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A thirst quenching podcast for the girls, gays, theys, & astrology baes where we talk about anything & EVERYTHING through an astrological lens.
I need to get out of here or I'm not going to survive this.
Jess:Make sure that no one really had access to me and knew exactly what to say to make me feel like I couldn't leave.
Serena:I feel like you are a really good inspiration of like a success story. People need to see this as, like, get out of that relationship. You get a better one. Hi, guys. Welcome tea from the Galaxy, a thirst quenching podcast for the girls gaze days and astrology bays where we talk about anything and everything through an astrological lens.
Serena:So today I have my best in a testy my best friend Jess here. I am currently in Jersey. I'm originally from New Jersey. I thought this was the perfect time to do a podcast like this. Thank you so much for having me.
Jess:Yes, I'm so excited. Excited to
Serena:be a couple questions that I ask everyone that comes on this podcast, you can answer any of them, all of them, none of them, whatever you feel comfortable with. But this is just so you know, whoever's listening can have a better understanding of who you are, your age, your pronouns, your sexual identity, and then your big three. Okay.
Jess:So I'm 27. My pronouns are she and her. And
Serena:I am straight. You're the first straight person on my body. But I'm an ally.
Jess:Three. I'm a tour son, Pisces moon and Virgo rising.
Serena:Love it. I always joke around. So Jess is engaged to a great man. And her fiance has very similar placements to me like, yes, we both have Cancer Suns, Capricorn moons, Leo Mercury. So I always joke around.
Serena:I'm like, maybe my perfect person has also a Taurus Sun Pisces moon. I just feel like those and I think this is literally why we're best friends. Well, not the only reason, but that combination, Taurus and earth sun and a water moon with a water sun and earth moon, We just get each other.
Jess:We just it just clicks. Yeah, there's no effort needed. You don't
Serena:overly explain anything. It's just an underlining understanding of each other.
Jess:Feel like yeah, for sure. I feel like anything can be dealt with through communication.
Serena:We've been friends for over ten years. We've never gotten to a fight.
Jess:Mhmm. And, like, I don't know. I can't, like, recall, like, any, like, times where we could have been, but we've just gotten through it
Serena:Yeah.
Jess:No matter what.
Serena:I feel like we just know how to, like, speak to each other too. We just know what, like, each other needs. Mhmm. So yeah. No.
Serena:I love it.
Jess:Comforting and nurturing. Yeah.
Serena:If you have a Taurus sun, Pisces, moon out there,
Jess:hit my line. Literally.
Serena:Yeah, little background of how our friendship started. So like what I said, we've been friends for over ten years. We we grew up down the block from each other, but we didn't know each other for so long because I went to public school and
Jess:you went to Catholic school. I went to private school
Serena:in eighth grade, the BBM era, era, we added each other on BBM and Facebook because we had a mutual friend because you still knew people through sports. Yes. Yes. So even though you went to a different school, you played soccer and stuff. So you so
Jess:I was on media was like my bridge for that.
Serena:Yes. Yeah, that definitely did help before you going into high school. Yeah, you were trying to meet a lot of people through social media. And that and I was one of those people. Yeah.
Serena:So then we started talking a lot. Threw a party in eighth grade. Invited you. I'll never forget that. Yeah.
Serena:We were we started being friends freshman year, but then we kind of like went our own ways a little bit, but it's not like any beef or anything. We just kinda, I think, separated Mhmm. Through like the different friend groups, but we were always friendly and everything. It wasn't until senior or summer going to senior year and senior year where we had a lot of similar classes together. So we saw each other every single day and became besties.
Jess:Yeah. And that was it. The rest is history.
Serena:Yeah. It's like We also both another reason that we were also friends or that started our friendship actually because it's not like we just edit each other on BBM and Facebook and like we were friends. But and we always went down to seaside and it was short and we always went to like the teen nights at Karma's. Oh my god. And I were glowing stuff.
Serena:Yeah. Literally. So that was our bonding moment.
Jess:We wouldn't even go together, but we would end up seeing one another. Yeah. Like, just, like, reflect on it. And I don't know. It was just our thing.
Serena:So Jersey Shore, you guys are the bridge between our friendship, honestly.
Jess:Each other for, like, over fifteen years, but I'd say like our solid friendship is approaching ten years.
Serena:Yes. Basically my sister. Yes. Happily ever after after that. Mhmm.
Serena:Let's get into the purpose of this. The reason that I wanted to do this video with you and kind of talk about narcissistic relationships and narcissistic abuse. If you've like read the title, you know that this is kind of what it's about. Feel very inspired by our friendship. People who I have on this podcast are people who inspire me period.
Serena:I love our friendship. I'm you inspire me period. But one thing that really I feel like actually drew us closer was one of like the worst time periods of our lives, which is very interesting and it just shows that everything happens for a reason and that you can always find the good and bad situations. Loved how we maneuvered being friends with each other while we were both in narcissistic relationships at different points in our lives.
Jess:I was 15 up until yeah. I was 19.
Serena:Yeah. And then me, I was at 23 to 25. Mhmm. So definitely different time period of your life. It's not like we were going through at the same time.
Serena:But if it wasn't for you
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:Bro, chuck me into a mental institution. I don't even know what I would have done. And I think you can see a lot of friendships fall and break when people are in narcissistic relationships.
Jess:For sure.
Serena:Because unless until you're in one, you really don't understand how your brain rewires and how your perspective of the like the world just completely changes. Mhmm. And with your perspective changing on the world comes relationship changes around you. Now your friends don't really fuck with you anymore. Your friends don't want to talk to you.
Serena:Your friends don't want to hear about it. Your friends don't like the partner that you're with, so they kind of distance themselves, you know, and not saying those are bad things to do. Like if you have someone that's close to you that's in a really, really toxic relationship and now it's toxic to you.
Jess:Yeah. Then you
Serena:do have to put boundaries. You have to do what you have to do. But there are people and friendships where people will just see you kind of crumbling in a relationship and they don't know how to deal with it. But I feel like with us, we were almost like each other's backbone. Yeah, we're what we needed.
Serena:And it takes a lot and like in a friendship because obviously you never want to see your best friend kind of crumbling in front of you. Yeah. But it says a lot or if it meant a lot to just be a solid person, a rock and a listening ear during a time of you know when you're going insane. Yeah. Because sometimes you just need to like talk it out.
Serena:And I think that was like a big thing from me with you just kind of talking it out and hearing it out loud and just kind of and not even just like needing advice every single time. Just like kind of being a listening ear and like kind of see like hearing your perspective and some bored almost. Yeah, because I'm a big believer in sometimes you just need to talk it out. Like sometimes you just need to say it over and over and over again. He talking about the same things that happened since like fifteen years ago, but he just need to like sort of each
Jess:conversation like I know we talked about this a million times, but yeah, we just kind of go through it and
Serena:I think it's healing. Especially if you feel triggered by something in the present day and you need to reflect on what happened in the past and talk it out. And just even if it's a story that you told a million times, talk it out because you're, you're making connections of what you've relived in the past already. I live this storyline already. Let me just talk it out instead of just like, you know, feeling all scrambled in your brain.
Jess:Of course. Yeah. And I feel like we all like we're living this life for the first time. And sometimes you really just need someone that you know that has your back to like really kind of put you in check and say like whether or not you're you're crazy or not. Yeah.
Jess:And like I felt like with you like throughout our friendship, I could always go to you and be like, okay. Like what do you think about this scenario? And you would give it to me straight. Yeah. Whether I was right or wrong.
Jess:Yeah. And and that's feel like everyone needs that in a friend.
Serena:It's not like we sugarcoated things like I'll always be like brutally honest or I'll tell you what you need to hear. But we also speak to each other in a way that's not
Jess:looking down
Serena:like or like what the fuck are you doing? Why are you doing that? You know, because when you're in a narcissistic relationship, I don't know why the fuck I'm doing this. Like I don't know like and so when people are looking down on you and they're like are you fucking stupid? Sometimes sometimes you kind of need to hear that but just call me stupid or like you're an idiot.
Serena:I don't get why you don't leave.
Jess:Like Yeah.
