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Explore the world of driver recruiting with the Hire Truckers Podcast! Join us as we talk to recruiting experts, offering industry insights, marketing trends, and motivation to enhance your recruiting skills. Whether you're a seasoned recruiter or just starting, our podcast is here to help you level up your game in the trucking industry.
Welcome to the HireTruckers podcast, where we interview experts in driver recruiting. We provide industry insights, marketing trends, and motivation to help you level up your recruiting game. Welcome to the Hire Truckist podcast. This is Aaron Craddock, your host. And today, I have Sadie Church with us, who currently runs recruit, hire, retain.
Aaron Craddock:Look forward. She was recommended from a few different people to have her on our show, and I'm super excited to have her on and excited to kinda share with you some of the stuff she's working on. And then more than anything, I think this episode is gonna add a lot of value to directors of recruiting, people that work in retention, because I view Sadie as one of the top industry experts, particularly in retention. Getting drivers to show up, for orientation, just doing really good follow-up throughout the whole process. I actually had heard her speak at the CDL life event a couple years ago.
Aaron Craddock:It was one of the first times I heard her talk about retention. I was like, wow. Like, more fleets need to hear this. So shout out to CDL Life's event, that they do every year. I encourage you guys to get out there.
Aaron Craddock:That's been one of my favorite industry events I've been able to attend the last few years. So, thank you for coming on the show today, Sadie.
Sadie Church:Thanks so much for having me, Erin.
Aaron Craddock:And so a little bit more background of Sadie just to give to give you guys, just why she's an expert. So she spent some time at NFI, leading there as the director of recruiting. And then after that, she went to Archer Express, and that's a lot of where I heard, some of how she improved their attention process there. And so we're gonna dive a little bit into that. The two topics that Sadie and I decided to dive into today are just growth mindset because we, you know, both really care about having mentors in our lives and the importance of that and then reading and growing.
Aaron Craddock:So we're gonna spend some time on that. And then we're also gonna spend some time on just some industry insights, like what's happening in the market, what are we seeing, what are drivers doing, are they applying for jobs, are they not. And then lastly, we're gonna go into just some retention tips and tricks. And so our value is that by you listening to this episode, just as a recruiting director, an executive in a fleet, or recruiter that you leave with that one little nugget that can help you improve your business. And so so we'll start out, Sadie, with just what are what is something you I know you're an avid reader.
Aaron Craddock:What's a book that you've read that's really just impacted your life? It can be recent or just in the past?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So, The Happiness Advantage by Shawn Achor. It's a a book, Harvard scientist on positive psychology and how to retrain your brain. Another really good one, I'm late to game on this one. I just finished Atomic Habits, and that was really good as well.
Sadie Church:And another recommendation that's kind of a little off the radar is the Four Agreements, and that was a really, really good one as well.
Aaron Craddock:I think I heard of that one, but I haven't read it. So what so Atomic Habits, that's been a really impactful book for me. It's one I I go back to every single year. Like, how did that one impact you? What's a little nugget from that?
Sadie Church:My favorite takeaway from that one was, like, how you when you have a goal or something in mind, how to speak it, to say it to others, to hold help hold yourself accountable. That one really spoke to me. I've always made to do lists, but I've never really, like, held myself accountable for goals. So I think that was really, really helpful.
Aaron Craddock:That's awesome. And then happiness advantage, like, why why does that matter?
Sadie Church:So that is, if you've ever struggled with anxiety or anything like that, it's it's the science behind your how your brain works, the left side versus the right side, and how you can exercise your brain to focus on positive emotions and have more control over any negative emotions, anxiety, depression, anger, whatever those emotions may be, that side of your brain is a lot stronger.
Aaron Craddock:Yeah. So I just I struggled with anxiety in different seasons of my life and probably depression, like never diagnosed. But I think it's one of those things that's just not talked about, like among high achievers, just how many people struggle with it. And then it's it's actually been through the rewiring. I first read the happiness advantage when I was at Randall Reilly.
Aaron Craddock:Like we went through that with some of our leadership team and, yeah, it just really, really changed the way I think and just labeling emotions and being okay with them. And I was actually even raised where, like, you didn't really talk about negative emotions. So you didn't talk about sadness or fear or, like, anything. Like, I I had a whole side of the emotional spectrum that I, I guess, completely just pretended like they didn't exist. I was like, I'm always in this happy world and it's really been through the last few years, which is a longer conversation, but I struggle with alcohol and how that that impacted things.
