Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
Processing the father wound happens in stages. Mentee's have the responsibility to not only help their mentee's through these seasons, but to recognize where they are at personally in addressing their own father wound. We've identified five stages/seasons of the father wound to give you greater insight into the internal journey and actions we must take to process our father wounds. Today's episode is part five of a five part series called The Father Factor. In this series we are unpacking God's vision for fathers, the role of a father, the signs and symptoms of a father wound, the difference between an orphan spirit and sonship, and the different seasons of the father wound.
Creators and Guests
What is You Can Mentor: A Christian Youth Mentoring Podcast?
You Can Mentor is a network that equips and encourages mentors and mentoring leaders through resources and relationships to love God, love others, and make disciples in their own community. We want to see Christian mentors thrive.
We want to hear from you! Send any mentoring questions to hello@youcanmentor.com, and we'll answer them on our podcast. We want to help you become the best possible mentor you can be. Also, if you are a mentoring organization, church, or non-profit, connect with us to join our mentoring network or to be spotlighted on our show.
Please find out more at www.youcanmentor.com or find us on social media. You will find more resources on our website to help equip and encourage mentors. We have downloadable resources, cohort opportunities, and an opportunity to build relationships with other Christian mentoring leaders.
You can mentor is a podcast about the power of building relationships with kids from hard places in the name of Jesus. Every episode will help you overcome common mentoring obstacles and give you the confidence you need to invest in the lives of others you can mentor.
Speaker 2:Welcome back to the You Can Mentor podcast. My name is Steven, and I'm here with a close friend, Zachary Garza.
Speaker 3:Our relationship's deteriorating before our very eyes.
Speaker 2:Oh, we are still in the Father Factor series. We're excited about this series. If you haven't checked out the past episodes, what are you doing with your life? I mean, what really do you have all going on? Like, I mean, you got to mow your yard, maybe do the dishes and listen to this podcast.
Speaker 2:You have 3 responsibilities. But in all seriousness, we're, we're excited about this series because there's just so much gold when you unpack the effects of a father wound. We all have a father wound, which is a very depressing thing to think about. But, particularly when you're a kid from a hard place, there are just a lot of signs of how this affects your entire life, your upbringing, your development. Today, we're gonna unpack the seasons of the father wound.
Speaker 2:So what does the father wound look like as you progress into adulthood? Though this episode may be directed more toward a kid from a father absent home, I think it still relates with everyone who has a father wound, and so I'm excited about this episode. Zach, what is the first season of the father wound?
Speaker 3:The first season of the father wound, we like to call the curiosity stage. Typically, this begins in early childhood. It begins with a child kinda coming up with their own narrative as to why their father is not around. This is, in my opinion, just the best time, a prime time for Satan to start to insert his lies.
Speaker 2:My wife's best friend is a single mom, and I I would put her daughter in this category, particularly because for the last 3 years she's consistently called me dad. And she's asking the question, like, why don't I have a dad around? Why do the kids in school, like, have 2 parents and I just have 1? And and it's not even necessarily out of a place of pain but it's more of just, like like you said curiosity of, like, why does my household look different than these other kids? And I guess this guy that comes over and hangs out with me is my dad, and so I'll just call him that.
Speaker 2:How old is she? She's 7.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And so just, like, some some of the questions that a child asks during this stage is just that, like, I wonder why I don't have a father around. And it it isn't out of anger. It isn't out of animosity. It's that they sincerely have no clue why their house looks different.
Speaker 3:And then once once they kind of begin to understand, like, why the father isn't around, the next question is, was it my fault, or did I do something wrong? And like that, as a child, to have to answer that question is just heartbreaking. Like, that that is a question that no child should have to have to answer. Yeah. And then just as I kinda start to progress in childhood, it's why doesn't my dad wanna be around me?
Speaker 3:Like, they they aren't advanced enough to logically understand, oh, there's an issue between mom and dad or, oh, my dad got sick. Like, their minds aren't there yet. So naturally, the enemy can lie to them and say, well, your dad isn't around because of you. And then there's just the comparison. Right?
Speaker 3:Like, what why am I different than my classmates? Why is our family different from my friends? They're genuinely curious to know, like, what's up with my family? How come it looks different?
