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Ryan and Annie interviewed a lot of midwives before their home birth. Every one of them ran through the schedule — first visit at 20 weeks, this at 22, this at 30. Hannah Penaluna did almost none of that.
Ryan and Annie interviewed a lot of midwives before their home birth. Every one of them ran through the schedule — first visit at 20 weeks, this at 22, this at 30. Hannah Penaluna did almost none of that. She talked about how she'd walk with them, and about inviting the Holy Spirit into it. This episode was recorded at her kitchen table outside Atlanta, and it covers a lot of ground: seven years of hospital midwifery in Australia, including a remote posting in the Torres Strait where she cared for a population with heart disease, diabetes and deep trauma; why 2021 made staying impossible; and the resuscitation she'll never forget — a baby with meconium aspiration who took no breath for fifteen minutes, parents praying in tongues over her, "House of Miracles" playing in the background, and an MRI weeks later showing a normal brain.
In this episode
Chapters
00:20 — Around a kitchen table outside Atlanta
00:51 — Meet Hannah Penaluna: Australia, four babies, three home births
02:14 — What made her different from every other midwife they interviewed
04:25 — Why faith is a hiring requirement in her practice
05:52 — The client who said prayer brought God into her life
08:14 — Praying over charts, and what it does to a difficult relationship
09:24 — Every baby is a miracle: on miscarriage care and grief
12:17 — Hospital midwifery in Australia, and the high-risk years
13:48 — Thursday Island and the Torres Strait
15:04 — 2020, 2021, and knowing it was time to go
16:18 — Praying with women when you're not allowed to
18:04 — The coffee conversation that moved a family across the world
19:34 — Why Georgia
20:53 — Building a practice from nothing
23:35 — A mansion in Buckhead, and God saying "I led you from that to this"
25:20 — The resuscitation: what meconium aspiration does
26:44 — "House of Miracles" playing as the baby was born
28:53 — The EMS team she's sure were angels
29:28 — Fifteen minutes, and an MRI that showed nothing wrong
31:40 — Clinical skill isn't the opposite of ministry
34:57 — What is God's design for birth?
36:56 — Growth, discomfort, and what we take from mothers when we remove it
38:13 — Labor land, the hormone cascade, and oxytocin junkies
40:31 — Sacrifice: the midwife's body, the mother's body, the cross
43:46 — Closing and prayer
New episodes every Tuesday, 6 AM ET.
Show notes, blog, and full transcripts: healthinthespirit.com
Follow along: @healthinthespirit on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook and YouTube
Got a healing story, a question, or a guest suggestion? ryan@healthinthespirit.com / annie@healthinthespirit.com
Health in the Spirit is recorded under the patronage of Ss. Cosmas and Damian, physicians who healed the body and soul without counting the cost.
This podcast is for education and encouragement. It isn't medical advice and doesn't replace care from your own clinician.
Health in the Spirit is a Christian health and wellness podcast with Dr. Ryan and Annie DeNome, a chiropractor and a theologian raising a family in Cincinnati, Ohio. Each week they bring holistic health, the wisdom of the healing saints, and the teaching of the Church into one conversation about how to live well, body and soul. Rooted in Saints, Scripture, and the Catechism, the show explores what the ancient wisdom of the Church has to say about the modern health crisis: nutrition, movement, rest, healing, and raising a healthy family. New episodes every Tuesday, beginning July 7, 2026.
You found us. Come on in. We're just getting started.
This is health in the spirit. I'm Annie Denome.
And I'm Dr. Ryan. In each week we're going to be sitting down with you at our kitchen table
to talk about where modern medicine meets the wisdom of Christianity.
So that we can learn how to take care of our bodies like we're going to live forever
and our soul like we're going to die tomorrow. Pull yourself something warm and pull up a chair.
Welcome back to the kitchen table guys. Today we're actually recording audio
only. So apologize you can't see all of our beautiful faces here.
But we are actually at a real live kitchen table down here right outside of Atlanta.
Georgia with our wonderful midwife Hannah Peneluna. So my introduction probably wouldn't be as
good as her just introducing herself even though she's very humble. So me and Annie will fill in
the gaps here. Perfect. Well, I'm so excited to be here. I've been a midwife in this greater
Atlanta area for the last four years. And I was a midwife back in Australia before I moved
to the US for seven years, which is where I did my training. I love midway free over there.
And for lots of reasons covered related found found ourselves here in the US.
