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Come join a groundbreaking new podcast that promises to change the way you think, the way you live, and the way you manage your future. Grab a cup of coffee, a 6mg Zyn, some noise-canceling headphones, and get lost in the world of the Fiscal Firehouse. With your co-host Jon Beattie and Louie Barela, the Fiscal Firehouse is your guide to financial freedom. Tailored to union firefighters, we will discuss problems, solutions, and benefits that are unique to our profession. Change your finances, change your life at the Fiscal Firehouse. Brought to you by Local 1309.
Introduction: Welcome to the
Fiscal Firehouse, a podcast
dedicated to promoting financial
literacy to firefighters.
I'm your co-host, John Beatty, executive
board member of Local 1309, a lieutenant,
and also a certified financial planner.
With me, I have the other co-host of the
fiscal firehouse, Louis Barella, executive
Board member of Local 1309 ambulance
driver, and want to be financial expert.
Together, John and I hope to bring
clarity to the world of personal finance,
specifically relating to firefighters.
Firefighting is a
difficult job making sound.
Financial decisions shouldn't be.
Jon Intro: In today's episode
of the fiscal firehouse, John
and Louis have a lighthearted
conversation about the lottery.
What are your odds of winning and
what you should do if you win?
The old saying that you can't win
if you don't play is accurate.
Right?
Later in the episode, John and Louis
have a philosophical conversation
about the difference between
being rich and being wealthy.
John and Louis will discuss the
five different elements of wealth
and how they change based on
what phase of life you are in.
Without further ado, let's kick it
over to local 1309 studios and the
recording of the physical firehouse.
Jon: welcome back to the Fiscal Firehouse.
I'm your co-host John Beatty.
Sitting across from me on this
beautiful wood table in local 1309
studios is definitely the fan favorite.
Louis Barilla.
Louis, what's going on
Louie: What's up jb Good to be here, bud.
I'm happy to have the fall in full
swing and get to keep the podcast
going for a new, hopefully calmer
season, at least until the holidays.
Jon: Yeah, that's right.
This is this is perfect.
I love this time of year.
Football's in full season.
Oh.
Since the last re since
the last recording.
So we weighed our way back to Wisconsin,
got to go watch the Badgers play,
and then went, took the kids to,
the holy Grail, the, Lambeau Field.
Oh my God.
And, that was a great experience.
But dude, my badgers,
Louie: Oh, rough
Jon: dude, you saw 'em,
Louie: I saw 'em live at the big
Jon: and it was not pretty, not good.
Yeah.
Louie: not good.
Yeah.
And Michigan's not good this year.
they're not a great team,
but Bandit Badgers are just
Jon: scoreless in the last two games,
and now they gotta go to, Oregon.
So Reed's at that game
Louie: gonna have a good time, I think
Jon: they're gonna be a blowout,
Louie: Ah, brutal.
Jon: it's too much.
But nonetheless, it brought me
back to the days of college.
And ironically, the, hotel that
we stayed at was right across
from the old fraternity house.
Not quite what I remembered, but
I woke up early Sunday morning
and was taking a little saunter.
And, as I looked out there, it
brought some back, some fond memories.
There was the, the front yard
was just littered in beer cans.
Oh yeah.
Must have been, 3000 beer cans out there.
And it's oh man, I don't want to go back.
But I enjoyed my time, when I was there.
Louie: nice to visit.
Jon: Oh, nice to visit.
But
Louie: we had the same thing.
We went back and went to my
old fraternity and it is a.
It is a pit.
I'm pretty sure it's more disgusting
now than when I lived in it.
Yeah.
I'm pretty sure, but when you're
in college man and you're 19 years
old, I, nothing seems that dirty.
Nothing seems that bad, but it
Jon: you're just living for the weekend.
Yeah.
And, some really good friends that you
probably still keep in contact with there.
Louie: there you go.
Jon: yeah.
But it was fun.
I forgot how much I liked Madison.
Like it's a really cool
Louie: a cool town.
Yeah.
Jon: right on the lakes there
and the weather was perfect.
It was like high sixties and
Louie: Randall's a great venue.
Jon: It was a, it is
Louie: a great venue.
Jon: Too bad, they suck and
it was a terrible experience.
Shut out.
But nonetheless, so we're gonna
have a lighthearted episode.
We've had some heavy topics
over the last, couple months.
And, we wanted to, have some fun with
this episode and talk about the lottery
and probabilities and just have some fun.
But, I do feel it, incumbent
that we, talk PSA announcement.
so we're recording this
towards the end of October.
and it's open enrollment season.
So just a reminder for everyone out there
that, if you're changing your medical
insurance or you wanna, contribute
to a flexible spending account to go
ahead and get your information in.
'cause most of those, you gotta
have it submitted by, the first
or second week in November.
So make sure and fill that stuff out.
And if you guys have questions
about flexible spending accounts
and HSAs and all that other stuff,
refer back to, previous episodes.
One of the first ones we recorded.
We pretty, we did a nice deep in depth
conversation about all that stuff, so
make sure and get your stuff filled out.
Louie: Yep.
Jon: Yep.
Yep.
Louie: Get it taken care
Jon: getting taken care of.
And, we're gonna opt into the old,
west Metro Medical Insurance this go
Louie: Oh yeah.
Switching it up, huh?
Jon: Gonna switch it up.
PPO three coming our way.
Louie: Okay.
All right.
All
Jon: All right.
and another thing I wanted to touch
on, and this is based off of our
last episode, which were, we talked
about the one big beautiful bill act.
we got a lot of actually
questions and some follow up,
from the listeners out there.
So one that we specifically wanted to
talk to, that most of the firefighters
are really interested in is this
whole concept of the OT deduction.
dude, they're trying to max that
thing out as much as possible.
And a very common, I think, misconception
out there is, FLSA, so the Fair Labor
Standards Act and how that applies
to us specifically as firefighters.
So pretty much most of the firefighters I
know are not based on a 40 hour work week.
Yeah.
Right.
They have a def different.
A different FLSA schedule.
So the two that I'm most familiar with are
one that is, basically a 27 day period.
It encompasses 216 hours and the
other one is a 24 day period,
which encompasses 192 hours.
I think that's really standard.
I know.
That's what We use here at West Metro.
So yeah, you gotta take those 24 blocks
and it'll definitely tell you on your
scheduling software what those blocks are.
Or you can reach out to
your payroll department.
but you basically gotta
work over 192 hours.
In those 24 blocks, that is what's gonna
qualify you for overtime or premium pay.
had several people being like, I'm
just factoring this off of 40 hours.
So if I'm doing more than 40 hours, then
I'm gonna have a ton of overtime that I
can, write off, so to speak, or deduct.
Louie: and doesn't
Jon: man, I wish it was that way.
I know I wish it was that way, but
that is definitely not the way.
so then it gets even a
little bit more convoluted.
And I had someone that was very astute,
reach out and being like, and they
were referencing our contract, right?
West Metro's So we, within that 192
hours, we have a little provision
that says that for 182 hours it
is paid as straight, and then you
basically have 10 hours that's built in
overtime as part of your base salary.
Man, once again, this
is not financial advice.
This is not tax advice, but I don't.
I don't build that in as overtime,
like I'm not gonna take that deduction.
I don't think that's in the
spirit of how the law was written.
so we'll see as more case studies get
played out on how this is gonna formulate.
But I really think it is the purpose
of, at least for the West Metro folks,
is you gotta be over that 192 hours.