Speaker 2:And I I don't know if this is representative of every single parent household, but I think there is a fear of addressing that curiosity. Particularly with our friend, she has struggled with how do I broach this conversation and explain why her dad's not around. Yeah. That's a that's a tough conversation to have with a 7 year old. Like, what do you do when your child's 7 and is asking you, where's dad?
Speaker 2:How do you answer that question?
Speaker 3:Well, in so often, it's just it's the most random things that can kinda spark this curiosity. Your school has a morning where dads come up and get donuts, or you're at a a sporting event, and all your friends have 2 parents there, or you go to the grocery store, and your child sees a family that has a mom and a dad. There are just so many things in society that a kid can look to and be like, something's not right here. And what a difficult question for a single mom to answer. Like, because most single moms that I know, like, they don't wanna toss their kid's father under the bus.
Speaker 3:And so, like, how do you answer those questions?
Speaker 2:Well, moving into the next stage, which I mean, it it's not necessarily age specific as you walk through these seasons, but generally speaking, you can watch a kid walk through these stages through their grade school years. And so, Zach, what's what's the second season of the father wound?
Speaker 3:The second season is is pretty complex. And this is what I like to call the anger, apathy, or prove it stage. For any kid, they could have one of these symptoms or they could have all 3. Typically, this begins around your teenage years, and this is whenever a child begins to kinda identify, what a man is in their own terms. Kinda like what we spoke about on the on the last episode was they figure out what a man is, and they figure that out by watching movies or by listening to music, by culture, by society.
Speaker 3:Some of the phrases that they kinda say to themselves have something to do with, I hate my father, and I'm glad he's not around. That's the anger. The apathy is perhaps, I don't have anything to offer. So what's the use in trying? And then the last one is the prove it stage, which is I'm gonna prove to people that I'm a manly man.
Speaker 3:This stage is kinda birthed out of rebellion. Like, oh, I don't have a dad around. I don't care. I don't need him. It's almost like they they go the opposite way of what they're actually feeling.
Speaker 3:Minimize it. Yeah. For sure. It's almost like, I don't need that. This isn't impacting me.
Speaker 3:This isn't affecting me. Right? It's it's almost like the kid who's mad, and then you're like, hey. How come you're so mad? And he's like, I'm not mad.
Speaker 3:I told you I'm not mad. I don't know why you think I'm mad. What's the deal? And, like, you just
Speaker 2:You screamed at me.
Speaker 3:Yeah. It's almost this, like, denial. Like, I don't have a dad. Who cares? It isn't like if I had a dad, then my life would be any different.
Speaker 3:It isn't like there's anything wrong with me. What? So
Speaker 2:And and I know we've already kinda talked about it, but what are some of the signs that a kid is in this stage?
Speaker 3:Well, the first sign is possible anger. Right? It's just that showing anger towards their father or even the the topic of fatherhood. Whenever they see their kids with who have dads with their dads, they get angry. The second one is suppressing emotions which ultimately causes anger to show up in different areas.
Speaker 3:And it's that 5¢ problem causing a $500 reaction. Just I can remember as a kid, I I was so angry and just the smallest of things would just set me off. Well, I see that a bunch in in our kids as well. If they lose a soccer game, then they just, like, lose their stuff. They flip out.
Speaker 3:Well, they're not really that upset about the soccer game. They're more upset about what's going on in life. The next symptom is apathy. Right? It's that $500 problem causes a 5¢ reaction.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. But that's different. Right? Totally different.
Speaker 3:Perhaps they're like not trying new things or not putting themselves out there or taking risks because their attitude is what use is it. It's not gonna work out for me anyways.
Speaker 2:I think you said on a a previous episode that that's more destructive. You don't recognize or respond equitably to a situation because you just don't care? I would rather have a kid scream in
Speaker 3:my face and cuss me out than just For
Speaker 2:something that doesn't matter?
Speaker 3:Yeah. Than just not care. Because, like, at least I can do something with the emotion that's that's coming out. When they're apathetic, it's just there's no emotion. It's just like they're dead.