Serena:You obviously deserve better. Because when you're in it, you know all these things.
Jess:And you feel like you can't leave. Yeah. So when someone's like, oh, you just have to leave and it's like, I I want to. Yeah. I I don't know how.
Jess:Like, I I don't think anyone else will love me beyond this. Like, that's
Serena:why I'm staying. Because narcissists will make you believe. Mhmm. This is another point that we can touch upon later in the video. But they'll literally make you so small.
Serena:He feel so small that no one else will love me. I'm too fucked up now. I'm too ugly. Whatever this is not and everyone hates me. Yes,
Jess:And the people that like they know you're close to they'll pin you against them. Yeah. Because like they know that they don't like them. So it's like you're really like in this small box.
Serena:Yeah. It's really lonely. We're in a friend group of multiple girls. And I love all of you. And you guys are all the reason that has helped me during very tough time periods and in my life, but I feel like you just knew exactly how to be there and what to say for me.
Serena:But having the support system of all the girls really helps me. Having a support system period. That is I think what really helps bring people finding courage to leave certain scenarios. Having a support system is everything. You need people behind you riding for you.
Serena:And if you don't have that is a recipe for disaster for a lot of people. A lot of people can go down a really bad path. Mhmm. So I am always grateful for our friend group. Like, can cry thinking about it.
Serena:Yeah. It's just like when you have a lot of people just lifting you up and wanting better for you and it's not doesn't come from jealousy or anything like that. It really is life changing.
Jess:Yeah.
Serena:And I feel like all
Jess:the girls in our friend group, everyone just has each other's best interests. Yeah. And we support each other in so many ways that it's like not just like they're on our bad days. It's on the good and and that's all that really matters.
Serena:Yeah. All type of jealousy. It's genuinely wanting the best for each other and like supporting that.
Jess:Everyone wins. Yeah.
Serena:Like, if I'm eating, we all have a play at the dinner table type shit. I do love that for us. And that is I think one of the biggest reasons that I was able to leave because the support that you need. If you guys don't know what narcissism is narcissistic abuse. Let's read a little definition of this is how it feels like being in a narcissistic abusive relationship.
Serena:So narcissistic abuse is a pattern of manipulative, aggressive, and calculated behavior inflicted by someone with NPD narcissistic personality disorder. It can involve psychological, emotional, financial or sexual manipulation, and can sometimes include physical violence. So some traits include sense of entitlement, lack of empathy. These are people who are narcissist. A need for attention, very controlling, like monitoring monitoring phone use, isolating victims from support networks, which I feel like we both encountered and financially controlling them, blaming, shifting blame and making victims feel guilty or confused and gaslighting.
Serena:So gaslighting is using emotional manipulation to make victims question their reality. Holy shit. That was like something that I dealt with for. Yeah, I literally feel like I was living on a different reality that when I got out of the relationship, I felt like I was on a cloud of confusion. Yeah, felt like
Jess:I on yourself again.
Serena:Yeah, backs of narcissistic abuse, anxiety or depression, PTSD, loss of sense of self and self worth, short term memory loss, headaches, body aches, trouble sleeping, and mood swings or depersonalization. So can you relate to any of those effects? Or how did you feel when you were in a narcissistic abusive relationship and now you're an outsider.
Jess:Yeah. Now looking in, I I don't know what I was doing first of all. Like, I I look back and I'm like, I I wish like I could have done things a lot differently. It's not until like honestly like I met you and I had the proper support. Mhmm.
Jess:That's when I was able to see like what was wrong with it. But it was definitely isolating. There were so many times where I felt like there was no one I could really go to because like when I would go to someone, they would tell me like, okay, like you gotta leave. And then I'd be like, oh, yeah, you're right. And then I would be thinking about it.
Jess:And when I would make efforts to leave and then it turned into well, that person's not good for you. They don't really care about you. They're not they're not doing this because they they love you. They're just jealous because you're in a relationship. Yeah.
Jess:They're they're single. They don't like it was always like something like that. When in reality, most of those people did care about me and they wanted the best for me. But I couldn't see that because that person was just making it seem like they were the best thing for me. And if I gave it up, then I never gonna find that again.
Jess:So definitely isolating. I had such bad anxiety to the point that once I got out of it, I realized that I was severely underweight. Mhmm. I just like could not sleep ever. But definitely controlling, definitely put me into a box, made sure that no one really had access to me, and knew exactly what to say to make me feel like I couldn't leave.
Serena:Yeah, that's the thing for half the relationship that I was in when I was in a narcissistic relationship. I was in therapy. And I was with my therapist for years prior. She told me that I was being psychologically abused by this person. Because It's not like you go to break up with someone and if you want to break up with me, break up with me.
Serena:They are literally making you feel like everyone around you hates you. That's the isolating part. They put you down so much or the opposite. Now they're love bombing you now. They're doing everything to get you back that you originally wanted from the jump or that they showed you from the jump to.
Serena:Yes. And it becomes a roller coaster of very high highs and very low lows. And to me, it became addicting.
Jess:Yeah.
Serena:From the very low lows equals the extremely high highs that I just want. So even though there's low lows, I'm getting the high highs and that's the side that I want. Yeah. And then you're just like fiending for that.
Jess:Yeah. Because like once you get the high highs and you know that they have the potential. Like in my mind, I viewed it as like that was the potential. Mhmm. But in reality, that was a mask.
Jess:Yeah. Like there wasn't really any truth behind that. It was just like they were showing me what I wanted to see just so I could stay. And I but I was always fighting for that because I'm like, oh, like I know it's there. Yeah.
Jess:I know I could do it. Like and it yeah. It became like a challenge. It was like I felt like I was in a like a game show, and it was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna win. Yeah.
Jess:But then it turned into the opposite that when those low lows kept on happening over and over again and they were worsening. Yes. That's when I was like, wait a minute. This isn't getting better. This is actually getting really bad.
Jess:And I feel like towards the end of my relationship, I felt like I was more focused on proving Yeah. That I was right. Mhmm. Like, I'm leaving you because you did x, y and z. And then that became like a whole nother thing within itself because they can't ever admit when they're wrong or that they did anything that was harmful to you.
Serena:Yes, I think narcissists have power trip that narcissists has. It's kind of scary actually, like how they just feel like they need to be in a sense of like you're the puppet and they're like controlling you. That's literally how it felt became a shell of myself. I literally felt like soulless Anxiety took over.
Jess:Like thinking back to it, like, I just don't know why I liked that feeling. Yeah. Like, was just like constantly being like love bombed and then feeling like absolute shit. And then it was just like a constant cycle of doing that. And it's like addicting.
Serena:Statistic abuse can feel equivalent to like being addicted to drugs. Yeah. Because you're just feeding for that dopamine hit, that serotonin hit. And then when you're low, like when you think about like drug addicts, when they are feeding for something they're like soulless. They cannot function without getting high and that's literally how I felt.
Serena:I felt like if I was on bad terms with my partner I could not function until it was better. And until I got that like dopamine hit. And that was really the first time that I ever felt like that. And it was very weird. Because, you know, me, I always like going out.
Serena:Yeah, like I like going out and like whatever, whatever. And I never really let past partners before this narcissistic relationship affect me. And I was in a handful of toxic relationships before this narcissistic relationship. In the past when I was like in toxic relationships and I can fight with a partner and be like, I'm not answering you for the rest of the night, like fuck off. But like this one, I couldn't.
Jess:And you know it's funny you say that because that's exactly when I knew that you were in exactly what I was in. Yeah. Because I'll never forget. We were like out one day and we were just having lunch. And I remember your phone kept blowing up and it changed your whole demeanor.
Jess:And I was like, this looks familiar. Yeah. Like more like I know exactly what's happening. I knew you always were like, I don't care. Like, just go on with it.
Jess:And it was actually so impressive when you would do it.
Serena:Yeah. I'm like, don't tell me what to do.
Jess:And honestly, like I think that's what started driving me to leave mine. Yeah. Because I'm like, oh, like she just like doesn't even care. Like I need to like adopt some of that. Like I don't have to like care so deeply about it.