And I work exclusively in the home birth setting, community setting, which just brings me so much joy.
I've been a Christian since I was 13 years old. I love incorporating my faith into my practice.
And I would say that over 90 percent of my clients are really looking for that full holistic
experience, including their spiritual well-being and how that relates to their births and pregnancy,
really praying over their experiences. And also over their experience with me serving them as well,
that the God would be my hands and feet. And so it's just such a blessing. And it's such a blessing
to be hanging out with you guys again and it's such an honor. I'm a wife and mother myself
to four beautiful babies, three of which were home birthed as well. And I never had midwives that
were able to incorporate that particular spiritual component into my experience. But I just think
of birth, pregnancy, labor and birth is our highest calling as wives and mothers. It's a
holy calling and and we treat it as such. So yeah. And I think that was one of the biggest things
for me and Annie when we had our very first phone call with Hannah interviewing a bunch of different
midwives before we were having a home birth. Every single other midwife we talked to was like
just running through the process. We have our first meeting at 20 weeks we do this at 22 weeks we do
this at 30 weeks this happens. And Hannah didn't give us any of that whatsoever.
She did a little bit but most of it was just talking about like the way it works under care,
not the not the logistics of things and just the confidence in her ability to invite the like
Holy Spirit and prayer into things versus just the logistics of these are all the things like it was
just this confidence that exuded from her in that we didn't need to know any of those things
because those were just going to happen and choose giving us all of the extras that come along
with working with her. I mean Annie can probably speak a little bit better to it.
Oh yeah I think what the point was that this is you know Hannah being our guide and
just really inviting God into it and that was just what stuck out to us. And really truly a birth
is this journey to the top of the mountain where the veil is thin between earth and heaven and
to have you know like it's a spiritual journey really as a woman to bring life into this world and
you know you're really face almost face to face with God in that moment and to have someone there
who knows that and believes it and is so part of her personality like you need you need a midwife
who who integrates us so much into her practice so and that's why we want to talk to her today
because I'm you know with this with birth journey with with birthing children to this life
there is so much probably so many stories you have of you know how God is intervened and how
God is present and the integration of both into the sphere and we'd love to hear all the stories
you have and yes yeah like well you guys know I'm a storyteller yeah and and I think that sharing
our stories is so powerful I really do you know believe that our bodies are fearfully and wonderfully
made to do this work and when when we can lean into that and when we can invite the Holy Spirit in
it's it I don't know if it's even midwives who are not Christians birth workers who are not
Christians they will say that it feels like God is in the room so many or that there's a higher
power there and we know that it's God we know that it's the Holy Spirit working and it's truly
incredible and so something that was very recently shared with us and we didn't even really
like understand the impact but I work in a practice with another midwife and we also have two
students and we also have a prenatal massage therapist and an IVC will see that all works out of
our office and it is a requirement that everybody that comes into our practice has a real personal
faith with with Jesus and so important for us but you know some of our clients that will come in
they may think like oh okay you know that sounds good like I mean I don't really have a personal
faith but it sounds good like I would love for you to pray for me because we always like ask
permission if that feels okay for them and and we probably we've had one father who said no that's
all good with me and then but his wife was like I would like that for me and so he was like oh okay
well if you'd like that for you you know I'll take the kids out of the room and you guys can all
pray together and we're like sure well like whatever format works for you because if we're not
incorporating this like one specific component then we've lost the holistic focus because if we
if we bring in like physical well-being nutrition if we bring in like mental and emotional health
but we leave that leave out spiritual health like we're missing a huge component it's not holistic right
if we leave that part out so for this one particular woman she said you know she had grown up in
like a Catholic home and and like but but nominal Catholic it was like she said that she felt that
her whole experience she had missed the boat in her in her spiritual she had gone to this Catholic
school where everything was like routine for her so she had no personal aspect of that it was
just like nominal and we know that that's so true for people that grow up going like in maybe
even in Christian homes in Christian schools like they're lacking that like personal faith
and so when she would come in like acknowledging like the miracle of this baby growing inside of
her acknowledging like that you know giving that baby and that miracle back to the Lord bringing
the Lord into her personal experience actually through her personal faith and I hadn't actually
thought about that aspect of she said you know like you inviting the Lord to be present in my life
brought him into my life you know and she said I had never I had never realized that's what was
missing missing I had thought that like God was a God of like judgment of like punishment but if I