Speaker 3:I'm like, man, how am I gonna break through this wall? And then just that, like, prove it, like, doing whatever they have to do to show that they're a man. And sometimes this is going to result in, like, life altering decisions. Like, if they do something, they get into a fight, they, do a crime, maybe they rob someone, maybe they have sex. Like, if you have sex when you're 14 and you get a girl pregnant, that's gonna affect the rest of your life.
Speaker 3:Yes. These are kids. But sometimes out of these father wounds can come life altering decisions that not only impact your life, but the life of your family and other people's families as well, which is terrifying. And, again, this perhaps your the kid that you're mentoring only has only deals with one of these or perhaps it's all 3, but that's our second stage. So the first stage is curiosity.
Speaker 3:You know, this is 0 to 10 ish. The next stage is this anger, apathy, prove it stage, and that really is from 10 and it can go all the way into your mid twenties. And so, obviously, there's a lot of things that impact and affect these seasons. Right? Like, having a mentor can dramatically lessen the impact of these seasons.
Speaker 3:They can shorten these seasons. Ultimately, a kid growing up without a father figure around, a kid with a father wound, they are going to ask these questions. They are going to experience these seasons in some way for some length of time.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's that's a good point. I mean, if a mentor meets a kid during the curiosity stage, can that prevent this next stage? Or is it I mean
Speaker 3:Yeah. I don't think it can prevent it, but I think it can lessen it. I think it can lessen the impact. And I think it's almost like it can minimize negative results. So a kid who's growing up with a severe father wound, like, their waters are choppy, man.
Speaker 3:Like, there are huge waves just crashing in but the sooner that a mentor comes, the sooner they can they can help those waves kinda calm down. Like, they can't get rid of the waves Mhmm. But they can minimize it to where not as much destruction is made.
Speaker 2:I mean, if you're if you're a mentoring organization, that's the reason you're you're seeking out kids that are in k through 4th grade and not particularly just looking for high school students to mentor. It's like there's a reason you try to mentor kids that are younger who come from a background from a father absent home, where mom might not necessarily recognize the effects of a father not being in the home until it's too late.
Speaker 3:Right. And in this stage, like, this is where the walls are being built up. Right? And, like, the the sooner you can get to them, the lower the wall is. But, like, that's why I'm not saying it's impossible, and I'm not even saying that you shouldn't try because every kid's worth it and God can redeem any story.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:But the earlier you get to a kid, the better chance there is of you overcoming that wall and you helping them take that wall down brick by brick.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Unless someone helps you process this stage, you could be there for the rest of your life. So, like, I know a lot of old older men, adults who have terrible anger issues towards their father, who have never dealt with this stuff before. And so it's it's almost like you can't move on to the next stage until you've had some someone help you process the last stage.
Speaker 2:Wow. That's huge right there. So these stages or these these seasons, a mentor is helping you walk through this process, hopefully. Let's talk about the 3rd season. You've titled this the desire stage.
Speaker 2:Can you unpack that? Sure.
Speaker 3:I was having dinner the other day with this guy who works for this national organization called Avid. The 2 of us took a trip down to Atlanta because we wanted to check out this mentoring org called Blueprint 58, led by miss Rebecca Stanley. And we were having dinner after spending some time with those guys and we had a lot in common. And I heard his story, he heard my story, and there was a lot of similarities. It was very apparent that both of us were lifelong learners, that we had this this appetite for learning and for growth.
Speaker 3:And it was almost like we appreciated mentoring. We appreciated growth because we knew what it was like to not receive that, and we appreciated it. I began to ask him questions like, hey, what drives you? Like, why do you do what you do? He said, well, it's because I wanted to become what I did never have.
Speaker 3:Right? And it's because I wanted to be the opposite of how I grew up, and I wanted to help kids who were just like me. That sounds almost verbatim like my story. And this desire stage is like, I want to do better. I want to be better.
Speaker 3:I want to help kids who were like me. I have a desire to kind of take this hard and turn it into good. Some things that they say to themselves is, I want to learn everything it takes to become a godly positive man. I want to submit and build relationships with father figures because I know that that's how you get ahead. I don't want what happened to me to happen to my kids or I wanna be the opposite of my father.
Speaker 3:Right? And so this desire stage, like, they've dealt with the anger. They've dealt with the questions. They're kinda saying, okay. Now that that's in the past, I don't wanna focus on the problem anymore, but I wanna focus on the solution.