Aaron Craddock:I actually got I was 3 years sober yesterday, so I got my 3 year chip. But alcohol, if you don't know, it only accelerates the anxiety and the depression and all of those things. It doesn't go the other way around. So so that's another thing. If you're listening to this podcast and you struggle with that and you wanna chat, I'm here for you.
Aaron Craddock:So been there, done that. So and Stay Sober One Day at a Time. And yeah. So I really appreciate you sharing, yeah, those books. So the other thing we talked about is how impactful mentors have been kind of in your life.
Aaron Craddock:And, like, what's your kind of your philosophy on, like, do we need mentors throughout life? What are your thoughts around that?
Sadie Church:I have a pretty strong opinion on this. I think if you truly wanna grow your career, identify a mentor early on, ask them to be your mentor, ask them to hold you accountable. I've had the same mentor for many, many years. We stay in very constant contact. He has absolutely been instrumental in my career.
Sadie Church:He gives me harsh advice when I need it, and he's also, you know, these back to the atomic habits, you know, like calling out a goal or something. He's the person, you know, who I I tell, hey, this is what I wanna do. This is my goal, and I don't wanna disappoint him. Like, I wanna I want him to be, you know, proud of of who I am and the work that I've done. So he's helped hold me accountable in those ways, and he's really guided me so many times throughout the years, keeping me going in the right direction.
Sadie Church:Again, not all positive, harsh feedback, but in a trusting environment.
Aaron Craddock:Mhmm. Yeah. I I have had I had one mentor that I've actually I need to follow-up with him. He's probably gonna listen to this. That's given me some harsh feedback and kinda held me accountable on some things and then I hadn't done it.
Aaron Craddock:And so then I quit talking to him as much. But really, it's been the last year or so that I valued, you know, kinda found accountability through some other circles, some different mastermind groups and things I'm in. And, yeah, just where we have, like, we're doing something as silly right now as like a 100 push ups and a 100 sit ups a day. And we have to text we have to text each other when we do it every day. And and then if we don't, we have to pay $20 into our, like, next time we get together dinner fund.
Sadie Church:Oh, that's great.
Aaron Craddock:And so and so it's, so I've missed twice, like, this month. But but so far, I've done, I guess, a 100 and, like, 1800 push ups and sit ups. That's awesome. Not have done like, even last night, I, like got home really late, had a really long day and it was like 10 o'clock. I just had 4 chocolate chip cookies and a glass of milk and which I don't normally eat, but I was celebrating.
Aaron Craddock:So but I was like, I gotta get down. My wife was like, are you really gonna do those 100 push ups and sit ups? And I was like, yes. Like, I thought the only reason is I know they would be ragging me today if I didn't get it done. And so Well,
Sadie Church:good to hear.
Aaron Craddock:The power of yeah. There's the power of accountability. There's just so many things that I really wouldn't do. And and speaking yeah. Just speaking out that those intentions and that vision.
Aaron Craddock:I think that that's another thing. Like, by by your being clear on where you wanna go and your vision, like, whether it's in improving or recruiting and retention department, how much you wanna improve it, or in launching your new business, and things like that. Like, by being clear and sharing that with the world, you're accountable and you actually have to do it, then then move forward in that direction. So I love that. Today's sponsor.
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Aaron Craddock:The next thing I wanted to touch on is before we dive into attention, like, what are you seeing kind of in the job market? And, you know, this episode will come out a little bit later in the year. But kinda what are you what are you seeing now? Like, we're as we record, we're sitting in late February here. What are you seeing with some different trends and and how do you think that impacts impacts things right now?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So a few different things. 1, we're I mean, truck driving, we know this. It's it's a very competitive market. Right?
Sadie Church:But it feels more so right now. In fact, I was looking for some statistics for a presentation we're doing, and I found a report, the 2023 fall driver study that said we're at a record low number of drivers looking for jobs, and that really stuck out to me. It says that we're there are only 33% of drivers are actively looking for a new job right now. That's compared to 40 40% where we were last year. Again, that's a record low, so it's tough.
