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Real News For Real New Mexicans.
The Chile Wire with Abe Baldonado. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to this week's Chile Wire, and I am honored to introduce my guest this week, mayor Gregg Hull, a gubernatorial candidate for 2026. It's election season.
Abe Baldonado:We're about three and a half weeks away from the June. And Mayor Hull, we are delighted to have you in the Chile Wire studio.
Gregg Hull:Well, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here, and I I'm just grateful to be here and talk about all the great things that are happening in New Mexico and how we're gonna move New Mexico forward.
Abe Baldonado:Absolutely. And before we get started with our conversation today, Mayor Hull, Chile Wire tradition, red or green?
Gregg Hull:Green.
Abe Baldonado:Smothered. Right. Smothered. We love it. We we we kinda judge the people that get it on the side.
Gregg Hull:Right? Right. A little bit. Just a little bit.
Abe Baldonado:Well, mayor Hull, a lot of folks, especially Rio Rancho, Bernalillo area, know you well during your tenure as mayor of the city of Rio Rancho. However, we have folks interested from all across the state. I would love for them to get to
Gregg Hull:know Mayor Gregg Hull. Absolutely. Well, in 2014, I was elected to my first term in office. I'd never been in politics before, and I was a small business owner. Prior to that, I owned a packing and shipping company for twelve years.
Gregg Hull:And in 2012, I decided to take a step back. Our youngest had just gone off to college, and so Carrie and I Carrie's my wife, had kinda said, what are we gonna do? You know, you're at that you're at a you're at a crossroads. Are we gonna stay here? Are we gonna, you know, travel?
Gregg Hull:She worked for Intel Corporation, and I was really kind of hoping she'd get what we call an ex parte stint over in Ireland so she could work and I could play golf. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Abe Baldonado:But That's the dream right there. That's it.
Gregg Hull:That's it. It's like, yeah. I could be I could be a a a kept guy in our in Ireland. Right? No.
Gregg Hull:Absolutely. But seriously, we I sold the company in 2012 and was doing some small business consulting and realized, you know, that the business climate in Rio Rancho was really, really difficult. And when you when you're in a group of people and you're complaining about government, they you know, the common response is, well, you should do something about And then I had some people actually ask me, have you ever thought about running for office? And my response to that was not on the bucket list. Not on the bucket list.
Gregg Hull:But after it was it was I don't know if it was coincidental or just, you know, as I say, kind of the hand of God, if you will. But two or three people just unrelated had had asked me the same question. Have you ever thought about running for office? No. And finally, after a third three or four people just randomly asked me this question, I'm like, where is this coming from?
Gregg Hull:Right? So literally went home and googled how to run for mayor. You know what I mean? Just just did the grassroots research. Right?
Gregg Hull:Just like what I would do with any other company that I had started because I I've owned two two successful companies. I owned a a manufactured housing sales company and appraisal company before the shipping company, and then the shipping company. But I had helped many people get their company started. Right? And kind of worked on the side with a lot of different small businesses throughout the state of New Mexico.
Gregg Hull:And, so I just started looking at it from a very grassroots perspective and became that blue collar worker that, that became the mayor of Rio Rancho, the third largest city in the state. And I have to tell you, it was it was it's been the honor of my life because I thought to myself, you know, there's there's at that time, there was probably a lot of people more qualified than me because I'd never been in politics. But as it turns out, a lot of people looked at my business my business dealings and that we that I had that experience of running a business and being responsible with budgeting, being responsible with debt management, paying employees, signing the front of a paycheck. Right? And they said, those are the qualifications we want to see in that office.
Gregg Hull:So where you might not think that you have the political experience, we think that you have the business acumen to actually take this thing forward. And and so I said, okay. Alright. Well, I'm gonna look at this. And the next thing you know, in 2013, I'm mounting a campaign to to run for mayor of Rio Rancho and won my first election with 65% of the vote.
Gregg Hull:So by all standards and and the headline on the on the local newspaper was, you know, Hull Wins by Landslide. That was, you know, that's I was like, wow. You know, God is good.
Abe Baldonado:Absolutely. Well, and mayor, you said something very striking about signing the front of a paycheck. And it seems like a lot of our leaders in New Mexico have only signed the back of a paycheck. Correct. And our government is cashing checks that, you know, there's a lot of misuse of funding, a lot of abuse, a lot of waste, and just really irresponsible budgeting.
Abe Baldonado:And I I think it's so important that we elect leaders who have created something because there's a little bit more of a passion and understanding about the responsibility that you have as a owner of a business. Right? You have to keep your, workforce happy. You have to accommodate their needs. I don't see that from our government today in New Mexico.
Abe Baldonado:I I see, you know, under the Michelle Lujan Grisham administration, tons of spending and a lot of big slap in the face to the industries that are actually providing the funding necessary for a lot of these programs that they're spending on with no actual plan to build sustainability into the a lot of these programs.
Gregg Hull:Well, we are. And I think that sometimes becomes the solution for government. If if people aren't satisfied, we just spend more money somewhere else. Right? We just we throw money at a problem and and there's just no accountability.
Gregg Hull:Right? Right. And I think that's the approach is we we throw good money after bad, as I call it. And it's like, hey, wait a minute. If we're investing money in a certain area and it's not getting the results that we were looking for, and it was just this kind of I call it I call it kind of this thing when you're you never go shopping when you're in a bad mood because maybe you'll just go spend money to try to make yourself feel better.
Gregg Hull:Right? You know, when I don't But And then you you
Abe Baldonado:tell yourself later, you're like, why did I buy this?
Gregg Hull:Well, yeah. You get buyer's remorse. Yeah. Absolutely. And I think there's a lot of things in the state of New Mexico we have buyer's remorse on because we haven't we it didn't fulfill what we were looking for it to fulfill.
Gregg Hull:And I think there's a lot of things that we need to look at as we go forward. In Rio Rancho, as mayor, we were very cautious and very careful about the things that we spent money on. Now, were there were individuals that said hit that would say, mayor, we need to start this program, or we need to start this program, or we need to spend money here, we need to spend money there. And my my response to that was, we have to get the basic things right first. Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:And so I was very laser focused on public safety, for example, making sure that our police officers and firefighters and dispatchers were being paid the right amount of money and that we were building that police force and building that public safety force that would meet the needs of our citizens. Because the the number one thing people wanna do when it comes right down to it, the number one thing is they wanna feel safe in their community. Absolutely. And I'm very proud of the fact that one of one of the things we started when when I first took office, we started doing the citizen survey every two years just in front of an election just to to put it out there, and it was an extensive survey that would ask people every question. How do you feel about your local government?