Speaker 3:I wanna focus on the future. This is where, in my opinion, like, the Lord can really redeem. He can really restore. Like, if you hear my story and ask me now, hey, Zach, would you go back and change any of that? I would say no.
Speaker 3:I wouldn't change one single thing because all of those things turned me into the man that I am today. And it's in this season where you begin to understand that. For me, I used to hate being around father figures. I used to just rebel against authority. But now, I love being around father figures, and I submit with pleasure because I know that's how the Lord has turned me into someone who looks more like him.
Speaker 3:I have a desire to do right. I've got this self starter mentality, this learner. Because for so long, I was on my own. Well, now I know what it's like to kind of create and be like a self starter. And what was once really, really bad in my life, well, the Lord kind of taught me some things during that stage, and I have the humility to listen to advice.
Speaker 3:I mean, you used to be able to not give me any piece of feedback. But because the Lord has dealt with those issues in my life, I now not only can I listen to feedback, but I have a desire to listen to feedback? I have a desire to be humble. I think this stage right here, this is really where the Lord begins to take a generational curse and turn it into a generational blessing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. That's kinda what I was hearing was that this is this is kind of like the redemptive stage where what the enemy meant for evil, God is turning for good. Yeah. And all of the strengths and things you've learned through the adversity of the father wound, like, God is turning into a place of strength and a place for you to engage and even find calling. I think that's awesome.
Speaker 2:I I wanna reiterate what you said. You said that really to move from the last stage, the anger apathy prove it stage into the desire stage, in most situations requires some kind of intervention like a mentor or a relationship. And if you don't have that, you can kind of get stuck. Whereas the movement from curiosity to the next stage, that's more of a natural just you're thinking about it more and you're responding to to the pain. And then this one to get to a place where you're processing that wound, in many situations you need someone to to come alongside you.
Speaker 3:Going from the curiosity to the anger, empathy prove it, like, that is natural. Like, you're gonna feel the effects of your father wound. You have no choice over that. But this next stage, the desire stage, you are consciously making a choice. You're saying, I wanna deal with my anger.
Speaker 3:I wanna deal with my apathy. I don't wanna prove it anymore. Like, you are making decisions that are, first off, extremely hard for any person much less a kid. You're making decisions to deal with this so that you can advance. And so it's it's a tremendous amount of work.
Speaker 3:To deal with my anger, oh, my gosh. It was so hard and it took a long time. And there were a lot of things that I did not wanna do. But because of men in my life, because of God's provision, because of His hand over my life, He helped me do that. But it was a choice, like, day in and day out, I had to choose to let go of my anger.
Speaker 3:I had to choose to forgive. I had to make these really hard choices. And I fell down, but I had to choose to get back up. What's crazy about this is those choices will lead you into this desire stage. Right?
Speaker 3:Like, God will transform your heart. Like, God will take your heart of stone, and He will turn it into a heart of flesh. He will take your unforgiveness and turn it into forgiveness. Right? Like, God is such a good God in that regard.
Speaker 3:But it's almost like he changes your heart, and then there's one more extremely difficult step that you have to get to in order to truly become all that he has. You're starting to, like, identify the orphan spirit and say, yeah, I'm dealing with these things. Yeah. I'm I'm taking these steps to change and to become more like a son. But then the Lord's like, hey, there's one more step, And this is might be the hardest one.
Speaker 3:But you have to deal with your father wound head on, and you've gotta forgive. And, like, there that is this next stage. Right? The forgiveness stage. And if you thought there were hard choices to get to the desire stage, like, to choose to forgive
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:And to let go and to not hold a grudge anymore against your father, which in some cases, we're talking about abuse. We're talking about things that could put a man in jail. We're talking about major hurts to look your father in the eyes and to truly forgive him in your heart. I believe it's impossible without the Lord Jesus Christ. You need so much of God's heart to do that and to process that into and to choose, like, you are choosing to enter back into that.
Speaker 3:I don't think there's a more courageous choice that you can make in your whole life. And that's why overcoming this father wound can be can be rare. Because who wants to choose to put themselves back into that? It takes a ridiculous amount of faith to trust the Lord and say, God, I'm gonna willingly endure this pain because you say it's for my good. And I look back on my life and I wish I could say I I was so mature that I chose that.