Because once again, every
department does things different.
we used to be penalized
if you took sick leave.
within that FLSA period within that
Louie: days.
Oh sure.
Jon: hour days.
So you'd get straight time if you worked,
in overtime of 24 hours, but you took sick
time 24 hours within that block of time,
So once again, every department operates a
little bit differently and you can't give
just gross generalizations about this.
So everyone out there, especially
outside of West Metro, you gotta really
do your due diligence on how your
contract is written and how it's applied.
And really, once the software gets
updated, the payroll software, it'll be
a lot easier, to identify that stuff.
But for this first go around, it's
gonna be a little choppy, but I do
feel quite confident in saying that
the 40 hours is not applicable.
You really have to look at
your FLSA schedule to see
how overtime is calculated.
Does that make sense?
Louis?
Louie: sense.
I like it.
Thanks for the advice.
I think that, it's gonna be weird
the first year when people are
trying to figure out exactly how much
they're gonna put in overtime and
what it's gonna look like and how
it's gonna be audited by the IRS.
So I would agree with you.
I think you should play conservative
and say, this is my non base pay.
This is my premium portion
above my, 56 hour work week
that I'm working or whatever.
and then that is what you should deduct,
when it comes time to do your taxes.
There'll be a lot more clarification
coming out, I'm sure over the next year,
but, I play it real safe this first year.
Jon: Yeah.
I'm always really conservative about that.
I just, I try to follow it
to the letter of the law
Louie: You don't want Uncle Sam
digging around in those finances,
Jon: and no.
so just a little housekeeping
on some of those things.
So yeah, keep the questions coming
guys though, if you've got 'em,
we'd be more than happy to, answer
'em to the best of our abilities.
But, we're gonna talk, we're gonna talk
about a little bit of lottery stuff here.
Yeah.
There's no shortage of DJ and
gamblers on, I don't care what fire
department we're talking about here.
You guys
Louie: all have 'em.
You guys all have that one B crew
that just likes to, they'll, they
will be sitting there gambling on
Russian, basement table tennis in
the winter and like weird stuff, man.
Jon: Parlays
Louie: to get rich quick though,
Jon: They do want it.
That is everyone's, I think
that's the easy way out.
And that's just man, that's what people
think about when they think about the
lottery or they think about all these
things that, social media bestows upon
us as far as reality versus perception.
And, yeah, it's really easy if
you just buy one ticket or you
make one bet and it's, you have
a huge windfall off of that.
that is the American way.
They, that's, they want rags to riches
and they want it to happen fast.
Louie: want it now and they want it all.
They want it all.
And they want it in cash.
They want to take the cash value
Jon: And then they don't want
to pay taxes and they just
want to take that to the max.
that's their society.
And like I said, the fire
department is no different.
We have a lot of type A personalities
that like to take risks.
They like to do things on their days off.
and, gambling is definitely part of that.
Louie: Oh yeah.
So speaking of that, let's, let's
just talk about the lottery.
'cause it's always fun, right?
Pe this is a great table talk around
the fire station, kitchen table.
You're having lunch, you're having
dinner, and people just want to
know that Powerball starts creeping
up, or that mega million start
creeping up and people go Hey, we
gotta take that engine over to the,
Jon: yeah, we got a
Louie: we go get groceries, we
gotta get some, we gotta get our,
pull our money and try to win this
Powerball or hit this jackpot.
but it's fun to think about what you
Jon: do.
Ah,
Louie: John, you're smart with your money.
I want to know if you won.
So the Mega Millions is now at about 340.
Jon: million.
Okay?
Louie: Okay.
if you took the cash value,
that's about $160 million.
Jon: 60%?
50% of what the advertised value
Louie: somewhere around there.
So you're looking about 160 million.
I'd say you don't, let's just
say half is gonna go away
Jon: It's a taxes, which it will.
Louie: probably, it's probably a fair.
So you're left with about $80 million.
you hit it, you take the cash baby.
'cause why would you not take the cash?
Jon: No, life's short.
Life is short.
Louie: are you doing,
John, with $80 million?
You finishing your career here
at Old West Metro or what?
Jon: As much as I love the
brothers and sisters, of West
Metro and I really do like my job.
But, if I did not need income, I
would, I would find something else.
And it's like I said, no disrespect to
the organization or what I really enjoy
in the value that I get out from this job.
But man, it's just there's a big
world out there and, time is the
most valuable resource we have.
So if I can control that time as much as
I can, I would take full advantage of it.
But we do play, Katie and I, we do
play, Powerball or Mega Millions.
Man sporadically.
It's really, when it gets up to those,
$1 billion, the odds don't change.
But for some reason I feel
more inclined to play when it
gets to over a billion dollars.
I think I just get caught up just
like everyone else in the excitement.
And, there's actually a lot
of studies, it's a lot of
like, um, planning a vacation.
So there's a lot of studies that say
that part of the effects of vacation
are what people really enjoy about.
Vacation is the lead up into the vacation.
Thinking about what you're gonna
do, dreaming about this and
fantasizing and envisioning what
that vacation's gonna look like.
I think that's what the Powerball or
Mega Millions is for a lot of people.
It gets them outside
of their normal lives.
it gets them thinking about what could
be possible if money wasn't an issue.
And it really gives them that
kind of freedom to think big.
Yeah.
And not be restricted by like,
well that'd be great, but I
can't afford that kind of thing.
So I think there is to a small amount,
like that's a small price to pay for
some excitement or some entertainment.
'cause it, at the end of the day,
that's what the lottery ends up being.
Yeah.
Is entertainment.
Louie: I totally agree.
I think, and even mathematically, there's
something called expected value, right?
So there comes a point where even
with the insane odds, the high
amount of the Powerball can, you
can make a mathematical case for
being like, I should buy a ticket.
'cause it's fun and
Jon: Oh yeah.
Louie: it.
And I totally get it.
I'm not poo-pooing that.
I would say that.
I would be surprised, John, if
your Powerball ticket comes at
the expense of your Roth IRA
Jon: or
Louie: or your 4 57 contributions, and
I don't know how true that is for other
people that play things like the Powerball
or the Colorado lottery or whatever.
I think that probably a lot of those
people feel like, they, they should be
saving more for retirement or saving more.
but they just feel like,
Hey, this is what we do.
And I think a lot of studies have
been done that show that, poor
people disproportionately play.
The lottery games.
and I think that is that,
that's the dark side about it.
And we're, you know, we're
keeping this lighter.
We don't have to go into that.
But, man, I do think that
it's fun if people wanna play.
And it's fun when crews play
when they talk about it.
I've heard some amazing things
that people that would do that,
what they would do with Powerball
or Mega Millions if they won.
And, I've got good ideas.
I never play, but if I
did play and I did win, I
Jon: you've never bought a ticket?
Louie: I shouldn't say never.
I have bought a ticket in the past.
I probably can count on one hand.
The amount of Powerball
tickets, that I have.
But I'll tell you what, you guys
wouldn't see me again at West Metro.
I wouldn't even, I wouldn't even call.
It wouldn't
Jon: Wouldn't even call in Rich.
You would just be No.
Louie: Yeah, I wouldn't even,
Jon: Louise
Louie: be worth, it wouldn't
even be worth my time to call in.
I'd be worth so much money that I would
be losing money by calling the chief
and telling him that I'm gonna quit.
yeah.