didn't do these things then I didn't have access because I didn't know how to have access
then I just didn't and so inviting him into my life once a month and then once every two weeks
and then weekly brought him into my life and and I had completely underestimated what that would
have looked like for him it was simply just by praying and inviting him to be present in that space
asking him to be our hands and feet and serving her and also asking for her to you know to feel the
presence of God in her everyday life and she said and that's what happened you know so it is it's
so powerful and that's just like this simple like day to day of like working in clinic and
you know we love to pray over our clients I don't say patience because they're not sick
but our clients charts and if you know it can be something relational like right no matter how much
like we want to serve clients that are like super aligned sometimes you may find that there is
like a relational component that is missing or like a disconnect and simply praying over that can
fix the disconnect because we want to love each and every one of our clients the way they need to be
loved so asking for the Lord to be our hands and our feet in that way is so powerful so that's on
the back end of of the way that we run our practice and so often it can be the client that you
might find like harder work or more of a challenge to connect with all the said in like when
you're serving them and they're further in their postpartum and they've invited you into such a
vulnerable time with them those challenges just fall away because you've asked for God to be your
hands in feet and he is and so any kind of disconnect is no longer there right so that's another
really powerful tool I feel like on the back end in terms of miracles I think that each and
every client that comes our way each baby that or the the knowledge of conception or you know
no matter how young these babies are how early in their gestation they are each and everyone is
a miracle and you know we know that miscarriages on the rise and so when we always offer miscarriage
care for free which actually in our current climate is a lot it is it's a lot you know because
we're finding that miscarriages on the rise and so then talking with these mothers who are struggling so
much and saying actually like your baby is and was a miracle your baby no matter how short of a time
they had here with us was a blessing they lived and they deserved to be acknowledged and grieved
and I'm here to grieve with you and I'm here to say like I find this really hard and I hope you feel
loved and I hope you know that your baby meant a lot to us and not just to you and we're so grateful
to have had the experience of of knowing your family of knowing your baby and we're so you know
a lot of times those say things like I don't know how you do this again and again and I'm like
actually like that's a blessing and a privilege and an honor to have been maybe one of the only
people that knew about your baby's life and like some of these still such a what do you call it
a can't give the right word but you know what I mean it's a stigma attached to like when you
should tell people about your pregnancies and you know waiting until safe gestation and then like
then women have this feeling like I shouldn't I shouldn't talk about my baby until I hit 13 weeks
or 15 weeks or 16 weeks and if that's a personal decision because you're just simply not ready to
share with the world and you want to keep your secret for a little bit longer great but actually
like talking about miscarriage talking about the fact that your baby live talking about the fact
that they were a miracle that they're a blessing and a gift from God is so powerful like in the grieving
process as well and then sharing that with others so they have an opportunity to like celebrate
your baby's life as well even if they're no longer with you I think is really important so I mean
I can go on on on about actual miracles so tell me like what you would like to know when it comes to
like miracles maybe in the birth space we think maybe even like before you into miracles in the
birth space it from what like we've talked about in the past of you having an extensive career in
Australia as a midwife and then coming over here I would be willing to bet that those are two
very different lives you led because that was from my understanding of your experience there's more
in like a medical setting a little bit more so maybe speak to like how that was and why you decided
to not keep it that way when you came here yeah wow this is a really big one so I think
oh this is like such a great question so I think and make sure that I don't go off on too many
tangents so I think yes I was a hospital-based midwife I did in Australia midwife is the norm
as opposed to here and so midwives do care for all women like we don't have anything like
labor and delivery nurses so midwives do all of the care and then if if in the setting it's a
high-risk pregnancy that we're caring for there'll be an OB in the room as well and so OBS
and midwives work in collaboration alongside of each other I did work in a very medicalized
setting in terms of like inductions were fairly routine I also worked with fairly high-risk
populations so in my first graduate year I worked in a high-risk birth suite which was like we
had plenty of low risk offerings in that in that hospital that I worked at and so as a new grad
it was considered important for us to be able to do the high-risk setting so we would attend C
sections alongside of an OB in the OR team receiving babies we would do a lot of high-risk
inductions heart conditions type 1 diabetes all different kinds of I guess comorbidities
is what you would say factors relating to why the pregnancy was high risk go and help them cold
go and help them thanks but and so so yeah so then I ended up moving very remote and that was a
high-risk population in a low resource setting so it was still part of Australia but it was it was