Speaker 3:Right? But it was really just I was naive. And I was so hurt that I would say to my mentor, I would say to God, Lord, whatever it takes, whatever it takes to let go of this, tell me what to do. Because I'll do it. Because I can't live another day with this.
Speaker 3:With this pain, with this hurt, with this anger. And it says clear as day in his word, forgive. It says, honor your parents. It doesn't say honor your parents if. It says honor your parents.
Speaker 3:What's the second part of that verse? So that it will go well with you in the land. And this is the crazy part, Stephen. And I honestly do believe this, and this is a little bit controversial, but it is clear in God's word that he is for the fatherless. And I honestly believe that there's a special place in God's heart for young men who have experienced deep father wounds.
Speaker 3:God said he's a he's a father to the fatherless. He sets the lonely in families. It says that he is near to the brokenhearted. And I can't help but think that, yes, God loves everyone. And this might just be me being super selfish, but I believe that God has a special heart for the fatherless.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:And I believe that he wants them to overcome and that he has amazing things planned for them, and that he's gonna use these children who have been wounded so intensely. He's gonna use them to show off and to say, look at how merciful I am. Look at how much I can redeem. Look at me restore. It's almost like if you see my life, it's a billboard for the goodness of God.
Speaker 3:Like, there is no way that he can overcome all that stuff. But I get to say, no, I did. And let me tell you how. Let me introduce you to Jesus. And so, like, yes, the walls sometimes can be so high.
Speaker 3:There's so much to overcome. But I believe that not only is God on your side, but I believe that God is for the fatherless, like he's more on your side than you can even imagine. And he says, I'm gonna give you the strength and I'm gonna give you the grace and I'm gonna give you everything you need to choose to enter into forgiveness. Because there's no way that someone in their flesh would choose to go through something like that.
Speaker 2:I would agree with you that I think forgiveness is kind of impossible without Jesus in this area of the father wound that in a way his forgiveness toward us in everything is is our entry point to forgiving. We forgive because we've been forgiven. And if you don't have an example of forgiveness, it's hard to to step out into that. And I I just think that Jesus has modeled forgiveness for us so that we might be able to take that difficult step to join him in forgiving.
Speaker 3:Yes. Like, Jesus modeled that. Okay? But I've never met Jesus in the flesh. And this is why I'm so passionate about mentoring.
Speaker 3:Like, yes, I love Jesus, like Jesus is my Lord and savior. Praise the Lord. But mentors are a real life in the flesh. I can look at this guy with my eyes. I can hear his voice audibly in my ears.
Speaker 3:Example of Jesus. And like, it's really hard for a kid to be like, well, Jesus did it 2000 years ago. And he, in this King James Version says, like, that's difficult, right? Yeah. But when he can look at you, and say, Steven forgives, and not only does Steven forgive, but he told me a story last week about how he forgave.
Speaker 3:Like, that is giving this kid courage. If Steven can do it, I can do it. If my mentor can do it, I can do it. And that's why mentoring is so powerful because you, by you loving God, by you doing the things of God, by you forgiving, by you being a man of character, by you doing the hard things, by by you getting stuff out of the darkness and into the light, it's like the kid who you're mentoring is watching you. And when you go ahead of them, you give them permission to do the same.
Speaker 3:Mhmm. Like, you are the forerunner. Like, you're the forerunner who's creating a path, who's paving the way for the kids to come who are behind you and do the exact same thing. Whenever a kid saying how in the world can I forgive? Yes, he can get strength from the Bible.
Speaker 3:There's no question about that. And, yes, he has the power of the Holy Spirit, like, God is with him. But he also has a man who's right by his side who's saying, hey, do you remember whenever I forgave last month? Follow this lead. Let's go.
Speaker 3:And if you fall, I'm gonna be here to pick you up. I know I've talked about this, but I'm gonna say it again. Whenever I forgave my dad, I drove all the way to San Antonio to have a 30 minute long conversation with him. And on the way there, I talked to my mentor, Steve. And on the way back, the first thing I did, whenever the Lord broke through in my relationship with my dad, I could feel the chains being torn off my chest.
