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“Words of Wisdom” is an initiative to document and celebrate the stories, insights, and wisdom of Singapore’s senior citizens. It's powered by Folklory, a service dedicated to preserving stories through audio podcasts, who will collaborate with 60 seniors aged 60 and above to create a series of 60 podcasts, each capturing a unique slice of Singapore’s rich history and culture. Find out more info at Folklory.com
00:00:00:00 - 00:00:24:02
Unknown
Hello there. This is Terence from folkloric. What you're about to listen to is a podcast from the Words of Wisdom Project, where we spoke to 60 Singaporeans over the age of 64 to 60 and captured their life lessons for the next generation. We hope you enjoy it. I.
00:00:24:04 - 00:00:51:00
Unknown
Farm. And we're here today to do this words of wisdom fuckery with Doctor Fu. And maybe the best way for us to start, is for Doctor Fu, for you yourself to introduce yourself to our audience. I'm, a Singaporean by birth. I'm already 68 years, so. I mean, the fact that it's not the video recording, you can see how old I am.
00:00:51:02 - 00:01:20:12
Unknown
So I have had, quite an interesting, experience, over this year, as a Singaporean and, therefore, it is really a privilege and a joy to be able to share it with, with the community. So thank you. Okay. I mean, you know, being 68, congratulations. You know, big, big life milestone, the past 60, you know.
00:01:20:14 - 00:01:44:20
Unknown
Could you one of the things that we really do want to understand a little bit more of is what's it like to, you know, build up a career over the years and grow alongside Singapore. So I do want to ask you a little bit about your career and, and what was the trajectory of career and what you started out before you embarked on your career?
00:01:44:22 - 00:02:16:08
Unknown
Terence. Yeah. I mean, I have to really look back and, I must say that, you know, if you connect it to the growth and development of Singapore, then I think the trajectory was, was quite aligned because, you know, when I was in school, the focus really was on, building the infrastructure, getting the process started.
00:02:16:08 - 00:02:51:10
Unknown
So they were really looking more for, you know, engineers and scientists and so on. So, you could say that, you know, my own, studies, was very much along those lines. My main, interest was really in chemistry, partly because I see chemistry as, micro architecture is building, you know, from small molecules.
00:02:51:12 - 00:03:20:08
Unknown
And, it has always fascinated me. So, so structure to it. And, therefore, for me, the study of chemistry was, extremely interesting. And, although it was not an easy subject to master, I must say, my interest, has, prevailed, and I was able to graduate from the university as a chemist.
00:03:20:10 - 00:04:00:00
Unknown
So that's how it really got started. I see, I just then I, I started, working my work life after, my university and I must say, it was relatively uneventful in the sense that I really did not change jobs too often. I started with the Ministry of Environment for a year, but then I was approached by, by lecturer to try and, join the R&D, industry that was starting up.
00:04:00:00 - 00:04:41:07
Unknown
And, Nestlé has just opened the R&D center in Singapore, and, my professor, highly recommended me to look into it. And, you know, I apply for the job, and, I was selected and I started working, for Nestlé R&D for the next 33 years. Well, I see, I see. But I did want to go back a little bit and ask you, was there anything in your childhood or youth that now you look back like, that's where my interest in chemistry started.
00:04:41:09 - 00:05:19:16
Unknown
I could not, identify any particular, turning point. In my early childhood. I must say, when, when I was young, I mean really young, actually, my interest was more in history. Oh, okay. Okay. But, you know, it, became very much a part of me, not as a career, but as, you could say, extracurricular activity because I'm very much into history.
00:05:19:18 - 00:05:45:24
Unknown
And, until today, I'm, I still read a lot of history, but I never, never really got started in that area because, I remember when I was in, secondary school, Terence, I think, I was sitting for an exam. I thought it was, supposed to be history, but it turned out to be something else that I think I fell.