Gregg Hull:How do you feel about this? How do you feel about that? Do you like the way the street lights are timed? I mean, this was an extensive survey. Right?
Gregg Hull:That we would just you know, how do you feel about public facilities? And one thing that I was always proud of in the last survey we did just before this last election, 97% of the individual survey said they feel safe in their community during the day in Rio Rancho. That's a huge number.
Abe Baldonado:I have friends who live in Rio Rancho and they say, I don't ever feel unsafe going to the grocery store. You know, you don't see panhandling like you do in other centers of the Albuquerque. Right. You know, it's interesting. The moment you cross that county line Mhmm.
Abe Baldonado:Into Rio Rancho, it's it's a very different feel.
Gregg Hull:Does feel different. You do feel different. And I I appreciate everybody that points that out. And when you go into our Walgreens, everything's not behind plexiglass.
Abe Baldonado:Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:When you go into the Target, you don't have to get a get a get somebody to to go unlock a cabinet to get toothpaste. I mean, the and I know that sounds ridiculous, but that's that's what's going on in in in
Abe Baldonado:blocks over that Walgreens in Bernalillo actually all locked up, you know, just stick of deodorant.
Gregg Hull:It is. Well, even coming here today, you know, this is one of the things that you see that's very different. You don't find this as much in Rio Rancho as you do in Albuquerque is that having having a a code on your on your restrooms. Yeah. You know, I mean, you see that at the McDonald's.
Gregg Hull:You see that at Burger Kings. You see that in every business The
Abe Baldonado:grocery store.
Gregg Hull:The grocery store. If you wanna get into the restroom, you gotta have a you know, there's there's locks on all the restrooms. So you see that. And and that that tells people that, you know, that they don't feel safe. Yeah.
Gregg Hull:Right? That they have to lock all this stuff up, and and that that becomes problematic. And I'm very proud of the fact that in Rio Rancho, it's a a beautiful, safe community. And so we invested in the first things first. Right?
Gregg Hull:Public safety. Infrastructure. Infrastructure. Huge one. Yeah.
Gregg Hull:Well, under and I know it may not sound like a lot, but it was a lot. Under my administration, we did more than a $150,000,000 worth of road projects and replaced between fifty and fifty four major roads throughout the city. It's just a long process because you'll still see people say online, well, you didn't fix my road. And I and I understand that. You know, is that 450 miles of roads over a billion dollar problem that had not been addressed before I took office, we substantial progress.
Gregg Hull:We started with the main arterials and then started working our way down. And, you know, I know everybody wants to get their neighborhood street repaved, and I get that. But it's a one step at a time process.
Abe Baldonado:And understanding the traffic study process takes a long time as well. Right? And I think that's a lot of times people don't understand that, hey. We have to do a traffic study to see what the best direction is here as we develop this road. Is it a one lane road?
Abe Baldonado:Is it a two lane road? Is it a four lane road?
Gregg Hull:Well, and and and you you do those studies, and you might get a study back that says, well, it it eventually needs to be a four lane road. But right now, they'll all the money we have is for this for two lane. Yeah. So people will ask, well, why did you do two lane when it needed to be four lane? Cause I didn't have the money for a four lane, so I had to do what I could do.
Abe Baldonado:The population hasn't grown to where it's expected to be Correct. The next decade. And so it's it's hard to justify because, again, you being responsible as far as budgeting, it may not grow. What if it doesn't grow? Maybe we're predicting that it will grow.
Abe Baldonado:And if it doesn't, well, then we just spent a lot of money on extra road that maybe we didn't need, which is unfortunate. And then that's another problem. Right? It's a catch 22. You're gonna be mad at me if I make it too big and it goes to waste or too small and we have to redo the road all over again.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. Absolutely. Traffic management and infrastructure management is is huge. Up in Rio Rancho before I took office, our water system had huge issues. We tackled that.
Gregg Hull:Did we get everything done? No. But we, we got a lot of progress made, and we we put things in motion that that set future leadership up for success. We have a new mayor in Rio Rancho, and it's kind of weird because I'm calling myself former mayor after after being the mayor for twelve years. But I was proud of the fact that, I got elected as an unknown in in 2014.
Gregg Hull:In, 2018 when I ran for reelection, one of our former mayors, Tom Swistak, reentered the race and decided he was gonna challenge me, and I ended up beating him. And that was a that was a much tighter race, but it was still a huge win. And then, in my last race, I think I won with almost 70% of the vote in a third as a third term mayor. So that just really showed that the citizens of Rio Rancho were behind me and supporting me and really like the trajectory that Rio Rancho was on. And I've been able to build really strong bipartisan relationships, whether it's Republican or Democrat.
Gregg Hull:I get into this question all the time of, well, you know, there's a Democrat legislature, and how are you gonna get anything done? I was asked the same questions when I first ran for mayor. It's what they call a weak mayor system up there. You've got a council manager form of government, and the mayor is just one of the members of the council really when it comes right down to it. And I said, look, success is not determined on whether or not you have power.
Gregg Hull:Success is determined on whether you have influence and you can get people to buy into your vision and then you channel that effort into a direction that achieves results. And people are looking for a leader that doesn't necessarily have power, but that has influence And trust. And trust. Right? And builds that trust across political aisles.
Gregg Hull:And so I tell people all the time, my my training over the last twelve years has been in a nonpartisan world because mayors in New Mexico are not supposed to be partisan. When we run as mayors, we don't run under a Republican moniker or a Democrat moniker. Now granted, people will ask. Yeah. Are you this or that or the other?
Gregg Hull:Right? And but at the end of the day, it's not based on that. It's based on how are you going to serve the people of Rio Rancho? How are you gonna serve the community? And so, I have had some tremendous training in this area in building bridges and talking with people and just understanding what some of the concerns are and building those relationships in those coalitions that right now, I I received a Facebook message this morning saying, hey, I'm a Democrat, but I'm gonna be voting for you.
Gregg Hull:Well, you know, I really love what you you did up in Rio Rancho. And it's just it's about building those relationships. Absolutely.
Abe Baldonado:And and it's about having dialogue.