Serena:My friend Jacob he sent me he took me out for like my birthday. My ex was fighting with me at this time the whole day. And it's like I could never do anything without her. I'm with a gay best friend. Yeah.
Serena:Like what the fuck do you think I'm doing? What's just fighting with me? He sent me videos or pictures of us the other day. And there's this one video on my phone and my face is just like dropped. And it's probably like a thirty second video.
Serena:And I just couldn't believe that one of my best friends took me out for my birthday and it was ruined by this. Like the whole time like it was such like a and I feel bad because it was such like a beautiful gesture and I couldn't even fully enjoy it because I was in my phone the whole time trying to make sure that my girlfriend was okay. Mhmm. But she couldn't give a fuck about me. Like
Jess:Because they don't care that they're making you like that in that moment. Mhmm. Because they don't want you to be happy outside of them. That's that's the part that's so unfair. Yeah.
Jess:And it just doesn't make sense.
Serena:They have to be the center of
Jess:your world. Yes, but at all times.
Serena:My ex was very jealous of me having close best friends. She hated that. She was so jealous of that. And I felt bad for that. Because I'm like, do you not have close best friends that you feel the same way?
Serena:Like there's like sisters to you that you? And she didn't. She had friends. She has friends all over. But nothing that like Randy, no, the effects that I can relate to.
Serena:Yeah. Anxiety and depression, a 100%. The trouble sleeping. I think the anxiety was the reason for the trouble sleeping. Yeah.
Serena:Headaches, body aches. I feel like for me, what started happening with my body as something that I knew my body was rejecting. And this could be just from always being in heightened stress, but I have PCOS, the hormonal disorder. Mhmm. So then my PMS got so fucking bad.
Serena:Mhmm. I literally felt like I was going insane. Yeah. Yeah. But this could also be mood swings or depersonalization too.
Serena:Like, it got the mood swings got so fucking crazy the second half of our relationship. Depressed short term memory loss because now they're shifting your reality at all times. Mhmm. So they're like, no, I never said that. That never happened.
Serena:What are you talking about? And then you're like, Like, oh I think I'm going crazy. Yeah. Because now you're trying to like go back in your head and you're like, wait, did did that happen? Did she say that?
Serena:Like, what? Like, oh, maybe maybe that didn't happen. Straight lies, bro. Straight lies. Like, this shit makes you go crazy.
Jess:I don't know if you remember how I used to have, like, severe stomach issues. Yes. So during the time that I was in that relationship, I had such bad stomach issues that I went to, like multiple gastroes trying to figure out what was going on. I remember. They said it wasn't lactose.
Jess:It wasn't celiac. And as soon thinking about it now, I don't really have those stomach issues anymore. So it was all stress induced.
Serena:Feel like that was like my our body like rejecting Yeah. Literally relationship. Going back the second half of the relationship because we did break up. I mean, this girl was breaking up with me like almost every single day. But there was a time period where we were like kind of broken up, I guess.
Serena:She still had a lot of control over me, but I moved to Florida. I'll get into that in a little tell all of why I felt like I needed to do that. But the second half of the relationship had such extreme mood swings that I don't even know if you know that or if any of our friends know that I was going insane. I would be screaming at her on the phone because at this point, I feel like you took my kindness for a weakness and fuck you. So now you're thinking I'm out here cheating on you.
Serena:I'm doing this, this and that, that, meanwhile, you're doing all that. Go fuck yourself. Probably a monthly occasion, especially when I was PMSing. And I just felt like I was going insane. Like one day I was Okay and then the next day I would just like remember everything go crazy.
Serena:Next day I was Okay. Just push my buttons in such a way that I would just go crazy. And that's something that you see when narcissistic narcissists to that they will push you and push you and push you and then you go crazy. I forget there's a word for that. The when you start going crazy, and then they want to record you and be like you're fucking crazy.
Jess:Yeah, Which Well, because they wanna have the upper hand at all all times. Yeah. So when you finally snap, they're like, see, this is why no one will wanna be with you. Exactly. Because look at how you're acting.
Jess:No one would put up with this. Only I'll put up with
Serena:And she would tell me that too.
Jess:Mhmm. But in reality, that's not who you really are. It's like when you're in that type of relationship, it's literally pulling out every possible worst trait that you could have. Yeah. And it's bringing it to the surface.
Jess:Mhmm. Which is like not usually who you are at the core.
Serena:You're crazy. You're angry. You're sad. You're confused. Mhmm.
Serena:And
Jess:You're a wild private investigator. Hire us. Literally.
Serena:Hire
Jess:us. Literally. In our prime, we could solve anything.
Serena:Yeah. No. Literally. That's how we found out a lot about what went down in our the shady shit that our exes were doing. Mhmm.
Serena:And the wrong
Jess:because no one would tell us. Yeah. If you know something, tell me. If you
Serena:know something, tell me.
Jess:Hey. Something else. Use tell.
Serena:There's always hints On top of the female intuition, there's always hints from people around that person.
Jess:It's one of those things that you wish someone would come forward.
Serena:I got that after. Yeah. Loss of sense of self and self worth. I'll never forget. And this was at the beginning of my relationship too.
Serena:But I went to your apartment and we made a list because I felt like so much like shit in this relationship already. And it was only only like a couple months in. But you know lesbian relationships a couple months is like a year already. And that shit felt like a year. Because lesbian relationships, you're spending so much time together, like with each other.
Serena:And also, I worked with her. So like this shit was like lesbian time on steroids was like how I felt. And one of the things that's on my list I'll never forget is she dims your light. Yes. Like you have no more light inside of you.
Serena:That's when I realized like was the beginning of the loss of my sense of self and self worth.
Jess:For sure. So prior to that relationship, you which I feel like you've returned to this, but you were in like the most vibrant era of your life. I remember like you just radiated so much like positivity and like this outlook on life that like it literally seeped into my life in the best way possible because it made me realize like, oh, you know what? She's doing all these measures to better herself. I'm gonna do the same thing because it's working.
Jess:And when I started to do that, it was like a seesaw. It was like, as soon as you started dating her, I saw that light start to dim, and that's when I
Serena:knew something was wrong. Such an odd feeling because it's like, how could I be so in love with someone? I love someone so much that is just treating me like shit. Like Yeah. Bringing out the worst side of me.
Serena:And now that's something that I know like being an outsider in a relationship that nothing that is right for you will dim your light. Yeah, will lessen you will make you feel like you have to shrink yourself like it's going to add to the brightness of your light for sure. So that should have been a red flag for me at the beginning, but also I was too like into deep already of the whirlwind of everything. Diverse actual romantic relationship with a girl too. So I do have to give myself grace of why I accepted a lot for so long.
Serena:This relationship is just fucking wild. I didn't deserve that.
Jess:You didn't deserve it at all. The million times we've gone over each scenario. We knew that it was wrong. Yeah. It's just that like in that exact moment when we were in those relationships, we felt like we were the the one that was doing something wrong.
Serena:Yeah. A 100%. Especially on the flip side of the narcissistic abuse when I started going crazy. I can definitely relate with that because the first half I was like, I didn't do shit wrong.
Jess:Oh, didn't
Serena:set 10 toes down. I will stand on that. I did not do anything wrong. I loved you hard. I was there for you.
Serena:I did everything that you wanted me to and listened to you. I was listening ear. I was not controlling. I let her do whatever she wanted. When it flipped and I started going crazy And then I started feeling bad and I think that's what kind of made me stay in the relationship too.
Jess:Did you feel like now you are the the one doing the controlling?
Serena:Yeah, because then at a point in time when I moved to Florida was like a snap in her because now there's no control over me. But then she started with the love bombing again. And I finally started seeing a side that I always wanted to see or that I saw at the beginning. And I'm like, wow. Maybe this could work again.
Serena:But I couldn't shake off, the fucking trauma. She would still put my buttons. Yeah. I just moved to Florida mostly because of you. I'm just trying to relearn myself again.
Serena:Yeah. I'm going to be making new friends. Yeah. I'm going be talking to my coworkers. Yeah, I'm going to go out with my friends who already live here acting like I'm cheating on you or you don't trust me when really I shouldn't trust you.