very remote on the place called Thursday Island and it was a hundred percent indigenous outside
of we did have government workers that would get pregnant and that we would care for so there
was some white women that we did care for but the majority of them were like a hundred percent
indigenous it's known as the Torres Strait Island region and so that was a very high-risk
population lots of heart disease lots of type 1 and not type 1 more type 2 diabetes very high
rates of type type 2 diabetes kidney issues like we had a whole dialysis department even though like
it was a very small hospital for that reason lots of domestic violence lots of substance abuse
and so that was like my jam I actually really really enjoyed serving in that setting because I
think those women like it was easy to love them that they were dealing with something like
really really hard almost all of them were and a huge back around of trauma as well and also very
isolated from everything else so I enjoyed that and then 2020 happened and we were still up there
2021 happened I realized I was going to be a non-compliant with a lot of the things that they
were recommending and also I was going to be non-compliant in the hospital setting separating
mothers from their babies and I quickly realized that I was not going to be able to survive staying
there but also like my philosophies were so out of whack with with that and I'd been able to somehow
still keep that a part of you know the way that I cared for women one in some of those cases
the clinical component was extremely necessary because it was a medical situation because they
were high risk and so it was easy to still keep my philosophies but then when COVID came in
it was not so easy you know having well women but having to treat them like they were
positive you know sick with COVID just because we hadn't gotten a test back was like I can't
treat these women like they're sick when I know that they're not and they're well and so that was
when the disconnect really started to come in with my with my practice there and because I knew that
I wasn't going to be able to be compliant for myself and I could no longer treat these women
according to like what I believed was right it was time for me to go were you ever integrating
Christian faith and prayer with those women even in a hospital setting so yes but I could only do
that so personally for myself I would always like pause outside of the room or even in the room
I would have moments of pause and prayer I I couldn't offer to pray with the women that was like
against like yeah that was considered not okay working in a mainstream medical situation but when
I worked up on Thursday Island we did have like women there was kind of like pseudo Christian like
it was sort of like they the English missionary society settled the Torres Strait Islands
way back in like the early 1900s I believe and so these women had this kind of like pseudo
Christianity so they would say things like I pray for me pray for me and one time I actually said
to the woman kitty do you actually want me to pray for you and she goes yes please I'm
a pray for me and so I said okay because I'm I'm going to you've asked me to so I'm going to pray
for you okay and so I did and and it really like calmed her down and then there were a couple of
other times where families would come in and I could just sense like that they were really open
and I would say things to them like hey like before I go before I go off shift or like you've come
in for an induction would you like me to pray for you for that and they'd be like oh my goodness yes
so regardless of like how I thought somebody might respond if I felt like it was welcome I would
ask and then if it didn't appear to be welcome then I would do it anyway just in private because
it was so important for me yeah I was gonna say that's something that me and any of it tended a
couple different like seminars of integrating the faith into practice a little bit more I think
that's one thing they always hit on is you pray for all of your clients or your patients and
you pray with some of them yeah but then sorry to get back so COVID happens you are not with all
of the things in Australia so you realize something has to change but your entire life and your
family are in Australia yeah what what was was there like one moment turning point where you were
like this is happening America is where I'm going it was actually my husband my husband felt burdened
and he had felt like God was clearly closing all doors and I was really resistant to that and he
said to me over coffee one Sunday morning like I mean God speaking to us and you can like choose to
listen but doors are slamming your faces and our faces and you can either choose to like keep
ignoring that or you couldn't see what's happening all around you there's a ticket out of here for us
and our family you have it I mean you I've always been a US citizen since a child and my children
were eligible for US citizenship and so he was like like God's closing doors first because we're
going to have to go and we're going to have to move to the US and this is going to be the way it is
the government is not in charge of your midway free degree you can take that with you it belongs to
you you want it fair and square and this is happening whether you like it or not and I was like oh God
why so I can't pretend that I was like so open and willingly listening to the Lord at that time
but once my husband like really set that tone I guess and was like a wake up call I was all
ears and like ready and willing to listen even though I was feeling resistant you know just
just from a perspective of I knew it was going to be hard yeah absolutely and then did you so we're
in we're right now we're filmed we're recording this from outside of Atlanta what brought you to
Georgia versus any of the other 50 states well that's really hard will we really jumped in a car
with our we flew into Dallas Texas we jumped in a car with our four children our seven suitcases