00:05:46:01 - 00:06:11:02
Unknown
Oh, I see. That, would be, from history for, for quite some time, but, I've always been, you could say a read of history. And, I enjoyed it very much because the story, as is, says that, it's history, you know. Yeah. It's about really the the the evolution of man.
00:06:11:04 - 00:06:36:00
Unknown
You could even and as a scientist, you could even talk about the evolution of the stars, and how we, from Stardust and how, civilizations developed, soon after the I know thing of the Ice age. So, for me, a very fascinating area, but that was not where, my career was all about.
00:06:36:02 - 00:06:59:13
Unknown
I see, I see. So I mean, in that sense, you know, you, you found the passion, you know, later and you actually managed to stick with it for like what you said 33 years, right. Yes. What do you think is the secret to your longevity in in the industry? Oh, partly because, the nature of the job itself.
00:06:59:15 - 00:07:37:09
Unknown
I was in R&D research and development. And really it was, it was a fascinating area because, most of the time, if you are in marketing, sales or even technical services, you know, you basically, doing a light work that you hope that, you know, the customer is satisfied. But when you do R&D, bit more alongside that, you have, a bit more time to, to, to try out new things.
00:07:37:11 - 00:08:14:19
Unknown
And, I think for me that was the, the clincher because, I was really very happy in my job. I had a wonderful boss, whom, till today we are very much in touch and we even, together wrote, translated, classical Chinese poetry into English, you know. I see, I see well, I mean it's, it does, I think that's a very important part of finding your, your motivation for things.
00:08:14:19 - 00:08:42:06
Unknown
It's all that. Right. Yeah. It's I think, you know, we the, the fact that, it was not really seen as, a dance at hand. Because it's R&D work and, you really can put your passion into it. During the time I was really able to play with a lot of, sophisticated laboratory instruments.
00:08:42:08 - 00:09:11:20
Unknown
Our lab was one of the best equipped, food labs in probably the whole of, Southeast Asia. So, it definitely kept me motivated for many years. But more importantly was the fact that I was able to try new things and, for me, you know, the education of a person is not just, to have enough knowledge to do the job.
00:09:11:22 - 00:09:45:10
Unknown
So for me, it's really about educating the character of the person. And, I as I said earlier, I love history. I also appreciate very much the arts and if I can from, from very young, I always wanted to integrate the arts and sciences as well as, Chinese and English, you know, especially to the, and cultures.
00:09:45:12 - 00:10:09:08
Unknown
So, you know, nowadays there are a lot of young people who they're studying very hard, although, you know, pursuing their careers very aggressively, but they don't feel like they have found their passion or they feel very disconnected from what they're studying or working. What advice do you have for young people like that? For me, of course.
00:10:09:10 - 00:10:43:06
Unknown
Terence, I have to admit that, we we live within our own circumstances, and, I cannot say that every everyone's opportunity is the same. Sure. It's not fair. And, you know, we should not make such comparisons. However, I think you should always look at it from what you can control. And I feel that if you have a passion for something.
00:10:43:08 - 00:11:15:09
Unknown
I believe that, you will usually do very well in it. Of course, accidents happen, you know, and you could be diverted, but, generally if, and this is what I advise, in fact, after retirement, I, I taught as a young associate professor in the university, National University of Singapore. I mean, just at a young, associate professor means, just basically part time.
00:11:15:09 - 00:11:50:03
Unknown
And I teach one course, a year. The whole idea was to me, to convey to them how important it is because, basically, I teach the graduate class. So how important it is that, they should be very passionate about, the subject that they're doing because, he, they will be motivated to continually explore the area and to to do really creative things.
00:11:50:05 - 00:12:13:15
Unknown
So, I would, as, as I would advise many of the young people please, please, do something that you really love. It's a, it's a very, very useful piece of advice because that's exactly what I do want to talk about next. You know the fact that you're a man of science.