I, you guys are just never here
from me or see from me again and
I'd move somewhere far away and
Jon: I'm trying to, I'm trying
to remember if Colorado's a place
that you can stay anonymous.
I don't think it is.
Louie: oh, I don't think so
Jon: think you actually
have to disclose it.
And they have to, you know, in
public records, I don't know if
they gave you your full name, but
it'd be like L and then Barre one.
Louie: Yeah, I don't think you could
just have your lawyer go in and
be like, Hey, this is my private
client that I'm taking it for.
Which is a shame 'cause it
leads to a host of problems,
Jon: we'll, which we'll
get into here in a minute.
Yeah.
but that is very accurate
as far as, I don't know.
I, you know, to get back to that
though, what would I do with 80 million?
and I've actually thought about this,
so I truly believe I would end up
starting, I would hope I would start
some kind of foundation, some type of
philanthropy where, you know, maybe
I keep like 10% of that, so eight or
10 million and then keep the other,
you know, 70 million for philanthropy.
'cause I think, I, I do think there is
a problem with too much wealth out there
and not having an incentive to work.
I don't think that's a productive life
and I don't want my kids to have that
type of windfall where they don't ever
have to like, think about working.
I think there is some value in actually
having motivation and having a passion
and having to do something and not
just have something handed to you.
I don't know.
it's easy to say that now, but
then I'd be like, dude, that,
that freaking boat was real nice.
That
Louie: that jet stream, man,
Jon: It was really nice.
Louie: airplane, man.
I don't wanna wait in these lines anymore.
Jon: I would, that is the one, honestly,
I am on the Warren Buffet train as far as
if you listen to some of his things about,
being one of the richest people in the
world, most wealthy people in the world.
And really his one really nice thing that
he would never give up is private travel.
Oh, you, because once you go
there, you can't go back into
the Southwest, what am IC 38?
I can't even sit with my kids.
No.
dude, it ain't happening.
Yeah.
So I would definitely take up Warren
on some private travel for sure.
but do I need 15 houses?
No.
Do I need all these other
Louie: things?
Just a few.
Just a few.
I just need a few, man.
Jon: just a couple, be
seasonal here and there.
What about you?
What have, have you guys ever thought
about what the Barillas would do
if you, Took the big winnings home.
Louie: Oh, man.
Caitlyn doesn't really play that game.
She doesn't really care.
She feels ah, that'd be just a curse.
Yeah.
Which we'll talk about
in just a minute here.
Yeah.
which, and she's right.
I would be like, oh sweetheart, we'd
go, we're gonna have houses in different
places, in different countries.
We're gonna go everywhere.
I think that, I think
that you're right though.
I would have to give a lot of it away.
Yeah.
I think giving it a lot of away is the key
to, and not to like all your third cousins
that start coming outta the woodwork.
That's not what I'm saying.
But I think to charity that would
have to be your mission and your goal.
I think if you kept it, you know, $80
million and this, that's a small, this
is a small jackpot, $80 million that
would be using our 4% rule, which if
you guys remember, if you take a pool
of money and you, only spend 8%, or
sorry, 4% of it, you have a very low
likelihood about living your money.
So using that rule, you would have about.
$3.2
million a year every year for the rest
of your life that you could spend.
that's like $266,000 a month that
you would be able to live off of.
that is insane.
you have a high income family's salary
every, a yearly salary, every month that
you could do whatever you want with.
And I think that you would, you
would have fun for a while, but
then you would go off the rails.
So you'd have to have some guard rails.
I think giving it away, having
some charitable things that you do
and having some kind of structure.
I don't think I'd work at West Metro.
I think I'd be done with that, but
I would try to do something, in a
volunteer aspect that I would get some
kind of pleasure and structure from.
I think.
that's what I say too.
I don't know.
I'd probably be on drugs and be
living under a bridge in five
years, but I'd be a fun five years.
Jon: it'd be five years worth noting.
You're not kidding about that.
so what are the actual odds?
All right, so I can't remember who,
who said this, but basically the theme
behind it was like, the lottery's
for people that can't do math.
Yeah.
It's basically attacks on the poor, more
or less because disproportionately people
from the lower end of the socioeconomic
spectrum do play the lottery in hopes
of getting out of that position.
Right.
Like, that's kind of, that
they believe that is their way,
to achieve financial freedom.
because of the, I don't wanna say it's
a lack of information, but it truly
is out of sometimes desperation, just
feeling well with $2 I have a chance,
and then I can do something with that.
So
Louie: yeah, $2 won't do anything in
my Roth IRA, but it'll change my whole
family tree if I hit the Powerball.
Which is true.
But you're not gonna hit the Powerball.
And I think that's the thing is a lot of
people like to say, someone has to win.
Someone has to win.
Yeah.
But not you.
Not you.
And that's just how it's gonna be.
John asked what are the actual odds?
The odds of winning the
Powerball are one in 292 million.
Yeah.
Which is.
Nuts.
I mean, that is an insane, that is such
an insanely hot, low odds that our brains
don't even know how to think of that.
Like that, that 292 million, it's
not like, um, your, your odds
are, in a stadium full of people.
And you might be that one out of
a hundred thousand people, it's
exponentially higher than that.
or worse odds that odds are
exponentially worse than that.
just to give you a couple ideas,
to put it in perspective, your odds
of getting struck by lightning in
your lifetime are one in 15,300
Jon: And probably even
higher here in Colorado.
Louie: in Colorado on the eastern
plains, man, you're probably, or
anywhere, even in the mountains.
In the
Jon: Up on the mountains.
Yep.
But,
Louie: it, so what that means is that
you are 19,000 times more likely.
Of getting hit by lining than
winning the Powerball 19,000 times.
we're firefighters, so we'll like
this one, not for firefighters,
but just for the public in general.
Just for everyone out there, your
odds of dying in a fire or a smoke
inhalation related incident are
one in about 1500, which is a lot
higher than I would've thought.
I would've
Jon: I would've thought.
Louie: because of the smoke.
I guess that makes it a lot higher.
so you're 198,000 times more likely to
die in a fire or smoke related incident
than you are of winning the Powerball.
No one thinks that's gonna happen to 'em.
No one thinks they're
gonna get hit by lightning.
but you still think if I buy that
ticket, man, I'm gonna win, get away.
And you're not.
You're just not.
Jon: Louise here to crush your dreams
and saying, you are not gonna win.
Louie: you're not.
Jon: And the Mega millions
isn't that much better.
It's basically 2 million less.
So they must have one digit off, I'm
guessing, is how they figure that.
'cause Mega Millions is one in
about 290 million, so it's gotta
be one digit off, and that's why
you have the odds difference.
So very low.
low probability of winning either
of those big national lottery.
So people are like, well,
hey, okay, that's fine.
I, that's a long shot.
But what if I play the state lottery?
You know, most states have a
lottery system and Colorado's
no different Colorado lottery.
It's lottery plus, something like that.
So the odds of winning
that are one in about 3.8
million.
So once again, when you talked about
the chance of dying in a fire or getting
struck by a lightning are a much higher
probability of either one of those
happening than the Colorado lottery.
So even that one is a very
low probability of ever.
Having that opportunity to win that.
Yeah.
When you start looking at that,
so the, what I love is then okay,
Louie, hey, one is not good enough.
What if I buy five tickets,
10 tickets, 20 tickets?
My chances are gonna be that much better.
how does the math work on that?
Is it, is it really that much better?
Is it that much more likely
that you're gonna win if you buy
10 tickets versus one ticket?
