doctor, oh,
nothing's wrong with you, then
you might want to think about,
oh, wow, maybe the stress has
kind of overwhelmed my system.
And this is like me trying to
adjust to that treadmill going
too fast. Now, when you start
using all those coping
mechanisms we talked about, and
you stay on that treadmill going
at that speed, and it becomes
your new normal. That's what
happens when you start to have
kids and you start to write,
you're starting to move down
this this path where now you're
taking on more and more and
more. You're using all these
coping mechanisms. And pretty
soon, you are turning up that
dial even point 1.1. Like it's
starting to go even faster, and
you hit this place. That's
called chronic adaptation. Where
are you using everything you can
to barely hang on your you don't
have reserve. So in the first
part, you might notice you
missed an appointment, and maybe
you had to pay for even if it
could be something as simple as
a mani pedi. And that's not like
you. It's not like you to miss
the Alright, I gotta pay the
money to how because I missed
it. I didn't cancel. But you're
like, wow, that wasn't like me.
Or you're so you miss the
deadline to miss appointments,
you forget things you and this
is not menopausal forgetting
things. Okay? This is like
right, irritability, and, you
know, snapping at your loved
ones. Now, the interesting thing
about burnout is it does have a
lot of overlap to menopause in
the sense of the symptoms. I
Dr. Mindy: was just thinking the
same thing. I was like, Wait a
second, where does where does
the lack of hormones come in
here, which we should discuss in
a hot moment. But yeah, keep
going. So
Dr. Neha: it's all connected.
But anyway, so now, you've you
realize that maybe you're going
in later, you're you're ending
later in your workday. So just
things start shifting, then
you've been there for a while
now you're in chronic
adaptation. So now you want to
think about things like you're
procrastinating your knee,
perhaps even calling in sick,
perhaps after a weekend, or a
week's vacation, you're still
not rested. So now you're just
not recovering, like you use to
recover. Right? A lot of people
say, oh, yeah, I'll sleep. I'll
work all week, and I'll catch up
on my sleep on the weekend. Like
that doesn't that doesn't
actually work. Biologically,
it's a good idea. But it doesn't
actually work. So the idea there
is things have been going on for
a long time. And now you're like
doo doo doo doo doo, you're
starting to deplete. Now, the
way you know you're in chronic
adaptation is because you're
requiring more of your coping
mechanisms to get the same
effect. So maybe used to say,
Yeah, I need a glass of wine
after work to take the edge off.
And now suddenly, it's during
the pandemic, and you're like,
Honey, can you hand me the
bottle? Right? Like, all of a
sudden, it's two glasses, or
it's one cup of coffee, and now
you're up to two or three. So
people don't actually notice
that they're moving across alarm
phase, chronic adaptation,
because they just think they're
using the same thing. A little
bit more.
Dr. Mindy: It's just more of it.
Yeah. Interesting. Okay, so
what? What happens after that?
Yeah,
Dr. Neha: one more thing,
because you're barely hanging on
by a thread and this chronic and
adaptation, one more thing
happens and you go sliding down
the slippery slope of burnout to
ineffectiveness, and that's the
exhaustion phase. Now that's
different than mental emotional
exhaustion. Right? But it's like
the exhaustion phase which is
like, it can sometimes coincide
with depression, not always it
doesn't have to. It's literally
you know, trouble like chronic
migraines pain, like you
literally are not functioning.
And we need I mean, that's when
you're in crisis and you need
like real medical help. But
here's what I want people to
know. If you know, the triad of
burnout, mental emotional
exhaustion, cynicism in
effectiveness, if you know these
and you know the phases of alarm
phase chronic adaptation and
exhaustion. I'm pretty sure
you're gonna pick this up
sooner.
Dr. Mindy: You're gonna Yeah,
for sure. Because you Yeah, cuz
you're giving language to
feelings that we dismiss. So and
Dr. Neha: that's what I hope the
whole we'll have. And this is
the deal, too. Yeah. If, if it's
not you when you're listening.
We need you to be the nurse for
other people that that nurse was
for me. If you know this, yeah,
you are going to be able to see
those you love and lead, you're
going to be able to say, Hey,
are you okay?
Dr. Mindy: Yes, yeah. So what's
interesting about this, and I
want to, of course, where my
brain goes next is like, okay,
like, again, I resonate with
everything you just said, I've
been in every single one of
those positions. And so I'm
curious, what do you do about
it, like if you can catch
yourself, so we'll talk about
that in a moment. But let's
touch on this on what you said
about, you know, all the
research I've done on hormones
and looking at hormones. And
what's happening to us through
this Peri menopausal years is
that I call it a neuro chemical
armor. You know, as our hormones
start to come down estrogen and
progesterone and testosterone
also stimulated different
neurotransmitters, different
types of neurotransmitters like
serotonin and dopamine and GABA.
So there's like this neuro
chemical armor coming down,
you're in your mid 40s, maybe
your kids are now teenagers, or
they're launching them into the
world, your maybe your work is
getting really intense, or
you're going back into the
workplace. And so there almost
is that at that explanation you
just made of these three phases,
where my brain goes is it's much
easier to hit those three
phases, when you don't have as
much estradiol when you're
lacking progesterone, when you
don't have as much dopamine,
serotonin, acetylcholine,
glutamate, oxytocin, GABA, I
mean, all these neuro chemicals
are up for grabs as you go
through this. So you're gonna
hit burnout much quicker it
would you agree.