Serena:So you're poking these little buttons on me and then I started going crazy and I'm like, oh shit, no one deserves to be like, you know, yelled out like that or going crazy on like that. Yeah. So I just felt like now we were just in a in a toxic game of we're both toxic with each other.
Jess:Yeah. And like, who's gonna leave first? Yeah. When you made the decision to leave it hurt. For me.
Jess:But I knew it was exactly what you needed because the distance it's like even if she wanted to control you she couldn't. Exactly. Because like she didn't know like if you were at work she couldn't like just like leave what she was doing to go check up on you. Like you had a sense of peace where you didn't feel like you had someone like watching over you all the time.
Serena:Yeah. And that's the thing too. I remember certain scenarios where she she would just like pop up up screaming at me at Johnny Max running to Johnny Max. Yes. I knew you're fucking cheating.
Serena:We're out with our coworkers. Our our mutual coworkers that we have. I went out one time. She did not let me be friends with any of our coworkers. Yeah.
Serena:Like, it was always a problem. And she convinced me that everyone we worked with hated me. And that was a big reason that
Jess:I quit that place too, which they didn't hate you.
Serena:Yeah. And I didn't realize that until I was out of
Jess:the relationship.
Serena:But probably went out one time with our coworkers. She wasn't working, so she wasn't there. And she was out doing who knows what with who knows who. We're getting a drink. Was innocent.
Serena:Three or four other coworkers. She runs into Johnny Maxx. I knew what the fuck are you doing? I knew you were fucking cheating on me. This is my town.
Serena:That's another thing. That was like another power thing too. Mhmm. She made it feel like she was mayor of this town.
Jess:She she owned it.
Serena:Yeah. She owned it. Everyone in here hates me.
Jess:Mhmm. And I dare I even like live there. Yeah. Like, it was like, that's her place. No one else's.
Serena:Yeah. I'll get you kicked out of here. This is my bar. These are my friends, bartenders. And it was embarrassing.
Serena:Like so embarrassing. They cause scenes. And I know you also experienced like a situation like that too, where they cause scenes and they they're making you look like who got them to that point of going crazy. You won't, I'm not doing shit. So they want to walk in and be like, fuck you, you're crazy.
Serena:You're cheating on me and you're just like, God bless me.
Jess:It's fucking summer. God bless me. It's fucking summer. I'm just enjoying myself. But
Serena:after that now, you know, you're walking on eggshells. I'm not gonna go out with my coworkers anymore. I don't want a bad situation with, you know, my coworkers or at work. I don't want it to be awkward. And yeah, I think they just like take over every area of your life.
Serena:Especially because I worked with her too. So now it's like I had no separation. And it's just like you're taking over, like, where I live to where I work to my friend groups. Like, you're just, like, infiltrating anything. But you try to do the same to them, and they're extremely private.
Serena:They do not like the UNO reverse. They do not like the UNO reverse.
Jess:No. No. Like, I'm actually thinking about a specific time. We were at one of our friend's houses for a birthday. And I remember I spent majority of that night in the bathroom diffusing a situation.
Jess:Just like Yeah. I'm not there's no guys here. Blah blah blah. I'm not cheating on you. Like, stop.
Jess:Like and then it would be like, well, I'm breaking up with you. Then you're then you're like sitting there begging someone.
Serena:Why did
Jess:they do that? That was
Serena:a very like almost daily weekly occurrence. I'm breaking up with you.
Jess:Mhmm. I And would be like please don't. And then I'm now looking at it. It's like what the hell? Why are you begging for me, man?
Jess:Remember too like when I would like get out of like the bathroom or whatever it was like where I was isolating myself in that moment and I would see everyone else like they like knew something went on but I wouldn't address it. Yeah. I'd be like everything's good. Yeah. As I'm like wiping tears like trying to like just act like everything's fine.
Jess:But like it got to a point where you just can't even hide in
Serena:it So or this is so this will be a leeway into because it's perfect that when you're in such a toxic relationship and a narcissistic abusive relationship like this, I realized that people don't even have to know me, even super personally know me to know that I was in something so fucking toxic because your body starts rejecting it. Your aura is, like, dark and gray. You're just like you become a shell of yourself and how you look, like, changes too. Feel like and that was something that I noticed with you. Mhmm.
Serena:And then I feel like people notice, like, with me too. For sure. Like you did not even have to know me personally and to know that I was in something really bad. And the people that did know me personally knew that I was in something bad just from like how I was. My point of view while you were in a toxic narcissistic relationship.
Serena:I knew that it was getting bad because anxiety just literally like spewed off of your your body or demeanor. And like what you said you lost a lot of weight too. So I remember the moment that I realized that it was affecting you like literally physically. The relationship didn't extend a lot longer after that, which is good. But seeing how much it physically affected you or is some type of like having to intervene.
Serena:Yeah, it was literally just shrinking you. Yeah. I was like oh this is really bad.
Jess:I know. And I feel like once it got to that point, you're right. That's when it was at the tail end. Yeah. And you helped me a lot because I finally was like saying out loud all the things that was happening to the point that like I would never tell anyone what was going on.
Jess:Yeah. And I would like start calling you telling you really bad stuff. Yeah. That like I knew if I told like most people, they'd be like you have to leave. Mhmm.
Jess:But it was kinda like I said before, I was on a mission.
Serena:Mhmm.
Jess:I can't leave yet. Like I have to like get my proof. Like I have to do everything to make sure I'm the good guy leaving this, which is a whole another podcast on me. But talking to you about it and like seeing your support Mhmm. No matter what, you never once said to me, you have to leave.
Jess:Yeah. You would just say you like, you give me your advice. You tell me what what you think I should do. But it wasn't like like, f him, like, we're done with this. Or you never put me in a situation where it was like, it's either me or him.
Jess:That that's never a good feeling. You know? Like, you don't wanna ever feel like you have to choose, especially in that scenario where the one person's telling you that, like, they are
Serena:Yeah.
Jess:The only thing that you have going for you.
Serena:Yeah. I think that is probably one of the worst things to do to someone who's in an abusive relationship. If it's stemming from a very loving place,
Jess:I love
Serena:you so much. I'm gonna make you choose between me and him because I'm hoping that your love for me is more. When you're being brainwashed by a narcissistic person, you're in such a different reality that you're not even thinking about choosing sides. And Mhmm. It just makes everything worse.
Serena:Mhmm. Because you're now you're put it's almost like you're pushing them towards the the narcissist. Yes. I was like, okay. I thought I had, like, at least a support system.
Serena:Now I don't even have them. Now the narcissist is right. Really only have the narcissist.
Jess:They're right. And I think what you did for me along with our friend group was you showed me that safety net where it was like, okay, once I get out of that, I'm gonna drop right into here and like, I'm gonna be okay. Yes. Exactly. Good.
Jess:Yeah. And like, that's exactly what happened. And it was like wild because I was so scared to do it for so long. But once I did, I was like, oh my god. Like, I have so much love around me.
Jess:I have so many people that care about me. Like he was wrong in all those ways. It made me realize like I wish I opened up sooner to someone about it because it probably wouldn't have went on so long. Yeah. But I think you came into my life at a perfect moment where like I needed it most and it relayed into me getting out of it.
Serena:Yeah, so I think it goes back to I understand how you are as a person and it wasn't so easy as just to leave. I knew that you needed to kind of gather up like your nuts before hibernation. I know you needed your proof. I know you needed your reasons. I know you needed.
Serena:It's just that feeling of like feeling Okay and feeling like you could do it. Also safety reasons too. Yes, That's something that in narcissistic relationships as well. You don't realize that your safety is being compromised too. So that's another reason that it's hard to leave because you don't want to get hurt.
Serena:You don't want them to hurt you. You don't want them to hurt people around you as well because they're evil. And I saw that what you were in was evil. Mhmm. I saw it was not easy.
Serena:It's not easy to get out of something that's evil. Like Mhmm. You know, I just I saw it with my own eyes him being evil. I knew that you needed a support system. You needed a listening ear.
Serena:Mhmm. And and a hype woman too.
