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Every Monday Evening at 8pm Eastern Time, the W3GMS/R Crew get together on the repeater at 146.985Mhz and discuss technical questions and sometimes do lessons related to Ham Radio for newer Operators to learn from experienced Elmers. The Workbench was set up to be a safe place for any technical questions to get asked and good answers to be given.
Good evening, 985. Welcome to the 985 workbench.
I'm Chuck and my call is NA3CW, tonight's host
for the workbench. I'm located in beautiful
edge of town, Parksburg, Pennsylvania. We
meet every Monday at 8 p.m. on the W3GMS Parksburg
repeater, 146.985 MHz. The PL tone to access
the repeater is 100 Hz. For those who use tone
squelch on receive, the repeater transmits
a Welch tone of 94.8 Hertz. Newcomers are very
welcome. We encourage all stations to check
in. Take a look at the repeater website located
at www.w3gmsrepeater.com. It has lots of information
including technical articles, pictures of 985
users in action, sometimes in inaction, and
repeater etiquette and history. And please be
aware that on occasions The repeater experiences
intermod interference and this is one of those
occasions. Please run maximum power, give
it all you got, or be prepared to check in digitally
through EchoLink or All-Star. We want to hear
you. To be able to use EchoLink or All-Star
985, you need to register with us. Directions
for doing so can be found on the website, w3gmsrepeater.com.
Also, when intermod is present before starting
a long transmission, give a short call. Am I
getting in okay? And I'll confirm that if
you are and otherwise not. And then you can
share your longer comments. And please do
that. Please do that. Here on the workbench
we focus on answering general questions of
radio theory and operation. Additionally, we
invite each station to briefly comment on your
Emmett's radio activity in the past week. When
checking in, please indicate if you have a
question for the workbench. If you don't have
a question, still check in. After all stations
have checked in, we will first share what we've
done this past week using a roundtable format.
Please write down the call of the station that
checks in right after you. When you have finished
your comments, turn the mic over to that station.
Once we have all made our comments, we will
start the question and answer portion of the
workbench, operating it as a directed net.
I will call on a station that indicated having
a question and then for stations who wish to
respond to that question. Wait to be recognized
by net control, me, before beginning a transmission.
This will help us handle the questions efficiently
and keep the net running smoothly. At times,
it helps for two stations to be able to pass
the mic back and forth to help clarify the
situation and pass information. Feel free to
do that as needed and then pass it back to
net control. Some things to remember. Never
get involved in a land war in Asia. And don't
be too quick to talk. Pause a couple seconds
before hitting the press to talk switch. This
is good repeater etiquette and the pauses are
especially helpful to those on All Star and
Echo Link. When you do click the push to talk
button, wait a second before starting to talk.
We don't want to miss what you have to say
at first, such as the first few letters of
your call. It takes a moment for the repeater
to process your PL tone. And also the repeater
has a three minute timer. And if you talk for
more than three minutes without letting up
on your mic button, the repeater completely
shuts down, locks up, and says no until you
release your push to talk switch. So every
two to three minutes, release your mic button
just for a moment. And then you can continue.
Before we begin, I want to say thanks to all
our workbench hosts. They're the ones who make
this happen. If you may be interested in hosting
the workbench, please contact Jim, AF3Z, or
any of us, and we'll help you get started.
And lastly, please join Phil, KC3CIB, this Thursday
at 8 p.m. for the 985 roundtable. I mean, all
the best people meet there. So at this time,
we're gonna start the check-in process. Remember
to indicate if you have a question for the group.
Digital stations using Echo, Link, or All-Star,
I'm going to leave a long pause to make it easier
for you to check in. And so please be patient.
I'm going to wait. Digital stations, please
call now. This is NH3CW.
AC3AAW3H. A.A.308. Short time. questions.
Number three, India, Lima, Sierra, no question.
W3MFB.
and I'll get back to me. Or he'll come back.
Okay, let me jump in here. So far, we had a
double and a triple, but I got Casey3WWC, I've
got LeonAA3LH, and the long lost Travis, the
other ILS, and W3MFB with a possible question.
Do we have any other digital stations? EchoLink
or All-Star, please call.
think we got all the digitals. So everybody
else, RF or digital, please call NA-3CW.
W-A-3-V-E-E, no question.
AC3RFG, Jim in Malvern, no questions.
3QP, no questions. This Whiskey Alpha 3, King
Fox Tango. No question. W3KZG, no
SQI, question.
3 Zulu. Follow up, no questions.
Juliet Golf Bravo, no question.
Good bunch. think we had a double. I'm not sure
if we backfilled it or not. I'll read you off
what I have. And please write down the station
at least, if you don't write them all down,
at least write down the station that follows
you so you know who to send it to. I got KC3WWC.
I got AA3LH. Travis, remind me what's your prefix
again?
November 3. You talk too soon, I just have number
three.
I keep waiting to talk. November 3, November
3.
Okay, thank you. N3ILS, W3MFB, WA3VEE, KC3RFG,
W3QP, WA3KFT, W3KZG, KC3OOK, and there
was a double in there, KC3SQI with a question,
AF3Z with a follow-up, and KV3JGB. Do we
miss anybody? Please call in HRECW. HCRW, no
question.
Okay, we'll add tail gunner, W8CRW, and good
evening to UCR. Okay, I think we've got everybody.
So we will now begin our round table part portion,
and we will start with John. KC3WWC, this is
NA3CW.
Hey Chuck, thanks. This is KC3, WWC. John
in Landisville. My week in radio has been
kind of light. I did apply for a list of vanity
calls, so we'll see if I get one of those shorter
ones, which will be nicer for DXing and a lot
less CW to send. So we'll see what happens.
I don't know that much else happened. A little
bit of POTA here and there. I'll over to Leon,
Alpha Alpha 3 Lima Hotel. This is KC3WWC.
Thank you, Mr. W W's. I see you. Yes. I had
a lot going this past week. Last week we were
out in Colorado and we, we set up to talk back
here. Uh, I also learned going out there in
July, July is, uh, the gray line does not work
with you like it does if you're out in May
or in, or in September. We learned that real
quick. But we were out in Colorado. We talked
back here. That was a big thing again to do.