Dr. Neha: Yeah, you're gonna
have so much less reserves, you
know, how I was saying at the
beginning, like where you are
from burned out to fully
charged, is whether you have a
net gain or net drain of energy
on a physical, mental,
emotional, social and spiritual
level. Well, one of the levels
is under physical is stress and
hormones. And so that's the
physical part of it. Now, I want
you to imagine, the mental part
of you is going to start saying,
I thought I knew my body. Oh, my
God, I didn't sleep well, last
night. Oh, my God, I'm getting
my midsection is getting fat on
it now, like, what is going on
here. So now the thoughts start
draining emotionally, you're
going to feel moody, you're
going to feel all these things,
because your hormones are all
changing, you might even not
have a sex drive anymore. So
socially, it might shift your
relationships and how you're
connecting intimately and
otherwise. And then on a
spiritual level. It's such, it's
almost like when we were
teenagers, and our body was
changing, and we didn't have
control of it, and our hormones
are changing, and our world is
changing. And you know, you it's
like this whole experience, the
kind of menopause for me has
gone across all levels. And so
when you say when you say, is it
easier to burn out? I have to
say, Yes, I think that it
depends on how much reserve you
have. Now, let's say some of our
coping mechanisms were eating
sugar, if sugar is your thing,
that it has been shown to, you
know, intensify the symptoms.
And so yeah, we are now having
to not only experience all these
changes in our body and our
moods and our all have this, we
sometimes have to give up the
coping mechanisms we've been
using Yes. To manage the stress
in our lives. Yeah, so yeah,
Dr. Mindy: and you know that you
also have the other the other
side of this where your adrenals
are supposed to actually come
over and start making some sex
hormones. But if you're like, in
full cortisol production, the
adrenals are like, hey, no, I'm
over here making cortisol. So
it's, it's, you know, what I
think is I'm hoping people are
grabbing from this part of the
conversation is that, you know,
burnout is real for the
perimenopause and menopausal
woman. And, you know, I think
this is why a conversation like
this is so ridiculously
important for that age, because
I feel like if you go into your
pyramid In a puzzle years,
knowing this could be that
burnout is going to be a much
easier state that your body and
your brain is going to go into.
At least if you have some
awareness, you might be able to
catch it before it totally takes
you down. At least that's the
way my brain thinks. So would
you what are your thoughts on on
that?
Dr. Neha: No, I think I think
that was well said, I think
that's really well said. And I
think each person the trick here
is that there's the stress
that's going on for all the
things we think we should do
need to do have taken on. What
happens is now our physicality,
in totality is at play with
perhaps where people who don't
have strong enough boundaries,
we think we need to take care of
the kids, and we need to take
care of our partner, and we need
to take care of the house. And
we better be an amazing, you
know, career woman, and who
knows what we've taken on. But
now, because this layer comes
on, it's actually a wake up call
to ask us if the way we've been
doing things is actually
working. And now it's time. Now
it's time to take care of us.
And our body is saying, You
gotta prioritize me. I've been
carrying you around for a really
long time. And please, please,
please come back to me. And it
stops us in our tracks. Yeah,
Dr. Mindy: thank you for saying
that. Because earlier this week,
I brought Dr. Lisa Moscone on.
And you know, the female brain
researcher, and she just put out
a book called the menopause
brain. And I asked her, tell me
what's going on to the brain
during perimenopause and
menopause. And she brought
something to my attention that I
had never heard and it's called
the grandmother effect. Have you
heard of the
Dr. Neha: grandmother effect? I
haven't Tell me. So.
Dr. Mindy: So it's where the
brain starts to prune what know
in the perimenopause years, the
brain gets rid of the neurons
that are no longer necessary.
And it starts to rebuild parts
of the brain that actually moves
it into this highly productive
state in six years into our post
menopausal years. And they call
it the grandmother effect,
because it used to be when we
are back in the hunter gatherer
age, that it was the grandmother
that would bring food back to
the community and would take
care of the kids while the
mother was tending to the baby,
she just burst. And, you know,
not to be sexist, but the men
were out hunting. So the
grandmother kept the peace, and
kept the kept structure to the
community while they were
looking for food. So there
became this reorganization of
our brains to step into this
incredible leadership role. And
the reason that I bring that up
is that I think what's happening
is that there's love this idea
of this neuronal pruning, where
the brain is like actually kind
of changing the neurons that it
doesn't need anymore, and
bringing new neurons online,
that in that state, we also may
me be more susceptible to
burnout because there's a brain
a massive brain change that's
going on. But if we could tell
work like yours, and hers, and
we could bring them together and
say, okay, Peri menopausal
women, so this brain changes
going on, there's, there's a
really positive place, you're
gonna land maybe a decade from
now. But I want we've given
language to the vulnerability of
of your brain as it goes through
this change. Now we you just
gave us language to identify it.
