Brett King Takes AIM

Professional Walleye Angler Brett King gives us insight into the future of the AIM walleye trail, the boating industry, and fishing on Pools 3 and 4 on the Mississippi River. 

AIM
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What is Reel Talk Fishing | With No Limits?

I'm Brian Bashore, Professional walleye angler and owner of The Walleye Guys Guide service. I am here to reel you in with captivating stories, expert tips, and interviews with some of the biggest names in the fishing community. So, sit back, relax, and let the drag scream!

Brian Bashore (00:01.55)
Hey folks, thanks for tuning into this episode of real talk fishing with no limits. I'm Brian Bechore your host. And today we're heading over to the mighty Mississippi out of red wing talking to the man himself, the river rat known as the king or Brett King is going to give us a little insight on what's going on in the Mississippi. Uh, yardcraft, Brett's the regional sales rep for yardcraft, bass cap boats. We're going to talk a little bit about boats. We're going to cover a little NWT and some aim circuit stuff. What's going on over there. So it's a good one, folks.

So you're going to want to listen in, stay tuned, follow along and let's see what Brett's got to say.

Brian Bashore (00:02.706)
Hey folks, thanks for tuning into this episode of Real Talk Fishing with No Limits. Today we are, we're going river fishing. We're going to talk to the river rat himself, the Kinger, Mr. Brett King, what's happening over there, Mr. Kinger.

Brett King (00:16.152)
Well, honestly, if you want to look out the window, there's a lot of boats. Not necessarily right here, but let's, let's just say the landings around here have been very, very busy the last few weeks and rightfully so. I mean, this is one of the reasons I live in, in what I call God's country is I, I do have the opportunity to fish pretty much 12 months a year, open water. So, um, it gets frustrating at times, right? I don't like the crowds and

Brian Bashore (00:44.188)
Right!

Brett King (00:46.028)
It fishes really small this time of year, but you completely understand. I did see there's some other bodies opening up. Looks like Go Kanto put some docks in. I think I got up yesterday. That'll, that'll believe it or not. That'll take some pressure off of here. Um, obviously they're fishing the Fox. Rainy river can't be too far behind. Um, and that will also draw a lot of people out of here. So it'll get better.

Brian Bashore (00:55.451)
Yeah, I saw that yesterday.

Brian Bashore (01:12.298)
Yep, it's a, I mean.

Brett King (01:14.156)
We still have some winter left. I mean we're not out of this year.

Brian Bashore (01:16.938)
Oh yeah. Yeah. It was almost 70 degrees yesterday and today it's like high of 20 something. So.

Brett King (01:22.456)
And we got that coming through tonight. So.

Brian Bashore (01:24.99)
Yeah, we have a couple of days, a no good, but I'll be on the river this weekend. And I mean, you get, what was it? Maybe two to three weeks that place was kind of locked up or at least.

Brett King (01:34.924)
It was, so I live right across from the nuclear plant where the reactors are. And they had two of them down. They had a mishap. They had two of them down for an extended period of time. And we all thought it was going to be, you know, no boy, no fish in this winter. Which would have been okay. Give, give them a break. Right. Um, but the way the weather worked out with this lack there, it literally, that was about.

Brian Bashore (02:00.47)
Right.

Brett King (02:03.868)
maybe two weeks where it was pretty much unfishable. But beyond that, I mean, there's been boats out here every single day.

Brian Bashore (02:10.342)
That was okay for those two weeks. Like you said, give him a break. Well, Brett lives across from a nuclear. That explains everything, man. I was... Yep, that's the...

Brett King (02:12.666)
Yeah.

Brett King (02:17.22)
It does man. I mean look at the hair color, all of it. Let's just say I, if it's ever the time, I don't have to worry about it. I'll never know what happens, so.

Brian Bashore (02:26.254)
Yes, you won't. Yeah. We don't need any more pressure up there than, uh, than we need. Cause obviously we got one of our, or our second stop of the season out of your back door. So what, uh, well, we'll just kind of get into that and we'll bounce around here a little bit. What are you expecting? What do you think? I mean, deficient is good up there. Well, I obviously have a, uh, a mount, a limit of whatever that's a little different than normal. Um,

Brett King (02:27.656)
Yeah.

Brett King (02:34.428)
Correct.

Brett King (02:50.052)
Yeah, that's very frustrating. You know, this, this section of the river, unlike a Prairie de Cheyne, right? The two DNRs get along here and they make a uniform set of rules. Um, so I don't completely understand the restrictions that are put on us. It will definitely be an entirely different tournament than any of, most of these guys I've ever fished here. Um.

I mean, honestly, for a place we used to come to and kick out 40 plus pound bags, 16 pounds is going to be a pretty stellar bag of fish here on the current format. That's laid in front of us for here. I don't know which way we were better off Minnesota only or what we're going to deal with now. Um, the two over 20. That.

Brian Bashore (03:39.722)
Right.

Brett King (03:47.68)
I thought we would play on would have been that would have been interesting, right? And unfortunately, the locals, all my local friends around here, a lot of them are steering away and are not going to join it. It's because, you know, they don't feel there's really a competitive advantage being a local now on the four fish, one over 20. So

Brian Bashore (03:49.35)
All right.

Brian Bashore (04:12.974)
Right. I mean, catching one is, you know, there's a lot of good fish there. A lot of big fish there, but the probability of catching one is pretty good. But being able to put two of those big ones in a boat, a little local knowledge is going to definitely help you out there.

Brett King (04:18.559)
Yep. There is.

Brett King (04:25.268)
Yeah, so I mean, I understand it. I mean, it's good news for everybody coming from far away that don't fish here a lot. You know, everything will be in play now on those rules. I mean, the lake will be in play. Everything will be in play.

Brian Bashore (04:31.807)
Right.

Brian Bashore (04:39.618)
So for those of you listening, we're talking national walleye tour here. Brett fish is the tour. I fish the tour. Uh, we go out of red wing. Uh, we're going out of the casino. I believe they moved the takeoff casino. So pools three and four and our, we are restricted to a four fish limit per boat with one walleye over 20 inches per boat. So once that fourth fish hits the live well, you're done for the day and you're heading into way in, which is not typical from what it would normally be. You'd have whatever the permit says.

Brett King (04:48.033)
I don't know what to say.

Brian Bashore (05:08.154)
Usually like seven or six or seven fish and weighing your best five and you'd have two, you know, one over 20 per angler. So you'd have two over 20, but pretty much it's a one man limit. So.

Brett King (05:10.057)
Yeah.

Brett King (05:16.772)
Yeah, anything over anything here, you know, on a local scale is you're going to weigh five and you can have two over 20. You know, that that's how all the tournaments go down here. So don't completely understand it. Obviously it's not my call. Um, I didn't get asked, so, um, you know, I just, we got to deal with it. I guess if you're going to commit to the tour.

I just, I know it is going to limit some entries here because of those rules. So.

Brian Bashore (05:51.274)
Yeah, we definitely don't want to limit entries and while we're trying to grow the, grow the sport a little bit, but due to the Coangler registration process, sign up sounds like everybody's pretty excited and those numbers are, uh, or co we're coming in super fast. And, uh, I mean, they obviously have to put a cap on it somewhere because they don't know how many pros are going in. So you can't guarantee 200 Co's in, but it sounded like I think 80 or so was the, was the cap, but I'll think there's still 40, you know, that signed up for all four that are sitting in the queue. So those are next in line, you know.

Brett King (05:53.666)
Nope.

Brett King (06:09.16)
Correct.

Brett King (06:20.152)
Uh, I did have a good friend of mine sign up, tried to sign up for Lake Erie yesterday, as soon as the one-offs opened up and he said he was gone six minutes into the opening and he was already on a wait list. So.

Brian Bashore (06:33.014)
Yeah. I had guys that signed up for all four before the deadline when that opened and they were on the wait list if they signed up in the afternoon. So, I mean, yeah, I talked to several guys at the spoke show this week and I said, Hey, I'm on Monday. We're getting in, we're signing up. I'm like, sign up. They're not taking your money, but you know, you get on that list. I said, but they're already, you know, the wait list has already got guys that are doing all four on it, which are obviously going to get priority. So it'll be interesting to see. Hopefully the, you know, the numbers on the pro side are.

Brett King (06:39.417)
Yeah. So...

Brian Bashore (07:00.93)
good enough that we can sustain a championship payout, um, you know, and that we can keep it moving along. But I talked to some people over there at the higher up their day and the rules are the rules for this year. We gave a lot of feedback. Like you said, you didn't get asked, you know, we did surveys and I think there was a question we, they were asked in our meeting about, uh, party fish. And we said, we didn't want, you know, we don't want party fish or not.

It was misinterpreted is how I understand this is yes if party fish is illegal then party fish is illegal But we don't mean to eliminate that other guys fish completely

Brett King (07:37.832)
Correct. I mean, it just seems like a bad trend, right? In the direction we're going and how it's going to impact co anglers.

Brian Bashore (07:42.574)
Mm-hmm.