Jess:Mhmm. Like. And and thinking about it, it's amazing that you just naturally could do that for me. Because like, I mean, I could do that for you no matter what. But I think knowing that, like, what I was seeing you go through was exactly what I went through.
Jess:I'm like, know exactly what she needs right now.
Serena:Mhmm.
Jess:But you just naturally knew like you took to that.
Serena:Toxic is toxic. So I was just like
Jess:You're like, okay. Like, how do we navigate this? Yeah.
Serena:Yeah. Like we need to there needs to be a way. But I also another thing too. I know you're not stupid. So I was like my bestie smart like she and and I knew internally you knew what you needed to do.
Serena:And I feel like you felt the same with me. Like you trust me enough that internally like she got this even if her other friends was to go to you and kind of worry about me. Like I know you would be like she's going through it but like she's got this. Like we internally have this like just knowing of we know better.
Jess:Yeah. Yeah. I knew so like for you, I saw like all the signs like with like the text messages and just like your demeanor changing.
Serena:Like we we need to
Jess:lock in here as like a friend and and make sure that I'm just here for you and however you need me to be. So every time you would call me, I would rarely give you input. I would just listen like you did for me. Yeah. And I would tell people around us to do the same thing.
Jess:I would suggest it highly. I'm like, don't tell her to leave. Just be there for her. That's what she needs right now. So knew that I had to get on your ex's good side.
Jess:And not even like in any fake way. It's just I knew that if I was like outwardly like showing hate to her like I was gonna immediately get shunned out and that was gonna be it.
Serena:Yeah. Because that's what she did with all my other friends.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:Because yeah. My friends don't really fuck with you because they're seeing what you're putting me through. Mhmm. Our friends are writers. They're like, if we don't like someone, we all don't like them and and you're gonna know what you're gonna feel it.
Serena:Mhmm. So I think she didn't like that because she's very used to being liked. Yes. Right? Farming person.
Jess:Yes. So she's like And and it's scary because she was likable. Yeah. And I think it hurt me too. Like once it like came to my senses that like she was like putting up like a whole facade, I like got upset for you because I'm like, wow.
Jess:Like, that seemed really good. Like, I'm actually upset that it it didn't work out the way it should've. You would tell me like what she was putting you through. I would think, I wish I could just go into your body and handle it for you. Yeah.
Jess:Because I knew how to end it.
Serena:Yeah.
Jess:But like at the same time, like out of all the people that I know, I knew you would handle it the best way because you're you're strong. Like, you had the
Serena:strength to do it. Me living in Florida now, I really feel like if I still lived in Jersey, I hate to say that I don't know if I would still be in the in the fucking whirlwind of it. Even when you try to leave, they won't let you. Like, they literally won't let you. They take over your everything in your life.
Jess:Yeah. Yeah.
Serena:You try to leave, like, no, you're not. Mhmm. I literally have to move like across the country. Like, don't know how you did it. Mhmm.
Serena:Like, felt like I had to really physically escape it.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:So that that's another level of strength too that you were able to just leave and continue moving
Jess:on living in the same state. I remember once it was done, I told everyone in our friend group, everyone I knew, I said, block them. Don't tell me anything because I don't want to know. Yeah, because anything that I would know would like restart the spiral. Yes.
Jess:So it was like, I rather just end it. And the moment I did that, I found such peace because like I realized that I just didn't I didn't need to be updated by it anymore. Like, I don't need to be involved in that. And honestly, like whoever was like the next victim, like, I felt for them because I knew exactly what they were gonna go through.
Serena:Why I was always a hunt like fucked up in my brain is I really don't think my ex is a narcissist. I think the abuse I went through was very narcissistic. But I think like she was just so fucked up like and I was the punching bag of everything. That's why I was like am I just making her crazy? She had a lot of baggage.
Serena:I'm going to heal it. Yeah, so I think that's what was something that had to be a learning lesson for me too that I was I just I took a lot and I took it on the chin because I was like, Okay, she has a fucked up past. Let me be like a healing person for her. Like I'll show her. I'll show her when people would look at it and be like, that's crazy.
Serena:She's accusing you of cheating every time you go out, and you never did anything. In my brain. I'm like, oh, I'm gonna prove to her that I'm good enough. Yeah, she's experienced this in the past. And I'm not a cheater.
Jess:Yeah, like I'm going to show her real love.
Serena:Yes. Exactly. Until it just never ended. Yeah. And it was just like, wow.
Jess:It's like how many times can I show you who I am?
Serena:Yeah. And until she was actually being the cheater. Yeah. That was wild. The the the lying will make you go literally insane.
Serena:Never be a fucking chill girlfriend. I was a chill girlfriend for the longest time. Never be a chill girlfriend. I am fighting for crazy bitch rights. Like, last time I was a chill girlfriend, I was prescribed Zoloft.
Serena:I was almost sent to a mental institution and I had to move across the country. Like, anytime someone I see someone act like a chill girlfriend, I'm like, you better stand the fuck up. You better get the phone password. The the get the phone password. I'm not playing with you.
Jess:The the problem is, like, people just don't understand that you're not being crazy. You're just setting boundaries. Like, how you want to be loved and, like, what bothers you. Like, that's not I don't think there's anything wrong in doing that. Yeah.
Jess:But, like, I don't know. Everyone wants to be the cool
Serena:girl, especially being a woman I just feel like you get nowhere being a passive woman in a relationship.
Jess:Yeah. Well, you just get walked all over walked all over. Voice what you want and how you feel about certain things. Yeah, and and learn how to compromise to you know like it doesn't always have to be exactly what you want or your partner wants you have to come and meet in the middle and see like, yeah, what will work best for your relationship.
Serena:Yeah, no, I tried the chill girlfriend, the chill healing girlfriend. Yeah, yeah, you can, you can go out with them. Yeah. Don't post me on your social media. It's okay.
Serena:Oh, you never wanna bring me out with your friends. It's okay.
Jess:And your phone died? No. It's okay.
Serena:Yeah. Every night? Every night your phone is dying. Every night you're you're sleeping out somewhere and I'm home watching your dog like
Jess:That would make me so mad for you. And I think that was like the hard part like seeing you go through it. I felt like I was reliving it again.
Serena:Yeah. So after I found out that she was cheating on me is kind of when I started being a little crazy again. That's when that that's when she brought out the FBI agent in me. Yes. And because before that, I will never give someone so much of my trust again.
Serena:I would I gave her way too much trust without like proving any type of that she was worthy of it. For someone who like me who has a lot of trust issues like that is crazy that I did that. And the only explanation I can say is that it was the first woman that I ever loved. So it was a different type of relationship dynamic, crazy excuses from a narcissist. Oh my god, this is like one of the craziest stories.
Serena:So only like a couple months into our relationship, it flipped. There were signs beforehand. Mhmm. You said the story the other day. Was at Bar Louie with my coworker.
Serena:Yes. And then she was like screaming at me thinking I was like fucking someone in the parking lot.
Jess:Parking lot.
Serena:Like what? Always like,
Jess:I told you like, as soon as you told me that I'm like, oh. Yeah. Wait, I I couldn't believe that because it's so ridiculous.
Serena:So there was like little red flags like that. Right? But I was like, no, I'm gonna I'm gonna prove to you. I'm gonna prove to you whatever you you come from damaged past. As the months was going on, she never posted me on her social media anymore.
Serena:It like flipped in like July and was breaking up with me every every other day. She never wanted to bring me around her friends. Oh, I get that if you want to hang out with your friends and have like girl time just like you and your girls because I'm the same way with you. Yeah. I was literally asked like can I come with you sometimes?
Serena:Yeah. No. Okay. At a certain point in time my intuition started ringing. And I remember one time specifically, I went to her apartment in August.
Serena:She also had a drinking problem, I will say. And I think that's escalated the abuse too. I mean, abuse very bad. There was one time she went out, I honestly didn't go with her. She's breaking up with me through text, she gets back to her apartment.
Serena:And she's begging for me to come over. So this was like a weird thing. It's like they hated us, but they like Wanted. Wanted us. They needed us.