Louie: no.
If you ask me to explain the math in
a way that anyone could understand,
I could not, I don't even understand
it, but I just know it's not that no,
Jon: no, it doesn't go from one
to oh, now I got a 10 chance.
'cause every time it's a random
chance you do that next drawing.
So your odds are still, equally
low at winning, whether you
buy one ticket or five tickets.
So, I mean, that's the one thing
I would encourage people when
they're playing to play responsibly.
So, you know, if you, if you
do, are a habitual player of the
lottery, if you typically buy
five or 10 tickets, just buy one.
Your chances are still so low.
But at least if you need
psychologically to move on and
say, I had a chance, there you go.
Then save yourself 20 bucks.
because the mega millions
now, is up to $5 per ticket.
Louie: Okay.
I didn't know that.
Jon: So historically, I think they've
always been $1 for every play.
but now it's up to five bucks, which is.
Dude, that, like I said, you buy two
tickets and that's 10 bucks right
Louie: and it's every week.
Jon: do that, I think it's multiple times.
It's either two or three times.
I think it's three times per week.
Louie: Oh man.
Jon: stuff.
So that stuff would add up in a hurry.
Oh, yeah.
Louie: Especially if that were in a Roth.
IRA I'm not saying you shouldn't play, but
I'm just throwing out some other ideas.
Jon: just throwing that out there.
Yeah.
so here's the trivia question for you.
All right.
What state has the best odds of
winning the lottery with a guaranteed
jackpot of at least 1 million?
Dollars.
Louie: Okay.
Jon: So I had to put that
$1 million caveat in there.
'cause there's a lot of state, I
had to do some research on this.
There's a lot of state lotteries that have
like small games, pick three or something
like this, where most of the jackpots
Louie: A hundred
Jon: 50
Louie: or 50.
Okay.
Jon: hundred thousand.
But these are ones that, have
typically from one to 35 or 40
random numbers, like five digits.
Louie: I didn't look these up.
I'm just gonna guess.
I don't know, you know the
answers, but I don't, so I'm just
gonna take a guess which state.
So this includes not only like
Powerball, but like the state
Jon: lottery.
The state lottery.
And I, once again, I didn't go
so in depth to verify that each
state has their own lottery.
I'm sure there's probably a couple states
that don't, and I don't have, and I don't
have disclosures on, don't pick this one.
Louie: So I'm gonna, you know, my
gut is telling me it's like a small
state with not a lot of people like
a Wyoming or Kansas or something.
But I actually think that.
Maybe there's more payouts in like
more populated states, like California
or I don't know, Florida or New York.
so I guess I'll just say Florida.
Florida?
Jon: Okay.
it's Colorado.
Louie: What?
No way.
Colorado.
Jon: at least from the
research I could do.
this was, and this took me an, an
inordinate amount of time to figure
this out, but the odds at one.
Point or one to 3.8
million are the best odds out
of any major state lottery
system that I could identify.
Massachusetts was like one in 7 million.
New York was one in 6 million.
They were higher up.
And once again, they must
just have larger numbers.
Yeah.
That identify those odds.
Wow.
I guess you're lucky to live
here in the state of Colorado.
Damn.
Louie: Dang.
Okay, hey, let's all play after this.
Let's go get, let's go get our tickets.
Jon: let's make it happen.
but it is interesting and you use,
a lot of the natural resources
here in the state and the parks
and everything else and Sure.
That's where a lot of that money
from the lottery goes is to
Louie: say.
Jon: That's what they
Louie: That's what they say.
That's what they say
Jon: what they, that's what they
want you to believe is this park was
furnished by the Colorado lottery.
they wanna make you feel good
Louie: Yeah.
It's a charitable deduction.
Man.
I'm just gonna write this off.
this is totally charitable.
Jon: it should be a charitable deduction.
All right, so follow up.
it's not, no.
So follow up is, okay.
What state or which, yeah, what state has
the best odds of winning the Powerball?
this is represented once again, when
they, there was a study that they did,
and it was like from 1992 to 2025.
So this year, which state had
the best odds of winning the
Powerball as represented by wind?
Per 100,000
Louie: So per capita.
'cause I was gonna say
probably California.
Yeah.
Jon: So you gotta take
population into that.
Which, which one has got the best chance?
Louie: Oh boy.
Jon: Oh
Louie: I am gonna go with Florida
Jon: Florida, okay.
All right.
little Rhode Island.
Yeah, little Rhode Island.
statistically speaking
has had the most wins.
They've had 488 wins.
since this timeframe
Louie: you could have given
me 48 more guests and I would
Jon: You would've not
gotten little Rhode Island.
yeah.
So consider next time
you're on the East Coast.
we do have some east coasters
that work here at the fd.
So next time you're back home, maybe,
wait to buy your lotto ticket, then.
There you
Louie: There you go.
Jon: that's gonna change your odds.
I dunno.
you gotta put it out into the
Louie: I gotta try.
You gotta try.
Whatever man.
You
Jon: try, you gotta put
it out in the universe.
All right, so then the last one
is, what is the most un unlikely
state to win the Powerball?
Once again, this is as
represented by 100,000 residents.
So which one has the least amount of wins?
Basically is what's, that's staying out
of all the states that play in Powerball.
And once again, I don't remember.
Offhand, if it's like 45 states
now that, that play into Powerball.
it's a high number.
Louie: I'm gonna go with Massachusetts.
Massachusetts,
Jon: okay.
It's the other m the old Mississippi.
Oh, Mississippi.
once again, I think they just
got into Powerball recently,
but they've had two wins.
Okay.
since they've enrolled so Dang.
Louie: Dang.
don't go
Jon: they could use a little luck down
there, down in Hurricane Alley, the old
Louie: They're overdue.
They're overdue.
That means go buy your
ticket from Mississippi.
'cause it's overdue, man.
that's how betting and gambling
Jon: It has to mean reversion, right?
Mean reversion.
It has to go back.
Like I love those people that literally,
like we've, Louis and I have been to
Vegas a few times, not to gamble, but for
conferences and other stuff, and I love
to watch those old birds out there that
just they just, see, we call 'em Seahawks.
They're just waiting for someone that's
been playing there for 20 minutes and
they could tell they didn't win anything.
Then they get up there and then
they claim that chair and they hawk.
Louie: it's hot.
It's gonna, it's overdue.
It's gonna hit, it's gonna hit.
Jon: It's gonna hit, man.
I love watching people in
their element like that.
'cause it is fascinating.
Yeah.
All right.
So what's the moral of the story
with this, you know, Powerball,
mega Millions, whatever lottery.
it's a long shot.
It's an extremely long shot.
Yeah.
We've already talked about the
statistical probability of you winning
and it's not likely ever, but if you
have to do it because it's a form of
enjoyment and entertainment for you,
by all means, but do it responsibly.
and, please don't do that in lieu of
contributing to, an investment account.
Louie: There you go.
Jon: that's the 2 cents for that one.
What's the, what's this thing
on the curse of the lottery?
yeah, man, one in 200 million chance, and
you're telling me I'm gonna be cursed now.
Yeah.
'cause I won.
Louie: So you're lucky
enough to actually win.
And then you have this kind of
well-known, phenomenon that happens
called the Curse of the Lottery winner.
And, what that is there's.
There's been different studies that
have been done at both statewide
levels and national levels that say,
something like 70% of lottery winners
go broke after just a few years.