Brett King (07:48.836)
when you really sit back and dissect the big picture, there's a lot of things going on here. And this is kind of, unfortunately, feeding into that.

Brett King (08:01.164)
It is what it is. I mean, we're going to have to deal with it. I was not, fortunately, I did not have, I was not part of that whole transpire of things that went down last year. Um, due to work commitments, I ended up having to pull out of the Sioux, um, which then took me out of the championship. Um, I would have literally had to win the Sioux. I was having a terrible year anyways, but, um.

Fortunately, and I'm glad and that's why I've remained fairly silent on all of what has transpired because I don't like armchair quarterbacks. I wasn't there. I didn't have skin in those games at the time. But, you know, obviously I'm committed to the overall picture of it. So

Brian Bashore (08:53.354)
Yeah, I think, you know, everybody wants to see the success of every circuit grow, uh, you know, and, and doing what we can to help where we can help. Um, but we don't make the decisions ultimately, but that would still be if you don't like it, don't fish it. So, I mean, it's, you have the choice. If you don't like it, don't do it. Otherwise, this is what it is. Get all in, do what you can do while you're there to put the word out, get social, get your friends to show up, fish it and catch the best four fish a day. You can at Red Wing, catch the best three fish you can a day at Green Bay.

Brett King (08:58.096)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (09:23.399)
and give it hell.

Brett King (09:24.84)
I mean, the rules are the rules and you know, I think we both can agree. As long as everybody plays by the rules. Um, that's it's still a tournament at the end of the day and we all want to.

Brian Bashore (09:31.395)
All right.

Brian Bashore (09:36.15)
Yep. And it is competitive as hell. Like you said, you can't, he'd never really been able. Now we got into the good, you know, a real point system where you need the points to qualify the points have always played in the, you know, just the AOI, which I think you 2019 you went in earlier. 18. And I mean, that's, so that's really the only reason we kept track of points, but you know, a lot of us were just every tournament was, nah, I'm playing to win. I don't care about points because.

Brett King (09:44.732)
Yep.

Brett King (09:53.631)
18.

Brett King (10:04.136)
Correct.

Brian Bashore (10:04.214)
You realize after about two tournaments that if you're in that race or not, kind of, you know, maybe three, you know, with just a four, but I love this format a lot better and it wasn't as hard maybe that first year you couldn't zero. But yeah, like you said, now if you, well, you could like the Detroit River year because so many people zeroed. Um, right.

Brett King (10:07.832)
Yeah.

Brett King (10:24.5)
Yeah, that was a tough one. And then you roll into Green Bay that same year, and that was a very, very tough bite. You know, I had to make some decisions accordingly to pretty much not necessarily go after the wind right out of the gate. I needed to secure a fish.

Brian Bashore (10:35.511)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Bashore (10:49.097)
A fish.

Brett King (10:50.32)
Seems ridiculously easy at Green Bay, but it hasn't proven to be that way that time of year lately. With all the full ice and stuff. So I literally fished at least the first day of that tournament to make the championship. That's what having the point system does to change the dynamics of the process.

Brian Bashore (10:55.343)
No, nothing's easy.

Brian Bashore (11:12.15)
Yeah, it definitely changes how you fish. It depends on where you're at and each tournament. So, I mean, obviously everybody wants to win and you're going for the win. And that's day one tournament one. Boom. That's the goal. And we're starting off at Erie. So everybody should be catching fish. So, but the difference between a fish and no fish is a couple of hundred points. And that's a deal breaker.

Brett King (11:25.768)
Alright, excuse me. Bye-bye.

Hey, I think it was back in about 17 on eerie. I fished two days and never caught one. I zeroed both days of that tournament, which is hard for a person to admit, but, and I wasn't the only one.

Brian Bashore (11:37.858)
That was muddy, right?

Brian Bashore (11:45.042)
No, that was a, we had a lot of Northwest wind, right? I got real muddy. Yep.

Brett King (11:49.644)
Yeah. And I was fishing next to, uh, I believe it was Zach Jobes at the time was leading day one and I was fishing in that pack and I had, uh, his good buddy Ross, I believe it Ross Swenson, I think it is on day two, he was my coangler in about halfway through day two, he looked at me and he goes, I have no explanation for this. He's like, you have the right baits.

Brian Bashore (12:14.318)
I got nothing, man. I don't know what's going on.

Brett King (12:18.648)
in the right place, the same as what he's been doing all week. And you're just not getting bit. But, you know, it's, well, yeah. So.

Brian Bashore (12:27.886)
I think I was in that pot of boats too. I think I counted 92 boats or something on that big school or something like that at one time. So, yeah, I didn't catch any cranking, but I went to the reefs very first thing. Cause I knew I could dig up five fish in 15 minutes. I drifted across, I digged up five fish in 15 minutes and trolled the rest of the day. So I got a limit each day, but it wasn't 10 pounds, you know.

Brett King (12:50.244)
Right. Yeah. And, and, you know, this year, a person might have to make those decisions depending on the bite because of the point system, you know, last year was, was very challenging if you dropped the ball in the first two, which I, I kind of did, um, spring Valley, that was a tough one for me, and then you go right to Winnebago on the rules we went to bag on and it, you know, it's a generally.

Brian Bashore (13:10.783)
That was a little tricky.

Brian Bashore (13:17.558)
Yeah.

Brett King (13:20.488)
smaller fish fishery where you're playing a game of ounces, you don't have to miss it by much in your way out lunch, you know, after the first two events. And that's pretty much what happened to my year last year. And then it's just almost impossible to catch up after that.

Brian Bashore (13:26.668)
No.

Brian Bashore (13:37.138)
It is, Randy Hummel and I, he went to a sports show with me this weekend to sell some Randy Riggs. And we were talking and I went through the tournaments from like 17 on. And I said, but I was really just when I didn't care so much for points, I was just playing to get up in there or at least cash a check. And I'm like, I can name this tournament, this tournament, this tournament where I threw fish back. And then I didn't bring in that one or two or whatever it was, but I voted to just kept those, even though there may be like a 16. Now you got to take any, the theory that a lot of other people probably did that too.

Brett King (13:58.28)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Bashore (14:06.826)
Um, but without taking that in, I'm like, all of those, I, I missed, you know, the last two or three payout spots because of that, you know, by throwing an 18 going, ah, I don't care. I'm going for the wind. So this, but now you went from making a few thousand bucks, which is always good to least get out of there with a check to zero.

Brett King (14:24.624)
Yeah. And you know, there's going to be a ton of those tough decisions. Should be, should be, uh, here when we come here. Um, if the bite is what it, what it should be in May, um, it's, there's going to be some tough decisions to be made because there is a lot of mid twenties fish in this system to have that in your hand and take the chance to throw it.

Brian Bashore (14:29.279)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (14:48.834)
I know and you're going to, I like it one of these and I got a 24 incher and it's, you know, if it's, I don't know, I've never fished it. Maybe it's two o'clock or something that makes that decision a little bit easier, you know, but if it's nine AM.

Brett King (14:58.136)
Well, I mean, not to, not to give it all away and, and send people on a goose chase, but the Saugers, the Saugers will be in play for this event here because we have very nice Saugers. We have a ton of 18 and a half to 19 and a half inch Saugers that are pushing that three pound envelope. Um, and then you stick one of those.

Brian Bashore (15:02.151)
Right.

Brian Bashore (15:22.966)
healthy fish.

Brett King (15:25.636)
22, 23 inch saugers, that's four and a half, five pounds. I mean, you're gonna be right there. I'm not saying you can win on them, but it's gonna be like the old days in the FLW. You could go out to the lake and make the top 10 fish and saugers. Yep, and that's gonna play right back into this.

Brian Bashore (15:39.566)
doggers.

Brian Bashore (15:44.846)
Right. And I love the Mississippi. I love all rivers actually. I mean, that's if we could just have a straight up river circuit, that would be awesome. Right. Which I believe AIM has one, right? Don't you guys have the river circuit now?

Brett King (15:50.837)
I'm in.

Brett King (15:56.88)
We do. And that was something, um, I kind of wanted for a long time because the dynamics, and there's a reason we left it rivers, right? As you notice, it doesn't say Mississippi river, um, but the dynamics up and down this, this river all the way down into the Quad Cities. You know, there's each pool is unique. It's fun. It's challenging. And there's a pretty, you know, solid contingent that.

like to run up and down the river and they can compete wherever they go. Uh, our numbers were down on that last year, unfortunately, but I, I think we'll be able to grow that. Um, and I've already heard of, you know, half a dozen new teams coming in this year. So, uh, but yeah, I, I mean, I'm in on that one. I mean, just go off the river and yeah, fish the current.

Brian Bashore (16:46.894)
Yeah. It's you just, you never know what you're going to hook into in the river. You know, weather usually isn't as big of an issue, obviously if, you know, first as a green Bay area, the Missouri river is pretty wide and long. So it can get kind of gnarly out there, but the Mississippi it's always just been. It's just nice. You know, it's manageable, you know, which is, which is great. And then you got the, I'm sure you got the Fox and other ones in play over there for you, but there's so much more.

attention to detail that goes into river fishing. My way I see it is I don't think the forward facing sonar plays into the river fishing as much. It can certainly be used.