and a dog at the time that we had brought over with us and we actually really prayed for the Lord
to lead us we had some I have an older brother that had been estranged from for many years who
lived in Georgia and he said that he really wanted to reconnect with us also I knew that there was
no licensing for midwife in Georgia midwives in Georgia which a lot of people see as a real
stumbling block to care here in Georgia or midwives care but also meant that I wasn't I didn't have
any licensure to be recognized as an Australian midwife which was good because the US government
doesn't recognize my qualification and so I'm the same as every other midwife that practices in
the state of Georgia which is not recognized and I'm cool with that yeah and I'm sure we could
have an entire other podcast about all of the people that want more licensure and more government
hands in the pot with midwifery for sure but that's not this podcast is for no that's right so you
ended up in outside of Atlanta serving this community here what did you just kind of set up shop
or where I kind of did I started to connect with midwives and some of those were hits and some of
those were misses depending if you really understand the climate of midwifery and it's the same with
everything I think with every area of work you like find your people and also when you're praying
very specifically for that it you know in your praying for wisdom and discernment over the people
that you meet and that you will find your community like God does bring that for you and so you
know we got very plugged in with the church we got I'm somebody who loves attending things in
the community and running things in the community and I was actually like pretty easy to meet like
minded people in that way and also in the aftermath of COVID here in the south a lot of people were
looking for something alternative and and you know would approach me to provide care for them
and so actually happened very organically and knowing that like my qualifications are not
recognized here in the US meant that I couldn't attend birth in a hospital setting anyway but I
also have always been a stickler for like evidence-based practice and it's something that gets driven
home in our midwifery culture in Australia so it was really easy to look at women especially having
served so many women in higher risk settings to be like this is very normal and or this is not normal
and I don't think it would be wise for me to serve you yeah and so those those kind of pathways
became really clear and so with the majority of women that are seeking out of hospital care they're
looking to be cared for it in a physiological normal process and that is exactly what we serve in
community birth setting and that for us includes twins and breaches and v-bats and a lot of women
were seeking that kind of care after not finding it in the hospital or perhaps they had
felt like their birth had been sabotaged due to fear mongering and so they were like you know
I had a previous C-section I don't feel like my body like I was respected and listening to my body
that's what I'm looking for this time and I'm like sweet that's what we do yeah that's amazing
and now you've got a thriving practice with a real office building shot of your house anymore
I'm a big girl now which is awesome and I think it's like kind of hitting on that how each
birth is its own miracle in a sense in every every life is its own miracle we're there
and I don't totally know how to word this question in the best way so we'll just go for it and
see what you come up with but every baby is a miracle but are we there any moments where you
like we're in a birth setting or working with a mom where you personally like experience to
miracle like maybe I quote I'm thinking is like a moment of like how is this going to work out
and then God just takes care of it or I mean you could take that to me whatever you want that for sure
yeah yeah well first I think like one of the most simplest ones which was pretty early in the
piece was I was caring for I'd just gone from like a very low resource community hospital setting
yeah to very wealthy very privileged but also disadvantaged in a different kind of way I find
that often like the wealthy of our community are actually like very isolated and I can remember
one time being in this huge mansion just outside of Buckhead and this woman was very isolated in
terms of family or I don't want to say friends but just like maybe friends because she was so
privileged wouldn't have been completely respectful of her choices to birth in the out of hospital
setting yeah and also the need for privacy and I remember this time sitting in this woman's like
master bathroom which was like a whole sweet end of itself and I got my assistant to take a
picture because I was like wait I just went from like working in this very low resource setting where
people didn't even have like furniture or like functioning houses to now like how did this happen
God and I remembered feeling like I felt God speaking to me of like this I led you from that to this
like you can be used in and your I am still your hands and feet in that setting and in this setting
and just being like kind of wowed by that that yeah it was like the polar opposite to where I had
been used to so that was just like in terms of like miracles probably like the most the freshest
and the most that the biggest one that comes to mind would be a resuscitation I had last year where
a baby had we didn't know I mean maconium aspiration which is what she was diagnosed with later
is something that can only be diagnosed on x-ray and it's where the baby through some kind of event
impregnancy aspirates maconium into the lungs but the lungs are sitting there dormant because they're
not being used right the baby's receiving oxygenated blood through blood flow in the cord and placenta
so you don't actually know it's happened until the baby's born and they can't use their lungs
and their lungs can't inflate because they're filled with maconium and it's a very very rare