Speaker 3:I was weeping with joy. The first thing I did was called Steve. First thing I did. And then I wept and he wept with me. But there's no way that I would have been able to forgive my dad without Steve.
Speaker 3:There's no way. And I needed to call him before because I needed encouragement, because I needed courage, because I needed someone to say, Zach, you can do it. We talked about the those questions last episode. Lord, do I have what it takes to face this man, to forgive this man, to deal with these issues, to go back? And Steve said, yes.
Speaker 3:You do. And let me tell you in the Bible where it says that, and let's pray together, and let's ask the Holy Spirit to come in here and guide you. And I truly believe that the Holy Spirit gave me new eyes to see my father that day, and I also truly believe that Steve helped usher that in. And that is why mentoring is so powerful. Because there are these young men, there are these children who kids from hard places who are in bondage.
Speaker 3:They are slaves because of the things that have happened to them. And you as a mentor, you get to not only introduce them to Jesus, but you get to be the real life example of Jesus and you get to help pull them out of that. And you get to help break them from the bond of slavery, and you get to introduce them to freedom. And you get to say, hey, this anger, this hatred, this bitterness, this grudge, all your this all this stuff from your past, it's holding you back. Let's break through, and let's see what you can become whenever you are a son of the most high king, whenever you have identity.
Speaker 3:But in order to forgive, you have to have these things. You have to have a shepherd, And you have to have someone who can identify the ways that you're hurt, or, hey, these are the things that are limiting you. This is what I see in your life. And you have to be open to that. You have to be able to receive feedback as a mentee, and a mentor helps identify emotions.
Speaker 3:He helps deal with them in a safe and effective way. And then, not only does the mentor help identify, but he helps the mentee deal with them and process them. And all of these things must come before actual forgiveness. Yes. 1st, it's the desire to to forgive, and then it's the words, I wanna forgive, but it's that heart.
Speaker 3:Right? Like, true forgiveness isn't just saying I forgive you, it's your heart forgiving them. And that's where a face to face meeting in my opinion has to happen, if possible. And that's whenever the mentee is saying, I wanna get rid of this anger in my heart, and I wanna be obedient to God and trust that his way is better and what he has for me is good. And when that happens, man, I believe the Lord sets you free and you just are propelled into your identity.
Speaker 3:Into your identity as a son, but also into your calling. And God is saying, I wanna spotlight you. I wanna show my goodness through you. I wanna show how I restore, how I redeemed through you and your story. My hand is gonna be upon you.
Speaker 3:Let's go change the world in my name.
Speaker 2:Amen. Come on. Would you say it's it's more difficult to extend forgiveness than to ask for it?
Speaker 3:Man, I think our kids, for some of them, of course, it depends on their story. But it's so hard because for some of these kids, they they had no choice in the matter. Mhmm. Right? Like, if I hurt you, most of the time, I chose to hurt you.
Speaker 3:But for these kids who are experiencing these hurts, they didn't ask for it. They didn't do anything to deserve it. So I think it's harder to extend forgiveness because I didn't do anything
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:To earn what happened or to deserve what happened to me and my family. I was a kid. Right? But for me to say, okay, I was truly a victim. I had nothing to do with this, but I'm still gonna forgive.
Speaker 3:And I I just think that's about the most powerful thing that a person can do.
Speaker 2:Mhmm. I have a guy in my life group right now. He faced sexual abuse in the home. He was homeschooled. His dad was aware of it.
Speaker 2:His dad never addressed it. He carried that with him his entire life. Just recently, he he got to this place where he was like, I need to forgive my dad even if my dad never acknowledges what he did or what he didn't do. I need to tell him that I forgive him. He like went to his house, said dad this happened.
Speaker 2:I know you're aware and I wanna say I forgive you. That led to his dad just blowing up and saying, how dare you accuse me of this and yada yada. And and I think that's a that's what a lot of people expect when they have that conversation is that when they forgive, like, it's just gonna be so offensive that it doesn't solve anything. And I guess that unresolved nature of forgiveness is like, what's the point?
Speaker 3:And that I believe is the lie because your friend did the right thing. Your friend brought what was in the darkness and brought it into the light. Your friend tried to forgive. Your friend ran towards the gunfire. He engaged.