So now, what do we do about
that? Because I don't think it's
acceptable to have a sufferer
for 10 years through that
process. Yeah,
Dr. Neha: I think it's, you
know, what it is, I think the
biggest thing it does is women,
women really do start to
reevaluate, they start to
reflect, they start to
reevaluate and use them. If they
haven't been someone who's been
sharing vulnerably with others,
they take it to the next level
of, of doing it, or maybe they
did share. But they haven't done
that. And so now they begin to
talk about things in on another
level. And I think it's so
beautiful. Because now, I mean,
I've been going through for a
while. And I have been fortunate
to have a partner who is some
pet empathic about it. And, you
know, how can I support you? Do
you want me to rub your back
like, do you want me to stay
away from you? Like, just tell
me how I can help you? Easy? I
gotta say, That's amazing,
because most of my life I
actually haven't had that. But I
think it's been really so I
think finding somebody who you
can talk to as well and really
share this and even in addition
to your doctor, of course your
doctor but there's something
every day about This that had me
feeling quite vulnerable through
it until I could figure it out.
Because these aren't quick
fixes, you know, it takes time
to normalize hormones, it takes
time to get off sugar and have
the effect, have you feeling
less than 10, hot flashes, and
what's happened happening? So
it's almost like we're moving
into, from the quick fix to the
rhythms of nature. And I love
how each one of us love that.
Yeah, how each one of us
surrenders to that happening, I
think is is an art.
Dr. Mindy: So beautiful. So
let's dive into, you know, a
solution here and to give some
people some hope you've said
this a couple of times now. And
I think I really think this is
interesting, because I can't
tell you how many times I've sat
and looked at my schedule. And I
finally learned that just
because my schedule is
incredibly full, doesn't mean
that's going to be an exhausting
week. And what I've decided is
there are certain activities I
do that fuel me. And there are
certain activities I do that
deplete me and and you said
something like the brain? Oh,
what did you see now? Ma'am? And
menopausal brains kicking in?
But you said there's an expense.
And then there's like, a net
expense? And then
Dr. Neha: net? Net net gain or
grain? Yeah. So yeah. So let's,
let's do this. Because not
everybody's in menopause. So I
want to kind of broaden it.
Right? Yeah. So great. This is
kind of me going through it
myself, and getting that time
off and those medications. But
here's the problem. When I was
on stress leave, I was off for
almost three months. And in that
time, nobody really, it was like
three months later, I was
sending to the ring for round
two, with no idea of what got me
there, or how to do it
differently. And so yeah,
powered by me is my answer to
that gap. And so maze, enjoy
going through it myself, and
knowing I needed to figure it
out, me helping 10s of 1000s of
patients and colleagues do this.
This is what I came up with.
When you think on a physical
level. I think of the very first
and most important thing someone
should be thinking of is do I
know how to decipher the unique
language of my own body? Meaning
my own physiology. So when my
drum constricts and my stomach
turns, do I know what that
means? Or do I just assume it's
a nuisance that I need to power
through so I can get things
done? Do I listen to when my
heart races? Or my stomach
turns? Or I'm sweating? Or do I
just try to move right through
it? So each of us has a unique
language, physical signals that
our physiology is giving us all
the time? Even right now, as
you're listening to this, feel
your bottom sitting on that
chair? Feel your feet on the
floor? And just notice Do you
are is your are the muscles of
your body? When you take a deep
breath? You know, do Are they
open relaxed and light? Or are
they constricted? Tight and
heavy? Is there some is your
right hip trying to get your
attention? Is your knee or quad
annoying? You? Did you work out
and do you feel sore? I don't
know what it is for people. It's
unique for everyone. But your
body's talking. The question is
are you listening? Right? So
basically, I break it into
stress and hormones. Okay, on
this under the physical Yeah.
Food Food is fuel. Are you
fueling yourself with processed
foods out of boxes? And you
know, fast food and whatever?
Are you someone who thinks
thoughtfully about how you
nourish yourself and through the
day how that happens? Do you
plan it? Or is it kind of like a
surprise after effect at two
o'clock in the afternoon? You're
like, oh, that's why my stomach
is like eating itself because I
never ate. So it's like, yeah,
on a scale of one to 10 Ask
yourself how satisfied are you
with the your nourishment and
your food? Then go to movement?
And or do you have ways to
joyfully move your body joyfully
move in your body multiple times
a week and sleep? So for sleep?
It's like ask yourself things
like so people are supposed to
get seven to nine hours of
quality sleep a night. We're
supposed to really be able to
cycle through 90 minute cycles
at least four times. A lot of
times now what do we do? We
farmed it out. We have rings,
and we look at our readiness
score to see if we're rested
like we don't even check
ourselves. It's so true. It's so
true. We're we're like
outsourcing whether we're
rested. So do you wake up in the
morning and do you will run
Astrid,
Dr. Mindy: can I ask you a
question on the physical?
Because one of the things that
came up in therapy when I was
talking about burnout with my
therapist, is she her one of her
questions to me was, do you feel
what tell me what you feel in
your body? And I said, I feel
completely disconnected from my
body. Like, I feel like my head
and my body are just two
different things. Is is that so
when you when you took us
through that exercise, is it
important to also point out that
some of the people listening may
just be like, I don't even know,
like, check in with my body.
Like there's just no body
awareness? Is that also a
physical symptom of burnout?
Dr. Neha: Well, that is, I want
to say congratulations to anyone
listening that says, Yeah,
that's me. Because
congratulations, you're a master
of the external world, you have
successfully cut off your
connection to your physiology in
order to perform in the world.
So whenever that happens, what I
do is I tell people to kind of
take an air pod case, take a
smooth stone, take something
that fits fits nicely in the
palm of your hand. And in your
next meeting, okay? When
something emotional comes up,
when something surprises you,
you can do it at the dinner
table, you're in a conversation,
ask yourself, what do I feel
inside my body. And if you're
like nothing, I want you to say
I can feel this in my hand. So
take something from that outside
world that you're a master of
and hold it and bring it in.