Serena:They like needed our especially me and you. I feel like we have like healing, very like calm energy and aura. I need you. I need you to come over or whatever. I remember my intuition was ringing so fucking heavy as soon as I walked into her apartment.
Serena:I was like, you were either with someone or someone was in this house. And when she like went to sleep, she was like fucked up. When she went to sleep, I was like I went through her whole apartment. I was like trying to look for like a clue of something. And the hair clip.
Serena:Yeah. Hair clip something something that wasn't her. That's when I started feeling like I was going a little crazy. If you experience this, like, would they every time they went out, would they want to break up with you?
Jess:Yes.
Serena:Yeah. I don't know what that
Jess:was about. Suddenly, I was nothing.
Serena:Yeah. So cut couple months later. Having fun.
Jess:They saw, like, what else is out in the world. So in that moment, they wanted that. It was a
Serena:power trip, but it's also like a tactic that I feel like I don't even know if they realize that they're doing it. Mhmm. But it's like you're making us so insecure then when you go out, we already feel like that you are possibly doing something or there are better options out. Now you're going out. You're breaking up with us.
Serena:You're making us feel like that you found something better. It's isolating. It's you're making us feel insecure. You make us feel small. And it's like all of it in one by doing that.
Serena:If every time you go out and you're not including us and you're breaking up with us when you go out,
Jess:It's like, what are you doing? Yeah.
Serena:Mhmm. Killing us. Killing our self esteem. Oh, she went out one night. Now it's like October.
Serena:Mhmm. Was breaking up with me the night before. Next day begging me to come over. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
Serena:Come over. And she really did love bomb. Mhmm. Like, not even just with words, but with like gifts too. This is when I found out that she was cheating.
Serena:And you you know the text. I don't know what came over me. At from this point in time, I never went through her phone. Mhmm. But she would go through my phone.
Serena:And she would unfollow people on my Instagram and stuff like that. And I don't know. Whatever. That's weird. But she had a thing with phones.
Serena:She was like, I'm not I don't go through phones. Meanwhile, she went through my phone. She's like, I don't let my girlfriends go through my my phone. Yeah. Okay.
Serena:Respect it. Now I'm like, now I will never do that. Yeah. If you are a D and D warrior or if you are someone that's like, oh, when I'm in relationship, I don't go through phones. Like, bye.
Serena:Onto the next. Should've called me when was goofy. Like
Jess:When I was the chill girl.
Serena:I will I will never be that goofy ever again. Like, if your phone is continuously on D and D and I can't even go on your phone to, like, change the song be without you having a fucking anxiety attack in the court, you are not the person for me. I want someone who's so chill. I pick up your phone Mhmm. And you're not even flinching.
Serena:Yep. That's something I always looked up into into your relationship as well. Mhmm. And it's not even just that. It's the trust within one of them.
Jess:Yeah. Like
Serena:I'm not even doing anything. So there's not even like an ounce in me that would feel any type of anxiety. Mhmm. You know? Because that's how I feel.
Serena:You can pick up my phone whatever all day, every day, babe. Mhmm. I have nothing to hide. But if roles were reversed, she was like, you know? And it's because she was doing shit.
Serena:Mhmm. But, so nah. Call Should've me when I was goofy. I'll never deal with that ever again. Had a wave of something to come over me and I was recording her on her phone on a Snapchat.
Serena:So within a one minute video, basically, she was like lay. It was so weird and she has balls for doing this too. She was laying on me in a way in an angle that she thought I couldn't see her phone.
Jess:But
Serena:if I went like this, I was recording exactly what was on her phone because I couldn't see her phone. I was like this. So I went on Snapchat. It was recorded like a one minute video. In this one minute video, I wish I recorded more.
Serena:Mhmm. I found two dating apps on her phone. And I saw text messages between her and what I thought was a friend and a girl that she always hung out with Mhmm. And was the reason I could never be around because you were actually having a fucking whole other relationship that looks like a breakup text. So I showed you the text exchange.
Serena:It was something like, we've been seeing each other for three months. Why all of a sudden it's not working? Now in my brain is calculating three months ago is when you started acting weird. Okay, so girls literally texting her having anxiety attack, trying to call her. She's denying the calls because she's with me.
Serena:And she's like, I would have came and seen you after work Like this literally looks like they were in a whole other relationship. And they broke up with
Jess:each other or something. Real quick, there was foreshadowing of this. Because do you remember when I visited you at work and we saw this girl? Yeah. And when we were in the bathroom, she went behind the bar and really like was talking to her and Petey and his other friend were like our private investigators.
Serena:Yeah. And that always stood out to me too because for boys to think that that was weird. Boys are don't really like have
Jess:that pick up on that.
Serena:They don't pick up on things like that. So for them to think that was weird. Yeah, that was a red flag. Yeah, because it obviously had had to have been something romantic or sexual. Yeah.
Jess:Sneaky. Yeah. Mhmm.
Serena:And then I would be like, why don't why don't these girls ever say hi to
Jess:me? Mhmm.
Serena:And she's like, well, you don't say hi to them. Meanwhile, it's because who knows what kind of storyline that she was flipping to that girl.
Jess:Mhmm. And it made sense why she didn't bring you around them.
Serena:Yes. I remember when I confronted her about that. Well, she was denying it at first too. And I was like, I literally have fucking proof.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:I still have proof to this day. Then she was like, it's a friendship breakup. Who the fuck says that I've been seeing you for three months and all of a sudden it's not working? What friend says that?
Jess:Yeah. That doesn't it doesn't go down that way.
Serena:Now the reason that I feel like I stayed after that was because she never showed me her phone.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:So I never had the proof. I was like, let me see your phone. No. That was another thing too. And even my therapist at the time said too.
Serena:She's like, there's a difference between being private and hiding something. And she was hiding something. And that moment she should have showed you her phone if she was really not doing anything to calm your nerves. But she didn't.
Jess:But she knew you're right.
Serena:She knew I would have found a whole bunch of shit if I went through her phone. I also found two dating apps. So the apps it was, oh, I was trying to see if you were on the dating apps. And then it was a breakup text. Let see your phone.
Serena:No. Let me see your phone. No. It was probably literally like forty five minutes of the back and forth of let me see your phone. Let me see your fucking phone.
Serena:And also I actually didn't even go insane. I was being so calm because I was so hyper aware of not wanting to be like her crazy exes. Crazy exes. Who knows if they're actually crazy? I was so hyper aware of not wanting to be like that.
Serena:The old me when my other past relationships, would have snatched that phone over. Let me get that fucking phone right now. And now I'm now I'll still be like that to this day. That's the last that's my only last time that I'll be a chill girlfriend. But I really wish I did.
Serena:Because I think that's the reason that I stayed after that. They were very good at manipulating the storyline after that after she basically said, she's not hanging out with this girl anymore, whatever. But she still was because I was catching her in lies. Now I started being crazy. When she said that if she was somewhere now I'd pull up to see if she was home or where she was.
Serena:Now it's November. And I caught her in a lie. She said that she was what? Like at work or something like that. Intuition was on point at this time too.
Serena:My intuition immediately was like go to blah blah blah's house her friend's house and I pull up her car is there. I'm over this shit bro. Like the lies make you go in saying everything where she was. Who is she with her going through my phone and lying about it bro. You're literally unfollowing people off my phone and I'm reaching out to these people asking why they unfollowed me and they're saying you unfollowed me multiple people.
Serena:Yeah, that know you're going through my phone admit to it. I don't care. Just admit to it. Like what are you doing? What are you looking for another manipulation tactic?
Serena:I was scared for her own safety. She would like put me in a position where I was scared that she was going to hurt herself or do something that I just wanted to be there first for her. So I think she pulled like every last trick out of the bag because she felt me like distancing from her and she was like, oh, I gotta pull like the illest fucking card, which is I'm gonna hurt myself when you love someone. You don't want that
Jess:to happen.
Serena:Yeah, caught her in a lie. I'm fucking over it. And then the next day she's like all over the place. Tell me why I buy a vacation for us to go on like the next day after that. That's when I brought her to the cabin.
Serena:Yeah, I was like she's so stressed out. She needs a vacation. Like we always want to do something like this. Like she's really not doing Okay. She wasn't physically.