Sadie Church:I mean, it's we're seeing few fewer, applications per job than what we would typically see. So it it's a tight market right now.
Aaron Craddock:That's interesting because I'm even thinking as of a few months ago, it really wasn't. So that's kind of the first times I'm hearing of it's almost like it's starting to turn around, it would seem. Do you see, like, things heating up, like, with Like, are we gonna have another run like we had after COVID where everybody's fighting after drivers, everybody has to ramp up their budget really quickly? Like, do you anticipate something like that happening, or or what what are you thinking?
Sadie Church:I don't think we'll see that really until freight starts to improve until rates start to improve. With freight volumes and rates being so low right now, I don't see a lot of fleets really wanting to grow their fleets right now. I think a lot of people are looking for ways to, cut costs as much as possible, and really just kinda maintain until the freight market stabilizes.
Aaron Craddock:Mhmm. What do you see because you've been through a few of these cycles being in the industry a while, like, where stuff has slowed down like this and then it sped back up. I mean, this is a little bit unique cycle, but what do you see, like fleets that you think are weathering this well that that is gonna enable them to pick up market share potentially when things ramp back up? Like, what what do you think, like, the smart fleets are doing right now or or maybe one example of of, someone that's doing a good job?
Sadie Church:Yeah. I think they're obviously they're all looking for ways to cut costs. So any easy wins to cut costs right now, you're gonna want to hold on to the fleet that you have, really focus on retention, so that you can spend less on advertising. So any way that you can you can reduce costs is really what you need to be focusing on and building more partnerships.
Aaron Craddock:Yeah. Yeah. Touch on that, partnerships. So, like, what do you see? Like, what type of partnerships would that be?
Sadie Church:So if you're a fleet, one of your big focuses would be identifying more new customers, expanding your freight network so you don't have to rely as much on the spot market. Building those relationships with customers, getting customer freight can certainly help you through some of these tough times.
Aaron Craddock:Makes sense. So, yeah, so you said focusing on relationship with what I heard was focusing on relationship with different carriers that contract freight, so you're not relying as much on the spot spot market. I guess one thing fleet can fleets can do is really focusing on human relationships. And those those connections. And I I think, like, some of the fleets I hear that are growing their fleet right now, it's because they've done that.
Aaron Craddock:They've really leveraged their relationships through this cycle, maintained a really good level of customer service. And then as, like, let's say dedicated lanes are heating up in a new market or a fleet makes a new acquisition, then they're getting a shot at that. And it's not it's not a race to the bottom on cost. So I think that that's super smart. And so then the word you used was retention.
Aaron Craddock:So and that's what I'm excited really excited to dive a little more into. So what's been some of your experience, like, with retention in the industry? Like, whether it's at NFI or Art Express? Like, how how have you kind of been involved on the retention side?
Sadie Church:Yeah. It actually goes back even further than that. I, several years ago, had the opportunity to go to Riverside Transport. I had previously been at CDL Life. Riverside Transport wanted to build a retention department, so they brought me in, to build the retention department from from the ground up.
Sadie Church:From there, I took over their marketing department and then their recruiting department and very quickly found just how hand in hand the 3 go. On the recruiting side, like, I always tell people you recruiting is, you know, you're filling a bucket and you don't want the bucket to be full of holes. So do you're just recruiting drivers. They're coming in one door. They're going out the other door.
Sadie Church:We want to set the right expectation, retain as much of our fleet as possible because at the end of the day, that's gonna lower your cost per hire, it's gonna lower your turnover, and then if you are setting the right expectations with your drivers and you are recruiting and hiring ethically, your driver's gonna be happier and they're gonna refer more drivers. And we've always found that obviously referrals are gonna drive down your cost per hire even further. You can reduce your ad budget even more if your if your drivers are referring other drivers for you. And we've also found that we have higher retention with our referred drivers. They have a lifeline at the company.
Sadie Church:They know to go to for help. So we have we also see better retention rate rates with referrals as well.