Speaker 3:He initiated. And although the results weren't what he hoped for, and in some ways, the results were negative and made things worse, what he did do is he put the ball and he took it from his court and put it into his dad's court. On the day of judgment, he could honestly look at the Lord and say, I did everything that I knew how to do. And I believe that while things didn't change in the in the physical realm, I believe what he did broke down walls and set him free in the spiritual realm. And so, yeah, it might not look like anything changed, But I believe a ton changed in his heart, and a ton and a ton changed in the Lord's heart.
Speaker 3:Because your friend was obedient, your friend did what God asked him to do. Mhmm. And so that's what's so hard about this is, yeah, things might not change on the surface. But I guarantee you that your friend's dad that night went home and he had to face the Lord in his heart, and he had to ask himself some hard questions. Yeah.
Speaker 3:And you never know what's gonna happen. It might take 5 years. It might take 20 years. It might take on his deathbed. But if your friend hadn't taken that first step, he never would have known.
Speaker 3:You can't depend upon other people's reactions for you doing something that God's called you to
Speaker 2:do. Mhmm.
Speaker 3:Right? Like, God called you to forgive, end of story. God called you to take what's in the darkness and bring it into the light, end of story. And it's up to you to be obedient to that, and it's up to you to deal with that and to process that. And when you get to heaven, God's not gonna care about other people.
Speaker 3:He's gonna care about you.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:Right? And he's gonna say, hey, I asked you to deal with this and you didn't do it. I don't know if he's gonna ask that.
Speaker 2:Well, I can tell you so many situations where you hear people say, I'm waiting for an apology. I'm not gonna go forgive. Right. That's on them. Right.
Speaker 2:And, like, and that's not godly. Jesus even addresses that. He's like, if you've offended someone, go to them. Right. And he also says, if someone has been offended by you, go to them.
Speaker 2:It's like he puts the responsibility on you in both situations.
Speaker 3:Right. In in every situation, I wanna be able to answer this question, Steven, with a pure heart, looking the Lord Jesus in the eyes and say, I did everything that I knew how to do. I tried everything, not one stone that I knew about was left unturned. And so, yeah, like, when talking about forgiveness, you can go to your father and try to strike up this hard conversation and it it might just turn into a dumpster fire. But if that's the last time that you speak to your father, whenever you have a conversation with Jesus, you can say, God, I did everything I knew how to do, and I believe that he's gonna meet you in that moment with a ton of grace.
Speaker 3:If you knew that you should have that hard conversation and you didn't, I think you're gonna have to have that conversation because he is pretty clear in his word. And if you really engage the spirit and say, Holy Spirit, I've got anger towards my dad, what do you want me to do? I'm pretty sure he's going to lead you and say, hey, you need to deal with it. You need to forgive. Yeah.
Speaker 3:And if you don't, well, that's that's called sin. That's doing your way instead of the Lord's way. That choice, that forgiveness propels us into the last stage, and that is this identity stage. And, yeah, these last three stages are hard because they are dependent upon each other. Right?
Speaker 3:The first two stages, they are naturally gonna happen, but the last three are dependent upon each other. So there's really no time frame for this.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:It can happen, you know, in your thirties, it can happen in in your sixties. But the time frame is solely dependent upon the mentee's desire and their ability to choose to go through the hard stuff. Yeah. I would be hard pressed to think that these things can happen in your twenties just because you're still growing up. You're still maturing.
Speaker 3:There's a reason why Jesus started his ministry at 30. But 30 and so on I mean, but 30 and beyond, I think there's an opportunity for you.
Speaker 2:I just think forgiveness is so weird because and and and maybe that's what you're getting out in your twenties, like, when you forgive someone. I always when it comes back up again and I feel all that anger and resentment and all that stuff, I'm like, I forgave them, like, 5 years ago. What's what's going on? And Yeah. I don't know if you have have any thoughts on, like, forgiveness isn't just this, like, okay.
Speaker 2:Well, we had the conversation. Now now I'm good. I think I think it's it's a little more complicated than that.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And, yes, I can forgive you with my words, but the heart's gotta get there. Yeah. Right? And sometimes from the head to the heart takes a decade.