Because pretty soon, you're
going to be like, Oh, wow, my
jaw. Oh, my God, my jaw is
tight. Oh, my right shoulder
blade kind of bumbo, it feels
tight in my chest. But what
sometimes we have to do when
we're masters of the external
world, is this is what we got
accolades for performing
externally. That's how we got
belonging. That's how the woman
felt we are successful. So yes,
no doubt that we have done this
in a very big culture to do
this, perform for our parents
perform for our family, get an A
make money, you know, get
promoted. Right? This is what we
get all the likes on social
media for? Yeah, so the answer
is, yes, many, many people are
there. And if you're missing, if
you're missing all the early
signals, then I shouldn't have
been so surprised when I was
powering through everything with
Mountain Dew and bar and telling
other people to eat a low, low
fat diet, that I was the one who
nearly hit a brick wall. Wow.
Right. So absolutely. The other
thing I would do is I would
write down any physical
symptoms, you have perhaps
reflux, perhaps back pain,
perhaps, you know, whatever it
is, write those down as well.
Now, what I do at the end, so
we're gonna give you we're gonna
give you a burnout, your own
burnout assessment, opportunity,
where you're gonna get an
interactive way to do this
yourself. And in 1520 minutes,
figure out where you are on from
burnout to fully charged, so
amazing in the physical section.
When I get down there, I say,
now this, look at the answers
that you just wrote down for the
physical section. And then I
want you to check in with your
body. And does it feel as you're
focusing on these things? Does
it feel heavy can tighten and
you know, constricted? Or does
it feel light and open? Because
if you're like this, yeah, I'd
eat fine. Yeah, yeah. I don't
need to sleep that much. I'll
catch up later. Yeah, yeah, I'm
really satisfied with all these
things. But your body feels
heavy. When your mind and your
body are not at sync, net drain.
So these screens have to it's
not just you answering the
questions. That's why I put a
six little mini video series
with it. So I walk you through
each one until you now pay
attention to your body. Okay, so
physical, that's physical. And
once if you give yourself a
score less than 10 out of 10,
right, one one to 10. I asked
you just tell me what would make
it attend that you would be
satisfied. So I want you to
know, I'm not telling you, you
need to eat four cups of leafy
green vegetables. I'm asking you
whether you're satisfied. How
satisfied are you? Because that
will also tell you when you're
less satisfied with something
that's a great place to start.
Right? Because that's something
that's really upsetting. So now
Yeah, okay. Now let's move to
mental mental is your thoughts
and how you form them. You know,
let's say I said to you, let's
oh my god, there's an
opportunity to go bungee
jumping. What's your first
thought that you'd have?
Dr. Mindy: I'm scared of
heights. So I would say hell no.
Have fun. I yeah, I'm not I
would not. Yeah.
Dr. Neha: Yeah, you wouldn't,
you wouldn't be ended up but
then man would imagine our other
friend who was here would be
like, I can't wait to feel like
I'm flying. Okay. And another
person might say, those things
aren't I'm not sure if those
things are safe. They've been
safety tested. Okay? So same
situation, same data. One of us
might purple up, personalize it
to myself, Oh, my God, I'm going
to die. I literally am going to
die. And other person might.
Yeah, that's Oh, you know? Yeah.
So we let projected on to other
people, oh, that's only for
people who are really athletic.
Or we might say, you know, I
don't know what the safety
testing is on that and go bigger
than me are you. It's when
things happen, people typically
pick a way of responding. They
don't, they didn't pick it. But
there's patterns. Like, when I
was young, I was raised by my
grandparents, for the first
couple of years of my life. When
I moved back in with my family,
at two years old, I thought I
had done something wrong to be
sent away from my grandparents.
And so I was really devastated.
And from then on, I decided if
anything went wrong, it was
probably my fault. So that's
personalization. So you can see
now in the world, how I can take
on much more than my own
responsibility. That's
personalization. And so in this
experience, that would be a net
drain of energy. Because
normally each experience in life
has some combination of it being
about me something about you,
and something about things
better than us. Each conflict,
each interaction all of them.
Alright, comparing and judging
other people, comparing yourself
to others and judging different
ways that you think about work
and how it should be. When
someone disagrees with you. Do
you let it expand your
perspective? And do you get
curious? Or do you dig your
heels in a double down on being
right? All of these are
interesting examples in the
mental section of the questions
I'll ask you, and then notice at
the end, whether you feel like
your body is you know, open,
relaxed, center, or it feels
heavy, tight, constricted, net,
Grant gain, net drain and mental
energy. So now let's do
emotional motional. It's really
easy, emotional as like, how
good are you at handling tears,
anger, anxiety, grief, trauma,
loss, apologizing, forgiving
other people and yourself and
play, enjoy? How? So the reason
I said it's easy as a topic is
not easy. But the question is
easy. If I want to know where
you're having, whether you're
having the net gain or net drain
of energy on an emotional level,
I'm gonna ask you this. Tell me
in which areas of your life you
are avoiding a challenge or a
difficult conversation?
Dr. Mindy: Yep. Yeah.