00:12:13:15 - 00:12:53:08
Unknown
Right. But what does the word love mean to you. Well, you know, to me, love is the greatest motivator. Nothing else compares to it. And, you know, out of love, you would do, really, things which, way out of the ordinary. I mean, you you could be talking about, love for, you know, for science or love for religion.
00:12:53:10 - 00:13:25:04
Unknown
Love for another human being. I mean that's the greatest motivator that you can think of. The way, way beyond what money is or power is. And this is how I feel and even the way I continue in my career, which was a quite a quite, unusual, 33 years with, one company.
00:13:25:06 - 00:13:56:07
Unknown
Was because really, I, I woke up every morning ready to go to work. You know, this, this is something that, to me is probably the greatest, motivator, of, our, our life, our career, our relationship as well. Sure. So, I mean, you you did mention earlier that it could also be even a love for another person, right?
00:13:56:09 - 00:14:24:14
Unknown
So are you a, big believer that, you know, love and the believer in love at first sight? That's exactly why I was at, you know, believer in love at first sight. Oh, really? Why? Why so, well, you know, I don't know, I, I suppose it's very difficult to explain, but I can give you a practical example.
00:14:24:16 - 00:14:58:21
Unknown
Sure. So I met my wife, in India, actually. Oh, wow. She's Persian. She's actually, from Iran. But, the family moved to India when she was, still in her teens, in the early 70s, before the Iranian Revolution. And she stayed and, you know, studied in India and, I met her in, in India.
00:14:58:23 - 00:15:36:11
Unknown
During a conference actually was a religious conference, Baha'i youth conference. Okay. And, well, I fell in love immediately. Immediately when, proposed, during the conference. Well, I got rejected during the conference. Wow. And, you know, we, you know, I mentioned that I proposed when we first met and, but, the second time we met, we were married, and, in between was eight years.
00:15:36:13 - 00:16:06:03
Unknown
Oh, wow. And I like, in terms of an eight years of courtship more, well, she was in India. It came back to Singapore, and, it's quite a distance. There's no internet. Then. Is. You send a letter, it takes a month to reach. And so and so, but I was not, it was not, she she said no, it just said no, until finally she agreed.
00:16:06:05 - 00:16:36:08
Unknown
And, you know, we so when we met the second time. After eight years, we were married. Wow. Amazing. Amazing. So, I mean, getting fully in love and getting married is one aspect of that relationship. But what about maintaining the relationship? What's the secret to maintaining love in a relationship? Very good question, Terrence.
00:16:36:08 - 00:17:07:24
Unknown
I mean, not today. Is easy come, easy go. And, we we sometimes wonder what, you know, if you, if a a couple decides to marry, whether they're really committed to it or not. It's, I mean, it's, it's a very serious issue. I mean, I'm not, you know, trying to make light of it, but, it's not easy.
00:17:08:01 - 00:17:42:19
Unknown
I fully agree. And it seems as though the choices are many today. And you know, you have you seem to have a million choice. But a million choices. But really I think if you think about it, that's the paradox of choice that it's not easy to choose. And very often when you make the decision we sometimes forget what is the purpose as well.
00:17:42:20 - 00:18:19:14
Unknown
And I don't for, you know what it, I mean I, I'm worried about what you see the, the high ed higher rates of divorce. Not only the worst but also the is no. Sure. And you have to wonder, could there be some really, a magic bullet? Something like that, but really a way that would help the young people, be able to sustain a marriage.
00:18:19:14 - 00:19:01:02
Unknown
And for me, I mean, communication, I fully agree, is very important. I think more than that, the evidence is the fact that, it must be able to repair, any sort of disagreement, conflict between the two of you. For me this is far more important. It's like, you know, I'm not sure one of the famous writers talk about how it's not important how many times you fall, but how many times, how many times you are able to stand up after that.
00:19:01:04 - 00:19:38:20
Unknown
The same in marriage, you know, and for me with my wife, we from very early beginnings, we decided that we should never allow, disagreement or conflict to, to stay over 24 hours, meaning overnight. We always felt that we should apologize. We should apologize not because we think we are wrong. We should apologize because in the process, we have hurt someone we love.