Brett King (17:27.948)
Well, I like to say that too. And then Tom Wynn comes here on an AIM tournament, we kick all our tails doing against that. Um, but as a whole picture, and obviously that is the hottest topic going around, particularly after this last Bassey lead event, I actually watched Chris Zeldane's podcast, I don't know if you've watched that or people should be watching.

Brian Bashore (17:32.298)
Right.

Brian Bashore (17:37.095)
He debunked it, yep.

Brian Bashore (17:46.242)
Right.

Brian Bashore (17:54.27)
I saw a little bit yesterday when he interviewed everybody on their boats. Yeah, that's.

Brett King (17:57.264)
on their boats and you know, five 12 inch graphs on the dash and uh I mean it's such a hot topic right now and it is it's painful. You know, I'm not anti right and I'm I realize it's not going anywhere. The money will come out of the companies and it's here to stay but for us old fellas that spent you know,

Brian Bashore (18:23.89)
Right, that's OGs, right?

Brett King (18:26.572)
a couple decades of your life learning how to fish every type of body of water there is, whether it's a reservoir or river, natural lake, great lakes, and now to think you gotta hit the reset button and start over, right? That's a hard one to swallow, but when you look back over the last few years, it's pretty evident what you have to do.

Brian Bashore (18:54.878)
Yeah, you're just, I told that to Randy and Ted, um, you know, to travel with again this year. And I said, it's, you don't have it. I was like, you're just, thanks for donating your money. You're not competing. So. Yep.

Brett King (19:05.232)
You're still going to have a few, right? There'll be times. I mean, this one here can easily be one without it. In fact.

Brian Bashore (19:10.854)
The whole schedule this year kind of sets up for anybody.

Brett King (19:13.632)
I probably, and I was telling Jason Shakir this not that long ago, I probably, I might even take it out of the boat for here, depending on the water conditions, just because for me, fishing just reactions here, it's probably going to throw me off more than help me, right? If I commit to it, I'm better off just doing my thing here and running my programs.

and let the cards fall where they may. So, there is.

Brian Bashore (19:44.158)
Yeah, you know what you're doing. You're familiar with it. You don't need to throw a wrench in there and all of a sudden get into, this is a head game, right? Completely. And we throw something, we get in our own head and can jack us completely up.

Brett King (19:50.533)
Yep.

Brett King (19:55.008)
And I mean, let's face it, that's a whole different level of. I don't want to. How do you describe it? Physical, mental, probably is a better word, stress level. Trying to stare at that screen all day. And then the mentality to just power around and not fish. That's a hard one to reset. You know, I'm just I'm a choker. I just like to cast and.

Brian Bashore (20:18.974)
It is. You're right.

Brett King (20:22.928)
I'll read a map and say, man, they should be right here on this nub or this high spot. And, uh, now, I mean, you might not even throw at that.

Brian Bashore (20:26.847)
out.

Brian Bashore (20:32.494)
Well, at least we got the side image. You can scan those areas and that's, I mean, that's still what I do. I'm like, Oh, I caught them there. I'm going to, you know, caught them on the graph turnaround position. And then I have to use my, my mega live, put it down and just look and be like, are they, you know, in size scan, you can't see the fish in the rocks, right? You just know that there's good structure, but mega live, you at least put it down and go, Oh, that rock swimming or Nope. That's just a giant pot of rocks. But you're like, I'm like, you know, we're still going to make a couple of casts probably cause there's one.

Brett King (20:58.6)
Yeah, why is that turtle moving across the bottom there?

Brian Bashore (21:01.718)
Yep. Yeah. It's a, it's a hell of a deal. And like I said, it's such a focus. You can't, I think that's where a lot of the complaints are coming from the, you know, guys watching the bass masters. I watched it. I was heading to Omaha and I'm like, it's not, it's the same. We're still staring at the back of their heads, but now they're, their focus, they're not taking their eyes off it versus being up cast and talking to the camera kind of, Hey, here's what I got going on. Here's why now it's don't talk to me. You know, I, I don't want to miss something, obviously.

So I think that's maybe where that little disconnect of people are getting a little frustrated with the viewership of it, but they did the right thing by putting the other half of the screen on. So you can see what the Angler sees.

Brett King (21:39.824)
That's where I'm going to go with this is I'm going to flip that around. And I watched a pile of it this weekend. Um, and I felt like I could sit there. I had it up on my big screen in my shop while I was working on boats and stuff. And, uh, I, I felt like I was learning. Right. Like I was physically training my brain because of the way bass covered it and engaged it. So I give them big kudos.

Before that, I do think they're doing everything in their power to make it as entertaining as possible. But I find it pretty cool when they're showing the actual screen of the sonar, watching people get those fish to trigger. Right. Then I don't remember who the gentleman was, but we had to get, he had a lone big fish, you know, big bass and he couldn't get, he raised it a few times.

And then all of a sudden he's like, oh, here comes another one. Now I'll get it to bite. And that other, if you watch that other fish swim in, right. And then the competition was there and he caught it from the next cast. So I personally feel like I was learning at home. Uh, and I don't find it boring to watch. I know that's not the positive, you know, sediment right now. Um, or the popular, I guess I should say.

Brian Bashore (22:41.399)
right now.

Brian Bashore (22:46.571)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (23:03.992)
Right?

Brett King (23:05.468)
you know, depending on what forms you're reading and whose podcast you're listening to. But it's here. It's not going anywhere. Right. I see some limitations to it eventually. Possibly. Right. But it will probably come more down from, uh, maybe a DNR aspect of it. Um, is where you might see some stuff imposed. Uh, can I see, uh, possibly, uh,

Brian Bashore (23:13.395)
No, it- it bastard sp-

Yeah. Yup.

Brett King (23:34.464)
A series that won't allow it. Possibly you take, you know, and I'm not saying AIM is looking at that. Don't get me wrong, Garmin's one of our great partners for AIM. But you take a series like AIM that's geared more towards the weekend angler, right? Hard working man. And that's a lot of old school anglers that don't want to engage this stuff. Eventually, they're going to potentially stop.

donating their money. If they're continually getting whooped up on by the Scopers, the forward-facing sonar. So I could see merit in having a series that is, you know, no forward-facing sonar. It's not allowed. And I could see that gravitating its own crowd eventually. I know one of the Muskie circuits did it already.

Um, you know, in my day-to-day job, I cover the country of Canada as well. And I got a call from one of my Canadian dealers last week wanting to know specifically where we were mounting the five fork hub box in the boats, because they have a bass circuit up there that sounds like they were going every other event, you couldn't use it. So you have to have the ability to take it out.

Brian Bashore (24:36.631)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (25:01.442)
Oh, quick.

Brett King (25:01.788)
So you're starting to see some of that happen. But to think people want to think they can do it and get it out of here, it's no. It's no different than when GPS came, site imaging came. It's just the next wave of technology. What are we going to have in 10 years, Brian? In a year.

Brian Bashore (25:13.355)
No.

Brian Bashore (25:17.717)
Right.

Brian Bashore (25:21.998)
360. What are we going to have in a year? As fast as this stuff, you know, this comes, I think there's, you know, thermal imaging type stuff coming and it doesn't get worse. It just gets better. I mean, and, uh, VAS does a phenomenal job with their production. And I don't know what the delay is, you know, but they're doing everything they can do and they're the leaders in this whole tournament world. If they make a change and say, Hey, this is, I think you're right. I think it gets maybe restricted or limited, right. To not.

Brett King (25:34.128)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (25:51.298)
22 inch screens and five transducers. It's like, you could have 12 or 16 inch screen, one and some tens and. You know, one scope or two scope, maybe whatever, whatever the case may be. I think there's, there's a lot of local or smaller bath clubs that have banned it for the same reason you just talked to it's, Hey, we're just out here trying to have fun and it's, we kind of want to level playing field, but if this guy's, you know, got a ridiculous amount of disposable income, good for you.

Brett King (26:00.4)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (26:16.598)
You know, to put the $40,000 on your boat. But this guy with his 1500 is like, I'm not competing, but it's opened up a whole new world as you've seen in bass, right? It's funny. Cause they were in this last tournament, their walleye fishing, they're pitching jig heads and three inch middle baits. Right? We've been doing this for years, but they're finding that these aren't, they're not on, they're not all on the bank. 80% of these bass are out here and open water and they're just, it's spinning reels, right? They call them weenie reels or whatever. The bass guys hated spinning reels forever, but now they all have.

Brett King (26:32.936)
Yes. Yeah.

Brian Bashore (26:45.95)
Almost more spinning reels in their boat than they do Baycasters. So welcome to the club guys.