Gregg Hull:Yes. You know,
Abe Baldonado:you have to have dialogue. And I wish more of our legislature thought that way. I think, unfortunately, a lot of them think this is just good for my district or good for a certain group of people rather than what's good for the state as a whole.
Gregg Hull:Sure.
Abe Baldonado:And that mindset to me is more important is, yes, you represent your district. But when you're voting in Santa Fe, you're not just making decisions for your district, you're making for decisions for the state as a whole.
Gregg Hull:Absolutely. And that's one thing that, you know, when when I talk about my experience and the things that I've done, the question comes up, is it a is it a big leap for a mayor to go to governor? And I would say no because a mayor has very unique experiences that somebody that has never been in political office has has not had. And, you know, I made sure that I wasn't just restricted to my area in Rio Rancho because I quickly realized as mayor of Rio Rancho, I've got neighbors all around me that my decisions are impacting those neighbors, whether it's the the Pueblos Yeah. Town of Bernalillo, village of Corrales, city of Albuquerque, you know, and then you've got Rio Rancho.
Gregg Hull:We've got Laguna that borders us over on the over on the West Side. You've got Zia Puebla, Santa Ana. We again, Sandia. Mhmm. Of these all of these different communities play an impact on what you're doing and the things that you do impact them.
Gregg Hull:Right? And so that's why I was chairman of the New Mexico Mayor's Caucus for eight years. And I worked with every mayor in the state talking about infrastructure, public safety, health care, education, all of these things that impact us on a day to day basis. Grocer seats tax. I was was endorsed by the the Santa Fe New Mexican over the weekend.
Gregg Hull:And one of the things they said is, you know, well, mayor Hull can sit here and talk about grocery seats tax for thirty minutes. Yeah. Can because it has such a huge impact on our local communities that we have to be very careful about how we alter that particular tax structure to make sure that we don't detrimentally hurt communities in their ability to pay for public safety. Right. That's huge.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. Paying for public safety is the number one thing we do. You know? 60% of Rio Rancho's budget is grocery seats revenue. 54% of our budget is public safety.
Gregg Hull:So that gives you a comparative of of how that works out. So while we while I'm I'm very big on yes. I'd love to see some tax reform. I'd love to see the grocery seats tax change to be more business friendly. And as a former business owner, I I experienced the impact of it directly in 2008.
Gregg Hull:I got audited by the state, not for anything other than grocery seats tax. Wow. And they came in and they just micro analyzed everything I had done, and it was a mess, the way the state came at us. We hadn't done anything wrong, but, ultimately, that the way they dissected it was it just showed how business unfriendly the state was toward businesses with this regressive type of tax. So how we replace that or restructure that is going be critical to make sure that we help businesses, but we also don't hurt communities.
Gregg Hull:Right? And their ability to provide critical services.
Abe Baldonado:Well, and the idea is to maybe lower that tax structure for GRT for small business. Right? Because I think larger businesses, especially like our oil and gas industry Yes. Usually they could afford a little bit more tax, not saying that they should be paying more. But when you consider a small mom and pop, you know, small business, if you're starting up a restaurant or maybe open up a second or third location, yeah, you're doing good.
Abe Baldonado:But still to have that very regressive tax structure, it it hurts.
Gregg Hull:It does. It hurts. Especially when you find the pitfalls of the way the the the tax code is written. Yeah. And I actually worked with representative Jason Harper to fix something that was when I got audited, there was there was some language in the tax code that was very damaging to our business.
Gregg Hull:And when I and it was funny after, I tongue in cheek said, if I ever have a chance to do something about this, I'm gonna do something about it. Right? This is in 2008. So I wasn't the mayor until 2014. And so as it turns out, now I'm the mayor, and I'm talking to Jace representative Jason Harper about the grocery seeds tax.
Gregg Hull:And I said, hey. Did you know that this is structured like this? And he didn't know it. And so as as a newcomer, I was able to influence some tax changes that actually help small business in the state of New Mexico. And we got it passed and we got it through the legislature and we changed that tax code that was that was a real pitfall for small businesses.
Gregg Hull:And there's a lot of details there, but I was very proud of the fact that I got put in a position where I actually could change something.
Abe Baldonado:Yeah.
Gregg Hull:And we did and we worked on it and we got it changed and and that was that was fun. But these are the things that I've worked on and then I've been a member of the Municipal League for the last, twelve years as well. And just most recently, I was the president of the municipal league, and that's where we work on municipal issues.
Abe Baldonado:Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:You know? And people will ask, well, what exactly do you do there? Well, we look at good legislation, and we we support it, or we look at bad legislation and we oppose it because of how it's gonna impact us on a local level. Right. And I think this is what gives me a really unique experience.
Gregg Hull:There's a lot of times in the legislature or in the governor, in the roundhouse, it's a one size fits all approach.
Abe Baldonado:And that's not even just on economy. That's education. It's public safety.
Gregg Hull:Correct.
Abe Baldonado:You have to look. A lot of our state is rule. What works in Rio Rancho, Bernalillo, Albuquerque may not be the same for, say, Hagerman or Las Vegas New Mexico.
Gregg Hull:Exactly. And and I have to point out is when it comes to education and when it comes to law enforcement and it comes to just public infrastructure, there are two communities I like to contrast that are very close to each other. You know, probably only 25 miles as the crow flies. You think about Los Alamos and Espanola and how diversely different those two communities are. But when we pass legislation in education, it's a one size fits all approach.
Gregg Hull:When we pass legislation in public safety, it's a one size fits all approach. And there are very, very different obstacles and very different issues that those two communities are facing that need to be addressed on a very local level. And I have that perspective because of working with municipalities across the state, whether it's Portales or Clovis or, you know, Santa Rosa, Tucumcari, Grant's. You think about all the different communities all the way down to Jowell, Dimming, Silver City, they're all very different in the way that they're structured and that the way they run. And the issues that they're facing based on economic differences.
Gregg Hull:When you think about grants and, they used to have the, you know, the the prisons out there that that that provided jobs, and there was mining out there that provided jobs. And then you look at Silver City and their their dependency on mining, then you the the whole state of New Mexico and the dependency on the oil and gas industry. But especially down in Southeast New Mexico, where all of that revenue is generated and the jobs that are created in that area that are very specific to that area. If you damage that industry, you you put a lot of jobs on the on the on the sidelines really quickly. We saw it happen up in Farmington.