but severe complication and so basically the baby's born they can't breathe so there's a heart rate
and that's all that you're left with and obviously a heart rate with like no oxygen getting through
is only going to be there for finite amount of time so it was something that we recognized pretty quick
and I can say it was a beautiful Christian couple and I can still remember they had worship
music playing on the background and I didn't realize until afterwards that the actual worship
song that was playing was House of Miracles and I found that just like God having such a sense of
humor like this is a House of Miracles you know and that was literally that line was playing as
the baby was born and we realized fairly quickly that we needed to be very dialed in with our
resuscitation that this was like beyond just a normal situation of baby needing a little bit of
assistance but that this baby needed full resuscitation including chest compressions and airway
assistance and we did have a 911 call and I can remember the whole time the parents
I always instruct all my families that if if there is a resuscitation to just sit with their baby
pray with them call out their name and that's exactly what this family did probably not fully
recognizing the actual weight of the situation just assuming that it was like a routine recess where
the baby needed a bit of assistance but they were speaking in tongues and calling their babies
calling out their baby's name and asking God to protect her and in that moment I felt like
peace wash over me and it was like an altered state of consciousness which is what we love to talk
about so much in the birth world because it's it's an offering that God gives us that we can take up
but it felt like everything else in the room just melted away and all I could hear was this
these parents always bring prayers over their daughter and I felt like a sense of peace even though
the situation was really really serious and one of my funniest things was when the EMS arrived
and later when I was telling the story to my husband I told him that all of the EMS team that
arrived were really really really good looking and he thought it was so funny it was like I mean
okay and later when I went to go and visit the team that we called to come and help us
I realized they were not in fact good looking at all and I truly believe that they're angels
in the room like because everything just looked amazing like and these it was like these people
because there was a firefighter there and then a paramedic and then an EMT and they all looked like
they were stunning like models like dropped and gorgeous that was my perception I could write
up and I mean I wrote in this ambulance with this baby and it was the most it was the most bizarre
thing and so when I was telling my husband later about it just like debriefing with him he was
like oh okay and I'm like yeah they were they were so good looking and he was like I mean okay
great and then I saw them and I was like they were just like normal people I was like I couldn't
believe that this EMS team were like how did they how are they all models like this is bizarre
anyways that was a really funny observation I so but they weren't they were normal people
and I truly do believe that there are angels in the room and and so that baby is doing well
even though the baby didn't take her own breath for the first 15 minutes of life I had the
blessing an honor and privilege of breathing life into her and I do believe that God truly
was my hands and feet that day and we did transfer and got assistance the baby was in the
NICU for about two weeks and to this day she has no deficits the MRI showed a normal normal brain
function and for no signs of life for 15 minutes I was like I was never expecting that to be the
case and so it truly was miraculous and I just I felt such a sense of honor and blessing as
difficult as it was and as hard as it was to process it later being privileged enough to be used
in that way and to breathe life into a baby and I always say in midwifery like we're not in the
business of like saving lives when the business of keeping birth normal yeah but that day I was
privileged to to be involved and you know obviously like God spared her life and she was always
meant to be on this earth but to be used in that way was truly miraculous for me and I just felt
like it was a real spiritual experience for me so incredible and yeah just like I said before you
are like this guide between earth and heaven and heaven and it's just like you said before like
sometimes they live and sometimes if death and just what you're not only you're not like this is
not just a job it's a calling it's it's almost like we see it as almost mission work like just it's
truly I feel like God has designed your heart for this and continue to mold your heart for this
because it's just such a specific calling and we have life and it's just beautiful to hear you know
different stories and just how how important it is to you know say you just kept it all clinical
and you kept it all you know evidence like just totally science and body you know
is there where am I going with this I think it'd be impossible to do that yeah I think like when
you truly believe in midwifery as like holistic service you have to but I have known midwives over
the years and it does look completely different right like I know exactly what you're talking about
it does look completely different it does look like vitals being taken like you know assessing
color of fluid assessing babies app cars after they're born it does look like that but when you're
looking at like shaping or or being involved in serving and ministering to mothers and understanding
the clinical component which is just only one small component and it isn't important components
you're incredible as well it isn't important component but like you can do those things and also like
recognize that this is mothers embarking on yeah they're they're their first journey into