Brett King (26:48.72)
They do. And, you know, I went up and had the opportunity last fall to, to go out to Lake of the woods and film, uh, next bite episode with, with Tom Winn and Chase Parsons. And, you know, obviously I made a pact to Tom to not talk about certain things, right? Um, it's only fair, but let's just say that was the most eye opening two and a half days of fishing I ever did. And I was the net man.

Um, for the reason, for a reason, because I was glued to the screen. Right. And I, he's a master at it. And I, I left there with very wide eyes on what I am up against and how important it is, it's going to be to engage that. Um, I always kind of fished under the impression there was limitations.

Brian Bashore (27:18.518)
I watched it. It was a good show.

Brian Bashore (27:23.862)
Yep. Hey, uh, Thomas, go ahead.

Brian Bashore (27:30.945)
Hang on.

Brian Bashore (27:36.659)
Yeah, he is good.

Brett King (27:47.784)
to win you could and couldn't scope realistically, you know, like when it's rough, for example. I couldn't even stand on that bow or that boat. And we got out there and I'm like, Tom, can you even do this in this conditions? And he was like, well, it was a lot worse than this when we won the aim championship up here. And I'm like, oh boy, I'm about to get educated. And it was impressive.

Brian Bashore (27:55.282)
Right, yeah, you guys had some good chop out there.

Brett King (28:15.164)
And, you know, he's been running around doing seminars. I've seen him at, you know, I'm at sports shows pretty much every week myself, uh, working on the boat business side of it. And, uh, he's been all over the place and his seminar rooms are packed. And that's one, one good thing about Tom Wynn I'll say is he's very giving, right? Like he's, he's an open book. He's not gonna intentionally lie to you. He might just say, no, I can't talk about that. Right. Um.

Brian Bashore (28:35.227)
is an open book.

Brian Bashore (28:44.842)
We all got to keep a couple of those things close, right? I mean, we want the helps the industry. How'd you win it? What'd you do? You know, and it'd give you a bunch. Tom was on our, on, on the first podcast and he dropped a couple of nuggets. Uh, you know, on what kind of. Yeah.

Brett King (28:46.685)
Yeah.

Brett King (28:54.296)
Okay. Yep. He's a great ambassador to the sport. I, that was the first time I really got to hang out with him. You know, chase and I go way back. I always love hanging out with him too. That was the first time I got to hang out with, with Tom. And I truly left those, those two and a half days up there feeling like I had a new friend, right? I mean, he was fun. Um, he's good on camera. He's, he's got that innocent, you know, kid in him that you can't not like.

Brian Bashore (29:03.072)
Oh yeah.

Brian Bashore (29:19.35)
He does.

Brian Bashore (29:23.118)
something you and I don't have right now.

Brett King (29:24.632)
Yeah, kind of like Okada. I always say that about Joe Okada. How do you not like full Okada? Right. He's always smiling and you know, everything. So, so yeah, that was pretty cool. Very eye opening. And I left there with a whole new mindset on, on the forward facing sonar. Don't expect massive things from me right out of the gate here, but that's one disadvantage I have living here is I don't have a great practice field for it because this walk moving.

Brian Bashore (29:28.342)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, class that guy.

Brian Bashore (29:45.023)
Right!

Brian Bashore (29:52.818)
Yeah. It's, it's tougher in the river is what I was getting at for the original is those fish are moving. And Tom realized that when he first few rivers he fished, he's like, wow, he has, he's like, I don't have rivers figured out. He'll have made it open. I mean, he's now he's now he's getting it kind of dialed in, but he's like, you know, I'm like, yeah, they don't just sit there on a Minnesota lake where they're not moving all day or minimal to the river where they have to move. No.

Brett King (29:57.349)
Yeah.

Brett King (30:07.919)
Yeah. Before I open my left finger.

Brett King (30:15.972)
Yep. So good stuff.

Brian Bashore (30:21.167)
He learned quick. What's up with AIM? What's AIM got going on? You guys are growing. We're in Minnesota, Wisconsin. Still got the North Dakota circuit, right?

Brett King (30:29.244)
the Dakota circuit. Yep. Now we've got the river division. We've got ideas on the board, you know, on the Bolton board, the white space board, whatever you want to call it. I mean, we've got a couple target missions up there for not necessarily this year, but hopefully in a few years to come to throw a little teaser out there. It's frustrating. I get tapped on the shoulder a

Brian Bashore (30:30.975)
and the river circuit.

Brett King (30:59.26)
It's gotta be almost 14 years. And, you know, a lot of, a lot of good thoughts come forward, but people don't always understand the entire dynamic of it and how calculated you need to be. Right? And how much things, you know, AIM is a really cool organization, um, that, that started big and through some bad decisions.

Brian Bashore (31:12.578)
how much things cost, right?

Brett King (31:28.048)
went through a lot of money quick, right? And we almost lost it completely. And then through a good board of directors, we rebuilt it to what it is today. And I will argue that it is one of the strongest tournament organizations, particularly in the walleye world that there is. You know, I think we...

Brian Bashore (31:47.438)
Well that's a... you can contest it to a simple thing. Board of Directors. I'm just gonna name out the few I know, I don't even know who's there. You. Chase. Joe?

Brett King (31:58.104)
Nope. Our new board now is myself, um, Kent Anderson. Yep. Um, we've got Joe Ocotta, Jason Shakir, and Jake Lapine. Um, Tom Kemos and Chase decided their, their time was up. Um, you know, and we all thank them for all their efforts. I mean, they were both a huge part of where we're at today and they were there from the beginning of the weekend walleye series, um, but I get it.

Brian Bashore (32:08.99)
Oh Jason's on now, okay.

Brett King (32:28.012)
It's not a paid position. Like people think the board of directors is all donated time. And, uh, but I do really like the dynamic we have right now with the people on the board, right? You get a ton of different viewpoints on it, you know, and Kent's kind of our bulldog, you know, he's, yep. And, uh, you know, then you got Joe on the opposite end that we're going to

Brian Bashore (32:30.033)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (32:47.446)
I'll just say, Kint's not, he's outspoken, so, and that's good. That's what you need to have on the board is just.

Brett King (32:56.804)
has brought in a new dynamic on techie stuff, right? That we're looking at. Jake's really good at that stuff. And, you know, and then you got Jason who's just stood the test of times. And, you know, he's one of the few guys in the business, you know, that actually makes his full-time living on fishing, right? So he's always got a good perspective. And so far it's been a really good board to work with.

Brian Bashore (33:26.23)
minutes a board of anglers, you know, all while anglers, some of those, like Jake's dabbed in the bass stuff a little bit, you know, and Joe's tried out a few different things and, and here and there, but yeah, that's a good bounce, but you can't, nothing beats anglers creating something for anglers. That's where you go, go right. Right.

Brett King (33:27.941)
Yes.

Brett King (33:34.184)
Mm-hmm.

Brett King (33:40.812)
And it's always what the best intent for the angles. Um, you know, it's not always the popular decisions we make, but the overall intent is, is it's angler owned, angler operated, and it's for the anglers. And, you know, I try to instill into Denny Fox, you know, Denny Fox has obviously been an intricate part of that. He's been the tournament director forever. He runs the day to day. Um, I work with him on that stuff when I can, but for the most part, it's Denny's.

It's Denny's ship. He's steering it. Um, so some decisions have to be made. Then we all get together on it. But, uh, you know, one thing I've always told Denny from day one is the one thing that has always bothered me about tournament fishing and tournament organizations is the angler, right? You and I, as the anglers, we are the customer and that gets forgotten.

Without the customer those doors don't stay open. So Denny treat these guys to the best of your ability as Ames customer and look at it with that mindset and We'll be just fine Because you and I both know we don't get that

Brian Bashore (34:57.286)
Nope. Well, it is all about the angle. I remember Cardenas saying that a couple of years ago at NDBT that I think was, you know, the new MC switch or before even the federation took over, but that was the new, the goal for the year was, Hey, the focus is the anglers put it back on the anglers, not me, you, whoever's on the stage, it's everybody. And Robert's done a great job with that. Obviously with the media stuff he does, which they got.

smart to hire someone outside to just do that full time. And then he, at any rate, he, I mean, he's, he's proud. He wears that aim flag. He runs around that sucker high and you know, he loves it. And I don't hear a lot of complaints. So from what I can tell, he's doing a health job.

Brett King (35:32.952)
Oh yeah.

Brett King (35:39.068)
And then this year we've always had Jeff Kozer and his brother, his brother's name is slipping me right now and I apologize for that, but Jeff Kozer has always helped us like on our national championship set up. He's a very techie video guy. Very good at that stuff. We actually brought Jeff in this year on a, on a part-time contract basis.

who run our social media. He's very good at that stuff. And I mean, the changes we're seeing already, he's doing a great job. And I was so happy when he came on board and our opportunity is going forward. Looking at different scenarios with Jeff is the, the world is wide open for us. Now. I don't know if you've ever watched any of like the graha wands from up in Grand Rapids, we run that.

That's Jeff Kozer and Denny Fox putting all of that on, right? That is aim. They subcontract us to go run that, that tournament. So, um, that just gives you a little bit of an idea of what kind of skill Jeff can put on.