It was great to do that, to hear you guys back
here. So we're glad to do that. All right, it
goes over to November 3, ILS, International
Landing Service, AA308.
Thanks, Leon and the group. It's good to be
back on. I want to say greetings from Seattle,
Washington. business. I travel back first thing
tomorrow morning. For Ham Radio this week,
I actually got to activate two parks. One was
just down the road from me where my hotel
is. And the second one, I drove across the
Canadian border and was in British Columbia
yesterday and activated Peace Arch Provincial
Park. So now I have that in my books. So other
than that, that's about it. So I'll hand it
over to Whiskey 3, Mike Fox Baker. Take it
away.
W3MFB here, let's see here. Mostly talking on
repeaters, a little bit of HF, but that's about
it, busy busy weekend. So I'll pass it over
to Ron, W-A-3-V-E-E, W3MFB. Mike, thank you.
W3MFB and the group WA3 VEE over here in Westchester.
All very, very good. I'll make a quick, nice
list here tonight, Chuck. And thanks, by the
way, for sitting in the captain's chair with
the rest of us back in coach class. Excellent.
So thanks for driving the bus. And Leon, it
was a pleasure to work you on 40 meters. I did
send you a QSL card. I'm not sure if you got
it yet or not, but you get one of those very
coveted VEE QSL cards. Ha ha, very coveted
indeed. but nonetheless, all very good. And
Travis, it's great to hear you. And yes,
let's see, 1976 was the last time that I was
in Blaine, Washington and crossed the border
there at Peace Arch. And I don't know if you
got over to a little tiny piece of the United
States in that area that you have to go through
Canada to get to it is called Point Roberts.
So something if you're coming back tomorrow,
but if you get out there again, if you haven't
already, check it out. It's rather interesting.
So Point Roberts it's called. So a little
tiny peninsula that sticks down from Canada
and crosses what is it, the 47th parallel
or whatever the border is there. So very interesting.
But you're in a beautiful area, as you well
know, and very good on the parks. So over here
what I'm doing is migrating a lot of my equipment
from my old 2005 Sienna to a 2020 Sienna, used
of course obviously, but very low mileage,
38,000 for a Toyota, that's almost nothing.
So migrating equipment slowly. So little scant
on 985 right now on RF, and I've got a bad ethernet
cable on my... note but once that gets replaced
at least I'll have of all-star so that's what's
going on here and let me turn it over to looks
like Jim KC3 RFG over there in Malvern WA3
VEE
This is KC3RFG. Thank you, Ron, for passing
over to me, Jim, in Malvern. And thank you
to Chuck and A3CW for hosting this evening.
Not a whole lot going on this past week for
me other than the normal nets and repeaters,
as was mentioned. Although I did want to mention
a really nice contact yesterday afternoon to
Venezuela on 10 meters. 10 meters is still
kicking really nice. So if you catch the openings,
it's been great. Very enjoyable. about it
from here so I will pass it on over to Tim.
W3QP from KC3RFG. KC3, RFG, and the group,
this is W3QP. Got out to do two soda summits
this weekend. I was down in Virginia visiting
my brothers and did some little ones, but it
was nice to get out and on the air. Currently
working on QSO cards from that outing. That
is all for me, so over to WA3KFT, this is W3QP.
W-A-3-Q-P, W-A-3-K-F-T. Yep, 10 meters was
open today. We talked to Florida. We have
a retired group on 28-4-3-5, one o'clock, from
one o'clock to two o'clock. And Ken, down
in Florida, monitors that frequency, knowing
that we get on between one and two. And today
the band was open. I had a laugh. His signal
from Florida was stronger than George's signal
from Plymouth meeting today. So we had fun.
Otherwise, we're dusting off some of the older
gear and playing with it and what have you and
setting things up. W3KZG to take it. WA3KFT.
W3KZG
Nothing this week in ham radio for me, just
lots of trailer work, trying to get my camper
together for the... Well, this year's almost
over, so maybe I'll have it ready for next
year. But nothing for me, so I'll send it over
to Bill, KC3OOK, take it away, this is W3KZJ.
W3KZGKC3OK, thanks Scott and Chuck, thanks
for taking the chair tonight. I had to run
over too. I guess I'll start with that. Most
of my radio activity's been here in the shop
doing woodwork. I made the base for the lab
table, got that done today.
We're working projects will be done. the usual
985.
on the Red Rose repeater net. it for me and
let's see I turn it over to Wayne KC3 SQI
KC3 OOK
Thank you, Bill. KC-3-O-OK. This is KC-3-S-Q-I.
Still working on moving all of the antennas
over to the new mast. And that's part of
my question for tonight. So that's about all
I was doing. This is I had family here last
week, son. daughter-in-law and granddaughters.
So that was my week. So I will turn it over
to Jim, AF3Z. This is KC3SQI.
Alright, thank you Wayne and just to be sure,
Chuck, am I getting it okay? You're doing just
fine, Jim. Yeah, I checked in on RF as well.
It sounded like it was gone. Anyway, yeah,
good evening everybody. AF3Z here. And my wake
was pretty quiet on radio. My normal kind of
CW stuff and the 985 thing. And my main other
thing was more support services and I'll talk
about that in my follow-up. So I think that's
about it here. So Matt. AV3JGB, AF3Z.
Thanks Jim. Chuck, I neglected to mention on
mobile, am I getting an RA? KB3JGB? Yeah,
you're rock solid. pretty close to the repeater
at this point so my my week radio is pretty
much today I'm coming back from Charlotte and
I On the way back on North Carolina, I was
calling frequency on two meter. I was trying
to check in repeaters. Couldn't get anybody
in North Carolina. The whole way I drove 100
miles there. It was inconceivable. But I got
up to Virginia and around the Roanoke area I
got a couple guys on the calling frequency
and got a couple repeaters to do some chatting.
So that was actually pretty cool. be traveling
through and making contact in a different state.
Well, I am in a different state. So that's
my weekend radio. I hand it over to W8CRW.
Thank you very much. W8CRW, good evening guys.
Thanks Chuck for taking the net tonight. let's
see, normal stuff. 985 activities, Red Rose
activities, Salem activities. That's it for
me. Chuck, back to you. W8CRW.