00:19:38:22 - 00:20:16:01
Unknown
So that's what we really apologize for. That unintentionally. Due to accident. Due to mis, misunderstanding. Hurt the person that we love. Not because, you know I think I'm wrong. I fully agree. I really do most of the apologize sleep, but you know, that has always been our policy and I think this is, a very important attitude to have.
00:20:16:03 - 00:20:43:13
Unknown
And, and the fact that they are willing to apologize and then start the communication again. This is really, I mean, if the Cold War starts, that's the end, you know, it's it goes on. Yeah. Yeah. Very true. Yeah. Rachel. So I mean based just based on that like, because a lot of young people today, they are so scared.
00:20:43:17 - 00:21:11:14
Unknown
They're very scared of commitment because they also see a lot of relationships just breaking apart. And, you know, for various factors of they want to live their lives, pursue their careers. They want to do want to, they want a simple life, like, they don't want the complications of a marriage and everything. What advice do you have for final for young people who, might be on the fence about starting a relationship or family and and things like that.
00:21:11:16 - 00:21:46:24
Unknown
Yeah. I have two boys. They're both not married yet, so I can say that, the advice that I would be is now, suggesting is something which I always, share with my two boys, so. Sure. Parents, you know, one of the greatest opportunity. To really to get to know another person well is really during your university days.
00:21:47:01 - 00:22:13:24
Unknown
You have reached a certain maturity and the university is such such a wonderful way to really meet somebody in a group. You know, it's not you know dating 1 to 1, you put on your best, and best make up, you know, your best, face, your best foot forward and so on.
00:22:14:01 - 00:22:46:05
Unknown
So the fact that you have the opportunity to be in the class with so many students in the playing field, with so many participants, in the canteen, just about everywhere, you have the opportunity really to observe. To really find, that one person that seemed to have those qualities that somewhat, you admire, somewhat compliment you.
00:22:46:07 - 00:23:09:15
Unknown
And I think, you know, the problem with with the students today is university is purely marketing. Set the same, but that's the truth. And and they when they go out to work and they have to work 12 hours a day. What time do you have to to get to know anyone else.
00:23:09:17 - 00:23:41:22
Unknown
Yeah. Yeah. It's completely I tell you and this opportunity really to be able to observe others in a group. It's the best because you can really see the honest behavior, the attitude. Not something made up for the date. That's true. That's very true. So I mean interesting that you talk about you know university is a very fertile ground for finding no need for mentoring relationships but even friendships.
00:23:41:22 - 00:24:10:00
Unknown
Right. And those of people. So of course, what what are some of those traits that have been very important for you in your life, in the friends that you surround yourself with? Yeah. Romantic or otherwise, I think. Yeah. Otherwise it's okay. And I think the important things, I mean, like what you mentioned that university is a great place to to really observe people and meet a lot of different people, and not all of them will turn out to be your spouse, right?
00:24:10:01 - 00:24:50:05
Unknown
Right. But some of them will turn out to be all very good friends. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think for us, we we sometimes forget, that, I mean, if you talk about friendship. Okay. The platonic friendship, really the purest ground is really when you're young. Yeah. And today, the kids are in the, you know, large room, latchkey room, what have you, really.
00:24:50:07 - 00:25:17:11
Unknown
We hardly have that, that sort of kampung spirit. Are you really, you know, my best friends that I've kept in touch? I'm already 68, so. Yeah. Talking about 60 years. Those from, from school. Some of them, of course, we have not met. Very often, but I still have, you know, fond memories of the time together.
00:25:17:11 - 00:25:52:10
Unknown
And we do meet. Oh, it's really it's such an a job. Friendship. Sharing and etc.. So, and then if you translate it to your secondary school, fantastic. You know, you playing together. You understand about life. It's such a fertile ground. But you know if the parents today expect the children just to go to school and come back and, do their homework at home.