Abe Baldonado:Yeah. With the coal plant. Exactly. Yeah. And, you know, having worked for the New Mexico Oil and Gas Association year after year after year, I saw progressive movements trying to attack the oil and gas industry.
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:And a lot of legislators backing that, yet they love all this money coming in. Right. Well, it's coming from oil and gas, but you're trying to implement policies that would hinder the progress of those the opportunities that exist. You know, the average salary in the oil and gas industry is well over a $100,000.
Gregg Hull:Oh,
Abe Baldonado:yeah. And that's just, you know, coming out from like an apprenticeship if you're a pipe fitter, whatever it may be, trucking, you know, but you're talking 6 figures here. And so you talk about the opportunities that exist in Southeast New Mexico and even in Northwest New Mexico in Farmington with the oil and gas industry up there. I mean, there is a hand up being provided for folks who are from poverty and saying, hey, there's a pathway for you to be taken out of poverty. You can get the job right out of high school if you do it right working for the industry and it will reward you very well.
Abe Baldonado:And we wanna keep New Mexicans in New Mexico. And unfortunately, you know, I've said this time and time again, we are the greatest exporter of our people, and it's so unfortunate.
Gregg Hull:It is. You you're so true there is that we are. And as a matter of fact, three of the three three out of the five of my children have left the state. And I'd like to get them back. Right?
Gregg Hull:And four out of nine of my grandchildren are not in the state. And I'd like to get them back. You know, New Mexico is a legacy culture. You know, when you think about Northern New Mexico and the generations and generations and generations of individuals that are here that have been here from the very beginning. Right?
Gregg Hull:And you think about the the culture of the of the Pueblos and the different communities across the state. We we are very uniquely New Mexico. Yeah. But we're not creating the opportunity to keep those our kids here. And that is so very, very important.
Gregg Hull:And that's one of the things that I talk about with communities across the state is economic development in in Carlsbad, Artesia is very different Yeah. Than economic development in Silver City.
Abe Baldonado:Well, and I'm glad you brought that up because I wanted to ask, how do we bridge rural versus urban New Mexico? Right? Because they're very different. And a lot of times, these small communities perhaps they don't want as large of economic boom as say Rio Rancho. So how do we bridge that?
Abe Baldonado:Right? What's good for Rio Rancho? Maybe it won't be good for Las Vegas. Maybe they don't want that type of growth. Like they want opportunity, but hey, we wanna stay small too.
Abe Baldonado:We wanna stay rural. But how do we expand those opportunities for some of those communities? You know, like, look at I grew up in Las Vegas, New Mexico and either, you know, you're employed by state government, but also the universities are the big employer there. And so they're they're asked maybe like, can we bring in another industry here that maybe maybe rewarding? We'll keep people here, make really good money, and wanna stay here that maybe isn't the university or state government.
Abe Baldonado:But it may not be like, hey, we want intel here or maybe we want a data center here. That might not be something they want. But something close enough to say, hey, we have a pathway here that we can create a pipeline for our students to remain in this community. And, you know, yes, we're not trying to grow as big as Rio Rancho and, you know, be the fourth largest city now in New Mexico. Right.
Abe Baldonado:But we also wanna keep our people here that will have good, great jobs.
Gregg Hull:Right. And I think the way you do that is you go into the communities and you work with the local leadership, you work with the mayor, you work with the councils, you work with the county commissioners and say, look, you all are asking for economic opportunity. You're asking for jobs. What are the jobs that you're looking for? If I if we go out and we recruit a company to come to New Mexico, what do you wanna see in your community?
Gregg Hull:Do you want do you wanna see back office? Do you wanna see manufacturing? Do you wanna see education, health care? I mean, all of those are a blend. But what are those things that you think would be a great fit for your community that when we go out and recruit somebody, we can make that fit.
Gregg Hull:And we can say this is where we'd like to bring this in. And that's what we did in Rio Rancho. We just talked to people and said, what are those things that really interest you? We we almost lost Intel Corporation. I mean, in their heyday, I think they were between eight and nine thousand employees.
Gregg Hull:When I took office, they were down to about 900. Wow. And getting them to reinvest in that facility, $3,500,000,000 in that facility and bring back get the job count back up to around 3,000 now, adding back 2,000 high paying jobs. We almost lost them. Yeah.
Gregg Hull:And and it's because of that anti business climate that we really feel right here in New Mexico.
Abe Baldonado:Was that also part of maybe like a more national trend as well as far as support? It seems like right now nationally, we're seeing from The United States a big investment in the Intel and what they provide and so maybe was some of that maybe some national trends that were happening as well where there wasn't as much investment in the Intel Corporation?
Gregg Hull:Well, think there needed to be a revitalization. The CHIPS Act was one of the part of that revitalization to try to get the the reinvestment back into The United States and get us back as a major, you know, leader in the semiconductor industry. Right? Intel was advancing this this advanced packaging system. And it was originally slated to go overseas.
Gregg Hull:But through the CHIPS Act and a few other things, they said, look, we've got to keep this technology here in The United States. We've got to be the leader globally in this particular area. We need these manufacturing facilities here. Having the government partner with or, you know, companies like Intel Corporation to keep those those manufacturing plants domesticated and create jobs here in The United States for our people was a critical step forward. The problem you ran into, in my opinion, with Intel New Mexico is Intel New Mexico was never never built the ecosystem around the manufacturing, the the the microchip industry, manufacturing like you saw happen in, for example, Portland or over in Arizona.
Gregg Hull:They built an ecosystem around that. All of the manufacturers of the tools that they were using, all of the different support facilities and support companies, they brought them in and they really surrounded those manufacturing facilities with those support companies. One that comes to mind is like Tokyo Electron that would build some of the the microchip processing tools that Intel uses to actually build out their microchips. Right? And there was just a ton of different companies.
Gregg Hull:Well, we never brought those companies to New Mexico to support this facility. They had satellite offices here, but if you wanted to you wanted to fix one of the tools my company actually went in and created the tool up, shipped it to Arizona. They'd fix it and then bring it back. You know? Yeah.
Gregg Hull:So, you you we wanna you we should have had that stuff here. Right? And and And that would have been more jobs.
Abe Baldonado:In those buildings doing that work that, hey, we live in New Mexico. We don't have to ship it over to Arizona or another state. We're here. We send it next door and some folks there handle it, and then they bring it back to us.