Thanks, CR. Before we continue, do we have
any late check-ins for the workbench? Please
call on A3CW. W3FES Fred in Coatesville.
KI-60M.
Give it a long pause in case we have any digitals.
Good evening, W3FES and KI6OM. So Fred, that
was your week in Ham Radio.
Not too bad, I had to rearrange some.
Yeah, very fine. W3FESKI6OM. Yeah, the name
here is Dave, located in Kennet Square with
some of the folks on here, but not everyone.
I think this is first time I've been checking
in on the roundtable. Yeah, as far as activity
this week, not a whole lot going on on HF,
but I've linked my 220 repeater to the pre-start
network. It's been connected up pretty much
first thing in the morning while I can babysit
and then disconnect it towards the late afternoon.
If anybody's got 220, you can get into it.
And the other thing was I finally got my new
Pennsylvania license plate, call sign plate,
so with the new 250 year anniversary plates.
So 13 bucks to get your call sign on the new
plate. Dude, I did have a question too, so
probably me is having a question. I'll turn
it back to net control, because I'm not sure
who's next on the roundtable. NA3CW, KI60M.
Thanks Dave, you're the tail gunner, so we
got everybody. So by review, this is NH3CW,
review, Mike MFB, do you have a question?
I remember it now. Thank you. Yeah, got Wayne
down as a question. I have Dave as a question.
And Jim, you said a follow-up, right?
Okay, well, I have my usual answer to your ham
radio week, 985 activities as usual, and pre-net
control for the PMAM net, although I didn't
get into the net itself at 6.30 yesterday because
of other commitments. There you go. So we're
now going to turn to the questions and answers.
We encourage all stations to make comments,
observations, and or share experiences. And
don't assume your level of expertise and knowledge
isn't enough. We can all learn from each other
and contribute to our discussions. So please
feel free to pick up the mic and have some
fun. And I say this every time and I'll keep
saying it. Sometimes what you think is a small,
dumb, simple question can have a very sophisticated
and thought-provoking answer. So never hold
back what you think is too elementary a question,
because sometimes it could be really worth
a good learning experience. Or it's your big
chance to stump the chumps. So our first question
comes from Mike there in beautiful downtown
Thorndale, W3MFB. Time to stop the chumps.
is NH3CW. 3CW in the group, W3MFP. Awesome,
awesome. Well, I'm glad the people that I know
could probably help me out with this can answer
the question that are here tonight. And Fred,
good to hear you. And Dave, hey man, been a
long time. Good to hear you too. Question of
the night. All right, so most of you guys know
I got the Yehsu G90 20 watt radio, right? for
HFs, 160 through 10. Now, when I go out and
about, I got power poles on the back, so I
hook it up to my 30 amp hour lithium iron phosphate
battery, Totally overkill for that radio. Specs,
transmission for the Zygmunt G90, 6 amps max
on transmit. I guess if you're doing the full
20 or whatever. And then on receive, not bad
at all, 700 milliamps. Okay, so six amps max
on the transmit, on full power. My question
is, what kind of, I want to get a smaller battery.
So maybe Tim, I don't know, whoever, but I want
to get a smaller battery than the 30 amp hour.
Now the 30 amp hour's pretty light. Bio I know,
I'd like to stay to the same brand or something
near it, but something smaller. Do I need a
six amp battery or should I get a 10 or a nine
or a 12? That's the part I don't really remember.
I guess it depends on how long you wanna operate
for, things like that. let's just say, most
of the day and night if I'm out camping and
if I'm just tootling around here, a couple hours
here and there. So that's the question. What
kind of battery, lithium battery should I get?
for the Zygu that's drawing 6AMS max on the
Transmit. NA 3CW, W3MFB in the group.
Very good, Mike. A really good question. And
what I found in my working experience is anything
to do with batteries is probably more complex
than you think. I mean, even a little AA.
When I worked with Animus, we made insulin
pumps that would run over a month on one AA
battery. I had no idea how a AA primary battery
was so busy. gentlemen and any ladies that
may be present. Do we have an answer or comments
for Mike? Please call NHRECW. I could start
us off,
Okay Ron, and there was another station that
doubled with Ron? RC3RFG.
Very good, gotcha Jim. So, uh, Ron, please proceed.
commercial. Excellent, excellent, excellent.
If it's your indulgence, Chuck, I will turn
it right over to Jim. Overall, yeah, you're
right, Chuck. Batteries are never that straightforward.
There's never really a clear answer. And Mike,
you kind of started to answer your own question
by saying that it depends on how long you're
going to, and you said operate, more like transmit.
Obviously, that's where the, and you stated
it, and it's pretty obvious, that's where the
consumption really is. So. You could probably
get away with something about half the size,
probably a 15 amp hour battery. And it depends
on how the manufacturer describes discharge
as a start. There are many other factors, but
that one comes to mind right off the bat.
Usually with a lithium iron phosphate battery,
you get to a certain point, say, 11 volts
or something like that and all of sudden your
radio stops working. That would be considered
in some circles as a full discharge, not to
zero, but to that point where the battery
is no longer really producing a useful amount
of energy. So depending upon what that point
is and looking at how long you're going to
transmit, that will determine at least capacity-wise
the size of your battery. If I were doing a
20 watt radio like that, probably a 15 amp
hour, just as a pull it out of the air guess
would do it. The other thing is, if that is
one factor, that's one factor to consider, the
other is convenience and weight. Just very
quickly, add my radio on the bicycle before
all start. What I did was I had a 9 amp hour
battery for a radio that I would run, a 5 watt
radio, and that just lasted and lasted and
lasted. So I don't know if I'm really answering
the question, but just some guidelines, and
then I'll turn it over to Jim. KC3RFG WA3VEA.
WA3VEE KC3 RFG. Thank you Ron. What Ron and
Chuck have said is perfect and it's really
relative. That's the problem. The only reason
I wanted to chime in Mike was because I have
a G90 and I have used it a lot, portable and
run it all day on a Dakota lithium 10 amp hour
battery and barely got it the third discharge.
Now that being said, really is due to how
much you transmit and I don't transmit. for
very long. don't do those five to eight minute
transmit QSOs. I'm usually on for a minute or
two at a time and then on to the next contact.