Brian Bashore (36:38.606)
All right. Yep.

Brian Bashore (36:48.734)
You got to do that nowadays. That's what I mean. It's a job. I mean, just the social media. I mean, if Denny's got to try to do all the media stuff and run the tournaments, obviously you'd be in a huge miss during the tournament. Cause he's, he's as busy and he, and all that, he's just has to be available, you know, you know, versus everything else. And it just, it takes a ridiculous amount of time to do it right. I mean, O'Connor can attest that he gets it and then the video and there's a reason that people do this for a living and can go to school for it nowadays.

Brett King (36:52.946)
Yes.

Brian Bashore (37:18.146)
produce this and that all this got to do is grow your sport. Nope. Right. So about the brand awareness and then the growth all follow. So.

Brett King (37:24.744)
So I'll go down a little bit of a path here. When you bring up Cardenas, Cardenas obviously a very good friend of mine as well. I love what he does with the NWT media. I don't care for some of the restrictions, but that's a subject we're not going to get into. But I will say this. You know, I left for a year and went and tried head to head. Right?

Brian Bashore (37:44.673)
Yeah.

Brett King (37:55.545)
And...

Brett King (38:00.26)
Because of head to head, I'm going to say the NWT is a better product. That's when they really kicked it up a notch on their coverage. And out of everything negative, something good always comes out of it. Obviously head to head didn't work out for a number of different reasons. So now we're, we're back with, you know, at the NWT again. So.

Brian Bashore (38:08.534)
Yep, it was.

Brett King (38:28.06)
But I will say, I think that forced the hand of NWT and others, you know, all the tournament organizations, like, this is pretty cool stuff, right? We need to up our game. And that's really when you saw that happen and Cardenas came on freelance and, and he's doing a great job with it.

Brian Bashore (38:46.91)
Yep. No competition, you know, breeds competition, right? And there wasn't any, so that you become complacent and they're like, good enough. We're getting by whatever. Then when you lose 10, 12 anchors, I think of you guys that kind of went one way or the other, and it's obviously it's a huge, you know, what people don't realize is everybody thinks we got free boats and hundreds of thousand dollars worth of sponsorship money and stuff. And the reality is that is not true. That is not true at all. At this.

Brett King (39:02.17)
Yep.

Brett King (39:11.545)
Yes, they do.

Brian Bashore (39:15.274)
It's expensive, man. I think head to head 16, just to get in that year. Right. Then you got travel food away from home. You know, NWT is saying we got seven, 7,000 entries for our four. Is that right? 7,000. And then if you want to decide possible that it's the week off of work, right? Some of us don't get paid vacation, right? Those fishing guides and, and the security and stuff, we don't, you know, there's that is what it is. So you're taking that whole.

Brett King (39:15.926)
Thank you.

Brett King (39:27.24)
What the hell's that?

Brian Bashore (39:42.866)
loss of income for the week. So God, I hope I at least cash a check. That's just a break even point really, you know, then we're all living in this economy.

Brett King (39:46.556)
Right?

Brett King (39:50.98)
And then, and then you got a few guys like myself and Kent Anderson that there's a pretty good chance when you go buy us in practice, we're on the phone. You might, you might even see me have my computer out trying to help one of my dealers. Um, so, uh, yes, I'm there fishing, but you know, I'm still working and I've spent many, many midnight hours catching up on emails and stuff because the work doesn't stop.

Brian Bashore (39:59.324)
Right? Yeah.

Brian Bashore (40:04.033)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (40:09.995)
still working.

Brian Bashore (40:19.998)
No, nobody cares that we're gone fishing, you know, and that's what I do every night. And Randy Ted looked at me like, man, the guy gets in and he sits down like a cyber meeting, let's go. Cause I got two or three hours with the stuff to get on the computer from whatever my digital media company or guide stuff, you know, to stay busy. Randy's notorious, humble. He sits at his boat and he's trading stocks and options all day. So if you see him on his phone, he's that's his kind of work. That's all he's doing is like, Hey, he'll text me and be like, Hey, you know, like I'm fishing, I'm fishing, you know, but he.

Brett King (40:21.473)
No. Nope.

Brett King (40:42.527)
the

Brett King (40:46.224)
Get in on this.

Brian Bashore (40:49.078)
does, does well. So he's a very smart guy, but it, yeah, it never ends. And I don't think, you know, people obviously don't, don't realize that or, or see it and don't realize that 99% of your national wallet tour pros have other, that's not their full-time job. They're a guide. I mean, even if it's the TV hosts, that's still a job, you know, chase all the next five guys, you still, it doesn't sleep, you know, the very few that just get to go fish.

Brett King (41:15.685)
I'm gonna back up for just a minute and go back to the freeboat comment.

Brian Bashore (41:20.394)
Yeah, let's talk about boats. Brett's a guy that knows a thing or two about boats. So people

Brett King (41:24.209)
That's, well, it's, it's funny because I'm in that position where I can make decisions right on promotional people, et cetera, and both on the Bascat boat side and the aircraft side. I don't have anything to do with our elite level guys on the bass side. That's all handled by one, one person. Um, but when I get approached on this stuff, right. Sponsorship.

and the attitudes, the unrealistic attitudes and expectations that come forward sometimes are mind-blowing. And every once in a while, I will get asked for a quote-unquote, free boat.

Brian Bashore (41:56.507)
Mm-hmm.

Brett King (42:09.676)
And I'm like, you know, let me put the perspective of the real reality out in front of you. Uh, been fishing now for 23 plus years ish. Pretty much fished everything that's come through. Uh, I work for a boat company. I repped in the Marine business for five years before that. And now I work for a very tournament orientated boat company.

Right? I don't know that you'll find another boat company is committed to promotional guys as bass cats, for example. And, uh, I still pay for a boat and I work for it. So how can you expect to get a free boat? You know, it's just not where we're at. It's all time when I first got in, there was some of that going on, but that's that 08 09.

Brian Bashore (43:01.159)
No, I mean there's...

Brett King (43:09.237)
2010 era pretty much put a complete stop to that.

Brian Bashore (43:13.77)
Yeah, you had the bill pay memo pay type, you know, boat deals, and there's still some dealer boat type things out there, but that's all about the relationship with, with you or that boat dealer, you know, type stuff. It doesn't, it's not coming from the manufacturer level so much.

Brett King (43:23.216)
Yeah, hope you're seeing it.

Brett King (43:28.236)
Here's a, here's a quick tidbit for anybody looking to get into the game. Um, as far as sponsorship wise, you are way better putting your efforts towards a dealership than you are me as the manufacturer. And the reason I say that, because that dealer is my customer, right? And they're very important to me. If, if a dealer comes to me with something, I'm going to listen.

Right? Does that make sense? So you're getting in this game. You're way better off a dealer themselves can do way more for you than I can as a manufacturer and what to elaborate on that a little more, what people forget. And I have to point it out often as look, I only control what's here in glitter. I don't control what's on the back. I don't control the $30,000 worth of electronics and trolling models and all that stuff you want to put on.

Brian Bashore (43:58.99)
Totally.

Brian Bashore (44:25.983)
Alright.

Brett King (44:27.512)
I have no bearing on that. So I can only help you on a very small piece of this package when you break it down into reality. So, um, but it's interesting and you know, kudos people are always trying. Nope. Well that, that is.

Brian Bashore (44:45.47)
Yeah, they're not going to stop because, you know, the perception is reality, but I don't know where they get the perception at that you're getting, you know, everybody's getting free boats and stuff, but.

Brett King (44:55.504)
You know, I can maybe.

Brett King (45:01.2)
Think of a couple, maybe, that might actually be a true statement on. But I'm not going to take it past a couple. I mean, we're all writing checks. So.

Brian Bashore (45:11.698)
No, it's very few and those couple are, they're paying for it one way or the other. I mean, they may be traveling out of pocket, going to boat shows every weekend and that's part of the deal.

Brett King (45:18.448)
They are 100% and you gotta...

Brett King (45:26.052)
Yep. So, you know, and I'm arguably not a massive social media guy, right? That's not necessarily my forte. I do what I can and I'm comfortable with, cause I don't want to come off as fake. But you know, like myself, I am at pretty much boat and sport shows from January 1st to April. And I talked to hundreds of consumers, you know,

Brian Bashore (45:28.372)
Yeah.

Brett King (45:54.788)
every weekend at these shows. And that's where I can influence things and guide people the right direction on products. And obviously I have to stay a little neutral and walk a rope, but I've learned to navigate it and it works out very well for me. And that's given me some advantages, I guess you could say within the industry, because I do talk.

one-on-one with so many people that are actually buying the product. You know, Kent Anderson, same story. You know, I mean, we're just in that unique position. He's the same way he's at boat shows every single week. And that's what we do all winter.