Gregg Hull:So it's things like that we have to look at very closely. Yeah. What is it that you think is a good fit? Because I hear this all the time. Well, we're the forgotten community.
Gregg Hull:We're the forgotten community. And I joke around saying, well, Rio Rancho would be forgotten if we didn't step forward and do something for ourselves. Right? At some point, you have to say, what is it that you wanna do here and how do you wanna proceed? What are the things that you'd like to see in your community?
Gregg Hull:Do wanna see aerospace? New Mexico, I think, quite personally, has a lot of foothold in the aerospace Mhmm. Space race industry or in that in that in that area. Right? In that space.
Gregg Hull:There's a lot that we can do there that we're not capitalized capitalized at.
Abe Baldonado:We have the space port in tier c that, you know, it's there. It's kinda used, but not to the extent that we would hope to see it.
Gregg Hull:Well, what have we not done there? What have we not done? Well, we haven't built up the ecosystem around it. Right. There's a lot of companies that would come in here and do a lot of research in technology and design and engineering, and innovation that there should be businesses all around Spaceport by this point in time.
Gregg Hull:So what are we doing to recruit those individuals, those companies into the state that will build up around Spaceport to say this is we support the total overall mission of Spaceport so that we can create more jobs, we can create more opportunity. And New Mexico, instead of being one of our 50 is missing, becomes the shining star in The United States when it comes to entering the space race because we've had a foothold in this for a long time. We should have been globally recognized when we launched that first commercial space flight. I mean, the this should look like a the, you know, the out there spaceport should look like a Woodstock concert of people just out there videoing this and watching this and seeing
Abe Baldonado:The historical moment.
Gregg Hull:The historical moment. Yes. That New Mexico is doing something incredible here, and it was kind of just a meh.
Abe Baldonado:Yeah. That's so unfortunate. And, you know, I always like to remind younger generations when I was a teacher, I I always like to remind younger generations that New Mexico missed out on some opportunities because I think a lot of younger people don't realize Microsoft was right here in our backyard. So was Amazon. Yep.
Abe Baldonado:You know, we have Intel. There was a a a point in time where New Mexico could have been the Simi Valley.
Gregg Hull:Yes.
Abe Baldonado:And and we missed out on that. And a lot of it was because of economic policy. And mayor, to be respective of your time, there's a couple other topics I wanna Oh, yeah. Kinda transition to. As I mentioned, former teacher, I wanna talk education.
Abe Baldonado:Yes. You know, we we always talk about being last in education, you know, last in everything good and first in everything bad. Education seems to be one of those trends, and we've had historical investments monetarily in education, and we've actually seen less results
Gregg Hull:Correct.
Abe Baldonado:For those investments, and and that's unfortunate. When I worked for Think New Mexico, I led their first ever education reform report. And one of the things that stood out to me, and I would love to gauge your your thoughts on this, you have a wonderful school district when you were mayor. You had Cleveland High School, had a great leader in Sioux Cleveland. Yes.
Abe Baldonado:The Rio Rancho School District is tremendous and has great outcomes. And but there was one thing that really stood out, and we saw this statewide in some research, is that administrative expenditures grew significantly over the last decade, and I'm sure they're still growing. And a lot of this is, you know, money spent on salaries for administrative staff, you know, a lot of these school APS, you know, four or five deputy superintendents. Right. I don't think that's necessary.
Abe Baldonado:To to me, I think that's irresponsible budgeting. I think, you know, maybe two or three. Get APS is very big. It actually might be too big, and that's why Rio Rancho one time separated. They said, hey, you know, we're gonna start our own thing over here and we're gonna be our own school district.
Abe Baldonado:But I was shocked to see that over a ten year, over a decade, 55% of expenditures grew in central admin instead of instruction and student support.
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:And, you know, Sue Cleveland wasn't a fan of the legislation we proposed to to cap that, but I think it's something that resonates with a lot of folks. I think our educators need more money put towards their classrooms to provide the instruction and student support that they need in those classrooms, whether it's classroom materials. You know, I go back to my first year teaching. I remember being given a debit card for $200 Yeah. To get classroom materials.
Abe Baldonado:Well, I'll tell you that didn't last a whole school year. Maybe it lasted a month and a lot of times and I still think today, a lot of our teachers are paying out of pocket for a lot of materials that they needed that may not be provided by the school district. But I would love to get your thoughts on education. I I've heard you at Race to the Roundhouse. You talked about accountability.
Abe Baldonado:We need that more than ever because Correct. You know, we we have teachers unions. We have others who really say, no, we don't want accountability. We want more, but we don't want accountability. It's like, what are you delivering?
Abe Baldonado:What results are you bringing in? You know, we have to gauge, hey, we're investing all this money yet student outcomes are declining or they're maybe not advancing as much as we'd hope. And, you know, I know there's a lot of folks out there that love to put a lot of weight on graduation rates. I I do not like graduation rates. That is not telling that a student is literate in Correct.
Abe Baldonado:Reading math and science. Yes. You graduated them, but are they ready for that next step
Gregg Hull:Correct.
Abe Baldonado:In their career or their academic career, whatever it may be, you know? And unfortunately, they're not. You go back and you find out that these students are still far behind in literacy.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. And and I mentioned this at Race of the Roundhouse is we're we're graduating students that can't read.
Abe Baldonado:Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:We're we're social promotion is is what
Abe Baldonado:we're doing. Celebrating. We're saying eighty nine percent of kids graduate. Okay. But out of that eighty nine percent, how many can read at grade levels?
Gregg Hull:Horribly in in a horribly unprepared for for college.
Abe Baldonado:Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:You know, college there. And career and workforce. And workforce. Correct. And so we have to get back to accountability.
Gregg Hull:So while I understand Sue or any superintendent's opposition to capping anything because, you know, when it comes to administrative stuff, it It
Abe Baldonado:was all fun. It was all playful, but I I got it. But at the same time, I said, it's not necessary. I I think of small school districts as well, you know
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:That have a superintendent making a $150,000 a year, not that they don't deserve it. But when you hire three or four deputy superintendents Right. That also six figures. Well, to me, it's like in a small town of 13,000 people and you have a student enrollment of, say, a thousand students in your school district. Right.
Abe Baldonado:It's hard to justify that.
Gregg Hull:But it gets back to the one size fits all approach. It's if something goes wrong in Albuquerque, so we have to fix it everywhere else. That's right. Okay? And that's why I think when when Sue jumps in, she does the same thing I do is, wait a minute.