And I think that, I mean, that's stark.
a lot of people might say that, that maybe
those numbers are not quite accurate.
Jon: Yeah.
Skewed a little bit,
Louie: little bit.
But there's still high it, it's
still a high chance that you're gonna
experience some really bad things that
happen to you if you win the lottery.
So going broke is like the very end game.
In the meantime, people will
have relationship breakdowns.
They are more likely to experience divorce
and estrangement from their families.
they have mental health problems
from the stress and the, the.
The trying to figure out how to
manage your money responsibly, from
people trying to swindle you, you have
exploitation and crime are increased.
and there's a lot of tragic ends.
Like they're more likely to die from
drug overdoses for obvious reasons, from
heart attack, from a bunch of different,
Jon: unnatural
Louie: causes, so to speak.
So you have these curses that happen
and it's not just with lottery winners.
I think that we'd like to focus
on that one 'cause we're like,
oh, I'm not gonna get lucky.
So if someone else gets lucky, then
at least I could feel like, ah,
they're not really getting that lucky.
They have all this, bad
stuff happening to 'em.
But there's a lot of studies that have
been shown that, People who come into
a lot of money in a relatively short
amount of time have similar problems.
Yeah.
Maybe not as pronounced, but in
some ways even more pronounced.
if you look at pro athletes, I mean, it
is, it is crazy how many NFL athletes and
NBA athletes are broke with just within a
few short years after exiting the league.
And it's for those similar reasons, like
when you throw a bunch of money, at a
young person who doesn't know how to
handle it, bad things very often happen.
And so I think that what we would
consider a blessing to come into a lot
of money, whether it's a windfall from a
rich uncle, a rich unknown uncle, right?
That's everyone's dream as well.
You have this rich unknown uncle that
just leaves you a bunch of money.
it.
it is not like you would all of
a sudden have the knowledge and
the foresight and the ability to
manage it in an effective way.
and it can lead to a lot of headaches and
a lot of problems, like real, legitimate
Jon: s Yeah.
And that's, it's funny when
you, it's, I mean, that, there's
actually nothing about that.
That's funny.
But it's funny in the sense of you feel
like you've been given this gift, you've
been given this big windfall, and all of a
sudden your life is gonna be incrementally
better and you're gonna be happier because
you now have this, newfound wealth.
Or money.
but it almost always ends up,
like you said, in a tragic event.
And I think the one that is the most,
you know, that would be really hard
to reconcile is are people hanging
out with you because they like you?
Or are they merely, you know,
hanging around you because of
the things that come with that?
I think that'd be really tough
psychologically to get over no, they
didn't like me before, but now of
a sudden I've got all this money.
They're, they're into wanting to hang out.
And I feel like you would
always be questioning
Louie: you'd always wonder mm-hmm.
Jon: Like, well, okay, does this.
person like me for who I am or
because, they get free things.
I think that'd be really hard.
And the explo, the exploitation
from, people surrounding them,
if they had friends beforehand, I
think those go through the roof.
And that professional athletes
are typically the ones that are
like the poster child for that.
Like they've got an entourage, right?
So you're not just funding, we
went out to dinner for myself,
it's no, myself and 28, my homies.
And then they're homies.
Homies.
And pretty soon, you know, you're
spending a hundred grand on a dinner once
you're like, dude, what just happened?
And I think that happens
time and time again.
So it's legit.
so what would you advise someone
if they didn't, if they do win the
Colorado lottery or something like that.
what should be some of the first
steps you think they should do?
Louie: I'll say this.
I think that the best thing you can
do if you, and we said winning the
lottery, but if you come into a lot of
money, whether it's a, a windfall of
Jon: which is more realistic
for our folks, right?
Like you do have someone, your
parents were wealthy or grandparents
or somehow like, you know, you just
came into this and we're not, and it
might not be $15 million, it might
be like a million dollars, but that
is a lot of money to, to our members.
And that's gonna, that's gonna happen
as this, generational wealth gets
transferred over the next, few years.
So this is for you guys as well.
This is, this goes beyond
just the Powerball winnings.
Louie: Yeah, I would say that, a couple
things that you can do to prepare to
come into a lot of money like that,
or when you do come in, is you need to
surround yourself with really smart people
who have your best interest in mind.
And this is gonna be really sad to say,
but it's that does not mean your family.
That does not mean your friends
or your homies that you grew up
with as much as you want it to.
It does not.
Those people are not
necessarily financial experts.
They are not necessarily, have your
best interest in mind or want you
to keep all the money that you got.
I would say that what it means is
you need like qualified, certified.
Educated financial experts and
legal experts in your corner.
you gotta have a legitimate CFP and a
legitimate, certified financial planner.
a legitimate accountant
and a legitimate lawyer.
Not family.
Not family.
I think that I, you can't say that enough.
It should not be family.
or close friends like, or friends at all.
This, these should just
be people that you find.
Jon: a business relationship.
They work for you.
Their interests have to be
aligned with your interests.
So basically they have to
put your interest first.
That's the whole concept
of a fiduciary standard.
and I can't agree with you more.
You have to surround yourself with
experts, and people that are, have the
knowledge and the ability to take that
windfall, that lump sum, whatever that
is, and then create a plan for you.
And then be able to help quarterback
how you're gonna use that money.
Yeah.
and really walk through those steps.
that has to be first and
foremost what happens.
yeah.
I don't know, man.
Honestly, there'd be nothing happier
for me than to get some, some
message, you know, a week down the
road and be like, dude, you won't
believe this firefighter from Weber.
Justin.
Their freaking, like Louis
and John are full of shit.
I won, man.
You gotta play.
You gotta play to win
Louie: That Nigerian
prince came through baby.
Jon: Oh my God, dude, I love it.
But yeah, the lottery's
all about speculation.
It's not investing.
Yeah.
All right.
So that's fun, just to think about that.
but now we're gonna pivot
just a touch and really.
get a little philosophical here.
Okay.
and this is one that I think
actually I really liked when
I was doing my coursework.
You know, there's obviously the
technical aspects of financial
advising and planning, you know,
coming up with investment strategies
and withdrawal strategies and
tax optimization, all that stuff.
and honestly, like the software
that they've created now, dude
is fantastic at that stuff.
Oh, believe it.
But really where I think the value,
whether you have a planner or
advisor or a counselor is really
in the thought exercises and the
communication that surrounds money.
And what is money?
Why do you need money?
What's the purpose of money?
And really diving into that
more, interpersonal concepts of
money and what it's there for.
But it's the difference between this
concept of rich and the difference
between this concept of wealth.
I think a lot of times.
and you can agree or disagree with me,
Louis, on this one, but I think a lot
of times, and I've even noticed myself
in conversation, getting those terms
intermixed, meaning the same things.
what's your thoughts?
do you differentiate the difference
between rich and wealthy, or
do you just think that's just
all the, all in the same?
Louie: No, you know what I think that
just out of, I don't know, laziness,
I kind of interchange the terms
Jon: or
Louie: I swap them out and use them to
refer to whatever, and this is probably
not right, or at least maybe not
according to your, formal definitions.
But I think in my head I always assumed
if there is a difference, it's that
rich is enough money for like your
current lifetime or maybe, for the
next 10 years or something like that.
a lot of money in a relatively
short amount of time.
But being wealthy, I've always
thought of as enough money that you're
gonna change your family tree, your
children and your children's children.
Yeah.
So something like Warren
Buffet is wealthy.