So it's really on and off use, but it runs all
day on that 10 amp hour with no problem whatsoever.
So I can tell you that from experience. Also,
as you know, Mike, the G90 will run on like
nine volts. So it doesn't care when it goes
low. With some other batteries, circuitry will,
or radio transs... circuitry will shut off when
it gets below 12. It doesn't even like 12.
The G90 will keep on running and as you know
it'll tune anything. I've seen it tune a fire
extinguisher so. Yeah so that's my comment.
The 10 amp hour works great for me on the G90
and no problems whatsoever for all day use and
still not discharged yet. So alright back to
NET KC3RG, back to NA3CW.
Thanks guys, do we have any other comments?
And I'm going to do a long wait here to see
if there's any comments from the digital side.
So any digital comments, call any 3CW.
Okay, nothing from the digital side. I've had
comments that we don't wait long enough for
the digital stations, that's why I did that.
All right, do we have any other comments
for Mike here? Please call NHECW. 3QP.
Go ahead, Jim.
This is W3QP. I agree with what everybody else
has said. I guess the two things I'll throw
out there. All batteries have a max discharge
rate. And I looking real quick at the BioNOs.
tend to be, the max discharge rate tends to
be double the capacity. So the smallest battery
you could get and still get six amps out of
the battery would be a six amp hour. So if
you do want to be able to do the 20 watts, I
would say get no smaller than 6 amp hours.
The asterisk is, of course, it depends on what
a particular battery is rated for. The lithium
ions tend to have a much higher rating. The
iron phosphates have a much lower rating,
relatively speaking. Not good or bad, just
is what it is. The other thing is there are
a number of different averages out there, depending
on what mode you're doing. And there are spreadsheets
that you can get where you put in how much time
you want to be listening, how much time you
think you're going to be transmitting. It will
use the ratios that people tend to have. And
it can calculate either how much amp hours you
need for a particular time frame or how long
you can transmit for a particular amp hour battery.
It's all averages, so you're going to get an
average answer, which may or may not suit you.
But that might give you some help if you Google
around. There's some YouTube guys that walk
through it, and there's some spreadsheets out
there. That is all for me. So back over to NA3CW.
This is W3QP.
Thanks, Tim. You are reading my mind a little
bit. Any other comments for Mike before I
make my comments?
Okay, this is NHRECW. The, uh, you brought
up the thing about maximum discharge current.
I have not done a study on lithium iron phosphate
batteries, so I don't know. I know with lead
acids, and actually with most chemistries, if
there's a term called C, which is capacity,
which is the amp hour rating, so this 30 amp
hour rating would have a C of 30. And a very
safe... and discharge current on I know lead
acids and a lot of other batteries is 0.1
C. So the bigger the battery the higher the
safe just continuous discharge current and
the higher the charge. that one C is always
safe. otherwise, if you're going to pull it
hard, then yeah, you've got to look up that
particular battery and that particular manufacturer
and see what the maximum discharge rate is.
And also, it affects maximum current rate,
too. And on charging, if again, like with
lead acids, Slow charge is friendlier than
fast charge because you're actually putting
back material onto the plates. And so if you
do it fast, it tends to pile them up and you
end up with a bulgy battery and early failure.
blasting a battery either in or out is not
a happy thing. of course, look up the specs.
Go by the manufacturer for the C rate and against
you know, the rate against C, whether it's
.1 or .5 or whatever, .5C, .1C, and that sort
of thing. So Mike, how we beat that one to
death? W3MSB NA3CW. Oh, you're making me laugh.
No, thank you guys. I really appreciate it.
Why ask Google or YouTube when you have the
985 crew? That's why I like asking the questions
here. A real world experience from people I
trust. All right, gentlemen, thank you very
much. So Ron, 15 amp. And I understand the
operating. For me, it's mostly, you know. like
Jim said, making the contacts and then sometimes
chewing the rag a little bit, you know, which
you guys know I like to do, especially here.
So the 10 amp from Jim, good for your podas
or activations or whatever. Tim got that for
the, you know, the six amp or more. Yeah, I'll
probably go like, you know, like the 10 or so.
also was... Ron said about weight. Yeah, just
kind of looking for something lighter because
I throw everything in my backpack. Whoa, talk
about an Irma. I hope you might be in hurt Chuck.
You're rock solid. Sorry, I'm on RF now. Yeah,
I just throw everything in my backpack that
I need in the backpack. It's getting heavy.
It's getting heavy. So I just try to lighten
the load a little bit. So I really appreciate
it. and thank you for the information. And I
have some research obviously to do. thanks
for the real world experience. So I'll pass
it back to Chuck so we can continue on with
Wayne, believe. NA 3CW, W3MFB. Thank you guys.
Very good, Mike, and a very relevant question
indeed. Wayne, it's yours. KC3SQI, NA3CW.
Thank you Chuck. NA-3CW, this is KC-3SQI. Okay,
for my new antenna mast, my tilt-over mast,
I am going to put the connectors and the...
remote antenna switch and the stuff like that
at the bottom of the mast into a weather protected
box. I ain't gonna say weather proof because
there's no such thing but... And this is
a plastic box. So if you were putting in, putting
this in, would you put it flat in the ground
beside the antenna, or would you put it on
the leg of the antenna, since I have a...
lawn people that run some rather large mowers
and I'm not sure what the weight on this
box would be before it crunches. So would
you put it on the ground or would you put it
on the leg? Back to you, NA-3CW, KC-3SQI.
Thank you, Wayne. Interesting question. it
undermines being obnoxious tonight. So, do
we have any responses for Wayne? Please call
on A3CW.
Okay, I got VEE and somebody double with him.
HCRW.
Okay, we'll start with Ron and then, Ron, turn
it over to CR. Chuck, N-E-3CW and the group
WA-3VE. It's kind of a similar situation here,
Wayne, if I understand your question, it's
primarily about the box on the ground or on
the mast, or on the leg rather. I would put
it on the leg for accessibility, for maintenance
and everything else, and it sounds like...
sounds like you have some lawn maintenance
folks there that might get too close also.