Gregg Hull:Just because it's broken here doesn't mean it's broken in Rio Rancho. Right? Just because it's broken here doesn't mean that it's broken in Edgewood or Moriarty. Right? So how do you help Edgewood and Moriarty excel while correcting Albuquerque or a district that might not be performing in a correct way?
Gregg Hull:I think that starts with the PED secretary and the fact that we've had, what is
Abe Baldonado:it? Seven?
Gregg Hull:Seven in the last
Abe Baldonado:eight years. I worked for probably four or five of those when I was at PED.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. And and when you look at that, there's no consistency. What made Rio Rancho a a wonderful school district? We had the same superintendent
Abe Baldonado:for over thirty years. Matters.
Gregg Hull:Leadership matters. Exactly. Consistency in leadership. And just because you don't get along with your PED secretary as governor is not is is not reason to say, okay, you're out because you didn't do what I said. You've gotta take somebody that if you hire somebody that has the professional experience to do the job, you need to let that individual do their job.
Gregg Hull:And then if the results don't turn out good, then you sit down and have a discussion about what you do to adjust. And you work those things out.
Abe Baldonado:And as governor, you trust that the secretary that you appointed is the expert. Right. Exactly. Heavily rely on their work. If they're giving you feedback saying, governor, this just won't work.
Gregg Hull:Right. You know? You need to listen to that.
Abe Baldonado:You need to listen to that.
Gregg Hull:You know what
Abe Baldonado:You can't get mad at that.
Gregg Hull:I you know, one of the things I did that was so disruptive to my administration as mayor was when we had to replace the city manager
Abe Baldonado:Mhmm.
Gregg Hull:Twice. And I I did not wanna go through that process. I've you know, our first city manager, Keith Reeseburg, was doing a great job, but he got an opportunity to go somewhere else. Then we had an another city manager that was not a good fit and and but he, you know, and then had to had to go. And then as far as he he had some other opportunities, he wanted to leave for.
Gregg Hull:And then and then our latest city manager, Matt Geisel, has brought a lot of great consistency to the administration. And behind the scenes, we had one, basically, deputy city manager that had been there for the whole term that I was there. And he brought a lot of consistency to the process and really oversight at all of the staff leadership and and did a really a great job in kind of keeping a fluid transition of different things, whether we had department directors or what have you. But the consistency does matter. And you you identify who's a good leader, who's not a good leader.
Gregg Hull:Can you can you alter their path or do you do need to do a replacement? But consistency is key. And I think when you get it to the superintendents and you get to the school principals, when you don't have a PED secretary that you can talk to and be and and have consistent conversations about what each district needs and what those individual and unique needs are, you're going to continue to run into headwinds that are gonna be problematic. I hate the fact that our school one of our school districts is in a lawsuit with PD over four day school weeks. If if you believe that you can accomplish the goals that we're looking for and get our kids educated and give them a great education in four days over five, then let's talk about that.
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:Let's use data. Let's use this data.
Gregg Hull:Data driven decisions. Exactly. Data driven. And when you think about think New Mexico. Great organization.
Gregg Hull:They sit down and they micro dissect the data. It's not emotional. When I read their reports that come out, these are not emotional reports. These are data driven result reports that say, this is this, this is this, and this is why this is not working.
Abe Baldonado:Absolutely. And that's what we did when we looked at education of you know, I remember sitting down with, Fred Nathan, very wonderful, gentleman. And I I loved working for Fred because I got an insight to how he thinks. And it was all, ape, what works and what doesn't. Yeah.
Abe Baldonado:What do we need to do? And it wasn't, hey, this is Republican, this is Democrat. Right. This is actually good for people. This is good for students.
Abe Baldonado:This is good for doctors. This is good for childcare. It may be, it was here is the data to show that this is a good idea or this is a good policy. And when we sat down, we said, hey. We need more money going to student support and instruction.
Abe Baldonado:And, you know, at the end of the day, it wasn't a target on any specific school. It was a statewide data point that showed across the state, central administrative expenditures were going up significantly
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:And outweighing. So how can we bring that down? Not to attack a school district saying, hey, you you can't spend. Obviously, you have to spend in in central administration. But how do we balance that out?
Abe Baldonado:How do we ensure that those dollars are actually going to the ones that matter most and that's our students? And, you know, we looked at everything to, reinventing the teacher prep program
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:A lot of times. And and that was, you know, something that's still being worked on right now with our post secondary education institutions. But, Mayor, I wanna be cognizant of your time. I know we're coming up here.
Gregg Hull:Let me hit two things real quick on this. Number one, I think that we really need to focus on third grade proficiency.
Abe Baldonado:Yeah. First off. The Mississippi miracle was the New Mexico miracle, and people do not understand that in New Mexico that, you know, we're we're talking about miss well, New Mexico was doing that, and we need to remind them that under governor Susana Martinez, these reforms that Mississippi carried out over the last decade
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:Were actually being done here in New Mexico. We have third grade retention that if you weren't reading at a third grade level, by the time you were in third grade, you would be held back to make sure that you caught up. Also Put more money there. You talked leadership. Mississippi had the same secretary of education for over a decade to carry that out.
Abe Baldonado:And there wasn't these big pendulum swings or, you know, governors mad that their secretary pushed back on something they believed to be right. And the secretary is like, actually, no. That's not gonna work.
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:Well, you're fired. No. That's not how
Gregg Hull:That sounds that's
Abe Baldonado:Exactly. And Carrie Wright did that in Mississippi. She said, hey. This is what we have to do. One was social promotion.
Abe Baldonado:The other was investments in the science of reading and making sure that, you know, essentially kids learn through phonics Right. Of which has been shown that, hey. This actually works. This the is way to teach
Gregg Hull:And we're gonna we're gonna bring that back. We're gonna bring those those things back. We're gonna stop social promotion in the third grade. We're gonna invest more money that if if we gotta spend another if we gotta if we gotta spend the money on on a child to keep him in in school one extra year, I was held back when I in the first grade. Absolutely.
Gregg Hull:And and and And there's nothing wrong with that. Kill me. There's nothing wrong with that. And we held one of my daughters back in the in kindergarten. And and because we just didn't feel like she was emotionally ready to step into the first grade.