Brian Bashore (46:39.562)
Yeah, hit Ken and one of his guys at home hall this weekend. I can't remember, uh, drawing blank. He fishes in David T with us. I can't remember short stock a guy, but they were, they were moving a few, but the market COVID split this whole boat industry to upside down on, you know, obviously supply demand, but looking at some of these, I'm talking 150, 180 thousand dollar boats. What, where are we going with all this stuff? Like I said, he controlled the glitter, this, you know, so I get it.

Brett King (46:47.175)
Okay.

Brett King (46:53.597)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Bashore (47:08.834)
trailers cost more, motors cost more. A lot of that's the, I want this $30,000, $40,000 worth of, you know, gadgets on this thing.

Brett King (47:15.26)
toys, toys. When you break it down, you know, to boat motor trailer, it's, it's not as ridiculous as when you look at the end number, right? And, you know, you ask, where does it stop? I don't know that it does, Brian, every time you think you hit a threshold, the envelope gets pushed, and it just keeps going. And I deal with it.

Every single day, obviously, I cover my territories from, well, as of recent now, I cover Washington to Cleveland, Ohio, down to Nebraska and the entire country. I can't call it a state, the entire country of Canada. So I'm talking to 17, 18 dealers almost daily. And it's.

Brian Bashore (47:56.693)
It's big territory.

Brett King (48:11.38)
more and more challenging all of the toys and gadgets and you can go back five years and not to name names but there was legit a trolling motor company and two electronics companies right i'll fast forward to now and you put this in perspective for dealers and the frustration levels now you've got five players four legit players in the trolling motor category

Brian Bashore (48:27.689)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (48:36.939)
Right.

Yep. Power pole, Minn Kota, Garmin, Lurance Ghost. Yeah.

Brett King (48:42.076)
And Garmin has made huge strides, you know, huge strides in, uh, in our market. And, you know, I've had a couple of the, the Garmin guys tell me pretty much point blank. That's big part of that is, is Danny Thompson and what he did with the, with the scope ice package and that was their breakthrough moment.

Brian Bashore (48:50.656)
Everything.

Brian Bashore (49:09.614)
Yeah it was.

Brett King (49:10.308)
what I've been told up here. So, you know, kudos to him for that. But this all leads to, you know, very interesting situations for dealers. I was just on the phone before we got on here, um, with my dealer out in North Dakota, North country Marine, trying to figure out, you know, through pictures and whatever, a dual graph set up on a yard craft and I could sense the frustration in his voice that they're being pushed.

Brian Bashore (49:26.774)
Oh yeah.

Brett King (49:39.14)
You know, to look at these situations and, uh, you know, then manufacturers will make a change. Like there's big shift in, in trolling this year that is causing a lot of us, a lot of issues, um, in rigging boats, dealerships struggled to find a qualified rigging person and dedicate them to that and the consumer demand now with all of these new toys.

Brian Bashore (49:48.329)
Right.

Brian Bashore (50:01.45)
Yup.

Brett King (50:08.164)
It's very hard and challenging for them to keep up. Heck, it's hard for you and I to keep up with all of it, right?

Brian Bashore (50:13.062)
Yeah, I don't even rig it. I just take it to the dealer. Seuss Force has a good guy. They've kept him there for a long time. And if I need something, I'm like, I'm going to screw it up. So just, you're the expert. Figure it out.

Brett King (50:23.332)
You're seeing more and more independents come along. Bill Schmoyer is one, because the demand for that rigging guy is there. And dealers are off sourcing their sold boats to these independents just because they get it and it's getting so techie, you need that guy. So, it's interesting.

Brian Bashore (50:27.45)
No. Yep.

Brian Bashore (50:46.646)
Cause if you don't do it right, you're, everybody's going to know about it. But if it's done good, it's, you know, silent, right? Hey, they did a good job, but if they did a bad job, he's going to go tell the world.

Brett King (50:57.064)
So, you know, boat sales, you know, back to the root of the topic. Where will it stop? I don't know. We built a 22 foot Jaguar Vascade and we put a 500 horse engine on it.

Brett King (51:11.936)
And we sell them, right? So where does it stop? I don't know. I don't have that crystal ball answer for you. COVID obviously severely accelerated everything in, in our business right now, it is posing a lot of challenges because people bought, impulse bought so much during COVID, like nobody could keep up.

Brian Bashore (51:13.762)
Good Lord.

Brian Bashore (51:34.766)
Alright.

Brett King (51:37.84)
I don't care if we ever see that again, to be honest with you, but nobody can come up. So people were paying top dollar, right? There was no negotiating. You want it. Here it is. If you don't want it, there'll be another guy coming in 10 minutes later to buy it. That was just the situation we were in. So now you fast forward to today and you have interest rates.

Brian Bashore (51:40.735)
I hear you.

Brian Bashore (51:48.364)
No.

Brian Bashore (51:53.771)
Exactly.

Brian Bashore (52:03.831)
Yeah.

Brett King (52:05.292)
and these boats are a price tag that need to be stretched out over many years for a lot of people to be able to swing it.

Brian Bashore (52:14.25)
I'm seeing the tags Saturday is biweekly now instead of the monthly payment. So it's not such a shock. It's 791 biweekly. You know what I'm like? Okay.

Brett King (52:19.956)
Yeah, they're getting creative. And you know, when I'm talking to people trying to respect what they're purchasing, um, you know, I tell them, look, this is an investment. This isn't a purchase anymore. I mean, you're probably paying potentially as much as you paid for a house at some point in your life. And, you know, you got to make smart decisions when doing it, but

Probably today's biggest challenge for dealers and manufacturers is a lot of people looking at new product today have that 20, 21 year model boat that they paid premium dollar for. And now they're trying to get it back either on the open market or on trade, right? Trade is easier because it's even tougher to get good financing on a used boat for a private buyer.

Brian Bashore (53:17.046)
Yep, true.

Brett King (53:18.284)
Well, those are the things, you know, myself and my dealers are navigating on a, on a daily basis, you know, on the current situation. And that was all driven by the COVID, you know, pandemic rush, gold rush, I guess I would call it. Wine to man.

Brian Bashore (53:20.622)
Thanks for watching!

Brian Bashore (53:35.57)
Yeah. Supply and demand. So there was a big demand and there was not much supply. And now we've supply has caught up and demand has slowed, you know, someone on some models, but interest rates are obviously a big part of that. And like you said, the financing, one of these boats are almost double what you paid in maybe 18, 19 for a boat. Uh, but a lot of that is due to the stuff you're putting on it. And I mean, it's to each their own. There's all these products. I can't imagine being the dealers of how much stuff.

Brett King (53:53.86)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (54:02.53)
You know, they can't, it's hard to get parts. So like Sue's force does a great job of having a lot of parts, far as you know, motors go on hand, but like saying, there's so many changes. I just heard of, uh, you know, we got lithium batteries. So when the lithium battery company guys, you know, got bought this, stuck it in. And when he crushed the top of it, because it's too big for his model of boat, it does the lid doesn't, doesn't close. You know, it's an eighth inch type thing, you know, and it's like, well, it was good last year, but the manufacturer made a change in this

Brett King (54:16.008)
Mm-hmm.

Brian Bashore (54:31.402)
Company wasn't ahead of the game far enough. Uh, there's all those little things that I'm sure the Trillomotors where you're mounting them up front is probably something you're having to adjust. And, and, and where can I get all this wiring and the right wiring, the harnesses and can I run a lithium to this, to the big motor and it's just, yeah. It's I mean, lithium batteries are expensive as well.

Brett King (54:40.742)
Mm-hmm.

Brett King (54:49.668)
Well, what would you pay for your first GPS trolling motor?

Brian Bashore (54:56.867)
Oh, probably like 1200 bucks or something.

Brett King (54:59.72)
12, 16, 1800 bucks depending on what voltage you got, right?

Brian Bashore (55:03.51)
Yep.

Brett King (55:05.384)
It's about five grand now, the time you're done. If you want to get into the brushless technology and the things that go with it, across the board for the most part, you could easily push towards $5,000. And I mean, when you look at just that one example, that's where your boat pricing comes from. And as hard as it is for consumers and dealers to keep up, it's just as hard for us as manufacturers, because you can't offer it all.

Brian Bashore (55:07.286)
Yeah.

Brett King (55:34.424)
Right. It's just, it's impossible. I mean, you got power poles and Raptors and, you know, four different colors of each. And, and when you get to this level of customer paying this kind of money for. You know, their boats, they kind of demand that right. Like they're going to pay that kind of money for it. And they want say a white power pole. You better give in a little bit on a white power pole.

Brian Bashore (55:39.863)
Alright.

Brian Bashore (56:02.314)
You better find a way to parable. Yeah.

Brett King (56:04.12)
Right. So, um, you know, even though that's not really your bread and butter, it's, it's part of the game that we have to navigate through and it's definitely gets more challenging every single day.