He has a lot of income producing assets
that continue to contribute to his
wealth, whereas who, you know, some.
A 22-year-old kid in the NFL is rich
'cause he got a contract for 5 million.
Yeah.
In my head that's how I thought about it.
But, happy to hear what
your coursework revealed
Jon: to.
No, I think that's a really good, and I
think that's above what most people think.
I don't think they can define it
in that frame or that context.
So I think you're right on.
So when I think of Rich, or being
rich, it's exactly what you said.
It's about what you have right now.
And that typically comes
from active income, right?
So working or whatever.
You're making money, and it
typically tends to be on the
higher income lifestyle, right?
So you're making a lot of money.
So you really, at that point, if you're
being rich, you're really focusing on cash
flow and then funding a certain lifestyle.
I think that's really what goes with
this when you think about rich versus
wealthy is rich is what you see.
So it's the stuff on Instagram, it's the
people driving the bugattis, it's flying
in a private jet, it's going to these,
isolated, Islands on a, on an extravagant
vacation that costs $40,000 a day.
that's what I think when you
think about being rich, it's
people making a lot of money.
and then they're living lavishly.
They're showing that money off, right?
Whether that's houses, cars,
vacations, all that stuff.
So the risk with being rich
is, it can be taken away and
it can be taken away rapidly.
All of a sudden, if you lose
that contract, if you're a pro
athlete and you get hurt, you no
longer get that guaranteed income.
That money's gone.
and that could go for a lot of other,
Louie: but your expenses are still
Jon: your expenses are still there.
Your lifestyle still remains the
same, but now your income is shut off.
So now that goes away.
So that's your biggest risk is if
you're relying on active income, so
a job or however you make your money.
and then that goes away
without savings or assets.
You're no longer rich anymore, and, but
you still have to fund that lifestyle.
Whereas wealth, I think it's more about
sustaining financial independence.
So it's assets like Louis
talked about that generate
income once you stop working.
So that can be through
different investments.
That could be through real estate.
There's a lot of different ways that
you can make what they call passive
income, where you're no longer
have to working, working for that.
Your money is making money.
That's what wealth is all about.
So your focus should be more on ownership.
In long term financial security.
and there's already the examples of
investments, real estates, having
a business that generates income.
and really the key idea there is
that wealth is about freedom of time
and stability and not just spending.
So there's a lot of, a.
Researcher, there's books out there
that specifically talk more about
that concept of, being rich versus
wealthy, the whole rich dad, poor dad,
millionaire next door kind of thing.
Yeah.
and that's really what they
talk about when they talk
about, you know, what is wealth.
And a lot of the, the people
that end up being millionaires
come from very modest means.
Yeah.
they're firefighters, they're teachers.
They're people that strategically
set away money every couple weeks,
whether that was in their investment
accounts or a brokerage account.
And then they just let that money work.
You know, they work their 20, they work
their 30, 40 year careers, and then
after 40 years of investing, they end
up with a lot of money because they
typically kept their lifestyle low.
They never, they never
out kicked their coverage.
They never lived beyond their means,
and they just kind of slow and
steady kind of the whole turtle race.
and that's how they became wealthy.
Yeah.
That's really the difference.
Louie: And I think that is really cool.
the book that you mentioned,
the Millionaire Next Door, that
was a book that was written
like probably 30 years ago now.
That was
Jon: in the nineties I think.
Louie: Yeah.
and the interesting thing about it
is they took like this data from all
these actual millionaires, like it was
hundreds and hundreds of millionaires
all over the country, and they found
out, and when they said by a millionaire,
that means someone whose net worth
is in excess of a million dollars.
So everything you.
Own minus what you owe.
If the difference after you take that
subtraction, if you have a million dollars
in assets, then you're a millionaire.
And what they found to John's point
is that millionaires are not flashy.
They're actually very
frugal in a lot of ways.
I think they said that the
average car, the median car or
something of a millionaire is
like a Ford, a Chevy or a Toyota.
it's like a very cheap brand.
It's not a Lexus and it's not a
Mercedes and it's not a Tesla.
it's a very,
Jon: do you actually remember
what the vehicle was?
They actually cited the number one, and I
can't remember what the sample size was.
We're talking, hundreds if not
thousands of people that they
ended up doing this survey on.
so it was a pretty good representation
of the general population, the
number one vehicle that their folks.
Louie: Toyota Camry.
Is it?
Toyota Camry
Jon: that, ended up being millionaires,
was a, Ford F-150 pickup truck.
Okay?
And we're talking like an older truck,
but that was the number one thing.
Once again, pretty modest.
So if you think of tradespeople,
if you think of, police officers,
firefighters, all these other things,
that was the average, vehicle that
these millionaires had was a Ford F-150.
Louie: Yeah.
They, and that, so first of
all, firefighters don't be
like, you know what that means?
I need to go get my Ford F 1309 $80,000.
that new, Raptor is built on the
F-150 chassis, so I'm gonna go
ahead and get a raptor at $95,000.
That's not what we're saying.
they're used, they are used
Jon: and they average, and I think
the average age of the vehicle was
somewhere between 15 to 18 years.
So once again, they e even if
they bought it new, they bought
it and they probably paid cash.
They didn't finance it, and then they kept
it until literally the wheels fell off.
And that's how they did it.
They didn't have a car payment for 20
years, so that money, they just were
able to stash away and invest it.
And then lo and behold, 20 years
down the line, this is what you got.
Louie: Yeah.
and that was true for
their whole lifestyle.
Like they, it showed that they also
lived in like middle class or maybe upper
middle class neighborhoods, but they
didn't live in like the whole McMansion
neighborhoods or, very exclusive.
ritzy neighborhoods.
They lived in like middle
class neighborhoods.
At least the majority of them did.
Yeah.
Which was interesting as well.
and then, they didn't pay a lot
for their clothes, for their
food, for their entertainment.
They didn't have a lot of
really expensive hobbies.
and so that kind of painted a different
picture, especially when that came out in
the nineties versus, MTV cribs or whatever
that showed rich people what they, what.
So that was like the, oh, this is
what a millionaire is really and
this showed, no, it's not, they live
on less than they make by a lot.
And I think they called
them like paw something,
Jon: something
Louie: like
Jon: prodigious savers of wealth.
Louie: It was something like that.
Yeah.
And so it showed that they saved
their money, like something like
30 to 40% of their income were
being, was being saved and invested.
Every year.
They tracked their expenses,
they could tell you how much they
spent on different categories.
and then it also in this, even
today, I think a lot of people would.
I find this hard to believe the
overwhelming majority of millionaires
were self-made millionaires.
So it's 80% did or first generation
millionaires, like they did
not inherit anything from their
parents or their grandparents.
and then they all had, like you said,
they had businesses, a lot of 'em had
businesses, but not what you think.
It's not like they had investment firms.
Their businesses were like janitorial
services, car wash, laundromats, like
very, blue collar plumbing businesses.
that is how they made their millions.
Yeah.
which is completely fascinating 'cause
it just shows like that is a really cool
way that people can actually get rich.
Lottery's.
Not gonna happen.
Powerball's not gonna happen.
inheriting it probably is not
gonna happen, but it can happen.
You can become a millionaire.
You can, get wealthy by.
doing the right things, making the right
moves, and saving your money and investing
it, for the long term, which is in my
opinion, that's like more encouraging
than anything about the lottery or
pro athletes or anything like that.
Jon: Yeah.
No, it's, to Louis's point,
it's 100% possible for everyone
that's listening to this.