Gregg Hull:And by keeping her in kindergarten an extra year, she actually developed really strong leadership skills because, hey, I've been here before, and I know how to help lead Right? And so she went into the first grade with all kinds of confidence, which was great. And now, I'm very proud of all of our kids. But I also want to say this because this is critical. We also need to offer options to kids that are of interest to kids.
Gregg Hull:And what saying there is career technical education. A lot of kids are saying, hey, I want to put my hand to the plow, as I call it. I want to get in there and work with my hands. I was one of those kids. I love to work with my hands.
Gregg Hull:I love to put things together.
Abe Baldonado:I think that's where we expand our charter schools, especially those focused on project based learning. You know, we we invest more in those. And we make those programs that work, those charter schools that work. Right. We make it easy for them to replicate.
Abe Baldonado:You know, we take away some of that red tape that is a barrier right now for schools replicating and continuing on. And, you know, we have to make that a little bit easier for our charter schools.
Gregg Hull:Charter schools, magnet schools, schools, trade schools. And and another place where I think that we we really are missing a lot of opportunity is supporting the the the homeschool community. Yeah. There's a lot of strong, strong leadership in the homes. And I wanna point that out because I believe that when we wanna hold schools accountable and we wanna hold education systems accountable, we also have to hold the parents accountable.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. Absolutely. Disengaged Parenting is parents are a problem, and truancy in this state is a huge problem. And we need to get back to enforcing truancy laws and saying, well, look, if you do know that you're severely damaging your child if you don't get them in school and you're not and you're not teaching them at home, is you're you're severely limit limiting their opportunities from an educational standpoint, from an earning standpoint, from a success standpoint, when you when they don't when they don't get the education that they need, and then you've got a you've got a a school system that's kind of complicit in it Yeah. Through social promotion.
Gregg Hull:Yeah. See, we know that this child's We not getting know this child's not getting that, but we're gonna go ahead and socially promote them so as to not to make them feel bad, you know? And look, I remember when I was a kid, you know, being held back, there was some stigmatism to it. Yeah. But I got through it.
Abe Baldonado:Well, and not only that, Mayor, you learn, and my father taught me this, is that you're gonna fail, but you're gonna learn. And it makes you more successful is that you have to go through those trials oftentimes. And so, you know, success and failure are tied together. Same thing with starting a business. Right?
Abe Baldonado:There's an idea there or maybe a potential thought that I may fail
Gregg Hull:at this. Right.
Abe Baldonado:Like, but is it worth it? Is it worth it to give it a shot? And you may fail, but guess what? You may come back even stronger saying, hey, I learned. Right.
Abe Baldonado:It was a learning experience. I failed there. Now I know what to expect as I start this other business or I do something different. Sure. This is what I learned.
Abe Baldonado:And it's important for our children to learn that as well because success doesn't come easy. Right. And I believe that, you know, we need to teach kids, don't worry about success, be significant, you know, think about your purpose and your impact and what you want to accomplish. I came from the generation that was told that you have to go to college to be successful.
Gregg Hull:Right.
Abe Baldonado:And that wasn't the case. I had a lot of friends who failed out of college. Weren't prepared, they weren't ready or it just wasn't for them, but no one showed them another way. Hey, go into a trade,
Gregg Hull:you know.
Abe Baldonado:Right now, one of my best friends is an amazing barber. He's my barber.
Gregg Hull:Yeah.
Abe Baldonado:And he loves it. You know? And I wish he would have maybe found that trade early on, you know, and it took him some time. I also think about what happens to the kids because I had students that weren't prepared, they weren't guided, and they went into the last topic I I just wanna briefly touch on, a life of crime. And that's unfortunately a pipeline that is created in our education system that kids that we leave behind oftentimes don't know where to go in the world and oftentimes leads into a life of crime.
Abe Baldonado:Not every student, not every kid goes down that pathway. There are success stories. There are wonderful stories that we need to share more. However, the ones that we hear more are, hey, this kid got away from us Right. Went into a life of crime, now repeat offender.
Gregg Hull:Well, we have a we have a school up in Rear Rancho called Independence High School. And it's kids that are struggling in the regular high school setting that we move them over into Independence and we try to give them more one on one, very specific attention. And these are kids that could be experiencing different levels of homelessness, having major problems at home, might be experiencing some battle with possible addiction or some thing that's been introduced into their life that is really causing them to struggle to get that high school diploma. This is my favorite school to attend the graduations, and this is my favorite school to go and talk. Because I remember giving my first talk to this school saying, listen.
Gregg Hull:Just because I think look. I think college and and and second you know, post secondary education is very important. So I'm not saying anything But against if the book if the book of your life doesn't include the chapter that says I went to college, doesn't mean that that's the end of it. Right. I didn't go to college.
Gregg Hull:I came out of high school, and my first job was cleaning hotel rooms. I was a housekeeper and coming out of high school. And I was serving pizzas at Pizza Hut at night. And before that, when my job before that, I worked at McDonald's. And as I pointed out, as was pointed out in the Santa Fe New Mexican in the endorsement, I mentioned this.
Gregg Hull:I didn't expect him to write about it. But, you know, to make ends meet when when I moved to Santa Fe, we were I was throwing a newspaper to make ends meet. Right? And while I was working for Oshman Sporting Goods at the time.
Abe Baldonado:I haven't heard that in a long time.
Gregg Hull:Oshman Sporting Goods. I was a ski tech and with mount ski bindings and stuff like that. But, you know, but I I had this mindset that I wasn't gonna have anybody tell me that I I wouldn't be successful or that and and and success is determined by how I feel good, by by how you kind of feel about yourself. I am very proud of my five children. I'm very proud of the family that we've built.
Gregg Hull:I'm very proud of who I am as a human being. I'm very proud of the service that I do at my church. I've been a very proud Sunday school teacher for, thirty years at my church, and I still do it today. And I did it throughout my term as mayor. I didn't give that up, and and I I don't intend on giving it up.
Gregg Hull:I I love having an influence over young people's lives and encouraging them that no matter what their their choices are, it's not over. Failure is not an end, it's a learning experience. Absolutely. Okay? And so, when I talked to these kids, I gave my first lecture to these kids.
Gregg Hull:I said, Yeah, when I came out of high school, I struggled with home life as well and moved out of my mom and dad's house and literally lived in a van for a while. These kids are like, and I'd never thought about this before. This kid walked up to me and said it. I'd never thought of it in this this light. He says, so you were homeless?