Aaron Craddock:Yeah. So how do you how do you keep them, like like, sitting down? Because that's one of the one of the biggest challenges is fleets have these drivers come on and then they leave 30 days later. So how do you impact that?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So if a if a driver's leaving in the 1st 30 days, that's gonna tell me a few things. One, did we not set the right expectations for the driver coming on board? And 2, what was our communication at what were what were our checking points with that driver in the 1st 30 days? Because if if we're losing a driver in the 1st 30 days, we're really really dropping the ball on staying in contact with that driver.
Sadie Church:How, you know, how was your 1st week? Was how was your equipment when you checked into it? I was always very heavily involved in the orientation aspect, so I was always right there when the when the drivers were being seated in the truck site. I knew immediately if the truck was dirty, that a driver was getting put into, or if it broke down at the terminal, right? Those are problems that you often see really early out of the gate.
Sadie Church:What was the onboarding process like? What was the orientation process like? Was it a welcoming? Was it a warm welcome in orientation? Did we go over useful content?
Sadie Church:Were you treated well? Were you treated with respect while you were here? Did we give you good clean equipment that met your expectations? Did we set the right expectations? So those are all really, really important things within the 1st 30 days.
Sadie Church:Just making sure that you're setting the right expectations and you're you're monitoring your processes.
Aaron Craddock:So how do you one of the things is, like, you're handle you're handing drivers off from your recruiter to your recruiting manager to safety to dispatch. So how do you, how do you manage the whole process from the recruiter to then maybe recruiting manager, safety orientation after they hire? Like, how do you keep consistent communication with the driver? Because a lot of times that's handed off at fleets and that breaks down. So how do how do how do fleets navigate that?
Sadie Church:That's a really good question, Erin. I am a huge advocate for full cycle recruiting. My recruiter's jobs are not done once the orientation has been scheduled. It is their job to walk the applicant all the way through the process and meet the driver in orientation on day 1.
Aaron Craddock:That's awesome. And then how are they are they managing it after after that, even after the day 1?
Sadie Church:Yes. They typically do check ins week 1. How was your 1st week? And they because they built that really strong relationship with them through the orient or through the application through onboarding process, that their recruiter typically tends to become kind of like a little bit of their lifeline to the company. So so the recruiter is often the one that the driver would call if they're experiencing any issues.
Sadie Church:We also do introduce our retention team during orientation, and the retention team leads a pretty significant portion of the orientation, so they're building that relationship with the retention team as well.
Aaron Craddock:Okay. So because I've always kinda wondered how do you do that hand off?
Sadie Church:Yeah. I'm not a big fan of multiple departments touching the driver through the orientation onboarding portion. It can cause a lot of confusion as to, oh, who was who was my point of contact, who do I call. I got to my hotel, I don't have a room, I don't know who to call, I talked to so many different people. I like for them to know that they have one central point of contact throughout the process.
Aaron Craddock:Mhmm. That's awesome. What's another question I'm not asking about retention that you think we need to cover that's really gonna help the director of recruiting or just yeah. What are some tips?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So I think another thing that fleets can do, we always think in terms of strictly retention related stuff. We don't think in terms of how do we create, a community for our drivers. How do we keep them engaged? How do we communicate with them?
Sadie Church:We often hear that communication is, a a in orientation, one of the questions we ask every driver who comes into orientation, tell me some of your pain points in your last job. Over and over and over again, communication is one of the top things that people say is an issue. So how do we create a community where we can communicate with our drivers and also give them a place where they feel like they know what's going on within the company, and they feel connected, and they feel informed, and they feel involved? So I'm a very big fan of starting a Facebook group. It's free.
Sadie Church:Any fleet can do it. Any fleet regardless of size can have a retention department. It's just retooling the people you have and then maybe just a little bit of a different way and embracing free tools that are out there. So set up a private Facebook group if you haven't done so. Make it a community.
Sadie Church:I am a huge advocate for post as yourself. So when I would post in the Facebook group, I post to Sadie Church. I'm a human. I'm not a corporation. I'm a person behind this company.
Sadie Church:Right? And in that Facebook group, we share messages on here's new freight lanes coming on, here's the new customer that's coming in this area, And we also we also communicate the hard stuff. Hey. We just lost this account out of Houston. You're gonna if you live out of Houston, it's gonna be a little bit more of a struggle to get you home.
Sadie Church:We're working through it. We're working on identifying other customers in the area so that we can pick the pick similar or those lanes back up. So it's communicating before it becomes a problem. So we can we communicated stuff like that. It could be a safety message.