And a million dollars obviously is not
what a million dollars was in 1992.
Obviously with inflation, everything else.
So you guys might be like, a
million dollars, that's, that
won't even buy me, you know, 10
years in retirement or whatever.
But if you take that same concept,
and then extrapolate it to where
we are now, rather than being.
having $1 million, you're gonna have two
and a half or $3 million because of you,
you made these actions and these steps.
And I think that's what's cool
because it's completely possible
and you can control that.
You can control all that stuff.
You can't control whether
or not you win the lottery.
You can't control what family
you're born into and whether or
not gonna get inheritance, but you
can totally control how much money
you spend, what your lifestyle
is, how you wanna live your life.
Like those are all things
that are within your control.
And that's what I like because
you can actually, you can affect
the change that you want to see.
And a lot of this is small, simple steps.
We're not talking about a
grand overhaul of your life.
Like a lot of these are just small little
behavioral changes that you can make.
A lot of this has to do with
automation, setting things up.
And then literally not touching it.
Just letting it go.
Louie: it go
Jon: And, in 30 years come back and be
like, wow, I would've never envisioned
I had that much money in that account
by just putting away this money every
couple weeks, not touching it, and then
being like, okay, I am ready to retire.
And looking at that and being
like, that's a lot of money.
I can't believe that
happened over 30 years.
Louie: and this is where, so this
is where it's like where Oz kind of
pulling back the curtain here, because.
John and I told you from the very
beginning when we started doing this
podcast, EPIs, this podcast episodes,
we were like, we want to see people
become financially independent.
that was the word that we always used.
And then we give our little car salesman
pitch, and we give this to the new guys.
When we're at the academy, we give this
to you guys on the podcast and other
people that we come in contact with.
We say, there's three things that
we try to teach people in order to
become financially independent, and
that is to live below your means.
Get out and stay outta debt and
then invest early and often.
And everything that we've
talked about, I feel like fits
into one of those categories.
Whether it's the debt episode or the
investment episode, or the retirement
account episode, it fits into one of
those three because at the end of the
day, if you do those three things, that
is how you build wealth, and that is
what John and I have been trying to get.
You guys listening to this to do is
build wealth, set yourself up and
your family up for future success.
And this whole wealth study and this whole
all these wealth studies and these things
that we are bringing to your attention
is just a way to motivate you that it is
possible and that there is an end goal.
And I think sometimes it's hard to
keep that end goal in mind because
you're like, I'm saving this money and
I don't know what I'm saving it for.
Or I have this future, you know,
somewhere off in the distant retirement,
post-retirement, life that I'd like to
get to, but I don't actually know what
that means and I don't actually know
what I want to do or when I wanna retire.
and I get that that's okay.
But at the end of the day, if you
have saved money and you've built
your lifestyle in a way that you can
easily fund it by with your salary and
still save, you're gonna give yourself
options for when you wanna retire, how
you wanna retire, what you wanna do in
retirement, and how much kind of fruitful
life you wanna live in retirement.
and not everyone has that.
It's sad to say that we've seen a
lot of guys that don't have that,
that leave, the fire service.
and we don't want that to
be any of our coworkers now.
Jon: no, I think that's, I
think that's well said, Lou.
And it's one of those things,
it's easier on this side of it.
Both Louis and I are close
in age and we're more towards
the latter end of our career.
I wish I would've, I shouldn't say I wish
I would've had something like this when I
was younger, 'cause I don't know if that
would've really changed honestly, my,
my lifestyle, how I went about things.
But it, I'm telling you right now,
looking at where I am now and because
of the changes I made when I was a
little bit younger, and just seeing it
start to pay off now, like some of that
compounding really make a difference.
It is totally worth it, but it's really
frustrating at the beginning where
you're putting in, you know, five,
six, $7,000 into your 4 57 and then
next year, it's okay, now I'm at 10.
Yeah.
And then I'm at like 16.
Louie: gonna, I'm never gonna get rich.
Never
Jon: gonna get there.
And I think that is the
hardest thing to stick with.
Is believing in the process and just
man at that very beginning, it just
takes some time for that to add up.
But then there's just a magic of math
that happens at a a certain point in
time when all of a sudden you're like.
Wow.
now that thing is really working for me.
And it just, it's staying the course.
It's like, you know, physicians,
I've always admired physicians not
because of their intellect, typically.
they are smart, but really it's their
tenacity to stick with something for 15
years to be able to operate on someone.
That's really what it's about.
And investing is no different.
It's the tenacity to stick with
something, even when you're not seeing
a huge, a change in your account value.
But just knowing and believing in the
process that if it keep sticking with
this over time, this is gonna pay off.
it's having that faith in the system,
which is just really hard when you're
younger and you've got, you've got
competing priorities for everything
that you wanna spend your money on.
it's that balance of living life
now versus delaying gratification
that every, everyone's gonna handle
that a little bit differently.
Louie: Yeah.
and there's never, there's not necessarily
a, I'm not gonna say that there is a
wrong way to handle it, which is like
not saving or not thinking about it or
not trying to address those problems.
But I think that you don't have to be
discouraged if you don't save 40% of
Jon: Yeah, 100%
Louie: And that's why
we've never advocated that.
We've never sat here and been like,
if you don't save loser a thousand
dollars a month, you're a loser.
You're gonna retire poor.
Like you're not gonna have any money.
We've never tried to say that.
but we do think that the, you know, like
John was just mentioning, we think that
the consistent, sacrifice now of money
into your investment accounts every month,
every paycheck, makes a huge difference.
And it takes a while to see it, but
when it, when you do see it at the
end of your career, you are shocked
by how much you have and how wonderful
that's gonna make your retirement.
Jon: Yep.
No, so when if you want to kind of, you
know, tie this in a bow, so to speak.
So rich basically equals money right now.
High income type stuff, right?
Whereas wealthy is more about
having a high net worth,
and then financial freedom.
So you're getting your money through
passive sources and, you have
the ability to do what you want,
when you want on your own terms.
So there's a couple different ways
that you can think about wealth.
and this is actually a book, that
just came out not too long ago.
I kind of just got some of the
cliff notes, but I really want to, I
really wanna read this book because
I like the framework for which this
guy thought about wealth and he
basically frames it in five different
dimensions or what he calls pillars.
and the first pillar is time wealth.
And this is one, maybe I'm
just getting old Louie.
This is the one that to me
like that struck with me.
And I think it strikes a lot of people
as they get a little bit older, their
kids get a little bit older and they
get a little bit closer to kind of
hanging up, the spurs, so to speak.
But it's, time, wealth is the ability
to control how you spend your time,
who you spend it with, what you do.
Who you are and you're basically
take a trading time intentionally
rather than letting it slip away.
And I was like, man, that thing really
resonated with me because it's really
the one resource out of all the resources
that you, that we talk about that you
cannot earn more of, you're maximizing
your autonomy over its foundation.
So that one, I was
like, dude, that one's a
Louie: that hits hard, man.
Jon: one hits hard as And I try to
keep up with a lot of our retirees
and have conversations and, you
know, the universal truth that I
have found time and time again.
people that I talk to six months
a year, four years after their
retirement, like, how's it going?
And almost universally they're
like, man, if I knew this is
what it was gonna be like.
I would've left three or five years ago.
I just, I was scared.
I didn't know if I had the money.
All these other things come into play.
Yeah.
but the one thing they realize
is that time is the one thing
that you can't get back.
so the other pillar is social wealth.