Serena:She really wasn't doing Okay. But I think it's because she got caught in a mad fucking lies. You're playing with multiple women and you got caught. So I think she was like going insane about it. Yeah.
Serena:One of the things I don't know. There's obviously a lot that was going on, but fucking booked a vacation for that. We went to a cabin together, and I paid for it like insane. You literally just like I just called her in a like a lie. Mhmm.
Serena:Now I'm the one saying I'm sorry. Let's go on a vacation. Yeah. Like, that's just like the the intricacies of how like a narcissistic relationship works that even when you're not in the wrong, they make you feel like you are. Mhmm.
Serena:You're apologizing for things that it's like, what are you apologizing for? Yeah. So we were at this in this cabin and it was actually a good time. We were laying down about to go to sleep or watching TV on her laptop. She falls asleep.
Serena:I'm like, dang. This is time to look at her messages. Mhmm. So I went to go look on her messages. And as soon as I click on her messages, her fucking laptop freezes.
Serena:And then she wakes up and she's like, what are you doing? And I just start hysterically crying and I run outside because now what am I doing? She kind of told herself a little bit because she was like, what did you say? I was just silent because I wanted her to like admit to something. And she goes back inside the cabin.
Serena:She's in there for like, I don't know another ten minutes. I'm outside granted. It's November in Connecticut. I'm fucking cold, I'm being stubborn. And then she opens the door again and she's like, come back inside.
Serena:Like I know why you did that. She was only calm because she probably deleted whatever the fuck was on her laptop. She went to bed again. And I remember that night I took the Jasmine and I was like, I think I seriously want to move to Florida. That's when she was like, you can come stay with me for a week.
Serena:And you know, we can try and figure it out. That was the first time that I was like, I need to get the fuck out of here. Yeah, like I can't, I can't live like this anymore. Whatever she wants to do fucking with whoever she wants to do. And then I cannot do a single thing.
Serena:Yeah, she's like screaming at me yelling at me breaking up with me every single day. Like I literally got put on Zoloft because the anxiety was just so I never felt anxiety like this in my life. Expressed to her that I think I want to move Florida. She starts going insane. The love bombing thing starts happening again.
Serena:The feeling bad for her starts happening again. Now I'm thinking shit, should I actually move to Florida? Should I stay here with her? But then she fucked up on a new year's day or whatever. The drinking was just really bad.
Serena:And I the drinking on top of the abuse was just really, really bad. And need to get out of here or I'm not going to survive this. Mhmm. Yeah.
Jess:But I think you did the best thing for yourself in that time period. And I remember we were, like, sitting at Kim's, and it was, like, all of our friends, and we're sitting there, and you walk in. And I can notice something was off, and I'm like, is everything okay? You're like, I'm gonna be moving to Florida. Mhmm.
Jess:And you told everyone, and we were all, like, drawing the floor because, like, we didn't think it would get to that point. Oh, yeah. And I think, like, you know, as your your people, we were all like, we have you here. Like, we got you. But then even, like, the week went by, everyone understood exactly why you needed to do that.
Jess:We don't blame you for feeling this way, but when we would be out, it was like looking around making sure like you were safe.
Serena:I couldn't even go out and enjoy myself anymore. Like my safety was compromised. Been at work. Mhmm. I could not I'm a bartender.
Serena:We were both bartenders.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:I could not have a conversation that lasted longer than a minute with someone without her bugging out on me. I literally there was times that I would be at work crying at the bar top because I just literally could not take it And the best shifts I had were the shifts that she was not working there. Oh, yeah. At the beginning it was it was nice. It was fun and nice and cool.
Serena:When it got to a point that I can't even do my job without you bugging out, bro. I can't do this anymore. Yeah. She convinced me that everyone in the town hated me. Even though I knew that wasn't true now, she made it feel like those are her stomping grounds.
Serena:A narcissist will do that even when it's not true. They'll convince you that everyone hates you and the people close to you. They really don't have the best intentions for you. I was very vulnerable at that time too, because not only was and I'm not going to put the 100% blame of me moving to Florida on her. My mom was also kicking me out of the house.
Serena:She was like buying a house with her boyfriend, and she is like, you're gonna need a place to stay. If you can't figure anything out, you can go live with your uncle in the Bronx. Now I'm feeling betrayal on all fronts. Mhmm. Now I'm like, what the fuck am I doing?
Serena:Like
Jess:Yeah. It was like your last resort.
Serena:Yeah. And it was just something that I was I had no ties. I was in a toxic relationship. I'm being kicked out of my own home. I have no job because I felt like I had to leave the job.
Serena:Mhmm. And I'm like, this is the time. I really feel like I had to do that to get out of that. But you know, she wiggled her way back into my life when I moved into Florida. I thought it was getting better.
Serena:It just wasn't like what you said it's a mask. It just got continuously got really bad. And I was supposed to move in September 2023 to move in with her and the weeks leaving leading up to this. It was so trippy that I literally felt like there was a little girl inside of me screaming and telling me not to move Like there was like something inside me that was screaming and that
Jess:was like Serena, you need to stay here. Please don't move back. I remember when you were talking about coming back. And I was like, this isn't the right move. Yeah.
Jess:Because I would be stuck. I would be living with her. Yes. And I knew that. Like, I was like In her house.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:And she she would say, you don't have to work for a little bit. You can focus on like your your can oh, because I was making candles. You can focus on your candles at the time and like don't feel pressured to work. That would have been the worst scenario for me. Even though it sounded very good, it would have been the worst thing because not only would I be relying on her for a place to live, now I'm relying on her for money.
Serena:Like, I would have
Jess:nothing. Fully tracked.
Serena:Yeah. Mhmm. And I think that was also a tactic too. Mhmm. I don't even know if she realized that she's has these tactics.
Serena:I think it was just like fully, you want someone so much in your control and you want so much control over someone because of your own fucking trauma of people leaving you that you did everything to suck the life out of
Jess:me. And
Serena:I'm not the one to be tied down. I don't like that. Don't tell me who I can be friends with. Don't tell me I can't go out. I'm a very social person.
Serena:So that just like really sucked everything out of me. I'm literally asking people around me like before you moved in with your partner. Did you feel this anxiety like am I I going crazy and literally everyone would say no. Yeah, I didn't feel as much anxiety.
Jess:Yeah, I'm
Serena:like Oh randomly Like what couple weeks before I had to move. I don't even think it was fully a breakup. I was just like, I feel I feel like I can't move to Jersey right now. I want to stay in Florida. Like my time here wasn't enough because I was really only in Florida for like eight months or something
Jess:at that time.
Serena:So I think she took that as a breakup but she was like well if you're not gonna move here then what the fuck is the point?
Jess:Yeah.
Serena:I dreaded telling you that I wasn't coming back to Jersey. Like I was so upset and You
Jess:know I I think I had a sense of relief though. Yeah, you know, like, because like, you know, one part of me is like, my god, like, she's gonna live down the street. This is gonna be amazing. But then another part of me was like, this isn't great. Is it right?
Jess:Yeah. And like, as much as it would have been great. I wouldn't want to see you go through that even more especially like knowing the relationship that you're in
Serena:was getting ready for you to be upset, but you weren't because she did some flexion again. Yeah. When she got caught out.
Jess:Yes. Because I was like, I'm happy that you're not because I heard that she was seen with another girl.
Serena:Yeah. So basically, had a mutual friend that what came up to you and was like, I didn't know Serena was in Jersey.
Jess:You were
Serena:like, she's not. Yeah. And he was like, well, I saw her girlfriend out with another girl that looked like Serena Mhmm. And didn't look like that they were just friends.
Jess:Mhmm. And I think that was what you needed to hear to solidify your decision on not
Serena:going back. I was like, fuck that.
Jess:Mhmm.
Serena:That's exactly what I needed to hear. And that's exactly, I think was the nail in the coffin Mhmm. Or validated the the the internal screaming that I was feeling. Yeah. Yeah.
Serena:Like, literally, the universe was like because that was probably happening and she was doing whatever she was doing still. It's like you want me to move in with you for what? Just go be single and do what you gotta do. And I knew exactly the date that that happened exactly lined up with a date that we were fighting with each other and she blocked me. So I couldn't see her location or anything.