Sadie Church:It could be, hey. We're seeing an uptick in trailer inspections. Give us your recommendations for how to fix this, or, hey, we're hearing that this drop lot is an issue, you know, what are you seeing there? So we're asking them for feedback, we're allowing them to weigh in on things. We also use it to personalize one another.
Sadie Church:So if I wanted to talk about what I did for the hey. I did this really fun thing for the weekend. I got to go see my daughter. You know, tell me something fun you experienced in the last week or say something good. We would give driver shout outs in that Facebook group, but it wasn't all positive.
Sadie Church:We encourage drivers to share their pain points with us because at the end of the day, we can't fix what we don't know is broken. So allowing them that private space, that private Facebook group to share their concerns with us, and I will tell you that's something that the team monitored that page very, very, very closely. I it was the last thing I checked at night before I went to bed. It was the first thing I checked in the morning when I woke up. We wanted to identify problems or issues in real time and be able to adjust them as quickly as possible.
Sadie Church:So if it's 7 o'clock at night and something comes across, I'm I'm here, I'm sitting, I'm waiting on a load, I'm getting really frustrated, I haven't heard back, my dispatcher left for the day, I'm taking a screenshot of that post. I'm sending it directly to our 247 coverage. Hey. We need to get this driver load. We need to get him out of the area.
Sadie Church:See what we can do. Let's follow back up. I'm messaging the driver, hey, this has been sent to to our after hours team, they're working on this. So we we see you, we hear you, and we're addressing your your concerns as quickly as possible. So it's great for retention as well on that end.
Sadie Church:If dry if you're allowing drivers a safe space, a private space to voice their concerns, you're gonna going to hear their pain points, you're gonna be able to address them in real time. So that's a free tool. Another tool that I recommend, again, kind of going back to that communication, if you have that Facebook group, take advantage of those Facebook lives. We did a biweekly fleet call where we would have different members of the leadership team on the call each week, and that's when we would go over anything related to routes, customers, inspection blitzes coming up, you know, just new tools that are available to them, new staff and introductions. Anything going on within the business, we would address on those calls with our drivers.
Sadie Church:They could comment live. We would respond to their comments live. It gave them the opportunity to weigh in in real time. For the drivers who didn't have Facebook, because there are drivers who don't have Facebook. For the drivers who didn't have Facebook, we would download that Facebook video.
Sadie Church:We would email it every week to our entire fleet. So if you don't have Facebook, weren't able to attend, you still had access to the video. We also did a, monthly driver newsletter. Every newsletter had all those communications as well, kind of summarized. And then we also, in every single newsletter, had a survey, a poll survey, just to check the overall wellness of our fleet.
Sadie Church:Again, address any pain points or issues if someone wants to report something anonymously that those monthly surveys allowed them the opportunity to do that. So those are free tools at your disposal, your biggest your biggest investment in that issue, the time that you that you spend in that group, hosting, communicating, and following up on concerns. Another very inexpensive, I believe it was $15 a month, thing that we did for our fleet was we created a Discord community. A lot, we were learning that, again, those questions that we ask in orientation when we're getting to know one another, we asked drivers, you know, what do you like to do in your free time? And we heard a lot of drivers playing, you know, online gaming.
Sadie Church:So they have plenty of time to do it on the road. Right? Play video games and, so one thing we thought would be fun would be to create our own, online gaming community. And, so we created our own discord group, and we encourage drivers to drivers and staff to join because we wanted the the 2 commingling. Again, remember, we wanna humanize one another, and we are people behind a corporation.
Sadie Church:So I wanted staff and drivers, anyone who is interested in gaming to join this community, and they can play online video games together. So just an another way to build a community and and be human
Aaron Craddock:That's awesome. Those are all just gold tips. Yeah. I've never even heard of, like, somebody using a Facebook group that well and leveraging it that way. I would think one of the concerns would be, if I'm thinking objections, like, if you're not gonna actually address the problems, it's probably not good to open that that door.
Aaron Craddock:Absolutely agree. If you're gonna address them, then it makes sense. So, it sounds like you would have to have a ton of alignment with, hey, we're really gonna help the drivers and put them first. This is gonna be uncomfortable. We're gonna hear, you know, what we're doing wrong.