Brian Bashore (56:16.594)
Yeah. I mean that kind of money you want what you want. If I'm paying this, you know, this is what I wanted. I want it. My boat needs to match my truck, truck needs match boat, whatever it may be. And I want the trailer to match this and my motor to match that and my power poles, you know, it's, I want it to look good. So, you know,

Brett King (56:30.872)
Yep. Well, and look what happened when you took in the like the trucks with the gray matte finish, you know, and all that. Well, the boats follow suit. Right. And all of a sudden people are building just a gray, flat gray boat. And so it all plays into that, that customer. And, you know, we as Basket and Yardcraft are a very customizable company for the most part.

particularly on the basket side. That's just what we're known for. And so it doesn't come easy, that's for sure.

Brian Bashore (57:05.742)
That's what keeps everybody busy and that's why we got jobs, right? And keeps it just the way it is. I just talked on another episode. It's just, these are the times we have to, you know, it's like forward facing. If you don't accept it and progress and move forward, you're just going to get left behind. Period. You know, no matter what industry or what product or whatever it is in this digital space, uh, I mean, these podcasts have been going on for years and I've been contemplating doing it for years. I'm like, nah, I don't want to, I don't need another thing. But then it's like.

Brett King (57:08.678)
That's right.

Brett King (57:21.968)
Yeah. Yes, you are.

Brian Bashore (57:35.202)
The walleye guys are being left behind because no one's talking to the walleye pros so much, you know, so it's fired up. It's a good time. It's fun and gives you guys and as well as myself all a platform.

Brett King (57:45.56)
Well, we appreciate it. I mean, that's, you know, I typically do any of these that are offered up to me.

Brett King (57:54.888)
So.

Brian Bashore (57:56.33)
Which everybody should when you get a chance. So, I mean, that's how they grow and that gives you a, and all our, you know, the companies we work with and whether they're sponsors or not, the opportunity to get out there as a sports show this weekend and realize there's a lot more people listening than, than I knew because they, you know, they, they came up and I liked that one or I loved this one. And you know, Johnny Kendall, they're doing this, this thing stuff. I said, I really loved listening to that one about the industry stuff from, you know, Joel Nelson, because some of us, those are more appealing to than, you know, than others. A lot of people want to hear about fishing stuff. So.

Brett King (58:10.768)
Yeah.

Brett King (58:23.572)
Yep, sure.

Brian Bashore (58:26.41)
Real quick we got so upcoming season. What do you what do you see? What do you like about it? Obviously, we got your home water, which is you know, probably the one you're looking to the most but green bay I know you spent a lot of time there. We got eerie. It's a cock. We I think you've had good luck. It's cock. We

Brett King (58:39.472)
We got it. It's really a good scavenger.

Brian Bashore (58:42.302)
And hereon, you definitely have had great luck up there.

Brett King (58:45.168)
Here, home's been good. Green Bay's been good. This, out of that schedule, well, this has been good to me. I haven't been able to knock one in the head here on a major scale, but maybe this year. It's a good schedule. It really is. And it's an appealing schedule. It's very diverse, right? A lot of travel, depending on where you live. That's part of the game, too.

Brian Bashore (59:03.894)
Yeah.

Brett King (59:12.068)
I'm looking forward to it. Erie should be a good time if the weather lines up, you know, it's a good period. I do enjoy going there in April because you pretty much only catch walleyes. You don't catch a lot of the sheephead, the catfish and things like that. Typically if you're trolling and a board goes back, it's a walleye. So that's always fun. And then obviously here with what the cards were being dealt, we're going to change the overall dynamics of it.

Brian Bashore (59:15.82)
Right.

Brian Bashore (59:21.87)
All right. Yep.

Brett King (59:41.288)
There's going to be certain things like, well, willow cats, creek jobs, not going to be quite as important probably because of what you're going to have to target for fish. But you better have some, and you better follow the rules, right? And that's a big part of it. And, you know, there's things you can and can't do with them here. So read up on that. I'm not going to sit here and divulge it all, but we ain't got enough time. But.

Brian Bashore (59:50.782)
But you better have some. Yep. All right.

Brian Bashore (01:00:10.16)
Alright.

Brett King (01:00:10.748)
Read the rules, read the state laws on them. Understand that there's two states. Keep in mind where you're staying because that comes into play. Which state you're staying in, et cetera. Sacakawea, that'll be fun. That's a really diverse fishery. There's so much there, so much that.

Brian Bashore (01:00:13.706)
Both states, dear two states.

Brian Bashore (01:00:33.518)
There's never a bad time up there.

Brett King (01:00:38.66)
We didn't untap as long as we don't end up in the situation we did. I think it was in whatever May that year and we all powered up 120 some miles. No, it won't be an issue. There's a good, good chance it could be. Yeah, there's a good chance it could be one within 10 miles of it. Take off.

Brian Bashore (01:00:45.09)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:00:49.678)
Yeah, I don't think that's going to be the issue. No, I don't just 50, 60 miles.

Brian Bashore (01:01:00.814)
They could be one with a closer than that event. So, you got it last time we were there at that tournament, the guy got second and he was not more than a mile away. So, because he couldn't go any further because he didn't have a boat with big enough fuel tank. So.

Brett King (01:01:08.228)
Right. Yup.

Brett King (01:01:13.704)
From here on, I'm looking forward to that, obviously. Got some great memories there. Talking to you guys over the course of the winter at different sports shows. Not getting a great vibe on the bite that time of year. Basically being told we're gonna have our work cut out for us to put that one together. So, remember, yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:01:17.652)
Alright.

Brian Bashore (01:01:29.942)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:01:35.166)
Is it early September of the championship? Yeah, who knows? I don't mean, we got to make it there first and foremost. Right?

Brett King (01:01:41.784)
Well, we gotta make it first. You're exactly right. I mean, that's not a gimme anymore. So.

Brian Bashore (01:01:47.67)
No, not at all. If you fish all four and you bring in limits, you should be safe. Yeah. But if you don't, you know, obviously if you zero you're out and if you come, well, you can come short on some of these loans. You got a big enough bag just because of the way that, you know, the three or four fish type thing lays out.

Brett King (01:01:53.936)
You're good. Yeah.

Brett King (01:02:06.752)
in the size of the fish we'll be dealing with at these places. You know, it's not that Winnebago scenario where, yeah, so you can make up some ground on this one. No doubt, this schedule. So all good. I'm super excited, Jack. I'll be running the new Yamaha 350. Cannot wait to get that. It's going to delay me a little bit and get my boat put together, but I'll get through it. I always have.

Brian Bashore (01:02:08.769)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:02:14.402)
Yeah, they all got big fish.

Brett King (01:02:35.332)
You know, I've borrowed boats before and things, so...

Brian Bashore (01:02:39.598)
You're not gonna stick that on that hobby boat you got going on?

Brett King (01:02:42.092)
Well, no, you'd probably see me in that hobby boat though out on Erie. Um, but no, I'm super stoked for that. Uh, talking to the Yamaha guys, you know, at the Minneapolis sports show and they introduced it and hearing their test numbers, um, what they were able to do with it on other holes. You know, Yarcraft is a fast hole. So I'm, I'm expecting, uh, some really cool stuff out of that.

Brian Bashore (01:02:46.359)
Ha ha!

Brian Bashore (01:03:04.714)
Yes it is.

Brett King (01:03:11.527)
super jacked about that.

Brian Bashore (01:03:12.974)
I remember my first experience watching a yardcraft open. It was Randy Gaines' yardcraft at Huron or yeah, Saginaw Bay. And we had that 45 minute right river boat ride where there was a gap where you could open it up. And we all kind of opened it up just cause you're tired of putz and along. And it was near the mouth of it. And Randy was way the hell behind me. And he passed every single boat to that next bridge. And it just, I was like, you hear that? Looked over and it was just.

Brett King (01:03:22.344)
Okay.

All right.

Brett King (01:03:33.105)
Right?

Brett King (01:03:39.129)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:03:43.218)
I mean as smooth and as clean as you could just I think get a 300 on it and just Right for everybody and came off plane and through their bridge and I was like Wow, I mean, I bet he was going 70 and he but he hit top speed so fast

Brett King (01:03:47.014)
Yeah.

Brett King (01:03:53.254)
Oh, excellent.

Brett King (01:03:57.444)
It's a fun boat to drive. There's no doubt. You know, obviously I'm biased. I work for them. It is a, it's a great hole. And you know, this year we introduced the new two 10 TFX. If you haven't checked that one out near in the market for a boat, look at that one in the SP package. It's, it's a very attractive price on it. I'm excited to get back out. You know, one thing with, with the scope and we'll be rods in hand.

Brian Bashore (01:04:02.282)
Alright.

Brett King (01:04:25.508)
You know, obviously I've been with JT rods a long time, helping them develop open water rods. I'm always looking forward to putting a spinning rod in my hand. That is the way I do like to fish. I've had success trolling. I love a good spinner bite, but at the end of the day, give me a jig and maybe a plastic and I'm pretty much in my happy place. So that'll be awesome. Go hand to hand combat, so.

Brian Bashore (01:04:36.875)
Me too.