Share what I have out back here. Like I said,
very similar. I also have a tilt over mast
that you're listening to the antenna, which
is mounted on it right now out back. And
it is in a bed. of Pachycandra and next to
some Arbavita. So when I get out, I don't have
a grass cutting service, but when I get out
there, it's not even close. So you might want
to, you might want to, for, I don't know how
the coax is running also, but mine ends up
on the ground, but it's in the bed. So it's
protected. So that's one thing you may want
to consider some kind of protection there, some
kind of proximity limitation thing. little
fence or something to keep the lawn mower folks
away from your transmitting facility there.
The other thing is that the boxes I would
have would be at almost eye level, or at least
chest level, and they would have inside, they
would have a blitz bug or a polyphaser, some
kind of lightning arrester, and that would
be on the mast that the there's a pole that
the mast that tilts down actually fastens to
and that gives it stability. It would be on
that stabilizing pole. So it would not be
of course on the mast, but it on the stabilizing
pole. So I'd have to disconnect the coax if
I were to lower the mast. So my vote would
be not only to keep it off the ground, but for
maintainability and accessibility. thing going
on what your situation is there probably have
it at least at chest level. C.R.A. W.A. C.R.W.
W.A.3 V.E.E. Thanks Ron. Wayne I have a similar
thought. My antenna feed is in one of those
I forgot the name of the the real name but it's
one of those plastic boxes that snaps closed
and it's watertight and I drilled holes for
the antenna connections. And it's mounted
up about four feet and I have it behind a couple
of boulders so you can't hit it. mean, it's
physically impossible to hit and that way I
don't have to worry about the lawn machine
taking it out. Back to you Chuck, WHCRW.
Thank you, CR. Do we have any other comments
for Wayne?
holding out there in case we had any digitals.
Yeah, would definitely, for the NH3CW, would
definitely get it up off the ground for a number
of reasons. Everything from, know, moisture
to ants to, you know, lawn mowers to whatever.
The other thing is, if you do put it up
on the mast a little bit and have cables running
up to it, by all means, get them well protected.
and close them in a quarter inch thick PVC
or something thick and durable that it can
be hit or weed-whacked or whatever. boulders
is a great idea. So back to you, Wayne, on
KC3SQI and HRECW.
Okay, thank you for the input. Yeah, was looking
at putting it, you know, dug into the ground
a little bit and then I go, wait a minute, that's
a plastic box. I don't think I want to do that.
So you have convinced me that I think I need
to put it up on the...
stabilizing leg and we'll go from there. Thank
you much. Back to you Chuck. NA-3CW, this
is KC-3SQI. And also with your plastic box,
I'm thinking it will appreciate being painted.
I don't know if you have that in mind. Either
clear paint or white paint or something that
will give it more of a UV barrier. I have found
that that really helps a lot of things. So
something to keep in mind. So Jim, AF3Z, you
have some... have some things for us, please
go. This is NHRECW.
Okay, very good. Now I'm on EchoLink. Founded
like some strange squelch tales there. So anyway,
just in case. Good evening again, everybody.
Last week I mentioned something in JimRFG.
This was a question for you, but you weren't
on last week. And just very quickly, I had
an interesting electrical phenomena to me when
I was using a shop vac to vacuum up water.
in the basement and the sump pump would run
at the same time. Normally it would draw current
and the voltage drops and other things dim or
slow down. But this time when the sump pump
would come on, the motor in the shop vac would
speed up and go faster. And as soon as the
sump shut off, it would slow back down again.
So I mentioned that curious problem here and
several people, three I think. all agreed that
it sounded like a bad or unstable neutral coming
from the power company into the house neutral
line 110 on either side with the neutral in
the middle and that it should be cared for
because you can end up cooking you know as
voltages go bonkers like that you can end up
cooking circuit boards and things and stuff
like that so that was Tuesday What night is
this? Monday night. And Tuesday I tried calling
my electrician, local guy here. He got back
to me right around 5 o'clock or so on Tuesday.
And he said, call PPL first because I see
from looking at the satellite view your line
is buried underground. And he said, check with
them first. So, okay. So Wednesday morning
I called PPL right when they opened up shop.
and talked to a woman, I wasn't sure she heard
me, but she obviously passed the word along
at around two o'clock in the afternoon and
the truck pulled into the driveway. And I explained
it to him and he said, we can check that quickly.
And so he put his stuff on the, on the line
and he said, yep, it's our neutral line. And
interesting to me as well, he then later in
the day brought a, like a rolling cart and
it looks pretty heavy. It's got big tires on
it. And a device, it's going to take about
a month to get a crew out here to bury a new
line for me. So he said we can fix it temporarily.
And my guess, I didn't ask him, but I think
basically it's a transformer. So the two 110
sides of the line coming in are on the primary.
And then there's, I guess, like a center tapped
secondary that provides a new neutral line
to the house. So anyway, that thing's sitting
out back and there's a thing that fits right
between, I think it's between the meter and
the house. It just gets sandwiched in there.
So anyway, that all went very well and PPL
got right on it. so things are better here.
My microwave had been acting up and I thought,
what's wrong with it? My dryer would start sort
of slow and struggle to start. Oh no, the dryer's
going bad. Multiple things like that. Sure
enough, that one problem solved all those various
things, but it took me a while to catch on to
it at all until I heard the vacuum cleaner
speed up when it should slow down and got help
here. So thanks to everybody here. that's my
report. Life is good again. Back to you, Chuck,
NA-3CW. This is AF-3Z. Jim, AF-3Z, this is
NA-3CW. Ciao. Yep, was a good follow-up, Jim.
Thank you for that. And over to Dave. KI6OM,
what's your question? This is an A3CW. Yeah,
very good there, Chuck. Just to make sure that
I'm making it in. Also, I don't have a technical
question. It has to do with FTA operation.
Just want to make sure that's consistent with
the net tonight. This is the technical net.