Aaron Craddock:And and we have to address it. Because if if you open the door to feedback, but then don't address it, then it just reinforces the bad. So that's really cool that you were able to address it, like, live and on the fly.
Sadie Church:Yeah. I mean, there are always gonna be people who you no matter what, you can't make them happy. Right? And that's always going to happen, but I will say if you are on top of it and you are addressing things and following back up, here's what we did, here's how we we addressed this, you will get fewer and fewer of those.
Aaron Craddock:That's awesome. And how did that how did that impact retention, like, by implementing that?
Sadie Church:So I didn't have the previous data before I started, so I can't really give you an honest answer.
Aaron Craddock:Okay. The, I can just think of even in terms of just driver morale and referrals and just crazy impact there.
Sadie Church:Yeah. I mean, we were on a wait list for several months, so we really created such a unique cool community.
Aaron Craddock:That's neat. The last thing I want to make sure we cover, before we get off is particularly, like, what are you doing with recruit hire retain? I know a lot of us have seen seen you on social media talking about the new venture. Yeah. Can you can you kind of explain what recruit hire retain is and and who you can help?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So we are a consulting company. We help in addressing any recruiting, marketing, or retention concerns fleets might have, whether it is to reduce your overall cost per hire, reduce your time to hire, take a look at your marketing, how can we, you know, suggest improvements to that, Or even just, hey, we have a really small team, but we really wanna focus on retention. Can you give us some ways that we can work to retain our fleet? So all things recruiting, marketing, and retention related, we specialize in in helping fleets just, hire dry hire more drivers at a lower cost and retain those drivers once they get them in the door.
Aaron Craddock:Yeah. And you've built, like, a rock star team really quickly of partners
Sadie Church:Yes.
Aaron Craddock:In the business. Can you share a little bit about who you have on your team and and why you're excited about that?
Sadie Church:Yeah. So we have Mike Kobal, Dave Renfro, and Ellen Voya on our team. Dave and Mike both have, many, many years of experience in, recruiting and transportation. Mike's very strong background is with owner operators. Several years ago, Mike even owned his own fleet, so has a lot of experience with owner operators.
Sadie Church:We each kind of different bring different skill sets, which is, I think, really, really complement one another. Dave, has worked for several large carriers over the years and also has a safety background. So he kind of brings in that safety component as well. Ellen has a very diverse background as well, worked in trucking as well before on the carrier side, and then started the Women in Trucking Association. And, just recently stepped down from her role as president of Women in Trucking Association, so we're super excited to have her on the team as well, her her perspective on, you know, a lot of companies wanna grow their female driver fleet.
Sadie Church:So having Ellen on it and having Ellen on the team will support that as well. So really, really great team. I'm super excited to have them on board. I think the unique thing that this gives us in our company is that when you hire, recruit, hire, retain, you aren't getting just one consultant's expertise and feedback and suggestions, you're getting a whole team of very experienced people. So I think that that's kind of unique to what we offer is that you really get an elite team of of experts in the industry.
Aaron Craddock:That's awesome. I love that because you're able to come alongside and partner with the fleet and help them just from, I mean, combine decades decades of experience, like on the applicant tracking system utilization side Mhmm. On, like, making sure you're using that on the retention side, on process, on safety, you know, mitigation of risk, and things like that. Like, like, those are all just really hot topics, and I think you guys can add a add a ton of value. And, I've even just heard from some people that have already worked with you guys just speak really positively of of how you've how you've worked with them and how you've really helped them.
Aaron Craddock:So I'm super excited to see how you guys, yeah, just continue to grow and see your vision, become become reality.
Sadie Church:Thank you. I appreciate that.
Aaron Craddock:Yeah. So that's that's all we have for today's show. Thank you so much, Sadie, for joining me. I know we've wanted to have this happen for a while. I'm super excited we were able to get you on.
Aaron Craddock:So thank you for your time.
Sadie Church:Thank you so much for having me on the show.
Aaron Craddock:Thank you for joining us today. Our goal with the Hire Truckers podcast is to provide industry insights, marketing trends, and motivation to level up your recruiting game. If we added value, take a few seconds to share this with your network. Have a great week!