Brian Bashore (01:04:48.618)
Yep. A little hand to hand combat for sure. All right. Let's wrap this thing up. But we got a little tidbit, a nugget, anything you can leave for the angler out there that's up and coming. I think you already dropped a couple of them for them, but if you got one more.

Brett King (01:05:02.752)
Yeah, you know, longevity is a big part of this business. When you look around, you know, don't expect the world to come to you no matter what you have for success in the beginning, it's longevity. When you look around at the guys that have stood the test of time, you know, and there's a bunch of us. It took me about 10 years to break through.

be able to actually say I could probably fish for a living. Right? I choose not to and keep a second career always have. And that's something you gotta think about too. If you wanna fish at this level, there's way more to it than the fishing. You gotta look at the whole aspect, the time commitment, right? Like I, in the beginning, I was always self-employed and that allowed me to do it. You know, just all kinds of dynamics like that. And

Brian Bashore (01:05:47.29)
Way more to it. Yeah.

Brett King (01:05:59.324)
Don't ever be afraid to reach out to us guys. Most of us are pretty approachable, right? I mean, if somebody sends me a private message on Facebook, I'm not going to steer them the wrong way. If it's something I cannot tell you, I'm just simply gonna tell you, hey, I can't go there. Please understand that. But for the most part, I'm an open book as well and I'm gonna help you any way I can. Gary Parsons is the best example I can give.

Batman has done more for people, myself included, than anybody else in this industry, if you're gonna ask my opinion. He's always been willing to help. He has sent contracts my way, gave me ideas on contract. He's always been willing to help. And we as the veterans, we need to help pass that torch as well.

Even though it looks easier now to come into this game with the Ford-facing sonar and be successful faster, that doesn't necessarily mean you're going to make it in this industry.

Brian Bashore (01:07:08.998)
Right. Yeah. Technology has sped up the learning curve for everybody. And every aspect of it, just the education factor of, you know, they're not waiting for the in Fisherman magazine to show up or Saturday morning, TNN, you know, bill dance show, whatever it was, Hank Parker, verge ward there. We got YouTube, we got these, we got tournaments happening, maybe more than there ever has been, you know, in coverage so they can, they can learn it. But.

Brett King (01:07:15.613)
guess.

Brett King (01:07:33.732)
And the last thing I guess I'd leave them with, if you're looking to get in this game, you got to be yourself. I mean, be who you are. You can't recreate yourself and come off fake, right? Like it's, it's going to bite you eventually. And we have seen it happen. Um, you just, just be who you are. You know, I mean, we're not all great at social media. We're not all great on camera. We're not all writers, right? Focus on your strengths and let that push you through.

Brian Bashore (01:07:43.98)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (01:08:02.026)
Yeah. And you know, knowing what those are. So listen to people around you when they say this isn't, you know, there's only one I can Ellie, right? But you know, not everybody can turn it on and off because you know, as well I do, and there's, there's Mike and then there's Ike and these are two different, you know, and Scarlett's kind of had a little bit of that type stuff going for him. And you couldn't be more right. Just be who you are and longevity. Cause this doesn't happen overnight. It is a, a long game with a lot of sacrifices and still not a lot of financial glory. So

Brett King (01:08:06.266)
Mm-hmm.

Brett King (01:08:16.118)
Yes.

Brian Bashore (01:08:31.182)
to speak on, on certain ends of it, but it doesn't mean there, there can't be. I mean, the potential and the horizon is never ending it. It's there for anybody who wants to do it. Well.

Brett King (01:08:41.336)
And I dabble a lot on the bass side now too, because of work. And people have this misconception that it's so much easier over there. Right? Like it's, it's an easier path. It really isn't when you break it down to percentages, it's the same game. So, there's just more, there's more opportunities, but more players.

Brian Bashore (01:09:02.07)
more players and it's, if you got the passion, it'll drive you where you need to go, but you know, there's an article that came out this morning, I think it's the MPA showed it outdoor life did it. Kyle Patrick wrote about the financial side of it, all that everybody overlooks. And it's like, create a budget, figure this out. You know, you'll find out real, real soon. You know, you might be able to scrape through a couple of seasons, even with it. That if it's, you know, if it's for you or not, um, but you.

Brett King (01:09:06.257)
Yes.

Brett King (01:09:25.768)
I spent some time with Kyle down at the NPA conference, got to know him a little bit. Not great, but he's definitely a charismatic young man and he's driven. I'll tell you that. I mean, I expect, I mean, he already showed it in this first one. I mean, he, he had a pretty good finish. So, um, and he's all in, I can tell you that much.

Brian Bashore (01:09:47.19)
Yep, he is. And he's, he's doing it right. He's looking through it with these wide open glasses of here's what I got. Here's where I need to be to make this, you know, ends meet. And if it doesn't, then something's, something's got to give somewhere, you know, and we'll, and it's fine. Another Avenue, maybe I got to, I got to go work part-time here or I got to do this, or I need to find a couple more, you know, partner sponsor type things and, and figure out some of our Avenue, you know, as Avenue of approach, we'd call it in the military of a, another revenue source. So.

It's a, you gotta wear a lot of hats, you know, to make things meet, but it's all fun. Like you said, this industry and you know, our touring pros are just the best group of guys that you can, you can hang with, you know, and if you, you can reach out to anybody, I get them, you get them, send them private message, email, text to the website through social. It doesn't matter. Most, all these guys are going to answer your questions to the best, their ability, the ones that can and can't and not steer you the wrong.

Brett King (01:10:45.672)
I'm still waiting for somebody to show the true side, the true story of all this fish and stuff. You know, the true reality TV, right? Because it is a fun group and I think back over the years, the memories that we cannot talk about in different scenarios for obvious reasons, but it has been a very fun journey and I wouldn't have it any other way. One other thing I guess I would add is surround yourself with a good woman, right? It's everything.

Brian Bashore (01:10:53.44)
Yep.

Brian Bashore (01:10:59.086)
All right.

Brian Bashore (01:11:10.926)
Yeah, boy, that is the number one key to the puzzle, man.

Brett King (01:11:15.556)
You know, I met, I got married last fall, um, to my wife, Colleen. And, uh, you know, I never, I didn't always have that support and she's been awesome. And I know, I know you've got a partner, you know, in years and, and it is a big piece of it, man, if you're, if you got somebody fighting you on the other end at home, uh, good luck. So, so cool to all those fishing wives out there. We know we put you through a lot.

Brian Bashore (01:11:39.007)
It's tough because you're not home a lot.

Brian Bashore (01:11:44.326)
Yeah, wallow widows, right? The walleye widows that are out there. They are, uh, they're troopers. And if you can get one that likes to go fishing with you, take her every chance you get up, my wife will say, Hey, I haven't even got to be in the boat this year. I'm like, I'll try to get you on the schedule because you know, I got to take to work what I can take to work.

Brett King (01:11:47.092)
Yes. All I would ever...

Brett King (01:12:01.476)
Mine mine doesn't go much past maybe a dinner cruise from here up to Prescott. That's about the extent of She wants nothing to do with the fish inside of it, which I'm good with that Right

Brian Bashore (01:12:06.498)
Yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:12:09.73)
Yeah, she loves it, but she doesn't love the heat. So it's kind of a early spring, late fall loves the late fall type stuff. I'm like, yeah, me too. So we definitely get more, more time them and, and she can fish. So, I mean, hell she's fish tournament with me before. I think we had eighth or something like that. So that's always totally, totally. Oh, the young guys that haven't experienced that stuff that it'll change, you know, as, as they move up and we've, we've seen that happen to many anglers.

Brett King (01:12:24.804)
Yeah, but it's all about that support at home. You got to have it.

Brett King (01:12:37.752)
I always joke that, you know, when, when spring go first come on the scene and he's tearing the, tearing the walls down of this empire. And I'm like, yeah, like I said it quite a few times like, man, we got to get that dude a girlfriend something we got to get, we got to get him married, you know, and slow him down a little bit. So, yeah.

Brian Bashore (01:12:37.79)
and you can tell the ones that don't have the support.

Alright.

Brian Bashore (01:12:51.934)
Totally. Yep. We still, we still do. So I still do. Oh, well it'll come. He's a good dude. So, hey to you. All right. Thanks Brett for your time today. I think all you've fallen long, you bet. We'll put some links down below here to check out the yard crafts and the aim circuit as well. So if y'all haven't dipped your toes in that, give it a shout and.

Brett King (01:13:00.092)
Correct.

Brett King (01:13:04.825)
for you.

Brett King (01:13:09.136)
Thanks for having me Brian.

Brian Bashore (01:13:18.878)
Try and you've got questions about it reach out to Brett. He'll be happy to answer them Thanks for tuning in everybody. You can follow if you're watching it You're watching it right here on YouTube or over the wall I guys Facebook page and you can download these and listen to them as you're driving to the classic or driving to your next tournament over on Spotify Amazon Apple Google wherever those podcast platforms are everywhere. They're all out there. So once again, thanks for listening tune in guys We'll see you on the water

Brett King (01:13:44.68)
Thanks guys.