00:25:52:12 - 00:26:29:23
Unknown
Yeah. That's it. Okay. What opportunity they have to develop good friendships. Forget it. Yeah. Rachel. Rachel. So, I'm not just talking about the university per se. That whole cycle of development of a human being. Allows you really from developing friendship, which is to some extent the, the also the foundation for a romantic relationship as well.
00:26:30:00 - 00:27:03:10
Unknown
Because if you are friends, believe me, you know, that there of course has to be affinity and attraction, but believe me, it it really helps because, when you are of one mind, you could, could, even, end the sentence, without first speaking it. I mean, it's, it's so wonderful and, you know, delightful sensation.
00:27:03:12 - 00:27:32:16
Unknown
And how have you, what's, how do you primarily maintain communications with these very very old friends. Good question. You know, there's nothing like meeting them face to face. And this is like, I'm back here in, my wife and I in Hainan will be there for another two years. We just completed one year.
00:27:32:18 - 00:28:02:03
Unknown
She's teaching in the, in the, Hainan middle School. And, unfortunately, they have a national day holiday coming up, which is a golden week. Yeah. So she has to teach on Sunday so she cannot come with me. I see, I see. So I'm here alone. But actually Karen's here because we have the, 50th, anniversary of our, 74 graduate class.
00:28:02:03 - 00:28:29:19
Unknown
So this is the one for some year because of kept in touch with all this, by the same cohort of the same year. I don't really know. Right together. So, you know, we we have kept in touch. Of course, we have very different professions. We live very different lives now. But that's after 50 years.
00:28:29:19 - 00:28:52:16
Unknown
I mean, I'm sure the plenty that we can still share. Yeah. Yeah. Well the number just baffles me. 50th anniversary of, graduate classes and, you know, I just had to come back for this, Yeah. Well, this year, I wish my wife was here. Yeah. Unfortunately, she worked. So. But congrats. Congrats on the milestone.
00:28:52:18 - 00:29:21:04
Unknown
So, I mean, like, always, I, I, I yeah, I really spend time, meeting them, having dinner, a meal is really one of the best ways to do it together. And so I did want to ask her, you know, like, young people today, they have all the means of communication of each other. Social media, you know, internet, Skype, zoom, whatever.
00:29:21:06 - 00:29:42:04
Unknown
But a lot of them also say that they are more lonely than than ever. Right. But why do you think. Why do you think that? Only in spite of being connected, Terence, most of the time when they're on the media, this just want to show themselves they're not even listening.
00:29:42:06 - 00:30:17:22
Unknown
There's nothing to do with communication. You know it shows how good you are in presenting something you know putting up facade and what have, I mean some of them are very genuine and really try and And promote a skill you know, and understanding I fully appreciate I mean I, I, I look at tick tock quite often as well, you know, and I really enjoy some of the, of the snippets and so on.
00:30:17:24 - 00:30:35:13
Unknown
But very often it's just they're not even listening. And the real essence of any conversation is to be able to listen.
00:30:35:15 - 00:31:25:20
Unknown
Not speaking. Yeah. Yeah I think, I think that's what you hit the nail on the head. Like social media a lot of times it's, it's just a one way street. If, if people are showing themselves but not really listening to each other. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As some of the conversational pieces, some of this, the I don't know if they're the, the, the actually sort of pre-prepared it or not, but, really, some of these, these shows are actually quite interesting because if they're really spontaneous, it shows that they are really able to listen and be able to respond, in a very appropriate manner.
00:31:25:20 - 00:31:57:00
Unknown
And then, with such humor here. And I really enjoyed those shows. I see, I see it's this is good. It's good. You know, like, we're recording this podcast also sort of, it's a time capsule that we're trying to capture for future generations, right? So if there's any one piece of advice that you would want to leave for future generations of Singaporeans who might be listening to this ten years, 20 years, 30 years, 60 years down the road?