Dr. Neha: Is that at home at
work socially, you know,
financially, odds are
entrepreneur, I don't know where
it is. But if you can tell me
where that's happening, all of a
sudden, your body's gonna do
this thing. And then tell me
where you're getting, you know,
a rise in energy and play and
humor and all of that right
away, you're gonna know, okay,
for social energy, this one's an
easy question two, it's
basically write down the five
people or groups of people that
you spend the most time with
online or in person. And then as
you bring those people to mind,
and write them all down, focus
in on the first one is your now
you got to tune into your body.
When you're with these people,
do you feel a net energy gain or
drain via your constriction,
tightness, heaviness? Or open,
relaxed, energized, right? And
you do that for each of the
people? Then you'd look at all
five? And then you say, okay,
overall, how am I feeling?
Right? How am I How am I
experiencing this? And then the
last one is spiritual. And
basically, in social, it's about
like, you really want to pay
attention to being able to give
and receive feedback, you want
to be able to know whether
you're talking when you don't
want things upset, you do talk
about people, or do you talk to
them? Do you know how to lean
into healthy conflict, you know,
how to draw set expectations,
make clear agreements, draw
healthy boundaries? So it's like
a all your social interactions?
If you're somebody who avoids
conflict and says yes, when you
really mean No, and you don't
know how to draw boundaries,
you're going to be doing a dance
and taking on too much. Right?
Yeah. And then when we move to
spiritual spiritual energy is so
fundamental. People are like, I
can't believe you put spiritual
energy in a business book or a
book on, you know, burnout for
work and at home and I said,
Well, spiritual energy is the
most important one. And what I
mean by that is you It's about
knowing what you value. It's
about when you know what you
value and what's most important
to you. What matters to you,
let's say your top five values.
So mine are love, integrity,
service, play and beauty. If I
know that those are what better
to me, it helps me I become much
more effective and making quick,
quick decisions that align now
short term and long term, I can
move forward and pivot in a
pandemic in a crisis, because I
know what matters most. Right?
So there's, there's lots of
benefits is value because in
spiritual, it's your value
system balance, just like value.
Dr. Mindy: It's like, yeah, it's
having an ethos really matters.
Yeah.
Dr. Neha: What's your spiritual
GPS? Right? Yeah. Oh, yeah. How
do you make decisions,
especially in a world moving
faster and faster? Like, if we
don't have all the data, and
we've got to make a decision how
you're going to make it, you
better be connected to your own
body, you better see how you
will how risk averse or that's
another piece of spiritual self
trust. So one of the questions I
asked here is, tell me where
you'll take risks, and tell me
where you avoid risks. So for a
long time in my life, I would
take risks mentally,
emotionally, socially,
spiritually, financially, and
entrepreneurially. Not so much
physically, like bungee jumping
in all that, and not so much
romantically because my hurt had
been crushed. And so if you see
where people take risks, and
where they don't, you know,
where they trust themselves and
where they don't. So,
Dr. Mindy: so what do you do
with all I mean, like, again,
I'm gonna say, I hear all of
those questioning. And my brain
is like, okay, like, I resonated
with a lot of things that you
said in there. But then the
burned out brain says, Okay,
well, that's, yeah, like,
there's a lot of places there to
work on, how the heck am I going
to put all of those back
together? Is it more of just a
moment of like, so you're
talking about, like a quiz that
your will leave a link to, that
will give you what, like a
rating of your burnout? Is that
kind of the way we're looking at
that?
Dr. Neha: Yeah, yeah, you're
gonna be able, at the end of
each section, you got to tap
into your own body, and you're
gonna, you're gonna be able to
see whether you're having a net
gain or a net drain. And so now
you know exactly where to focus.
Now you know where to focus.
Dr. Mindy: Okay, got it.
Dr. Neha: This is so enormous
how the world gets worn out.
It's so enormous. And so to
personalize it to you,
Dr. Mindy: you need to not it.
Oh, love that. Okay, minute.
Here,
Dr. Neha: I need to first
physical and spiritual and
emotional are the ones that are
drains. Looks like I was really
heavy. When we started talking
about emotional, let me go,
they're hot. So you will know
where to go once you do the
assessment. And then the book
will give you tools and each
section to focus there.
Dr. Mindy: Okay, so this is this
is brilliant, because what I'm
thinking is I just went through
this experience myself where the
first 90 days of this year I was
like, I just became really good
at saying no, I just said no to
everything, so that I could try
to figure out what I needed to
do to be able to get my feet
back on the ground. And then I
went on a vacation with a friend
and I call it the sensory
deprivation vacation where we
just sat or in an Airbnb with a
beautiful pool, and we read
books and watch shows, and it
was like the most mellow time.
And when I came back, everybody,
all my staff and every my
family, they're like, Okay,
you're good. Now you're good.
Like you took a week off, you're
good. And my and it was like I
was good for a hot moment until
the I call it the patriarchal
pace started back up again. And
it made me realize the reason I
share this with you is it made
me realize in that moment, that
recovering from burnout isn't
just sitting your ass down. Like
there's more. It's a there's a
much more sophisticated path
which you just gave us. It's
understanding where you are the
most off course. Did I interpret
that right?
Dr. Neha: Yeah, step one is
sitting your butt down. Step one
is probably gotten here because
you have something that you're
passionate about that you really
want to change, and you've been
putting your energy and effort
into making that happen. And
yep, at some point, you start to
spin and you start losing
energy. And so the first thing
is, burnout is a wake up call.