The rags unit is on Thursday night. So this
is the workbench and you're coming in dead
solid. Please present your question. Yeah,
very good. So, I do have a lot of FT8 operation
and more recently been running FT8 digital modes
on 6 meters. And, you know, 6 meter band's
been, when it's open, it's terrific band. But
I was, I received an email from my ham,
a couple of states away, who scolded me for
how I was operating on FT8 6 meters. He says
the reason for this note is to suggest that
when you decode other six meter FDH stations
in your area calling DX or calling CQDX that
you transmit in sync with them. He says when
the band's open to these and he goes on and
explains it and then he says when a strong
station in your area is transmitting during
your listening sequence, it can push the much
weaker DX signals down into the noise, reducing
your ability to copy them. So basically what
he was doing was saying, try to figure out
who my local stations are in the area on six
meters and then whether you're transmitting
on your first odd or even to transmit in sync
with them. And that kind of had my head spinning
on how FTA actually works. And I've never been
able to get a straight answer. I've done the
AI searches and AI couldn't figure it out.
So I figured I'd bring it up on the net tonight
and get some thoughts. I'll turn it back to
you there, Chuck, and you can direct it, KI-61.
Thanks Dave. Well, that is one subject I
am absolutely, totally, and completely unqualified
to answer. So somebody help us. If you have
any comments for Dave, please call on A3CW.
3QP Go ahead, Jim.
Chuck, this is W3QP. Take this with some salt,
because it's been a while since I've read up
on the latest operating practices. But in regards
to transmitting in sync with the DX station,
or let me rephrase that, on the same frequency.
If you're transmitting on the same frequency
as everybody else, it's much more of a battle
for that DX station to hear you. If you find
a clear bit of spectrum that isn't the frequency
that he's transmitting on, I don't see an
issue with using that. It increases your odds
of being heard. You know, it's possible you're
stepping on somebody you can't hear, but you
can't hear them. You have no way of knowing
that. I question that bit of advice. As for
the the the round a round B transmitting
if I'm transmitting on round a you have to respond
to me on round B if you respond on round
a I'll never hear you because I'm transmitting
so I'm not entirely sure what he's getting
at with that My best guess would be if there
is a strong Station near you and you want
to call CQ Calling CQ with him or opposite
of him may have an effect on how well you're
heard outside of the area and how well you hear
stations calling back. But that would be if
you're calling CQ, not if I'm calling CQ. If
that helps, maybe I misunderstood the question.
That is all for me. This is W3QP, back to NET.
Quick clarification. Go ahead, Dave, you guys
go back and forth. Yeah, W3QPKI 611, thanks
for the invite. I agree with you 100%. Just
for clarification, when operating FT8, you can
see the signals on the waterfall and my standard
practice is to not transmit over any stations
over anybody's waterfall. So technically I
am frequency offset from everybody else in that
chunk of bandwidth. And the other scenario
to answer your question is, yes, it was when
I was calling CQ, I was scolded for calling
out a sequence. So that was the scenario, just
for better clarification. I'm back in it. Okay,
I6-1.
KC3WWC.
This is W3QP. I certainly didn't mean to say
that you were calling on anybody else's frequency.
I just wanted to be clear about it. Yeah, that
sounds good. If you're calling CQ, he might
have a point that if there's a strong station,
you may be better to call with them. If he's
from a couple of states over, I wonder how he
knows that. But that might be something worth
experimenting with. I struggle to see that
as something worth sending you an email on,
but I don't know. I could be wrong. That is
all for me.
Yeah, very good, Tim. Does anybody else have
any comments for Dave? Please call.
KC3TYX, late check-in and comment.
KC3TYX, good evening. And Vic, throw in your
two cents.
I understand what you're saying. I'll tell you
what, when I'm on FTA, I click the little button
that says, hold transmit frequency, and I pick
a clear spot, just like you were mentioning,
and I stay put. Most people respond, you know,
their waterfall could be anywhere up and down
the screen. It's not necessarily on top of me.
But on rare occasions, someone will respond
to me right on top of me. You know, I don't
know what the difference really is. The only
thing is when you do that, if the person forgets
to move off of you, then it's a problem and
you're both on the same frequency. So I just
hold frequency. never, you when I'm calling
and when I'm responding, I still hold frequency
and I try to stay away from all the other waterfalls.
So I'm not really sure what he was saying. KC3TYX
back to net.
Good, Vic.
Dave, are you good?
Yeah, thanks there, Chuck. Yeah, I think the
NITS pretty much clarified it. I do the best
practices where I do hold my transmit frequency,
and other folks that don't click that box want
to, and if they forget to move, then they're
right on top of your waterfall. yeah, whether
you should be on the transmitting in the first
even or odds or evens when you're calling CQDX
on six meters. I you've done all the right practices
as far as not being on top of anybody else
and being respectful of them. And there are
a couple of stations that are typically, if
they are close by, they can overload your receiver.
But somebody several states away to get an
email like this. And it was well intended. The
gentleman, I won't give the call sign, he's,
I think he was out of Northern Maryland. Definitely
well intended. But it seeming to indicate on
FT8, which has the capacity to take a small,
know, a couple kilohertz worth of bandwidth
and actually segregate, segment that down further
into potentially hundreds if not thousands
of other transmissions. And I just found it
odd that somebody would say that I should be
transmitting in sequence for fear of desensing
somebody else's front end on their, their,
on their receive. So that was what I was getting
at. And I'll mind you, the folks, I did take
a look under the hood, so to speak, and some
of the stations who I, the I got this from.
He has a very, very tall tower and runs stacked
Yagi arrays for six meters specifically, long
booms and everything else and lots of power.
So he's definitely a big gun. So when somebody
sends me a statement like this, I take it and
try to understand it. So I think we've circled
the wagons on this one. Appreciate the help
and we'll turn it back to net control. NA-3CW,
KI-60M.
Very good, Dave. Before we bug out, does anybody
have any other comments or did any comments
generate a question? Please call in HRECW. HRECW.
I was mentioning the case for your antenna
things. I couldn't think of the word, but I
was trying to think of the word. It was a Pelican-like
case. That's what I use. It is watertight and
it works great. Now they have Pelican cases
and they have knockoffs, so it's your choice.
But I find them to be very helpful for that
kind of situation. Back to net. W8CRW.
Thanks, CR, very good comment. Any other comments?
I'd like to follow up on AF3Z's follow-up.
Go ahead, Jim.