Speaker 3:That's yes. And so, but, like, that's what's so difficult about this desire forgiveness identity stage is you 1st and foremost, you have to choose to deal with it.
Speaker 2:Mhmm.
Speaker 3:Like, you have to identify it. And we talked earlier in previous episodes about just how many people are in denial. Mhmm. Oh, you're never gonna advance past the anger apathy prove it stage if you don't if you don't say that there's an issue. And so, like, there are so many, like, grown up mature moves that have to happen in order for you to reach your true identity.
Speaker 3:If you've been dealt this hand of a severe father when of an absent father, of trauma as a child. In this last stage, this identity stage, right, this is where you have a desire. You want to learn how to be a son or a daughter and come to accept the unconditional love of a father who will never leave me. Like, this is that consistently walking in sonship, having a vision, having a call, sacrificing, considering others more important than yourself, having integrity. It's all the things that you think of when you think of godly character.
Speaker 3:It's your heart is good, your motives are pure, you have self worth and self confidence, not for what you do but for who you are. And your intimacy level with God, like all of these really hard things that you chose to do, man, you better believe it just brought you so close to God. Like, I wouldn't change a thing about my life because it's brought me to the intimacy level today of where I am with God. Like, I love the Lord so much with all my heart and I hate sin. I know I'm not perfect, but I try everything I can to rid my life of sin, to identify things that are gonna keep me not from being a good person, but from intimacy with God.
Speaker 3:And like, I can honestly say that God is my father, and that like, I'm not just giving you guys the church answer here. Like, God's my father because I didn't have a father, and because he stepped in that gap. And he's the most important person in my life. Growing up because of my father wound, like, it it led me to having so many sinful tendencies, whether it was my fault or not. Right?
Speaker 3:Like, I I grew up with all this fear and all this sin. But now that the Lord has has taken that away, it reminds me of the verse. It's in Luke 7. Just, therefore, I tell you because their sins have been forgiven, like, she has loved me much. Like, it is that the person who has been forgiven the most loves the most.
Speaker 2:And
Speaker 3:I understand I'm taking that out of context, but that's what that means to me. And I just look at all that the Lord has done in my life and how he's rescued me and how he's redeemed me, and that's why I love him. Because I can look at tangible example after example after example of God's hand on my life. And that is my dream for every single kid. That's why I say that God has a special heart for the fatherless kid because he who has been forgiven much loves much.
Speaker 3:And our kids have been dealt a terrible hand, But I believe that because of that, the Lord's gonna redeem that and rescue them from that, and they're and he's gonna set their hearts on fire for him. And he's gonna use their hearts to transform this world and to transform their kids and to transform generations and to transform their families. He truly can take what was meant to hurt us and turn it into a blessing. It's this identity stage where you get that new mindset of a son. Right?
Speaker 3:Where you change your thinking, where you leave the orphan mindset and you adopt a mindset of sonship. And now, you have new confidence, you can take risks, you can forgive, you can trust, you can give and receive love. And that's what the Lord wants for us. He wants for all of us but especially the kid who has a father. Alright.
Speaker 3:I know that we just talked about a lot of stuff regarding the father wound. Pretty sensitive stuff and pretty deep stuff. Real heady. If you guys want to get in contact with us, please. Like, we are lonely up here.
Speaker 3:We don't have anything to do except just create podcasts. And we would love to hear from you. Send us an email hello at youcanmentor.com. Find us on social media. Go to our website.
Speaker 3:We wanna learn more about you. We wanna help you process this stuff, and we wanna meet your friends. So if you know any other mentoring org that's mentoring kids from hard places, send them to us. Introduce us. Let's play matchmaker.
Speaker 3:If you're a part of a mentoring org and you wanna be on this podcast, holler at us.
Speaker 2:I I was just gonna say that if you asked us for a t shirt, there's a 50% chance we might send
Speaker 3:you one. I I'll say I'll say 90% chance. Hey. This concludes the series on the father factor, the father wound, the impact of a father. We hope you enjoyed it.
Speaker 3:We're praying for you, and we want nothing more than to allow the Lord Jesus to change your heart so that you can build relationships with kids from hard places and introduce them to the heart of Jesus.
Speaker 2:If there's one thing you picked up from this entire series, we hope it's this. You can mentor.