It's a wake up call, that a
breach has had But most often,
it begins on a spiritual level,
where you're saying yes to
things that don't really matter.
Or you're doing it because
you're out of obligation rather
than inspiration. And you start
draining energy, or you're like
me, I was like, I will single
handedly change healthcare you
Right? Like, not gonna happen,
they have like, nice try. And so
it starts with a really noble,
no, I want to do everything for
everybody, right. And in the
end, it ends up with you
thinking you are super a
superpower. And somehow the
biological laws of the universe
don't apply to you. Right. And
so in that sense, your need, you
do need to be stopped. And so
sitting down is good. But a
massage chair on Friday, a
sitting down and venting, you
know, in front of the TV for
series or in front of your
laptop for series, that's not
going to help it. In the end,
it's going to slow things down.
So perhaps you can start to
reflect and get perspective. But
I think the big gap is, what do
I do with this mess? And that's
right, where do I focus next?
And what are the concrete tools
that are going to help me heal
and go back in the world and do
it differently? Right.
Dr. Mindy: So once you with this
test, you now know which piece
you need to work on. And I would
assume that that you have lists
of like, if it's physical, if
it's spiritual, if it's social,
you're in the book, you probably
have lists of here, all the
things you can do. One of my
questions, as I'm listening to
you talk, and I just want to
make sure we give, we help women
understand this piece of it,
which is, how do you explain it
to those around you. Because,
you know, there I have found
that when I've hit these moments
where I'm just like, I can't
keep going at this pace, I can't
quite put words to explain it to
my husband, or to explain it to
my team or to my publisher, it's
like, like, I don't know how to
tell you that the brain is no
longer as sharp and effective as
it used to be. And I don't know
what I need to do to get myself
back online. So how do we
express it to the our loved
ones, and and our and the people
we have to perform for?
Dr. Neha: So we're gonna go back
to what I said to you in the
beginning. It's called the body
map. Okay, where we tuned in to
ourselves. So if I said to you,
Hey, Mindy. My throats been
constricted, and my heart's been
racing, and my stomach's been
turning. I said yes, to getting
this done in two months. And I
didn't sleep last night, or all
weekend, I haven't been able to
sleep or focus. What I think is
going on, is that I have said
yes, when I really meant no. And
while I don't want to disappoint
you, what I have to pay
attention to is that my body is
actually saying this isn't going
to work. Now, the good news
about knowing and deciphering
the physical language of your
own body, that unique language
of your own body. Is that what
is someone going to say? No,
your heart isn't racing. No,
your stomach isn't turning, well
said. It's Dana. But nobody
shares or knows what to do with
this. We're in order to explain
it like and I'll tell you why. I
think from when we were really
young. We think about somebody
is playing like a child is
playing with bubbles or with
their brother or whatever. And
suddenly you say, okay, honey,
it's time to go to school. And
they're like, I have a tummy
ache. I can't go to school. And
you say no, no, I just saw you
playing with your brother. You
guys get to go to school. Even
young, we as adults don't
understand that actually, what
we should be thinking about is
does this child feel lonely on
the bus? So they're getting
bullied? Do they have to sit
alone at the cafeteria? Because
as soon as you said it was time
to go to school, their body
started talking. And we teach
them? No, you're you're just
fine. You go to school, we teach
them at a young age to override
those signals. So true. So I
don't want anyone to feel like
oh, how did I get here? We live
in a society that's moving in a
digital and AI age is moving
faster and faster by the minute.
Yeah, and us trying to keep up
with this Secretary, we've
literally created an external
world that exceeds the capacity
of our own biology.
Dr. Mindy: Oh, that was that was
so well said, Oh, bingo. I call
it the patriarchal pace. That is
just like that production pace.
And that at you actually bring
up what a question I was going
to ask you is, you know, when I
hear the definition of burnout,
when I hear about all the
different pieces of it, I'm
like, what human? Isn't burnout
burnt out at this moment? And
what is our way out of it? So if
we've, if the digital world has
now exceeded our human
physiology, like, what is our
way out?
Dr. Neha: Well, I mean, I think
we have to expand our capacity.
So the way that you expand your
capacity is, like I said, this
game change for me was being
able to pick up signals early in
my body. If I'm not catching
this until really late in the
game, I feel helpless at it.
Because it's happening to me.
Yes. And when I get the agency
to know that throat
constriction, and some attorney
means I'm not speaking my truth,
oh, and holding back, all of a
sudden, in a meeting, I can say,
you know, what I said, I'd have
that by Friday, Monday is going
to be a lot better. And the help
that I would need is support
from the marketing team, or, you
know, if I'm talking about at
home, a cleaning lady, and Lola,
I don't know what it is. But in
those moments, it's time for us
to uplevel our ability to
function in this world. And that
requires inner work that
requires us knowing ourselves
picking up signals earlier, the
people I think, who are going to
succeed in this next leg of our
life, and the race that is now
on digitally, are the ones who
can pick up signals early, or
taking data from inside them,
and using their own intuition,
their body's physiology, getting
extra information, so they can
make more decisions with less
information at a quicker pace.
Amazing.
So yeah,
Dr. Mindy: and it's it. Yeah, I
love what you're
Dr. Neha: saying. And we're
gonna, yeah,
Dr. Mindy: yeah. And so you
know, what I heard in that is
boundaries. You have to, you
have to learn to set some
boundaries, and you have to
learn how to express what you
need. And I think those are two
things. And I don't mean this in
a sexist way, any shape or form.