Thank you Chuck. AF3Z, Jim, yes, thanks for
the whole story of the power problem. I now
understand what happened and yes, you're exactly
right. That is a roll around transformer on
a dolly and the transformer is now supplying
a neutral with a center tab for your house.
Now, they're only able to do that for smaller
loads. They can't do it on a huge 200 amp service
with a heat pump. It just won't run it. But
you can run indefinitely on that temporary.
PECO has the same exact setup for them and it
allows them to immediately get someone back
into service like you said when they might not
be out with a crew for quite a while. Now that
being said, the fact that your local grounding
system, like your ground rod, water pipes,
whatever, actually did not take over when PNL's
neutral failed. you now know the quality of
that local grounding system at your house. I'll
let it drop here.
So that tells you that your local ground rod
and or water piping and all could be improved
because your station, your radio station and
whatever surge suppressors you have are running
on that system. including PP &Ls and right now
it's not doing so great so you might look
into maybe improving that. wire and also right
now any surge suppressors you have are only
referenced back to the transformer. It's not
really a ground-ground, it's a return. will
work out. the grounding system because in an
ideal situation your grounding be able to take
over when the utility power neutral fails.
obviously they can't. And that's very common.
not so great for that. just be aware of that.
But I'm glad you got a quick resolve to the
problem and you can run indefinitely on that.
and KC3RFG get back to net.
Thanks Jim, very good and relevant comments.
Any other comments or questions?
Good job. Thank you Jim, thank you Chuck.
I wonder when they bury a new line and I don't
know how that is, is it all one cable with all
three wires in there what? But I wonder if
they will redo the ground. When they put in
that rolling deal, they put a special ground
rod in or an extra one, whatever, and hook
that up to there. So anyway, that's interesting.
I don't have much in the way of rusters. stuff.
My lightning arrestor is simply unplugging
antennas and things. But that is interesting.
And maybe that's why it wasn't too extreme
too, because maybe the grounding system was
working to some extent but not very well.
But anyway, thank you very much for that word,
dear Jim. Back to you, Chuck, AF3Z.
Thanks Jim and So before we close down the
workbench for the evening, do we have any
anybody out there that's been lurking around
and wants to get on our list to show that
you were here? Any late check-ins? Please call
NHECW.
from our sponsor. Thanks to all stations for
checking into the 985 workbench and a big thank
you to Joe, W3GMS for making the 985 repeater
available for the workbench. You are invited
to use the repeater often. It's a great way
to show that you appreciate the gift of 985
to the amateur radio community. Finally, we
hope to hear you again on Thursday evening
at 8 p.m. during the 985 roundtable. And again,
that will be... headed up by Phil, KC3CIB.
This concludes the workbench for tonight. Please
feel free to stick around and continue the
discussion on 985. Have a good night and a
great week ahead. 73, this is NA3CW, clear.
Thanks again, another really good workbench.
Some good, good content tonight. Again, thanks,
73, W-A-3-V-E-E.
Thanks, Ron. There was another station that
doubled, Ron. AF3Z, this is KC3SQI. Ed Wayne
AF3 is at. Yeah, when you contact them when
they're going to pull a new wire in, ask them
if they'd also do a mega test on your ground
rod. That will give you then definitive resistance
of that ground rod to the ground as to whether
you need a new ground rod or not. Okay, very
good. What was the name of that test? I missed
it. It's called a MEGOR. M-E-G-G-E-R. It's
a MEGOM meter. But it puts pretty high current
into them. And that will figure out how your
ground is and how the ground rod is making
connection to that ground. Very good. Well,
he's an ear maker. I just didn't know what it
was. All right. Very good there, Wayne. Thank
you. I appreciate that. That's a good, good
thought. As I was saying that, I thought I
ought to ask them specifically if they're going
to do put a new rod in or not, but that would
be a good way to go. All right. Thank you, Wayne.
Hope you're hanging in there well. by the way,
speaking of birds, at our last... camera club
meeting and a guy took this picture right out
back of like a Walmart or something around Lancaster
but they're sort of open land maybe even an
official park but he had a picture of an adult,
uh, pilliated woodpecker on the side of the
tree and three young pilliated woodpeckers sticking
their heads out with their mouths open waiting
to be fed. It was an amazing picture. Now he
had spent a lot of time, but he didn't have
to go to any far off wilderness. Just out back
of the Walmart or something. So I thought
you might be interested in that beautiful picture.
AF3Z. Oh, yeah, you know, if you get lucky,
you can find one of those places, but I haven't
put in the time trying to do that. I just
have the problem with my dogs not accepting
the fact that the turkeys can also be in my
backyard. I've gotten a pilia with peckers
in my backyard often. K-8-3-B-M-S.
Hank, I forget where your backyard is, but
yeah, we used to get them down there kind
of stung, but I haven't seen them where I am
now. So very good. Thanks for chiming in here,
Hank. Becker, you win.
I'm going have to go horizontal here because
I've to get up and take the XYL to doctor's
appointment in the morning. But I wanted to
throw that out to you to have them do a test
on your grounding system while they're also...
They'll probably do that anyway since the
neutral was bad. but that would give you numbers
that you could work with and I can tell you
whether they're good, bad, or indifferent. Okay
everybody, have a good night. 73, KC3, SQI.
Have a good night, Wayne. Jimmy, I'm doing
okay, thank you. Had some up and downs last
week with diabetes.
driving on Thursday apparently my blood sugar
dropped when I got out of the car to well while
in the car I to go into the bank.
were weak and I couldn't stand up straight.
Fortunately I always...
pocket so I had two pieces and almost immediately
I Yeah, finally home in Newtown Square, Pilea
woodpeckers there have come by many times.
I've hung out a sewage cage.
Off of Bishop Powell Road, there's a big wooded
area. Used to be a troop farm. They did lot
of equestrian sports and also not too far from
the reservoir, Springdale Reservoir, Geist
Reservoir, down the road a little bit more.
And on the other side of the old cornfield,
the big wooded area as well, like our Williamson
Lodge. The Pelea woodpeckers like to go there
a lot. They're very shy birds and they must
be awfully hungry. Jimmy, as they come out
in public. I can tell you a true story that
happened exactly one year after my mother's
passing. Go ahead, Jimmy. KA-3, BMS. How are
you doing? How's everything? What's hot? What's
not? I went to old Buzzard, what's hot, what's
not. Did you get any snow today? K-3 BMS.