And I think this is, really important.
And that's keeping quality of your
relationships, some sense of a
community, your social capital.
This is something here
at the FD we hold dearly.
This is one of the best parts of the
job is who you get to work with in
spending time with your coworkers.
so I don't know if that one's so
much, of a factor for a lot of us
because we really, for the most
part, really enjoy the people we get
to work with and have a lot of fun.
Yeah.
so I don't think, I think that's
more for jobs where you're really
beat down by your coworkers and
just really hate coming to work.
Louie: we're beat down by our coworkers,
Jon: but in a
Louie: different, we like cums for it
Jon: Yes.
In a meaningful way.
the other one is, mental wealth.
and that's having, a clarity of purpose,
growth, emotional health and curiosity,
engaging in meaningful mental work.
so this is one that I think when Louie
was talking about, like, you know, having
philanthropy or setting up a foundation,
if you came into a big windfall, I think
this is the one, they really, I think
this is really framed around purpose.
Like, what are you, what are you
spending your time on this earth to do?
And a lot of our work though is
purposeful, although sometimes
it doesn't always feel that way.
Yeah.
But I think most of us have a sense in
value in what we do, physical wealth.
this is one, once again, as you get
older, man, you sit there and this
one becomes, you take it less and less
for granted because you start to have
ailments, you start to have injuries,
you can't quite do what you used to.
thinking about your health and
vitality, energy, how you're
spending your time, taking care of
your body, what you're putting into
your body, all those other things.
dude, once again, this is not
a 20-year-old temple anymore.
dude, I can't eat those
sweets like I used to.
Louie: I think that the other, the
other important thing notice about your,
or to remember about your health is
that if it's gone, I mean, very often
it's hard to get back, especially as
Jon: you get older.
Oh, 100% it's not coming back.
Louie: So if you.
If you have bad health now, or you
neglect your health now, then you are
going to be paying some of your money
that you've been saving up in retirement
and you're not going on vacation, you're
not gonna go do really cool things or
have a great time, golfing or doing
whatever you wanna do on vacation.
You're gonna be spending it on
dialysis treatments and you're gonna
be spending it on medications and
on things related to your health.
So if you don't make an investment in
your health now and get financially
wealthy or financially healthy
now, you will pay for it later.
You will money.
And I, when I say pay for it, I mean
financially, you will pay for it.
Jon: Yep.
And then his last pillar, is this
concept of, financial wealth.
And really that is, more
traditionally what we think about
when we think about wealth, right?
So money, assets, income,
financial, freedom.
and really the thing about
this one is, thinking about.
When you have enough, and this is the
one that I think most of our folks
struggle with the most, and this is
what typically keeps people working here
longer than they probably need to, is
they haven't quite defined what enough is.
so really it's all about, no longer
just the accumulation phase, but
really what are you gonna do and
how do you want your money to
support your other types of wealth?
And the one thing I really like that
he focuses on is these five pillars.
Are gonna change depending on where
you are in your life cycle, right?
It's just, it's natural to
happen as you're younger.
You feel less about the time wealth 'cause
you still have many years in front of you,
so you're not so concerned about that.
You're probably more concerned about
building up your financial temple, so to
speak, and some of these other, the social
wealth is probably really important.
And then as you get to middle
age, like three or four of these
become equally important and
you're trying to balance those.
And then as you get a little bit older
and a little bit closer to retirement
or in retirement, then man time,
wealth is your number one priority.
So these things will change
as you age and as you grow up.
But I think being really
mindful of what wealth is and.
Thinking about that, I think is
a really good thought exercise.
I think if more people thought about
why they were spending money or how
they were spending money, I think it
would, I think they'd get more happiness
on the things that they actually
did buy because it would have some
more purpose and meaning behind it.
So, kind of a deep thought
exercise on some of that stuff.
But, I would incur you guys, and sorry,
I wanted to look, about what this guy's,
book was, I believe his name was Sahil
Bloom, was the author and it had something
to do with the five Elements of Wealth.
So I'm probably butchering that, but
I'm sure if you just Google some of
those things, his book will pop up.
I wanna read a little bit more about
it, but I really liked the framework, in
which he addressed some of those things.
So the difference between being
rich versus being wealthy.
here at the fiscal firehouse,
we want you guys to be wealthy.
Yeah.
Not so much rich
Louie: in every area of your life.
Jon: That's right.
Yeah.
That's right.
Cool.
Anything else you want to
add to the, podcast, Louis?
Once again, we're coming up on about
our hour of, conversation and dialogue,
so hopefully this one wasn't as heady.
It was a little bit more lighthearted,
thinking about the lottery and
odds and rich versus wealth and how
to achieve some of those things.
but, nonetheless, good conversations.
Louie: I thought it was great.
I had a good time.
I think it's fun talking about it.
I would still talk to you if I won the
lottery, just so you know, if I won the
Jon: you would probably still reach out to
Louie: I'll probably reach out.
I, or I'd have someone reach out on my
Jon: Yeah, your people
would call my people.
Louie: yeah, exactly.
I'd have them call you and tell
you that I'm doing all right.
Just so you know that everything's
Jon: I don't know how a
country club would look on you.
I don't know if you could quite
assimilate into the country club love
Louie: I'd get kicked out.
I'd get kicked out
Jon: wearing, yeah.
Wearing your wife.
Beat her on the golf course.
Yeah.
Probably wouldn't cut
the, wouldn't cut it.
Louie: no, I think I'd get kicked
out and I'm okay with that.
I, I'll never be that kind of guy
and I'm okay with that, even if I
won $80 million in the Powerball,
Jon: There you go.
No, you got a big heart.
Louie.
I've definitely, I know that much
about you and, we'll wrap this up.
As always, guys, you know how
to get ahold of us by now.
we are gonna have a little bit of
a teaser, coming up for you guys.
starting, next year.
We're, thinking about,
taking this onto some video.
We're thinking about
doing some video platform.
We've gotten a lot of requests and
we also know this is once again,
just the media in which a lot of
our folks are consuming content.
Louie and I are, considering,
slash intentionally, maybe
putting this on the old YouTube.
So we're working on getting
some equipment set up and
Louie: completely unrelated.
We're also getting Botox
Jon: injections.
Yeah,
Louie: we got a lot of work
to do between now and then.
Jon: we do, I know I've
got a phase for radio.
so you guys will get
to see it in the flesh.
Those of you that, dunno who Louie and I
are, but we are looking forward to that.
we're not gonna promise a date yet,
because, we still gotta get some
stuff, in the pipeline, so to speak.
So that'll be coming.
But other than that, continue
to listen to the podcast.
please send some likes, some
subscribes, all that stuff.
I actually, I don't understand how the
algorithms work, but if you feel like a
lot of this stuff is valuable for people
to at least just noodle over, you know,
give us a like, or something that might,
just put this in front of someone's
ears that didn't even know we existed.
Yep.
All right.
Louie: All right.
we appreciated guys.
Thanks for your time.
Thanks for listening.
Stay safe and keep saving.
The Fiscal Firehouse Podcast is
a podcast curated specifically
for local 1309 members.
This podcast is for informational
and educational purposes only,
and should not be construed as
professional financial advice.
Should you need professional
advice, consult a licensed
financial advisor or tax advisor.
The opinions of John Beatty, Louis
Barilla and their castmates are
solely their own, and don't reflect
that of West Metro Fire Rescue.