Gregg Hull:And I said
Abe Baldonado:Technically, yeah.
Gregg Hull:Technically, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Alright. Never thought about it that way.
Gregg Hull:Never thought about it like that. He says, that's amazing. And and you're the mayor? And I said, yeah. And I want you to be encouraged because don't let anybody tell you because this didn't happen, this didn't happen, and this didn't happen.
Abe Baldonado:Circumstance is gonna define your whole life.
Gregg Hull:Correct. That that somehow that translates into you failed. Yeah. Game over. End of story.
Gregg Hull:No. No. Every end of every chapter is the beginning of a new story. You only end the story when you decide the story's over. And if you give up, then you've made that decision.
Gregg Hull:But you know what? That's not the end of the story because now the now the next chapter says, well, I gave up. Yeah. Or I went into crime. Or I went into this.
Gregg Hull:Or I went into that. These are individual choices. And what what I wanna do is encourage young people to know that regardless of circumstance, you have value. Mhmm. Don't let anybody ever convince you that you don't have value.
Gregg Hull:Because I will tell you what, we can go into a lot of stories in my childhood where I didn't feel like I had any value. Mhmm. I didn't let that define me and I had some people that were encouraging me saying, don't let this what these people are saying over here define you. You make your own path. You continue to go forward.
Gregg Hull:And as I've said before, if I become governor, that's gonna be amazing. If I don't, I got to be the mayor of my city for twelve years.
Abe Baldonado:Of course. And you got to be a gubernatorial candidate. That's a experience in itself Yes. Traveling around the state, meeting new Mexicans and having conversations, even like how we are today. Just having a conversation about things I'm
Gregg Hull:a blue collar worker that got to be the mayor of my city. I mean, I I know I own the business, but I still went to I still went to work every day and still tow boots and blue jeans. And and and was certified in all the tools that were, you know, in heavy equipment that we used. Because I was the first one on the job trying to help get things done. Right?
Gregg Hull:I was the I was the lead, you know, basically, the engineer of all the things that were happening. So I led the teams that got the work done. I didn't send somebody out there, you know. I had I had other supervisors. Don't get me wrong.
Gregg Hull:But we but I was always one of those supervisors that would go out on the jobs as well to make sure that we were being safe and that the work was getting done. And I still remember the one time I I can't remember what year it was, but I was I was in an auto accident where I was a pedestrian that was run over by a car. And I've been in the hospital for a couple of days. And I got out the hospital and I found out that while I was out of work, that this one job had not been prepared for. So I literally showed up on this job site and a neck brace, and I had a bandage on the side of my head and a bandage on the top of my head, and my arm was in a cast.
Gregg Hull:And and I'm I'm showing up to work going, okay. Well, we gotta get this stuff done. And everybody's like, what are you doing here? You know, you can't be here. I was, I'm fine.
Gregg Hull:All I'm gonna do is sit here and watch. I'm not gonna do anything. You know, just make sure it all gets done. And and and it but that's commitment you have to have to get things done, and you show up every day. And I've had so much fun showing up every day as the mayor of Rio Rancho, helping people, changing lives, and that's what I wanna do for New Mexico now.
Gregg Hull:I really wanna just put my best foot forward and do the best I can to work with the people of New Mexico and be present in each community. Be present and understand what the needs of each community are. And so you get to that crime issue is that communities need help in crime. They don't need a one size fits all approach. This is this the way we're gonna deal with it.
Gregg Hull:They wanna see a governor that's gonna be on the ground in that community that's gonna say, this is how we're strategically gonna build the police force. And I've heard some people say, we don't need more police officers. Well, I have to disagree when we deploy the National Guard into Ria Riba County.
Abe Baldonado:There's a need.
Gregg Hull:Does Espanola, you know, have enough police officers? They will tell you no. We need more police officers. So okay. So how do we help Espanola and Ria Ribe County get more police and sheriff's officers in those departments to help overcome the fentanyl problem and the and the opioid problem that is rampant in those communities.
Gregg Hull:Right. And so yeah.
Abe Baldonado:And also from a a statewide level, how do we incentivize and also make future generations of police force feel welcome into that position? Because I think nationally, we've kinda made it a a bad stigma to be a police officer and a public safety officer in
Gregg Hull:a You hit the word welcome. You know what? You know why people feel different, Rio Rancho? It's because, when they drive up there is because our community has a strong, strong public sentiment of respect and love for our police officers.
Abe Baldonado:Absolutely.
Gregg Hull:Because we understand the job they're trying to do. And you may not like them on one day because they pull you over and give you a ticket cause they're doing their job. Right?
Abe Baldonado:But they'll be the ones you call when you need something.
Gregg Hull:Exactly. But when you dial 911, they're gonna be the first ones to show up on your worst day and try to make it better.
Abe Baldonado:That's amazing. Merrill Hall, I don't think we can end on a better note. I just wanna say, I know what it takes just having worked for former lieutenant governor John Saunders and working on campaigns during my, you know, early, I guess, early adult years. Yes. I don't wanna age myself too much.
Abe Baldonado:But the commitment that it takes to to jump into something like this. And so I just want to say God bless you, your wife, Carrie, and your entire family because making that decision to take this leap to run for office doesn't come easy. Yeah. There's a lot of reflection and prayer that goes into it. And so I just wanna say God bless you as you hit the campaign trail for the
Gregg Hull:final Thank you.
Abe Baldonado:Three and a half weeks, and thank you for wanting to lead New Mexico.
Gregg Hull:Absolutely. And I'm looking forward to it. Thank you for having me on the show.
Abe Baldonado:Absolutely. Mayor Hull, just as we close, where can folks go to learn more about
Gregg Hull:you and your Please go out and visit our website, Gregg, then that's gregghull.com, greghull.com. Or you can email me at greg@greghull.com as well. And follow me on Facebook. That's that's a great way to keep in touch. Greg Hull for New Mexico is the Facebook page.
Abe Baldonado:Wonderful. Mayor Hull, thank you for your time today. Thank you. Thank you for coming on to Chile Wire. And hopefully, we get to call you maybe governor Absolutely.
Abe Baldonado:In a few months. Absolutely. Well, we wish you the best of luck, Mayor. God bless you. And that's it for this week's Chile Wire y'all.
Abe Baldonado:Stay tuned because we have other gubernatorial candidates in the coming weeks. We'll see you soon.