But I do believe as women, we
have a hard a real hard time
with that. And I can tell you,
it's a big part of what I'm
learning in my own life now is
to put down the people pleasing,
ask myself what is right for me,
and then put the boundary up and
then express what I need. And I
think I think that's another way
of looking at it the way you
just said it is that it's never
been more important to have a
boundary
and for those of you who are
listening, she just showed me
there's a whole chapter in her
book on why boundaries matter.
Yes. Oh, there we go. Yes.
Amazing boundaries.
Dr. Neha: And and I did I
actually did a whole hour with
Mel Robbins on her podcast on
people pleasing. So for women
who struggle with this, I will
hear me talk about not only how
I figured it out how it came
about, because pleasing started
early. It didn't start lately.
Yes. Oh, yes, yes, well, it's
one of the it's one of those
things with deep roots and, and
it can change it can you can
shift their actual tools that
you can actually develop your
boundaries. And for some people,
they've been crushed in their
life. And their boundaries are
more than like armor around them
that doesn't allow connection
and vulnerability. And so
sometimes founders are too rigid
in reaction oftentimes to trauma
or pain. Sometimes boundaries
are too porous because we want
you to like us, and in many
other reasons, but we not only
do we need to learn boundaries,
boundaries change for me,
they've changed each decade. And
what's important to me changes
what I'm willing to do as an
aspiring medical resident is
different than I'm what what I'm
willing to do in my 40s and 50s.
Right, and so to know how to do
it, and then adjusted to your
environment and the context in
which you are based on the
values and your spiritual
guidance system. You now can
navigate the world but to me
it's an inner game now. It for
for we got here with an outer
game, but now it's really
important to do the inner game.
Dr. Mindy: Yeah, and I do but
Leave, you know, Dr. Lisa
Moscone and I chatted about this
about how when you get on the
other side of menopause, the way
that she said it is like, you
just you stop giving fucks
anymore like you stop caring so
much about that. People pleasing
sorta, which was beautiful to
hear this researcher say it that
way. I'm like, Yeah, you know,
that actually has been my
experience is that as my
hormones have shifted, and
wisdom and years of exhaustion
trying to people, please, I've
now hit a point where I'm like,
yep, not going to do that
anymore. And I will, I'm curious
if that's on the backside of
menopause, if that's what we
tend to see more is because of
the hormonal shift, because of
the brain shift. setting
boundaries become easier. It's
just a hypothesis that as I
heard you talk, I thought that
might be where we're going in
our 60s and 70s.
Dr. Neha: Yeah, I think the way
that I experienced that is
there's external data, okay.
Trials, double blinded, placebo
controlled trials, research
knowledge, we learn in school
and other places, plus, internal
experience. So that's our lived
experience, what we've what
we've experienced personally in
the world, plus, our physical
body signals that no one but us
can experience our own
intuition, you know, when a
mother has this gut, knowing
that something's wrong with
their child, or something's off
that experience. So it's
external data, plus internal
data equals integrated
decisions. I love that. And so
thought, how are we going to
navigate? How are we going to
navigate this world, we need
more data. So start, yeah,
getting to know your own self
more, because that's how you're
going to be able to make a
decision in a world where
pandemics occur and unknown
things occurred, you have to
make decisions and shift
suddenly you're in an office,
now you're at home, the way
we're gonna have self trust and
the ability to be agile and
adjust to a fast paced world
that we by the way, all co
created, use their brains to co
create a great masters better do
more with less each year. Right?
The way we're going to do that
is by grade, knowing our
internal data more, and seeing
where it matches and seeing
where sometimes we have to draw
boundaries, we have to do things
differently, and and create new
ways of doing things.
Dr. Mindy: Yeah, oh, so
beautifully said, Well, I could
probably I could pick your brain
for a very long time. So and I
think this is such an important
topic that so many people are
going through. So before I ask
you my last question, which I
always is just a personal one
that I love. And where can
people find you and you have
some really cool resources? Can
you talk a little I know you're
doing a live event, if,
depending on when people are
listening? Can you talk a little
bit about that?
Dr. Neha: Sure. So if people are
interested in a live event,
literally on powered by me five
days of it, I try to do one
public retreat a year, the one
that I happen to be doing in the
next couple months is at omega
Institute, June 9 to the 14th.
But if you're listening to this,
and it's after that, my website
is intuitive intelligence
inc.com. So I can see at the
end, and go under Events, and
under the Events page, you're
going to be able to see this. I
have two books that are out I
have powered by me and I have
talker X on audiobook. So this
is talker X on Yeah, there you
go. That's about leading into
healthy conflict. That's about
leaning into healthy conflict.
And it's also about women
physical symptoms, have a
physical cause. And when
physical symptoms sometimes have
are because of unresolved
mental, emotional, social,
spiritual issues in your life
showing up in your physical body
to get your attention. So like,
yes, sometimes someone will have
migraines because they have a
tumor in their head. Yes, that's
or they're, you know, they'll
have a headache because they're
dehydrated, for sure. But if you
get a clear Villa health, what
if it's actually because you're
somebody who's more introverted
and doesn't express yourself and
your partner blows up and has,
you know, expresses their anger
all the time, and you're just
absorbing it. So there's
unresolved mental, emotional,
social, spiritual issues that
can show up in your physical
body to get your attention. So
if you're not getting the
answers you need, there's
something else going on on
another level. So I want you to
trust yourself and know that
there are answers. Neha
sanguine.com is another easy
place that they can do it. And
then we also promise them a
burnout awareness prescription.