Hey Hank, AF3Z, and you got it all in there
before the beep beep beep went. And I wish
we had had snow today. I decided, due to
my schedule, I've actually put off cutting
the grass for a while. And so it needed to
be done and the weather wasn't going to get
any cooler for a few days around here. So I
went out in mode this morning so I'd beat some
of the heat. But then I started doing some trimming
and some other stuff and ended up running,
making two trips to the local compost site
to dump off stuff I had trimmed and cut here
in the yard and that kind of stuff. But anyway,
I was soaked, tired, hot. It was not fun,
so some snow would have been very good. So
yeah, I'm curious about your story there.
I saw, now I'm trying to remember what it was
exactly. Oh, I know, my granddaughter who
is not, no, excuse me, she's 12 at this point.
She really likes otters and I saw a video on
YouTube. somebody who...
Now I can't even fully remember the story, but
he was taking care of a young otter that got
somehow abandoned or whatever. And he finally
released it back into the wild, but this otter
will come back and he goes out kayaking and
the otter will jump up on his kayak and visit
with him and crawl around and then jump back
in the water. So animals are interesting how
they act. I also remember a story one time.
about a guy in Africa, I think, who had done
a lot for protecting elephants and creating
a preserve where they wouldn't be hunted and
stuff like that. And after he died, these elephants
that were related to that elephant, or no,
after he died, the elephants that he worked
with would come and just sort of stand at his
house on the anniversary of his death every
year. Interesting. There's a lot more to animals
than us that meets the eye. So back over to
you.
Absolutely true, Jimmy. It's absolutely true.
K3 BMS. I've worked with animals professionally.
Dairy farming with horses. I the dairy cattle
very much. I remember one girl used to, whenever
I'd milk her, used to lick. Mary Biddy was her
name, this is 34 years ago. I can tell you
about a couple horses that were trying to distract
me so they can get into the barn and eat.
And get into the feed box. guarding the pillion
at Whooppecker.
So, let's probably...
years now we had a cherry tree I planted back
in 77 with my father. down there is only a
stump left. The tree had split. be taken down
so it wouldn't cause damage to the shed or
otherwise.
and the stump was riding away. What are you?
My mother died Christmas Day of 2000. pulled
into the driveway.
Free stop.
y'all must
They are so shy, notably shy.
take several pictures of it. And it just kept
looking at me.
Good to hear you, Jimmy.
Yeah, I
to the rain that we've had here lately.
week I did half the yard this week and I did
the other half of the yard so it's very uneven.
have not done any of trimming because I ran
out of gasoline oil mix so Friday I
to mix with the fuel oil mix. Back to you
please, Jimmy. King America 3, Boston.
Hank, AF3Z. Yeah, very interesting. I have
a tree stump hawk story for you.
forget how long ago now, but my wife and I,
there was an English walnut tree in the backyard.
was starting, you could see it was rotting at
the base to some degree, or know, stuff was
coming out of the trunk around the base.
And this tree was not too far from the house
and leaning toward the house. So we finally
decided it might be wise to get that taken
down, which we did. But my wife said, well,
let's leave a stump. And it was about eight,
nine feet tall. leave that up for woodpeckers
and whoever, you know, to be able to use it
and enjoy it. So we did that. She died now,
pushing three years ago, two and three quarters
years ago or something like that. so sometime
after that, I was doing a thing and it's
a long story, but it was sort of a workshop
type thing online and using photography as
a... means of sort of reflecting and meditating
or whatever. And so I forget what the assignment
was, but there were two trees that are the big
stump in the eight, nine foot high stump was
standing there. And next to it was a, oh, I'm
trying to think what it's called. It has something
to do with water. Anyway, a tree that she planted
was doing quite well and growing not far from
that stump. And so I thought this thing I was
working on would be interesting to a picture
of those two trees beside each other, her stump
and also her new tree that was growing quite
well. And so I'm laying on the ground to get
a good angle on these trees. And all of a sudden
the hawk comes and lands on top of the stump.
And it just felt like one of those kinds of
visitations or something. Because I've never
seen a hawk do that, especially not when I'm
out there. I'll see them fly around a little
bit. But came and landed right on her stump
and I still wonder, you know, there's a lot
more to life than meets the eye. Back to you,
Hank, AF3Z. There is, Jimmy, I agree with
you. Does somebody else need to use a repeater,
K-3BMS?
I guess not.
Okay. You open your eyes.
you see that you weren't looking for notice.
Very good, Mark.
little girl.
Okay, yeah.
K-8-3-BMS. pecker or a little kid.
very interesting. Just remembered something.
I want to go out back. Bees moving into my
house. A little hole next to a... jams.
are going in and out of there. narrative. thing
I need is a big bee's nest in the wall of...
I've got an early morning coming in the morning
and I had a late night last night.
out too long but... here and good to hear
you, good to hear your stories and share my
story and all that kind of stuff. So you take
care and look forward to the next time, KA-3BMS
AF-3Z. Jimmy, may I express concern and ask
you to realize it's friendly concern and not
a lecture?
Surely. I understand the foundation or premise
of my statement is...
who are deadly allergic to bee stings. I've
come very close to death, at least thrice in
my life. I've been hospitalized several times
for it. And I would tell you to be extraordinarily
careful. Yes, this is a time to do it when
it's dark, you might want to be able to...
contact a University of Pennsylvania, or no,
Penn State University, Penn State University
Extension Campus in Chester County or Lancaster
County. Have them come and take it, take care
of it for you. They can have, you know, beekeepers
take care of that for you.
I have been swarmed.
He really died from it.
That's not my point. I'm expressing...
We
of these things. You know these days bees are
becoming much more scarce with chemicals and
stuff we use. So that's a problem too. I don't
like to kill bees but I don't want them growing
or living in the house. So yeah, thank you very
much. No problem at all on that. All right,
catch you later there Hank and again thanks
for the call, AF3Z.
You're welcome for the call. I enjoy your company
very much.
care, good night, gesundheit.