Serena:So caught. Like, it just lined up. That's another thing in in the narcissistic abusive relationship when you're piecing together all the lies. Mhmm. And it's like, wait.
Serena:You said you were doing this, but I saw here on social media that this was happening and then this day and then this day and then that and you just feel like a literal FBI.
Jess:Yeah, it all starts to add up.
Serena:Yeah, everything added up. And at that point, things were adding up very heavily what I needed. And I knew at that point in time that I made the right choice.
Jess:I also feel like going to Florida was your best move. Next best move was launching yourself into California. I feel like, yes, I feel like huge had so much fun that you had us like a reminder that you are that bitch.
Serena:I needed that. I was trying to have a conversation with her for so long. But see here now music festival and Asbury Park on the beach was happening. She was not answering me. Like, I was like, all I need is a conversation.
Serena:I need to have a conversation with her. She would not have a conversation with me after that breakup. So I said, fuck it. I'm going to dine at shore, which is a big lesbian pool party in Palm Springs. That's such an amazing time.
Serena:But of course, a lesbian magazine on Instagram posted me posted a picture of me like hooking up with a girl one day, blasted it all over Instagram, and then a video the next day. And then that's when I finally hear from her. She said that to me, like I knew you were cheating on me. Fuck you. Like, you're so mad.
Jess:Trying to make it seem like it was you the whole time. It's like
Serena:Exactly. And that's probably the storyline that she's flipping to people to. Whatever. I don't give a fuck. Cares like you were doing that the whole time?
Serena:Yes, that was a little petty, but at that point in time I was so over it.
Jess:Of what you needed.
Serena:I needed it because it did make me feel like attractive. You feel ugly in a narcissistic relationship. You feel so small. Don't feel like I literally was such a shell of myself. That's just best way I can describe it.
Serena:Completely lost myself. I didn't feel attractive anymore. I mentally felt like I was insane. So now I'm like people just aren't gonna like me and I needed that trip to kind of be feel myself again. And have some positive attention.
Serena:Yeah. And just like, realize that I am a likable person. Yeah, that was another thing that I feel like, yeah, is no coming back from that. Yeah. Like there was no way we were gonna get back together after especially she was caught.
Serena:She was already doing whatever she was doing. I have proof of that and caught her. So yeah, it's just like there was no ever coming back from that. But I really think being in Florida is what helps and like the physical distance. Yes, definitely helped tie it back to astrology though.
Serena:This is an astrology podcast. Sorry, sorry, I forgot about this thing that was interesting that I realized about our narcissistic relationships were they kind of lined up with eclipse eclipses. So for you in 2017 and 2018 there was Leo and Aquarius eclipses happening. Eclipses bring sudden and extreme changes. Extreme endings, beginnings, but eclipses are very faded.
Serena:They bring karmic events. They're tied to our karma, whether it's this lifetime or past lifetimes and anything that happens under eclipses. I always say let go let God. I believe in free will, but during an eclipse season I think that there's so much shifting universally and spiritually and in the physical realm that you really have to just sit back and see what the universe is showing you and wants for you at this time. And the more that you try to fight it, the painful that it's going to feel or harder than it's going to get eclipses.
Serena:Definitely remove things that's supposed to be removed from your life and bring things, you know, karmic things into your life. It's supposed to derail you a little bit because it's supposed it's aligning you for your higher purpose. So it was interesting because in 2017 and 2018 there was Leo Aquarius eclipse eclipse is happening and you are a Taurus but Jess is also a tourist stellium. So she has multiple Taurus placements. The Leo and Aquarius eclipses were making squares to hurt all her Taurus placements.
Serena:And that is a tense aspect. Anytime there's eclipses going through the fixed signs. So Taurus Scorpio Leo Aquarius it can feel like a harsher time period for you. The changes that are happening in your life are hard harder to push through. Yeah, especially being fixed sign to fix signs.
Serena:Get they get the rep of like being stubborn. They're not as flexible as other signs when they make changes and they move. It's because they wanted to be on their own time and how they do things. Move at their own speed and when they're ready to make changes. But the things with eclipses and why it can feel so hard for fixed signs is because the universe, they don't care if you're stubborn.
Serena:They're like, no, this change is going happen now. These eclipses were at later degrees of Leo and Aquarius, just like basically squaring your sun and Mars especially, and your sun sign is like your ego, your identity. Mhmm. And Mars, anytime there's like a square or tense aspects to a Mars, it can be aggressive Yeah. And angry.
Serena:That's probably why your anxiety was high into. Like, your whole body is just filled like almost just imagine you feel like you're on fire. Almost like that's what these changes felt like. So literally around the time of the ending of your relationship, there was total lunar eclipse in Leo. And then after that, there was a solar eclipse in Aquarius in February two weeks later.
Serena:Wow. Yeah. And that was literally the time of like the ending where you were like, am I need to get the fuck out of this. Like, this is killing me at this point. I thought that was very interesting.
Serena:And it shows that that is what was meant to be. This relationship was very karmic and that you needed it to like learn a lot, which I feel like you did. Person was meant to exit your life at that time and has been gone from that time. And it created like a new identity for yourself too.
Jess:For sure.
Serena:And that's something that you see with eclipses when I was in a narcissistic relationship and why I feel like it was also karmic and meant to be was the beginning of that relationship was the beginning of the Taurus Scorpio eclipses and I'm a Scorpio rising. So it was bouncing back and forth between my first house of self and my seventh house of close personal relationships. So it completely like was the beginning of a completely like different type of relationship and showing my new era of like being in relationships with women and then the ending of it. And the last time that I really spoke to her was the last eclipse of that eclipse cycle. One thing that I noticed that was similar with our relationships.
Serena:Yeah. And with the lining up with the eclipses and just showing that I feel like it was like meant to be in it and also karmic relationships as well. Another reason that I wanted on you on this podcast as well to talk about all these things too is I feel like you are a really good inspiration of like a success story of
Jess:like me emo. Yeah, like
Serena:coming from like her relationship with her fiance now are my couple goals. And I don't just say that because you're my best friend is because I genuinely look at their relationship and I'm like, wow, I want something like this. And to see where you came from and the toxicity that you were once in to like the beautiful healthy relationship that you're in now is just people need to see this as like get out of that relationship because they're a better one.
Jess:I love you.
Serena:I love you. Love you.
Jess:To bounce off of that, it really will get better. Yeah. And like, I know that you're gonna find that and it's coming and all the things that you've been through, it's just working you up to the point that you're gonna have that person that just makes it all make sense. Mhmm. Petey specifically, like, what made him so special was that he did not break me in any way, but he, like, was holding the glue ready to, like, fix it.
Jess:Yeah. And he didn't have to. Yeah. But he taught me, like, that real love exists and that I was deserving of it. Mhmm.
Serena:The light at the end of the tunnel and that like, yeah, people are meant to build you up. Real love is not putting you down. It's patience and building you up and like just really creating a legacy together. Literally, your person will not have you crying on the bathroom floor like every single night. Like, your person will not have you looking at yourself in the mirror questioning yourself, questioning your worth, making you feel like your light is dim.
Serena:Mhmm. And to kind of take away that spark
Jess:from you. Sure.
Serena:That was, like, a big learning lesson.
Jess:And I I think I learned that. So, like, within like the first month of dating Petey, we went to Moonrise. I remember I kept checking my phone waiting for someone to blow up on me. Yeah. And he just didn't.
Jess:He was supportive. He's like, love your outfits. Like, you look great. Hope you guys have fun. Send me a video of the set.
Jess:Like, he was so from day one, he was always so supportive. And he showed me like that a real relationship could exist with love and trust. That healed me because since I had trust issues, him being so trusting in me, I'm like,
Serena:he deserves it back. Yes, 100%. Thank you for being on this podcast and getting vulnerable with me and talking about this. Yeah, yeah. Know, our one hundred millionth time of talking
Jess:about working through this past. Last time
Serena:yeah, maybe this is like the final chapter. Is the finale. Yeah.