And so the where you get your
prescription for you know,
burnout awareness is intuitive
intelligence inc.com forward
slash burnout hyphen r x r x
like prescription. And there
you'll get a mini video series,
you'll get the interactive
assessment that we spoke about
on the on the podcast
Dr. Mindy: may sue. Yeah. And
we'll leave the link in there as
well. So amazing. And I hope
people go find all your
resources, because there's what
I'm learning from this
conversation is, wow, there's a
lot of pieces to this. There's a
lot of things to look at and
discuss. So this was this was
amazing. Here's, here's my last
question. Just want to ask
everybody, because I think it's
a very interesting concept,
which is, what what is your
definition of health? I feel
like we are always trying to
move towards being healthy. We
want health, but we don't really
know how to define it. And then
there's a second part of that
question, which is, do you have
any health goals that you're
that you're striving for right
now? Yeah, always. Like me, I'm
just a continual work in
progress.
Dr. Neha: Yeah, well, I told you
that my greatest challenge for a
long time was my physical health
because I grew up being such a
people pleaser that I was really
vigilant and in tune with
everybody else and what they
needed, not so interested in
what this body needed. And so
what I would say is that my
definition, so my, my challenges
that I work on every day, are my
alignment around, making sure I
take my supplements hydrate and
move my body. That is so hard
for me, it should not be I'm a
doctor. But it is my area of
challenge that I am consistent
with routine and self care is
what I work on really hard. My
definition of health is
alignment, because to me, health
is me we world. And the
alignment inside me on a
physical, mental, emotional,
social, spiritual level. That
what I think is what I say is,
is that I show up aligned in the
world, for myself that and with
what was knows I love and lead
and with the bigger planet, so
no other species would destroy
their own home. It's it's not
even a thing of nature. No. So
and I think that true health, I
think true health is us,
creating each one of us working
to create inner alignment, and
then alignment with one another,
and to the larger world. So to
me, that's, that's what health
is. So it was definitely a work
in progress. Yeah,
Dr. Mindy: no, but you have such
a, that is one of the best
definitions of health that I
have ever heard. And I think it
is it makes it a more inner
experience. You know, it's not
like you're, you know, you're
not looking for a number on the
scale or your blood work to be
perfect, or whatever. I mean,
you really gave it a much more
inner experience. So I love that
that was, and I think what you
said about us being the only
species that destroys our own
home, like, you know, one of the
my big takeaways right now is
that women's physiology is
absolutely at an evolutionary
mismatch with the day to day
life that we're that we're
living. And so if you use your
definition of health, what
you're doing is you're saying,
Okay, you're not looking without
you're looking within and how do
I line myself up, and then that
internal navigation system that
you've spoken of, it becomes
much easier to read. So that was
beautiful. So thank you, this
was incredible. And the Hi, I
really, really appreciate ya, I
really appreciate your depth of
thought and how you've given you
know, a really wide view of
burnout as opposed to just it
looks like this your ass down. I
really feel like you just gave
it such so much more context
than I've ever ever heard. So I
just think you thank you for
keep keep up doing all the great
work you're doing. Keep writing
books, I hope you're writing
more books. So this was amazing.
I really appreciate you. Not
that. I guess I shouldn't end a
conversation on burnout to tell
you to write more bugs, but your
brain might need to be
documented more. So I really
appreciate you This was
incredible. Thank you.
Dr. Neha: Well, thank you. I
have to say the biggest the
funniest thing you know the
jokes that really, you know, you
know, launching a book, how
enormous writing a book,
completing a book and launching
a book is enormous. And that was
the right like, how am I going
to do this? And launch a book on
burnout and not burnout myself?
Like, well, yeah, what is the
way to do that? So, you know,
it's, it's a constant, I don't
think we're ever there. I think
that we're, it's, you know,
people say to me, are you do you
ever burn out? And what I say
is, there's underlying
mechanisms of who I am and how
hard I drive myself, that will
always be me. But what I will
tell you is, what's changed
dramatically, is how soon I pick
up when I'm off track, and the
how quickly, I get back on
track. And so it's not that I
don't fall off track I do. It's
that I recognize that quicker.
And I'm back on in a day in a
week, you know, like, that is
what I hope for. So don't I'm
not going to give you the answer
where you're never going to be
yourself or you're going to be
some massively other person. But
I will tell you how to expand
your capacity, build your
intuition, tune into your body,
a line, and now you're going to
have the capacity to see it
coming and make adjustments that
are really effective for you. So
yeah, it's it's beautiful. It's
an incredible journey. And I'm
so glad we're on it together.
Yeah,
Dr. Mindy: Agreed. Agreed. Thank
you for all your work. And I
hope everybody goes and finds
you, and we'll have you back
again. This was a beautiful
discussion. So thank you.
Dr. Neha: Thank you, Mindy,
anytime.
Dr. Mindy: Thank you so much for
joining me in today's episode. I
love bringing thoughtful
discussions about all things
health to you. If you enjoyed
it, we'd love to know about it.
So please leave us a review,
share it with your friends and
let me know what your biggest
takeaway is.