motherhood and that it's the experience that they will have will shape them and even and look we
can't protect mothers from trauma because what some one person's perception is of trauma is
another person's perception of trauma so like we can't save women from the experience that they're
meant to have even even in that setting I truly believe that that mother has done such a beautiful
job of settling into her life with this baby even having had quite a challenging start to it
because when we pour love and service into mothers it really shapes them and gives them confidence
and who God has already created them to be but so I think that I know what you're saying in terms of
if you cut out all the other aspects and you only have the clinical component
well it just kind of tends to be kind of like robotic I guess you would say and routine and missing
that personal like I see this is such a big deal and I believe in the sanctity of human life yours
in this babies and so I care for you accordingly because I value it I honor and I respect it and I
truly believe that your life and your baby's life is a blessing and I want to serve you well while
you embark on this beautiful like journey and blessing that that God is giving you and that's
when it changes from just something clinical to I want to be of service to you I want to see you thrive
I believe this is such a blessing and I want to treat you accordingly I believe in respect and
sanctity of human life and I believe that every life is a gift and so therefore how I approach
those gifts needs to be like thoughtful yeah respectful and giving it the reverence that it
deserves yeah 100% and I I do want to say too I think we're going back to I don't know what you
said but I God I think God waste nothing he waste no opportunity and no matter what the outcome of
your birth is I believe he is present and that's part of your story and he's going to use that
for your good he's working all things together for your good and so I just want to give hope to
anybody out there who may have had maybe not the journey that they expected but knowing that God
is was there with you the whole time he never abandons you okay I feel like we can talk about I know
all that and I like I'm like as you're talking like I have a 50 million questions like I feel like
we could go off of this but I also wanted to hit on like what do you believe well we can cut
this off but I was going to say you could either go the route of what happens when a midwife is
totally just maybe not spirit felt but more emotion felt but I feel like that's going to go on
yeah or I want to talk about you know what do you think that God's design for birth is like
what do you think like he's he has infinite wisdom and he's so intelligent in our design as
women and I think you out of all people have a really good knowledge of this and a good you see
that every day like what God's design for our bodies are and what for pregnancy and for birth is
is there you know what's what do you believe that God's design for yeah birth and pregnancy is
yeah I believe our bodies are fearfully and wonderfully made as women to bring forth life and so I
believe that we are perfectly capable of getting pregnant the staying pregnant and then giving
birth to our babies and I do believe that the physiological process of birth like is a gift and
also sets us up from motherhood I believe that there is discomfort and challenge to those journeys
just like with anything that grows and shapes us as human beings and so I believe that when we
always take I do believe that there's wonderful resources that we can use clinically when
those are indicated and when maybe birth has fallen outside of a range of normal which can happen
for environmental factors not all women are healthy and well and so I do am thankful for resources
like an OR like epidurals when they're indicated but I do believe that physiologically God designed us
to do this just as we are and that with appropriate guidance and support and love and encouragement
that we're so capable and also that we need to make it the norm in a culture that has gotten so far
away from us being like self-reliant or responsible in caring for ourselves or even just afraid of feeling
any ounce of discomfort or pain yeah that like actually so much like any kind of growth comes with
discomfort and challenge and actually like birth is another another aspect of that and so when
we take that away from mothers routinely we rob them from an experience and from growth that they
might have needed to experience and not to say that they can never experience that again when we
grow and learn as human beings and our eyes are open and when we're really seeking the Lord's will
for our lives he'll make that you know clear to us but I do believe that that women are designed
to give birth gradually like and I do believe that that can happen and I don't believe that that
can only happen with a midwife you know some women will choose very different forms of care
obviously I attend women who want to have an out of hospital birth with a midwife but I do
recognize and have respect for the resources at the hospital that some women will need to have
see section that some women may benefit from having an epidural like when their hormones are checked
out I believe that God gave us an altered state of consciousness and people call it labor land
and I believe that that is protective in order to help us deal with the discomfort
of labor and birth and then that perfect cocktail of hormones which causes contractions
and then brings our babies down and we experience those reflexes that help us push a baby out
and then the whole room will fill up with love and oxytocin when that baby is born right so the
mother falls on love with her baby the baby you know has this perfect cocktail of hormones too
that is system and breastfeeding and then you know when husband and wife mother and father are in
the room together they're also all releasing oxytocin and so they're falling more and more in