00:31:57:02 - 00:33:02:05
Unknown
What's the one piece of advice that you want to leave behind? Terrence, you know. The world has changed. There's there's no question about it. You know, just the fact that the how over our time, especially in my case, where we, we went from, from the I was born in, 66, just, not too long after the war and now in the 21st century and, quite far into the 21st century, over this period, there's been tremendous changes, yet, you know, the evolution of, of the material world, has been tremendous.
00:33:02:05 - 00:33:28:02
Unknown
I mean, you cannot imagine, I mean, take, for example, I mean, my parents, were almost, from the same, village next to each other in Hainan. And they meant that in my case, you know, I met my wife who, you know, at least when we aboard were at least 5000km away from each other.
00:33:28:04 - 00:34:04:15
Unknown
So, physically, really the world has changed. But then the problem is, we have not evolved very much as a social big. And this is something which to me is is very dear to my heart because, I think we need to catch up and for Singapore especially, you start to appreciate that being such a small country.
00:34:04:17 - 00:34:55:23
Unknown
It's not going to be easy to grow the next 50 years. And my, my really advice is that, the opportunities are there, you know, but let's not just do it because everybody else is doing it. But really because I feel that we should start forging, you know, new ways of doing things so that, from amongst the Singaporeans, we have more than just being very process oriented.
00:34:55:23 - 00:35:30:08
Unknown
I mean, you know, it's well known Singapore. We are good with process. Yeah. But, creativity is, not the thing. And Einstein once said, I paraphrase, of course, that, imagination is greater than knowledge. Because knowledge is what, you know, what is available already in the world. But imagination goes way beyond that.
00:35:30:10 - 00:36:10:14
Unknown
And I think, Singapore young has to be has to be more imaginative. And be willing to out of love for particular subject for particular career particular direction Eliza really explore and go deep into it. Then I think, you'll find Singapore will not only survive the next 50 years, but will try for sure.
00:36:10:16 - 00:36:33:09
Unknown
Awesome, awesome. I think that's very, very wise and helpful words. And it would be very interesting for anyone listening to this. Oh yeah. Thanks so much Doctor Fu for no, no, no, thank you for listening. No. Thanks for opening up and sharing your amazing stories of of your love at first sight. And and, you know, the advice you have for young people.
00:36:33:12 - 00:36:56:17
Unknown
Sure. Definitely. People listening to this will find this interesting, whether it's ten years or 50 years down the road. Yeah. And, I, I think we we have to realize, Terence, that, we are really one to Man of Steel. And, you know, I mean, my, my PhD is in international law and climate change. Oh I see.
00:36:56:17 - 00:37:29:18
Unknown
And, I'm a chemist by profession. My first master's is in chemistry by second. This is the library science. Like this and international, ISO but really, you know, once we we we we get this right. There were one humanity. Then everything else changes. But just this world today is just so divided. Yeah. And it really pains my heart.
00:37:29:20 - 00:37:57:19
Unknown
And therefore, you know, the fact that we are in Hainan now is the fact that, really, I'm there because, I'm, my family name is Fu. So I'm Hainan is actually, goes back to but by roots. So the more important that that, that I mentioned earlier, I translate I read classical Chinese, literature and I mean, poetry into English.
00:37:57:21 - 00:38:31:12
Unknown
So I really want to be able to bridge between the East and the West and, you know, whatever you say, still very much, Singapore, at least amongst, majority is still very much, of the Western, education Western and so on. So I really hope that and, I will, will be able to do something to be a bridge.
00:38:31:14 - 00:38:38:02
Unknown
And,
00:38:38:04 - 00:39:07:09
Unknown
Hello again. I hope you enjoyed listening to that for Clearing Words of Wisdom is a project by Charlotte Coal, powered by Phil Cleary and supported by our Singapore Fund. To find out more, please visit our website at Folklorico. That's f okay o r y.com. Goodbye.