love as a family and the blessing for us as midwives getting to witness that is that we also get a
hit of oxytocin just naturally by watching this like beautiful scene unfold of physiology and and
people will say that midwives are oxytocin junkies so I just believe like it's impossible that there
would be any mistake when it comes to this perfect cocktail of hormones that allows us to do all
of these things and so it's clear that this is God's design otherwise it wouldn't just all happen
right and I'm not saying it happens every time I'm not saying that there's not nuance to the
conversation with all of this right and I can talk about like I've already have that I have seen
variations of normal and I've also seen abnormal a creep in and I'm grateful for the clinical
component when it's needed but actually like really most of the time it's not and I just I truly get
to just witness miracle after miracle and witness like blessings and life unfold and I'm
forever grateful for that amazing but what what a gift you know as much as you you know are working
and like it's a grind to be I mean I feel like what a like what a job I mean it's like totally you
don't know when you're going into work sometimes you know the middle of the night to sleep as
you can sense a lot of you know giving up of your body kind of like being a mother in short
heart like as a midwife it's almost like you do take on this this motherly role yeah absolutely
and you know I think it's just a gift as a mom to give up your body and kind of what I reflect on
is like when Jesus on the cross is like you know I've given or oh gosh yeah what I you know I
I am giving up my body for you and like yeah um oh my did I even get a theology degree I'm
right I'm cutting up a salad you're right you're right you're right where am I last time
yeah god Jesus giving it all up on the cross
for us and then you know it's such a small component but it is like into that the way a mother
will give up her body for her child and for her child's best it is what it is the example that
he set for us of sacrifice and so just a very small component I know where you are going with
that a very small component of that as a midwife is being willing to sacrifice sleep sometimes
sacrificing you know family functions or things that you really wanted to do but god calls us to
a life of sacrifice he gave us that example of giving us his body on the cross to save us and so
we are called to do that as mothers and you're right like there is a component of midwifery where
that is required as well so and and it's a blessing to do so even though it's hard in the moment
you know and sometimes your family will like you'll get your phone will ring and your family will
be like oh not now I wanted you to go to this with me and you're like this is just the way that it is
so yeah so grateful for that opportunity and yeah it is just such a you know gift but also like I
said it's a ministry and it's just it's so cool to see you like really actually like take on
formal grace and be present to people you know in the most vulnerable you are like this is like
you're being present in the most vulnerable state of people's lives and bringing life into this world
which is like that you know I could think at least I feel like it's like a incredibly high calling
you know yeah and try to say a huge responsibility to be present to be born yeah I feel like there's
so many ways that the you've probably experienced like hard working through different situations
and you're probably gonna like you know continue the rest of the day like oh I could have talked
about this and this and so this is just the beginning of the the conversation you guys like we're
we're gonna continually revisit you know how like what is the integration of god in this this
incredibly physical thing that is part of life and I think with that and I think with that thought
we'll post some pictures of where we're literally recording this around our kitchen table while
me and Annie are taking turns corralling our son here yeah just been super fun but with that we'll
we'll just close things out and we're we definitely are gonna come visit Hannah again and if she ever
comes up to Ohio to hang out with us she will be recurring guests so with that let's just
go ahead and close it yeah absolutely if you and we just want like all of our you know if you're
sure I had a you could we just want all of our listeners to know like this is you know where
your birth where you're gonna birth is where you feel safest but this is just an opportunity for
you guys to hear another perspective on this beautiful journey you have to take as a mother
and so if you have any questions feel free to reach out to Ryan dr. Ryan or I or Hannah we would
love to answer any questions you have that we didn't cover in this podcast and just bring to
light any anywhere that where there's a question mark so it's a beautiful way that we decided to
bring life into this world and we're so blessed and so if you have any questions feel free to reach out
perfect and with that we'll go ahead and close things out if you guys enjoyed this podcast go ahead and
like and follow and all those things were on everything where podcasts are and let's just go ahead
and close in prayer real quick and thank you so much Hannah for joining us at the kitchen table thank
you for having me guys god we thank you for our time here with Hannah and her wonderful family and
the beautiful breakfast we had this morning and we just asked that any of the words spoken here today
don't fall on deaf ears and if anything that was spoken today is not a view lord
or not meant to be heard by any of our listeners just please wash it off with your precious blood
in the name of Jesus we pray amen amen
health and the spirit is recorded under the pageantage of saints cosmos and Damien
physicians who healed the body and soul without counting the cost if this helped you share with
someone you love rate us review us and come sit with us again next week may god bless you and keep
you healthy in mind body and soul amen